WEBVTT - Talking Tech 7th January 2025 0:00:08.059 --> 0:00:12.050 Hello everyone. Welcome to Talking Tech. This edition available from 0:00:12.050 --> 0:00:17.750 January the 7th, 2025. Yes, happy New year! Hope it's 0:00:17.750 --> 0:00:20.660 going to be a terrific one for you. I'm Stephen Jolly. 0:00:20.660 --> 0:00:22.790 Great to have you with us listening maybe through Vision 0:00:22.820 --> 0:00:26.960 Australia Radio, associated stations of the Radio Reading Network or 0:00:26.960 --> 0:00:30.710 the Community Radio Network. There is also the podcast. To 0:00:30.740 --> 0:00:32.810 catch that, all you need to do is search for 0:00:32.810 --> 0:00:35.929 the two words talking tech. And it can all come 0:00:35.960 --> 0:00:39.169 usually on a Tuesday afternoon just after it's been produced. 0:00:39.199 --> 0:00:42.229 Another option is to ask your Siri device or smart 0:00:42.229 --> 0:00:46.879 speaker to play Vision Australia Radio talking tech podcast Vision 0:00:46.909 --> 0:00:52.820 Australia Radio Talking tech podcast. Normally with me is Damo McMorrow, 0:00:52.849 --> 0:00:58.040 Vision Australia's national access technology manager. Damo is taking his 0:00:58.040 --> 0:01:02.000 Christmas holiday break at the moment and will return at 0:01:02.000 --> 0:01:06.369 the end of January. However, shortly before Christmas Day, Moe 0:01:06.370 --> 0:01:10.779 sat down with colleague and friend Kimberly Mean. Kimberly is 0:01:10.780 --> 0:01:15.520 a participant in the Vision Australia graduate program on placement 0:01:15.520 --> 0:01:19.840 at the Cooper Centre in Brisbane. Kimberly, welcome to Talking Tech. 0:01:19.869 --> 0:01:21.850 Thank you. It's lovely to be here, Damo. 0:01:21.880 --> 0:01:24.220 I think I first met you when I did your 0:01:24.220 --> 0:01:28.959 workplace assessment, and I was quite intrigued by sort of 0:01:28.990 --> 0:01:31.330 some of the different models and some of the different 0:01:31.330 --> 0:01:34.420 tech that you use by way of background, though. So 0:01:34.420 --> 0:01:37.660 you are part of our graduate program here at Vision Australia. 0:01:37.690 --> 0:01:41.619 Tell me a little bit about your vision hearing condition. 0:01:41.709 --> 0:01:44.319 Um, so I have usher syndrome. I was born with 0:01:44.319 --> 0:01:48.340 usher syndrome. I have had a hearing loss since birth, 0:01:48.340 --> 0:01:51.190 so I've had a severe to profound hearing loss and 0:01:51.190 --> 0:01:54.820 have worn bilateral hearing aids since I was a toddler. 0:01:54.820 --> 0:01:58.060 And then when I was 11, they realised that I 0:01:58.060 --> 0:02:00.760 had a problem with my vision as well. And by 0:02:00.760 --> 0:02:04.180 the time I was 18, I was legally blind. Still 0:02:04.180 --> 0:02:06.880 wearing hearing aids, of course. I still wear them to 0:02:06.910 --> 0:02:10.510 this day. However, I'm now in my 40s and in 0:02:10.510 --> 0:02:12.970 my 30s. I did go totally blind. 0:02:12.970 --> 0:02:15.550 So it's been quite a journey for you then, with 0:02:15.550 --> 0:02:17.560 a lot of changes along the way. 0:02:17.590 --> 0:02:19.660 Yes yes, yes. 0:02:20.260 --> 0:02:23.050 How has that sort of impacted have you had to 0:02:23.080 --> 0:02:25.210 change careers in that kind of thing? 0:02:25.240 --> 0:02:29.380 Yeah. So that was some choices that I made starting 0:02:29.380 --> 0:02:32.410 off as a teenager coming into, you know, early adulthood 0:02:32.410 --> 0:02:34.780 and realising, you know, I've got to make a choice 0:02:34.780 --> 0:02:37.960 for a career path. I love to cook. So it 0:02:37.960 --> 0:02:41.080 was always a passion of mine to go into the kitchen. 