1 00:00:00,760 --> 00:00:02,480 Speaker 1: What I found that Steph and I and this is 2 00:00:02,480 --> 00:00:05,560 Speaker 1: something we are always working through and it's made such 3 00:00:05,559 --> 00:00:06,000 Speaker 1: an impact. 4 00:00:06,040 --> 00:00:08,639 Speaker 2: Of that is the thing which stops you from sharing 5 00:00:08,680 --> 00:00:10,240 Speaker 2: how you're going, because if you're like, well, for share 6 00:00:10,240 --> 00:00:13,039 Speaker 2: how I'm going, then I can't be the peacekeeper here 7 00:00:13,440 --> 00:00:15,160 Speaker 2: and then it's all going to come tumbling down. 8 00:00:15,400 --> 00:00:18,160 Speaker 3: My value is my ability to keep the harmony as well. 9 00:00:18,320 --> 00:00:20,360 Speaker 3: I'm the up guy, and if I'm not being the 10 00:00:20,440 --> 00:00:22,160 Speaker 3: up guy, then I'm nothing. 11 00:00:22,480 --> 00:00:24,240 Speaker 1: I feel like, oh, I've got to help them. How 12 00:00:24,239 --> 00:00:26,480 Speaker 1: do I help them? Which obviously sometimes I can't? 13 00:00:26,520 --> 00:00:28,360 Speaker 3: So is that hard? If Steph comes in and maybe 14 00:00:28,400 --> 00:00:30,360 Speaker 3: if there's something going on with her and that she's 15 00:00:30,360 --> 00:00:31,160 Speaker 3: not in a good space. 16 00:00:31,320 --> 00:00:35,400 Speaker 1: Yes, we share ninety five percent of everything in our lives, 17 00:00:35,880 --> 00:00:38,600 Speaker 1: but then we don't share, or we weren't sharing the 18 00:00:38,720 --> 00:00:43,800 Speaker 1: five percent because we didn't want to hurt the other person. 19 00:00:44,120 --> 00:00:46,760 Speaker 3: By continuing to hold off, which is what we're doing, 20 00:00:46,800 --> 00:00:50,400 Speaker 3: we're keeping the boat afloat, but a leak has run. Yes, 21 00:00:50,400 --> 00:00:52,600 Speaker 3: so there is a small leak, but over time this 22 00:00:52,640 --> 00:00:53,360 Speaker 3: will think the boat. 23 00:00:53,800 --> 00:00:57,120 Speaker 1: For me, it's the fear of confrontation. In my childhood, 24 00:00:57,280 --> 00:01:00,240 Speaker 1: my parents fought a lot. I would like intercend to 25 00:01:00,280 --> 00:01:03,040 Speaker 1: make sure that something that could cause them to argue wouldn't, 26 00:01:03,360 --> 00:01:04,960 Speaker 1: so then we would have peace. 27 00:01:05,160 --> 00:01:07,000 Speaker 4: There would be no arguing confrontation. 28 00:01:07,520 --> 00:01:08,920 Speaker 3: I just hate it and I will avoid it at 29 00:01:08,920 --> 00:01:11,680 Speaker 3: all costs. I try to get better, but it's still 30 00:01:11,680 --> 00:01:13,200 Speaker 3: a real struggle for me. So I'm sure a lot 31 00:01:13,240 --> 00:01:15,679 Speaker 3: of people listening are exactly the same. Are there any 32 00:01:15,680 --> 00:01:18,080 Speaker 3: practical steps that you have taken to get better at that? 33 00:01:19,520 --> 00:01:22,440 Speaker 2: Sharing how you're going is one of the best things you. 34 00:01:22,400 --> 00:01:24,839 Speaker 3: Can do for your mental health, but when you most 35 00:01:24,840 --> 00:01:27,280 Speaker 3: need to tell someone how you're going, it's often the 36 00:01:27,360 --> 00:01:30,119 Speaker 3: hardest thing to do, and if you don't address how 37 00:01:30,120 --> 00:01:34,680 Speaker 3: you are, your feelings confesster and lead to things like anxiety, depression, 38 00:01:35,240 --> 00:01:38,720 Speaker 3: even suicide. In this podcast, we ask a range of 39 00:01:38,760 --> 00:01:42,039 Speaker 3: inspiring people how they express themselves in the hope that 40 00:01:42,080 --> 00:01:45,759 Speaker 3: we can all learn something more about arguably life's most 41 00:01:45,760 --> 00:01:46,800 Speaker 3: important skill. 42 00:01:46,920 --> 00:01:50,120 Speaker 2: To ask yourself, how am I feeling? How do I 43 00:01:50,160 --> 00:01:54,160 Speaker 2: express how I'm feeling? How do I share my mood? 44 00:01:56,040 --> 00:02:00,720 Speaker 2: All right, we've got Laura Henshaw here. Question that we 45 00:02:00,760 --> 00:02:04,720 Speaker 2: always ask is really how do you how do you 46 00:02:04,720 --> 00:02:08,040 Speaker 2: share your mood? How do you go about getting in 47 00:02:08,040 --> 00:02:09,760 Speaker 2: touch with how you're feeling, and then how do you 48 00:02:09,800 --> 00:02:10,720 Speaker 2: go about expressing that? 49 00:02:11,280 --> 00:02:14,600 Speaker 1: Oh, good, good question. How do I share my mood? 50 00:02:14,639 --> 00:02:18,000 Speaker 1: I think it depends on the day and also who 51 00:02:18,080 --> 00:02:20,760 Speaker 1: I'm around. So I am very lucky to be in 52 00:02:20,800 --> 00:02:25,200 Speaker 1: a similar relationship as you both a business And are 53 00:02:25,240 --> 00:02:27,440 Speaker 1: you best friends? Was that awkward to ask you? 54 00:02:28,280 --> 00:02:30,440 Speaker 3: Because it'd be weird if I said, now, oh, he's 55 00:02:30,440 --> 00:02:32,320 Speaker 3: in my top ten, and then it was like he's 56 00:02:32,360 --> 00:02:35,000 Speaker 3: my best friend, like that would be weird. But I'd say, 57 00:02:35,040 --> 00:02:36,880 Speaker 3: we're we've got to be up there with each other. 58 00:02:37,120 --> 00:02:37,799 Speaker 4: We rank each other. 59 00:02:38,000 --> 00:02:39,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, we've got to be in the top three in 60 00:02:39,320 --> 00:02:42,040 Speaker 2: each other's best friends. To say I think I have 61 00:02:42,639 --> 00:02:43,840 Speaker 2: I did to think about this the other day. 62 00:02:43,919 --> 00:02:45,239 Speaker 5: Can you do it separately? 