WEBVTT - Talking Vision 733 Week Beginning 17th of June 2024 0:00:51.888 --> 0:00:57.698 From Vision Australia. This is talking vision. And now here's 0:00:57.698 --> 0:00:59.678 your host, Sam Colley. 0:01:02.128 --> 0:01:05.368 Hello everyone. It's great to be here with you. And 0:01:05.368 --> 0:01:08.308 for the next half hour, we talk matters of blindness 0:01:08.308 --> 0:01:12.208 and low vision. Welcome to the program. We've got a 0:01:12.208 --> 0:01:15.268 jam packed show for you in store this week as 0:01:15.268 --> 0:01:20.068 we honor stellar, who's moving on from Vision Australia after 0:01:20.068 --> 0:01:25.228 15 years, including, of course, five years as the host 0:01:25.228 --> 0:01:29.458 of Talking Vision. Stellar caught up with me to say 0:01:29.458 --> 0:01:33.508 farewell to our listeners, but also have a look back 0:01:33.508 --> 0:01:38.308 over the past 15 years of her involvement in radio, 0:01:38.308 --> 0:01:41.698 as well as other roles such as working with the 0:01:41.698 --> 0:01:46.648 Vision Australia library. That conversation is coming up right around 0:01:46.648 --> 0:01:50.278 the corner, so make sure to stick around. And then 0:01:50.278 --> 0:01:53.968 after my chat with stellar, you'll hear an excerpt from 0:01:53.968 --> 0:01:57.058 one of the first interviews she did as host of 0:01:57.058 --> 0:02:02.788 Talking Vision with a researcher and participant in the Bionic 0:02:02.788 --> 0:02:08.158 Eye trials back in 2015. I hope you'll enjoy this 0:02:08.158 --> 0:02:17.748 special episode of Talking Vision. Today is quite emotional for, well, 0:02:17.748 --> 0:02:20.328 not only me, but a lot of the other Vision 0:02:20.328 --> 0:02:24.528 Australia radio crew and the Talking Vision crew as Stella 0:02:24.528 --> 0:02:29.538 is heading off to explore some new adventures. It's my 0:02:29.538 --> 0:02:33.738 great pleasure to welcome Stella on to Talking Vision. Not 0:02:33.738 --> 0:02:37.428 for the final time by any stretch, but to say 0:02:37.428 --> 0:02:42.258 farewell and thank her for all she has contributed both 0:02:42.258 --> 0:02:46.248 to talking vision and passing on her years of wisdom 0:02:46.248 --> 0:02:50.298 and expertise to me to help make talking vision the 0:02:50.298 --> 0:02:54.498 best it can be. Stella, welcome back to Talking Vision. 0:02:54.498 --> 0:02:57.138 Thank you very much for your time. Oh, thanks. 0:02:57.138 --> 0:02:58.368 For having me on the show. 0:02:58.368 --> 0:03:01.188 Sam. Now, it's a bit of a special bit of 0:03:01.188 --> 0:03:04.938 an emotional conversation we're having today, as this will be 0:03:04.938 --> 0:03:08.268 your final conversation on Talking Vision. 0:03:08.388 --> 0:03:08.928 Oh. 0:03:09.378 --> 0:03:11.658 I don't know. Do you think you'll have me back 0:03:11.658 --> 0:03:13.038 on again? Absolutely. 0:03:13.038 --> 0:03:16.218 You're more than welcome in various other capacities, Liz. For sure. 0:03:16.218 --> 0:03:19.158 No worries. But yeah, it's a big time. You'll be 0:03:19.158 --> 0:03:24.048 heading off to explore other opportunities after 15 years at 0:03:24.048 --> 0:03:28.068 Vision Australia. So how do you feel looking back over 0:03:28.068 --> 0:03:30.558 those 15 years? What are the emotions that are kind 0:03:30.558 --> 0:03:32.448 of running through your mind at the moment? 0:03:32.448 --> 0:03:37.368 Oh well, bittersweet, I would say. Like, I'm really excited. 0:03:37.368 --> 0:03:41.568 It's time for me to move on and explore other opportunities. 0:03:41.568 --> 0:03:45.018 But it's interesting when you start leaving an organisation, people 0:03:45.018 --> 0:03:48.288 start saying really nice things to you and you know, 0:03:48.288 --> 0:03:51.798 and now I'm like, oh, do I want to go? 0:03:51.798 --> 0:03:56.388 But so bittersweet, I would say, and emotional, of course, 0:03:56.388 --> 0:04:00.078 when you've been somewhere for 15 years and Vision Australia 0:04:00.078 --> 0:04:04.818 has certainly meant a lot to me. I don't feel 0:04:04.848 --> 0:04:08.568 because I work, uh, you know, you get to know 0:04:08.568 --> 0:04:14.028 the library members and Vision Australia clients, not forgetting staff 0:04:14.028 --> 0:04:17.838 as well. You know, you sort of in radio, you're on, 0:04:17.928 --> 0:04:21.498 you're sort of connected to the community. You are so 0:04:21.498 --> 0:04:24.918 so it's yeah, I would say that it's a little 0:04:24.918 --> 0:04:28.668 bit sad, but at the same time, I'm excited. 0:04:28.668 --> 0:04:31.788 You mentioned people there, and quite a few of your 0:04:31.788 --> 0:04:35.868 roles have been quite heavily involved with talking to people, 0:04:35.868 --> 0:04:40.098 allowing people to tell their stories, but also helping people 0:04:40.098 --> 0:04:43.698 out more generally in the community. So what's it been 0:04:43.698 --> 0:04:48.528 like interacting with so many wonderful people over those 15 years? 