WEBVTT - Talking Tech 14th November 2023 0:00:08.148 --> 0:00:11.778 Hello everyone! Welcome to Talking Tech. This edition available from 0:00:11.778 --> 0:00:15.888 November 14th, 2023. I'm Stephen Jolly. Great to have you 0:00:15.888 --> 0:00:20.208 with us listening through maybe Virgin Australia Radio associated sessions 0:00:20.208 --> 0:00:24.108 of Australia or maybe the Community Radio Network. There is 0:00:24.108 --> 0:00:26.748 also the podcast to catch that, all you need to 0:00:26.748 --> 0:00:30.288 do is search for the two words talking tech and 0:00:30.288 --> 0:00:33.168 down a canal come usually on a Tuesday afternoon just 0:00:33.168 --> 0:00:36.558 after it's been produced. Another option is to ask your 0:00:36.558 --> 0:00:40.428 Siri device or smart speaker to play Vision Australia Radio 0:00:40.428 --> 0:00:45.768 talking tech podcast Vision Australia Radio talking tech podcast with me, 0:00:45.768 --> 0:00:48.618 someone who can explain all this tech stuff really well. 0:00:48.618 --> 0:00:54.888 Vision Australia's national advisor on access technology, David Woodbridge David, 0:00:55.128 --> 0:00:58.128 let's start with a bit of an update to a 0:00:58.128 --> 0:01:02.058 conversation we had last week about the vision store, where 0:01:02.058 --> 0:01:06.768 you were talking about the great reservoir. It is for 0:01:06.768 --> 0:01:09.528 Christmas gifts, but people have got to make sure they 0:01:09.528 --> 0:01:11.868 make the last order date to get it to their 0:01:11.868 --> 0:01:13.008 friends by Christmas. 0:01:13.218 --> 0:01:16.818 So the order cutoff date is in two parts, actually. 0:01:17.058 --> 0:01:21.948 So if you're anywhere else in Australia except for Western Australia, 0:01:21.948 --> 0:01:25.788 then the cutoff date is actually 8th of December. And 0:01:25.788 --> 0:01:28.368 if you are in Western Australia then the cut off 0:01:28.368 --> 0:01:33.768 date is the 1st of December. So again, Western Australia 0:01:33.768 --> 0:01:37.218 is actually the 1st of December. Anywhere else in Australia, 0:01:37.218 --> 0:01:40.998 including Tasmania is actually the 8th of December. 0:01:41.148 --> 0:01:45.768 And those dates are Fridays. We did mention last week 0:01:45.768 --> 0:01:52.518 the brilliant and the major update to version 2.1, and 0:01:52.518 --> 0:01:54.618 you've been playing with those updates. 0:01:55.368 --> 0:01:58.398 I have, as we pointed out, that our will now 0:01:58.398 --> 0:02:03.018 connect with the Vision Australia library. So in in iOS 0:02:03.018 --> 0:02:08.418 or Android terms, the connect. And it was absolutely amazing 0:02:08.418 --> 0:02:13.098 because I was able to listen to everything that the 0:02:13.098 --> 0:02:17.808 visual library offers. So I was enjoying a couple of 0:02:17.808 --> 0:02:22.818 my already on my bookshelf Daisy audio books. Then I 0:02:22.818 --> 0:02:27.198 was able to read the Sydney Morning Herald in Braille, 0:02:27.198 --> 0:02:31.988 actually on the Braille display of the Bryant, and also 0:02:31.998 --> 0:02:35.538 was able to listen to a few podcasts, including Talking 0:02:35.538 --> 0:02:39.138 Tech from Vision Australia Radio, which was also very awesome. 0:02:39.798 --> 0:02:43.848 And just to note for people that for what I've 0:02:43.848 --> 0:02:46.128 got is that if I return a book on my bookshelf, 0:02:46.128 --> 0:02:48.378 which you can do on the Bryant, I've actually got 0:02:48.378 --> 0:02:52.998 my profile set up on Vision Australia Library to automatically 0:02:52.998 --> 0:02:56.538 suggest another book to me once I've returned one. Now, 0:02:56.538 --> 0:02:58.908 if you don't have that turned on in your profile, 0:02:59.178 --> 0:03:01.458 what would have to happen is that you'd have to 0:03:01.458 --> 0:03:06.648 log in either on the connect app on Android or iOS, 0:03:06.738 --> 0:03:11.508 or on the web page for Vision Australia library, and 0:03:11.508 --> 0:03:14.778 