Speaker 1: Get a Peter Hell, are you here? Welcome to You
Speaker 1: ain't seen nothing yet?
Speaker 2: The movie Podcast, where I chat to a movie lover
Speaker 2: about a classic or beloved movie they haven't quite got
Speaker 2: around to watching until now. And today's guest singer, songwriter, musician, podcaster, broadcaster, author,
Speaker 2: entrepreneur mate Claire Bowditch.
Speaker 3: The first rule of fake club is you do not
Speaker 3: talk about fake.
Speaker 4: Club now always. You're afraid of you broke my heart.
Speaker 5: I admire your luck, mister Bond, James.
Speaker 6: Bond, they couldn't have at any right now, you ain't
Speaker 6: seen nothing yet.
Speaker 2: If the keys to a happy, healthy life is to
Speaker 2: surround yourself with positive, creative people, than everyone to try
Speaker 2: to become mates with Claire Bontage. Now, understandably, not everyone
Speaker 2: is able to make that happen for a.
Speaker 1: Variety of reasons geography, access, etc.
Speaker 2: But what you should do is attempt to devour the
Speaker 2: creativity of Claire Bontage anyway you can. And the great
Speaker 2: news is, due to the prolific and neglecting nature of
Speaker 2: Claire's work, there is more opportunities than with most people.
Speaker 1: Firstly, there is Claire's music.
Speaker 2: From her debut release Autumn Bone to what was left,
Speaker 2: featuring her breakout hit Divorcee at twenty three. It's still
Speaker 2: such a stunning song. The moon looked on the Winter.
Speaker 2: I chose Happiness Incredible albums for me. My favorite and
Speaker 2: for many is her seminal album Modern Day Addiction, with
Speaker 2: which is a true masterpiece in my top five of
Speaker 2: all time. I revisit it quite often, and if you
Speaker 2: haven't listened to it, I urge you to do so.
Speaker 2: I have been guilty of forcing people to listen to.
Speaker 1: Songs from this album.
Speaker 2: At a post Logi's function, I made a group of
Speaker 2: people listen to Claire's song Your Own kind of Girl,
Speaker 2: and I said, if you have daughters, you need to
Speaker 2: listen to this song and make them listen to it.
Speaker 2: I don't have daughters, so I'll just force other people
Speaker 2: with daughters to listen to that song. It's such an
Speaker 2: incredible song, so many incredible songs on that album. Please
Speaker 2: listen to it if you haven't already, and I'm sure
Speaker 2: you will love it. Using the title of that song,
Speaker 2: Claire released her raw, honest and life affirming memoir Your
Speaker 2: Own Kind of Girl, which again I have passed on
Speaker 2: to many many people.
Speaker 1: It is a stunning piece of world work.
Speaker 2: Claire is also a social entrepreneur, founding The Big Heart
Speaker 2: of Business, which exists to teach creative people about business
Speaker 2: and business people about creativity in ways that makes sense.
Speaker 2: Claire was in Offspring. She hosted ABC Radio. She's a podcaster.
Speaker 2: Claire is honest, believes in the power of positivity, but
Speaker 2: he's not afraid to speak about her own demons and
Speaker 2: self doubts. Claire is incredibly talented, compassionate, funny, and I'm
Speaker 2: bloody stoked to be hanging with her today.
Speaker 6: Hello, I'm Claiboditch. My three favorite films are as follows one,
Speaker 6: car Wise in the Mood for Love, I'm all I'm
Speaker 6: going to take?
Speaker 4: Which one?
Speaker 6: Have the Sound of Music? By the Sound of music,
Speaker 6: Oh ray Me Do Rainy? And lastly Black Balloon by
Speaker 6: Alissa Down Why Hello Helloul. But the truth is there's
Speaker 6: now another contender in the mix. Until last night, I've
Speaker 6: never seen the movie Rocky.
Speaker 2: Surely this is one movie that barely needs a synopsis
Speaker 2: provided Is there anyone on this planet Earth who doesn't
Speaker 2: know what Rocky is about? On November twenty five, nineteen
Speaker 2: seventy five, we find a small time boxer getting heckled
Speaker 2: and ged, and the rams shackled about in a dodgy gym.
Speaker 2: Despite being declared the winner, the Italian Stallion claims forty
Speaker 2: four dollars fifty five cents after locker, shower and twel
Speaker 2: charges are deducted. If this isn't rock Bottom, it's pretty
Speaker 2: close for Rocky Balboa, played of course by Sylvester Stallone,
Speaker 2: who also wrote the screenplay.
Speaker 1: Living in a.
Speaker 2: Shithole, working for a loan shark, barely able to get
Speaker 2: the attention of local pet store worker Adrian, played beautifully
Speaker 2: by Talia Shaier, but things eventually are on the way up.
Speaker 2: Heavyweight champion of the World Apollo Creed Carl Weathers show
Speaker 2: boats into town talking a big game, but that talk
Speaker 2: gets curtailed when his opponent is injured. Determined not to
Speaker 2: miss out on the chance for another payday, Apollo has
Speaker 2: the idea to give an unknown fighter the chance of
Speaker 2: a lifetime.
Speaker 1: Directed by John g. Elvedson said it in a fever.
Speaker 2: The Crawati Kids stand by Me an iconic score by
Speaker 2: Bill Conti, the highest grossing film of nineteen seventy six,
Speaker 2: It won three Oscars for Best Film, Best Director, and
Speaker 2: best editing.
Speaker 1: Rocky is the.
Speaker 2: Ultimate underdog Rags the Riches movie Claire Boatage. Are you
Speaker 2: inspired enough to run up the steps of Parliament House.
Speaker 1: In Spring Street here in Melbourne?
Speaker 6: Not only am I inspired enough, I already did it alone.
Speaker 6: That's why I was laid.
Speaker 1: Welcome to you, wanting nothing yet absolute treat.
Speaker 6: This is one of my favorite podcasts.
Speaker 2: Oh well, you're very kind, and I had the treat
Speaker 2: last night because I watched it last night as you did.
Speaker 1: And I know you watched it because you sent me
Speaker 1: love the little videos throughout throughout you. You were set up,
Speaker 1: you had popcorn, we did. Did you watch it by yourself?
Speaker 1: As the family?
Speaker 6: Myself, my cat, my dog, my husband Marty, and one
Speaker 6: of my sons, Oscar. So the other kids were out,
Speaker 6: that's the only reason they weren't watching. Yeah, I said
Speaker 6: to them, guys, I was not allowed to watch this
Speaker 6: when I was a child. I'm giving you the opportunity
Speaker 6: now now they're fifteen, fifteen, and nineteen. So they were
Speaker 6: so two of them left the house and with the
Speaker 6: other one stayed and we got to watch it together.
Speaker 2: Who There's a lot to talk about and we'll get
Speaker 2: to it soon. So this is something you weren't allowed
Speaker 2: to watch. And we spoke about as I do most guests.
Speaker 2: There's a couple of films that we I ask you
Speaker 2: that you haven't seen. There were I think Aaron Brockovich
Speaker 2: may have been one that was tantalizing to chat to
Speaker 2: you about. That would have been amazing. But I feel
Speaker 2: like Rocky is such an iconic film and I we've
Speaker 2: been close to maybe getting it done. Luke McGregor nominated
Speaker 2: but then told me it's three months earlier.
Speaker 1: They're not the rules, Luke.
Speaker 6: No, Luke. I mean, look, he's an artist, so he's
Speaker 6: always pushing the boundaries. No, that's not the rules. And
Speaker 6: I'm so grateful that they are the rules and that
Speaker 6: you've stuck to them. Like, I appreciate this disciplinary sort
Speaker 6: of streaking you because I've benefited greatly from it.
Speaker 2: Well, I cannot wait to get stuck in talking about Rocky.
Speaker 2: There's so much to talk about. Let's talk about your
Speaker 2: three favorite films. Great now, I thought the first one,
Speaker 2: I have no idea what this film is. I thought
Speaker 2: you were about to say Willy Wonk and my Mind
Speaker 2: with the Chocolate Factory. Yeah, yeah, yeah, My apologies.
Speaker 6: Not at all, not at all. It was actually Jelly
Speaker 6: in the Chocolate Factory. The original was one of my
Speaker 6: favorite films as a child, but one. Ka Wai is
Speaker 6: an incredible Shanghai based director whose beauty and ability to
Speaker 6: play with light just broke my heart when the first
Speaker 6: time I saw in the Mood for Love, which is
Speaker 6: essentially a story, you know, a story about two people
Speaker 6: who are engaging in falling in love. It was made
Speaker 6: in two thousand, but the first time I saw it,
Speaker 6: I just felt that I had seen something that would
Speaker 6: stay with me for life, something that was beautiful and true.
Speaker 6: Now the world felt the same way, you know. It's
Speaker 6: one of the few films and few filmmakers from Asia
Speaker 6: who was able to crack through into a Western market.
Speaker 6: His movies are all subtitled, so they're all in original language.
Speaker 6: But it's just a beautiful, contemplative story. And as always,
Speaker 6: it's the soundtrack. Who I don't know who wrote the soundtrack.
Speaker 6: Actually that's ridiculous, I'm making a note here, but the soundtrack,
Speaker 6: the way it all worked to and the gentleness of
Speaker 6: the movie was just so beautiful. So it's stuck in my.
Speaker 1: Heart all of these years, and what's the film about.
Speaker 6: It's really essentially about two people, two people who are
Speaker 6: living quite small lives and find each other within that life.
Speaker 6: They engage on what could be called an affair of
Speaker 6: sorts or the contemplation of an affair for a lot
Speaker 6: of it. So I won't spoil that for you, but
Speaker 6: that's part of its beauty. It's about real people in
Speaker 6: real life and the emotional struggle of trying to find
Speaker 6: truth and connection in an environment where it's not encouraged.
Speaker 2: You spoke about light, then we're actually having a conversation
Speaker 2: about light the recording and you think about light a
Speaker 2: lot like you have a relationship with light, and that
Speaker 2: obviously you when you perform, whether it be in a
Speaker 2: video or on stage, you must be thinking about light
Speaker 2: a lot.
Speaker 1: Did did this inform that? Were you? Were you aware
Speaker 1: of your relationship with light? You watch us all? Did
Speaker 1: this begin that relationship?
Speaker 6: Let's just let's just go back to track a bit
Speaker 6: and explain this. When I say relationship with light, light,
Speaker 6: I guess what Pete's referring to is, you know, previous
Speaker 6: conversation we've had based on a renovation that we're doing,
Speaker 6: where myself and my lovely electrician. You know, we were
Speaker 6: learning from each other. He was fascinated by the strength
Speaker 6: of feeling that I had around the color, the warmth,
Speaker 6: and the choice of light. So I'll explain it. We
Speaker 6: all have our own sensitivities, things that sort of You know,
Speaker 6: you might smell jackfruit and not like the smell. It's
Speaker 6: very You know, your sense of smell is really strong.
Speaker 6: One is too, But one of my strongest emotional reactions
Speaker 6: and senses is sight and light. So if we're in
Speaker 6: a room and there's white light, and I realized this
Speaker 6: as a kid, I just don't feel great. I feel
Speaker 6: cold and scared. If there is warm light, I feel
Speaker 6: open and able to It's sort of like I feel
Speaker 6: like I belong. Now call it synthase easier or something
Speaker 6: else if you like, that's fine, but I think it's
Speaker 6: not uncommon. I'm not sure if Wi's ability to play
Speaker 6: with light, it probably did inform me. But I think
Speaker 6: what it did was I responded to it because I
Speaker 6: saw that he saw light in the same way, or
Speaker 6: he felt the emotional quality of light in the same
Speaker 6: way I do. It sounds ridiculous, but if I can.
Speaker 1: It doesn't seem ridiculous at all.
