WEBVTT - Talking Tech, 22nd August 2023 0:00:08.188 --> 0:00:12.028 Hello everyone. Welcome to Talking Tech. This edition available from 0:00:12.028 --> 0:00:16.318 August 22nd, 2023. I'm Stephen Jolly. Great to have you 0:00:16.318 --> 0:00:19.018 with us, wherever you're listening may be through Virgin Australia 0:00:19.018 --> 0:00:24.958 Radio associated Stations of Australia or perhaps the Community Radio Network. 0:00:24.958 --> 0:00:28.078 There is also our podcast. All you need to do 0:00:28.078 --> 0:00:31.088 is search for the two words talking tech and down. 0:00:31.108 --> 0:00:33.868 It will all come usually on a Tuesday afternoon just 0:00:33.868 --> 0:00:37.498 after it's been produced. Another option is to ask your 0:00:37.498 --> 0:00:41.398 Siri device or smart speaker to play this in Australia. 0:00:41.398 --> 0:00:47.188 Radio Talking Tech Podcast. Vision Australia Radio Talking Tech Podcast 0:00:47.308 --> 0:00:50.338 with me someone who can explain all this tech stuff 0:00:50.338 --> 0:00:57.388 really well. Vision Australia's National Advisor on Access Technology, David Woodbridge. David, 0:00:57.388 --> 0:01:01.468 a couple of AI stories to start. The first one 0:01:01.468 --> 0:01:05.158 relates to Be My Eyes Now Be My Eyes has 0:01:05.158 --> 0:01:06.688 been around for a while, hasn't it? 0:01:06.928 --> 0:01:09.418 It is, and for people that don't know what it is, 0:01:09.418 --> 0:01:14.488 it's a video support service. So you get the app 0:01:14.488 --> 0:01:19.768 running on iOS or Android. You can then contact any 0:01:19.768 --> 0:01:23.548 volunteer around the world for assistance in what you may 0:01:23.548 --> 0:01:26.848 need help with through a sort of person looking through 0:01:26.848 --> 0:01:29.398 a video camera and of course talking to you as well. 0:01:29.728 --> 0:01:32.638 Things like, you know, finding out what's in the pantry, 0:01:32.638 --> 0:01:35.428 finding out that what that mystery jar is, checking your mail. 0:01:35.428 --> 0:01:39.268 And of course, with all these video type services, always 0:01:39.268 --> 0:01:42.298 be prepared to make sure that you don't give out 0:01:42.298 --> 0:01:46.228 any confidential information, your location if you don't feel safe 0:01:46.228 --> 0:01:49.258 and so on. So just view it like you've got 0:01:49.258 --> 0:01:53.008 a real person in your help helping you. But from 0:01:53.008 --> 0:01:56.458 all tents and purposes, it's a stranger helping you. They're 0:01:56.458 --> 0:01:59.458 just there because they can see and they can support you. 0:01:59.458 --> 0:02:02.788 But I've always heard very positive things from my eyes 0:02:02.878 --> 0:02:05.368 I've never heard of. Well, so far I've never heard 0:02:05.368 --> 0:02:08.278 of any negative things happening. But like with everything on 0:02:08.278 --> 0:02:11.158 the Internet and video wise, like I just said, use 0:02:11.158 --> 0:02:12.178 it with common sense. 0:02:12.298 --> 0:02:16.168 Yeah, but wonderful people, the ones I've engaged with anyway. Indeed. 0:02:16.168 --> 0:02:18.268 And and of course, the reason why we're mentioning it. Oh, 0:02:18.328 --> 0:02:19.258 do you want to say something or not? 0:02:19.258 --> 0:02:21.838 I did, yes. I wanted to ask you about the 0:02:21.838 --> 0:02:26.068 virtual assistant that's gone into public beta. Tell us about that. 0:02:26.188 --> 0:02:28.168 I know I was too excited to get onto the 0:02:28.168 --> 0:02:30.418 main the main part of it. All right. So what 0:02:30.418 --> 0:02:32.718 they've done is and this has been available in a 0:02:32.728 --> 0:02:35.728 beta for quite a long time, so it's