actually search and add a book there so you actually 0:03:14.778 --> 0:03:21.168 can't add a book inside the online Daisy Vision Australia 0:03:21.168 --> 0:03:24.228 library service. But like I just said, if you've got 0:03:24.228 --> 0:03:26.808 an automatic update once you've returned to book, then you 0:03:26.808 --> 0:03:27.558 should be fine. 0:03:27.888 --> 0:03:31.218 But it's pretty good how the newspapers tumble down as 0:03:31.218 --> 0:03:32.418 they're published, don't they? 0:03:32.808 --> 0:03:36.528 It's incredible. Yeah, and the one nice thing about Brown, 0:03:36.528 --> 0:03:39.918 which we always keep getting caught out with speech, is 0:03:39.918 --> 0:03:42.078 that you really get to learn how people spell their 0:03:42.078 --> 0:03:44.988 names or other things going on in the world that 0:03:44.988 --> 0:03:48.438 you're actually literally reading in under your fingertips. So that's 0:03:48.438 --> 0:03:51.378 one of the things I miss about Braille in particular, 0:03:51.378 --> 0:03:52.938 is that you don't have that sort of one on 0:03:52.938 --> 0:03:54.618 one correspondence for literacy. 0:03:54.918 --> 0:03:57.588 Leader has been with us now as a technology in 0:03:57.588 --> 0:04:00.588 the iPhone for three years. It came out with the 0:04:00.588 --> 0:04:05.358 iPhone 12. More and more work is being done to 0:04:05.358 --> 0:04:09.138 make use of this technology. And there's an app that 0:04:09.138 --> 0:04:13.908 you discovered recently called Obstacle Detector. What do you reckon? 0:04:14.418 --> 0:04:16.428 It's a very good start. I mean, there's been a 0:04:16.428 --> 0:04:18.918 few of these apps over the years that have work with, 0:04:18.948 --> 0:04:22.038 you know, the 12 Pro, 13 Pro, 14 Pro and 0:04:22.038 --> 0:04:24.948 of course the 15 Pro. And look, it has it 0:04:24.948 --> 0:04:29.058 has vibration, it has audio and it has speech, which 0:04:29.058 --> 0:04:30.998 what I would advise not to use because it all 0:04:31.008 --> 0:04:33.408 makes make the app unusable because it keeps talking at 0:04:33.408 --> 0:04:37.218 distances and so on. But as a good starting point 0:04:37.218 --> 0:04:41.028 to tell you how far you're away from an object. 0:04:41.028 --> 0:04:44.598 So of course, in the old terms, the closer the clicks, 0:04:44.598 --> 0:04:47.358 the closer you are, the lower the slower the clicks, 0:04:47.358 --> 0:04:50.628 the further away you are. And I think if I 0:04:50.628 --> 0:04:53.898 was going to test this absolutely properly, then I would 0:04:53.898 --> 0:04:58.458 suggest maybe wearing a chest harness or a lanyard around 0:04:58.458 --> 0:05:00.258 your neck, which sort of may or may not work 0:05:00.258 --> 0:05:03.318 because it still moves when you're walking around. But look, 0:05:03.318 --> 0:05:06.018 I think it's a good start because rather than spending, 0:05:06.678 --> 0:05:10.128 I don't know, six. $700 on a on a sonar 0:05:10.128 --> 0:05:13.308 device you're spending. If you want to buy the full version, 0:05:13.308 --> 0:05:17.448 $7 on something that you know may work for you 0:05:17.448 --> 0:05:21.258 and may not. Keeping in mind that you've got all 0:05:21.258 --> 0:05:24.108 the other lead functions such as door detection and so 0:05:24.108 --> 0:05:28.758 on in the camera app on iOS, but it's one 0:05:28.758 --> 0:05:30.978 of those apps where I think because somebody has gone 0:05:30.978 --> 0:05:34.458 to the trouble of writing and developing such an app, 0:05:35.118 --> 0:05:38.538 I would love it if people gave the developer feedback 0:05:38.538 --> 0:05:42.878 and constructive feedback. So saying, look, this is really fantastic. 0:05:42.888 --> 0:05:45.078 It would it be possible to do A, B, C, 0:05:45.078 --> 0:05:48.648 and D and really encourage this developer and perhaps other 0:05:48.648 --> 0:05:53.178 developers to take on this type of orientation mobility software 0:05:53.178 --> 0:05:55.608 on your smartphone, in this case, the iPhone. 