0:02:41.080 --> 0:02:43.750 So I worked as a chef, realised that it was 0:02:43.750 --> 0:02:48.130 probably not my smartest moment as much as I really 0:02:48.130 --> 0:02:51.040 enjoyed doing that. So then I decided that I was 0:02:51.040 --> 0:02:52.750 going to go work in an office, so I became 0:02:52.750 --> 0:02:55.690 an accountant instead. I did that for a lot of years, 0:02:55.690 --> 0:02:59.050 but as my sight was getting worse, I was having 0:02:59.080 --> 0:03:01.690 to adapt to different technologies. So I've used a variety 0:03:01.690 --> 0:03:05.669 of technology to access computers and things like that. As 0:03:05.670 --> 0:03:07.590 I went totally blind, that was a it was a 0:03:07.590 --> 0:03:12.390 rather sudden event that happened, wasn't entirely expected for me, 0:03:12.390 --> 0:03:14.250 so I wasn't really well prepared for it. So I 0:03:14.250 --> 0:03:17.160 took a few years off working altogether to kind of 0:03:17.190 --> 0:03:19.380 learn some skills that I needed to be able to 0:03:19.410 --> 0:03:23.130 live independently as a blind person. And then I decided 0:03:23.130 --> 0:03:26.010 to go for another career change. And I'm now a 0:03:26.010 --> 0:03:30.870 counselor and I'm I'm in the graduate program at Vision Australia. 0:03:30.960 --> 0:03:33.630 I'm hoping to find my next job after that. 0:03:33.660 --> 0:03:38.490 Excellent, excellent. So in terms of the technology, how has 0:03:38.490 --> 0:03:41.040 that changed for you over time? 0:03:41.220 --> 0:03:45.030 It's been huge, Damo. So I got my first set 0:03:45.030 --> 0:03:48.900 of hearing aids at almost two. That was 40 years ago. 0:03:48.960 --> 0:03:52.530 So the technology for hearing it's been roughly the same, 0:03:52.530 --> 0:03:56.310 but the significant improvement in the technology over the years. 0:03:56.310 --> 0:03:59.160 So I still wear a basic hearing aid, which has 0:03:59.160 --> 0:04:01.830 a mold that sits inside the ears with a tube 0:04:01.830 --> 0:04:05.460 that goes to the amplifying aid which sits over the 0:04:05.460 --> 0:04:08.550 back of the ears. That particular aid, which is called 0:04:08.550 --> 0:04:12.690 an over the ear aid, it has changed in size significantly. 0:04:12.690 --> 0:04:15.630 So when I was two, they were so big that 0:04:15.630 --> 0:04:17.219 they actually had to be taped to the side of 0:04:17.219 --> 0:04:20.190 my head. Oh wow. My parents needed to use double 0:04:20.219 --> 0:04:22.530 sided tape and actually stick them to the side of 0:04:22.530 --> 0:04:24.030 my head, just to get them to sort of stay 0:04:24.030 --> 0:04:27.270 in place as I grew. The technology kind of grew 0:04:27.300 --> 0:04:29.909 with me, so I've used a range of technology to 0:04:29.940 --> 0:04:34.650 access my primary and secondary education. I still had vision 0:04:34.650 --> 0:04:36.390 in those days, so I was able to read and 0:04:36.390 --> 0:04:39.390 my hearing was my biggest problem. So I wore a 0:04:39.390 --> 0:04:41.969 set of hearing aids, one in each ear, and I 0:04:41.970 --> 0:04:47.310 also used an FM receiver with my teacher wearing the microphone, 0:04:47.310 --> 0:04:49.800 and I wore the receiving unit. These are some of 0:04:49.800 --> 0:04:53.490 the original technologies. And so they were attached with a 0:04:53.490 --> 0:04:57.930 cord and a plug. So I used to literally plug 0:04:57.930 --> 0:05:00.800 the cord for the FM receiver into the back of 0:05:00.800 --> 0:05:03.590 each of my hearing aids and feed the cord down 0:05:03.590 --> 0:05:05.690 through my uniform shirt. And then I had to wear 0:05:05.690 --> 0:05:08.120 it on a belt because it was it was quite heavy. 