WEBVTT - Talking Tech 22nd October 2024 0:00:33.383 --> 0:00:37.162 Hello everyone. Welcome to Talking Tech. This edition available from 0:00:37.162 --> 0:00:41.422 October the 22nd, 2024. I'm Stephen Jolly, great to have 0:00:41.423 --> 0:00:45.143 you with us listening maybe through Vision Australia Radio, associated 0:00:45.143 --> 0:00:49.462 stations of the Radio Reading Network or the Community Radio Network. 0:00:49.492 --> 0:00:52.223 There is also the podcast. To catch that, all you 0:00:52.223 --> 0:00:54.923 need to do is search for the two words talking 0:00:54.953 --> 0:00:57.353 tech and Dan. It can all come usually on a 0:00:57.353 --> 0:01:01.013 Tuesday afternoon just after it's been produced. Another option is 0:01:01.013 --> 0:01:04.133 to ask your Siri device or smart speaker to play. 0:01:04.163 --> 0:01:09.263 Vision Australia radio talking tech podcast. Vision Australia radio talking 0:01:09.293 --> 0:01:15.113 tech podcast with me. Vision Australia's national access technology manager. 0:01:15.143 --> 0:01:17.453 Damo McMorrow. Hey, Damo. 0:01:17.783 --> 0:01:18.953 Hi Stephen. 0:01:19.462 --> 0:01:23.033 This month, which is very much a month around vision 0:01:23.033 --> 0:01:27.202 awareness and vision protection. And of course we had International 0:01:27.203 --> 0:01:30.413 White Cane Day just a week or so ago on 0:01:30.443 --> 0:01:36.083 October the 15th. So let's talk about getting around today. 0:01:36.113 --> 0:01:39.773 And the first thing I'd like to mention is an 0:01:39.803 --> 0:01:42.713 Australian initiative. Be good to give a shout out to that. 0:01:42.713 --> 0:01:46.042 And it's an initiative to make available a new kind 0:01:46.043 --> 0:01:49.823 of tip for the cane called sensible. And where the 0:01:49.823 --> 0:01:51.653 developers have gone to a lot of trouble to have 0:01:51.653 --> 0:01:55.343 something that will cover a lot of different services very 0:01:55.343 --> 0:02:00.773 smoothly and perhaps put less stress on the arm. It 0:02:00.773 --> 0:02:07.793 can be found@sensible.com.au sensible com.au. It's good to see these 0:02:07.823 --> 0:02:09.593 Australian initiatives. Damo. 0:02:09.623 --> 0:02:12.773 It absolutely is. And for anyone who's ever got their 0:02:12.773 --> 0:02:15.923 cane stuck in a crack in the pavement and winded themselves, 0:02:16.103 --> 0:02:19.493 I'm sure it would be a welcome innovation. 0:02:19.523 --> 0:02:24.803 Yes. So sensible. Com dot a u. Now let's talk 0:02:24.803 --> 0:02:28.313 about the higher technology sort of stuff that's going on. 0:02:28.313 --> 0:02:31.692 and there are some interesting devices that are in development 0:02:31.692 --> 0:02:36.733 or very early stages of availability. Tell me about the glide. 0:02:37.063 --> 0:02:40.782 Yeah, the glide is an interesting one. Gliding is the 0:02:40.782 --> 0:02:43.873 company that's producing that one. And they are at this 0:02:43.873 --> 0:02:48.373 point a start up. So it's not currently available. And 0:02:48.373 --> 0:02:51.252 I think they're initially going to launch it in the 0:02:51.252 --> 0:02:55.303 US and the UK. And they have taken some pre-orders 0:02:55.303 --> 0:03:00.612 from those countries. It is essentially a guide robot type device. 0:03:00.613 --> 0:03:05.203 It's about 8in or 20cm tall, and it has a 0:03:05.203 --> 0:03:09.282 telescopic handle that the user holds on to, and it 0:03:09.282 --> 0:03:13.423 has some wheels underneath it and it rolls along. You're 0:03:13.423 --> 0:03:18.703 holding the handle by steering the power assisted wheels. It 0:03:18.703 --> 0:03:23.263 provides guidance, and it has a range of different sensors 0:03:23.262 --> 0:03:27.493 to help you with things like obstacle avoidance and that 0:03:27.493 --> 0:03:30.673 type of thing. So quite an interesting one. I'm not 0:03:30.673 --> 0:03:34.543 quite sure how I feel about it personally, and whether 0:03:34.542 --> 0:03:37.813 I would ever be willing to swap my dog guide 0:03:37.813 --> 0:03:41.742 for a robot device at this stage, I absolutely wouldn't. Um, 0:03:41.863 --> 0:03:45.523 but it's it's certainly an interesting concept, and there's been 0:03:45.523 --> 0:03:47.803 quite a bit of interest in it overseas. 