Speaker 2: And the reason I wanted to mention it because I
Speaker 2: just maybe think we don't often take in. Everyone's so busy,
Speaker 2: we don't often take in. We might go, oh, I
Speaker 2: like this, I like the way that smells, or I
Speaker 2: love the way you know that that thing looks, but
Speaker 2: we don't then go, Okay, well, how do I make
Speaker 2: those choices in my life to have these things surrounding
Speaker 2: me more often?
Speaker 6: And I think what happens is some of us who
Speaker 6: are sensitive to certain things, it really affects our life.
Speaker 6: So that's why we're forced to sort of consider it.
Speaker 6: And that's probably what happened with me. I just realize
Speaker 6: I'm a performer, and I would reflect back on performances.
Speaker 6: Why was that useful? Well like why did I kill
Speaker 6: it that night and not another night? And so often
Speaker 6: it had to do with the sensitivity the lighting in
Speaker 6: the room. And it goes back to probably a basic
Speaker 6: human or maybe mammalian impulse. Let's say cats don't give
Speaker 6: birth in full light. Women prefer to give birth in
Speaker 6: modest light as well, just because it's one less thing
Speaker 6: to think about, you know, cats go to the back
Speaker 6: of the cupboard where it's dark and they do their thing.
Speaker 6: So anytime I'm vulnerable if the lights are bright. And
Speaker 6: this is an interrogation technique, you know, it's been used
Speaker 6: freeans to the lights are bright, you're overwhelmed and you're
Speaker 6: probably not responding to whatever that is that you want
Speaker 6: to the nuance of whatever it is, the subtlety of
Speaker 6: whatever it is that's going on.
Speaker 2: But it's why restaurants often use handles, yes, you know,
Speaker 2: as opposed to your spotlights.
Speaker 6: It probably goes all the way back there. You know,
Speaker 6: we were people around the campfire once. We were people
Speaker 6: who didn't actually have any exposure to electric light until
Speaker 6: the very first person who could call himself an electrician, Edison. Yeah,
Speaker 6: what luck he invented. Edison was the first electrician. We
Speaker 6: think of it as a normal, you know, everyday trade
Speaker 6: and very important trade. But it didn't exist until that
Speaker 6: dude made it exists. Isn't that wild?
Speaker 1: It's crazy?
Speaker 6: And the same too with podcasters, pech. I mean, they
Speaker 6: didn't exist until quite recently exactly, and.
Speaker 1: We've taken the will by storm, both of us. Claire,
Speaker 1: go see that movie.
Speaker 6: That's all I'm saying is beautiful.
Speaker 1: Yes, when was it made? Two thousand and two, two
Speaker 1: thousands great.
Speaker 2: I think The Sound of Music is a movie that
Speaker 2: we covered recently with the wonderful Judith Flucy.
Speaker 6: I can't believe that Juda had not seen.
Speaker 2: It more than any other. I mean, I'm shock that
Speaker 2: you haven't seen Rocky, but I understand it. Jude seemed
Speaker 2: to be raised Catholic. I think you actually considered becoming
Speaker 2: a nun like a movie buff. None of it made sense,
Speaker 2: and I had seen it. I'd seen the Sound of Music.
Speaker 2: Not as many times I've seen Star Wars, but kind
Speaker 2: of in the vicinity.
Speaker 6: Do you like the movie?
Speaker 1: I love the movie?
Speaker 6: Correct, Yeah, that's right, because that's the right answer. Now,
Speaker 6: I don't trust people who tell me they don't like
Speaker 6: the Sound of Music. I'm sorry if that's you. But
Speaker 6: what's going on there? What? How can you not love
Speaker 6: that movie?
Speaker 1: Well, I mean you might have to jack with dude, that's.
Speaker 6: Right, you know why? Because I think you had to
Speaker 6: be indoctrinated early, you know, maybe that's it.
Speaker 1: I think there are a lot of movies like that.
Speaker 1: I think this really.
Speaker 2: This is one of those movies, because I think Jude
Speaker 2: made some reasonable, reasonably good points about the lack of
Speaker 2: plot in.
Speaker 6: The movie and the extended plot and that you know, yeah, look,
Speaker 6: she's not wrong, and.
Speaker 2: It doesn't after the Nazis invade. It kind of doesn't
Speaker 2: become about Maria after that, after the wedding doesn't really
Speaker 2: become about Maria become kind of Captain von Trap's movie.
Speaker 1: And yeah, but.
Speaker 6: The music and la costumes as well, but also the
Speaker 6: spirit of the thing, which is again this story of
Speaker 6: someone who is doggedly intent on being who she is
Speaker 6: within the confines of society at that time. You know,
Speaker 6: Maria v She's she should never have been a nun
Speaker 6: like we knew that from seeing her that was that
Speaker 6: was not her fate. She was there to sing and
Speaker 6: share songs. It is the ease with which she says
Speaker 6: shares songs and the normalcy of that that I think
Speaker 6: I love as an adults as well as a costume.
Speaker 6: So we mentioned the costumes. I've actually got a dress
Speaker 6: that I bought recently in the style of the Maria
Speaker 6: von Trapp playsuits made out of the curtains. I wore
Speaker 6: that at a show recently, great response. It's sort of
Speaker 6: white with greed.
Speaker 1: Have you ever sung any Sun music live? Like thrown
Speaker 1: in the.
Speaker 6: Little Yeah, I did a sort of is this one
Speaker 6: called it quite a spooky enchanting improv of you know,
Speaker 6: the song farewell alvidazain adue to. I can't remember the
Speaker 6: name of the action, but yeah, on the stairs. Recently
Speaker 6: at a show it was responded too strongly, I think positively.
Speaker 6: I'm not sure, but.
Speaker 1: I did carry up the stairs.
Speaker 6: It was at the forensics four room and the stick
Speaker 6: there was a staircase, so that was all part of it.
Speaker 6: And I was wearing the bond trap dress. But it
Speaker 6: was in the spirit of a random creative adventure. You know,
Speaker 6: sometimes we've got to try stuff that's a bit scary
Speaker 6: and it makes us feel alive again. So that's why
Speaker 6: I did that. But that that story of what creativity
Speaker 6: can bring to her life, now, that was really important
Speaker 6: for me as a little kid. We watched this. We
Speaker 6: watched that movie with my family. I think it might
Speaker 6: have been at Rye camping ground, local town hall. I
Speaker 6: remember Albi Mangele's Adventures being there on there and also
Speaker 6: the sound of music, and it was just a sort
Speaker 6: of a show that was always on every time it
Speaker 6: came on TV. But we'd all sit down and watch
Speaker 6: it together, but we'd be sent to bed before the
Speaker 6: Nazis came, you know, so we would usually watch the
Speaker 6: first half of the second half. It was shocking as
Speaker 6: an adult to watch it.
Speaker 2: I did learn, maybe unsurprisingly that when I was researching
Speaker 2: for the Dudes episode, that in Germany, like a lot
Speaker 2: of the German executives and film industry, they wanted basically
Speaker 2: to end at the wedding, so that was where it
Speaker 2: swissed to end.
Speaker 1: So you basically saw the German version of the elm.
Speaker 6: I saw the German version, the thought that it is
Speaker 6: actually based on a true story, The thought that that
Speaker 6: von Trapp family did run away and find shelter in
Speaker 6: the hills in some canton. You know, that's all extraordinary, and.
Speaker 2: They left behind that they left behind that house like
Speaker 2: they left with very little money.
Speaker 1: Eventually got to America.
Speaker 2: And what was one of the fascinating things I learned
Speaker 2: was the real Maria von Trapp had like I think,
Speaker 2: her parents died.
Speaker 1: When she was very young.
Speaker 2: She was raised by an uncle who was not very nice.
Speaker 2: And it was when she actually when the kids showed
Speaker 2: her love that was and they gave her a kiss.
Speaker 2: That was the first time she'd ever actually been kissed
Speaker 2: any in any way, shape or form. And she fell
Speaker 2: in love with the kids before she fell in love
Speaker 2: with Captain von Trapp.
Speaker 6: Wow, I mean, wouldn't be the first time a woman
Speaker 6: has I mean maybe Von Trapp was a bit of
Speaker 6: a pain in the a And you know, having.
Speaker 1: That whistle like the whistle was whizzle was too much.
Speaker 1: And the use of.
Speaker 6: Soft lens in that movie too, I don't know, Look,
Speaker 6: it just it blew my mind. Yeah, I didn't know
Speaker 6: there was soft lens. All I knew is I was
Speaker 6: looking at the screen suddenly everything was soft and sweet. Yeah,
Speaker 6: but I think it was the sweetness perhaps of the film,
Speaker 6: her rebellious nature within the strict confines of the time,
Speaker 6: and also the frugality of it. So there they are
Speaker 6: these you know, brilliant he's a millionaire, but she's using
Speaker 6: what they have curtains and so on. Now, my mum
Speaker 6: was brought up. I was born in Melbourne. Mom was
Speaker 6: born in Amsterdam in forty two, in the middle of
Speaker 6: occupied Amsterdam, one of eleven and she grew up through
Speaker 6: the First World War and the aftermath of that, and
Speaker 6: she often speaks about the cleverness with which people were
Speaker 6: able to repurpose things. You know, they didn't have much food,
Speaker 6: so sometimes people would because everything was on ration, so
Speaker 6: sometimes people would just make soup out of potato peels.
Speaker 6: So to see her making costumes out of the curtains,
Speaker 6: I just love that. It was so deeply creative. But anyway,
Speaker 6: so that's the sound of music, my gosh.
Speaker 2: And another fun fact if you haven't listened to For
Speaker 2: those who have didn't listened to the episodes, this live
Speaker 2: too lives at this stage our only live performance. Will
Speaker 2: do some more soon. But one of my favorite facts
Speaker 2: was the money that the von Trap's got. The reason
Speaker 2: they got so much money is not because of Captain
Speaker 2: von Trapp, because his late wife and her great grandfather
Speaker 2: I think, invented the torpedo.
Speaker 1: It was torpedo money.
Speaker 6: That is fascinating. The other thing to mention about that
Speaker 6: movie and why it's so deeply affecting still, it's like
Speaker 6: all a lot of the stories that we see set
Speaker 6: in that time, which is you see the courage of
Speaker 6: people who stood up to what was clearly wrong and
Speaker 6: the sacrifice that they made, and I just you know,
Speaker 6: I just think when you can combine that with song
Speaker 6: and dance, because you know, Rocky didn't have song and
Speaker 6: danced Didy. We'll talk about that later, but when you
Speaker 6: can combine that in that way, it's no wonder the
Speaker 6: world fell in love with that movie. Yeah, I respect you,
Speaker 6: but that's it. That's one of my favorites.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I agree, I agree, Black Balloon.
Speaker 6: It's hard for me to choose a favorite movie. There
Speaker 6: are so many wonderful Australian directors and movies. A couple
Speaker 6: of years back, I had the pleasure of working with
Speaker 6: a crew on a television show, got Offspring. Now I'm
Speaker 6: not an actor, but you'll be great work, Thanks Buddy.
Speaker 6: During a COVID Offspring came on a streaming service for
Speaker 6: the first time and it's created bit of renaissance in
Speaker 6: my own recognizability at the supermarket shallow stades. The point
Speaker 6: being I had a very minor role is the truth
Speaker 6: of it.
Speaker 1: But I had the.
Speaker 6: Pleasure there of understanding more about how films are made
Speaker 6: and filmmakers create their work and also directors. Black Balloon
Speaker 6: was made by one of the incredible directors I got
Speaker 6: to work with on Offspring. Her name is Alissa Down.
Speaker 6: She wrote and directed this film. It was based on
Speaker 6: her life, really and to understand the enormous effort it
Speaker 6: takes to create a film. You know, that was my
Speaker 6: first insight into all of that. But that's not why
Speaker 6: I love the film. When I watched it, it's a powerful,
Speaker 6: beautiful story featuring a family who were different yet again
Speaker 6: set I think in the seventies, late seventies, early eighties.