0:04:48.528 --> 0:04:53.178 Yeah, it has been wonderful to steal your words there. 0:04:53.178 --> 0:04:56.988 It's been a learning curve. So I was a coordinator 0:04:56.988 --> 0:05:00.348 of volunteers for six years before I stepped into the 0:05:00.348 --> 0:05:06.048 communications role and taking over talking vision. I don't think 0:05:06.048 --> 0:05:10.038 I have ever felt so accepted by a community before, 0:05:10.068 --> 0:05:12.378 you know, as someone who is fully sighted. But I 0:05:12.378 --> 0:05:15.768 had a real passion for radio and I really wanted 0:05:15.768 --> 0:05:19.218 to talk to our community of interest and provide the 0:05:19.218 --> 0:05:24.588 information that they needed and wanted from the radio program. Yeah, 0:05:24.588 --> 0:05:27.078 it was really it was. I won't lie, there were 0:05:27.078 --> 0:05:30.318 times where I felt a little bit nervous and am 0:05:30.318 --> 0:05:32.418 I saying the right thing? Am I doing the right thing? 0:05:32.418 --> 0:05:34.338 But the thing that really helped me is that I 0:05:34.338 --> 0:05:37.788 actually listened to people, and I had someone like Stephen 0:05:37.788 --> 0:05:41.118 Jolly really supporting me and talking to me, like really 0:05:41.118 --> 0:05:45.438 mentoring me in those early months. Probably up to a year. Yeah. 0:05:45.438 --> 0:05:50.328 And it was great. Really fantastic. Yeah. Illuminating. 0:05:50.328 --> 0:05:53.388 I would say that's a wonderful word. And had you 0:05:53.388 --> 0:05:57.018 done much radio before you came into Vision Australia? 0:05:57.018 --> 0:06:00.258 Certainly well before Vision Australia, I had done some and 0:06:00.258 --> 0:06:04.758 I was still in a local Melbourne community radio station, 0:06:04.758 --> 0:06:07.968 so I had done some butt ploughing in, so it 0:06:07.968 --> 0:06:11.598 was a bit of a dream coming into Vision Australia radio. Yeah, 0:06:11.598 --> 0:06:13.188 and I wanted to do more. 0:06:13.188 --> 0:06:17.598 And certainly had the opportunity to do more with Talking Vision, 0:06:17.688 --> 0:06:21.348 as you mentioned, and allowing so many people to tell 0:06:21.348 --> 0:06:24.438 their stories. So what does it mean to be a 0:06:24.438 --> 0:06:28.248 storyteller from your side of things and allowing people to 0:06:28.248 --> 0:06:30.678 give their insights and their stories? 0:06:30.678 --> 0:06:33.918 Well, I don't know. It's just about to say nobody 0:06:33.918 --> 0:06:37.188 can tell your story the way that you can, like 0:06:37.188 --> 0:06:40.038 that person can, but sometimes you might need a little 0:06:40.038 --> 0:06:44.418 bit of help to tell your story and the platform 0:06:44.418 --> 0:06:47.928 to do that. And I think radio, you know, it's 0:06:47.928 --> 0:06:52.848 absolutely the perfect place. I'm also a writer, so I 0:06:52.848 --> 0:06:56.688 you know, I like helping writing people's stories as well. 0:06:56.688 --> 0:07:02.058 And I think storytelling is so important because it's it's 0:07:02.058 --> 0:07:05.418 about that lived experience, isn't it? Yeah. And you want 0:07:05.418 --> 0:07:08.568 to be able to believe that person saying that. 0:07:08.568 --> 0:07:12.288 You've been involved not only in talking vision, but quite 0:07:12.288 --> 0:07:15.698 a few other programs such as Hear This and. Author 0:07:15.698 --> 0:07:19.178 author over the years, with quite a heavy involvement from 0:07:19.178 --> 0:07:23.108 the Vision Australia library, but also a close association with 0:07:23.108 --> 0:07:26.858 Francis Keeland, one of the people we mentioned earlier in 0:07:26.858 --> 0:07:30.368 the interview, people coming back into it. So what's that 0:07:30.368 --> 0:07:33.338 been like to blend that love of radio and love 0:07:33.338 --> 0:07:34.958 of writing and literature? 0:07:34.988 --> 0:07:38.258 Oh well, an amazing place. Vision Australia, is that it 0:07:38.258 --> 0:07:41.468 has a library and a radio station. The two big 0:07:41.468 --> 0:07:43.958 love of my life. And now I'm wondering why am 0:07:43.958 --> 0:07:46.838 I leaving then? So I became when I was a 0:07:46.838 --> 0:07:50.288 coordinator of volunteers, I actually was in a show called 0:07:50.288 --> 0:07:53.918 Tropical Island and that was on Saturday nights. And that 0:07:53.918 --> 0:07:56.888 was all different topics where we read about that. So 0:07:56.888 --> 0:07:59.468 that was great. And I was also already involved with 0:07:59.468 --> 0:08:03.068 Francis Keelan when she was doing here this. So it's 0:08:03.068 --> 0:08:07.028 just exciting because I get to talk to authors as well. 0:08:07.028 --> 0:08:11.558 Like I can't speak more highly of it and fun. 0:08:11.558 --> 0:08:14.438 It's been really great and I hope it's been well 0:08:14.438 --> 0:08:17.558 received by the listening audience because we're having a good 0:08:17.558 --> 0:08:21.038 time doing it and we think it matters. And hopefully 0:08:21.038 --> 0:08:22.028 it does matter. 