0:05:08.120 --> 0:05:10.250 It was about the weight of 3 or 4 mobile 0:05:10.250 --> 0:05:14.180 phones sort of tied together. It wasn't a light unit. No. Wow. Yeah. 0:05:14.210 --> 0:05:16.039 And then my teacher wore a similar unit with a 0:05:16.040 --> 0:05:19.219 microphone clipped to their shirt as well. It made a 0:05:19.220 --> 0:05:22.790 huge difference for my access to being able to hear 0:05:22.790 --> 0:05:25.820 what was going on in the classrooms. But it wasn't attractive. 0:05:25.820 --> 0:05:29.300 It wasn't. It wasn't pretty. And it definitely wasn't. It 0:05:29.300 --> 0:05:32.659 wasn't very transferrable. Once you're kind of hooked yourself up 0:05:32.660 --> 0:05:33.919 for the day, you really don't want to have to 0:05:33.920 --> 0:05:37.670 take it off again. Over time, you know those the 0:05:37.700 --> 0:05:40.250 FM receivers got much, much smaller. I now use a 0:05:40.250 --> 0:05:43.279 unit that's about the size of my pointer finger. Wow. 0:05:43.310 --> 0:05:47.120 So tiny little unit now and it's completely Bluetooth. I 0:05:47.120 --> 0:05:49.099 just plug it into the side of the computer with 0:05:49.100 --> 0:05:51.890 a tiny little cord and that's it. That's all I 0:05:51.890 --> 0:05:53.480 have to do now so I don't have to actually 0:05:53.480 --> 0:05:56.300 physically wear it on me anymore. I still wear my 0:05:56.300 --> 0:05:59.860 hearing aids, but the the connections are all done via 0:05:59.860 --> 0:06:02.140 Bluetooth now, which is out of this world. There's no 0:06:02.140 --> 0:06:05.380 more cords to get tangled up in, and and I 0:06:05.380 --> 0:06:07.750 have a lot more control over the device as well, 0:06:07.750 --> 0:06:09.340 so I'm able to turn it on and off. I 0:06:09.340 --> 0:06:12.250 don't need to be hearing conversations that teachers are having. 0:06:12.250 --> 0:06:15.700 So the technology for hearing has advanced incredibly. It's gotten 0:06:15.700 --> 0:06:18.940 a lot smaller, a lot more powerful, and it's gone 0:06:18.940 --> 0:06:24.460 from being corded analog technology to being wireless and Bluetooth 0:06:24.460 --> 0:06:28.480 digital technology. So it has come a long way. The 0:06:28.480 --> 0:06:31.300 hearing aids themselves have also decreased in size. So the 0:06:31.300 --> 0:06:33.279 ones that I wear now, if you put them next 0:06:33.280 --> 0:06:35.440 to the ones that I wore as a child, it's 0:06:35.440 --> 0:06:38.380 maybe a third of the size. So they've come down 0:06:38.380 --> 0:06:40.420 in size a lot, which makes them a lot easier 0:06:40.420 --> 0:06:41.230 to wear. 0:06:41.260 --> 0:06:44.110 I would imagine they'd be a lot more programmable as well, 0:06:44.110 --> 0:06:47.020 whereas before probably all you had was a volume control. 0:06:47.020 --> 0:06:51.190 Exactly. So originally I literally had a battery case on 0:06:51.190 --> 0:06:54.430 the back of them that you pull it open and 0:06:54.430 --> 0:06:56.980 change a little battery, which I used to change maybe 0:06:56.980 --> 0:07:01.450 once a week and and just a like a rolling 0:07:01.450 --> 0:07:03.820 volume control. So roll it all the way up or 0:07:03.820 --> 0:07:05.890 roll it all the way down. And it was, it 0:07:05.890 --> 0:07:08.470 was actually quite touchy as well. So if I bumped 0:07:08.470 --> 0:07:10.150 it with a hat or something, you know, my hearing 0:07:10.150 --> 0:07:13.390 aid setting would change. It's a lot more programmable. Now 0:07:13.390 --> 0:07:16.450 I have rechargeable hearing aid, so I pop them into 0:07:16.450 --> 0:07:19.780 