63 00:02:45,280 --> 00:02:45,520 Speaker 6: Though? 64 00:02:45,880 --> 00:02:51,680 Speaker 2: What like save it on three? Is your best friend? 65 00:02:51,919 --> 00:02:52,160 Speaker 4: Yes? 66 00:02:52,600 --> 00:02:53,320 Speaker 2: Oh look at you. 67 00:02:54,680 --> 00:02:55,280 Speaker 6: She twitched. 68 00:02:56,000 --> 00:02:59,360 Speaker 2: You can't see it, but she twitched. No, but she 69 00:02:59,560 --> 00:03:04,119 Speaker 2: is okay? Is there no one else compared to play 70 00:03:04,480 --> 00:03:07,560 Speaker 2: that card game bullshit, which is like two sevens? Are 71 00:03:07,560 --> 00:03:09,040 Speaker 2: you sure you put two sevens down? 72 00:03:10,360 --> 00:03:15,040 Speaker 3: I would say, though that number one, Yeah, we get it. 73 00:03:15,040 --> 00:03:15,480 Speaker 6: You get it. 74 00:03:15,480 --> 00:03:17,000 Speaker 2: You're closer to your business partner. 75 00:03:16,760 --> 00:03:19,560 Speaker 3: And I would say my relationship with Will outside of 76 00:03:19,560 --> 00:03:21,040 Speaker 3: my relation to each other? What do you want to 77 00:03:21,000 --> 00:03:24,320 Speaker 3: do with my relationship with Will outside of my relationship 78 00:03:24,360 --> 00:03:27,600 Speaker 3: with my partner? Is the is the other relationship in 79 00:03:27,639 --> 00:03:29,600 Speaker 3: my life that I need to nurture and spend most 80 00:03:29,639 --> 00:03:32,080 Speaker 3: time with in my love comfortably. But the things that 81 00:03:32,120 --> 00:03:36,520 Speaker 3: we deal with sometimes feels like we are in a marriage. 82 00:03:36,600 --> 00:03:39,040 Speaker 3: It's true, and I think I don't experience that with 83 00:03:39,080 --> 00:03:41,960 Speaker 3: other friends. Yeah, just just because of how much of 84 00:03:41,960 --> 00:03:45,880 Speaker 3: our lives are crossed over. Yeah, as well, and I'm 85 00:03:45,880 --> 00:03:50,040 Speaker 3: sure for better and for worse, totally Italian marriage that's approved. 86 00:03:50,600 --> 00:03:51,520 Speaker 5: That was good. 87 00:03:51,800 --> 00:03:53,240 Speaker 3: Yeah, and I'm sure you would have the same. 88 00:03:54,320 --> 00:03:56,560 Speaker 2: We're doing the interview here, stop living them. 89 00:03:57,480 --> 00:03:57,920 Speaker 6: I know. 90 00:04:00,440 --> 00:04:06,080 Speaker 5: What Longbrook did, so I am no. Okay, So I 91 00:04:06,120 --> 00:04:07,680 Speaker 5: just derailed a very serious question. 92 00:04:08,200 --> 00:04:12,920 Speaker 2: That's fine. You can do as you like. Don't a second. 93 00:04:12,960 --> 00:04:16,479 Speaker 1: I want so in my business relationship and friendship where 94 00:04:16,480 --> 00:04:18,360 Speaker 1: we do, we are each other's number one. 95 00:04:18,680 --> 00:04:20,680 Speaker 2: You say you're lucky because you get a business partner 96 00:04:20,720 --> 00:04:24,920 Speaker 2: like stef Yes, and that's lucky because you you have 97 00:04:24,960 --> 00:04:27,440 Speaker 2: like a permanent channel. 98 00:04:27,040 --> 00:04:29,760 Speaker 1: Exactly to be open about how how I'm feeling. And 99 00:04:29,839 --> 00:04:32,839 Speaker 1: so I think for me, there's something that I feel 100 00:04:32,839 --> 00:04:35,479 Speaker 1: that it is within Steph and with Dobson. I'm very 101 00:04:35,520 --> 00:04:37,960 Speaker 1: open about my mood and how I'm feeling. 102 00:04:38,040 --> 00:04:40,200 Speaker 5: And if I am going through, you know, a. 103 00:04:40,200 --> 00:04:42,400 Speaker 1: Day that's shit, and like especially with like what you 104 00:04:42,400 --> 00:04:43,840 Speaker 1: guys do and you have to come and show up 105 00:04:43,839 --> 00:04:48,400 Speaker 1: on the microphone and be fun, it can be really difficult, 106 00:04:48,440 --> 00:04:51,080 Speaker 1: like right before that, if you just don't feel good 107 00:04:51,279 --> 00:04:54,040 Speaker 1: in yourself or whatever it might be. But I find 108 00:04:54,080 --> 00:04:56,040 Speaker 1: more generally than that. And maybe I don't know if 109 00:04:56,040 --> 00:04:57,680 Speaker 1: this is this is a good thing, but I do 110 00:04:57,760 --> 00:05:01,200 Speaker 1: find I if some is really bad, I can't do this. 111 00:05:01,320 --> 00:05:04,400 Speaker 1: But most of the time I try and show up 112 00:05:04,680 --> 00:05:06,599 Speaker 1: even if I'm not feeling one hundred percent. 113 00:05:06,720 --> 00:05:08,320 Speaker 5: Sometimes trying to show up. 114 00:05:09,000 --> 00:05:12,240 Speaker 1: In myself as kind of happy and everything and it's not. 115 00:05:12,279 --> 00:05:14,640 Speaker 1: Maybe it's faking it a little bit can then make 116 00:05:14,720 --> 00:05:15,920 Speaker 1: me feel happy. 117 00:05:17,120 --> 00:05:18,719 Speaker 5: In that moment as well. 118 00:05:18,720 --> 00:05:22,800 Speaker 1: But I find too, with me so long, exactly right, 119 00:05:23,279 --> 00:05:25,880 Speaker 1: exactly right. But I think too, I'm and this is 120 00:05:25,880 --> 00:05:27,560 Speaker 1: something that Steph and I speak about all the time. 121 00:05:27,640 --> 00:05:31,920 Speaker 1: I'm very impacted by people's energy and mood. So if 122 00:05:31,960 --> 00:05:34,680 Speaker 1: someone comes into our team and this is something I've 123 00:05:34,680 --> 00:05:36,640 Speaker 1: tried to work through, and not taking this energy on 124 00:05:36,720 --> 00:05:39,080 Speaker 1: it and it's like in a horrible mood and oh, 125 00:05:39,120 --> 00:05:42,640 Speaker 1: you know, obviously something's going on. I really struggle with that. 126 00:05:43,240 --> 00:05:44,840 Speaker 1: I feel like, oh, I've got to help them. 127 00:05:44,880 --> 00:05:47,239 Speaker 5: How do I help them? Which obviously sometimes I can't. 128 00:05:47,279 --> 00:05:49,240 Speaker 3: So is that hard if Steph comes in and clearly 129 00:05:49,279 --> 00:05:51,400 Speaker 3: maybe there's something going on with her and that she's 130 00:05:51,440 --> 00:05:52,200 Speaker 3: not in a good space. 