0:05:55.818 --> 0:06:00.528 That's obstacle detector, very easy to find in the App Store. 0:06:01.008 --> 0:06:04.548 As Christmas approaches, we start to think about how we 0:06:04.548 --> 0:06:09.408 might treat others, or even ourselves. And maybe the device 0:06:09.408 --> 0:06:12.348 of the year is the sense player from hims. 0:06:12.768 --> 0:06:15.588 You know, look, I was looking back over all my gadgets. 0:06:15.588 --> 0:06:18.738 Now I've got two shelves that are four meters long, 0:06:18.738 --> 0:06:22.548 practically with lots and lots of tech on them, including 0:06:22.548 --> 0:06:25.668 other areas of this room. And I was thinking, if 0:06:25.668 --> 0:06:28.728 I had to really sit down and work out what 0:06:28.728 --> 0:06:35.088 the most interesting, innovative, good looking, easy to use, most 0:06:35.088 --> 0:06:38.718 productive little piece of hardware that I could possibly have 0:06:38.718 --> 0:06:42.858 in my hand, of course, besides my iPhone, then I 0:06:42.858 --> 0:06:45.348 really think it really does need to be the sense 0:06:45.348 --> 0:06:49.728 player OCR 80. And the reason for that is because 0:06:49.728 --> 0:06:52.788 we've got the FM radio. We can use it as 0:06:52.788 --> 0:06:58.668 a custom keyboard to your smartphone iPhone in particular. We 0:06:58.668 --> 0:07:04.308 can listen to podcasts, Daisy books, the web, radio in particular, 0:07:04.368 --> 0:07:08.118 use it as a recorder and so on. And the 0:07:08.118 --> 0:07:11.688 fact that it looks like a really cool little device 0:07:11.688 --> 0:07:15.378 in your hand, plus the fact that it's got stereo speakers, 0:07:15.378 --> 0:07:18.048 which to me is actually a really cool thing. When 0:07:18.048 --> 0:07:21.318 you're listening to good audio, then I don't think there's 0:07:21.318 --> 0:07:24.588 anything not in the device. And one really cool thing, 0:07:24.588 --> 0:07:27.768 I came across this really lovely thing that was mentioned 0:07:27.768 --> 0:07:30.858 on Vision Australia as part of our workplace web hub, 0:07:31.068 --> 0:07:34.998 and that is the light that cannot be seen. And 0:07:34.998 --> 0:07:40.218 it's an audio described miniseries about a blind girl meeting 0:07:40.218 --> 0:07:44.838 a German soldier during the last part of the Second 0:07:44.838 --> 0:07:49.488 World War. And it's beautifully done. The actress is absolutely 0:07:49.488 --> 0:07:53.538 amazing portraying a blind person, and I listen to that 0:07:53.538 --> 0:07:57.468 on Netflix on my sense player. How cool is that? 0:07:57.468 --> 0:08:01.338 Listening to an absolutely beautiful little miniseries and being able 0:08:01.338 --> 0:08:03.498 to listen to it on my little handheld device. 0:08:03.678 --> 0:08:08.748 And it's great with Connectable headset, 3.5 mil connection, or 0:08:08.748 --> 0:08:12.558 of course, the Bluetooth. And it's very good with the 0:08:12.558 --> 0:08:17.928 Apple AirPods. Great little device. I Bluetooth that yesterday to 0:08:17.928 --> 0:08:21.468 my speakers in the lounge room, and could quickly change 0:08:21.468 --> 0:08:24.468 from one web stream to another, and it worked beautifully. 0:08:24.468 --> 0:08:25.848 It was like a remote control. 0:08:26.268 --> 0:08:27.198 Nice little device. 0:08:27.588 --> 0:08:30.438 Tell me about Octo Studio. 