0:08:22.028 --> 0:08:24.578 I'm sure it does. I'm certain there's a lot of 0:08:24.578 --> 0:08:28.538 people out there that absolutely love to hear these programs. 0:08:28.538 --> 0:08:31.298 They're very well received. I'm sure we've had a lot 0:08:31.298 --> 0:08:35.468 of wonderful feedback. And, you know, that comes directly into 0:08:35.468 --> 0:08:39.338 your work with the library outside of radio, with so 0:08:39.338 --> 0:08:43.148 many events and so many books and conversations that have 0:08:43.148 --> 0:08:46.148 gone on over the years. So what's it been like 0:08:46.148 --> 0:08:50.018 to work with the library team as somebody who does 0:08:50.018 --> 0:08:51.428 love literature so much? 0:08:51.428 --> 0:08:53.948 Oh, well, like I was saying, it's on a par 0:08:53.948 --> 0:08:56.828 with working with the radio team. And what I love 0:08:56.828 --> 0:08:59.768 about the library is that they're really open to doing 0:08:59.768 --> 0:09:02.858 so many great events. So it's been a bit of 0:09:02.858 --> 0:09:05.738 a privilege. I feel like I've been in my role, 0:09:05.738 --> 0:09:09.698 so I'm in communications and marketing, but I've been really 0:09:09.698 --> 0:09:12.818 lucky in that I've been able to be in radio 0:09:12.818 --> 0:09:15.518 and in library and in marketing and comms. So I 0:09:15.518 --> 0:09:19.028 feel like I've, you know, worked across the gamut. Yeah. 0:09:19.028 --> 0:09:22.178 You've done the whole package for sure. Um, and let's 0:09:22.178 --> 0:09:25.808 go back to when you came in to Talking Vision 0:09:25.808 --> 0:09:30.218 after you had been mentored by Stephen Jolly and all 0:09:30.218 --> 0:09:34.268 you'd learned from that, and then you passed that information 0:09:34.268 --> 0:09:37.118 on to me 4 or 5 years ago when I 0:09:37.118 --> 0:09:38.648 came in as a. 0:09:38.648 --> 0:09:40.268 Young youngling. 0:09:40.268 --> 0:09:44.978 Career start, graduate and, um, you know, jumped into the 0:09:44.978 --> 0:09:48.218 world of radio. And that's something I'd been involved with 0:09:48.218 --> 0:09:52.178 in student broadcasting for quite a few years. But yeah, 0:09:52.178 --> 0:09:57.218 it's just been wonderful to learn everything I know from you. 0:09:57.218 --> 0:10:00.908 And it wouldn't be the same show without you. So 0:10:00.908 --> 0:10:03.638 that's one of the things I wanted to do today, 0:10:03.638 --> 0:10:08.438 is to thank you for all you've contributed to Talking Vision, 0:10:08.438 --> 0:10:10.958 both as a host and as a mentor. 0:10:11.138 --> 0:10:12.998 So I want. 0:10:12.998 --> 0:10:15.608 To make you cry, though. That's why I'm sort of 0:10:15.968 --> 0:10:17.888 don't want to go on about it too much. I 0:10:17.888 --> 0:10:19.178 don't want to make you cry on. 0:10:19.328 --> 0:10:21.908 No, no, I'm not gonna cry. That's really nice. And 0:10:22.058 --> 0:10:25.868 and I will say that as much as, you know, 0:10:25.868 --> 0:10:29.498 it was. I loved doing the show and, you know, 0:10:29.498 --> 0:10:32.678 loved talking to people who are blind or have low vision. 0:10:32.678 --> 0:10:38.198 And I felt very welcomed by the community, our listening audience. 0:10:38.198 --> 0:10:42.908 And I knew that you needed a radio person behind 0:10:42.908 --> 0:10:46.208 the mic. I really thought, I want the next person 0:10:46.208 --> 0:10:48.848 to do the show to be blind or have low vision. 0:10:48.848 --> 0:10:51.758 And then I saw you and went, right, okay. 0:10:52.568 --> 0:10:55.958 Yeah. And it's been a whirlwind. It's been a roller coaster. 0:10:55.958 --> 0:10:58.598 It's been a wild ride. It's with the, you know, 0:10:58.598 --> 0:11:03.638 all the euphemisms. Well, the handover happening during Covid, that was. Yeah, 0:11:03.638 --> 0:11:06.038 that was a bit of a challenge. But we got 0:11:06.038 --> 0:11:10.118 through it together so you know. Yeah. Oh yeah. 0:11:10.118 --> 0:11:12.518 Well if you're going to learn something, go in the 0:11:12.518 --> 0:11:13.208 deep end. 0:11:13.208 --> 0:11:16.568 Oh absolutely. For sure. Now I'm going to throw a 0:11:16.568 --> 0:11:19.958 bit of a tricky one at you Stella. Now having 0:11:19.958 --> 0:11:23.558 done so many interviews over the years, do you have 0:11:23.558 --> 0:11:24.278 a favorite? 