WEBVTT - Talking Tech 12th December 2023 0:00:08.208 --> 0:00:11.868 Hello everyone! Welcome to Talking Tech. This edition available from 0:00:11.868 --> 0:00:15.858 December 12th, 2023. I'm Stephen Jolly. Great to have you 0:00:15.858 --> 0:00:19.728 with us listening maybe through Virgin Australia Radio, Associated Stations 0:00:19.728 --> 0:00:23.838 of Australia or maybe the Community Radio Network. There is 0:00:23.838 --> 0:00:26.568 also the podcast to catch that. What you need to 0:00:26.568 --> 0:00:29.688 do is search for the two words talking tech and 0:00:29.688 --> 0:00:32.658 downer can all come usually on a Tuesday afternoon just 0:00:32.658 --> 0:00:35.748 after it's been produced. Another option is to ask your 0:00:35.748 --> 0:00:39.468 Siri device or smart speaker to play bridge in Australia. 0:00:39.468 --> 0:00:45.018 Radio talking tech podcast Virgin Australia Radio talking tech podcast 0:00:45.018 --> 0:00:48.888 with me, someone who knows all this tech stuff really well. 0:00:48.888 --> 0:00:54.678 Vision Australia's national advisor on access technology, David Woodbridge David, 0:00:54.678 --> 0:00:58.698 let's start with an interesting little set of apps. You've 0:00:58.698 --> 0:01:01.998 found that test one's listening skills. 0:01:02.208 --> 0:01:05.028 And I wish I had had these apps when I 0:01:05.028 --> 0:01:07.248 was actually growing up at school, when I was doing 0:01:07.248 --> 0:01:11.988 orientation mobility about listening and paying attention to my environment. 0:01:12.528 --> 0:01:16.158 These apps basically test exactly that, so they test what 0:01:16.158 --> 0:01:19.458 you're listening to for both general sounds and your environment 0:01:19.458 --> 0:01:22.338 and of course, traffic sounds, movement and that sort of stuff. 0:01:22.608 --> 0:01:25.518 So there's three apps. So in the App Store and 0:01:25.518 --> 0:01:29.058 also the Google Play Store, if you search for one 0:01:29.058 --> 0:01:35.208 word echo viz, so that's EQ Hovis, then it'll end 0:01:35.208 --> 0:01:38.238 up giving you three applications. And one is called echo 0:01:38.238 --> 0:01:43.608 vs game, echo vs quiz and echo vs straight. Now 0:01:43.608 --> 0:01:47.838 the echo vs game one. I got a bit sick 0:01:47.838 --> 0:01:49.848 and tired of it. This one costs about $2 and 0:01:49.848 --> 0:01:53.208 the other two are free. But the the Echo game 0:01:53.208 --> 0:01:55.188 one is about you're in a maze and of course 0:01:55.188 --> 0:01:57.918 you've got to listen to echos and the steps of 0:01:57.918 --> 0:02:00.198 that your feet make and echoing that sort of stuff. 0:02:00.198 --> 0:02:02.478 So it was a little bit annoying because I hate 0:02:02.478 --> 0:02:06.678 maze games. Um, so I bypassed that one fairly quickly. 0:02:06.678 --> 0:02:10.398 The Echo Quiz one was amazing because what it has 0:02:10.398 --> 0:02:13.038 is about 75. I think it's about 75 to 80. 0:02:13.038 --> 0:02:16.518 Fun questions and you've got multiple choice. So for example, 0:02:16.518 --> 0:02:20.388 it'll say you're on a busy street. Which side of 0:02:20.388 --> 0:02:22.488 you did the bus turn up on. And then it 0:02:22.488 --> 0:02:24.578 calls it plays about I think it's about a 5 0:02:24.578 --> 0:02:28.998 or 6, 7 or 8 second audio track. And of course, 0:02:28.998 --> 0:02:31.788 because you've got to wear headphones with left and right 0:02:31.788 --> 0:02:35.628 stereo channels on them. Or it might say, which way 0:02:35.628 --> 0:02:38.478 is the cyclist coming towards you? Is it coming from 0:02:38.478 --> 0:02:40.968 your left going to your right, or is it going 0:02:40.968 --> 0:02:43.248 from your right, going to your left, or is it 0:02:43.248 --> 0:02:47.418 coming