131 00:05:52,360 --> 00:05:56,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, sometimes, but we always now we have tools in place, 132 00:05:56,240 --> 00:05:58,360 Speaker 1: and in the conversations that we've had with with both 133 00:05:58,400 --> 00:05:59,839 Speaker 1: of you, I think it's helped us so much as 134 00:05:59,839 --> 00:06:04,400 Speaker 1: well being more comfortable and having those conversations. And so 135 00:06:05,000 --> 00:06:06,919 Speaker 1: I think what it was you who said, do you 136 00:06:06,920 --> 00:06:08,360 Speaker 1: send a WhatsApp sometimes? 137 00:06:08,640 --> 00:06:11,560 Speaker 2: Yeah? Yeah, I do. Got a little message thread with 138 00:06:11,880 --> 00:06:14,240 Speaker 2: Woods and our EP captain Pooppens. 139 00:06:16,839 --> 00:06:19,000 Speaker 3: It's funny talking seriously and then dropping his name. 140 00:06:20,120 --> 00:06:23,040 Speaker 2: I get desensitized to the name over time and it's 141 00:06:23,120 --> 00:06:23,680 Speaker 2: quite funny. 142 00:06:23,800 --> 00:06:26,120 Speaker 5: Yeah. But yeah, that's so that was something that I 143 00:06:26,440 --> 00:06:27,880 Speaker 5: know you. 144 00:06:27,960 --> 00:06:30,240 Speaker 2: Fire off like a bit of a precursor, Yeah, just 145 00:06:30,240 --> 00:06:33,160 Speaker 2: going hey, if we need to yeah, yeah, yeah, And 146 00:06:33,600 --> 00:06:35,400 Speaker 2: I mean it's funny because I mean what he mentioned 147 00:06:35,440 --> 00:06:39,200 Speaker 2: the marriage thing before, and I think that your romantic 148 00:06:39,279 --> 00:06:45,320 Speaker 2: relationship is naturally fraught with all of these kind of like, uh, well, 149 00:06:45,320 --> 00:06:48,640 Speaker 2: you've got like desire and like obligation to each other 150 00:06:48,760 --> 00:06:52,680 Speaker 2: and all those things which can complicate a romantic relationship. 151 00:06:52,960 --> 00:06:55,440 Speaker 2: But kind of what's beautiful about the business partner friendship 152 00:06:55,480 --> 00:06:59,440 Speaker 2: relationship is you kind of take out love and sex effectively, 153 00:06:59,520 --> 00:07:01,760 Speaker 2: so you you don't really kind of have to get 154 00:07:01,760 --> 00:07:05,239 Speaker 2: into those ikey areas but complicate or kind of jade 155 00:07:05,279 --> 00:07:08,880 Speaker 2: your conversation. It's like we're talking about a friendship here purely, 156 00:07:09,360 --> 00:07:12,360 Speaker 2: and if that's not on the right rails, then we 157 00:07:12,440 --> 00:07:15,440 Speaker 2: both know that this is going to fall apart, and 158 00:07:15,480 --> 00:07:17,600 Speaker 2: it does really quickly as well, like if you're not 159 00:07:17,920 --> 00:07:20,000 Speaker 2: really honest with each other. It's funny, and I wanted 160 00:07:20,000 --> 00:07:21,080 Speaker 2: to bring of a story with you while that it 161 00:07:21,080 --> 00:07:22,480 Speaker 2: would bring up because he brought up with me, But 162 00:07:22,520 --> 00:07:23,600 Speaker 2: I'm throwing him under the bus. 163 00:07:24,320 --> 00:07:26,480 Speaker 3: If you feel comfortable, If you feel comfortable. I can't 164 00:07:26,520 --> 00:07:28,520 Speaker 3: remember whether we did this on the mics or off 165 00:07:28,560 --> 00:07:31,960 Speaker 3: the mics. After I came on the kickpod where you 166 00:07:32,040 --> 00:07:35,480 Speaker 3: talked about a holiday that you and are you okay 167 00:07:35,480 --> 00:07:36,000 Speaker 3: to talk about it? 168 00:07:36,080 --> 00:07:36,200 Speaker 6: Yes? 169 00:07:36,840 --> 00:07:38,520 Speaker 3: So you and Stefan on a holiday with both your 170 00:07:38,560 --> 00:07:42,200 Speaker 3: respective partners, and there was obviously just a little bit 171 00:07:42,240 --> 00:07:44,400 Speaker 3: of tension going on, which which again Will and I 172 00:07:44,440 --> 00:07:47,120 Speaker 3: can absolutely relate to that. It can the fact that 173 00:07:47,160 --> 00:07:49,520 Speaker 3: we literally spend every single second together. Of course there's 174 00:07:49,560 --> 00:07:51,000 Speaker 3: going to be a little bit of tension in it 175 00:07:51,000 --> 00:07:53,440 Speaker 3: can be such a business thing or whatever. And it 176 00:07:53,480 --> 00:07:55,840 Speaker 3: got to a point on the holiday where your partners 177 00:07:56,240 --> 00:07:58,960 Speaker 3: actually said to both of you, you guys need to 178 00:07:58,960 --> 00:08:01,080 Speaker 3: go and sit in the room and have a chat. 179 00:08:01,800 --> 00:08:03,040 Speaker 3: Can you talk a bit more about that? 180 00:08:03,280 --> 00:08:04,160 Speaker 5: Yeah, of course. 181 00:08:04,760 --> 00:08:07,200 Speaker 1: So I don't think we've ever spoken about this publicly, 182 00:08:07,280 --> 00:08:10,600 Speaker 1: but happy happy to you now, I am. 183 00:08:11,840 --> 00:08:12,160 Speaker 3: Thanks. 184 00:08:13,760 --> 00:08:16,000 Speaker 4: That was definitely OFFTIMI. 185 00:08:18,480 --> 00:08:25,840 Speaker 2: Yes, well done, best friend. 