called the 0:02:35.728 --> 0:02:40.278 Be My Eyes AI Assistant. So effectively what you do 0:02:40.278 --> 0:02:42.988 is so rather than quote, talking to a real person, 0:02:43.438 --> 0:02:48.358 you take a photo of anything and then it sends 0:02:48.358 --> 0:02:51.448 off that photo slash image off to the servers and 0:02:51.448 --> 0:02:55.048 then it comes back and gives you a overall summary 0:02:55.318 --> 0:02:58.408 of what the actual photo or the image contains. Where 0:02:58.408 --> 0:03:01.078 the AI comes into it is that you can then 0:03:01.078 --> 0:03:05.338 interrogate the image. So you can say, Tell me more 0:03:05.338 --> 0:03:08.728 about the third jar that you saw on my bench 0:03:08.908 --> 0:03:11.788 or tell me more about this shed. So when I 0:03:11.788 --> 0:03:15.208 did it in my backyard on the weekend, it said 0:03:15.208 --> 0:03:17.578 Your shed doors open. Now, I didn't know that because 0:03:17.578 --> 0:03:19.948 I forgot to close it. I thought, Oh gee, that's 0:03:19.948 --> 0:03:24.268 pretty good. So the difference between I guess using what 0:03:24.268 --> 0:03:26.908 we've previously used on sort of our iPhones and Android 0:03:26.908 --> 0:03:29.968 phones about taking a photo and give us the information 0:03:29.968 --> 0:03:33.448 back to us in general, This one I think is 0:03:33.448 --> 0:03:37.678 a lot, lot more detailed. It really is absolutely amazing. 0:03:38.308 --> 0:03:41.728 And the fact that then you can interrogate the image 0:03:41.728 --> 0:03:44.038 and you can ask multiple questions so you get in 0:03:44.038 --> 0:03:45.598 a bit of a chat and then of course, right 0:03:45.598 --> 0:03:48.688 down the bottom it always says something like, look, if 0:03:48.688 --> 0:03:52.138 you're not finding the information you want from the AI 0:03:52.138 --> 0:03:55.168 or from the photo slash image, here's a button to 0:03:55.168 --> 0:03:59.548 call a real sighted person. Now, the thing about this stuff, 0:03:59.548 --> 0:04:03.328 and I'll mention this again in the next story, this 0:04:03.328 --> 0:04:07.138 is absolutely amazing what it does. It's very detailed, but again, 0:04:07.138 --> 0:04:12.658 it's object recognition and it's artificial intelligence, object recognition, which 0:04:12.658 --> 0:04:17.548 means it's the system deciding what's in the picture. Now, 0:04:17.548 --> 0:04:20.998 when I took a picture at karate over the weekend, 0:04:20.998 --> 0:04:24.538 it informed me that there was this beautiful banner on 0:04:24.538 --> 0:04:27.448 the opposite side of the dojo. It got everything else 0:04:27.448 --> 0:04:29.938 correct except the banner, because there's actually no banner. But 0:04:29.938 --> 0:04:33.208 what there is, is a glass wall with mirrors in it. 0:04:33.208 --> 0:04:35.398 And above that glass wall with the mirrors in it 0:04:35.398 --> 0:04:38.608 is a long white part of the wall. And then 0:04:38.608 --> 0:04:40.858 it's got a gap at the top. Now, I can 0:04:40.858 --> 0:04:43.588 quite easily think about why that sort of thought. It 0:04:43.588 --> 0:04:45.808 was a big white banner because it's a big white 0:04:45.808 --> 0:04:48.748 part of the wall. So with everything that we talk 0:04:48.748 --> 0:04:51.418 about object recognition moving forward in the next two years 0:04:51.418 --> 0:04:56.308 or so, please remember that this is recognition or object recognition. 0:04:56.308 --> 0:04:57.688 So if you remember back in the old days of 0:04:57.688 --> 0:05:00.388 OCR where it was sort of garbage in, garbage out, 0:05:00.388 --> 0:05:02.578 we're sort of still getting a little bit of that 0:05:02.578 --> 0:05:05.038 with object recognition, even though it is getting better. 