1 00:00:00,320 --> 00:00:03,200 Speaker 1: How I work is having a little break over the 2 00:00:03,240 --> 00:00:06,160 Speaker 1: festive season, so I have handpicked a few of my 3 00:00:06,320 --> 00:00:09,800 Speaker 1: absolute favorite episodes from the last year to play for 4 00:00:09,880 --> 00:00:13,080 Speaker 1: you in this best of series. I hope you enjoy 5 00:00:13,160 --> 00:00:16,120 Speaker 1: and I will be back with new episodes twice weekly 6 00:00:16,320 --> 00:00:21,720 Speaker 1: from January twenty nine. Do you find yourself constantly trying 7 00:00:21,760 --> 00:00:26,160 Speaker 1: to ensure that people like you, maybe bending over backwards 8 00:00:26,200 --> 00:00:30,080 Speaker 1: to avoid giving bad news or make someone unhappy. But 9 00:00:30,120 --> 00:00:32,920 Speaker 1: what if the extra reassurance and the fear of being 10 00:00:32,960 --> 00:00:37,920 Speaker 1: too direct actually causing you more harm than good. Many 11 00:00:37,960 --> 00:00:40,720 Speaker 1: of us battle with some degree of people pleasing in 12 00:00:40,760 --> 00:00:45,080 Speaker 1: our personalities, and the negative consequences can appear both in 13 00:00:45,159 --> 00:00:49,479 Speaker 1: our personal and professional lives. To dive into this topic, 14 00:00:49,640 --> 00:00:53,080 Speaker 1: we are joined by Laura Henshaw to talk about how 15 00:00:53,240 --> 00:00:56,920 Speaker 1: she realized that her need to be liked was affecting 16 00:00:56,960 --> 00:01:01,840 Speaker 1: those working under her. Laura Henshaw is a dynamic force 17 00:01:02,000 --> 00:01:06,040 Speaker 1: in the health and wellness industry. As the co founder 18 00:01:06,160 --> 00:01:10,600 Speaker 1: and CEO of the incredibly successful kick app and community. 19 00:01:11,000 --> 00:01:14,240 Speaker 1: She leads a mission to reshape how people perceive wellness 20 00:01:14,280 --> 00:01:18,880 Speaker 1: and their relationship with themselves, and Laura is having a 21 00:01:18,920 --> 00:01:22,520 Speaker 1: massive impact with the kick app. Currently sitting at over 22 00:01:22,640 --> 00:01:26,000 Speaker 1: two point five million users and reaching people in over 23 00:01:26,040 --> 00:01:30,400 Speaker 1: one hundred and twenty countries. In this episode, we discuss 24 00:01:30,480 --> 00:01:33,759 Speaker 1: the ways that your people pleasing could be holding you back, 25 00:01:34,400 --> 00:01:38,560 Speaker 1: How Laura changed her people pleasing behavior, and how she 26 00:01:38,680 --> 00:01:48,360 Speaker 1: broke her destructive habit of reading comments from all the trolls. 27 00:01:49,480 --> 00:01:53,200 Speaker 1: Welcome to How I Work, a show about habits, rituals, 28 00:01:53,240 --> 00:01:57,200 Speaker 1: and strategies for optimizing your day. I'm your host, doctor 29 00:01:57,200 --> 00:02:01,680 Speaker 1: Amantha Imber. In addition to her credible success, Laura is 30 00:02:01,760 --> 00:02:05,559 Speaker 1: a self confessed people pleaser, but she's done the work 31 00:02:05,640 --> 00:02:09,920 Speaker 1: to improve in that area. In fact, she did that 32 00:02:10,000 --> 00:02:14,200 Speaker 1: work with her coach, Jennie Martino, who helped her realize 33 00:02:14,240 --> 00:02:17,360 Speaker 1: how her need to be liked was affecting her work. 34 00:02:21,000 --> 00:02:23,959 Speaker 2: The biggest thing that comes to mind is when I 35 00:02:24,000 --> 00:02:27,600 Speaker 2: met Janie. One of the biggest things holding me back 36 00:02:27,680 --> 00:02:30,600 Speaker 2: in when I say reaching my full potential as a leader. 37 00:02:30,639 --> 00:02:32,680 Speaker 2: I feel like we're always learning and growing, right, So 38 00:02:32,680 --> 00:02:34,520 Speaker 2: I'm definitely not there yet, and I hope I never 39 00:02:34,560 --> 00:02:36,519 Speaker 2: get there, because you want to keep growing and evolving. 40 00:02:37,320 --> 00:02:40,480 Speaker 2: But something that was holding me back a lot was 41 00:02:40,800 --> 00:02:43,760 Speaker 2: how much I cared about what people think or thought 42 00:02:44,240 --> 00:02:48,520 Speaker 2: and also my need to be liked by every single person, 43 00:02:49,360 --> 00:02:52,480 Speaker 2: when you need to be liked by everyone that you're leading, 44 00:02:52,560 --> 00:02:55,840 Speaker 2: if that's kind of something that and I didn't consciously 45 00:02:55,880 --> 00:02:58,880 Speaker 2: put it as a KPI, but subconsciously that was number 46 00:02:58,880 --> 00:03:04,280 Speaker 2: one before everything else, which isn't the best for anyone 47 00:03:04,440 --> 00:03:06,960 Speaker 2: at all, because then you're leading a lot of the 48 00:03:07,000 --> 00:03:11,040 Speaker 2: time in fear because you don't want to let anyone down. 49 00:03:11,120 --> 00:03:13,560 Speaker 2: You want people to like you, so giving feedback is 50 00:03:13,639 --> 00:03:18,640 Speaker 2: incredibly difficult. Feedback is obviously incredibly important for people growing 51 00:03:18,960 --> 00:03:21,799 Speaker 2: in their career, al so in being clear and where 52 00:03:21,800 --> 00:03:24,000 Speaker 2: you actually want the business to go and taking control 53 00:03:24,080 --> 00:03:27,760 Speaker 2: of it and executing the vision, the strategy, etc. But 54 00:03:28,000 --> 00:03:32,200 Speaker 2: I was so stuck in thinking that that mattered. And 55 00:03:32,240 --> 00:03:34,239 Speaker 2: I think for me, I have a lot of people 56 00:03:34,280 --> 00:03:37,280 Speaker 2: pleasing tendencies and I don't want to say that all 57 00:03:37,320 --> 00:03:39,160 Speaker 2: women do not have that, and that's great, And I 58 00:03:39,160 --> 00:03:41,960 Speaker 2: don't want anyone listening to think that, oh, because I'm 59 00:03:42,000 --> 00:03:43,760 Speaker 2: a woman, I must be a people pleaser, because I 60 00:03:43,800 --> 00:03:45,760 Speaker 2: don't think that's the case at all. But I think, 61 00:03:45,840 --> 00:03:49,839 Speaker 2: unfortunately maybe in gender stereotypical roles where more of the 62 00:03:49,880 --> 00:03:53,360 Speaker 2: care is or expected to be, etc. And so sometimes 63 00:03:53,360 --> 00:03:56,600 Speaker 2: it does come up, and so my people pleasing tendencies 64 00:03:56,720 --> 00:03:59,880 Speaker 2: really leaned into that need to be liked, and so 65 00:04:00,080 --> 00:04:03,560 Speaker 2: I've had to undo a lot of that, which Janey 66 00:04:03,600 --> 00:04:06,200 Speaker 2: helped me work through, and I have just like the 67 00:04:06,240 --> 00:04:09,160 Speaker 2: way that I'm able to lead now in comparison, when 68 00:04:09,160 --> 00:04:11,560 Speaker 2: I look back at that person, I'm like, oh, my goodness, 69 00:04:11,760 --> 00:04:14,960 Speaker 2: it's crazy. Like I do identify still with with myself 70 00:04:15,000 --> 00:04:17,320 Speaker 2: of you know, three or whatever years ago, two years ago, 71 00:04:17,760 --> 00:04:20,560 Speaker 2: but I just feel so different, like I've been let 72 00:04:20,600 --> 00:04:22,160 Speaker 2: free in being able to let that go. 73 00:04:22,360 --> 00:04:24,599 Speaker 1: I feel like you've just described my twenty twenty four. 74 00:04:26,040 --> 00:04:28,360 Speaker 1: I want to know for you, though, Laura, if you 75 00:04:28,400 --> 00:04:30,520 Speaker 1: think back over the last three years and this big 76 00:04:30,560 --> 00:04:34,520 Speaker 1: shift that you've made, what are some of those practical 77 00:04:34,600 --> 00:04:37,440 Speaker 1: things that you did, all those mindset shifts that you 78 00:04:37,520 --> 00:04:40,120 Speaker 1: had to make that had the biggest difference. 