186 00:08:29,080 --> 00:08:31,280 Speaker 5: Oh my goodness. So what that was? 187 00:08:31,320 --> 00:08:33,960 Speaker 1: We actually we were away for a couple of nights 188 00:08:34,080 --> 00:08:36,120 Speaker 1: and it was the second night and they actually stayed 189 00:08:36,120 --> 00:08:38,600 Speaker 1: in the room the whole time. Yeah, And what I 190 00:08:38,720 --> 00:08:40,440 Speaker 1: found that Steph and I and this is something we 191 00:08:40,480 --> 00:08:43,559 Speaker 1: are always working through and recently we've worked through it 192 00:08:43,600 --> 00:08:45,640 Speaker 1: a lot more and it's made such an impact of 193 00:08:45,679 --> 00:08:48,960 Speaker 1: our relationship in a positive way. But what we do 194 00:08:49,440 --> 00:08:52,040 Speaker 1: and I was I was going to ask if you 195 00:08:52,160 --> 00:08:55,320 Speaker 1: both do this as well? But because we love and 196 00:08:55,360 --> 00:08:59,360 Speaker 1: respect each other so much, we protect we share ninety 197 00:08:59,480 --> 00:09:03,520 Speaker 1: five percent of everything in our lives, but then we 198 00:09:03,600 --> 00:09:07,280 Speaker 1: don't share or we weren't sharing the five percent because 199 00:09:07,920 --> 00:09:10,280 Speaker 1: and maybe that was the thing about being open about 200 00:09:10,280 --> 00:09:12,800 Speaker 1: what we actually really want or how we're really feeling, 201 00:09:12,920 --> 00:09:17,360 Speaker 1: because we didn't want to hurt the other person and 202 00:09:17,400 --> 00:09:19,360 Speaker 1: we knew that, like because we are so open with 203 00:09:19,440 --> 00:09:20,920 Speaker 1: each other, like Seth might have known that I was 204 00:09:20,920 --> 00:09:23,480 Speaker 1: going through something really hard or vice versa. 205 00:09:23,640 --> 00:09:25,479 Speaker 5: So then either of us didn't. 206 00:09:25,200 --> 00:09:27,400 Speaker 1: Feel comfortable then being like, well, hey, I'm actually really 207 00:09:27,440 --> 00:09:30,680 Speaker 1: struggling with this, knowing that that might put more load 208 00:09:30,800 --> 00:09:32,960 Speaker 1: on the other person and might put more responsibility on 209 00:09:32,960 --> 00:09:35,360 Speaker 1: the other person. It might change, you know, it could 210 00:09:35,440 --> 00:09:38,520 Speaker 1: change things. That was and so that was kind of 211 00:09:38,559 --> 00:09:42,320 Speaker 1: what dot Doosh has a combination. 212 00:09:47,440 --> 00:09:50,839 Speaker 5: Doosh said to us. They said, like, we. 213 00:09:50,320 --> 00:09:53,559 Speaker 1: We know it's because you care about each other so much, 214 00:09:55,120 --> 00:09:57,440 Speaker 1: and so they said, like, you just need to be 215 00:09:57,600 --> 00:10:00,760 Speaker 1: open with each other, and it it was actually a 216 00:10:00,800 --> 00:10:03,520 Speaker 1: really uncomfortable conversation. We speak about it every now and 217 00:10:03,559 --> 00:10:07,160 Speaker 1: then in terms of where we've actually just more recently 218 00:10:07,240 --> 00:10:10,920 Speaker 1: had another really open, fantastic conversation. We actually worked with 219 00:10:11,000 --> 00:10:14,120 Speaker 1: a coach on that conversation, which was it was really 220 00:10:14,120 --> 00:10:16,600 Speaker 1: helpful because I think when there is two of you 221 00:10:17,080 --> 00:10:19,400 Speaker 1: having you don't have anyone who's objective because you're in 222 00:10:19,440 --> 00:10:23,280 Speaker 1: it all the time, you can also get like, especially 223 00:10:23,280 --> 00:10:26,040 Speaker 1: because we just try to protect each other so much. 224 00:10:26,280 --> 00:10:29,440 Speaker 2: It ends up this is sorry, this is like I 225 00:10:29,480 --> 00:10:31,679 Speaker 2: hope everyone, I hope this isn't maybe like a last time. 226 00:10:31,720 --> 00:10:33,880 Speaker 2: I hope this isn't exclusive for anyone who's listening. Is 227 00:10:34,000 --> 00:10:35,440 Speaker 2: button push it? But like I feel as if this 228 00:10:35,480 --> 00:10:38,160 Speaker 2: chat abound partnerships anyone can apply to their relationship as 229 00:10:38,160 --> 00:10:41,160 Speaker 2: well as anyone else they work with closely. Yeah, yeah, 230 00:10:41,200 --> 00:10:43,560 Speaker 2: I think so, yeah, because I don't want to know, 231 00:10:43,720 --> 00:10:45,520 Speaker 2: just feel like we're kind of like living in this 232 00:10:45,920 --> 00:10:49,120 Speaker 2: space where we kind of have professional best friend partners. 233 00:10:49,480 --> 00:10:51,319 Speaker 2: But I know lots of other people who own a 234 00:10:51,360 --> 00:10:53,120 Speaker 2: business with other people, or if you've got a best 235 00:10:53,120 --> 00:10:55,280 Speaker 2: friend or a partner, whatever it is. And it's funny 236 00:10:55,400 --> 00:11:02,160 Speaker 2: you're talking about exactly what the relationship therapist that Sam 237 00:11:02,240 --> 00:11:06,319 Speaker 2: and I used, we reach exactly the same conclusion with her. 238 00:11:06,720 --> 00:11:09,440 Speaker 2: The word she used for it was, you guys have 239 00:11:09,520 --> 00:11:15,880 Speaker 2: faux vulnerability where it's like you're you're both trying to 240 00:11:16,440 --> 00:11:19,240 Speaker 2: act like you're both really vulnerable around each other, but 241 00:11:19,520 --> 00:11:22,240 Speaker 2: you both care for each other, and this was something 242 00:11:22,640 --> 00:11:25,040 Speaker 2: very foreign to me. You care for each other too much, 243 00:11:25,880 --> 00:11:29,240 Speaker 2: you're and so you're you're like, oh, yeah, I'm