Speaker 6: It star a number of unusual stars. Tony Collet's in there,
Speaker 6: but also Jim A Ward who was a model at
Speaker 6: the time. But the story itself is about it's sold
Speaker 6: through the perspective of a brother whose brother is severely
Speaker 6: autistic in a time where we really didn't understand what
Speaker 6: that meant to live, what it meant within a family
Speaker 6: to live with that kind of incredible difference. I'll just
Speaker 6: say that it's a beautifully told film because it's true film.
Speaker 6: It talks about the concepts of the time, the toughness
Speaker 6: of the time, those Australian ideas of you know, you're
Speaker 6: weak if you don't take care of your own but
Speaker 6: the effect that having a sibling who's different in your
Speaker 6: family can have on a family in both a difficult
Speaker 6: way also in a really profoundly beautiful way. So there's
Speaker 6: a depth to this story. As I said, it is
Speaker 6: based somewhat on Melissa's own experience. I just thought it
Speaker 6: was gorgeously executed. It's a comedy drama.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a beautiful film. I did see it when
Speaker 1: it came out.
Speaker 2: I don't think I could add anything that as any
Speaker 2: more than what you've said, but I remember being blown
Speaker 2: away by all the performances, by the craft of the film,
Speaker 2: and then the power of it.
Speaker 1: It's a beautiful film.
Speaker 6: Even as I'm talking about I'm sort of stumbling over
Speaker 6: it because I haven't seen it for a few years now,
Speaker 6: but it's one that sat with me. One of the
Speaker 6: things I really was delighted by was the performance of
Speaker 6: Jem Award. We don't expect much from you know, if
Speaker 6: you don't know who she is. She's a person who
Speaker 6: is very famous for being a model as a teenager,
Speaker 6: I don't know what, and she's sort of gone quite quiet.
Speaker 6: She's living quite a private life. Kate Bush style, you know,
Speaker 6: had a lot of success, prefers a privacy, and he's
Speaker 6: unusual in that way too, so I find that all
Speaker 6: quite fascinating. But her performance was so true. I don't
Speaker 6: know that. It stretched her terribly, and I've always wondered
Speaker 6: what else she might have to offer to acting if
Speaker 6: she wanted to. But it was a beautiful surprise. There's
Speaker 6: a tenderness to that film. It's a beauty.
Speaker 1: It's a great nomination. Great three films.
Speaker 2: Now let's move on and let's talk about the film
Speaker 2: we are here to talk about nineteen seventy six. The
Speaker 2: highest grocing film in nineteen seventy six won the Oscar
Speaker 2: written amazingly. When people find out, I think people forget
Speaker 2: who wrote this film. The star of the film wrote it.
Speaker 2: So it'sisterlone. It's set up eight movies spanning over five decades.
Speaker 1: Eight. Yeah, there you go.
Speaker 6: I've got so much ahead of me.
Speaker 1: Oh, you'll be coming back. Claire an incredible film, iconic
Speaker 1: Claire Boatage. Did you enjoy Rocky?
Speaker 6: I can't tell you how much I enjoyed Rocky.
Speaker 1: Yes, I'm so glad.
Speaker 2: I mean when you came in, you know you were
Speaker 2: making some motions towards enjoying it, and you did send
Speaker 2: me a video last night of you pubbing the air
Speaker 2: when Rocky goes up the stairs.
Speaker 6: I am surprised by how much I loved it. I
Speaker 6: thought that i'd watched it, actually, And when I look
Speaker 6: down a sort of list of movies that of the
Speaker 6: era that I hadn't watched it, I thought to myself, No,
Speaker 6: I've never seen Rocky. What I'd seen a few of
Speaker 6: the iconic images yep, of course, Rocky pumping and pumping
Speaker 6: fists in the air, running down the streets of Philly,
Speaker 6: maybe smashing a clump of meat. I might have seen
Speaker 6: that clip at some point. And of course I knew
Speaker 6: the music extremely well, but not so well. I actually
Speaker 6: thought I have the Tiger as part of Rocky One.
Speaker 2: It's not it's so funny because I sent Derek here
Speaker 2: at Cassaway Studios. I sent him either Tigers who played
Speaker 2: at the start, and he goes, it's actually Rocky too, mate.
Speaker 1: Oh bloody hell, it is too. Because I said him
Speaker 1: before I watched it last night.
Speaker 6: It's Bill CONTI was the music maker of this Rocky soundtrack,
Speaker 6: and you know, you know all the songs, you think
Speaker 6: you know the movie. I'd never seen it. I just
Speaker 6: didn't realize that there was a story there that was
Speaker 6: beyond two like spashion each other and us getting sort
Speaker 6: of inspo and I always sort of knew that it
Speaker 6: had some effect on dress code. You know, there's a
Speaker 6: common dress code that i'd seen and spotted in the
Speaker 6: eighties of men with fedoras on and leather jackets. I
Speaker 6: didn't you know. Now I know where that came from.
Speaker 6: You still see it around from time to time, and.
Speaker 2: I like that he came in bouncing your squash ball
Speaker 2: this morning too. Exactly did it reshape how you and
Speaker 2: you just saw it last night? And this podcast?
Speaker 1: I always remind people you're you're still processing what you
Speaker 1: saw last night, So did it reshape in your mind?
Speaker 1: Sylvester Stallone, It sure did.
Speaker 6: You can hear that. I'm slightly speechless here because, of course,
Speaker 6: after watching the movie, I haven't slept. I've been up
Speaker 6: all night really finding out more about Sylvester his contribution.
Speaker 6: I underrated him, is what I'm.
Speaker 4: Going to say.
Speaker 6: I thought he was someone who got lucky. Somewhere along
Speaker 6: the line, someone funded a field film and spawned you know,
Speaker 6: it was really the beginning of spawning second, third, fourth, fifth,
Speaker 6: et cetera. Serials of movies. None of that is true.
Speaker 6: Sylvester Stallone was a kid who was maybe in his
Speaker 6: thirties when this film finally got up. He wrote the
Speaker 6: film himself after failing and failing and failing in his
Speaker 6: career as an attempted actor in America in the seventies,
Speaker 6: and this was his last chance Texico. You know, this
Speaker 6: was a script that he wrote based on, you know,
Speaker 6: some thoughts that he had, possibly even I think there
Speaker 6: was a court case later on about who was actually
Speaker 6: based on and so on. But he's telling a biographical
Speaker 6: story and he put everything into it. And the same
Speaker 6: way Rocky did. He refused to allow anyone to buy
Speaker 6: the film the script of the film without him being
Speaker 6: attached to it. He was offered an enormous amount of
Speaker 6: money to sell it someone else would play it, and
Speaker 6: he said no. So there was all that sort of
Speaker 6: really interesting stuff about Sylvesterterlone.
Speaker 2: He said no with one hundred and six dollars in
Speaker 2: the bank. Wow, And he was offered three hundred and
Speaker 2: forty thousand dollars in nineteen seventy six.
Speaker 6: What's that like, fifteen million?
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's it's something huge. I just do a calculator, Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: fifteen million dollars.
Speaker 6: She had one, yeah, one, three, three.
Speaker 2: But it is incredible because he also was playing these
Speaker 2: roles where he was he was the mugger. So I
Speaker 2: told them Stephen Colbert, because I was always a mugger.
Speaker 2: I mugged you know Kojack Jack Kojack and Edward Woodwood
Speaker 2: and you know all these other guys in these TV.
Speaker 6: Shows, and couldn't get a break, could Yeah?
Speaker 2: And then he thought, well, what happens if I can
Speaker 2: obviously people ask how people see me? What if I
Speaker 2: create a character where I'm still like a mugger, but
Speaker 2: I've got I've got more going on than people realize.
Speaker 2: I've got something else that's worth, something that people can't
Speaker 2: quite see.
Speaker 6: And that's a classic Joseph Campbell hero's journey, but told
Speaker 6: in the context of its time, with the language of
Speaker 6: its time. We will talk about language maybe a little later,
Speaker 6: or some of some of the perceptions that we would
Speaker 6: now find questionable, which were really really interesting because there
Speaker 6: it all was out in the open. That skill of
Speaker 6: working with what you've got. I think that again, we
Speaker 6: talked about it before the sound of Music, but that
Speaker 6: again is really interesting to me. So not only was
Speaker 6: Sylvester salone unable to find a break, had the clever
Speaker 6: realization as an artist that this is how I'm seeing,
Speaker 6: so I'm going to work within that field. There's something
Speaker 6: else about Sylvester's face that I found out that I
Speaker 6: found really really fascinating. I always thought he was affecting,
Speaker 6: trying to affect a look on his face, like James
Speaker 6: dean Or. But the truth is I found out last
Speaker 6: night that when he was born, it was a traumatic berth.
Speaker 6: There was an obstetrician. The doctor had to use two
Speaker 6: pairs of forceps to get that kid, Sylvester out and
Speaker 6: in the course of that, one of the nerves in
Speaker 6: Sylvester's face was was seve it. The reason he looks
Speaker 6: and has the that look that we recognize him for
Speaker 6: is because he's partially paralyzed in the bottom of his face.
Speaker 6: He used again what that look said to the world
Speaker 6: and told a story within the context of who he was.
Speaker 6: I just I just love that. Yeah, things before that
Speaker 6: movie weren't going that well.
Speaker 2: For No, he did a movie called Death Race two thousand.
Speaker 2: He wasn't the lead, he was a smaller part, and
Speaker 2: executives were watching that and I think they're even watching
Speaker 2: the wrong person. Though there was a blonde had boken
Speaker 2: there and they said, hang on isn't his space to
Speaker 2: be attained. He's blonde, and they're like, oh, well, he'll
Speaker 2: make it work, and they actually almost cast the wrong
Speaker 2: the wrong I'm not sure how that happens, and that
Speaker 2: might that might be a bit of bullshit anyway.
Speaker 1: But there was another career he was he was going with.
Speaker 2: He had made some some adults films otherwise akaography.
Speaker 6: Soft porn. I haven't seen them myself, so I can't
Speaker 6: really I can't say.
Speaker 1: Next week's eisode and you ain't seen nothing yet.
Speaker 6: But he spoke about that later, didn't he? Do you
Speaker 6: know anything about what it was revealed at the time
Speaker 6: or was it something he got secret that came up
Speaker 6: as a shame?
Speaker 2: I thought it came later. Funnily enough, I haven't. I
Speaker 2: haven't gone down the rabbit hole of the flies a career.
Speaker 6: Fair enough, fair enough. What we know just from you know,
Speaker 6: it's a basic overview is yeah, he had to. He
Speaker 6: was desperate to pay the rent. He had no way
Speaker 6: of paying the rent. He was offered a role in
Speaker 6: a soft porn film before a couple of years before
Speaker 6: Rocky came out. It was either that or he mugged
Speaker 6: someone and stole the rent. Money, he said, so he
Speaker 6: chose the soft porn film. Now, the fact that in
Speaker 6: those times, if a woman had done that, they wouldn't
Speaker 6: have been able to have a career, even you know,
Speaker 6: in today's day and age, we know everything about everyone.
Speaker 6: But he would have thought to himself, I'll do this,
Speaker 6: no one will ever see it, I'll pay my rent,
Speaker 6: and I'll keep trying to sell my brilliant screenplay. He
Speaker 6: did what he had to do to make the art.
Speaker 6: I just got on him.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I, like I said, I.
Speaker 6: Haven't seen the film, not sure the quality of the
Speaker 6: work done there. But again, it's a story within a story.
Speaker 6: It's a story of someone who's constantly being given limited
Speaker 6: opportunity by the world and still is carrying this little
Speaker 6: secret idea of victory in his heart that maybe there's
Speaker 6: something more.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and what this means is with this context, it
Speaker 2: makes Rocky. We think of Rockies. This boxing movie. Now,
Speaker 2: I would argue that it's not a boxing movie.