79 00:04:40,440 --> 00:04:42,800 Speaker 2: Oh, it's such a good question, and it's great that 80 00:04:42,839 --> 00:04:44,960 Speaker 2: you've also been on the journey because I think a 81 00:04:45,000 --> 00:04:48,279 Speaker 2: lot of people have and will relate to this. For me, 82 00:04:48,800 --> 00:04:51,320 Speaker 2: and one of the questions Janie asked me was, and 83 00:04:51,360 --> 00:04:53,000 Speaker 2: we work through this in one of my I think 84 00:04:53,040 --> 00:04:55,920 Speaker 2: it was almost my first session with Jane, which was 85 00:04:56,200 --> 00:04:58,640 Speaker 2: why do you want to be liked? Like, why is 86 00:04:58,680 --> 00:05:01,760 Speaker 2: that important? And is that actually what is important to you? 87 00:05:02,680 --> 00:05:04,599 Speaker 2: And what we came out to is not, I don't. 88 00:05:04,720 --> 00:05:06,800 Speaker 2: It's not really about being liked per se, but it's 89 00:05:06,839 --> 00:05:09,479 Speaker 2: about being respected. And I think that was kind of 90 00:05:09,520 --> 00:05:11,760 Speaker 2: rooted in a lot of stuff for me. I know 91 00:05:11,839 --> 00:05:14,720 Speaker 2: we might touch today on imposter syndrome and kind of 92 00:05:14,760 --> 00:05:19,320 Speaker 2: being a young female leader. Also because of where my 93 00:05:19,440 --> 00:05:23,240 Speaker 2: career started was with social or part of it was 94 00:05:23,279 --> 00:05:26,039 Speaker 2: social media, and so for a very long time I 95 00:05:26,080 --> 00:05:29,640 Speaker 2: felt that I wasn't taken seriously. Well I wasn't. Actually, 96 00:05:29,680 --> 00:05:31,320 Speaker 2: I can It's not just what I thought. I was 97 00:05:31,320 --> 00:05:34,320 Speaker 2: not taken seriously by a lot of people that I 98 00:05:34,440 --> 00:05:35,400 Speaker 2: worked with. 99 00:05:35,680 --> 00:05:36,760 Speaker 1: How did you know for sure? 100 00:05:37,279 --> 00:05:39,159 Speaker 2: Well, I mean there were times when I was in 101 00:05:39,240 --> 00:05:42,440 Speaker 2: rooms with people that I worked with that would describe 102 00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:45,039 Speaker 2: so often Steph and I as the marketing girls, and 103 00:05:45,080 --> 00:05:47,719 Speaker 2: it's like, no, we built this brand, we run this business, etc. 104 00:05:48,520 --> 00:05:53,160 Speaker 2: There's been multiple occasions where that has happened in different ways, 105 00:05:53,160 --> 00:05:55,480 Speaker 2: and I think at that time, I felt like I 106 00:05:55,560 --> 00:06:00,680 Speaker 2: just had to prove myself and I think because of 107 00:06:00,720 --> 00:06:03,160 Speaker 2: that kind of I've definitely worked through that and now 108 00:06:03,240 --> 00:06:05,599 Speaker 2: I know that like, that's on them. I don't have 109 00:06:05,640 --> 00:06:09,120 Speaker 2: to prove myself to anyone. But that definitely was a 110 00:06:09,120 --> 00:06:12,880 Speaker 2: big cause of why I then felt that I had 111 00:06:12,920 --> 00:06:14,839 Speaker 2: to kind of lead that way. And so for me, 112 00:06:14,920 --> 00:06:16,520 Speaker 2: it was kind of thinking about, Okay, I need to 113 00:06:16,520 --> 00:06:20,719 Speaker 2: be respected, that's what's important, and then it's unpacking Okay, 114 00:06:21,360 --> 00:06:24,080 Speaker 2: how do you get respect with your team? How do 115 00:06:24,120 --> 00:06:26,920 Speaker 2: you get respect with the people around you by being 116 00:06:26,920 --> 00:06:29,240 Speaker 2: a good leader and knowing that you can still lead 117 00:06:29,240 --> 00:06:32,080 Speaker 2: with empathy, because that's very, very very important to me. 118 00:06:33,080 --> 00:06:35,720 Speaker 2: But I think it was also the realization that it 119 00:06:35,800 --> 00:06:38,920 Speaker 2: is impossible to be liked by everyone because no matter what, 120 00:06:39,120 --> 00:06:41,080 Speaker 2: like I know that, you know, in running a business, 121 00:06:41,120 --> 00:06:44,560 Speaker 2: you and everyone that's listening that does most decisions you make, 122 00:06:44,720 --> 00:06:46,520 Speaker 2: there is going to be someone that's not going to 123 00:06:46,640 --> 00:06:49,320 Speaker 2: like the decision. It's very very rare we make decisions 124 00:06:49,320 --> 00:06:52,000 Speaker 2: where everyone agrees on it and is going to like 125 00:06:52,040 --> 00:06:55,320 Speaker 2: the outcome, right, especially when you're running a business. And 126 00:06:55,360 --> 00:06:57,280 Speaker 2: so it was also that realization that I was, well, 127 00:06:57,279 --> 00:06:59,800 Speaker 2: I'm setting myself up to fail because I can't actually 128 00:07:00,000 --> 00:07:03,839 Speaker 2: achieve this and I'm not driving the business, and in 129 00:07:03,920 --> 00:07:05,520 Speaker 2: my role as CEO of if I'm not driving the 130 00:07:05,520 --> 00:07:08,640 Speaker 2: business forward, then I shouldn't be in the role. 131 00:07:10,240 --> 00:07:13,760 Speaker 1: How then, because I feel like one of the hardest 132 00:07:13,800 --> 00:07:15,800 Speaker 1: areas where this plays out is when you have to 133 00:07:15,840 --> 00:07:18,520 Speaker 1: have those tough conversations. And I mean I hate calling 134 00:07:18,520 --> 00:07:20,480 Speaker 1: them tough conversations. I try to think of them as 135 00:07:20,520 --> 00:07:23,960 Speaker 1: important conversations, as opposed to difficult conversations because it changes 136 00:07:23,960 --> 00:07:27,239 Speaker 1: the mindset. But they're hard. If you've got a high 137 00:07:27,560 --> 00:07:31,920 Speaker 1: need to be liked and you are delivering news that 138 00:07:32,040 --> 00:07:36,120 Speaker 1: someone else is going to find tough or confronting or 139 00:07:36,480 --> 00:07:39,280 Speaker 1: hard to take on board. How did you change your 140 00:07:39,320 --> 00:07:41,040 Speaker 1: approach to those kinds of conversations. 141 00:07:41,400 --> 00:07:45,520 Speaker 2: I think realizing that in going in to be liked. 142 00:07:45,520 --> 00:07:48,400 Speaker 2: So there was one instance I remember I delivered something 143 00:07:48,400 --> 00:07:50,640 Speaker 2: to the team and Janie was there and she said, 144 00:07:50,680 --> 00:07:52,320 Speaker 2: because I had always thought like I have to do 145 00:07:52,320 --> 00:07:54,480 Speaker 2: a like a sandwich, I think this is something I 146 00:07:54,520 --> 00:07:57,600 Speaker 2: don't actually sandwich. I don't agree that I should be. 147 00:07:57,680 --> 00:07:59,320 Speaker 2: I don't think it's the best way to approachings, but 148 00:07:59,360 --> 00:08:03,480 Speaker 2: I used to. And the feedback I got was it 149 00:08:03,520 --> 00:08:05,440 Speaker 2: was almost like I made a sandwich, but it was 150 00:08:05,520 --> 00:08:07,880 Speaker 2: like with the thinnest slice of ham in the middle, 151 00:08:08,040 --> 00:08:10,360 Speaker 2: which is what I had to deliver, And then it 152 00:08:10,400 --> 00:08:12,960 Speaker 2: had like a hundred pieces of bread on both sides, 153 00:08:13,680 --> 00:08:16,640 Speaker 2: so no one got the message. No one's tasty because 154 00:08:16,640 --> 00:08:20,360 Speaker 2: I put so much stuff around it in the fear 155 00:08:20,440 --> 00:08:24,000 Speaker 2: that of the thing I was delivering. What that then 156 00:08:24,080 --> 00:08:26,760 Speaker 2: means is, I think, when you're delivering out of a 157 00:08:26,760 --> 00:08:29,920 Speaker 2: place of fear, if you don't believe in what you're 158 00:08:29,960 --> 00:08:32,400 Speaker 2: saying or feel that it's fair or whatever it might be, 159 00:08:32,920 --> 00:08:34,720 Speaker 2: how the heck is your team going to find it 160 00:08:34,760 --> 00:08:38,000 Speaker 2: also fair and believe in it back. So that's number 161 00:08:38,040 --> 00:08:40,840 Speaker 2: one thing. But what I then was able to navigate 162 00:08:40,920 --> 00:08:42,800 Speaker 2: through time was realizing the biggest I think one of 163 00:08:42,800 --> 00:08:46,640 Speaker 2: the biggest realizations for me was feedback is a kindness. 164 00:08:46,960 --> 00:08:50,960 Speaker 2: Being clear is kind That's the biggest thing. And there's 165 00:08:51,000 --> 00:08:53,640 Speaker 2: a book I can't remember the name of it. I 166 00:08:53,640 --> 00:08:55,760 Speaker 2: will find it once I finished this pod and I 167 00:08:55,760 --> 00:08:57,240 Speaker 2: can send it through to put in the show notes. 168 00:08:57,240 --> 00:08:58,920 Speaker 2: But it's fantastic And at the start of it there's 169 00:08:58,920 --> 00:09:03,320 Speaker 2: a chapter around an employee that never gets feedback. They're 170 00:09:03,360 --> 00:09:06,360 Speaker 2: the really likable person in the office. They contribute to culture. 171 00:09:06,520 --> 00:09:09,240 Speaker 2: Radical candor yes, radical canduct yes, yeah, who's the author? 