0:03:47.833 --> 0:03:51.193 Yes, it's developed in the United States. I think they're 0:03:51.193 --> 0:03:54.642 intending it would be available in about a year's time 0:03:54.643 --> 0:03:58.693 in the United States. And I imagine about two years 0:03:58.693 --> 0:04:00.523 or so before we would see it. And I think 0:04:00.523 --> 0:04:03.793 it's about 1500 bucks us they're anticipating. 0:04:03.823 --> 0:04:04.663 Yes. That's right. 0:04:04.693 --> 0:04:06.283 Not too bad. No. 0:04:06.313 --> 0:04:08.113 And I think for a lot of people, you know, 0:04:08.143 --> 0:04:11.473 it does have the potential to perhaps give them a 0:04:11.473 --> 0:04:15.433 different type of mobility to, to what they're currently experiencing. 0:04:15.463 --> 0:04:17.503 The device itself, as I understand it, is sort of 0:04:17.533 --> 0:04:19.452 a rounded shape. So I picture it as being like 0:04:19.453 --> 0:04:22.213 a bucket with a telescopic handle off one side of it. 0:04:22.213 --> 0:04:24.642 But given that it's not available here, I haven't actually 0:04:24.643 --> 0:04:27.323 been able to get a hands on look at one 0:04:27.323 --> 0:04:27.983 of these. 0:04:28.013 --> 0:04:30.113 But you have looked at a prototype of a thing 0:04:30.113 --> 0:04:31.613 called a biped. 0:04:31.793 --> 0:04:38.543 Yes. The Noah product from biped II, which is based 0:04:38.543 --> 0:04:44.483 in Sweden, and this one is described as a harness. 0:04:44.483 --> 0:04:48.683 So it is a wearable device, and you have the 0:04:48.713 --> 0:04:52.283 sort of metal band of the harness goes around the 0:04:52.283 --> 0:04:55.523 back of your neck. And then there are two box 0:04:55.553 --> 0:05:01.823 like structures that sit against your shoulders, pointing forward. The 0:05:01.823 --> 0:05:05.693 batteries go into the part that goes around the back 0:05:05.693 --> 0:05:09.233 of your neck, and in the two structures you have 0:05:09.263 --> 0:05:14.213 sort of all of the smarts, including the cameras and sensors. Now, 0:05:14.213 --> 0:05:16.733 the idea with this one is that you wear the 0:05:16.733 --> 0:05:22.223 device and it does obstacle detection. It has some AI 0:05:22.253 --> 0:05:25.213 built into it, which is designed to help you find 0:05:25.213 --> 0:05:30.373 a way around obstacles. And when paired with your phone 0:05:30.373 --> 0:05:35.353 and used with a set of aftershocks bone conduction type headphones, 0:05:35.353 --> 0:05:38.233 it will also give you some spoken feedback, so it'll 0:05:38.233 --> 0:05:44.263 give you distances to obstacles. It also can do GPS navigation. 0:05:44.263 --> 0:05:46.243 So they've tried to make it sort of an all 0:05:46.243 --> 0:05:49.783 in one, rather than having a GPS device, a cane 0:05:49.783 --> 0:05:53.683 or a dog and a perhaps a pair of smart glasses, 0:05:53.683 --> 0:05:56.833 they've tried to sort of integrate all of those different 0:05:56.863 --> 0:06:00.073 tools into one device. 0:06:00.283 --> 0:06:03.943 What's interesting about this device, and also the glide, is 0:06:03.943 --> 0:06:08.083 that they're very much software dependent, of course. So once 0:06:08.083 --> 0:06:12.523 you buy the basic device, um, the hardware may not change, 0:06:12.523 --> 0:06:15.013 but the software will evolve over time. 0:06:15.103 --> 0:06:18.013 Yes. That's right. I mean, I suspect with the biped 0:06:18.013 --> 0:06:22.543 unit because it contains camera technology, you know, as lidar 0:06:22.543 --> 0:06:26.923 technology and those things develop. They may revise the hardware 0:06:26.923 --> 0:06:30.553 at different times to give it, you know, greater resolution 0:06:30.553 --> 0:06:33.913 and be able to feed more information to the eye 0:06:33.913 --> 0:06:36.373 in the back end, if you like. But yes, a 0:06:36.373 --> 0:06:39.463 lot of these things are very much software based. 