here 244 00:11:29,280 --> 00:11:31,280 Speaker 2: for you, I'm sharing everything with you. But because you 245 00:11:31,360 --> 00:11:34,000 Speaker 2: care for the other one so much, you're holding back 246 00:11:34,040 --> 00:11:37,360 Speaker 2: this tiny bit. And because you're holding back this tiny 247 00:11:37,400 --> 00:11:40,640 Speaker 2: bit subconsciously, you're both aware of the fact that you're 248 00:11:40,640 --> 00:11:43,280 Speaker 2: holding about this tiny bit, and you know yourself you're 249 00:11:43,320 --> 00:11:45,760 Speaker 2: holding it back. And because you know yourself that you're 250 00:11:45,760 --> 00:11:47,840 Speaker 2: holding back and you feel like you have to hold back, 251 00:11:48,160 --> 00:11:49,840 Speaker 2: you're starting to resent the other person for it. 252 00:11:50,800 --> 00:11:55,199 Speaker 1: Yeah wow, And then exact true, No, it's exactly it's 253 00:11:55,240 --> 00:11:58,360 Speaker 1: exactly right, because then you're holding back and you're not 254 00:11:58,480 --> 00:12:02,160 Speaker 1: saying you're both not saying what you want because you think, 255 00:12:02,360 --> 00:12:04,640 Speaker 1: you assume that it's going to impact the other person 256 00:12:04,679 --> 00:12:05,680 Speaker 1: in a bad way and you want. 257 00:12:05,559 --> 00:12:08,679 Speaker 4: To protect them. Yes, but what actually. 258 00:12:08,520 --> 00:12:11,560 Speaker 1: In our most recent conversation, we both said, and you 259 00:12:11,640 --> 00:12:14,240 Speaker 1: have to create a very safe space to have conversations 260 00:12:14,679 --> 00:12:19,240 Speaker 1: where you are being not faux vulnerable, really actually vulnerable, 261 00:12:19,960 --> 00:12:21,679 Speaker 1: where you know you go into and we set an 262 00:12:21,679 --> 00:12:24,240 Speaker 1: intention actually going to the conversation saying that we both 263 00:12:24,280 --> 00:12:27,199 Speaker 1: want in this conversation out of this we both want 264 00:12:27,240 --> 00:12:29,840 Speaker 1: to create this really safe space and we know that 265 00:12:29,960 --> 00:12:31,640 Speaker 1: it's safe and that we're not going to nothing we 266 00:12:31,679 --> 00:12:34,360 Speaker 1: say is going to end our friendship or relationship, Like 267 00:12:34,440 --> 00:12:36,040 Speaker 1: we want to work through it. 268 00:12:36,040 --> 00:12:39,400 Speaker 3: Right, funnily enough, by continuing to hold off, which is 269 00:12:39,440 --> 00:12:42,560 Speaker 3: what we're doing. We're keeping the boat afloat, but a 270 00:12:42,640 --> 00:12:45,520 Speaker 3: leak has sprung. Yes, there is a small leak, which 271 00:12:45,600 --> 00:12:49,320 Speaker 3: is it's unnoticeable kind of day to day, but over 272 00:12:49,360 --> 00:12:51,400 Speaker 3: time this will sink the boat. So it's funny. So 273 00:12:51,400 --> 00:12:53,000 Speaker 3: it's like you got to go there. 274 00:12:53,200 --> 00:12:53,640 Speaker 5: You have to. 275 00:12:53,760 --> 00:12:55,880 Speaker 1: And because two, if you only are doing things because 276 00:12:56,280 --> 00:12:57,600 Speaker 1: it's good to do things because you care. 277 00:12:57,480 --> 00:13:00,120 Speaker 5: About other people, but then if you're not living true. 278 00:12:59,880 --> 00:13:03,480 Speaker 1: To yourself because the care is triumphing over all of 279 00:13:03,520 --> 00:13:07,959 Speaker 1: your own wants, yeah, you then end up really not 280 00:13:08,320 --> 00:13:12,480 Speaker 1: so not happy in some areas because of the But 281 00:13:12,520 --> 00:13:14,160 Speaker 1: then when you actually say it, and that's what Steph 282 00:13:14,160 --> 00:13:16,720 Speaker 1: and I worked through. It was what we both said 283 00:13:16,720 --> 00:13:19,760 Speaker 1: that we wanted and we worked through is absolutely fine. Yeah, 284 00:13:19,800 --> 00:13:21,640 Speaker 1: and it can co exists, like saying what we want 285 00:13:21,679 --> 00:13:23,480 Speaker 1: and care for each other at the same time, and 286 00:13:23,520 --> 00:13:25,320 Speaker 1: finding a solution that works for everything. 287 00:13:25,360 --> 00:13:28,720 Speaker 2: Well, you realize that funnily enough, Well, the realization for 288 00:13:28,800 --> 00:13:32,240 Speaker 2: me is that you realize exactly what you said, is 289 00:13:32,280 --> 00:13:35,920 Speaker 2: it not only does caring for myself also mean that 290 00:13:35,960 --> 00:13:38,480 Speaker 2: I can care for you? I think that the step 291 00:13:38,559 --> 00:13:41,560 Speaker 2: beyond that is if I'm going to care for you, 292 00:13:42,360 --> 00:13:46,800 Speaker 2: I have to care for myself. Like they almost. You 293 00:13:46,880 --> 00:13:50,400 Speaker 2: can't double dip there. You can't go like, oh yeah, 294 00:13:50,440 --> 00:13:52,280 Speaker 2: I'm gonna care for you over here and care for 295 00:13:52,360 --> 00:13:54,600 Speaker 2: myself over here. It's like no, no, no, you're gonna live 296 00:13:54,640 --> 00:13:56,640 Speaker 2: that closely with someone one on one. It's an all 297 00:13:56,640 --> 00:14:00,280 Speaker 2: in And I think I mean that the before you 298 00:14:00,280 --> 00:14:02,360 Speaker 2: finish this therapy session. It's so funny, Laura, you and 299 00:14:02,440 --> 00:14:05,120 Speaker 2: I love the same person. It's really fun you always 300 00:14:05,160 --> 00:14:08,640 Speaker 2: in up here. But if we we'll touch on that later. 