Speaker 6: Well, yeah, maybe not. It did spawn the genre of
Speaker 6: what do we call it, sport drama?
Speaker 1: Sport drama.
Speaker 6: Yeah, it's not a boxing film. Is that wild?
Speaker 2: It's amazing, Like, there's so much non boxing going on
Speaker 2: in this but when we know the story that you
Speaker 2: so beautifully this line sly story. It's a much more
Speaker 2: personal film than I think people remember it or give
Speaker 2: it credit for being this really this.
Speaker 1: Is why because he.
Speaker 2: Yeah, absolutely, and that's why he knocks back, you know,
Speaker 2: fifteen point when I think you did the calcination before
Speaker 2: cli million dollars, when he has just over one hundred
Speaker 2: bucks in the bank to play this role they wanted.
Speaker 2: The budget they offered was two million dollars, which at
Speaker 2: the time was a pretty decent budget. But it had
Speaker 2: to be played by James Kahn or Burt Reynolds or
Speaker 2: Ryan O'Neill. And so I said, no, it has to
Speaker 2: be me, and big, big call, good, great call for him,
Speaker 2: a great call on the producers, and so they slashed
Speaker 2: a budget in half. They had one million dollars to
Speaker 2: do it after that, and they did it. Yeah, they
Speaker 2: did it, and he, you know, the commitment was that
Speaker 2: he would play the part.
Speaker 6: It's so interesting our raw. I mean, I don't know
Speaker 6: if that added to the rawness of the settings, but
Speaker 6: a lot of it's filmed in darkened rooms. A lot
Speaker 6: of the lighting is natural. There's quite a few scenes
Speaker 6: that are at night or early in the morning, so
Speaker 6: they've used a lot of natural light in the way
Speaker 6: that they filmed it too, because of probably the stock
Speaker 6: that they use in those days. It looks beautiful. I
Speaker 6: watched it in filmaker mode on my TV, so there's
Speaker 6: that beautiful look too. But it's a capsule. It's a
Speaker 6: time capsule, you know, the language of the time, the
Speaker 6: obsessions of people in the time, and that idea of
Speaker 6: trying to make a name for yourself yet again was
Speaker 6: sort of played out by every single character. You know.
Speaker 6: It wasn't I don't know if we're at that stage yet,
Speaker 6: but it wasn't just him. It was his trainer, it
Speaker 6: was his best mate, it was his girlfriend. And it
Speaker 6: was also in the context of the times, you know,
Speaker 6: this moment in time where there was all this American
Speaker 6: pride around these discussions about what it is to be
Speaker 6: in this great land of America, the land of opportunity,
Speaker 6: you know. But because it was a fresh perspective, it
Speaker 6: wasn't written by I don't think by committee. It was
Speaker 6: written by a singular lens of singular original focus. This
Speaker 6: is one of the reasons it's so fascinating.
Speaker 2: And it's great you mentioned the American Dream, which kind
Speaker 2: of Rocky doesn't really think he's he's invited to the
Speaker 2: American Dream. Does he like he's just living this life?
Speaker 1: He doesn't. He's got so much self doubt, you know.
Speaker 2: And and it's only when you had the lawyers and
Speaker 2: the promoters and the polo come to him and kind
Speaker 2: of dangle the American Dream in front of him, even
Speaker 2: though they didn't think it's really like. There's a great
Speaker 2: line in it during the fight with a polo where
Speaker 2: his trainer says, you know, once Rocky knocks him out
Speaker 2: and gives him a bit of hope, and all of
Speaker 2: a sudden, they've got to fight in their hands, And
Speaker 2: the trainer says to him, you know, you think this
Speaker 2: is a show.
Speaker 1: He thinks this is a fight. And I love that line.
Speaker 6: It's beautiful line. Yeah, it's always tempting to count ourselves
Speaker 6: out and ford to bitterness when things don't go right.
Speaker 6: I don't know about you, Pete, You've had a pretty
Speaker 6: successful career. You seem to work a bit, but there
Speaker 6: there are a lot of ups and down.
Speaker 1: I want.
Speaker 6: A lot of ups and downs in life, you see.
Speaker 6: And Rocky had this key moment in. It seems that
Speaker 6: the character had this key moment in his youth where
Speaker 6: he did have that touch of self belief and it
Speaker 6: wasn't matched by his coach. At the time. He felt
Speaker 6: that he wasn't seen, he wasn't given opportunity, and he
Speaker 6: sort of settled, you know, he started working for I
Speaker 6: Hope we don't spoil it for you guys, Spoil Heavy podcast,
Speaker 6: Spoil Heavy. Then he took a job as a medium heavy,
Speaker 6: collecting debt for someone who may or may have worked
Speaker 6: in the mob. You know, he said, he settled that
Speaker 6: was the best he could do. He was making the
Speaker 6: best of the life that he could. He was taking
Speaker 6: small risks in the way that was safe enough for
Speaker 6: him to exist within the society he was in. But
Speaker 6: then there's this beautiful scene where he's offered the chance
Speaker 6: to fight Apollo and he says no, and someone reminds him.
Speaker 6: The promoter reminds him, you know, this is your time
Speaker 6: to shine. He says, yeah, okay, And then is it
Speaker 6: Vinny who is the coach? Micky? Excuse me. Micky's a
Speaker 6: seventy six year old man who has canceled Rocky's locker recently.
Speaker 6: He's just looked at him and said, mate, you made
Speaker 6: your choices when you started working for the Heavy. I
Speaker 6: don't believe in your work anymore. If you're not going
Speaker 6: to pick yourself and you have the potential for greatness,
Speaker 6: you're out of the band. You know, you don't get
Speaker 6: a locker at the gym anymore. But Micky then revises
Speaker 6: his own point of view. When this opportunity comes up,
Speaker 6: he has the vulnerability to knock on on. He's knocking
Speaker 6: on rocky door and he says, you know what you need.
Speaker 6: You need a manager, and I can do it. I'm
Speaker 6: seventy six, I've got so much to give, and Rocky says,
Speaker 6: get out, mate. He's bitter. He says, get out.
Speaker 2: But let's have you want to listen to that scene please,
Speaker 2: I've organized this scene. We'll listen to it in two parts.
Speaker 2: So this is Mickey offering his management skills through Rocky,
Speaker 2: who eventually goes into a room and locks him out.
Speaker 4: I want to be your manager.
Speaker 7: You follow that to you, Fods said, I don't need
Speaker 7: no merch, but you can't lie what I'm going to
Speaker 7: give you.
Speaker 4: I mean, I got pain and I got experienced.
Speaker 1: I got pain, I got experienced too.
Speaker 7: Listen, kid, here you go, he make what I need
Speaker 7: your help about ten years ago?
Speaker 1: Right ten years ago, you never helped me. You didn't care.
Speaker 6: Well, if you wanted help, I say, if you wanted help,
Speaker 6: why didn't you ask?
Speaker 3: Why didn't you just ask me?
Speaker 4: King?
Speaker 3: Look, I asked, but you never heard nothing.
Speaker 1: Well, I uh, I'm seventy.
Speaker 4: Six years old.
Speaker 2: And so Meredith burgesses Mikey. And there's so much we
Speaker 2: could play so much more about that scene. It's a
Speaker 2: beautiful moment earlier when he says, Mickey says something like
Speaker 2: you've got art, and he says, I may have heart,
Speaker 2: but I don't have my locker.
Speaker 1: And I think the locker is You could argue that
Speaker 1: that is the thing.
Speaker 2: That actually is what we would you would call the
Speaker 2: inciting incident that because it's it's a strangely kind of
Speaker 2: formulated film in a way, it's kind of genius.
Speaker 1: But that the locker scene, it.
Speaker 2: Gets his it gets they take his locker and he
Speaker 2: can't understand it, and then he and then what happens
Speaker 2: after that, It says he spied. It's the first time
Speaker 2: he gets really angry. He goes in the Mickey and
Speaker 2: that they have a screaming match, and then he tells
Speaker 2: he's still on the Adrien and the pestor and he
Speaker 2: can't quite get her attention or and she's kind of
Speaker 2: busy and he's talking about the locker and then the
Speaker 2: street kid. He takes his street kid.
Speaker 1: Home, the young girl home, creeper.
Speaker 2: Creeper, and she calls him a and he calls him
Speaker 2: a creeper, and then he says, how do you know
Speaker 2: what you're talking about?
Speaker 1: Creeper?
Speaker 2: And then he kind of mumbles it back to himself
Speaker 2: he had, So he's starting to believe his confidence has
Speaker 2: just been being and he's self worth has has been
Speaker 2: completely eroded. And then it's a whole you go. Paulie
Speaker 2: invites him to Thanksgiving and he's still.
Speaker 1: Did you tell it? I'm coming? Did you tell her?
Speaker 1: Because he just.
Speaker 2: Can't believe that Adrian would actually be excited about him
Speaker 2: being there. And then when he kind of finally believes
Speaker 2: that this, you know, okay, I'm here for dinner, Paulie
Speaker 2: stuffed at the moment and throws the turkey out of
Speaker 2: the house.
Speaker 1: In a very weird move. Weird and violent, moved weird
Speaker 1: and very violent.
Speaker 6: Not a forgiveness for him has to be yes.
Speaker 1: And there's a lot to talk about, Paulie, there's no
Speaker 1: doubt about that.
Speaker 2: And then he kind of reluctantly in the end, kind
Speaker 2: of through the door, and he had you know, he's
Speaker 2: got these wonderful little lines. I never spoke to a
Speaker 2: door before. And then it's important though, I think that
Speaker 2: Adrian at this point opens.
Speaker 1: The door and she's ready to go out with him.
Speaker 6: Spot on. He had to ask first. So and that's
Speaker 6: what Mickey is saying, and that's what life keeps saying
Speaker 6: to him, and that's what life keeps saying to us.
Speaker 6: You can count yourself out anytime, but your nexus of control,
Speaker 6: you know, the circumstances of your life you cannot control,
Speaker 6: but you can keep showing up. You can talk to
Speaker 6: a bloody door, feel like a full risk something. When
Speaker 6: Rocky Is changes his mind and does yell out after Mickey, wait, wait, wait,
Speaker 6: you know, okay, I admit I need help, I need
Speaker 6: a manager. So he's sort of making the best choices
Speaker 6: for the potential of possibility. But like all great acts
Speaker 6: of courage, it is courageous not because we're not scared,
Speaker 6: because we don't know what's going to happen. He doesn't
Speaker 6: know if he's going to win. He doesn't know if
Speaker 6: it's whether his leg's hurt, his knees hurt. Adrian won't
Speaker 6: talk to him. But what we find inspiring and why
Speaker 6: we still love this film is that he keeps showing up.
Speaker 6: He keeps showing up, and he keeps making that little
Speaker 6: tiny choice where he can.
Speaker 1: Let's have him listen to the at the second part
Speaker 1: of that scene, I did take us away from it.
Speaker 1: You be beautifully brought us back to it. Claire.
Speaker 2: This is Rocky yelling as Mickey has already left the apartment,
Speaker 2: so he's yelling down the stairs now. And this is
Speaker 2: all improvised by svisister line.
Speaker 1: Enough forget.
Speaker 3: Two years are going to my house, my house, my house, stink.
Speaker 3: Try it sticks. I have from don't fall around me
Speaker 3: your oh my bright mack. At least you have pride.
Speaker 3: I know brid lot legs are going. Everything that's going,
Speaker 3: no one's getting them. Knock. This guy comes up off
Speaker 3: with me a fight. Do you want to fight the fight? Yeah,
Speaker 3: I'll fight the big fight. I wouldn't want to fight
Speaker 3: that big fight that was gonna have. I get that
Speaker 3: I already get that. You want to be excited. See
Speaker 3: you are helping me. How do you make it like
Speaker 3: late day working? Nothing working? They got God take the check,
Speaker 3: ol batas.