172 00:09:09,280 --> 00:09:12,000 Speaker 2: Is it Kim Scott? Yes, Kim Scott, radical candor. That 173 00:09:12,120 --> 00:09:15,200 Speaker 2: first chapter made I recommend anyone that is struggling with 174 00:09:15,240 --> 00:09:17,800 Speaker 2: this right now to read that. It made such a 175 00:09:17,800 --> 00:09:20,720 Speaker 2: big impact for me because this person in this book 176 00:09:20,800 --> 00:09:23,480 Speaker 2: wasn't giving any given any feedback because everyone was trying 177 00:09:23,480 --> 00:09:25,320 Speaker 2: to avoid it because they liked them and they thought 178 00:09:25,360 --> 00:09:27,440 Speaker 2: that would be best for them. And then when they 179 00:09:27,520 --> 00:09:30,080 Speaker 2: were let go and they said, why didn't anyone tell me? 180 00:09:30,760 --> 00:09:34,080 Speaker 2: It's like stepping back and actually thinking about that, why 181 00:09:34,120 --> 00:09:36,560 Speaker 2: didn't anyone tell you? Because they were trying to protect you? 182 00:09:36,640 --> 00:09:39,320 Speaker 2: But in trying to protect you and be likable, you know, 183 00:09:39,400 --> 00:09:42,200 Speaker 2: to them, you then set them up to fail in 184 00:09:42,240 --> 00:09:45,200 Speaker 2: their role. And if people are coming to work with you, 185 00:09:45,240 --> 00:09:47,520 Speaker 2: I think I always feel like Kick, we're so lucky 186 00:09:47,559 --> 00:09:49,360 Speaker 2: to have the team that we have, and for people 187 00:09:49,400 --> 00:09:53,080 Speaker 2: to take time within their career path at KICK, you know, 188 00:09:53,240 --> 00:09:54,880 Speaker 2: and for us to be part of their journey is 189 00:09:54,880 --> 00:09:58,439 Speaker 2: a really special thing, and it's very important that we offer, 190 00:09:58,760 --> 00:10:01,640 Speaker 2: you know, career growth and development for those people. But 191 00:10:01,720 --> 00:10:04,360 Speaker 2: if we're not giving feedback on how they can improve 192 00:10:04,679 --> 00:10:07,640 Speaker 2: or being clear with our expectations, that's not the best 193 00:10:07,640 --> 00:10:09,960 Speaker 2: for them, and it's also not the best for the business. 194 00:10:10,840 --> 00:10:13,439 Speaker 2: And that's where another really really big lesson from Janey 195 00:10:13,480 --> 00:10:16,560 Speaker 2: has come in on communication and the power of being 196 00:10:16,640 --> 00:10:21,040 Speaker 2: clear and that you can do that with empathy. And 197 00:10:21,080 --> 00:10:23,880 Speaker 2: that's been a huge, huge lesson for me as well. 198 00:10:24,040 --> 00:10:26,400 Speaker 2: And you just as I said, like that sandwich with 199 00:10:26,480 --> 00:10:29,120 Speaker 2: the hundred slices of bread on each side, it doesn't 200 00:10:29,160 --> 00:10:32,880 Speaker 2: help anyone. And you just say, it is hard. You 201 00:10:32,880 --> 00:10:35,119 Speaker 2: walk into the room, you know you're having a hard conversation. 202 00:10:35,640 --> 00:10:38,120 Speaker 2: You just need to start it. Once you're in the conversation, 203 00:10:38,200 --> 00:10:40,400 Speaker 2: it's absolutely fine. It's kind of just that start part 204 00:10:40,400 --> 00:10:44,200 Speaker 2: where you fee uncomfortable, but you're also assuming what the 205 00:10:44,280 --> 00:10:46,040 Speaker 2: other person is going to do or how they're going 206 00:10:46,080 --> 00:10:48,560 Speaker 2: to react. You don't know. And so I think we 207 00:10:48,679 --> 00:10:51,000 Speaker 2: need to also give people the benefit of the doubt 208 00:10:51,000 --> 00:10:52,920 Speaker 2: in that situation that though they might be aligned with 209 00:10:52,960 --> 00:10:54,840 Speaker 2: this or they might take this on board, it's also 210 00:10:54,880 --> 00:10:57,079 Speaker 2: their choice if they take it on board or not, right, 211 00:10:57,160 --> 00:11:00,200 Speaker 2: but it is as leaders it is our responsibility to 212 00:11:00,240 --> 00:11:01,040 Speaker 2: share that with them. 213 00:11:01,160 --> 00:11:03,640 Speaker 1: I want to ask in terms of this need to 214 00:11:03,679 --> 00:11:06,720 Speaker 1: be liked and how you've kind of shifted that into 215 00:11:07,120 --> 00:11:10,600 Speaker 1: you know, it's a need to be respected, I'm reminded of. 216 00:11:11,240 --> 00:11:13,000 Speaker 1: I thought it was such a powerful interview that you 217 00:11:13,040 --> 00:11:14,880 Speaker 1: gave on the Imperfect, So I want to say that 218 00:11:15,040 --> 00:11:19,640 Speaker 1: was late twenty twenty three maybe, And during that interview 219 00:11:19,720 --> 00:11:24,240 Speaker 1: you spoke about how you read the comments online, all 220 00:11:24,280 --> 00:11:28,199 Speaker 1: of them, and Steph, your business partner and best friend, 221 00:11:28,200 --> 00:11:33,559 Speaker 1: doesn't and I remember being really surprised but curious. Has 222 00:11:33,600 --> 00:11:37,600 Speaker 1: your behavior changed in light of, I guess, trying to 223 00:11:38,080 --> 00:11:41,439 Speaker 1: manage your people pleasing ways? Or do you still do that? Oh? 224 00:11:41,520 --> 00:11:43,560 Speaker 2: Great question. I'm very proud to say that I don't 225 00:11:43,559 --> 00:11:44,840 Speaker 2: do that anymore. 226 00:11:45,080 --> 00:11:46,040 Speaker 1: How did you stop? 227 00:11:46,280 --> 00:11:48,480 Speaker 2: I mean, I working through all of this, and I 228 00:11:48,520 --> 00:11:52,040 Speaker 2: suppose it's kind of separate to my leadership journey per se, 229 00:11:52,120 --> 00:11:54,720 Speaker 2: but it'll write it. It all comes together and links in. 230 00:11:55,559 --> 00:11:57,679 Speaker 2: I tried to and have been on a journey to 231 00:11:57,679 --> 00:12:01,760 Speaker 2: stop caring about what people think. And Brene Brown talks 232 00:12:01,760 --> 00:12:03,480 Speaker 2: about this a lot, and it's one of my favorite 233 00:12:03,480 --> 00:12:06,600 Speaker 2: pieces of work that she has done when she talks 234 00:12:06,640 --> 00:12:09,160 Speaker 2: about people in the arena and if someone is not 235 00:12:09,240 --> 00:12:11,440 Speaker 2: in the arena with you, getting their butt kicked like 236 00:12:11,559 --> 00:12:14,000 Speaker 2: their opinion. I've definitely butchered this. But Essentially, it's like 237 00:12:14,040 --> 00:12:18,240 Speaker 2: their opinion doesn't matter because they're up sitting just watching 238 00:12:18,360 --> 00:12:20,520 Speaker 2: and observing. And I think what I was doing was 239 00:12:20,559 --> 00:12:23,959 Speaker 2: thinking that. For me, it comes down to growing up. 240 00:12:24,240 --> 00:12:28,520 Speaker 2: Something that I valued myself on a lot was being 241 00:12:28,559 --> 00:12:32,560 Speaker 2: a hard worker. And so that's something that I'm trying 242 00:12:32,559 --> 00:12:36,080 Speaker 2: to undo as an adult now because I think often 243 00:12:36,080 --> 00:12:37,840 Speaker 2: what I do is I hide behind the fact that 244 00:12:37,920 --> 00:12:40,719 Speaker 2: I work hard because then I don't have to think about, well, 245 00:12:40,720 --> 00:12:42,320 Speaker 2: hang on, what value do I add here? It's like, well, 246 00:12:42,360 --> 00:12:44,720 Speaker 2: I'm a hard worker. That's the value that I add. 247 00:12:45,480 --> 00:12:47,960 Speaker 2: But if I strip that back and I don't do that, 248 00:12:48,040 --> 00:12:50,880 Speaker 2: which can lead to burnout and you can't work, you know, 249 00:12:51,320 --> 00:12:53,240 Speaker 2: sixteen hours a day for the rest of your life 250 00:12:53,280 --> 00:12:55,360 Speaker 2: every single day. It's too much, you know, ebbs and flows, 251 00:12:55,360 --> 00:12:57,800 Speaker 2: and sometimes I'll be busy weeks and less busy weeks. 252 00:12:58,679 --> 00:13:01,400 Speaker 2: But I have had to rip that back, and I 253 00:13:01,400 --> 00:13:04,920 Speaker 2: think a part of that was there's a book called Burnout. 254 00:13:05,240 --> 00:13:08,960 Speaker 2: It's fantastic. There's one page that's about the whip and 255 00:13:08,960 --> 00:13:11,679 Speaker 2: I just I just related to it so much when 256 00:13:11,679 --> 00:13:13,760 Speaker 2: I read it, and essentially what they talk about is 257 00:13:14,240 --> 00:13:17,640 Speaker 2: and it's mainly aimed at women this book. For a 258 00:13:17,640 --> 00:13:20,800 Speaker 2: lot of people, we feel that we have to seek 259 00:13:20,840 --> 00:13:23,120 Speaker 2: out this like I was these trolling comments because the 260 00:13:23,120 --> 00:13:25,600 Speaker 2: reason I was seeking them out is because I feel 261 00:13:25,640 --> 00:13:27,320 Speaker 2: like I have to continue working hard, I have to 262 00:13:27,360 --> 00:13:30,400 Speaker 2: continue improving. And so if I would read it, it 263 00:13:30,440 --> 00:13:32,760 Speaker 2: was almost this fuel of the fire of Okay, I'm 264 00:13:32,800 --> 00:13:36,040 Speaker 2: not good enough yet. I have to keep in the book. 265 00:13:36,080 --> 00:13:37,720 Speaker 2: The way they talk about it is it's a whip. 266 00:13:37,960 --> 00:13:40,360 Speaker 2: I have to keep whipping myself because then if you 267 00:13:40,400 --> 00:13:42,199 Speaker 2: pull back and what they talk about in the book 268 00:13:42,440 --> 00:13:44,600 Speaker 2: and you look at where you've what you've built, or 269 00:13:44,880 --> 00:13:46,800 Speaker 2: how you in your career, where you've got to, and 270 00:13:46,840 --> 00:13:49,079 Speaker 2: you know with what we've built with Kick, I look 271 00:13:49,160 --> 00:13:51,320 Speaker 2: back and I think, Okay, the reason I have got 272 00:13:51,360 --> 00:13:53,840 Speaker 2: here is because of the whip. So if I put 273 00:13:53,840 --> 00:13:57,040 Speaker 2: the whip down and I stop fueling myself through all 274 00:13:57,080 --> 00:14:01,320 Speaker 2: of these kind of horrible trolling comments online, constantly trying 275 00:14:01,320 --> 00:14:03,720 Speaker 2: to be better and better and better, I won't have 276 00:14:03,760 --> 00:14:06,600 Speaker 2: any drive, and therefore I won't be able to continue 277 00:14:06,640 --> 00:14:09,080 Speaker 2: to grow. Then it's been working through like that is 278 00:14:09,120 --> 00:14:10,800 Speaker 2: not the reason that I have got to where I 279 00:14:10,840 --> 00:14:15,040 Speaker 2: am today and unpacking that, but it has been really, 280 00:14:15,080 --> 00:14:18,200 Speaker 2: really hard to do that, and it also depends, like 281 00:14:18,200 --> 00:14:20,120 Speaker 2: I feel like our confidence ebbs and flows, and I 282 00:14:20,160 --> 00:14:23,440 Speaker 2: know when you think of like the most kind of 283 00:14:23,480 --> 00:14:26,640 Speaker 2: corny Pinterest quote, it's like confidence is not a destination. 