0:11:24.278 --> 0:11:25.988 I knew you were going to ask me this. I 0:11:25.988 --> 0:11:28.958 don't want to say a favorite just in case, but 0:11:28.958 --> 0:11:33.428 for me, I really like I still remember my first one, 0:11:33.428 --> 0:11:36.728 one of the if not the first interview I did. 0:11:36.728 --> 0:11:40.088 They were doing trials of the Bionic Eye and I 0:11:40.088 --> 0:11:42.968 think it was Doctor Lauren Ayton. In fact, I know 0:11:42.968 --> 0:11:46.418 it was. And they had a woman who was blind 0:11:46.418 --> 0:11:49.448 and she was participating in the trials as well. It 0:11:49.448 --> 0:11:54.878 was just it was just an amazing conversation. I just 0:11:54.878 --> 0:11:57.548 loved it. And I thought because it was it was 0:11:57.548 --> 0:12:00.398 about science and it wasn't something I was familiar with 0:12:00.398 --> 0:12:05.108 as well. And the person who was blind and talking 0:12:05.108 --> 0:12:08.228 about it, she was so excited and they both had 0:12:08.228 --> 0:12:12.908 this amazing connection as well. So that was a favorite 0:12:12.908 --> 0:12:14.708 one because it was one of the first ones. It was. 0:12:14.868 --> 0:12:19.608 So completely different from anything I had known. And then 0:12:19.608 --> 0:12:22.938 other favorite ones is when I have been talking to, um, 0:12:22.938 --> 0:12:26.808 younger people as well and hearing their resilience. There was 0:12:26.808 --> 0:12:29.778 one young woman I spoke to, she lost her vision 0:12:29.778 --> 0:12:34.548 in a workplace accident, and, uh, she had been living 0:12:34.548 --> 0:12:37.878 in rural Australia and she had to move to the city, 0:12:38.088 --> 0:12:42.978 which because, well, she actually wanted to as well, but 0:12:42.978 --> 0:12:46.308 there were more, uh, opportunities. And she was able to 0:12:46.308 --> 0:12:49.548 get around a little bit better. Um, so that was 0:12:49.548 --> 0:12:52.098 a bit of a favourite one too, like there's been 0:12:52.098 --> 0:12:56.628 so many and hearing about, of course, the Braille music 0:12:56.628 --> 0:13:00.258 camp that I love, and it's really the ones where 0:13:00.258 --> 0:13:03.648 people are just getting on with their lives and kind of, 0:13:03.948 --> 0:13:07.278 you know, forging ahead and making a difference to their 0:13:07.278 --> 0:13:09.678 lives and to other people's lives. 0:13:09.678 --> 0:13:13.668 And that's palpable when they have that excitement about what 0:13:13.668 --> 0:13:17.208 they're doing and they're so engaged. And that also makes 0:13:17.208 --> 0:13:21.378 our jobs easier as interviewers, when you get people come 0:13:21.378 --> 0:13:25.788 in and they absolutely they're so passionate about what they're doing, 0:13:25.788 --> 0:13:29.778 what they're involved with, and that really rubs off on 0:13:29.778 --> 0:13:33.048 the interview. But also that goes out to the listener, 0:13:33.048 --> 0:13:37.398 of course. And that just makes for such wonderful radio. And, 0:13:37.398 --> 0:13:40.188 you know, being able to enable people to tell those 0:13:40.188 --> 0:13:43.518 stories as we've mentioned. So, you know, that's an absolute 0:13:43.518 --> 0:13:44.838 highlight for sure. 0:13:44.838 --> 0:13:48.108 Yeah, that's that's a great word palpable, isn't it? I 0:13:48.108 --> 0:13:52.368 think my least favorite ones are probably, you know, sighted politicians. 0:13:52.368 --> 0:13:56.628 I remember one federal election talking to one particular politician 0:13:56.628 --> 0:14:00.138 who's no longer in politics. And even at that time 0:14:00.138 --> 0:14:02.808 I thought, yeah, I really don't like you, but you 0:14:02.808 --> 0:14:06.348 have to, you know, you can't you cannot go in 0:14:06.348 --> 0:14:09.588 with the audience knowing what's going on in your head 0:14:09.588 --> 0:14:12.108 as well. Yeah. And I can say, I don't think 0:14:12.108 --> 0:14:16.488 I've ever had an argument with anybody on talking vision. No, no. 0:14:16.488 --> 0:14:17.808 Maybe behind the scenes. 0:14:17.808 --> 0:14:22.308 Yeah, maybe. Maybe off air. It depends. But you know, 0:14:22.308 --> 0:14:26.808 there's been other interviewers and other radio veterans that both 0:14:26.808 --> 0:14:30.048 of us have worked quite closely with. You talk about 0:14:30.048 --> 0:14:34.008 politics there. And that's where Peter Greco comes in as 0:14:34.008 --> 0:14:36.858 a name who's really rubbed shoulders with quite a few 0:14:36.858 --> 0:14:40.698 politicians and grilled them to, you know, yeah, as, as 0:14:40.698 --> 0:14:43.158 much as you can do in a friendly way. But 0:14:43.158 --> 0:14:45.708 he really sort of gets to the bottom of things 0:14:45.708 --> 0:14:48.138 and makes sure he gets the answer well. 0:14:48.138 --> 0:14:50.808 After he's in a bit of a fortunate position too, 0:14:50.808 --> 0:14:53.988 because he's, well, one that's the nature of his show, 0:14:53.988 --> 0:14:57.768 but also as a volunteer, whereas I'm a staff member 0:14:57.768 --> 0:15:00.558 and I have to, you know, I can't be putting 0:15:00.558 --> 0:15:04.218 people offside as such. Not that Peter does, but Peter 0:15:04.218 --> 0:15:08.028 talks to everyone and pretty much the same way in 0:15:08.028 --> 0:15:12.828 a very grounded kind of he doesn't stand on ceremony 0:15:12.828 --> 0:15:16.158 as such. No. Yeah. No. He's someone good to aspire 0:15:16.158 --> 0:15:17.478 to be like. Yes. 0:15:17.478 --> 0:15:20.958 Yeah, absolutely. And that's where one of the influences has 0:15:20.958 --> 0:15:25.638 come hopefully through my stint in Talking Vision, getting influences from, 0:15:25.638 --> 0:15:28.818 of course, you and Stephen, but also having listened to 0:15:28.818 --> 0:15:31.758 Peter and the way that he carries out his interviews 0:15:31.758 --> 0:15:34.908 as a radio veteran of over three decades, which I 0:15:34.908 --> 0:15:37.008 just think, oh my God, he doesn't like to talk 0:15:37.008 --> 0:15:40.188 about it because he's just, as you said, so grounded. Yeah. 0:15:40.188 --> 0:15:43.698 And he doesn't want to talk about himself, and that's fine. 0:15:43.698 --> 0:15:46.938 But he's just such a wonderful person, as you said, 0:15:46.938 --> 0:15:51.228 to aspire to. But finally, Stella, is there a message 0:15:51.228 --> 0:15:54.198 that you want to end our conversation with? Do you 0:15:54.198 --> 0:15:57.018 want to sort of give our listeners a bit of a, um, well, 0:15:57.018 --> 0:15:59.928 not so much a I wouldn't say final because, you know, 0:15:59.928 --> 0:16:03.918 it's not final. Well, not my eulogy. No, certainly not. 0:16:03.918 --> 0:16:06.408 But just to wrap up with, do you have something 0:16:06.408 --> 0:16:09.048 that you'd like to sort of let our listeners know 0:16:09.048 --> 0:16:10.818 on just a message for them? 0:16:10.818 --> 0:16:13.398 Yeah, I'd just like people to know how much I 0:16:13.398 --> 0:16:17.238 have loved working at Vision Australia and being a part 0:16:17.238 --> 0:16:21.108 of Vision Australia Radio, how much I have loved being 0:16:21.108 --> 0:16:26.598 on air and how much I have such respect for. Look, 0:16:26.598 --> 0:16:28.788 I'm just going to say it for blind people and 0:16:28.788 --> 0:16:32.298 for people with low vision. I think you're all fantastic. 0:16:32.298 --> 0:16:37.218 I always have a soft spot, and that may sound 0:16:37.218 --> 0:16:40.638 very patronising because you're not. People aren't all the same, 0:16:40.638 --> 0:16:44.928 but forever in my heart as such. Yeah. And thank 0:16:44.928 --> 0:16:48.498 you very much for listening to me over the years 0:16:48.498 --> 0:16:51.348 and for putting up with me as well, and for 0:16:51.348 --> 0:16:54.288 all the fantastic feedback I've received. 0:16:54.438 --> 0:16:58.038 Oh well, it's been a pleasure, Stella, to listen to 0:16:58.038 --> 0:17:01.218 your programs, but also for me to be so heavily 0:17:01.218 --> 0:17:04.758 involved as the host now and having, as I said, 0:17:04.758 --> 0:17:06.198 learned so much. 0:17:06.198 --> 0:17:09.498 Oh, Sam, you're a champion. You're a champion. 0:17:09.498 --> 0:17:12.138 I won't go on too much about it because I 0:17:12.138 --> 0:17:14.968 think we'll start bawling. So I think we'll have. So 0:17:14.968 --> 0:17:17.758 wrap it up for this stellar. It's been an absolute 0:17:17.758 --> 0:17:21.208 pleasure to catch up with you today as always, and 0:17:21.208 --> 0:17:22.798 all the best for the future. 0:17:22.798 --> 0:17:24.298 Thank you so much, Sam. 0:17:31.258 --> 0:17:34.948 I'm Sam Kelly and you're listening to Talking Vision on 0:17:34.948 --> 0:17:40.468 Vision Australia Radio. Associated stations of the Reading Radio Network 0:17:40.468 --> 0:17:44.998 and the Community Radio Network. I hope you enjoyed my 0:17:44.998 --> 0:17:49.438 conversation there with Stella as she heads off from Vision 0:17:49.438 --> 0:17:53.608 Australia after 15 years. We wish her all the best 0:17:53.608 --> 0:17:57.118 in her future endeavours and can't wait to see her 0:17:57.118 --> 0:18:01.198 back on talking vision down the track. So fingers crossed. 0:18:01.198 --> 0:18:05.578 Let's see what happens. And now we switch roles and 0:18:05.578 --> 0:18:08.308 take a bit of a trip back in time. As 0:18:08.308 --> 0:18:14.098 Stella interviews Lauren and Dianne, who were both involved in 0:18:14.098 --> 0:18:17.698 the bionic ear trials back in 2015. 0:18:17.788 --> 0:18:22.138 With me today is doctor Lauren Ayton, Bionic Eye clinical 0:18:22.138 --> 0:18:27.088 research team leader and research fellow at the Department of Ophthalmology, 0:18:27.088 --> 0:18:32.848 University of Melbourne, and also Doctor Dianne Ashworth, Deakin University 0:18:32.848 --> 0:18:38.248 Social Work Department, Faculty of Health in Geelong. And Lauren 0:18:38.278 --> 0:18:43.348 Ayton is giving her research update of the bionic eye 0:18:43.348 --> 0:18:50.638 and Dianne is the trial participant. Hello Lauren and Dianne 0:18:50.638 --> 0:18:52.678 and thanks for coming on today. 