0:05:05.548 --> 0:05:10.058 So is that your understanding, David That. This be my 0:05:10.058 --> 0:05:16.088 eye feature of Be my eyes actually identifies elements in 0:05:16.088 --> 0:05:20.498 a photograph and then goes to other resources. So it 0:05:20.498 --> 0:05:25.568 goes to databases somewhere to get more information. Not actually 0:05:25.898 --> 0:05:29.378 what is in the photograph, but what the photograph relates to. 0:05:30.608 --> 0:05:32.768 It's hard to say because when it bombs out, because 0:05:32.768 --> 0:05:35.438 it is still in beta and for people that signed 0:05:35.438 --> 0:05:37.778 up for this beta, yes, it's coming. Just waiting to 0:05:37.778 --> 0:05:40.238 your turn comes. I signed up straight away when I 0:05:40.238 --> 0:05:41.678 first heard about it. So that's why I've got it 0:05:41.678 --> 0:05:45.068 fairly quickly when they announced it. But when it bombs out, 0:05:45.068 --> 0:05:47.918 it actually says cannot contact service. I don't know what 0:05:47.918 --> 0:05:52.028 the server ends actually doing, but I don't know what 0:05:52.028 --> 0:05:55.118 sort of database it's accessing because it came back and 0:05:55.118 --> 0:05:59.168 said that my clothes basket, you know, you close baskets 0:05:59.168 --> 0:06:01.058 got holes in it. So you know for the air 0:06:01.058 --> 0:06:02.588 to breathe when you've got your dirty clothes in there 0:06:02.588 --> 0:06:05.198 and so on, it came back and said, I had 0:06:05.198 --> 0:06:11.348 a heater in my room, which it described as a radiator. Now, 0:06:11.348 --> 0:06:14.318 I'm assuming in America people must have lots of these 0:06:14.318 --> 0:06:17.018 things with holes in it that are square, that look 0:06:17.018 --> 0:06:21.308 like a radiator. So it got that one wrong. It 0:06:21.308 --> 0:06:25.028 also did my famous one of calling my red garbage 0:06:25.028 --> 0:06:26.768 bin because I put it in the garbage. It called 0:06:26.768 --> 0:06:30.968 that a fire hydrant. So it's still got a long 0:06:30.968 --> 0:06:34.088 way to go. But may I say, let's say I 0:06:34.088 --> 0:06:37.688 gave object recognition a score of a 50% a year 0:06:37.688 --> 0:06:40.328 and a bit ago. I'd say this is about 70 0:06:40.328 --> 0:06:43.898 to 75% now. So it definitely is improving. And, you know, 0:06:43.898 --> 0:06:47.258 I'm assuming, Steven, the more photos and images it takes, 0:06:47.258 --> 0:06:50.588 you would assume they've got some algorithm that says, well, 0:06:50.708 --> 0:06:52.898 somebody said they didn't have a good experience because you 0:06:52.898 --> 0:06:55.088 can mark it up when you do it. And hopefully 0:06:55.088 --> 0:06:57.938 on those things where you say, no, it wasn't correct, 0:06:57.938 --> 0:07:01.838 they can go back over those images and say, Yeah, look, 0:07:02.108 --> 0:07:04.808 that was obviously a garbage bin. It was not a 0:07:04.808 --> 0:07:06.008 fire hydrant and so on. 0:07:06.248 --> 0:07:10.208 I understand that if it recognized in the photographs, say, 0:07:10.208 --> 0:07:13.028 the Sydney Opera House, it would then be able to 0:07:13.028 --> 0:07:16.538 tell you more about the Sydney Opera House from places 0:07:16.538 --> 0:07:18.938 that it goes to in the Internet. And it's pretty smart, correct? 