0:08:30.798 --> 0:08:33.648 Over the last several years or so, we've had a 0:08:33.648 --> 0:08:37.188 number of apps brought out by, in particular, places like 0:08:37.188 --> 0:08:40.128 the emerging printing house for the blind to do with 0:08:40.128 --> 0:08:44.148 teaching blind or low vision children how to code. And 0:08:44.148 --> 0:08:45.918 most of it's been around the sort of concept of 0:08:45.918 --> 0:08:49.788 block programming where you basically add blocks or code chunks 0:08:49.788 --> 0:08:52.548 into a stack, and you can change them around and 0:08:52.548 --> 0:08:55.428 you can do sounds or pictures or images and that 0:08:55.428 --> 0:08:59.208 sort of cool stuff. And what Perkins School for the 0:08:59.208 --> 0:09:02.958 blind have done in conjunction with MIT, who really knows 0:09:02.958 --> 0:09:07.278 what they are? They actually have an app called Octo Studio, 0:09:07.278 --> 0:09:11.328 which again is for seven years and above, teaching blind 0:09:11.328 --> 0:09:15.558 and low vision and sighted children originally sighted how to 0:09:15.558 --> 0:09:18.408 do block coding. And what they've done is they've made 0:09:18.408 --> 0:09:23.598 the app on iOS and Android screen reader friendly. So 0:09:23.598 --> 0:09:25.848 if you're on iOS, VoiceOver works. If you're on Android, 0:09:25.848 --> 0:09:29.208 talkback works. And look, I wouldn't say the apps and 0:09:29.208 --> 0:09:32.868 they admit this. It's not 100% accessible, but 90% of 0:09:32.868 --> 0:09:37.308 it is fine for doing basic block coding so you 0:09:37.308 --> 0:09:41.178 can pick your image, sound, etcetera. And you can build 0:09:41.178 --> 0:09:44.118 this little program, and then you can run the program. 0:09:44.118 --> 0:09:47.958 And the video that they had was a strawberry on 0:09:47.958 --> 0:09:51.378 a plate getting squashed. Remember this is for children. So 0:09:51.378 --> 0:09:54.138 that's why the strawberry got squashed. But no, it's really, 0:09:54.138 --> 0:09:58.518 really cool. It's free. So octo as it sounds studio 0:09:58.518 --> 0:10:02.478 and I think it's really worthwhile. It's again another tool 0:10:02.478 --> 0:10:08.308 in your toolbox for getting your young folks into Stem science. Technology, 0:10:08.308 --> 0:10:09.778 engineering and mathematics. 0:10:10.018 --> 0:10:13.798 There was an article on VS which is the Blindness 0:10:13.798 --> 0:10:18.358 Community Forum for Apple Stuff, an article there are a 0:10:18.358 --> 0:10:23.608 few weeks ago about the Mac and how well Apple 0:10:23.608 --> 0:10:26.878 is playing the game, supporting the Mac for blind users. 0:10:27.268 --> 0:10:28.738 Tell us about the article. 0:10:29.368 --> 0:10:33.058 Yeah, the article was basically entitled I can no longer 0:10:33.058 --> 0:10:37.348 recommend the Mac for people who are blind in particular. 0:10:37.348 --> 0:10:39.418 And this was all based around Safari. So when using 0:10:39.418 --> 0:10:44.128 Safari on some web pages or maybe lots of web pages, 0:10:44.128 --> 0:10:47.218 for this person that wrote the article, you would get 0:10:47.578 --> 0:10:50.548 Safari not responding. And this person said that this got 0:10:50.548 --> 0:10:54.238 to such a state of irritation that he now can 0:10:54.238 --> 0:10:58.978 no longer recommend the Mac, particularly if using web browsing 0:10:58.978 --> 0:11:03.268 in good conscience to people actually using Safari. And he said, 0:11:03.268 --> 0:11:05.878 I know you can do workarounds. I know you can 0:11:05.878 --> 0:11:09.268 go and use another app, but, you know, honestly, VoiceOver 0:11:09.268 --> 0:11:11.938 should be fixed so it works with the application that's 0:11:11.938 --> 0:11:13.588 built in, which is Safari. 0:11:13.918 --> 0:11:14.938 What's your reaction? 0:11:15.298 --> 0:11:18.538 My reaction is it's that old thing about chucking out 0:11:18.538 --> 0:11:22.048 the baby with the bathwater. I haven't had the safari 0:11:22.048 --> 0:11:26.188 not responding now for quite a long time, but even 0:11:26.188 --> 0:11:30.598 on windows, when I had issues with Microsoft Edge or 0:11:30.598 --> 0:11:34.018 Firefox or Chrome and one of them didn't work, I 0:11:34.018 --> 0:11:35.968 just went and switched to another browser. I mean, at 0:11:35.968 --> 0:11:37.858 the end of the day, it was no big deal. 0:11:38.248 --> 0:11:40.318 And I really think that's the attitude we need to 0:11:40.318 --> 0:11:42.808 take with the Mac. Just because VoiceOver is built in 0:11:42.808 --> 0:11:46.828 and just because it supposedly crashes all the time with Safari. 