0:18:52.978 --> 0:18:55.948 Hi, Stella. Hi, Stella. It's a pleasure to be with you. 0:18:55.948 --> 0:19:00.238 Just very quickly, just to set the scene. Lauren, what 0:19:00.238 --> 0:19:02.398 does bionic mean? 0:19:03.148 --> 0:19:05.638 It's an excellent question. It's. It's sort of a word 0:19:05.638 --> 0:19:08.638 that really evokes the idea of the $6 Million Man, 0:19:08.638 --> 0:19:13.168 doesn't it? Um, but Biomedical bionics really is the field 0:19:13.168 --> 0:19:16.978 of research where we're trying to develop different devices that 0:19:16.978 --> 0:19:19.918 can restore parts of our body that don't work properly. 0:19:19.918 --> 0:19:24.298 So things like the cochlear implant for hearing impairment or 0:19:24.418 --> 0:19:27.388 prosthetic limbs, if you've lost a leg or an arm, 0:19:27.388 --> 0:19:30.988 for example, an injury. And so the bionic eye is 0:19:30.988 --> 0:19:33.808 a similar sort of thing. So we're trying to use 0:19:33.808 --> 0:19:37.198 our electronic device to give back some sight to people 0:19:37.198 --> 0:19:38.488 who have lost their vision. 0:19:38.518 --> 0:19:41.518 There are two types of bionic eye. Or this bionic 0:19:41.518 --> 0:19:44.878 eye is a very specific one related to the retina. 0:19:44.878 --> 0:19:47.428 Yeah. That's right. There's actually a whole lot of different 0:19:47.428 --> 0:19:51.058 groups working on bionic eyes. There's about 35 different groups 0:19:51.058 --> 0:19:54.988 around the world now, and everyone uses slightly different technology. 0:19:54.988 --> 0:19:59.068 So there are devices which the electrodes that we use 0:19:59.068 --> 0:20:01.498 to give back vision go into the eye. And then 0:20:01.498 --> 0:20:04.528 there are some groups where the electrodes go into the brain. 0:20:04.528 --> 0:20:07.018 So there's a group at Monash University that are doing 0:20:07.018 --> 0:20:10.138 that type of device. So the one that we have 0:20:10.138 --> 0:20:14.308 tested recently where Di was one of our wonderful participants, 0:20:14.308 --> 0:20:17.188 is a device that goes into the eye, but it 0:20:17.188 --> 0:20:20.338 actually goes in behind the retina. So it's a very 0:20:20.338 --> 0:20:24.208 safe location and very easy to get to surgically. 0:20:24.328 --> 0:20:27.808 Diane, what vision do you have? 0:20:28.018 --> 0:20:34.018 I have retinitis pigmentosa or RP. Uh, so I have 0:20:34.018 --> 0:20:38.428 lightened up perception. Um, so and I have only had 0:20:38.428 --> 0:20:41.848 light and dark perception for about, oh, just over 20 years, 21, 0:20:41.848 --> 0:20:44.338 22 years. So, um. Yeah. 0:20:44.878 --> 0:20:48.268 And what could you see with the bionic eye? 0:20:48.778 --> 0:20:55.078 Um, spots of light, um, which the scientists called phosphenes. Um, 0:20:55.198 --> 0:20:57.388 they were supposed to be, you know, like all these 0:20:57.388 --> 0:21:01.768 lovely little circle spots, but they weren't. And I'm one 0:21:01.768 --> 0:21:07.228 of three participants, so, um, I was the first one to, um, uh, 0:21:07.228 --> 0:21:10.108 I suppose be switched on is what they call it. So. Yeah, 0:21:10.108 --> 0:21:11.728 just to even find out whether it was going to 0:21:11.728 --> 0:21:14.308 work or not. But yeah, these spots of light would 0:21:14.308 --> 0:21:17.128 come off, um, the implants in my left eye. So 0:21:17.128 --> 0:21:21.838 where I would see the phosphenes is in my right eye. So, um. Yeah, 0:21:21.838 --> 0:21:24.718 vision Lauren can fill that in, but vision seems to 0:21:24.718 --> 0:21:27.058 be always upside down and back to front. It was 0:21:27.058 --> 0:21:30.328 an amazing experience. Um, I don't know how much you 0:21:30.328 --> 0:21:34.618 want me to go into here, but, um, I yes, 0:21:34.618 --> 0:21:38.308 it's going to be something that's going to be, I think, 0:21:38.308 --> 0:21:40.228 useful in the future. 0:21:40.228 --> 0:21:42.898 Uh, what was the commitment involved in. 0:21:43.168 --> 0:21:45.808 18 months at first. And then they asked, would I 0:21:45.808 --> 0:21:49.348 extend for another six months? So all in up it 0:21:49.348 --> 0:21:53.308 was two years. So, uh, for the first 18 months 0:21:53.308 --> 0:21:55.708 was one day a week. And and then after that, 0:21:55.708 --> 0:21:57.298 it was two days a week. I came in and 0:21:57.298 --> 0:22:00.898 got tested. So it was, you know, quite a, I suppose, 0:22:00.898 --> 0:22:04.738 a commitment in my time. And. Yeah, it's funny, I'll 0:22:04.738 --> 0:22:06.388 give you a little bit of a human side of it. 0:22:06.418 --> 0:22:08.998 It's I was testing a lot in the, the booth 0:22:08.998 --> 0:22:13.018 in