0:06:39.493 --> 0:06:42.733 Is the biped far away from being available in Australia? 0:06:42.763 --> 0:06:46.243 I don't think so. Um, I believe that Vision Australia 0:06:46.243 --> 0:06:50.983 will be offering it. There's, um, some discussions and things 0:06:50.983 --> 0:06:53.173 ongoing at the moment, but I'm hopeful that we will 0:06:53.173 --> 0:06:56.113 be able to see that one fairly soon. 0:06:56.143 --> 0:06:58.003 I know you can't give me an exact price, but 0:06:58.033 --> 0:06:59.983 what sort of money are we talking about? 0:07:00.013 --> 0:07:05.383 I believe it's around the 7500 dollars mark. It's not 0:07:05.383 --> 0:07:08.413 a cheap piece of equipment, and it's something that I 0:07:08.413 --> 0:07:10.843 think you would have to be really fairly sure that 0:07:10.843 --> 0:07:15.373 it's going to suit your particular needs. O&M orientation mobility 0:07:15.373 --> 0:07:19.303 is a very individualized thing. You know, it'll be awesome 0:07:19.303 --> 0:07:22.423 for some people and for others, it definitely won't suit them. 0:07:22.443 --> 0:07:25.353 Lots of trialling will have to be available, I imagine, 0:07:25.353 --> 0:07:26.973 for expensive purchases. 0:07:27.003 --> 0:07:28.623 Yes, absolutely. 0:07:28.713 --> 0:07:33.213 You've been doing some work recently with your phone, your iPhone, 0:07:33.213 --> 0:07:38.193 using it to get some orientation or mobility tips. Where 0:07:38.223 --> 0:07:39.333 are you at with that? 0:07:39.573 --> 0:07:43.263 So there's a couple of things that I've been experimenting with, 0:07:43.263 --> 0:07:49.503 particularly with the update to iOS 18. The fact that 0:07:49.503 --> 0:07:53.943 some of the navigation modes or camera modes that you 0:07:53.973 --> 0:07:57.843 used to have to access through the magnifier app are 0:07:57.843 --> 0:08:00.903 now available on the rotor, so it becomes very easy 0:08:00.903 --> 0:08:04.503 to activate them on the fly. There's a couple of 0:08:04.503 --> 0:08:07.713 things that I've been experimenting with a few weeks ago. 0:08:07.713 --> 0:08:10.803 On a recent trip to Melbourne, we were staying in 0:08:10.803 --> 0:08:13.803 a hotel where we were about as far away from 0:08:13.803 --> 0:08:16.563 the lifts as it was possible to be, and it 0:08:16.563 --> 0:08:19.803 was one of those situations where the corridor had about 0:08:19.803 --> 0:08:24.003 20 or 30 different twists and turns and changes of direction, 0:08:24.003 --> 0:08:26.313 and all of the parts of the corridor kind of 0:08:26.343 --> 0:08:30.603 felt the same. So in that instance, I used the 0:08:30.603 --> 0:08:35.043 text detection and the door detection features in the iPhone 0:08:35.043 --> 0:08:38.763 Pro models to be able to identify the door of 0:08:38.763 --> 0:08:43.293 my room and also be able to read the room numbers, 0:08:43.352 --> 0:08:47.162 because there's nothing more disconcerting than trying a door and 0:08:47.163 --> 0:08:49.563 discovering that it's not yours, and that you might be 0:08:49.563 --> 0:08:51.453 frightening the life out of the person on the other 0:08:51.453 --> 0:08:55.412 side of the door. That was actually very helpful. The 0:08:55.413 --> 0:08:58.263 other thing that I've been experimenting with a little bit 0:08:58.263 --> 0:09:01.413 is the people detection mode, which has been around for 0:09:01.413 --> 0:09:04.833 a while, but I've never really used it in any 0:09:04.833 --> 0:09:08.282 great detail, but it can be quite helpful if you're 0:09:08.283 --> 0:09:13.052 trying to, for example, follow