a charge unit every night. I do get a good 0:07:19.780 --> 0:07:22.540 amount of battery when I consider that I can hook 0:07:22.570 --> 0:07:25.240 up a lot of devices to my hearing aids now. 0:07:25.240 --> 0:07:28.660 So I have my phone hooked up 24 over seven, 0:07:28.870 --> 0:07:30.850 because I actually use an app on my phone to 0:07:30.880 --> 0:07:33.850 control the programs on my hearing aids, and I can 0:07:33.850 --> 0:07:38.740 control things like, um, sound compression. So when I get to, uh, 0:07:38.770 --> 0:07:42.160 volumes that are too loud for me or too out 0:07:42.160 --> 0:07:46.000 of my pitch, the hearing aids will automatically control that 0:07:46.000 --> 0:07:49.360 by either suppressing the sound or turning themselves off altogether. 0:07:49.630 --> 0:07:53.410 I've got different functions for if I'm in crowded areas, 0:07:53.410 --> 0:07:56.080 if I'm doing a one on one conversation, if I'm 0:07:56.080 --> 0:07:59.100 in a lecture hall with a teacher, I have different 0:07:59.100 --> 0:08:03.090 settings that I can use to really maximize what I'm hearing. 0:08:03.120 --> 0:08:05.490 Make sure that the clarity is there for me, that. 0:08:05.490 --> 0:08:07.350 It really has come a long way, hasn't it? 0:08:07.590 --> 0:08:10.260 Yes it has. And I no longer have the issue 0:08:10.260 --> 0:08:13.080 of accidentally bumping that volume control and just being stuck 0:08:13.080 --> 0:08:16.680 with it until I see my audiologist again. Because when 0:08:16.680 --> 0:08:18.750 you reset it, it resets the volume. 0:08:20.100 --> 0:08:23.790 In terms of the visual technology. Would I be right 0:08:23.790 --> 0:08:27.180 in thinking that as your vision went, you had to 0:08:27.210 --> 0:08:29.820 transition from magnification to speech? 0:08:29.850 --> 0:08:33.030 Yes, you're 100%. I feel like I have sort of 0:08:33.059 --> 0:08:37.739 traversed the range of technology that people use when they 0:08:37.740 --> 0:08:42.420 are low vision, transitioning into total blindness. When I was 0:08:42.420 --> 0:08:44.100 first sort of starting to work in an office, I 0:08:44.099 --> 0:08:46.140 didn't need anything more than just a pair of glasses. 0:08:46.140 --> 0:08:48.599 I just wore some reading glasses to start with. I 0:08:48.599 --> 0:08:51.629 had tunnel vision at the time, so I started to 0:08:51.630 --> 0:08:56.009 need things like magnification. I used Zoom text. So I 0:08:56.010 --> 0:08:59.879 had a combination of magnification and audible when I needed it. 0:08:59.880 --> 0:09:04.020 So an audio input. I used various different types of 0:09:04.020 --> 0:09:07.650 hearing aid hookups as well with my phone and my computer, 0:09:07.650 --> 0:09:11.760 but primarily magnification in a lot of my accounting days 0:09:11.760 --> 0:09:14.670 was the way that I would access the computer, whether 0:09:14.670 --> 0:09:18.750 it was using the CCTV to access paperwork, whether it 0:09:18.750 --> 0:09:21.179 ended up scanning them into my computers, and then using 0:09:21.179 --> 0:09:24.869 Zoomtext to enlarge them. I've kind of transitioned through a 0:09:24.870 --> 0:09:28.410 lot of those technologies right through to now, where I 0:09:28.439 --> 0:09:33.150 am completely reliant on an audio or a Braille input, 0:09:33.150 --> 0:09:35.760 so I don't have any usable sight anymore. 