behind you and going forward so that that's really fine? 0:02:47.418 --> 0:02:48.528 And of course, at the end of it all, it 0:02:48.528 --> 0:02:49.848 gives you a bit of a bit of a score 0:02:49.848 --> 0:02:52.038 because it'll always say if you're correct or incorrect out 0:02:52.038 --> 0:02:54.648 of you have three multiple choices, and then you can 0:02:54.828 --> 0:02:56.778 go back and play them again. So the one that 0:02:56.778 --> 0:02:59.928 I found was really annoying was the, you know, you 0:02:59.928 --> 0:03:02.028 can hear a humming noise. What are you standing in 0:03:02.028 --> 0:03:07.608 front of a dishwasher, a washing machine or a fridge? Um, 0:03:07.608 --> 0:03:09.468 and I'll let you guys have a play of that 0:03:09.468 --> 0:03:11.058 and see which one you came up with. I got 0:03:11.058 --> 0:03:13.548 it wrong the first time, I might say. And then 0:03:13.548 --> 0:03:16.728 the third game, which is again, my interesting one. It's 0:03:16.728 --> 0:03:20.628 the echo vs straight one, and this sounds like exactly 0:03:20.628 --> 0:03:23.778 what it is you're crossing is straight, but you have 0:03:23.778 --> 0:03:26.178 to listen to the traffic sounds. So a couple of 0:03:26.178 --> 0:03:30.738 the questions are you're crossing a pedestrian crossing on a 0:03:30.738 --> 0:03:34.908 dual carriageway. So you know one carriageway each way. So 0:03:34.908 --> 0:03:38.418 two lanes. When is it safe to cross. So you've 0:03:38.418 --> 0:03:40.338 got to listen to the cars waiting to stop and 0:03:40.338 --> 0:03:43.488 start idling. And then you cross. And then it gets 0:03:43.488 --> 0:03:46.578 more and more complicated because then you've got background sounds, 0:03:46.578 --> 0:03:49.908 you've got roosters crowing, um, and you've got other noises 0:03:49.908 --> 0:03:52.458 going on and it gets more and more complicated. The 0:03:52.458 --> 0:03:55.428 only thing I think I worked out is because it's 0:03:55.428 --> 0:04:01.458 an overseas European type street, set up the cars near you. 0:04:01.458 --> 0:04:04.008 I go in the opposite direction. So when we're standing 0:04:04.008 --> 0:04:06.318 on the side of the road, the the cars are 0:04:06.318 --> 0:04:09.228 normally going one direction that are closest to you. We'll 0:04:09.228 --> 0:04:12.018 just remember in this game that the cars that you 0:04:12.018 --> 0:04:14.208 would think will be going right, right the normal way 0:04:14.208 --> 0:04:15.978 in front of you are on the actual opposite side 0:04:15.978 --> 0:04:19.098 of the road because of the way the traffic goes, um, overseas. 0:04:19.098 --> 0:04:22.758 But besides that, really, really fun to play. And of course, 0:04:22.758 --> 0:04:24.798 I had other questions about if you heard a truck 0:04:24.798 --> 0:04:27.438 pull up, uh, where is it? Or a bus or 0:04:27.438 --> 0:04:30.048 whatever else it might be. So the two main ones 0:04:30.048 --> 0:04:34.038 that I really would let ask people to actually check out, 0:04:34.248 --> 0:04:38.418 particularly if you've got, um, young people or teenagers learning 0:04:38.418 --> 0:04:42.708 a bit more about echolocation and taking account of sounds. 0:04:42.708 --> 0:04:46.158 Really go through the quiz particularly, and then the straight 0:04:46.158 --> 0:04:47.118 one following that. 0:04:47.688 --> 0:04:49.668 So it's called echo vs. 0:04:50.148 --> 0:04:52.278 Yeah. So echo is to find all three of them. 0:04:52.368 --> 0:04:54.018 But if you want to get specific ones in its 0:04:54.018 --> 0:04:58.578 echo vs new word quiz, echo vs New Word Street. 