284 00:14:26,720 --> 00:14:28,800 Speaker 2: It's a journey. I know, and I can see like 285 00:14:28,840 --> 00:14:32,280 Speaker 2: the clouds around it. But it's true, right, you can 286 00:14:32,360 --> 00:14:34,880 Speaker 2: never ever, ever stop working on yourself. And so sometimes 287 00:14:34,880 --> 00:14:36,880 Speaker 2: I will go through stages where I feel tempted to 288 00:14:36,880 --> 00:14:39,280 Speaker 2: go and look at those comments and take them on board. 289 00:14:39,840 --> 00:14:43,920 Speaker 2: But I have done a lot of work on myself 290 00:14:44,000 --> 00:14:47,160 Speaker 2: to now have so many tools to not go and 291 00:14:47,200 --> 00:14:49,800 Speaker 2: do that and know that how hard I work has 292 00:14:49,840 --> 00:14:51,920 Speaker 2: nothing to do with how worthy I am as a 293 00:14:51,920 --> 00:14:56,200 Speaker 2: person and that I'm you know, capable of deserving of things. 294 00:14:57,000 --> 00:14:59,080 Speaker 2: That's been really hard to work through, but that has 295 00:14:59,120 --> 00:15:03,000 Speaker 2: been so important and in truly believing like within myself 296 00:15:03,200 --> 00:15:05,640 Speaker 2: to be able to kind of get through that stuff. 297 00:15:05,640 --> 00:15:08,080 Speaker 2: And I definitely still have self doubt, but it does 298 00:15:08,120 --> 00:15:10,160 Speaker 2: not control me like it used to. 299 00:15:10,440 --> 00:15:14,280 Speaker 1: Like that sounds absolutely phenomenal what you've done, Laura. That 300 00:15:14,400 --> 00:15:17,960 Speaker 1: is such a huge change to achieve. I don't know you, 301 00:15:18,000 --> 00:15:19,080 Speaker 1: but I feel proud, you. 302 00:15:19,000 --> 00:15:20,520 Speaker 2: Know, thank you. It's very kind. 303 00:15:20,720 --> 00:15:25,120 Speaker 1: How then, do you know when enough is enough? At work? 304 00:15:25,400 --> 00:15:29,320 Speaker 1: I mean, you know, you're like this amazing mascot for 305 00:15:29,360 --> 00:15:31,680 Speaker 1: well being. You know, that's that's who you are, that's 306 00:15:31,720 --> 00:15:35,120 Speaker 1: what Kick is. Yet you're a business owner, you're a CEO, 307 00:15:35,960 --> 00:15:39,120 Speaker 1: you do obviously have an amazing work ethic, and you've 308 00:15:39,120 --> 00:15:41,760 Speaker 1: got friends and family. How do you know then when 309 00:15:42,040 --> 00:15:43,920 Speaker 1: enough is enough on a day to day or week 310 00:15:43,960 --> 00:15:44,800 Speaker 1: to week basis. 311 00:15:44,960 --> 00:15:46,840 Speaker 2: Well, I have to start by saying sometimes I don't 312 00:15:46,920 --> 00:15:49,080 Speaker 2: and this is something I'm absolutely working through. So I 313 00:15:49,120 --> 00:15:52,040 Speaker 2: do not have this down pattern perfect. But for me, 314 00:15:52,160 --> 00:15:55,720 Speaker 2: what I have learned is when I don't stop and 315 00:15:55,760 --> 00:15:58,840 Speaker 2: I don't have anything outside of work, first of all, 316 00:15:58,880 --> 00:16:01,200 Speaker 2: like the impact that that then puts me back in 317 00:16:01,240 --> 00:16:04,640 Speaker 2: a fear driven mindset because one hundred and ten percent 318 00:16:04,640 --> 00:16:07,520 Speaker 2: of my focus is on work, and so my full 319 00:16:07,560 --> 00:16:10,720 Speaker 2: fulfillment in my life is based on what happens, you know, 320 00:16:10,800 --> 00:16:13,440 Speaker 2: with Kick and running a business, Like the one thing 321 00:16:13,480 --> 00:16:15,480 Speaker 2: that is guaranteed is that stuff's going to go wrong. 322 00:16:15,520 --> 00:16:17,480 Speaker 2: Like that's the one thing. There's something else is guaranteed. 323 00:16:17,480 --> 00:16:19,480 Speaker 2: There's gonna be things that you're going to come up 324 00:16:19,480 --> 00:16:22,600 Speaker 2: against that you maybe have never solved before or are 325 00:16:22,680 --> 00:16:25,120 Speaker 2: really really going to challenge you like that is guaranteed 326 00:16:25,200 --> 00:16:27,200 Speaker 2: right as we know in anyone that's a business owner 327 00:16:27,240 --> 00:16:30,520 Speaker 2: will also know that. And so because of that, if 328 00:16:30,560 --> 00:16:33,280 Speaker 2: I have all of my eggs in the basket of work, 329 00:16:34,040 --> 00:16:36,600 Speaker 2: I am then operating knowing that I have to keep 330 00:16:36,600 --> 00:16:38,280 Speaker 2: going and going and going because this is the only 331 00:16:38,320 --> 00:16:40,600 Speaker 2: way I'm going to get fulfilment. And if something goes wrong, 332 00:16:41,120 --> 00:16:45,240 Speaker 2: controlling your emotional reaction within yourself and they're not going 333 00:16:45,320 --> 00:16:48,720 Speaker 2: down a path of for me really getting deep in 334 00:16:48,760 --> 00:16:52,400 Speaker 2: that self doubt mindset, but also a shame mindset in 335 00:16:52,520 --> 00:16:54,760 Speaker 2: that you know something might go wrong not go the 336 00:16:54,760 --> 00:16:58,440 Speaker 2: way that I wanted it to. I now am much 337 00:16:58,480 --> 00:17:01,440 Speaker 2: better at reframing into you know, this didn't go the 338 00:17:01,480 --> 00:17:03,800 Speaker 2: way I wanted it to. Here's my learnings. I'm moving 339 00:17:03,840 --> 00:17:07,040 Speaker 2: on instead of saying I am stupid, or I am dumb, 340 00:17:07,160 --> 00:17:09,880 Speaker 2: or I'm not good enough. Because what happens when you're 341 00:17:09,920 --> 00:17:12,199 Speaker 2: in that mindset or I have found, is that it 342 00:17:12,320 --> 00:17:14,359 Speaker 2: is so hard to get out of it. And once 343 00:17:14,400 --> 00:17:17,960 Speaker 2: you spiral it might start in one element of your 344 00:17:18,440 --> 00:17:21,359 Speaker 2: work or your job, it will spread into every element 345 00:17:21,400 --> 00:17:23,520 Speaker 2: of your life unless you and your work, and then 346 00:17:23,560 --> 00:17:26,679 Speaker 2: it will start to spread out psyche cancer unless you 347 00:17:26,840 --> 00:17:28,919 Speaker 2: take control of it. And so for me, I know 348 00:17:29,040 --> 00:17:30,560 Speaker 2: that if I have all of my eggs in the 349 00:17:30,560 --> 00:17:32,639 Speaker 2: basket of work and I work every single day and 350 00:17:32,640 --> 00:17:35,520 Speaker 2: don't take any breaks, that's kind of where I will 351 00:17:35,560 --> 00:17:38,600 Speaker 2: be end up. And that's not the best thing for me, 352 00:17:38,960 --> 00:17:42,440 Speaker 2: for the company, for anyone that I work with, because sometimes, 353 00:17:42,480 --> 00:17:44,800 Speaker 2: like you know, back, this has not happened for a 354 00:17:44,840 --> 00:17:46,879 Speaker 2: long time, but I've had spirals that have lasted like 355 00:17:47,000 --> 00:17:50,240 Speaker 2: six seven months, and that is so much time to 356 00:17:50,320 --> 00:17:52,720 Speaker 2: lose because when you don't believe in yourself and you're 357 00:17:52,720 --> 00:17:55,680 Speaker 2: trying to move a company forward, it's very, very, very difficult. 