0:09:36.300 --> 0:09:39.720 For a lot of people, that transition is really hard 0:09:39.750 --> 0:09:42.420 because most people want to try and hang on to 0:09:42.449 --> 0:09:46.110 doing things visually for as long as they can. As 0:09:46.109 --> 0:09:49.499 someone who's made that transition and done it, I must 0:09:49.500 --> 0:09:52.949 say very successfully, from what I've seen of your work 0:09:53.069 --> 0:09:56.120 and your work set up here. Do you have any 0:09:56.150 --> 0:10:00.319 sort of general advice for people on a transitioning from 0:10:00.319 --> 0:10:03.890 low vision to blindness, but b also dealing with the 0:10:03.890 --> 0:10:05.179 the hearing loss? 0:10:05.240 --> 0:10:08.540 Mm. That's a good question. And to me it was 0:10:08.569 --> 0:10:12.050 a couple of things that kind of worked together. I 0:10:12.050 --> 0:10:15.439 needed to change my perspective, my mindset. I was one 0:10:15.439 --> 0:10:18.770 of those people who didn't want to be a blind person. 0:10:18.800 --> 0:10:21.410 I to this day, I'm not really sure why that 0:10:21.410 --> 0:10:23.390 was an issue for me, but it was. I didn't 0:10:23.390 --> 0:10:25.969 really want to to kind of have to wear that label. 0:10:25.969 --> 0:10:29.420 And until I accepted that it wasn't a bad label, 0:10:29.420 --> 0:10:32.630 it was just a state of being. It wasn't a 0:10:32.630 --> 0:10:35.089 the core of my identity. It was just something that 0:10:35.089 --> 0:10:38.059 I was living with. It became much, much easier for 0:10:38.059 --> 0:10:41.210 me to go, okay, I'm not actually able to see 0:10:41.209 --> 0:10:44.120 that screen anymore. I really do need to be transitioning 0:10:44.150 --> 0:10:47.420 to a screen reader. So mindset, I would say it's 0:10:47.449 --> 0:10:50.839 at least half the battle for most people. Honestly though, 0:10:50.870 --> 0:10:55.959 it is a big barrier as far as transitioning the technology, 0:10:55.990 --> 0:11:00.249 my biggest suggestion would be try everything. You don't know 0:11:00.250 --> 0:11:03.609 what's going to work for you until you've tried it. 0:11:03.670 --> 0:11:07.389 I tried a variety of different things that didn't work 0:11:07.390 --> 0:11:10.869 for me, and I'm glad I kept trying different things to. 0:11:10.900 --> 0:11:14.199 I found a combination that actually worked for me. There's 0:11:14.199 --> 0:11:17.110 a lot of things out there. There's a lot of choices, 0:11:17.109 --> 0:11:19.869 and choices are amazing because it means that we can 0:11:19.900 --> 0:11:23.050 then find that unique combination that's going to work for us, 0:11:23.050 --> 0:11:25.420 and the condition that we are living with. 0:11:25.449 --> 0:11:30.280 And in terms of adapting to hearing loss. Any any advice? 0:11:30.309 --> 0:11:35.050 It's about exploration. And honestly, your specialists are actually going 0:11:35.050 --> 0:11:38.140 to be your best friends in that exploration. For me, 0:11:38.170 --> 0:11:41.199 with my hearing loss, I am really good friends with 0:11:41.199 --> 0:11:43.809 my audiologist. I'm on a first name basis. We have 0:11:43.809 --> 0:11:46.209 phone numbers, we ring each other on a regular basis, 0:11:46.209 --> 0:11:50.110 and I found that rapport really important because it meant 0:11:50.109 --> 0:11:53.740 that I feel comfortable to tell my audiologist, hey, this 0:11:53.740 --> 0:11:58.329 isn't working for me anymore or I'm considering trying to 0:11:58.329 --> 0:12:02.079 do this with technology. What suggestions do you have? What 0:12:02.079 --> 0:12:05.890 do you know is out there? I often will trial 0:12:05.920 --> 0:12:09.460 prototypes for them because I do have complex needs, so 0:12:09.459 --> 0:12:13.150 I'm able to give them a really holistic view of 0:12:13.150 --> 0:12:15.760 what I think is useful in the technology and where 0:12:15.760 --> 0:12:18.969 I think some improvements can be made. So my my 0:12:18.969 --> 0:12:23.410 big suggestion is find your specialist, find your supports and 0:12:23.410 --> 0:12:26.319 really become friends with them. They are wanting to help 0:12:26.319 --> 0:12:28.660 you just as much as you need the support. 