0:11:47.428 --> 0:11:51.088 That's one program that I use out of about 20 0:11:51.088 --> 0:11:54.688 programs on the Mac. So just because one program doesn't 0:11:54.688 --> 0:11:56.968 work doesn't mean you should stop using the Mac. So 0:11:56.968 --> 0:11:59.368 that's sort of my argument against that particular article. 0:11:59.368 --> 0:12:02.638 But let's hope the issue is dealt with so that 0:12:02.638 --> 0:12:05.248 you don't have to go another way around. Don't stop 0:12:05.248 --> 0:12:08.788 yourself having the benefit of pretty good technology. Just like 0:12:08.788 --> 0:12:13.408 windows technologies. You've had an interesting experience using audible because 0:12:13.408 --> 0:12:15.958 you're one of these people who uses the same app 0:12:15.958 --> 0:12:18.418 on different platforms. Tell us about it. 0:12:18.688 --> 0:12:20.968 I've been listening to see if other people have this issue. 0:12:20.968 --> 0:12:23.818 So when I'm using the audible app on iOS or 0:12:23.818 --> 0:12:27.358 on my iPhone 14 Pro, when I go down the 0:12:27.358 --> 0:12:31.558 main home tab where you've got suggestions of titles or books, 0:12:31.768 --> 0:12:36.358 what VoiceOver says is details button, and then practically almost 0:12:36.358 --> 0:12:39.868 like it's reading an image of the title of the book, 0:12:39.868 --> 0:12:42.568 and sometimes it reads it properly and sometimes it doesn't. 0:12:42.568 --> 0:12:44.458 And if it doesn't read it properly, I just get 0:12:44.458 --> 0:12:48.478 details button. Now, when I use the exactly same app 0:12:48.898 --> 0:12:52.618 cause different coding was on Android, when I go down 0:12:52.618 --> 0:12:56.908 the home tab on suggested titles, it reads out that 0:12:56.908 --> 0:12:59.758 all the titles of the books properly, you know? So 0:12:59.758 --> 0:13:02.518 I get Harry Potter, Philosopher's Stone and then a bit 0:13:02.518 --> 0:13:05.068 of a little summary who the author is and so on. 0:13:05.248 --> 0:13:09.858 But I definitely don't get anything about details. Button and you, 0:13:10.028 --> 0:13:11.968 you know, you feel like it's sort of reading half 0:13:11.968 --> 0:13:14.278 of the screen and half the time it's all jumbled up. 0:13:14.278 --> 0:13:16.678 So what? I'd love to know. And you can email 0:13:16.678 --> 0:13:20.158 David Woodbridge at Vision Australia at org. Are other people 0:13:20.158 --> 0:13:25.048 experiencing this very annoying issue on iOS? Because if you are, 0:13:25.048 --> 0:13:27.028 I'd love to hear from you. And in that way 0:13:27.028 --> 0:13:31.198 I can email or you can email, particularly us in Australia, audible, 0:13:31.198 --> 0:13:34.558 Australian Audible and just give some feedback to them because, 0:13:34.558 --> 0:13:37.318 you know, I've got lots and lots of books and audible. 0:13:37.318 --> 0:13:41.128 I'd I'd love to read my title suggestions properly. 0:13:41.488 --> 0:13:43.888 Just before we go, a reminder of where people can 0:13:43.888 --> 0:13:46.408 find details of what you've been talking about in this 0:13:46.408 --> 0:13:48.118 and previous editions of the program. 0:13:48.538 --> 0:13:50.938 So as always, you can check out my blog site, 0:13:50.938 --> 0:13:54.688 which is David Woodbine dot Podbean podbean. 0:13:54.868 --> 0:14:00.118 Com David would be dot podbean pod b e a 0:14:00.118 --> 0:14:02.668 n to write to the program. 0:14:03.058 --> 0:14:04.768 You can write to me at vision where I work 0:14:04.768 --> 0:14:09.238 which is David Woodbridge hot sounds division australia.org. 0:14:09.358 --> 0:14:14.338 David Dot Woodbridge at Vision australia.org. This has been talking 0:14:14.338 --> 0:14:17.608 tech with me has been Vision Australia's national advisor on 0:14:17.608 --> 0:14:21.628 access technology David Woodbridge I'm Stephen Jolley stay safe. We'll 0:14:21.628 --> 0:14:23.038 talk more tech next week. See you.