358 00:17:56,320 --> 00:17:58,119 Speaker 2: And so that's been one of the biggest things. And 359 00:17:58,160 --> 00:18:00,760 Speaker 2: then the other thing is is understand So having things 360 00:18:00,800 --> 00:18:04,560 Speaker 2: outside of work is very important, but then understanding as well. 361 00:18:05,080 --> 00:18:08,399 Speaker 2: If I push push, push, I'm not going to be 362 00:18:08,400 --> 00:18:10,200 Speaker 2: able to show up as my best self the next day. 363 00:18:10,800 --> 00:18:13,080 Speaker 2: My brain doesn't work as well. I get brain fog. 364 00:18:13,160 --> 00:18:15,400 Speaker 2: I find it really hard to focus on deep work. 365 00:18:15,400 --> 00:18:17,359 Speaker 2: I find it really hard to actually step back and 366 00:18:17,400 --> 00:18:20,680 Speaker 2: actually work out what am I working on that's impactful, 367 00:18:20,880 --> 00:18:23,399 Speaker 2: because you get so stuck in the weeds and just 368 00:18:23,520 --> 00:18:26,320 Speaker 2: on this kind of wheel of got to keep going, 369 00:18:26,359 --> 00:18:28,560 Speaker 2: got to keep going, and then you're actually again not 370 00:18:28,720 --> 00:18:32,920 Speaker 2: making impact. That's what's important, right, and so it's stepping 371 00:18:33,000 --> 00:18:35,240 Speaker 2: back and being able to do that. But it's definitely 372 00:18:35,240 --> 00:18:38,480 Speaker 2: something like, as I say this, I don't always get 373 00:18:38,520 --> 00:18:38,880 Speaker 2: it right. 374 00:18:39,880 --> 00:18:44,080 Speaker 1: When you recognize that you're in a spiral. What has 375 00:18:44,160 --> 00:18:47,560 Speaker 1: worked for you in the past in terms of breaking 376 00:18:47,600 --> 00:18:50,520 Speaker 1: out of that, either quickly or slowly. 377 00:18:50,480 --> 00:18:53,119 Speaker 2: I think it's understanding shame has been one of the 378 00:18:53,119 --> 00:18:56,040 Speaker 2: biggest things Brene Brown. I reference her so much. She's 379 00:18:56,080 --> 00:18:58,320 Speaker 2: just incredible. Her work is for me personally, has made 380 00:18:58,320 --> 00:19:00,960 Speaker 2: such an impact. She has a book. It's got a 381 00:19:00,960 --> 00:19:03,840 Speaker 2: red cover. It's essentially all about different emotions and the 382 00:19:03,920 --> 00:19:06,639 Speaker 2: definitions Atlas of the heart, so you know all of them. 383 00:19:06,720 --> 00:19:10,520 Speaker 2: Amazing at of that. I highly recommend that book to 384 00:19:10,600 --> 00:19:15,280 Speaker 2: anyone that's listening because the way she defines and kind 385 00:19:15,320 --> 00:19:19,199 Speaker 2: of speaks through shame really help me understand what it is. 386 00:19:19,240 --> 00:19:21,240 Speaker 2: And I think when you understand what it is, it 387 00:19:21,320 --> 00:19:25,439 Speaker 2: is easier to call it out when it's happening. And 388 00:19:25,480 --> 00:19:27,359 Speaker 2: so what I sometimes I don't do this, but what 389 00:19:27,400 --> 00:19:29,159 Speaker 2: I try to do and what I find really works 390 00:19:29,240 --> 00:19:33,399 Speaker 2: is trying to step out from the situation and separate 391 00:19:33,760 --> 00:19:35,960 Speaker 2: from myself, like the way I'm talking to myself that 392 00:19:35,960 --> 00:19:38,359 Speaker 2: I'm not good enough, because I know how it feels. 393 00:19:38,400 --> 00:19:40,080 Speaker 2: And when I start feeling that way, I'm like, Okay, 394 00:19:40,160 --> 00:19:41,760 Speaker 2: hang on, I need to look like what's going on 395 00:19:41,800 --> 00:19:43,800 Speaker 2: in my brain, what's going on in my mind? And 396 00:19:43,840 --> 00:19:47,640 Speaker 2: I'm able to take those thoughts and almost like visualize 397 00:19:47,680 --> 00:19:51,560 Speaker 2: separating them from myself and then identifying that, Okay, I 398 00:19:51,640 --> 00:19:54,639 Speaker 2: have not all of a sudden lost my entire brain 399 00:19:54,720 --> 00:19:58,399 Speaker 2: capacity forgotten how to do my job and have just become, 400 00:19:58,720 --> 00:19:59,919 Speaker 2: you know, not be able to do anything that has 401 00:20:00,160 --> 00:20:02,399 Speaker 2: not happened. Now, while that's what I'm telling myself in 402 00:20:02,400 --> 00:20:05,719 Speaker 2: my head that has not happened, this is actually shame 403 00:20:05,960 --> 00:20:08,080 Speaker 2: and I need to get out of this, and then 404 00:20:08,160 --> 00:20:10,120 Speaker 2: I will reframe it away from you know, I am 405 00:20:10,119 --> 00:20:12,800 Speaker 2: not good enough to This didn't go the way that 406 00:20:12,840 --> 00:20:15,560 Speaker 2: I wanted. Here's my learnings. I'm going to move forward. 407 00:20:16,640 --> 00:20:19,320 Speaker 2: As I said, it's easier said than done, and sometimes 408 00:20:19,320 --> 00:20:21,119 Speaker 2: it does take a few days to be able to 409 00:20:21,200 --> 00:20:24,879 Speaker 2: kind of separate that. But it's coming back to focusing 410 00:20:24,880 --> 00:20:27,159 Speaker 2: on the present, because when you're doing that, you're just 411 00:20:27,200 --> 00:20:28,920 Speaker 2: caught up in you know, what's happened in the past, 412 00:20:28,960 --> 00:20:31,359 Speaker 2: and you're making stories up in your head, trying to 413 00:20:31,400 --> 00:20:33,560 Speaker 2: come back and cent to yourself and come back to 414 00:20:33,600 --> 00:20:37,760 Speaker 2: the present and taking those thoughts out from that and 415 00:20:37,840 --> 00:20:38,680 Speaker 2: working through them. 416 00:20:38,960 --> 00:20:40,960 Speaker 1: How do you know when you're in a spiral? Like 417 00:20:41,000 --> 00:20:42,679 Speaker 1: can you think of a time when I don't know 418 00:20:42,720 --> 00:20:45,119 Speaker 1: you were last in it, or when it was particularly 419 00:20:45,160 --> 00:20:46,119 Speaker 1: hard to get out of? 420 00:20:47,000 --> 00:20:49,520 Speaker 2: How do you know how it feels in my body? 421 00:20:49,640 --> 00:20:53,840 Speaker 2: I feel my chest is tight, I feel sad, and 422 00:20:53,880 --> 00:20:58,080 Speaker 2: I feel like really demotivated and maybe not depressed per se, 423 00:20:58,119 --> 00:21:01,359 Speaker 2: but just really down. And I know that that's not 424 00:21:01,400 --> 00:21:04,560 Speaker 2: how I usually feel, Like our body tells us. We know, 425 00:21:04,680 --> 00:21:07,360 Speaker 2: like how you feel is everything, And that's something that 426 00:21:07,520 --> 00:21:10,159 Speaker 2: in terms of going back to the advice that Jennie 427 00:21:10,160 --> 00:21:11,840 Speaker 2: has shared for me and what I've learned the most 428 00:21:11,880 --> 00:21:13,679 Speaker 2: from her, like that's one of the biggest things, is 429 00:21:13,680 --> 00:21:15,760 Speaker 2: going back to how do you feel? Like it's one 430 00:21:15,800 --> 00:21:19,080 Speaker 2: of the questions that comes up out of almost anything 431 00:21:19,359 --> 00:21:21,920 Speaker 2: that you're kind of working through, and so I know 432 00:21:21,960 --> 00:21:25,280 Speaker 2: what that feeling is and I can identify that, and 433 00:21:25,280 --> 00:21:27,160 Speaker 2: then it's yet working out how to get out of it. 434 00:21:27,200 --> 00:21:30,560 Speaker 1: You spoke about not having all the balls in the 435 00:21:30,600 --> 00:21:34,280 Speaker 1: one basket, in the work basket. What actions do you 436 00:21:34,320 --> 00:21:36,919 Speaker 1: take where you feel like it is leaning that way, Like, 437 00:21:37,160 --> 00:21:39,199 Speaker 1: what are the steps that you've taken in the past 438 00:21:39,440 --> 00:21:43,399 Speaker 1: to be more balanced and I guess reduce the chance 439 00:21:43,440 --> 00:21:46,119 Speaker 1: of burnout and being in one of these virals. 440 00:21:46,320 --> 00:21:48,240 Speaker 2: At first, it's acknowledging that all of my eggs are 441 00:21:48,280 --> 00:21:50,760 Speaker 2: in the work basket, which I mean again, for anyone listening, 442 00:21:50,760 --> 00:21:53,280 Speaker 2: it's pretty hard to do that, and especially when sometimes 443 00:21:53,280 --> 00:21:55,560 Speaker 2: I think we get in this almost marta mindset of 444 00:21:55,760 --> 00:21:57,679 Speaker 2: I have to all my eggs have to be in 445 00:21:57,680 --> 00:22:02,120 Speaker 2: this basket? Do they? Why are you just telling yourself 446 00:22:02,119 --> 00:22:04,720 Speaker 2: that probably that's usually what the answer is, but I 447 00:22:04,720 --> 00:22:07,480 Speaker 2: think will have to do this, well, why do you? 448 00:22:07,520 --> 00:22:10,239 Speaker 2: Probably not, You're just in this spiral, And so I 449 00:22:10,320 --> 00:22:12,240 Speaker 2: kind of step back and I look at, Okay, what 450 00:22:12,440 --> 00:22:14,560 Speaker 2: And especially for me as well, like one of my 451 00:22:15,040 --> 00:22:19,240 Speaker 2: kind of hobbies per se is running, but running is 452 00:22:19,600 --> 00:22:22,640 Speaker 2: also a big part of my work and making content, 453 00:22:22,760 --> 00:22:24,720 Speaker 2: and so I've had to also be quite honest with 454 00:22:24,760 --> 00:22:26,800 Speaker 2: myself because sometimes I'm like, oh, no, I've got my running, 455 00:22:27,040 --> 00:22:29,639 Speaker 2: but it's like, well, no, running is also technically a 456 00:22:29,680 --> 00:22:31,960 Speaker 2: part of my work, because you know, we've got the 457 00:22:32,200 --> 00:22:34,760 Speaker 2: Kick Growing program and Kick and all the content that 458 00:22:34,840 --> 00:22:37,080 Speaker 2: I create out of that. So I step back and 459 00:22:37,119 --> 00:22:38,919 Speaker 2: I think, Okay, well what am I doing outside of 460 00:22:38,960 --> 00:22:41,040 Speaker 2: work to fill my cut back up? And one of 461 00:22:41,080 --> 00:22:44,160 Speaker 2: the things I often find will kind of go off 462 00:22:44,440 --> 00:22:45,879 Speaker 2: and I don't know if this is the same for you, 463 00:22:45,920 --> 00:22:48,639 Speaker 2: that I will kind of first just put in the 464 00:22:48,640 --> 00:22:51,240 Speaker 2: bin per se is social time, because I think I 465 00:22:51,280 --> 00:22:54,840 Speaker 2: don't have time to do that. And you also, sometimes 466 00:22:54,880 --> 00:22:58,359 Speaker 2: when you feel exhausted, maybe because of work or whatever, 467 00:22:58,400 --> 00:22:59,960 Speaker 2: it might be the last thing you want to do 468 00:23:00,160 --> 00:23:02,040 Speaker 2: is go out for dinner or go and speak to 469 00:23:02,080 --> 00:23:04,040 Speaker 2: more people because you just want to be by yourself. 