0:07:18.948 --> 0:07:21.188 Yeah. And I'm assuming like even looking at something like 0:07:21.788 --> 0:07:23.468 a bus, it says there's a bus and said, well, 0:07:23.528 --> 0:07:25.658 where's the door on the bus? Is it at the 0:07:25.658 --> 0:07:27.908 front is at the back. So what I'm going to 0:07:27.908 --> 0:07:31.658 do actually this week, I'm dragging one of my friends 0:07:31.658 --> 0:07:34.748 out into the countryside, so to speak, and we're going 0:07:34.748 --> 0:07:37.838 to be looking at trains and railway platforms and shops 0:07:37.838 --> 0:07:39.638 and all sorts of stuff. And I just want to 0:07:39.638 --> 0:07:42.848 get an idea of what this image processing really does. 0:07:42.848 --> 0:07:45.548 So hopefully I can give you a lot more information 0:07:45.548 --> 0:07:48.098 about what this image processing does. But like I said, 0:07:48.098 --> 0:07:50.168 this is really exciting times. 0:07:50.588 --> 0:07:52.748 Now, I've got to tell you that I yawned a 0:07:52.748 --> 0:07:55.208 bit when I read the headline for this next one 0:07:55.208 --> 0:07:59.408 the other day, Australian Invention to Help the Blind. And 0:07:59.408 --> 0:08:03.428 it's about smart glasses due out in 2025, I think. 0:08:03.798 --> 0:08:07.268 Hmm. Yeah it is. And look, must I say, I 0:08:07.448 --> 0:08:10.988 got a bit underwhelmed by it because yes, it is 0:08:10.988 --> 0:08:14.108 smart glasses. It just does do object recognition. Exactly the 0:08:14.108 --> 0:08:17.948 same thing that, you know, be my eyes I does 0:08:17.948 --> 0:08:21.518 and other things including, you know, seeing eye in the 0:08:21.518 --> 0:08:26.348 world support channel even your camera on your iPhone and 0:08:26.348 --> 0:08:28.178 your Android phone does all this sort of stuff. Now, 0:08:28.178 --> 0:08:31.508 what I noticed in the demo on the television that 0:08:31.508 --> 0:08:34.478 they had on this link was that they only did 0:08:34.478 --> 0:08:38.018 the stuff that it recognized correctly because again, we're talking 0:08:38.018 --> 0:08:42.788 about object recognition. It's artificial intelligence. It's to do with 0:08:42.788 --> 0:08:44.678 all sorts of things. And again, we've already talked about this, 0:08:44.678 --> 0:08:47.288 about what sort of databases or what the server is doing. 0:08:47.888 --> 0:08:51.818 So I'll be interested to see what happens in 2025. 0:08:51.818 --> 0:08:54.758 So I'm not currently getting too excited about it because 0:08:54.758 --> 0:08:56.678 we're going to have other things on the market by then, 0:08:56.678 --> 0:09:00.188 like the Vision Pro, and you can imagine, you know, 0:09:00.188 --> 0:09:02.618 if BMI, AIS and that sort of stuff, you can 0:09:02.618 --> 0:09:04.088 even run them or you should be able to run 0:09:04.088 --> 0:09:05.558 them on the Vision Pro What's. 0:09:05.558 --> 0:09:06.308 The vision Pro. 0:09:06.818 --> 0:09:08.558 The vision Pro sorry, Is this for the people that 0:09:08.558 --> 0:09:12.728 don't remember? That's the smart glasses or the wearable AI 0:09:12.758 --> 0:09:17.228 virtual reality headset that Apple's going to be selling next 0:09:17.228 --> 0:09:20.138 year and it's going to be about, you know, 3000 0:09:20.138 --> 0:09:24.338 or 3600 us. So it's going to be quite expensive. But, 0:09:25.328 --> 0:09:27.368 you know, there were all these I mean, remember, we've 0:09:27.368 --> 0:09:30.848 got we've got the end vision glasses out there, we've 0:09:30.848 --> 0:09:34.208 got the Orcam, so we've got all these plethora. I 0:09:34.418 --> 0:09:37.868 said that correctly of different devices out there. So this 0:09:37.868 --> 0:09:41.438 one's going to have to be absolutely outstanding to compete 0:09:41.438 --> 0:09:45.578 with not only other assistive technology devices, but also mainstream 0:09:45.578 --> 0:09:48.368 devices coming on board like the Vision Pro. 0:09:48.488 --> 0:09:53.048 We will await with interest Les Brillo. Now