0:04:58.728 --> 0:05:01.158 And they're in the Apple Store as well as the 0:05:01.158 --> 0:05:04.458 Google Play Store. Seeing I that's been around quite a 0:05:04.458 --> 0:05:06.258 few years, let's talk about it. 0:05:06.288 --> 0:05:09.338 Yes, I think we should do a drumroll. This one. Um, 0:05:09.338 --> 0:05:11.108 let me just explain. If you don't know what seeing 0:05:11.108 --> 0:05:14.348 AI is, particularly Android users out there saying that AI 0:05:14.348 --> 0:05:16.658 is a suite of applications that when you run the 0:05:16.658 --> 0:05:19.868 application particularly, which is free, of course, you get lots 0:05:19.868 --> 0:05:22.868 of different quote channels or options, so you get a 0:05:22.868 --> 0:05:24.668 short text for just pointing your camera at something and 0:05:24.668 --> 0:05:27.068 having it read quickly. You sort of get a proper 0:05:27.068 --> 0:05:30.908 document scanning option. You get product info, which is barcoding, 0:05:31.028 --> 0:05:36.398 you get facial recognition, object recognition, hand recognition, light detection, 0:05:36.398 --> 0:05:37.658 and so on. This is a. 0:05:37.658 --> 0:05:39.488 Product from Microsoft. 0:05:39.488 --> 0:05:43.148 Correct? That's right. And it's been available in on iOS 0:05:43.148 --> 0:05:46.538 for a very long time. Well finally this is what 0:05:46.538 --> 0:05:50.348 I said about the drum roll. It's now available in Android. 0:05:50.348 --> 0:05:53.528 If you like me and you use iOS and Android, 0:05:53.528 --> 0:05:56.348 it's a little bit different because on iOS you've got 0:05:56.348 --> 0:05:59.678 a slider, um, that you can flick up, up and 0:05:59.678 --> 0:06:01.658 down between the different options. Well, I think they've had 0:06:01.658 --> 0:06:04.688 to do it a different way on Android. So the 0:06:04.688 --> 0:06:08.018 main screen gives you the option. So you've got short 0:06:08.018 --> 0:06:11.468 text document reader and someone. So you flick between them 0:06:11.738 --> 0:06:13.688 like you would normally do on a normal application. Then 0:06:13.688 --> 0:06:15.338 you double tap to activate it. Then you choose the 0:06:15.338 --> 0:06:17.978 back button to go back. So it's slightly different in iOS. 0:06:18.518 --> 0:06:22.598 But the other thing that's exactly the same is initially 0:06:22.598 --> 0:06:24.608 this is for Android users that haven't seen it before. 0:06:24.758 --> 0:06:27.908 When you first go into a quote channel or an option, 0:06:27.908 --> 0:06:30.938 it brings up a little help thing that explains to 0:06:30.938 --> 0:06:32.678 you how to use it and what it's for, and 0:06:32.678 --> 0:06:34.568 that sort of stuff. Then once you have done that, 0:06:34.568 --> 0:06:36.968 it won't come up a second time unless you're specifically 0:06:36.968 --> 0:06:39.938 going to help and have a look at it again. Uh, 0:06:39.938 --> 0:06:42.248 so that tends to drive you crazy when you want 0:06:42.248 --> 0:06:44.138 to explore the app and you go into different options 0:06:44.138 --> 0:06:45.668 and it keeps coming up, but once you've done it 0:06:45.668 --> 0:06:47.618 the first time, it'll then go away and you can 0:06:47.618 --> 0:06:50.588 operate it normally. But no, this is one of those 0:06:50.588 --> 0:06:54.338 things to me. The Seeing Eye app on iOS and 0:06:54.548 --> 0:06:59.498 Android is my Swiss Army knife of AI apps to 0:06:59.498 --> 0:07:02.738 assist me in my environment, and it's absolutely amazing. So 0:07:02.798 --> 0:07:06.128 there you go. Everybody who uses iOS and Android now 0:07:06.128 --> 0:07:09.338 can enjoy the freedom that AI gives you. 0:07:09.758 --> 0:07:14.138 Now it must be Christmas early for the Android environment 0:07:14.138 --> 0:07:18.188 because be my eyes. The AI feature, which has been 0:07:18.188 --> 0:07:22.538 around in the iOS environment for a little while, it's 0:07:22.538 --> 0:07:24.098 come to Android. That's right. 