Speaker 7: You come around here, you want to move in here
Speaker 7: and they come a here my.
Speaker 3: House, real life, come in and no steps.
Speaker 1: To play steps I mean Swiss sillone is.
Speaker 2: So it's such a beautiful, heartfelt, naturalistic moment, like that's
Speaker 2: an outburst, and he has a couple of outbursts, but
Speaker 2: it's it's juxtaposed.
Speaker 1: With these moments of tenderness throughout the whole film.
Speaker 6: The way he was speaking there. So we listened to
Speaker 6: it last night. I was watching it. Obviously, I had
Speaker 6: to put on the.
Speaker 1: Subtitles.
Speaker 6: Subtitles actually, and again you know we can sort of
Speaker 6: laugh about it. We always did laugh about it. I
Speaker 6: previ thought that that was a choice that Sylvestis alone
Speaker 6: was making. You know, I met I became aware of
Speaker 6: him when I was a kid, and he was already
Speaker 6: by then. You know, his movies ran by Rocky, they
Speaker 6: were huge. He was a cliche. I discern him with
Speaker 6: some sort of lucky lucky dude. But he because of
Speaker 6: that injury in his youth, parts of his tongue and
Speaker 6: lip is paralyzed. He has found a way to communicate
Speaker 6: that is feel you know, it was Philly. He's a
Speaker 6: Philly boy using language from the time that chinks. But
Speaker 6: when you hear him really talk, even if I didn't
Speaker 6: have the subtitles on, I know what he's saying, you know,
Speaker 6: I know the I know the spirit of what he's saying.
Speaker 6: And that emotional quality huge rare in an actor, rare
Speaker 6: to sustain over a lifetime. But again, the fact that
Speaker 6: it's all based in the originality of who he is
Speaker 6: and work within the limitations that life gave him. I
Speaker 6: just find it bloody fascinating.
Speaker 2: And then he takes a moment which we don't even
Speaker 2: see on camera, and he just he you know, but
Speaker 2: you can imagine it playing out where he's got Okay,
Speaker 2: I do need a manager, and Micky's good.
Speaker 1: He has come to me.
Speaker 6: At least I won't forward to bitterness.
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah. He chooses, he chooses to fight, and
Speaker 1: he chooses literally Jesus to fight, and.
Speaker 2: He goes to Mickey and it's it's shot long lens
Speaker 2: and it's beautiful.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 6: At the start of the film, he goes into the
Speaker 6: pet shop where Adrian works. Adrian doesn't talk very much.
Speaker 6: Adrian is his love interest. But there's this one little
Speaker 6: image that stuck with me. In there, he's buying a
Speaker 6: turtle terrapin, you know, a domestic turtle. He's just buying
Speaker 6: whatever he can to have a chance to chat with
Speaker 6: with Adrian. Really, but in there, there's this huge dog
Speaker 6: in a very small cage within the pet shop, and
Speaker 6: I keep thinking about this image that you know, that
Speaker 6: was him. He's huge dog in a small cage, and
Speaker 6: this is him realizing he wants more freedom, he wants
Speaker 6: more choice. He you know, the cage is comfortable, but
Speaker 6: he needs a way out. Throughout the watching of this film,
Speaker 6: my husband kept saying the words Adrian, and I'm like,
Speaker 6: what are you doing? Why do you say that? What
Speaker 6: do you say? Are you giving me a clue? What
Speaker 6: are you saying? And I couldn't work out why he
Speaker 6: kept saying that, and I wanted him to shush because
Speaker 6: I wanted to make up my own idea about the
Speaker 6: film and so on. But anyway, we'll get to that later.
Speaker 6: But there are a couple of times where he's admitting
Speaker 6: he needs Adrian and he needs love and he needs
Speaker 6: tenderness that she's been denied by her life as well.
Speaker 6: That's beautifully paid.
Speaker 1: Well, it's about two people actually seeing each other, you know, like.
Speaker 2: Adrian feels invisible and worthless, and we know that we
Speaker 2: can understand me through Paul's relationship. And you know how
Speaker 2: Volatiley he is a brother, guys, you know that. But yeah,
Speaker 2: who was In the original script, it was supposed to
Speaker 2: be Adrian was Jewish, and that was going to be
Speaker 2: a Jewish mother, like an overbearing Jewish mother, and then
Speaker 2: they for whatever reason, they changed it to her brother
Speaker 2: and an overpowering I see kind brother who Funnily enough,
Speaker 2: as the sequels go on with that and they said,
Speaker 2: too much becomes more of almost a comical must soften
Speaker 2: a character.
Speaker 1: But I think it's about two people being seen.
Speaker 2: Like Rocky feels worthless, feels like a bum them in
Speaker 2: the mint of times, you have a bum.
Speaker 6: Stink creeper, you know all those like screw you, I'm
Speaker 6: a bomb, Like, yeah, just the language of the time
Speaker 6: so beautiful. We've got to bring those things back.
Speaker 2: And the only thing he's got to talk about really
Speaker 2: is boxing. And there's a beautiful scene they go on
Speaker 2: this date. It was supposed to be shot at a restaurant,
Speaker 2: but they couldn't afford extras. So they can have the
Speaker 2: idea of doing it. How about we do it at
Speaker 2: someplace where it's it's t I closed, I shrink. Yeah,
Speaker 2: let's have a listened to that.
Speaker 6: You know, I got started fighting?
Speaker 3: Huh? No, am I talking too loud?
Speaker 1: Three minutes? My father, he's a oh man, it was
Speaker 1: never too smart. He says to me. You weren't born
Speaker 1: much of a brain, you.
Speaker 6: Know, so, uh, you better start using your body right,
Speaker 6: so I've become.
Speaker 1: A fighter, you know what I mean? While you why you.
Speaker 3: Left my mother?
Speaker 6: She said the opposite thing.
Speaker 2: What she said?
Speaker 1: What you said the opposite?
Speaker 6: So you weren't born much of your body, so you
Speaker 6: better develop your brain, so she said.
Speaker 1: You time, I asked you a question? Absolutely, why do
Speaker 1: you want to fight? Because I can't sting a dance?
Speaker 4: You?
Speaker 3: Hey, that was durrific.
Speaker 1: I'm pretty good at this. He's very sweet.
Speaker 6: It's super sweet. I can't see her dance. I love
Speaker 6: that all those beautiful classics have playfulness that he has.
Speaker 6: What we hear is like his battle with his own
Speaker 6: inner critic and his own idea of an inner champion. Yeah,
Speaker 6: and hers too, and how when they see each other
Speaker 6: things shift for them. They're able to see each other
Speaker 6: through each other's eyes, but it took uts on both
Speaker 6: of their behalf. I can't imagine how that would have
Speaker 6: how that the play would have been without that love
Speaker 6: interest element.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, well they probably would have had to lean
Speaker 2: into more boxing, I would imagine and make it this
Speaker 2: more of a boxing movie than it actually actually is.
Speaker 2: When I was watching it last night, and I always
Speaker 2: think about the person watching the film, I thought, I
Speaker 2: really hope you were really enjoy it, but I didn't think.
Speaker 6: I was quite surprised. I really did love it.
Speaker 2: Yeah, And the more I watched it and the more
Speaker 2: I thought about, I thought, I think you're going to
Speaker 2: relate to rock.
Speaker 6: You know.
Speaker 2: Let you you've written your beautiful memoir, your Own kind
Speaker 2: of Girl, which I mentioned at the start, like.
Speaker 1: I followed your career, you know when you know, since Divorce.
Speaker 2: By twenty three came out a long time ago, a
Speaker 2: long time ago, and I continue to follow and I
Speaker 2: went for new music.
Speaker 1: Clearly we'll get to that.
Speaker 2: And you just assume people come out fully formed and
Speaker 2: you know, ready for the bright lights and that with
Speaker 2: all the abilities and experience in the world, but it takes,
Speaker 2: and you did it so beautiful in your book to
Speaker 2: talk about the anxiety and how the courage it takes
Speaker 2: to kind of make, you know, the get to a
Speaker 2: stage and to stand on stage. So when I I
Speaker 2: was thinking about that as I was watching Rocky last night,
Speaker 2: I thought, I think you might connect with this character.
Speaker 6: Yeah, I didn't. I think in a way, the reason
Speaker 6: we all do is because we all have these limitations,
Speaker 6: you know, these things that happened to us and our
Speaker 6: role in life. You know, we're lucky, We're eighty six
Speaker 6: billion yurons who somehow got to live life. But we
Speaker 6: are wired for survival, and survival is you know, it's
Speaker 6: right there, and the most basic rung of Maslow's the
Speaker 6: hierarchy of needs, and life keeps throwing all this stuff
Speaker 6: at us, and to choose survival is wise. It's what
Speaker 6: we all do. But we long for more as well.
Speaker 6: So life and our brains are constantly telling us to
Speaker 6: play more. And yet there's this other part of us
Speaker 6: that's telling us to make courageous choices. We all are
Speaker 6: fighting with those two forces and trying to find our
Speaker 6: best way in for me writing a book talking about
Speaker 6: the most difficult things that have happened in my life
Speaker 6: and trying to bring the light out from them and
Speaker 6: work out why, you know, why I had the brain
Speaker 6: that I had and why I felt the ways that
Speaker 6: I did to work out what to do with those things.
Speaker 6: That's why I have the privilege of being a creative person. Now.
Speaker 6: If I could have done things differently, I might have.
Speaker 6: If Rocky could have had a different kind of job,
Speaker 6: he might have too. But we all see a little
Speaker 6: bit of that curry. We all have to call in
Speaker 6: that courage right throughout our lives. That's a creative process.
Speaker 6: As why I always say everyone's creative because we're all
Speaker 6: working within limitations and we're finding the best way to
Speaker 6: mush them together and make stuff that's interesting and meaningful
Speaker 6: and playfully comic and allows us to connect. So loved
Speaker 6: I loved that. I love that that story became has
Speaker 6: become a part of our popular culture now. Like I said,
Speaker 6: I was always laughing about the music, and sometimes we'd
Speaker 6: play Rocky. We play Rocky in the Rocky theme songs,
Speaker 6: and I have the target from Rocky too in the
Speaker 6: back room before a show to pep us up, you know.
Speaker 6: But now I said, of no, right, So it's based
Speaker 6: in something that was significant, you know. It was a
Speaker 6: significant story told in a simple context, with limitations and
Speaker 6: done masterfully. I would say, if you're a vegan, you
Speaker 6: might want to be a little bit aware of you
Speaker 6: might feel sensitive while watching this movie. I just want
Speaker 6: to give that heads up. Why am I saying that?
Speaker 6: Why am I saying that?
Speaker 1: Pete tell me, well, there's a lot of meat.
Speaker 6: There's a lot of meat. That's right now, there's the
Speaker 6: throwing of the turkey. What a waste. You know, we've
Speaker 6: spoken about that. But again, working with what you've got
Speaker 6: in the spirit of frugality, which is something that we
Speaker 6: were all frigging force through in the last Maybe that's
Speaker 6: part of it too. We've gone through here in this
Speaker 6: state of victory six very limiting, weird lockdowns in the
Speaker 6: past two years, and we've learnt, you know, we laugh
Speaker 6: about why sour dough became so important to us. Again,
Speaker 6: it was within our nexcess of control. We could do
Speaker 6: something we could explore with sour dough. Rocky doesn't have
Speaker 6: access to the kind of gym that Sylvester sallone, Now
Speaker 6: does you know? Or Chris Hemsworth might, So what's he doing, Pete?
Speaker 6: What does he do?
Speaker 1: Well?
Speaker 2: He gets access to a butcher's and just pounds pounds
Speaker 2: downs very dead cows.