that's a 0:09:53.048 --> 0:09:55.898 GPS app that's been around for quite a few years 0:09:55.898 --> 0:09:58.508 now and it's coming to the blind cell phone. I 0:09:58.508 --> 0:09:59.918 use laser a lot. 0:10:00.068 --> 0:10:03.938 For general use. It's on both iOS and Android and 0:10:03.938 --> 0:10:07.388 like you, Steve and I tend to use it for just. 0:10:07.818 --> 0:10:09.918 Keeping track of where I am, and then I know 0:10:09.918 --> 0:10:11.958 when I'm on the bus normally or the train. I 0:10:11.958 --> 0:10:15.738 tend to use Blind Square, but if you do a 0:10:15.738 --> 0:10:20.358 app update on your Blind Child Classic two, you'll get 0:10:20.358 --> 0:10:25.608 a notification that Letsoalo is now on your phone and 0:10:25.608 --> 0:10:27.378 you can update it. And then of course, when you 0:10:27.378 --> 0:10:29.628 go out and about, if you're up and down arrow 0:10:29.628 --> 0:10:33.408 keys and your selector and your back buttons on your simple, 0:10:33.408 --> 0:10:36.618 lovely physical keyboard or your blind show classic two, you 0:10:36.618 --> 0:10:38.508 can use it to your heart's content. So it's a 0:10:38.508 --> 0:10:42.528 real g-p-s application rather than the very, very, very, very, 0:10:42.528 --> 0:10:47.028 very cut down version of the localisation, which is almost 0:10:47.028 --> 0:10:49.728 useless on the on the blind shelf. Classic two. So 0:10:49.728 --> 0:10:52.578 if you want a full functional GPS set that everybody 0:10:52.578 --> 0:10:54.768 else uses, then go for this and I think you'll 0:10:54.768 --> 0:10:56.418 be pleasantly surprised. 0:10:57.018 --> 0:10:59.928 Now tell us about V0 starter. 0:11:00.348 --> 0:11:04.008 So VR starter is an app that came out. JS 0:11:04.008 --> 0:11:06.348 I want to say almost maybe ten years ago maybe, 0:11:06.348 --> 0:11:09.828 but it's a it's a voice over starter kit, if 0:11:09.828 --> 0:11:11.748 you like. So what it does is it teaches you 0:11:11.748 --> 0:11:15.528 how to use all the different gestures in voice over. 0:11:15.768 --> 0:11:18.858 So if you're a beginner user, or maybe you might 0:11:18.858 --> 0:11:21.768 want to rediscover some gestures that always gave you pain 0:11:21.768 --> 0:11:24.648 in the past, then you can rediscover that. And of 0:11:24.648 --> 0:11:26.838 course it's going to have all the what I tend 0:11:26.838 --> 0:11:30.078 to call the iPhone ten gestures, such as dragging it 0:11:30.078 --> 0:11:31.998 from the bottom, dragging down from the top and all 0:11:31.998 --> 0:11:34.398 that sort of interesting stuff, plus your router and so on. 0:11:34.878 --> 0:11:38.778 So if you know someone that's starting off using a 0:11:38.778 --> 0:11:44.058 voiceover on the iPhone, the iPad and so on, including 0:11:44.058 --> 0:11:46.608 the iPod Touch that still got one, then this is 0:11:46.608 --> 0:11:49.098 a really good app and of course it's free. So again, 0:11:49.098 --> 0:11:53.778 it's called Vo, as in voiceover space starter. And like 0:11:53.778 --> 0:11:56.448 I said, it's really pleasing to see it back on 0:11:56.448 --> 0:11:57.288 the App store again. 0:11:57.528 --> 0:12:01.788 Very good. You have been playing with the Braille Doodle 0:12:01.788 --> 0:12:05.658 from Touch Pro Foundation. What's this doodle concept? I have 0:12:05.658 --> 0:12:06.568 heard of it before. 