0:07:24.098 --> 0:07:27.698 So this caused a bit of confusion. Um, last week, 0:07:27.698 --> 0:07:30.878 because what happened was they announced seeing AI and then 0:07:30.878 --> 0:07:32.828 that's been my eyes. And it was I thought, well, 0:07:32.828 --> 0:07:35.348 hang on a minute. Be My Eyes is an app 0:07:35.348 --> 0:07:39.368 where you contact a volunteer and like the IRA paid service, 0:07:39.368 --> 0:07:42.458 someone who can tell you what you're looking at and, uh, 0:07:42.458 --> 0:07:45.188 read out information on a teen or read out a 0:07:45.188 --> 0:07:48.428 letter through the camera and so on. But what's happened, 0:07:48.428 --> 0:07:50.978 of course, for us iOS users this year is that 0:07:50.978 --> 0:07:54.878 we've had the the public beta version of the virtual 0:07:54.878 --> 0:07:59.198 AI assistant, which basically you take a picture of whatever 0:07:59.198 --> 0:08:00.968 you might be taking a picture of, let's say, um, 0:08:00.968 --> 0:08:04.808 a backyard or a playground layout or a building layout inside, 0:08:04.808 --> 0:08:07.658 like reception and chairs and lifts and so on. And 0:08:07.658 --> 0:08:09.308 then it will tell you what's in the photo, and 0:08:09.308 --> 0:08:11.528 then you can actually interrogate it a little bit more 0:08:11.798 --> 0:08:15.698 so that that option, which is the virtual AI of 0:08:15.728 --> 0:08:19.118 Be My Eyes, has now come into the Be My 0:08:19.118 --> 0:08:23.918 Eyes version on Android. So when they were saying be 0:08:23.918 --> 0:08:27.338 my eyes comes to Android, what they were saying is 0:08:27.338 --> 0:08:31.058 that the be my eyes virtual AI is now in 0:08:31.058 --> 0:08:34.448 the public initial request feature, so I'm going to run it. 0:08:34.448 --> 0:08:37.328 Last week I was able to put a request in, 0:08:37.328 --> 0:08:41.138 so when I tapped on virtual AI, it said, your 0:08:41.138 --> 0:08:43.838 request has been logged. Uh, we'll let you know when 0:08:43.838 --> 0:08:46.778 it's going to be available for testing. So now for 0:08:46.778 --> 0:08:49.598 Android users, not only do you have a full blown 0:08:49.598 --> 0:08:54.908 scene AI, which also does scene detection for taking photos, 0:08:54.908 --> 0:08:58.748 but you've also got that option on being my eyes. 0:08:58.748 --> 0:09:01.658 When you request to be part of the beta testing service. 0:09:02.018 --> 0:09:06.458 We'll switch to the Mac now, Audible and Kindle, those 0:09:06.458 --> 0:09:08.078 apps both available on the Mac. 0:09:08.348 --> 0:09:10.088 I should say, up front, because I ran an Apple 0:09:10.088 --> 0:09:12.758 Silicon chip mac, which is basically all new Macs these 0:09:12.758 --> 0:09:15.608 days anyway, so it's the M1 chip and upwards. I 0:09:15.608 --> 0:09:19.298 can run the course iOS apps through a thing called Rosetta, 0:09:19.598 --> 0:09:22.538 and I thought for a while the audible app would 0:09:22.538 --> 0:09:25.478 allow you to run on an Apple chip computer. I 0:09:25.478 --> 0:09:27.638 don't know why, but I tried it the other day 0:09:27.638 --> 0:09:29.978 just because I felt like trying. I thought, my goodness, 0:09:29.978 --> 0:09:32.618 I can actually use and listen to all my books now, 0:09:32.618 --> 0:09:35.678 which I've got about 1300 off. So that was really exciting. 0:09:35.678 --> 0:09:37.808 But the second thing that got me really, really, really, 0:09:37.808 --> 0:09:41.498 really excited was that never have you been able to 0:09:41.498 --> 0:09:45.968 read Kindle books on your Mac with the Kindle Mac app, 0:09:46.028 --> 0:09:48.638 and since they updated it, I think it's about a 0:09:48.638 --> 0:09:51.128 month or two ago now. So they rewrote the thing. 