Speaker 6: Yeah that's right. He hall his mate poorly horn meat
Speaker 6: and he practices cracking ribs on these animals who've already passed,
Speaker 6: so that could be. It was confronting for Rocky at
Speaker 6: first himself, what with all this mew who killed these animals?
Speaker 6: And then he goes, okay, right, so they're already one.
Speaker 6: How can I use this?
Speaker 2: It's all running and it's it's I mean, and I
Speaker 2: loved last night knowing where it goes in the future movies.
Speaker 1: Like the first montage was him like having the you know,
Speaker 1: the yolk eggs.
Speaker 6: And and that's where that came from.
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, and then and then like going out and
Speaker 2: his first run and he's almost like he looks sore
Speaker 2: already when he's crawling down the stairs.
Speaker 1: And the music they played during that is so good.
Speaker 2: That it's more like a slower version because it's the
Speaker 2: first one. It's like it's like really like a tired
Speaker 2: version of what we're going to hear later on.
Speaker 6: There are all refrains of the same kind of motifs
Speaker 6: and idioms that done with different lyrics. Sometimes like that
Speaker 6: that same song was played at the beginning with as
Speaker 6: a song on the radio with a romantic theme. Again,
Speaker 6: this might have been within the limitations of their budget.
Speaker 6: They just would just reuse the same film.
Speaker 2: And they were just running around shooting gorilla style, like
Speaker 2: when the guy throws an orange at Rocky that he
Speaker 2: had no idea what was going He saw it as
Speaker 2: a camera and that was just like that wasn't a plan.
Speaker 2: There's no thing in the script that says man throws
Speaker 2: orange at Rocky Bilboa and Rocky catches it. They were
Speaker 2: just driving around, going let's shoot something here, let's shoot
Speaker 2: something here. Is I do think only the third movie
Speaker 2: in the world that you steady cam really yeah, which
Speaker 2: is for those at home, it's when you see often
Speaker 2: using when there's a lot of movement. Aaron Sorkin famously
Speaker 2: uses a lot of steady cam with those walking shots.
Speaker 2: It's a lovely they use it when he goes up
Speaker 2: the stairs at the I think it's a state library.
Speaker 2: And for the running shots they use a lot of
Speaker 2: steady Cam I reckon.
Speaker 6: It's probably one of the first movies I've ever mentioned
Speaker 6: the word prostrate as well prostate. Do you remember that
Speaker 6: when I said prostrate And I'm going to say it's
Speaker 6: not correct because it's prostate. So you remember when Buddy's
Speaker 6: in bad mood. Buddy was the driver of the big
Speaker 6: shot you know who, he was, the heavy who was
Speaker 6: working for And again we're realizing, like, this is a
Speaker 6: tough environment, this is a tough world. Not everyone's going
Speaker 6: to like you. Buddies decided that he likes he does
Speaker 6: not like Rocky r. He hates Rocky. He gives him
Speaker 6: a hard time all the time. There are all these
Speaker 6: challenges Rockies responding to and it's like Buddy's in a
Speaker 6: bad mood. It's this prostrate, it's prostrate, prostrate, prostrate. Buddies
Speaker 6: in bad moods is prostate. I was like, wow, you
Speaker 6: know again, the rawness. Someone would have probably written that,
Speaker 6: maybe written that out of the script if it had
Speaker 6: been in a writer's room for years and years, which
Speaker 6: I don't think it was. But there's a rawness too.
Speaker 6: There's you know, fluff on the camera, there's filth on
Speaker 6: the floor, the apartment, nothing's perfect in this world. And
Speaker 6: that's why I think again, we respond to it because
Speaker 6: it mirrors the real world, which is not everyone's going
Speaker 6: to like us, and we've got to choose his opinion
Speaker 6: we're going to believe in.
Speaker 1: And also, what's good about that driver or the driver
Speaker 1: of the loan shark. Not even the loan shark, he's
Speaker 1: quite nice to it.
Speaker 6: It's quite nice. He keeps giving him five fifty bucks.
Speaker 1: Five bucks.
Speaker 2: Yeah, he's got support him, but it's it's the driver
Speaker 2: that's giving Rocky shit like that. That's how rock bottom
Speaker 2: they want to and that's the reason they want to
Speaker 2: make him rock bottom. Even when the loan Shark is saying, well,
Speaker 2: you've got to break his thumb next time, break his thumb,
Speaker 2: which is a lovely Again, he's because Rocky is not trying.
Speaker 2: We want our characters to be good, have a sense
Speaker 2: of decency and goodness, and then we want to see
Speaker 2: him try. And Rocky takes a while before he believes
Speaker 2: enough of himself to try, so we need to see
Speaker 2: him be good. And he doesn't break the thumb. So
Speaker 2: there's all these little things, and he's just generally kind
Speaker 2: to everyone. But even when the loan Shark is and
Speaker 2: you need to break his thumb. He's got an asthma pump.
Speaker 1: But it's just a lovely this guy. The guy's one
Speaker 1: day going to be the heavyweight the world.
Speaker 2: We don't know that yet, but like the guy he's
Speaker 2: telling him off with the masthma part, it's just a
Speaker 2: lovely little touch.
Speaker 6: You know what else I really love is probably worth
Speaker 6: a much bigger conversation. But again, the fact that Apollo
Speaker 6: is a man of color, that the champion as portrayed,
Speaker 6: you know, the dominant champion in the world is a
Speaker 6: person of color with power and choice. It's good to
Speaker 6: have an historical movie in which there are people of
Speaker 6: different ethnicities, people of different skin colors, different genders, playing
Speaker 6: power roles in different ways as well. Now how that
Speaker 6: plays itself out over the course of Rocky or you know,
Speaker 6: the final victory or so on, is also worthy of conversation.
Speaker 6: But I enjoyed that because it showed again a reflection
Speaker 6: of real life as opposed to so many of the
Speaker 6: stories that we saw a victory, which ever included a
Speaker 6: story of the victory of people who were different, you know,
Speaker 6: people with a like Rocky himself being different but also
Speaker 6: people who came from different backgrounds. People who it came
Speaker 6: from had different skin colors, people who had different ways
Speaker 6: of thinking and so on. So that is another reason
Speaker 6: why this is interesting. And we didn't often see intelligence
Speaker 6: matched with boxing as well. I didn't even know, for example,
Speaker 6: but I learned from this film that there's a word pulism.
Speaker 6: Do you know what pugilism is? So it means the
Speaker 6: professional hobby of boxing. It's a great word. Never heard
Speaker 6: of it. I thought it meant something completely different. Learned
Speaker 6: a lot from this film.
Speaker 1: People learned a lot. And there's not a polo played
Speaker 1: beautify by Carl Weathers.
Speaker 6: Incredibly complex and beautiful role.
Speaker 2: Yeah, and it's beautifully written and realized because he is
Speaker 2: a mirror image of Rocky. Now that goes beyond color.
Speaker 2: It's that he is articulate and Rocky is a mumbler,
Speaker 2: you know. It's that he's cocky, and Rocky is wrapped
Speaker 2: through self doubt. He's technically proficient in the ring, where
Speaker 2: Rocky is more of a brawler. He's a businessman. Rocky
Speaker 2: does not have a cent to his name.
Speaker 6: Get a leather briefcase. Kids don't get into sport says Apolo,
Speaker 6: don't get into it, stinks, don't be a stinker, got
Speaker 6: a leather brewcase.
Speaker 1: And he's a businessman. I like it. Also, there wasn't
Speaker 1: strings possibility.
Speaker 2: It's a it's a Polo's idea to you know, fight
Speaker 2: Rocky or to find this this challenger is this one
Speaker 2: shot the American dream.
Speaker 7: Without a rand contender. What this fighter is going to
Speaker 7: need is a novelty. This is the land of opportunity rate.
Speaker 7: So Apollo Creed on January first, gives a local underdog
Speaker 7: fighter an opportunity, a snow white underdog, and I'm going
Speaker 7: to put his face on his poster with me, and
Speaker 7: I'll tell you why, because I'm sentimental, and a lot
Speaker 7: of other people in this country are justice sentimental, and
Speaker 7: there's nothing they'd like better than the Apollo Creed give
Speaker 7: a local Philadelphia boy a shot at the greatest title
Speaker 7: in the world on this country's biggest birthday. Now, that's
Speaker 7: the way I see it, and that's the way it's
Speaker 7: gonna be.
Speaker 4: Apollo. I like it.
Speaker 3: It's very American, no Jergins, It's very smart.
Speaker 6: Some more coffee, mister Creed, what.
Speaker 7: Do you think about Billy snow How about the big
Speaker 7: Chucksmith's too old and dull.
Speaker 6: And then when we get Paolo, who gives him this
Speaker 6: chance at the American Dream, that's really interesting.
Speaker 1: Too, and I love saying him is like the businessman.
Speaker 2: And then he's he comes out of George Washington and
Speaker 2: it's like and then and Rocky comes out and he's
Speaker 2: got shamrock meets that. You know, Paulie's going to force this.
Speaker 2: You know that Pauli's making more money out of it
Speaker 2: than Rocky.
Speaker 6: You can make money out of my name, you do it.
Speaker 6: You go ahead, Polly, Yeah, you know, generosity.
Speaker 2: And they realize apparently that that's that little money. They
Speaker 2: realized that they had the wrong shorts to match the poster,
Speaker 2: and then so so they wrote something just the handle
Speaker 2: of that little moment where he says, you got the
Speaker 2: wrong shorts and my shorts.
Speaker 6: So this is Rocky going into the arena the night
Speaker 6: before to have a look, you know I was seeing.
Speaker 6: I texted, actually made of money, who works at the ABC?
Speaker 6: If you walk into the ABC officers in any city,
Speaker 6: there are these huge posters of the presenters. And I
Speaker 6: wrote to my mate Zen last night, I said, when
Speaker 6: you walk into the ABC's how you feel you walk,
Speaker 6: you know you walking. He's a huge post of yourself.
Speaker 6: But Rocky, yet again, is choosing truth. He walks into
Speaker 6: the arena and I didn't know about that fact. He
Speaker 6: walks into the arena, empty arena the night before. He
Speaker 6: looks up at the poster and instead of going, Wow,
Speaker 6: there's me on a poster, he goes, the shots are wrong.
Speaker 6: You know, he's saying he's not falling for the story
Speaker 6: of it. He knows the risk. He wants things to
Speaker 6: be right.
Speaker 2: And the promoter, the promoter basically says it doesn't matter matter,
Speaker 2: which again reminds the audience and reminds Rocky that he's
Speaker 2: no chance.
Speaker 7: Yeah.
Speaker 1: And then also the robe was too big for him.
Speaker 1: It was all big and gold, yeah, which which was
Speaker 1: apparently a mistake. And then so they wrote that the.
Speaker 2: Little conversations he has with agent just before he goes
Speaker 2: out is so lovely, like the fact that he almost
Speaker 2: seems a bit maybe you'd be worried that he's unfocused.
Speaker 2: You know, if you were his coach or manager, he'd
Speaker 2: be going to come on focus on the ring. Agent
Speaker 2: probably shouldn't be here, get it, you know, like just
Speaker 2: focus but he is always charming throughout this.
Speaker 6: He keeps saying to it, doesn't he He keeps saying,
Speaker 6: don't leave town, don't leave town. I'm sorry about my
Speaker 6: terrible accent. I keep coming in, going into it unconsciously.
Speaker 6: I don't I don't mean to be doing that. But
Speaker 6: he's saying to her, you know, is it too baggy?
Speaker 6: And he keeps saying to it, you're looking great today.
Speaker 6: He's doing the opposite of what Apollo's doing, which is,
Speaker 6: you know, focusing, breathing deep and so on. The stakes
Speaker 6: are so high that he actually can't engage that He's
Speaker 6: been playful, and he's keeping that playfulness and that openness
Speaker 6: to possibility, and I think it's delightful. He's not willing
Speaker 6: to acknowledge how much is writing on it consciously, but
Speaker 6: he knows within himself.