301 00:14:10,080 --> 00:14:16,880 Speaker 2: I can't do it with this right now. I don't 302 00:14:16,920 --> 00:14:18,240 Speaker 2: know about you, because it was funny when you were 303 00:14:18,280 --> 00:14:20,480 Speaker 2: talking about, you know, people coming into your team and 304 00:14:20,520 --> 00:14:22,280 Speaker 2: trying to look after everyone and how you like doing that. 305 00:14:22,360 --> 00:14:24,520 Speaker 2: I imagine you feel the same stuff as I feel with Woody. 306 00:14:24,560 --> 00:14:26,360 Speaker 2: It's like I've got to look after you, and that 307 00:14:26,400 --> 00:14:28,000 Speaker 2: often means if I want to look after you, I 308 00:14:28,000 --> 00:14:30,160 Speaker 2: can't show you everything that's going on here because then 309 00:14:30,200 --> 00:14:31,440 Speaker 2: I'm not going to be able to look after you. 310 00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:35,280 Speaker 2: But the same point that I reached with my therapy session, 311 00:14:35,320 --> 00:14:37,080 Speaker 2: I'm not sure if you reach the same with yours. 312 00:14:37,120 --> 00:14:39,160 Speaker 2: Was I kind of always like try and well, you 313 00:14:39,200 --> 00:14:41,160 Speaker 2: know me well enough, now try and like wrap up 314 00:14:41,200 --> 00:14:43,400 Speaker 2: the therapy and like a nice little sentence or something, 315 00:14:43,480 --> 00:14:45,280 Speaker 2: just like, all right, guys, here's the take home from today. 316 00:14:45,320 --> 00:14:47,760 Speaker 2: Like this is ever runs homework, like I always just 317 00:14:47,800 --> 00:14:48,360 Speaker 2: try and do that. 318 00:14:48,480 --> 00:14:49,240 Speaker 4: You're a high achiever. 319 00:14:49,720 --> 00:14:51,400 Speaker 2: I just like doing it right. You know, it's like 320 00:14:51,400 --> 00:14:53,280 Speaker 2: getting the you know, putting your hand up in English class. 321 00:14:53,440 --> 00:14:56,760 Speaker 6: Anyway, So I finished a therapist s well like a plus. 322 00:14:56,960 --> 00:14:59,440 Speaker 2: So this was the great thing. That's what they do 323 00:14:59,600 --> 00:15:02,760 Speaker 2: often they But I finished this session and I was like, okay, cool. 324 00:15:02,800 --> 00:15:04,400 Speaker 2: So what we're taking away from this is, you know, 325 00:15:04,520 --> 00:15:06,080 Speaker 2: at the end of the day, we just love each other, 326 00:15:06,120 --> 00:15:07,400 Speaker 2: and you know that's all that manage. We're going to 327 00:15:07,440 --> 00:15:09,560 Speaker 2: try really hard for each other. And she was like, no, Will, 328 00:15:09,640 --> 00:15:12,800 Speaker 2: that is not what I'm saying. It's like what I'm 329 00:15:12,800 --> 00:15:15,400 Speaker 2: trying to say, is if you keep trying to look 330 00:15:15,440 --> 00:15:19,800 Speaker 2: after each other like this, you will fall apart. Yeah, 331 00:15:20,760 --> 00:15:24,560 Speaker 2: which for me it was it was like, I don't know, 332 00:15:24,640 --> 00:15:26,920 Speaker 2: it's like someone's talking to Chinese to me, because I've 333 00:15:26,960 --> 00:15:29,920 Speaker 2: always thought that to look after a relationship you have 334 00:15:29,960 --> 00:15:33,120 Speaker 2: to physically look after it. But and I suppose this 335 00:15:33,320 --> 00:15:36,520 Speaker 2: nice way to tie back in with Shamo mood, you're 336 00:15:37,080 --> 00:15:41,920 Speaker 2: how are you? How do you go now with treading 337 00:15:41,920 --> 00:15:45,200 Speaker 2: that line between looking after people, looking after your partner, 338 00:15:45,240 --> 00:15:50,040 Speaker 2: looking after your business relationship, and then not letting out 339 00:15:50,160 --> 00:15:53,120 Speaker 2: yourself because you're trying to look after them. And sorry 340 00:15:53,160 --> 00:15:55,120 Speaker 2: before I go on, and this is this is the thing. 341 00:15:55,160 --> 00:15:56,440 Speaker 2: I would love to talk to you more about it. 342 00:15:56,440 --> 00:15:59,360 Speaker 2: And it's going to come up is your relationship with control, 343 00:16:00,280 --> 00:16:04,880 Speaker 2: because that for me, just you're in your psychology and 344 00:16:04,920 --> 00:16:07,720 Speaker 2: my psychology is so clearly the thing, isn't it. It's 345 00:16:07,760 --> 00:16:09,320 Speaker 2: like if I can control it, if I can look 346 00:16:09,360 --> 00:16:13,160 Speaker 2: after it, they're safe. I'm safe, But you're not actually 347 00:16:13,160 --> 00:16:14,120 Speaker 2: listening to what's going on. 348 00:16:14,960 --> 00:16:17,400 Speaker 5: No, and you're not in control at all. 349 00:16:17,480 --> 00:16:19,560 Speaker 1: I think the thing one of the biggest learnings I've 350 00:16:19,560 --> 00:16:23,320 Speaker 1: had with that is that my control of I mean 351 00:16:23,360 --> 00:16:26,760 Speaker 1: other people and in relationships and keeping peace. I love 352 00:16:26,840 --> 00:16:30,640 Speaker 1: the imperfect episode Truth versus Harmony. I thought that was fantastic. 353 00:16:30,680 --> 00:16:33,040 Speaker 1: But I've listened to it literally ten times. With doctor Emily. 354 00:16:33,080 --> 00:16:34,160 Speaker 4: I was like, this is for me. 355 00:16:34,600 --> 00:16:36,040 Speaker 1: It wasn't obviously for me, but I was like, I 356 00:16:36,120 --> 00:16:40,120 Speaker 1: need to absorb this in that I choose harmony instead 357 00:16:40,160 --> 00:16:42,800 Speaker 1: of truth. And I think by choosing harmony in terms 358 00:16:42,800 --> 00:16:45,480 Speaker 1: of so if if I go to the coffee shop 359 00:16:45,480 --> 00:16:47,680 Speaker 1: and my coffee is cold, and this was the example, 360 00:16:47,840 --> 00:16:50,320 Speaker 1: Dr mus I'm not stealing this now myself, this was 361 00:16:50,360 --> 00:16:52,520 Speaker 1: her example, and I have a shit coffee or a 362 00:16:52,520 --> 00:16:55,360 Speaker 1: cold coffee, and then I could just not say something 363 00:16:56,240 --> 00:16:58,160 Speaker 1: and then not going maybe not go back there again. 