0:09:51.368 --> 0:09:55.148 It's now become completely accessible. Now you can't read in 0:09:55.148 --> 0:09:57.998 continuous mode that we've been used to in in iOS, 0:09:58.028 --> 0:10:01.358 on Kindle and Android, but you can definitely read page 0:10:01.358 --> 0:10:03.458 by page. You can jump around your contents, you can 0:10:03.458 --> 0:10:05.258 do all the stuff you can probably really do on 0:10:05.258 --> 0:10:08.728 iOS and Android, and it's just. Amazing in my book 0:10:08.728 --> 0:10:10.468 library at the moment on my Kindle is probably got 0:10:10.468 --> 0:10:12.988 a couple of thousand books in it, so it's really 0:10:12.988 --> 0:10:15.568 fantastic that I've now I've got availability of both my 0:10:15.568 --> 0:10:18.868 audible library and my Kindle library on my Mac. 0:10:19.468 --> 0:10:22.708 For those who have a blind show. Classic two phone. 0:10:22.888 --> 0:10:26.038 It's got nice buttons on it. You can't run messenger 0:10:26.038 --> 0:10:27.268 Light on it anymore. 0:10:27.688 --> 0:10:31.288 No, now it doesn't tell you that it's Mission Delight, 0:10:31.288 --> 0:10:32.908 I should say, until you try and run the thing 0:10:32.908 --> 0:10:35.128 because it just says messenger. So I, you know, I 0:10:35.128 --> 0:10:36.778 use messenger all the time with my family. So I 0:10:36.778 --> 0:10:39.568 popped in there and read it and it went. Messenger 0:10:39.568 --> 0:10:43.588 light is no longer supported. And I went, oh. So 0:10:43.588 --> 0:10:45.688 then it took me to a web page which was 0:10:45.688 --> 0:10:48.748 not particularly accessible on the blind show. So what I'm 0:10:48.748 --> 0:10:52.888 trying to let people know about is the positive thing 0:10:52.888 --> 0:10:54.928 about the Blind Shield Classic two is that you're using 0:10:54.928 --> 0:10:57.928 a quote launcher, which is basically in Android. So it's 0:10:57.928 --> 0:11:01.648 taking you to a nice, safe, menu driven environment, and 0:11:01.648 --> 0:11:04.348 they take care of all the applications running in the background, 0:11:04.348 --> 0:11:05.728 which is why I said I didn't realize it was 0:11:05.728 --> 0:11:09.658 a messenger light, but once those apps ever get updated 0:11:09.658 --> 0:11:12.448 or get broken because, you know, in this case meta, 0:11:12.778 --> 0:11:15.868 Facebook has taken it away, then there's nothing you can 0:11:15.868 --> 0:11:19.258 do about it. So just keep in mind until either 0:11:19.258 --> 0:11:22.618 the blind shield code is changed to the updated application, 0:11:22.618 --> 0:11:25.198 which is the full messenger, or they just take it 0:11:25.198 --> 0:11:27.778 away completely. From that point of view, there's nothing you 0:11:27.778 --> 0:11:29.218 can do about it because you can't come out of 0:11:29.218 --> 0:11:32.578 the Blind Shield. Classic two menu. Run talkback and go 0:11:32.578 --> 0:11:34.558 and run your normal messenger like the rest of us 0:11:34.558 --> 0:11:38.128 can do on a smartphone, whether that's Android or iOS iPhone. 0:11:38.578 --> 0:11:40.618 So I was a bit disappointed by that because it 0:11:40.618 --> 0:11:42.688 was such a great thing that it works so well. 0:11:42.688 --> 0:11:45.388 So here's fingers crossed that the developers will know about. 0:11:45.388 --> 0:11:48.058 I've already contacted quantum and let them know and we'll 0:11:48.058 --> 0:11:49.768 see what happens, probably in the new year. 0:11:50.128 --> 0:11:52.078 Tell us about copilot. 0:11:52.438 --> 0:11:57.868 Copilot is basically the AI system produced by Microsoft in particular. 