0:12:06.588 --> 0:12:09.708 The Pebble with sighted children. Back in the day there 0:12:09.708 --> 0:12:11.988 was a thing called the Magna Doodle and the manga 0:12:11.988 --> 0:12:16.578 doodle is actually a flat plastic tray with magnets underneath it. 0:12:16.578 --> 0:12:19.728 And you grab your little magnetic pen and as you 0:12:19.728 --> 0:12:24.198 draw all the magnetic filings come up and you can 0:12:24.198 --> 0:12:28.098 see lines happening on the actual underneath the plastic of 0:12:28.098 --> 0:12:30.348 the magna doodle on top. But what they've done for 0:12:30.348 --> 0:12:33.258 this one, the brow doodle, similar thing. You've got all 0:12:33.258 --> 0:12:36.528 these little magnet pins this time and they come up 0:12:36.528 --> 0:12:39.738 as you draw your stylus or pen across the magnet. 0:12:39.948 --> 0:12:42.108 The one that I've got is the brow doodle mini. 0:12:42.108 --> 0:12:43.968 You can also get a full size one, but this 0:12:43.968 --> 0:12:47.658 one's probably about, I'd say about 30 characters by 30 0:12:47.658 --> 0:12:50.808 characters wide. And I said lots and lots of pins. 0:12:50.808 --> 0:12:53.748 You can do lots and drawings, shapes. You can do 0:12:53.748 --> 0:12:55.818 bar charts, you can even do your own Braille if 0:12:55.818 --> 0:12:59.058 you really want to, as in proper Braille, but really interesting. 0:12:59.058 --> 0:13:00.588 And the reason why I brought it up today is 0:13:00.588 --> 0:13:05.328 because they've now sold up to $40,000 worth of Braille 0:13:05.328 --> 0:13:11.028 doodles as I pre-release in 18 countries, and you get 40% 0:13:11.028 --> 0:13:15.558 off if you put in a pre interest order before 0:13:15.558 --> 0:13:18.858 October 31st. And I think it's certainly worthwhile. You don't 0:13:18.858 --> 0:13:20.898 have to spend any money up front. It's just to 0:13:20.898 --> 0:13:23.268 put your name down for interest. And then when they 0:13:23.268 --> 0:13:25.698 start selling it, you'll get 40% off. And considering that 0:13:25.698 --> 0:13:30.228 it sells for $150, I'm certainly going to put my 0:13:30.228 --> 0:13:32.988 name down to get one for that 40% off. 0:13:33.258 --> 0:13:35.958 Yeah. So just to get this right, it's for doing 0:13:35.958 --> 0:13:37.638 sort of temporary Braille, isn't it? 0:13:37.848 --> 0:13:40.758 Correct. Yeah. So, you know, particularly in a classroom, like 0:13:40.758 --> 0:13:43.758 if a teacher just wanted to quickly say, look, here's 0:13:43.758 --> 0:13:47.958 what a cell looks like, so here's the membrane, here's 0:13:47.958 --> 0:13:50.778 the nuclei and so on. Or, you know, this is 0:13:50.778 --> 0:13:53.208 what a red cell shape looks like or a white 0:13:53.208 --> 0:13:55.668 cell and anything else you can possibly think of that 0:13:55.668 --> 0:13:58.908 you can just do a quick draw up. Then the 0:13:58.908 --> 0:14:00.708 Braille doodles, perfect for that sort of stuff. 0:14:00.828 --> 0:14:04.398 Terrific. Before we go, a reminder of where people can 0:14:04.398 --> 0:14:06.948 find details of what we've been talking about in this 0:14:06.948 --> 0:14:08.928 and previous editions of the Program. 0:14:09.198 --> 0:14:11.448 And Data Reservoir. You can check out my blog site, 0:14:11.448 --> 0:14:15.968 which is David Wood beer dot podbean pad com. 0:14:15.978 --> 0:14:20.388 David would be dot podbean pod b e a n 0:14:21.288 --> 0:14:22.638 to write to the program. 0:14:22.788 --> 0:14:25.518 You can write to me at Vision Australia where I work, 0:14:25.518 --> 0:14:30.378 which is David Woodbridge. How it sounds at Vision australia.org. 0:14:30.558 --> 0:14:35.298 David Dot Woodbridge at Vision Australia. Org This has been 0:14:35.298 --> 0:14:38.748 talking tech with me has been Vision Australia's National Advisor 0:14:38.748 --> 0:14:43.098 on Access Technology, David Woodbridge. I'm Stephen Jolley. Stay safe. 0:14:43.098 --> 0:14:44.658 We'll talk more tech next week. See you.