the Bionic Institute in Melbourne, and it's actually where 0:22:13.018 --> 0:22:16.468 all the cochlear implant stuff was done as well. And 0:22:16.468 --> 0:22:20.908 so we'd be testing thresholds and things like that and 0:22:20.908 --> 0:22:24.718 quite laborious stuff that we had to do. So I thought, okay, 0:22:24.718 --> 0:22:26.098 we need to, you know, bring a little bit of 0:22:26.098 --> 0:22:29.788 this in. So in come the chocolates. So, so there'd 0:22:29.818 --> 0:22:31.618 be chocolates, you know I. Oh, we did well in 0:22:31.648 --> 0:22:36.688 that one. Okay, get the chocolates out. But, yeah. No, look, 0:22:36.688 --> 0:22:38.068 there was a lot of stuff that had to go 0:22:38.068 --> 0:22:39.448 through and a lot of, you know, a lot of 0:22:39.448 --> 0:22:42.448 hard work. And the three of us, the three participants, 0:22:42.538 --> 0:22:44.068 put a lot of hard work into it. 0:22:44.068 --> 0:22:46.348 So I'm sorry to interrupt. I was going to say, like, 0:22:46.348 --> 0:22:48.778 I just yeah, just to confirm that it was amazing. 0:22:48.778 --> 0:22:51.178 So all three of these people came in, gave up 0:22:51.178 --> 0:22:54.358 their time for at least 1 or 2 days a week. And, 0:22:54.358 --> 0:22:56.548 and it was really sort of. Yeah, like I said, 0:22:56.548 --> 0:22:59.878 quite laborious testing. So we didn't know anything about how 0:22:59.878 --> 0:23:04.108 this device worked. So the testing was very basic, very repeated. 0:23:04.108 --> 0:23:05.728 And they did brilliantly. 0:23:05.908 --> 0:23:08.878 So what what were some of the laborious tests that 0:23:08.878 --> 0:23:10.318 you had to do? 0:23:10.708 --> 0:23:13.378 Well, one of the I think the three of us, um, 0:23:13.378 --> 0:23:18.148 you know, loved this is sarcasm. Um, it's called, uh, 0:23:18.148 --> 0:23:22.078 testing the threshold now and what it is like, you know, safety, safety, 0:23:22.078 --> 0:23:25.348 safety was, you know, the main key of all this, 0:23:25.348 --> 0:23:27.328 this testing as well, you know, what's going to be 0:23:27.328 --> 0:23:30.748 safe for use and that. So I had no qualms about, 0:23:30.748 --> 0:23:33.418 you know, me being put into danger and that. But 0:23:33.418 --> 0:23:37.018 to test it, the lowest level that phosphenes could be 0:23:37.018 --> 0:23:40.708 detected so that, you know, understanding, you know, at that 0:23:40.708 --> 0:23:44.008 lowest level of, um, I'm going to say electricity or 0:23:44.008 --> 0:23:47.218 stimulation that, you know, it needed to be for sight. 0:23:47.218 --> 0:23:50.578 So and that was quite had to concentrate a lot 0:23:50.578 --> 0:23:52.918 because I've got all swirls in my eyes. And if 0:23:52.918 --> 0:23:56.128 people have got PP, they'll probably go, yes, I've, I 0:23:56.308 --> 0:23:59.848 um and and when the stimulation would come, sometimes it 0:23:59.848 --> 0:24:01.978 was hard to tell whether it was the stimulation or 0:24:01.978 --> 0:24:03.808 whether it was, you know, the swirls in my eyes 0:24:03.808 --> 0:24:06.568 that were, that were, you know, reacting in some sort 0:24:06.568 --> 0:24:09.268 of way. So I actually said to them, you know, 0:24:09.268 --> 0:24:11.158 at one point, because I didn't want to give any 0:24:11.158 --> 0:24:13.828 false information, it all had to be, you know, what was, 0:24:13.828 --> 0:24:16.738 you know, correct in that. So I'd say, oh, maybe. 0:24:16.738 --> 0:24:19.168 And they go, yep. Okay. Yeah. So they used to 0:24:19.168 --> 0:24:22.168 interpret that, you know, is it like we went through 0:24:22.168 --> 0:24:25.138 a lot of a lot of repeating and that is, 0:24:25.138 --> 0:24:27.058 you know, to get, you know, the results at the 0:24:27.058 --> 0:24:30.118 end of it. So I'm actually very proud to have 0:24:30.118 --> 0:24:32.218 been a part of it from when I first saw 0:24:32.218 --> 0:24:35.788 the Phosphenes you do think, oh, you know, what are 0:24:35.788 --> 0:24:38.878 these all about? You know, um, as the testing goes on, 0:24:38.878 --> 0:24:43.288 you know, you're working through, you know, you first off, um, 0:24:43.438 --> 0:24:47.968 it's called psychophysics. Um, so they sent the, the stimulus 0:24:47.968 --> 0:24:52.528 through directly through the, the wires into the implant, then that, um, 0:24:52.528 --> 0:24:56.698 graduated onto using a camera. So the information from the 0:24:56.698 --> 0:24:59.638 camera camera would then, um, you know, go through all 0:24:59.638 --> 0:25:03.748 the mechanisms and stimulate the electrodes in the eyes. And 0:25:03.748 --> 0:25:06.508 it was this day I can remember, um, you know, 0:25:06.508 --> 0:25:09.748 using the camera, moving my head around, and, um, and 0:25:09.748 --> 0:25:13.408 I just said, oh, I forgot the camera was there. 