470 00:23:04,359 --> 00:23:06,679 Speaker 2: But you actually need to get out and do that. 471 00:23:06,880 --> 00:23:10,000 Speaker 2: And for me, it's been really really acknowledging that that 472 00:23:10,160 --> 00:23:13,639 Speaker 2: social time that fills my cup like that is recharging, 473 00:23:13,680 --> 00:23:17,879 Speaker 2: even though it's with people and solo time is very important, 474 00:23:17,920 --> 00:23:20,119 Speaker 2: but connection is also a way to fill like up 475 00:23:20,119 --> 00:23:22,000 Speaker 2: that sometimes I think when we get caught up in 476 00:23:22,000 --> 00:23:24,040 Speaker 2: our own heads, we just put it off and cancel 477 00:23:24,040 --> 00:23:26,119 Speaker 2: it because we don't think that we can show up. 478 00:23:26,160 --> 00:23:29,600 Speaker 2: But that's actually what helps well for me recharge my batteries. 479 00:23:29,640 --> 00:23:31,320 Speaker 2: So it's looking at, Okay, what am I doing, and 480 00:23:31,359 --> 00:23:33,080 Speaker 2: it's what am I spending time on? 481 00:23:33,160 --> 00:23:33,240 Speaker 1: It. 482 00:23:33,359 --> 00:23:35,600 Speaker 2: Something that I always love to think about when it 483 00:23:35,640 --> 00:23:37,879 Speaker 2: comes to hobbies or just things that can take my 484 00:23:37,960 --> 00:23:42,119 Speaker 2: mind off just the grind of the day, is what 485 00:23:42,240 --> 00:23:44,480 Speaker 2: have I done lately? Where I didn't look at the time, 486 00:23:44,840 --> 00:23:48,840 Speaker 2: and time just passed by and I didn't even realize, 487 00:23:48,840 --> 00:23:50,320 Speaker 2: and I wasn't thinking about like, oh I need to 488 00:23:50,320 --> 00:23:52,320 Speaker 2: be productive after this, or you know, I'm only going 489 00:23:52,359 --> 00:23:54,320 Speaker 2: to do this for an hour. I didn't even notice 490 00:23:54,520 --> 00:23:56,920 Speaker 2: and the day passed. I mean, I don't do a 491 00:23:56,960 --> 00:23:59,080 Speaker 2: lot of it, but when I've done pottery before, that's 492 00:23:59,119 --> 00:24:01,879 Speaker 2: something that happens. When I spend time with kids, like often, 493 00:24:01,920 --> 00:24:06,480 Speaker 2: that's also what happens painting and reading, and so I 494 00:24:06,520 --> 00:24:09,040 Speaker 2: try to get those things back in my life. But 495 00:24:09,240 --> 00:24:12,240 Speaker 2: it's important to acknowledge as well that sometimes there are 496 00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:15,880 Speaker 2: periods where work will take a lot from you. And 497 00:24:15,920 --> 00:24:18,440 Speaker 2: it's accepting that and honoring that, because I think when 498 00:24:18,440 --> 00:24:20,600 Speaker 2: we try and fight it, it can just make it worse. 499 00:24:21,119 --> 00:24:23,199 Speaker 2: But just trying to make sure we're really honest with 500 00:24:23,280 --> 00:24:25,280 Speaker 2: ourselves if we say I don't have time to do 501 00:24:25,320 --> 00:24:29,480 Speaker 2: anything for myself. It's really asking like why and if 502 00:24:29,480 --> 00:24:33,320 Speaker 2: you can trying to do something, otherwise you won't show 503 00:24:33,440 --> 00:24:35,920 Speaker 2: up one hundred percent when you get to work. Anyway, 504 00:24:36,040 --> 00:24:36,680 Speaker 2: we will. 505 00:24:36,480 --> 00:24:39,560 Speaker 1: Be back with Laura soon, and when we return, Laura 506 00:24:39,680 --> 00:24:43,160 Speaker 1: shares the rituals and habits that keep her from overloading 507 00:24:43,200 --> 00:24:46,679 Speaker 1: on work, why it's crucial to avoid responding from an 508 00:24:46,680 --> 00:24:50,120 Speaker 1: emotional state, and her top tip for starting the week 509 00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:57,400 Speaker 1: strong to ensure you actually get things done. If you're 510 00:24:57,480 --> 00:25:00,159 Speaker 1: looking for more tips to improve the way you I 511 00:25:00,200 --> 00:25:03,600 Speaker 1: can live. I write a short weekly newsletter that contains 512 00:25:03,640 --> 00:25:06,840 Speaker 1: tactics I've discovered that have helped me personally. You can 513 00:25:06,840 --> 00:25:10,760 Speaker 1: sign up for that at Amantha dot com. That's Amantha 514 00:25:11,160 --> 00:25:20,879 Speaker 1: dot com. I am curious as to how then you 515 00:25:20,960 --> 00:25:23,800 Speaker 1: stay disciplined with making sure that you do have time 516 00:25:23,920 --> 00:25:29,199 Speaker 1: for these other non work activities, because I think you know, 517 00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:31,880 Speaker 1: and I say this as someone who I think could 518 00:25:31,880 --> 00:25:34,280 Speaker 1: do with working less hours. It's kind of it's easy 519 00:25:34,280 --> 00:25:36,120 Speaker 1: to say and it's easy to know, but then it's 520 00:25:36,160 --> 00:25:38,399 Speaker 1: hard to do. And so I can share with you 521 00:25:38,440 --> 00:25:40,480 Speaker 1: something that I have found quite useful because I agree 522 00:25:40,480 --> 00:25:44,080 Speaker 1: with social connection, it's such an energizer. And I've got 523 00:25:44,080 --> 00:25:46,240 Speaker 1: my family. I've got my beautiful daughter, a beautiful partner, 524 00:25:46,560 --> 00:25:49,840 Speaker 1: and they're amazing friends that are so important. I'm an only child, 525 00:25:49,840 --> 00:25:52,240 Speaker 1: and so my friends are like family. And I have 526 00:25:52,280 --> 00:25:55,119 Speaker 1: a little ritual that I generally do it on Mondays 527 00:25:55,160 --> 00:25:58,560 Speaker 1: where I will just send a bunch of messages to 528 00:25:58,640 --> 00:26:01,840 Speaker 1: my friends and get social catch ups in the diary. 529 00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:04,120 Speaker 1: And I know that if I've got at least one 530 00:26:04,200 --> 00:26:06,760 Speaker 1: or two friend catch ups that might be a walk, 531 00:26:06,840 --> 00:26:09,240 Speaker 1: or it might be a meal or something else, then 532 00:26:09,840 --> 00:26:14,320 Speaker 1: that's a good week. I'm feeling my social cup for you, Like, 533 00:26:14,359 --> 00:26:17,439 Speaker 1: do you have any rituals or kind of little hacks 534 00:26:17,480 --> 00:26:20,760 Speaker 1: like that that almost keep you honest away from just 535 00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:21,920 Speaker 1: overloading on work. 536 00:26:22,040 --> 00:26:24,439 Speaker 2: Oh, that's such a good thing to do, especially at 537 00:26:24,440 --> 00:26:25,720 Speaker 2: the start of the week. I think for me, it's 538 00:26:25,840 --> 00:26:28,400 Speaker 2: scheduling in at the start of the week. Like that's 539 00:26:28,440 --> 00:26:30,600 Speaker 2: the biggest hack that we can do for ourselves, because 540 00:26:30,720 --> 00:26:33,160 Speaker 2: if you don't, you never set yourself up for success, 541 00:26:33,200 --> 00:26:36,399 Speaker 2: because then you don't have any boundaries kind of in 542 00:26:36,440 --> 00:26:39,040 Speaker 2: your day. You haven't set your routine up, and then 543 00:26:39,080 --> 00:26:41,160 Speaker 2: you will every time. I mean, it's the same thing 544 00:26:41,160 --> 00:26:45,040 Speaker 2: with moving your body right. If you don't prepare, if 545 00:26:45,080 --> 00:26:46,919 Speaker 2: you wake up in the morning and you don't know 546 00:26:46,920 --> 00:26:49,159 Speaker 2: what workout you're going to do, you haven't got your 547 00:26:49,200 --> 00:26:52,600 Speaker 2: clothes out, you haven't really allowed yourself enough time, and 548 00:26:52,640 --> 00:26:54,840 Speaker 2: you haven't thought through it and planned. It is so 549 00:26:54,920 --> 00:26:57,320 Speaker 2: easy to be like, oh it's too hard, I'm just 550 00:26:57,359 --> 00:26:59,000 Speaker 2: going to keep sleeping, or I'm just going to hit 551 00:26:59,040 --> 00:27:01,119 Speaker 2: to work early, or whatever might be. And it's the 552 00:27:01,119 --> 00:27:04,760 Speaker 2: same thing right with everything with planning. So for me 553 00:27:05,080 --> 00:27:08,480 Speaker 2: with movement, it's making sure I've worked out where that's 554 00:27:08,520 --> 00:27:10,880 Speaker 2: going to fit in my week, because if I haven't 555 00:27:10,920 --> 00:27:13,159 Speaker 2: the week, we'll just override it. And doing that at 556 00:27:13,160 --> 00:27:15,000 Speaker 2: the start of the week. And then also the social thing. 