Speaker 2: There is that beautiful moment, though, when Apollo brings him
Speaker 2: into the press conference and he's watching with Adrian and
Speaker 2: Apollo is going to make a few jobs and you
Speaker 2: have nothing too over the top, but you know enough
Speaker 2: that he's making fun a little bit of making light
Speaker 2: of Rocky and Rocky you know, he says, it doesn't matter,
Speaker 2: it doesn't matter. And then when he leaves, he actually says,
Speaker 2: you know what Apollo said, it did bother me. And
Speaker 2: that's that's almost a first little thing of oh, hang on,
Speaker 2: there's maybe more fighting than we think to.
Speaker 6: Thine self be true. I love the energy that he
Speaker 6: gets and that we see him get, and it was
Speaker 6: there right from the beginning in that very first fight. God,
Speaker 6: you know that very first fight. I can't remember. The
Speaker 6: contender was a Spider or something. Spider, that's right. So
Speaker 6: it opens, you know, the movie opens with this picture
Speaker 6: of Jesus and from there were to the ring, you know,
Speaker 6: the ultimate fight, and then he beats Spider, smokes a ciggy,
Speaker 6: Spider has a beer there in the back room. The
Speaker 6: reason he beat Spiders because Spider challenged him at a
Speaker 6: certain point, or you know, there was some energy that
Speaker 6: he gets every time someone doesn't believe in him. I
Speaker 6: love the way he uses that, and that's used right
Speaker 6: throughout until this point at the end, which we were
Speaker 6: just talking about.
Speaker 1: Let's hut about the end.
Speaker 2: Did you did you expect You've probably been groomed now
Speaker 2: to expect the protagonists to win at the end.
Speaker 6: Yeah, Look, a lot of people had won already throughout
Speaker 6: the film. So you know you've got Adrian there with
Speaker 6: a content of her time being told by her brother
Speaker 6: that she's broken because you know she's not a virgin
Speaker 6: and she's one. She's chosen victory and moved out in
Speaker 6: the meantime.
Speaker 1: It is a great scene.
Speaker 2: Talia Shai a great performance and just takes it. I
Speaker 2: do love that stallone well as a writer, and Rockie
Speaker 2: is the character allows her to have that victory like,
Speaker 2: does not try to She's he recognizes that she's in
Speaker 2: control of this now and this is her fight. I'm here,
Speaker 2: but you take it up to him. Yeah, I think
Speaker 2: that's really good until he goes too far when she's
Speaker 2: left the room and he goes too far, and he
Speaker 2: just goes over and says, enough.
Speaker 6: Enough now.
Speaker 4: It's cool. That's so poorly.
Speaker 3: I don't want you missing hull, and I don't raise
Speaker 3: you to go with this scumbu.
Speaker 6: Yeah, come on, hitlp me.
Speaker 3: Come on, I'll break both arms so they don't work
Speaker 3: for you.
Speaker 6: No, am I good enough to meet with Kazo through That's.
Speaker 3: Like to a Kaso. Now you're a big shot fighter
Speaker 3: on the way up. You don't even draw a clump
Speaker 3: toy of friend, Paulie, when I gonna get your meet
Speaker 3: every morning, you forgot that night. I even give you
Speaker 3: white sister, Dude, I'm a pink. Pink gets you the
Speaker 3: best lose out. I don't get married because of you.
Speaker 3: You can't look by yourself.
Speaker 6: I put your to get on.
Speaker 4: You can't you all me?
Speaker 3: You owe me. You're supposed to be good to me?
Speaker 3: Who You're fine? Hell yeah, I'm just good. I feel idea.
Speaker 3: I didn't care you Pollie, I don't know you know that,
Speaker 3: and you made me feel like a loader. You're busted.
Speaker 6: Just over. There's quite a few opportunities for victory and
Speaker 6: quite a few victories throughout it. And there's also Poorly.
Speaker 6: You know, we don't get a clean victory for him
Speaker 6: because he's a broken character, but he keeps getting included
Speaker 6: even though he's broken, and he eventually, you know, makes
Speaker 6: him cash gets a different job. So there are all
Speaker 6: those victories along the way. Did I expect Rocky to win, Yes,
Speaker 6: except for the fact that I knew that there were
Speaker 6: all these other movies that came afterwards, and I wondered,
Speaker 6: how can you end it? I was press paused at
Speaker 6: about five minutes before the end, and I went, I wonder,
Speaker 6: what's going to happen here? Normally we're indoctrinated to have
Speaker 6: more of a round up at the end or so,
Speaker 6: and so I liked I actually really enjoyed how one.
Speaker 6: And I think it was right too, that, you know
Speaker 6: Apollo in that context, Rocky got his nose broken for
Speaker 6: the first time, Apollo got sort of the life in it.
Speaker 6: He got terrified of losing for the first time. Neither
Speaker 6: of them wanted to rematch. I'm left curious what happens now.
Speaker 2: Well, what happens now is you need to go and
Speaker 2: watch every other version. Do you take on the challenge
Speaker 2: and the invitation to watch Rocky too, and then one
Speaker 2: day come back.
Speaker 1: To us I do.
Speaker 6: I'm a bit scared, though, Pete, because I've really you know,
Speaker 6: it's hell't We've gone pretty deep, like we didn't have
Speaker 6: many laughs during this year, and I and I realized that,
Speaker 6: you know, but I think with the amount of coffee
Speaker 6: I've drunk this morning, the lack of sleep that we
Speaker 6: both had, and the effect that this movie had on us,
Speaker 6: it's been quite somber. I've enjoyed it. If I go
Speaker 6: and watch the next Rockies are the highs and lows.
Speaker 1: Yes, and I think they get Listen, Rocky is the
Speaker 1: best of the lot of them.
Speaker 6: Okay, number one?
Speaker 1: Yeah, right, so and then and then two. They're very
Speaker 1: good and they get they get.
Speaker 2: There's there's some you know, decreasing value as it goes along,
Speaker 2: but it's certainly the Apollo and the Rocky story continues
Speaker 2: into In fact, it kind of takes place pretty almost
Speaker 2: there's not much space between this movie and what happens.
Speaker 2: It almost flows straight on right for memory. Watched for
Speaker 2: a while, but I think it's I think it's certainly
Speaker 2: watching you watch two.
Speaker 6: All right, all right, I'll tell you what. My life
Speaker 6: is definitely richer. For one. You know, I've got I've
Speaker 6: got new sayings in my heart, like you know, like
Speaker 6: colon people a coconut or a yo yo. I mean
Speaker 6: they've fallen from public culture. It's also, of course, you know,
Speaker 6: mix saying things like you're going to crap thunder. You know,
Speaker 6: I've got all these wonderful sayings in my head. I'm
Speaker 6: newly inspired as a person. And it did make sense
Speaker 6: at the end, of course, when Rocky is yelling Adrian
Speaker 6: and I looked at MARNI when is that what you
Speaker 6: were talking about? He goes, right, good on you for
Speaker 6: spoiling it for me.
Speaker 1: Thank you telling me the last scene of the film.
Speaker 6: Thank you so much.
Speaker 2: I that even that moment Talia Shi Adrian, like when
Speaker 2: Rocky says to her, you Adrian at the press cont
Speaker 2: she's a little bit embarrassed.
Speaker 1: By what did you think of that? She goes, why
Speaker 1: did you do that?
Speaker 2: I'm not sure about that? And then she finds the carriage.
Speaker 2: She ever comes to a shyness to run into a
Speaker 2: boxing ring is kind of incredible.
Speaker 6: Rocky's let's recreate it. I'll be I'll be Rocky and
Speaker 6: Uba Adrian Rocky a Rocky amazing, amazing. Well I got shivers.
Speaker 2: So really, if there's a Rocky nine or Apollo three,
Speaker 2: because that's what happens down the track is that the
Speaker 2: recent reboots have been about a polo, which is a
Speaker 2: polo's son.
Speaker 6: What's the best?
Speaker 1: Surprisingly good?
Speaker 6: Yeah, good, okay, yeah, maybe I'll go. I mean, do
Speaker 6: I go?
Speaker 1: I think it one by one the next step as
Speaker 1: we go along.
Speaker 6: What I've learned from this is just a reminder of
Speaker 6: all the things seemed to matter, originality and courage when
Speaker 6: combined can create great work. We must have the courage
Speaker 6: to keep counting ourselves in when nobody else sees us.
Speaker 6: That requires a commitment on our own behalf to do
Speaker 6: the difficult work of not knowing how the outcome is
Speaker 6: going to be. But we've got to keep showing up.
Speaker 6: Love's worth fighting for. The meat that you're eating may
Speaker 6: have been punched by someone. It was an original training
Speaker 6: method that he votes, which is now normal. But I
Speaker 6: think I found myself quite inspired by the whole thing,
Speaker 6: and I'm really really glad that you made me watch it.
Speaker 4: Mate.
Speaker 1: Well that is a beautiful sentiment in summation, and thank you.
Speaker 2: Clear vote please before we quickly go any news anytime soon?
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, yeah, I got.
Speaker 6: So much new stuff.
Speaker 1: Yeah, what can you tell? What can you tell us?
Speaker 4: Now?
Speaker 1: It should be out literally very slightly in a week
Speaker 1: or so.
Speaker 6: Well, yeah, you're not going to get the music by then.
Speaker 1: Beat, I'll tell you that much better throw to a track.
Speaker 6: What I do want to tell you is that I
Speaker 6: am out there doing the jog in the morning, punching
Speaker 6: the meat and climbing up and down those stairs, and
Speaker 6: I'm wearing loose tracksuits and I'm yelling Adrian all the time. Yeah,
Speaker 6: I got some new stuff, and I tell you what,
Speaker 6: you'll be the first to know, I promise. But thank
Speaker 6: you for the encouragement and saying that you actually care
Speaker 6: and want to hear new stuff. That means a lot
Speaker 6: to me.
Speaker 2: I completely and I said in the intro that all
Speaker 2: your albums are incredible, but modern day Adiction in particular
Speaker 2: is in my top five and I go back to
Speaker 2: it so often as I do. What was left and
Speaker 2: the window I chose happiness. But thanks, we just need
Speaker 2: some new clearvotus music.
Speaker 6: I'm going to bring it to you. I promise, I promise.
Speaker 6: I just need a Is there a Mickey out there
Speaker 6: who would like to.
Speaker 1: There was a seventy eight year old.
Speaker 6: Give me seventy six.
Speaker 1: Sorry Mickey, love a bit of wisdom.
Speaker 6: Good love you lots, hie everyone. Thanks for having me.
Speaker 2: Well, that was a fun way to finish this season.
Speaker 2: Oh you ain't seen nothing yet. I'm so glad Claire
Speaker 2: loved Rocky and not only just loved it, but it
Speaker 2: had so much to offer and to reflect on, so articulate,
Speaker 2: so thoughtful. I really really loved that chat about the
Speaker 2: film that I hadn't seen for a little while. I've
Speaker 2: seen it in my adult life, but not for a
Speaker 2: few years. So it was great watching it last night
Speaker 2: knowing that I was going to be chatting to Claire
Speaker 2: about it. So thank you so much Claire again for
Speaker 2: doing that. Podcast comes with homework, it also comes with
Speaker 2: a production and the man behind that is Derek Meyer
Speaker 2: some castaway Studios, Gido.
Speaker 1: Derek, good mate.
Speaker 2: It's our final ride before we rude out to the sunset,
Speaker 2: before we take a little break, before we come back
Speaker 2: with season five.
Speaker 1: Can you believe it?
Speaker 5: It's hard to believe four seasons is now. That's epic.
Speaker 1: That's amazing.