364 00:16:58,160 --> 00:17:00,600 Speaker 1: But I'm not hurt the person who made my coffee feelings. 365 00:17:00,880 --> 00:17:03,320 Speaker 1: Or I tell them my coffee was cold, they remake it, 366 00:17:03,400 --> 00:17:05,200 Speaker 1: and then I go back there again, and they don't 367 00:17:05,200 --> 00:17:07,120 Speaker 1: lose me as a customer, and I've been honest with 368 00:17:07,560 --> 00:17:08,240 Speaker 1: my feedback. 369 00:17:08,320 --> 00:17:10,399 Speaker 4: It's so hard to do it though, So it is 370 00:17:10,560 --> 00:17:11,120 Speaker 4: so hard. 371 00:17:12,080 --> 00:17:12,760 Speaker 3: I can't have. 372 00:17:12,920 --> 00:17:16,360 Speaker 4: Lactose but full cream last I would. 373 00:17:17,520 --> 00:17:20,800 Speaker 3: I would do that and be sick rather than say hey, 374 00:17:20,840 --> 00:17:22,960 Speaker 3: which is such a simple thing. Hey, I think you 375 00:17:23,040 --> 00:17:26,320 Speaker 3: put cow's milk in my coffee. But I don't know 376 00:17:26,320 --> 00:17:28,080 Speaker 3: why is that so hard for us? 377 00:17:29,440 --> 00:17:32,240 Speaker 1: I think it's well for me, it's the fear of confrontation, 378 00:17:32,359 --> 00:17:34,399 Speaker 1: and that's come from and in a lot of the 379 00:17:34,480 --> 00:17:37,399 Speaker 1: work I've done recently in going through like where is 380 00:17:37,440 --> 00:17:38,000 Speaker 1: that come from? 381 00:17:38,040 --> 00:17:40,480 Speaker 5: I think for me it came from in my childhood. 382 00:17:40,640 --> 00:17:43,959 Speaker 1: My parents fought a lot from when I was like 383 00:17:44,240 --> 00:17:47,919 Speaker 1: about six to twelve, when they're separated and I was 384 00:17:47,960 --> 00:17:50,560 Speaker 1: the oldest child, And this was definitely my parents didn't 385 00:17:50,560 --> 00:17:53,240 Speaker 1: put this responsibility on me, but I felt responsible for 386 00:17:53,440 --> 00:17:54,679 Speaker 1: stopping them from arguing. 387 00:17:54,760 --> 00:17:56,720 Speaker 5: Like I thought I was Honestly, I thought I was a. 388 00:17:56,680 --> 00:17:59,040 Speaker 1: Counselor at ten years old, which I obviously wasn't, and 389 00:17:59,080 --> 00:18:02,960 Speaker 1: that was my entitle myself. But I knew things that 390 00:18:03,040 --> 00:18:06,159 Speaker 1: would cause them to argue, so I would intercept, Like 391 00:18:06,440 --> 00:18:08,480 Speaker 1: when Dad got home, I would like intercept to make 392 00:18:08,480 --> 00:18:10,680 Speaker 1: sure that like something that could cause them to argue 393 00:18:10,680 --> 00:18:14,280 Speaker 1: wouldn't so then we would have like a peace one 394 00:18:14,280 --> 00:18:16,159 Speaker 1: and there wouldn't be no there would be no arguing. 395 00:18:16,840 --> 00:18:19,280 Speaker 1: And I think that has and because I did that 396 00:18:19,320 --> 00:18:21,520 Speaker 1: for quite a long time. 397 00:18:22,320 --> 00:18:23,280 Speaker 5: I think I am. 398 00:18:23,520 --> 00:18:27,600 Speaker 1: I am very avoidant of confrontation because of that kind 399 00:18:27,640 --> 00:18:30,920 Speaker 1: of learned behavior when I was younger. 400 00:18:31,320 --> 00:18:32,680 Speaker 4: Totally yeah. 401 00:18:32,680 --> 00:18:34,400 Speaker 5: And I think it's also then coming back to also 402 00:18:34,480 --> 00:18:35,200 Speaker 5: not how don't know. 403 00:18:35,240 --> 00:18:38,000 Speaker 1: I just feel really uncomfortable saying what I want out 404 00:18:38,040 --> 00:18:40,000 Speaker 1: loud and putting because I don't I think because I, 405 00:18:40,359 --> 00:18:42,800 Speaker 1: for me, it's very important to be well. I don't 406 00:18:42,880 --> 00:18:44,680 Speaker 1: know if it's important to be selfless, but it's something 407 00:18:44,680 --> 00:18:45,760 Speaker 1: that a lot of people have always said to me. 408 00:18:46,560 --> 00:18:48,960 Speaker 2: It's the same thing, isn't it. It's like, I can't 409 00:18:49,000 --> 00:18:51,239 Speaker 2: put my needs here first because I've got to make 410 00:18:51,280 --> 00:18:54,399 Speaker 2: sure this is harmonious because it ties in with ultimately 411 00:18:54,520 --> 00:18:57,359 Speaker 2: like a primal sense of security, which is like if 412 00:18:57,400 --> 00:18:59,719 Speaker 2: I can keep the piece here, the roof staying over 413 00:18:59,720 --> 00:19:01,560 Speaker 2: their head, Mum and dad are staying together. So it's 414 00:19:01,840 --> 00:19:04,639 Speaker 2: so triggering for you. And again that just talking in 415 00:19:04,680 --> 00:19:08,320 Speaker 2: this language of sharing how you're going, I feel like 416 00:19:08,920 --> 00:19:11,879 Speaker 2: that is the thing which stops you from sharing how 417 00:19:11,920 --> 00:19:13,480 Speaker 2: you're going, because if you're like, well, for share how 418 00:19:13,520 --> 00:19:17,280 Speaker 2: I'm going, then I can't be the peacekeeper here, and 419 00:19:17,320 --> 00:19:18,840 Speaker 2: then it's all going to come tumbling down. 420 00:19:18,840 --> 00:19:21,800 Speaker 3: I've actually brought everyone down around me, and now I'm 421 00:19:21,880 --> 00:19:25,159 Speaker 3: unlovable because my value is my ability to keep the 422 00:19:25,200 --> 00:19:27,840 Speaker 3: harmony as well. I'm the up guy and if I'm 423 00:19:27,880 --> 00:19:31,240 Speaker 3: not being the up guy, then I'm nothing exactly and 424 00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:35,600 Speaker 3: that's a really hard thing to accept. I'm so curious, though, Laura, 425 00:19:36,480 --> 00:19:39,119 Speaker 3: I'm saying I confrontation. I just hate it and I 426 00:19:39,119 --> 00:19:42,640 Speaker 3: will avoid it at all costs. I'm still probably there. 