557 00:27:15,040 --> 00:27:17,479 Speaker 2: I try and make sure I have one kind of 558 00:27:17,520 --> 00:27:20,040 Speaker 2: social connection thing during the week and then one on 559 00:27:20,080 --> 00:27:23,560 Speaker 2: the weekend as well. And it's making the effort to 560 00:27:23,560 --> 00:27:27,120 Speaker 2: put that in right and sometimes I know and I can. Again, 561 00:27:27,160 --> 00:27:28,639 Speaker 2: it comes back to how I feel in my body, 562 00:27:28,680 --> 00:27:31,680 Speaker 2: Like when I start feeling down and tired and that 563 00:27:32,119 --> 00:27:34,280 Speaker 2: feeling like close to burnout, I look at a hang on. 564 00:27:34,440 --> 00:27:36,480 Speaker 2: If I look back at the past month or whatever, 565 00:27:36,560 --> 00:27:39,040 Speaker 2: I haven't done the things that I know can help 566 00:27:39,119 --> 00:27:41,840 Speaker 2: me work through this, so I don't always do it, 567 00:27:41,880 --> 00:27:43,120 Speaker 2: but that's a really good hack. 568 00:27:43,359 --> 00:27:45,119 Speaker 1: I want to pick up on what you said before 569 00:27:45,240 --> 00:27:48,359 Speaker 1: about Sydney, where you have to go to Sydney. No, 570 00:27:48,480 --> 00:27:50,560 Speaker 1: you get to go to Sydney. Tell me about that. 571 00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:55,160 Speaker 2: Oh, I mean that's perspective? Is everything right? And I 572 00:27:55,200 --> 00:27:58,719 Speaker 2: think when we get caught up in the busyness of 573 00:27:58,800 --> 00:28:01,120 Speaker 2: like how many times do you ask someone how they're 574 00:28:01,119 --> 00:28:04,159 Speaker 2: going and they say busy? And I really try not 575 00:28:04,480 --> 00:28:08,840 Speaker 2: to do that because I like focusing on perspective and 576 00:28:08,880 --> 00:28:12,840 Speaker 2: then coming back to gratitude. When I focus on gratitude, 577 00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:15,800 Speaker 2: I'm able to be so much more present, and I'm 578 00:28:15,880 --> 00:28:19,119 Speaker 2: just able to show up in such a better way 579 00:28:19,560 --> 00:28:21,719 Speaker 2: than I do when I think, you know, the world 580 00:28:21,840 --> 00:28:24,520 Speaker 2: is happening to me instead of being like, no, I'm 581 00:28:24,560 --> 00:28:26,639 Speaker 2: happening to the world. Like we're in control of a 582 00:28:26,680 --> 00:28:29,959 Speaker 2: lot more than we think, and so so often we think, oh, 583 00:28:29,960 --> 00:28:31,399 Speaker 2: I have to go to this meeting, I have to 584 00:28:31,400 --> 00:28:34,040 Speaker 2: go to work today, I have to go to Sydney, 585 00:28:34,240 --> 00:28:36,679 Speaker 2: And it's reframing that to no, I get to go 586 00:28:36,720 --> 00:28:39,880 Speaker 2: to Sydney. And yes, you know, flying in and out 587 00:28:39,920 --> 00:28:42,440 Speaker 2: in a day might be tiring, but what an amazing 588 00:28:42,520 --> 00:28:44,920 Speaker 2: opportunity to be able to go and do whatever I'm 589 00:28:44,920 --> 00:28:47,400 Speaker 2: doing there, and then I think, Okay, well, it's pretty 590 00:28:47,400 --> 00:28:50,600 Speaker 2: awesome that someone you know cares about me enough to 591 00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:52,960 Speaker 2: want me to go to Sydney and meet them, Because 592 00:28:53,000 --> 00:28:55,680 Speaker 2: then when I go, I'm not going in this headspace 593 00:28:55,720 --> 00:28:58,920 Speaker 2: of I don't want to be here, I'm exhausted, I'm tired, 594 00:28:59,120 --> 00:29:01,040 Speaker 2: because that's going to pack the entire day. I'm going 595 00:29:01,040 --> 00:29:02,800 Speaker 2: to have a horrible experience one million percent. 596 00:29:02,920 --> 00:29:05,880 Speaker 1: I want to ask you about something you You wrote 597 00:29:05,920 --> 00:29:09,000 Speaker 1: this really great post on LinkedIn, which I think it 598 00:29:09,040 --> 00:29:11,640 Speaker 1: was something like ten things I now know to be 599 00:29:11,680 --> 00:29:14,480 Speaker 1: true as a CEO, something like that. I'm paraphrasing, and 600 00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:17,080 Speaker 1: one of the things you wrote, I'll read it out 601 00:29:17,200 --> 00:29:19,760 Speaker 1: because I really loved it, and I'm curious as to 602 00:29:19,800 --> 00:29:22,600 Speaker 1: how how you apply this day to day. You said, 603 00:29:22,720 --> 00:29:25,160 Speaker 1: responding in an emotional state is never a good idea. 604 00:29:25,360 --> 00:29:27,720 Speaker 1: Always take a moment, a few minutes, an hour a day, 605 00:29:27,720 --> 00:29:29,760 Speaker 1: depending on how you feel and the response within your body, 606 00:29:29,840 --> 00:29:32,240 Speaker 1: before you respond, Wait until you can get into a 607 00:29:32,280 --> 00:29:36,080 Speaker 1: win win mindset instead of you versus the other person mindset. 608 00:29:36,440 --> 00:29:38,120 Speaker 1: Can you tell me about that? How did you learn 609 00:29:38,160 --> 00:29:38,640 Speaker 1: that lesson. 610 00:29:38,880 --> 00:29:41,680 Speaker 2: Oh, I mean, I've learned it many, many, many times. 611 00:29:42,680 --> 00:29:46,640 Speaker 2: I think when things happen, it might be that I 612 00:29:46,680 --> 00:29:48,600 Speaker 2: don't know, someone responded to something in a way that 613 00:29:48,640 --> 00:29:52,240 Speaker 2: you didn't feel was fair, or you're in a negotiation 614 00:29:52,720 --> 00:29:55,200 Speaker 2: and it's not feeling whatever it might be, usually because 615 00:29:55,200 --> 00:29:57,320 Speaker 2: it feels unfair, right, That's why we respond in that way, 616 00:29:57,640 --> 00:30:01,200 Speaker 2: and the first response, like our automatic res is, oh, 617 00:30:01,320 --> 00:30:03,440 Speaker 2: I need to tell them, like why they've made me 618 00:30:03,480 --> 00:30:06,640 Speaker 2: feel this way and why they're wrong and etc. There 619 00:30:06,720 --> 00:30:09,200 Speaker 2: is no way, like in the art of negotiation or 620 00:30:09,240 --> 00:30:11,800 Speaker 2: just generally approaching a conversation that if you approach a 621 00:30:11,800 --> 00:30:14,000 Speaker 2: conversation like that, you were going to get a good 622 00:30:14,040 --> 00:30:17,280 Speaker 2: outcome because you're going in wanting to I suppose you're 623 00:30:17,320 --> 00:30:19,440 Speaker 2: not really wanting to attack the other person, but that's 624 00:30:19,520 --> 00:30:22,640 Speaker 2: kind of how you're approaching it, because what you really 625 00:30:22,640 --> 00:30:24,760 Speaker 2: want if you step back, and it always comes back 626 00:30:24,760 --> 00:30:26,440 Speaker 2: to this, which is again in the moment. And that's 627 00:30:26,480 --> 00:30:27,959 Speaker 2: why I kind of said if it takes admitted an 628 00:30:28,000 --> 00:30:31,160 Speaker 2: hour a day, because sometimes things will trigger us into 629 00:30:31,200 --> 00:30:36,360 Speaker 2: a really intense emotional response, never ever, ever ever respond 630 00:30:36,640 --> 00:30:39,440 Speaker 2: in that time. It's I don't know any time in 631 00:30:39,480 --> 00:30:41,600 Speaker 2: my life when I've responded in that while I'm in 632 00:30:41,640 --> 00:30:45,320 Speaker 2: that feeling that it's been a good outcome, or if 633 00:30:45,320 --> 00:30:47,440 Speaker 2: we have got a good outcome, it's just taken so 634 00:30:47,720 --> 00:30:53,440 Speaker 2: long to get there. So step out and think, Okay, yes, 635 00:30:53,680 --> 00:30:57,240 Speaker 2: this person has really maybe it's a contract negotiation, they've 636 00:30:57,280 --> 00:30:59,600 Speaker 2: sent things through that have really offended you, like they 637 00:30:59,600 --> 00:31:02,600 Speaker 2: don't see my value, I'm being taken advantage of, etc. 638 00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:03,040 Speaker 1: Etc. 639 00:31:03,760 --> 00:31:06,000 Speaker 2: So it's stepping back and being like, Okay, they have 640 00:31:06,360 --> 00:31:08,640 Speaker 2: responded in that way, so how I would have responded 641 00:31:08,680 --> 00:31:10,640 Speaker 2: like that's but I'm not going to take it personally. 