someone, and also if you're 0:09:13.053 --> 0:09:16.862 getting onto a crowded bus or train. I don't know 0:09:16.862 --> 0:09:20.132 about other dog guide users, but mine will find me 0:09:20.132 --> 0:09:23.432 a seat, whether it's a vacant one or a or occupied, 0:09:23.433 --> 0:09:26.043 particularly if the occupant happens to be eating a pie 0:09:26.043 --> 0:09:29.282 or something like that. So being able to actually identify 0:09:29.283 --> 0:09:31.443 whether a seat is vacant before you put your hand 0:09:31.473 --> 0:09:34.142 out or go to sit down is pretty helpful. So 0:09:34.142 --> 0:09:37.262 I have been using some of these built in features 0:09:37.262 --> 0:09:39.332 over the last few weeks and found them to be 0:09:39.333 --> 0:09:42.333 quite helpful. I should stress that there is a bit 0:09:42.333 --> 0:09:45.933 of a limitation in that they don't all work on 0:09:45.933 --> 0:09:50.073 all models. Some of these features do require the LiDAR 0:09:50.073 --> 0:09:55.652 feature available in the Pro Series, iPhone 16 Pro, 15 Pro, 0:09:55.683 --> 0:09:58.413 14 Pro, and so on in order to get the 0:09:58.413 --> 0:09:59.433 most out of them. 0:09:59.463 --> 0:10:02.732 Yes, I'm very interested in those ones and very convenient. 0:10:02.762 --> 0:10:07.713 Let's talk about now the meta Ray-Ban glasses and IRA. 0:10:07.742 --> 0:10:09.662 There's been some action there. 0:10:09.693 --> 0:10:13.742 Yes there has. So for a few weeks IRA have 0:10:13.742 --> 0:10:17.943 had in a sort of a closed beta operating where 0:10:18.242 --> 0:10:22.912 you could register for being able to access IRA through 0:10:22.943 --> 0:10:27.083 your meta smart glasses. So it gives you a essentially 0:10:27.083 --> 0:10:30.803 a hands free option, similar to perhaps what you get 0:10:30.803 --> 0:10:33.532 through things like the envision glasses or those that remember 0:10:33.533 --> 0:10:38.272 the original IRA glasses when they first came out. The 0:10:38.272 --> 0:10:41.872 implementation is not perfect at this stage. They are using 0:10:41.872 --> 0:10:46.973 the WhatsApp application to do the video calls. But on Monday, 0:10:47.002 --> 0:10:51.143 IRA opened that beta program up so that any IRA 0:10:51.173 --> 0:10:54.443 user can, um, if they have a set of meta 0:10:54.473 --> 0:10:57.563 smart glasses, they can access the IRA service through them. 0:10:57.563 --> 0:11:02.603 So when you update your IRA explorer app, there's now 0:11:02.602 --> 0:11:05.992 a customized call option. And one of the options you 0:11:05.992 --> 0:11:10.703 can select there is meta Ray-Ban glasses. They're very keen 0:11:10.703 --> 0:11:14.693 for people's feedback, and they're also encouraging people to lobby 0:11:14.723 --> 0:11:18.802 meta to open up their API, as it were, so 0:11:18.803 --> 0:11:23.213 that they can work directly with the IRA application. 0:11:23.453 --> 0:11:25.882 The name dolphin's been around a while. 0:11:25.882 --> 0:11:30.892 So dolphin is a British company and as you say, 0:11:30.892 --> 0:11:33.742 they've been around for a while. I can remember using Hal, 0:11:33.742 --> 0:11:35.963 which was their DOS screen reader back in the day, 0:11:35.963 --> 0:11:39.803 and I'm showing my age here. I know, but their 0:11:39.803 --> 0:11:42.923 supernova product has also been around for a while, and 0:11:42.923 --> 0:11:46.372 it is a predominantly, I guess, a screen enhancement program, 0:11:46.372 --> 0:11:48.923 although it does come in a few different flavors. So 0:11:48.923 --> 0:11:54.053 there is the magnifier only version. There is a version 0:11:54.053 --> 0:11:58.823 that is a magnifier with some speech functionality for reading documents, 0:11:58.852 --> 0:12:01.763 reading emails, that type of thing. And then they have 0:12:01.762 --> 0:12:05.813 a version which is a full magnifier and full screen reader. 