0:12:28.689 --> 0:12:32.439 Really good advice and and really powerful stuff. And I 0:12:32.439 --> 0:12:34.809 imagine it's the same in the IT space with the 0:12:34.839 --> 0:12:38.679 sort of the vision technology is, you know, exploring different solutions. 0:12:38.679 --> 0:12:42.130 Keep trying things and I guess evolve with the technology 0:12:42.130 --> 0:12:44.800 I imagine would be important to as, as as it 0:12:44.800 --> 0:12:47.709 changes and develops, you know, keep keep up with what's 0:12:47.709 --> 0:12:48.250 out there. 0:12:48.280 --> 0:12:52.109 Yes, absolutely. It's not something I'm very good at. I 0:12:52.109 --> 0:12:54.630 have to work. I have to push myself. But I 0:12:54.660 --> 0:12:57.479 have found so many benefits from just keeping up and 0:12:57.479 --> 0:13:00.660 asking questions. And hey, how do you do this when I'm, 0:13:00.689 --> 0:13:03.359 you know, grabbing a coffee and talking to a colleague 0:13:03.599 --> 0:13:06.780 and really kind of exploring what has emerged in the 0:13:06.780 --> 0:13:09.209 field because it is an emerging industry. 0:13:09.240 --> 0:13:10.859 It is, isn't it? Yeah, yeah. 0:13:10.920 --> 0:13:13.380 It's constantly being developed all of the time. 0:13:13.410 --> 0:13:16.439 Yeah, absolutely. I mean, when I look at the things in, in, 0:13:16.469 --> 0:13:19.079 at with respect to blindness and low vision that have 0:13:19.079 --> 0:13:22.050 changed even over the last 4 or 5 years, it's 0:13:22.050 --> 0:13:23.339 been absolutely massive. 0:13:23.370 --> 0:13:26.880 Oh, yes. Definitely. I almost can't keep up at this point. 0:13:27.300 --> 0:13:28.199 It's a full time job. 0:13:28.709 --> 0:13:31.709 Well, there's a really good podcast called Talking Tech that 0:13:31.709 --> 0:13:34.140 you might like to check out that helps keep keep 0:13:34.140 --> 0:13:37.020 you abreast of the latest technology. Hey, Kimberly, thank you 0:13:37.020 --> 0:13:39.750 very much for joining us on Talking Tech. It's been 0:13:39.750 --> 0:13:43.800 a fascinating discussion, and I have personally really enjoyed being 0:13:43.800 --> 0:13:46.080 part of your journey over the last few months. And 0:13:46.079 --> 0:13:48.540 you've taught me lots too. So thank you very much. 0:13:48.569 --> 0:13:50.880 No, thank you and thank you for having me on 0:13:50.880 --> 0:13:52.260 on to to talk today. 0:13:52.290 --> 0:13:53.069 No problem. 0:13:53.069 --> 0:13:58.590 Kimberly mean a Vision Australia graduate program participant speaking late 0:13:58.589 --> 0:14:03.900 last year with Damo McMorrow. Wow. Before we go, a 0:14:03.900 --> 0:14:08.190 reminder for details of this and previous editions of the program. 0:14:08.189 --> 0:14:13.709 You can go to VA radio.org/talking tech, VA radio, dot 0:14:13.709 --> 0:14:18.329 org slash talking tech and to right to the program. 0:14:18.329 --> 0:14:24.749 You can email Damo McMorrow at Vision australia.org. Yes, he 0:14:24.750 --> 0:14:28.800 is keeping an eye on his inbox. Damo McMorrow at 0:14:28.800 --> 0:14:33.180 Vision australia.org. This has been talking tech. Our guest has 0:14:33.180 --> 0:14:37.320 been Kimberly Mean, a participant of the Vision Australia graduate program, 0:14:37.320 --> 0:14:42.390 speaking with Talking Tech's Damo McMorrow. I'm Stephen Jolly. Take care. 0:14:42.390 --> 0:14:44.400 We'll talk more tech next week. See you.