0:25:13.408 --> 0:25:15.388 And I felt like the information that I was seeing 0:25:15.388 --> 0:25:18.118 was coming through my eye. And I'll never forget that feeling. 0:25:18.118 --> 0:25:20.938 It just it was like, um, yeah. It was like 0:25:20.938 --> 0:25:23.848 it was becoming normal. Um, and my brain was just 0:25:23.848 --> 0:25:26.668 getting so used to the information. So a part of 0:25:26.668 --> 0:25:29.608 it is learning what you're seeing, I think, and really, 0:25:29.608 --> 0:25:32.488 you know, connecting to that, that thing as a normal 0:25:32.488 --> 0:25:34.468 part of, of what you're seeing. 0:25:34.738 --> 0:25:37.768 We see emotion involved with that. 0:25:38.008 --> 0:25:42.208 Look. There's been I wouldn't say emotion as such, but 0:25:42.208 --> 0:25:46.558 there's there's been I feel warm even thinking about it. 0:25:46.558 --> 0:25:49.138 It's sort of like gives this warm feeling in your heart. 0:25:49.138 --> 0:25:52.648 It's it's just maybe information that your brain just, you know, 0:25:52.648 --> 0:25:55.108 loves to get. I don't know, I have no, you know, 0:25:55.108 --> 0:25:57.268 I don't know the answers, but I know when I 0:25:57.268 --> 0:25:59.428 see the phosphene the first day when I saw them, 0:25:59.428 --> 0:26:03.838 it's like, oh, you know, there was one that, um, well, 0:26:03.838 --> 0:26:06.508 they sent in this, um, stimulation that, you know, because 0:26:06.508 --> 0:26:08.698 they thought, yeah, you beauty this is working. So it 0:26:08.698 --> 0:26:11.068 went through and it sort of lit up the whole 0:26:11.068 --> 0:26:13.828 array of that's what it seemed to me of, of 0:26:13.828 --> 0:26:17.848 the phosphenes. And I just went, wow, you know, and 0:26:17.848 --> 0:26:19.558 Nikki was in the booth, said, he said, is that 0:26:19.558 --> 0:26:22.408 wow good or wow bad? And I said, that's wow good. 0:26:22.408 --> 0:26:26.398 It just like I said, the feeling is, um, it's 0:26:26.398 --> 0:26:29.488 hard to describe, but it's a it's a really wonderful feeling. 0:26:30.418 --> 0:26:35.548 Diane the Bionic eye is now turned off. Yeah. Would 0:26:35.548 --> 0:26:38.758 you turn it back on? Would you do all this again? 0:26:38.758 --> 0:26:42.688 Yes, yes I would for the part. Look, look in 0:26:42.688 --> 0:26:46.348 two ways I would, because when I started with this 0:26:46.348 --> 0:26:48.988 research I never thought, you know. Oh yes, yes, I'm 0:26:48.988 --> 0:26:50.938 doing this because I really want a bionic eye. I 0:26:50.938 --> 0:26:53.548 did it to help the researchers and, you know, and 0:26:53.548 --> 0:26:56.878 and be a part of something that's exciting as well. Um, 0:26:57.118 --> 0:27:00.268 being a part of it has shown me that there 0:27:00.268 --> 0:27:03.988 is going to be use for the bionic eye, particularly 0:27:03.988 --> 0:27:08.098 in the software and the different elements that Australia is, 0:27:08.098 --> 0:27:11.458 is developing, I think. Yeah, like I say, there's going 0:27:11.458 --> 0:27:13.558 to be real use in in what is there. So 0:27:13.558 --> 0:27:14.998 I would put my hand up to help with the 0:27:14.998 --> 0:27:17.728 research again. But I'd also put my hand up, um, 0:27:17.728 --> 0:27:20.638 you know, later on for the full device. 0:27:20.788 --> 0:27:24.358 I've been speaking with Doctor Lauren Ayton, who's Bionic Eye 0:27:24.358 --> 0:27:29.968 Clinical research and research fellow, the Department of Ophthalmology, and 0:27:29.968 --> 0:27:34.878 doctor Dianne. And Ashworth, who was the trial participant in 0:27:34.878 --> 0:27:39.678 the research. Thank you both so much for your very 0:27:39.678 --> 0:27:44.388 important work in this area and for your commitment to 0:27:44.388 --> 0:27:48.048 the research as well. And thank you for your time today. 0:27:48.078 --> 0:27:49.158 Thanks, della. 0:27:49.668 --> 0:27:50.628 Thank you. Stella. 0:27:57.658 --> 0:28:00.748 And that's all the time we have for today. You've 0:28:00.748 --> 0:28:04.978 been listening to Talking Vision. Talking vision is a Vision 0:28:04.978 --> 0:28:09.148 Australia radio production. Thanks to all involved with putting the 0:28:09.148 --> 0:28:13.348 show together every week. And remember, we love hearing from you. 0:28:13.348 --> 0:28:16.648 So please get in touch any time on our email 0:28:16.648 --> 0:28:21.958 at Talking Vision. At Vision australia.org. That's talking vision all 0:28:21.958 --> 0:28:26.488 one word at Vision Australia. Org but until next week 0:28:26.488 --> 0:28:29.098 it's Sam Colly saying bye for now. 0:28:32.648 --> 0:28:36.398 You can contact Vision Australia by phoning us any time 0:28:36.398 --> 0:28:45.698 during business hours on one 308 4746. That's one (300) 847-4106 0:28:45.698 --> 0:28:51.038 or by visiting Vision Australia. Org that's Vision australia.org.