0:12:05.902 --> 0:12:09.053 It is sort of, I suppose, a competitor product to 0:12:09.083 --> 0:12:14.213 zoom text and fusion. Very similar functionality. So it does 0:12:14.213 --> 0:12:19.823 your speech, your magnification. There is a USB version available, 0:12:19.823 --> 0:12:22.762 and it can also be paired with a number of 0:12:22.762 --> 0:12:28.552 different webcams and document cameras to provide magnification for printed 0:12:28.553 --> 0:12:33.323 documents and distance magnification, depending on the camera that you're using. 0:12:33.352 --> 0:12:35.273 It just runs in the windows environment. 0:12:35.272 --> 0:12:36.892 It is a windows application. 0:12:36.892 --> 0:12:39.142 Yes, it's had an update recently. 0:12:39.173 --> 0:12:42.913 Yes it has. So dolphin have on the 10th of 0:12:42.913 --> 0:12:50.093 October released version 23.03, which addresses some compatibility issues with 0:12:50.093 --> 0:12:55.282 the latest versions of Microsoft Office 365. Those of you 0:12:55.283 --> 0:12:58.433 that use office 365 would know that on a fairly 0:12:58.433 --> 0:13:03.772 regular basis, Microsoft release updates and sometimes they work well, 0:13:03.772 --> 0:13:07.313 and other times they sort of introduce accessibility challenges. There 0:13:07.313 --> 0:13:11.272 are the usual array of bug fixes and enhancements, and 0:13:11.272 --> 0:13:17.573 also some support for some new webcam and document camera devices. 0:13:17.573 --> 0:13:21.232 So those people who are already using a version of 0:13:21.232 --> 0:13:25.703 supernova 23, you should get that update automatically. So the 0:13:25.703 --> 0:13:28.042 next time you start up supernova, it should prompt you 0:13:28.043 --> 0:13:31.613 to install the update. Uh, of course, if you're running 0:13:31.612 --> 0:13:34.553 an earlier version of supernova, then you would need to 0:13:34.583 --> 0:13:39.293 sort of purchase an upgrade in order to get version 23. 0:13:39.293 --> 0:13:42.352 But once you do that, you would automatically be looking 0:13:42.352 --> 0:13:44.813 at 23.03. 0:13:44.843 --> 0:13:47.992 What's the best way to find out about supernova? If 0:13:47.992 --> 0:13:50.333 people are curious after hearing you talk about it. 0:13:50.333 --> 0:13:55.732 It is available through the Vision Store website. You can 0:13:55.732 --> 0:14:00.112 also download directly from dolphin and we'll put the link 0:14:00.112 --> 0:14:03.532 in the show notes. You can actually download a fully 0:14:03.533 --> 0:14:07.522 functional 30 day trial of supernova, so it's not a 0:14:07.522 --> 0:14:10.612 timed demo, um, in that it will work, you know, 0:14:10.642 --> 0:14:12.833 all day, every day for 30 days and give you 0:14:12.833 --> 0:14:16.273 an opportunity to give it a really good road test, 0:14:16.272 --> 0:14:19.603 as it were. Before you buy, it is slightly cheaper 0:14:19.603 --> 0:14:24.283 than Fusion and Zoomtext, and there are a number of 0:14:24.283 --> 0:14:27.672 different upgrade options available in terms of the software maintenance 0:14:27.673 --> 0:14:28.782 agreements as well. 0:14:28.813 --> 0:14:32.803 Dolphin supernova Before we go, a reminder you can find 0:14:32.833 --> 0:14:35.292 details of what we've been talking about in this and 0:14:35.293 --> 0:14:41.623 previous editions of the program from VA radio.org/talking tech. VA 0:14:41.623 --> 0:14:46.483 radio.org/talking tech and to right to the program. 0:14:46.483 --> 0:14:51.912 Damo Damo dot McMorrow m c m o r o 0:14:51.913 --> 0:14:54.073 w at Vision Australia. 0:14:54.403 --> 0:14:59.653 Org Damo dot McMorrow at Vision Australia. Org this has 0:14:59.653 --> 0:15:02.653 been talking tech with me has been Vision Australia's national 0:15:02.653 --> 0:15:07.063 access technology manager Damo McMorrow I'm Stephen Jolly. Stay safe. 0:15:07.063 --> 0:15:09.013 We'll talk more tech next week. See you.