Speaker 2: I mean, the exciting thing about season five is it's
Speaker 2: going to have our one hundred episode in it, So
Speaker 2: we'll see if we can come up with something special,
Speaker 2: maybe a live event.
Speaker 5: Can we have a banner?
Speaker 2: Definitely a banner. We're gonna run to a banner. Yeah, yeah,
Speaker 2: we're both going to run it. I'm not sure he's
Speaker 2: gonna hold it. That's the only thing. Somebody two guests
Speaker 2: to hold the banner. Hey, let's talk about Rocky before
Speaker 2: we head off. You'd be a Rocky fan, wouldn't you.
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 5: Definitely, Yeah, most Definitely.
Speaker 1: It wasn't the most convincing, but I feel there's a
Speaker 1: caveat coming a bit of.
Speaker 5: A Rocky two.
Speaker 1: Okay, Rocky two, three and four.
Speaker 2: Wow, that's interesting because it's out a clear I was
Speaker 2: going to watch Rocky two, so we'll take it one
Speaker 2: by one. I won't commit you to watching you know,
Speaker 2: all of them, but I said, I said, listen, Rocky
Speaker 2: is probably the best of them. But with that said,
Speaker 2: they do become more soap oper operatic as they go along.
Speaker 2: But Rocky, too, I think is very good. And I
Speaker 2: remember as a kid loving Rocky three and loving Rocky four.
Speaker 2: I just got a feeling when I go back and
Speaker 2: watch them as an adult, I'm probably gonna.
Speaker 1: Enjoy Rocky as a movie. Definitely, definitely more than that.
Speaker 2: It's more clarify, it gets more more popcorns involved as
Speaker 2: we go along.
Speaker 5: Yeah, Definitely, Rocky is a way better movie than the rest. Yeah,
Speaker 5: but to me, that was my era, and it was
Speaker 5: just like they were coming out while I.
Speaker 1: Was, yeah a young man, and of course Club of Land.
Speaker 5: And it was topical two with the whole jigo.
Speaker 2: Yeah, very typical. Now up and that cand of words. Hey,
Speaker 2: a few little facts that I've got to get to.
Speaker 2: Claire mentioned earlier in the podcast that there was some
Speaker 2: conjecture about about where the story came from. It certainly
Speaker 2: obviously did come from slice the loan's own experiences and
Speaker 2: his own thoughts as far as where his acting was
Speaker 2: and the way he was feeling that an event inspired
Speaker 2: it was a guy called Chuck Wetner who was like
Speaker 2: a middleweight kind of out of the boxer, who was,
Speaker 2: you know, I'm not sure how to describe it, like
Speaker 2: a solid boxer, average boxer. But he got the chance
Speaker 2: to fight Muhammad Ali and he knocked Ali down once
Speaker 2: and he didn't win, but he knocked him down so
Speaker 2: that you could kind of see that, imagine that inspiring
Speaker 2: Sevestillone to write the way he did and the climact
Speaker 2: in particular. Funnily enough, Chuck Witner then goes on the fight,
Speaker 2: has it like an exhibition fight against Andre the Giant,
Speaker 2: which you know what happens in Rockie three. Paul Cogan, Yes,
Speaker 2: hold thunderlips, and they actually Chuck Wender did sue. He
Speaker 2: did a suit stallone a couple of times. Eventually they
Speaker 2: privately settled in two thousand and three we mentioned if
Speaker 2: you don't Stallone knocking back a pretty big offer to
Speaker 2: sell the rights to United Artists. He refused, he wanted
Speaker 2: to be in the film. The right call was made. Also,
Speaker 2: the good news is he wasn't. He was paid twenty
Speaker 2: thousand for the script and a sag that's a screen act.
Speaker 2: This good minimum of three hundred and fifty dollars per
Speaker 2: week to make the movie. But he did have some
Speaker 2: back end on it, and I think he ended up
Speaker 2: making around about twenty two million from the film.
Speaker 1: So pretty pretty cool.
Speaker 2: Some choices to play Adrian were also Susan Sarandon Cher
Speaker 2: and Bett Midler was offered the role, she said no.
Speaker 2: Stallone wins Oscars for Best Screenplay, nominated for writing the
Speaker 2: screenplay and acting, and up until a few years ago,
Speaker 2: the only other two people who had done that, I
Speaker 2: believe was Charlie Chaplin and Awson Wells.
Speaker 1: Not bad company to be in.
Speaker 2: I haven't gone back and looked at who's won since,
Speaker 2: but I know Bradley Cooper comes to mind with the
Speaker 2: Star is Born as far as writing and acting and
Speaker 2: being nominated. So in one final fact that actually blew
Speaker 2: me away a little bit. In the first draft. Stalone
Speaker 2: writes the draft, the first draft over three days, and
Speaker 2: there's a lot of rewrites goes on. In fact, Mickey
Speaker 2: was quite racist in the first draft. Adrian was Jewish,
Speaker 2: Pauli was his Jewish step mather. I mentioned that during
Speaker 2: the podcast. I got to say, Mickey's a little bit
Speaker 2: racist in this one. But in the end, what was
Speaker 2: supposed to happen in the end was Rocky was going
Speaker 2: to throw the fight and then use the money to
Speaker 2: open a pet store with Adrian.
Speaker 1: Can you believe that? Can you believe that being the
Speaker 1: ending of Rocky.
Speaker 2: I don't think you get Rocky two, Rocky three, Rocky
Speaker 2: four or the Apollos. If frock is opening a pet store,
Speaker 2: that sounds more like a Pixar film to me. That
Speaker 2: was great, That was great fun. I really enjoyed that
Speaker 2: so much. Thank you Claiboutich. Once again, thank you Derek
Speaker 2: for all your work throughout this season. We're going to
Speaker 2: take a shorter break. I know the last time we
Speaker 2: took like it was almost a three close to a
Speaker 2: three month break. It's would be close to a bit
Speaker 2: of a three week break. The suits of iHeartRadio. I
Speaker 2: want me to get back quicker than I did last time.
Speaker 2: We are with iHeartRadio now still being produced by Castways
Speaker 2: Studios and recording here, but it'll be a shorter break.
Speaker 2: We're going to record some episodes to get ahead of
Speaker 2: the pack, and we'll come back with some great guests
Speaker 2: and some great movies. Please send your emails to yasny
Speaker 2: podcast at gmail dot com, or you can jump on
Speaker 2: our speak pipe if you follow the links and leave
Speaker 2: a voice message for us, and you're going to hear
Speaker 2: your own voice on our podcast. We do have an
Speaker 2: email that we wanted to read to court our attention, Derek.
Speaker 2: Who's that front before we before we wrap up?
Speaker 5: This one's from Mark in Queensland. Beauty. Hi, Pete, love
Speaker 5: the podcast for damn you Hellier. You have plunged me
Speaker 5: into financial ruin.
Speaker 1: Haven't done that?
Speaker 5: Because every time you review a movie or talk up
Speaker 5: one of the reviewers top three, I have to sign
Speaker 5: up to another streaming. I'm with Mark and that one
Speaker 5: happens to me.
Speaker 1: Well, if you're working entertainment, you can claim it on tax.
Speaker 6: Mark.
Speaker 1: That's just you need. You need to work out how
Speaker 1: to work in the industry and then you disclaim it all.
Speaker 5: On tax.
Speaker 1: I didn't know that, but you should be doing that.
Speaker 1: You should be doing that just in time.
Speaker 5: I also can't believe that nobody has done pulp fiction.
Speaker 4: Mm hmm.
Speaker 5: There is so much to discuss and unravel in this classic.
Speaker 1: It's funny.
Speaker 2: We had somebody recently talk about, you know, requesting more
Speaker 2: Tarantino films. I do when I put out the list
Speaker 2: to any potential guests, I kind of sometimes say, you know,
Speaker 2: we're keen to do you know, some Tarantino or some
Speaker 2: Hitchcock or some foreign language films. There have been some
Speaker 2: of the stuff that's been requested, so it's just a
Speaker 2: matter of finding that right person.
Speaker 1: So certainly a classic film.
Speaker 2: And you know, I would love to talk polp fiction
Speaker 2: with someone I know, Peter and Peter Gat one of
Speaker 2: our most fervent listeners, I have to say, loves the podcast.
Speaker 2: It often reminds me that the podcast has come out
Speaker 2: each week on Twitter. For some reason, he hates pulp fiction.
Speaker 2: So we may actually lose one of our most passionate
Speaker 2: followers for one week if we do pop fiction. But
Speaker 2: I think at some point we will have to do it.
Speaker 2: So polp fiction, I'm sure we'll get to it. At
Speaker 2: some point, and of course Reservoir Dogs absolutely, And.
Speaker 5: Here comes a good bit talking of classics. I had
Speaker 5: a laugh when you were discussing with Luke McGregor whether
Speaker 5: you can include Harry Potter as it might not be
Speaker 5: a classic. Well, if that's fair enough, here's the band.
Speaker 5: But you did have weird Science classic really regards Mark.
Speaker 2: Oh, Mark, Well, I mean I take your point. I
Speaker 2: take your point, but we'd science does. There's different genres and.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean we may have.
Speaker 2: We may have scraped the one that I the other
Speaker 2: one is Ronnie Chang doing made in Manhattan, but I
Speaker 2: would still argue that, you know, as a romantic comedy,
Speaker 2: it's up there. Yeah, I take your point.
Speaker 1: I take you.
Speaker 2: Sometimes we scrape, we we we shoehorn them in because
Speaker 2: it's it's about developing, you know, covering genres as well,
Speaker 2: and and different kinds of films, which is fun. Maybe
Speaker 2: you should have been Porky, so maybe would have been
Speaker 2: happy with Porky's or zapp All great films, all great films.
Speaker 2: I want to thank listeners really sincerely, I'm blown away.
Speaker 2: This started as a labor of love, really, just the
Speaker 2: filling the gaps in my own filmography, and I have
Speaker 2: loved watching these films and having these conversations and feedback
Speaker 2: I've received both through the yasny podcast, a Gmail, and
Speaker 2: just you know, on my Instagram and Twitter feeds. People
Speaker 2: come up to me personally and then saying how much
Speaker 2: after gigs. Yeah, it's been really really touching. I'm so
Speaker 2: glad we're building this community, and that was always the
Speaker 2: dream that we could build this, you know.
Speaker 1: A community of film lovers who love talking about films.
Speaker 1: There'll be more live events.
Speaker 2: I would love to get one hundred episode live event
Speaker 2: going and one or two more. We might aim to
Speaker 2: do maybe three live events in season five. That would
Speaker 2: be amazing, So thank you. Thanks to all the amazing
Speaker 2: guests in season. In season four, we start with Osha
Speaker 2: Ginsburg doing Roman Holiday. You know, it seems like a
Speaker 2: while ago now in Kate Lambrook with Fight Club and
Speaker 2: everyone who's just been on it for the twenty odd episodes.
Speaker 2: We have done some big names. I've been talking to
Speaker 2: visit us in season five, some big movies. What I
Speaker 2: might do next time is maybe release in advance who
Speaker 2: we have coming up so people can actually watch the movies.
Speaker 2: Have requested that a little bit of time to be
Speaker 2: able to get the movies watched before the episodes come out,
Speaker 2: so we might try to put out a little calendar
Speaker 2: of what might be coming up. Sometimes, you know, we
Speaker 2: can't always do that. Sometimes that we do record it
Speaker 2: literally days before you hear it. Sometimes they are more
Speaker 2: in advance. So thank you so much, thanks for listening.
Speaker 2: Thank you Derek, and we will see you in a
Speaker 2: few weeks for season five of you Ain't seeing nothing
Speaker 2: yet until then, take care, And so we leave all
Speaker 2: Pete save Van Sult, and to our friends of the
Speaker 2: radio audience, we've been a pleasant good name.