642 00:31:11,160 --> 00:31:13,560 Speaker 2: I'm going to come back to what do I want 643 00:31:13,600 --> 00:31:15,920 Speaker 2: to get out of this and what do they want 644 00:31:15,920 --> 00:31:17,640 Speaker 2: to get out of it? And how can I respond 645 00:31:17,640 --> 00:31:20,480 Speaker 2: in a way to bring us closer to that outcome? 646 00:31:20,960 --> 00:31:23,080 Speaker 2: That will often help the other person to bring down 647 00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:24,920 Speaker 2: their guard, because if you go in with your guard 648 00:31:24,960 --> 00:31:27,280 Speaker 2: and you're in this attack mode, they are going to 649 00:31:27,560 --> 00:31:30,360 Speaker 2: straight get on the defense and negotiating with anyone or 650 00:31:30,360 --> 00:31:32,880 Speaker 2: having a conversation when someone is defensive is I mean, 651 00:31:32,920 --> 00:31:36,200 Speaker 2: we've all been in those situations. It's really difficult. Is 652 00:31:36,560 --> 00:31:38,560 Speaker 2: very very rare you will get anywhere. 653 00:31:38,240 --> 00:31:41,640 Speaker 1: Right how do you, I guess, almost take yourself down 654 00:31:41,680 --> 00:31:44,479 Speaker 1: off that cliff's edge when you're feeling like that to 655 00:31:44,480 --> 00:31:46,880 Speaker 1: calm yourself down, whether it's over a period of hours 656 00:31:47,000 --> 00:31:48,240 Speaker 1: or a day or more. 657 00:31:48,280 --> 00:31:50,800 Speaker 2: I let myself feel the feelings. I think that's really important. 658 00:31:50,880 --> 00:31:53,520 Speaker 2: I think often we feel or we're told that we 659 00:31:53,640 --> 00:31:56,440 Speaker 2: have to. You know, we can't get upset, we can't 660 00:31:56,440 --> 00:31:59,680 Speaker 2: feel angry, they're fine. Like, you have to honor your emotions, 661 00:31:59,680 --> 00:32:02,959 Speaker 2: and when something triggers you, it's just a I suppose, 662 00:32:03,000 --> 00:32:07,400 Speaker 2: indication of something you really care about about yourself. So 663 00:32:07,520 --> 00:32:11,000 Speaker 2: I let myself feel the emotion, and depending on how 664 00:32:11,040 --> 00:32:13,040 Speaker 2: hard I'm feeling it, then I just I know if 665 00:32:13,080 --> 00:32:15,040 Speaker 2: I'm still like, if I'm still feeling that for a 666 00:32:15,080 --> 00:32:16,880 Speaker 2: long time, I know that I have to wait a 667 00:32:16,880 --> 00:32:19,600 Speaker 2: little bit longer. Usually I find a good night's sleep 668 00:32:20,160 --> 00:32:22,960 Speaker 2: will help me get out of that emotional state most 669 00:32:22,960 --> 00:32:26,440 Speaker 2: of the time, but I wait until I don't feel 670 00:32:26,760 --> 00:32:29,640 Speaker 2: super super triggered and I suppose attacked by it and 671 00:32:29,680 --> 00:32:31,800 Speaker 2: emotional about I let those emotions, I honor them, I 672 00:32:31,880 --> 00:32:33,600 Speaker 2: let them pass there. Of course, there are times when 673 00:32:33,640 --> 00:32:35,560 Speaker 2: it doesn't pass, and that's when I actually be like, okay, 674 00:32:35,560 --> 00:32:37,680 Speaker 2: we need to move forward, like coming back to again, 675 00:32:38,040 --> 00:32:40,880 Speaker 2: what is the outcome that they want? Like what's the 676 00:32:40,880 --> 00:32:43,480 Speaker 2: best outcome for them, what's the best outcome for me? 677 00:32:43,680 --> 00:32:47,200 Speaker 2: Like a win win mindset, and then like applying it 678 00:32:47,240 --> 00:32:49,239 Speaker 2: to that, and it is it's talking to people about it. 679 00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:51,680 Speaker 2: Talking it through always helps because I think sometimes we 680 00:32:51,720 --> 00:32:53,800 Speaker 2: can get in our head and we start making up 681 00:32:53,840 --> 00:32:57,160 Speaker 2: all of these assumptions and all of these stories. You know, 682 00:32:57,520 --> 00:32:59,880 Speaker 2: we always say, like the truth is there's one person 683 00:33:00,280 --> 00:33:02,120 Speaker 2: the other person's side, and then there's the truth right, 684 00:33:02,160 --> 00:33:04,840 Speaker 2: and sometimes too, what might happen? They might have triggered 685 00:33:04,880 --> 00:33:07,479 Speaker 2: something in you, and then you will then make up 686 00:33:07,480 --> 00:33:10,600 Speaker 2: this entire thing in your head that makes you really 687 00:33:10,640 --> 00:33:13,160 Speaker 2: angry and it keeps that emotion. But none of that 688 00:33:13,240 --> 00:33:15,800 Speaker 2: has happened. It's all made up in your head based 689 00:33:15,840 --> 00:33:18,280 Speaker 2: on how you think that personal responder or assumptions, etc. 690 00:33:18,880 --> 00:33:21,680 Speaker 2: So it's just being able to realize that if that's 691 00:33:21,760 --> 00:33:26,120 Speaker 2: lasting longer, what that is, step out of yourself and 692 00:33:26,160 --> 00:33:28,800 Speaker 2: then work through what am I trying to get out 693 00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:30,080 Speaker 2: of this? And what do they want? But it is, 694 00:33:30,160 --> 00:33:31,920 Speaker 2: as I said, it is much harder said than. 695 00:33:31,840 --> 00:33:36,080 Speaker 1: Done, isn't it. I want to finish with asking I 696 00:33:36,120 --> 00:33:38,240 Speaker 1: feel like you're the sort of person you know, given 697 00:33:38,280 --> 00:33:40,960 Speaker 1: how well well read you are and how thoughtful you are, 698 00:33:41,040 --> 00:33:45,680 Speaker 1: that you know perhaps has different mantras or sayings or 699 00:33:45,720 --> 00:33:48,600 Speaker 1: ways of being that perhaps a friend of mine at 700 00:33:48,600 --> 00:33:51,600 Speaker 1: different times in your life. I'd love to know right 701 00:33:51,640 --> 00:33:55,160 Speaker 1: now what is a mantra or a quote or something 702 00:33:55,360 --> 00:33:57,960 Speaker 1: like that that is serving you particularly well right now. 703 00:33:58,400 --> 00:34:01,480 Speaker 2: Oh, that's such a good thing. I think for me, 704 00:34:02,080 --> 00:34:04,560 Speaker 2: I'm still working through, as I said, like working on 705 00:34:04,640 --> 00:34:09,000 Speaker 2: confidence and removing self doubt is still something that I'm 706 00:34:09,040 --> 00:34:12,640 Speaker 2: working on. It's a journey. So the thing that right 707 00:34:12,640 --> 00:34:14,480 Speaker 2: now did I always come back to is that I 708 00:34:14,520 --> 00:34:18,000 Speaker 2: am good enough and I'm safe and that really helps me, 709 00:34:18,120 --> 00:34:21,920 Speaker 2: especially that I am safe part because I think I 710 00:34:21,920 --> 00:34:23,680 Speaker 2: don't know what it is, but it just makes me 711 00:34:23,760 --> 00:34:26,440 Speaker 2: feel calm when I say it and I believe it, 712 00:34:26,480 --> 00:34:27,920 Speaker 2: which is you know what we want to do when 713 00:34:27,960 --> 00:34:28,680 Speaker 2: we have a mantra. 714 00:34:28,880 --> 00:34:32,680 Speaker 1: Definitely, Laura, It's made such a joy having you on. 715 00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:36,440 Speaker 1: Thank you so much for sharing this last hour with me. 716 00:34:36,760 --> 00:34:38,759 Speaker 2: Thank you, thank you so much for having me. 717 00:34:39,960 --> 00:34:42,200 Speaker 1: I hope you love this chat with Laura as much 718 00:34:42,280 --> 00:34:45,680 Speaker 1: as I did. And I know some of it really 719 00:34:45,760 --> 00:34:49,520 Speaker 1: hit close to home, such as the need to be liked. 720 00:34:50,320 --> 00:34:52,880 Speaker 1: If you want to learn more about Laura, I highly 721 00:34:52,920 --> 00:34:57,480 Speaker 1: recommend checking out her podcast, Kickpod or the kick app. 722 00:34:57,600 --> 00:35:00,280 Speaker 1: I've put links to both of those in the show notes. 723 00:35:01,280 --> 00:35:04,000 Speaker 1: If you like today's show, make sure you get follow 724 00:35:04,160 --> 00:35:07,640 Speaker 1: on your podcast app to be alerted when new episodes drop. 725 00:35:08,200 --> 00:35:10,719 Speaker 1: How I Work was recorded on the traditional land of 726 00:35:10,719 --> 00:35:12,960 Speaker 1: the Warringery people, part of the Kulan nation.