0:11:57.868 --> 0:12:01.168 And it sort of combines what does combine Bing, which 0:12:01.168 --> 0:12:06.838 is their big search engine and ChatGPT for. And if 0:12:06.838 --> 0:12:10.318 you're on Windows 10 and of course, Windows 11, the 0:12:10.318 --> 0:12:13.408 copilot button is actually on your taskbar. So it means 0:12:13.408 --> 0:12:17.188 you can access the AI chat system to, you know, 0:12:17.188 --> 0:12:20.908 ask for coding or ask for travel travel plan information, 0:12:20.908 --> 0:12:24.808 or ask basically anything you can ask of quote chat GPT. 0:12:25.648 --> 0:12:28.468 But the main difference is one, because it is. It's 0:12:28.468 --> 0:12:31.378 also using Bing as its search engine. It's live. So 0:12:31.378 --> 0:12:33.448 I can actually ask it, you know who won the 0:12:33.448 --> 0:12:35.638 the formula one this year or who are the top 0:12:35.638 --> 0:12:38.398 ten drivers for formula One this year? And I'll give 0:12:38.398 --> 0:12:40.828 you that information. The chat GPT one will only go 0:12:40.828 --> 0:12:45.058 up to 2022. The free version, at least the reason 0:12:45.058 --> 0:12:46.828 why I like it running on the Mac is because 0:12:46.828 --> 0:12:49.168 of course I'm not using windows, so I have to 0:12:49.168 --> 0:12:52.558 use the web version of Copilot, but I can still 0:12:52.558 --> 0:12:57.268 use my microphone to speak into the microphone button to 0:12:57.268 --> 0:12:59.008 ask it questions. And it comes back to me with 0:12:59.008 --> 0:13:02.518 this beautiful sounding, um, female voice. And it sounds really nice. 0:13:02.638 --> 0:13:04.828 The only thing I wish it would do is like 0:13:04.828 --> 0:13:08.518 ChatGPT now where you can basically ask it questions and 0:13:08.518 --> 0:13:10.498 it speaks back to you and you're having a continuous 0:13:10.498 --> 0:13:14.218 conversation without speaking any buttons. This feels a bit primitive now, 0:13:14.218 --> 0:13:16.768 because with copilot I've got to press the microphone button, 0:13:16.768 --> 0:13:18.928 asked the question, and then it comes back and gives 0:13:18.928 --> 0:13:20.668 me the answer. Then they've got to press the button again. 0:13:20.668 --> 0:13:24.478 But the two way conversation in, um, the open ChatGPT 0:13:24.478 --> 0:13:27.568 on both iOS and Android is just flawless. So here's 0:13:27.568 --> 0:13:29.398 fingers crossed. I don't know what it's like on windows 0:13:29.398 --> 0:13:32.728 of Copilot with the continuous chat function. Um, but yeah, 0:13:32.908 --> 0:13:35.458 at the moment it does feel a little bit primitive. 0:13:35.458 --> 0:13:37.378 It feels like the old days, even if like one 0:13:37.378 --> 0:13:37.948 a year ago. 0:13:38.248 --> 0:13:41.698 Yes. It's amazing. It's moving so fast. Before we go, 0:13:41.698 --> 0:13:43.948 a reminder of where people can find details of what 0:13:43.948 --> 0:13:46.618 we've been talking about in this and previous editions of 0:13:46.618 --> 0:13:47.398 the program. 0:13:47.398 --> 0:13:49.858 Indeed. So as always, you can check out my blog site, 0:13:49.858 --> 0:13:54.538 which is David would be dot podbean pad Bayon com. 0:13:54.718 --> 0:13:59.728 David would be our podbean pod be a incom to 0:13:59.728 --> 0:14:00.718 write to the program. 0:14:00.718 --> 0:14:02.638 You can write to me at Vision Australia, where I work, 0:14:02.638 --> 0:14:06.538 of course, which is David Woodbridge how it sounds at 0:14:06.538 --> 0:14:07.438 Vision Australia. 0:14:07.678 --> 0:14:12.568 Org David Woodbridge at Vision Australia. Org this has been 0:14:12.568 --> 0:14:16.318 talking tech with me has been Vision Australia's national advisor 0:14:16.318 --> 0:14:20.788 on access technology David Woodbridge I'm Stephen Jolley. Stay safe. 0:14:20.788 --> 0:14:22.318 We'll talk more tech next week. See you.