427 00:19:43,119 --> 00:19:45,120 Speaker 3: I try to get better, but it's still a real 428 00:19:45,119 --> 00:19:47,359 Speaker 3: struggle for me. What of you, cause I'm sure a 429 00:19:47,359 --> 00:19:49,959 Speaker 3: lot of people listening are exactly the same. Are there 430 00:19:50,000 --> 00:19:52,400 Speaker 3: any practical steps that you have taken to get better 431 00:19:52,400 --> 00:19:52,639 Speaker 3: at that? 432 00:19:53,560 --> 00:19:54,080 Speaker 5: So a few. 433 00:19:54,160 --> 00:19:56,760 Speaker 1: So in my role at Kick, I have had to 434 00:19:56,840 --> 00:20:01,080 Speaker 1: learn to give radical candor is author Kim Scott. 435 00:20:01,119 --> 00:20:02,080 Speaker 5: It's a very good book. 436 00:20:02,280 --> 00:20:04,240 Speaker 1: And at the start of the book because as a leader, 437 00:20:04,280 --> 00:20:06,199 Speaker 1: I have to give feedback to my team and if 438 00:20:06,240 --> 00:20:08,560 Speaker 1: I don't give because I often I used to think, 439 00:20:08,600 --> 00:20:10,640 Speaker 1: oh I give them feedback, like I hurt their confidence 440 00:20:10,640 --> 00:20:12,240 Speaker 1: and I'm a bad person and they're not going to 441 00:20:12,240 --> 00:20:15,280 Speaker 1: feel empowered in their role. But it's actually very important 442 00:20:15,280 --> 00:20:17,320 Speaker 1: for me to give them feedback. And then at the 443 00:20:17,359 --> 00:20:20,159 Speaker 1: start of the book, Kim speaks through an example of 444 00:20:20,280 --> 00:20:23,240 Speaker 1: a team member who everyone loved. They were fun, loving, 445 00:20:23,400 --> 00:20:25,800 Speaker 1: they were great for the culture, but they were not 446 00:20:26,040 --> 00:20:28,440 Speaker 1: very good at their job. And because they weren't doing 447 00:20:28,440 --> 00:20:30,240 Speaker 1: their job properly, they were the rest of the team 448 00:20:30,280 --> 00:20:33,000 Speaker 1: were always picking up their pieces. But no one ever 449 00:20:33,080 --> 00:20:35,960 Speaker 1: gave that person feedback because they felt that he was 450 00:20:36,000 --> 00:20:37,720 Speaker 1: just so good and oh, he's a great person, and 451 00:20:37,760 --> 00:20:39,399 Speaker 1: I feel they felt bad. They didn't want to protect 452 00:20:39,480 --> 00:20:42,040 Speaker 1: him and they didn't give him feedback, and then he 453 00:20:42,160 --> 00:20:45,080 Speaker 1: ended up getting fired because he was just underperforming. 454 00:20:45,080 --> 00:20:47,520 Speaker 5: And obviously, at work, you do need to perform within 455 00:20:47,600 --> 00:20:48,600 Speaker 5: your role for your team. 456 00:20:49,359 --> 00:20:52,320 Speaker 1: And he said something around like, I wish you just 457 00:20:52,400 --> 00:20:55,240 Speaker 1: told me because I could have. Like, if you give 458 00:20:55,280 --> 00:20:58,000 Speaker 1: someone the feedback they can, then you're then giving them 459 00:20:58,000 --> 00:21:00,840 Speaker 1: an opportunity to grow and learn in that totally. 460 00:21:00,600 --> 00:21:01,720 Speaker 5: And that's really important. 461 00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:03,520 Speaker 1: And so that has that book to helped me a 462 00:21:03,520 --> 00:21:06,520 Speaker 1: lot in giving feedback at work and in strengthening that 463 00:21:06,600 --> 00:21:07,240 Speaker 1: muscle at work. 464 00:21:07,280 --> 00:21:09,960 Speaker 5: It's actually also helped me in my personal. 465 00:21:10,440 --> 00:21:12,560 Speaker 2: It's funny because it's probably tied in together, isn't it. 466 00:21:12,560 --> 00:21:15,200 Speaker 2: Once you kind of get used to breaking the bank 467 00:21:15,640 --> 00:21:19,200 Speaker 2: with one tool, which might be feedback that ease and 468 00:21:19,920 --> 00:21:22,879 Speaker 2: or it sort of makes it easier to do it 469 00:21:22,920 --> 00:21:25,120 Speaker 2: in other ways, which might be expressing how you're feeling. 470 00:21:25,520 --> 00:21:27,240 Speaker 2: That's interesting, actually. 471 00:21:27,119 --> 00:21:29,320 Speaker 3: So another one one more? Sorry, I find this fascinating. 472 00:21:29,800 --> 00:21:35,040 Speaker 2: How do you so feed psychologists? I know you needs 473 00:21:35,080 --> 00:21:46,800 Speaker 2: like everyone else you gepus, we go free therapy, so. 474 00:21:46,840 --> 00:21:50,080 Speaker 3: Feedback at work. I imagine you would just label it that 475 00:21:50,240 --> 00:21:52,560 Speaker 3: so people know that that's what they're about to get. 476 00:21:52,680 --> 00:21:56,080 Speaker 3: If you have to start a confrontation with someone in 477 00:21:56,119 --> 00:21:59,560 Speaker 3: your personal life outside of work, how do you go 478 00:21:59,640 --> 00:22:00,080 Speaker 3: about that? 479 00:22:00,520 --> 00:22:03,560 Speaker 1: So what I've learned to do is reframe it. So 480 00:22:03,640 --> 00:22:05,120 Speaker 1: in my head, I was like, if I'm going to give, 481 00:22:05,320 --> 00:22:06,800 Speaker 1: if I'm going to go, because obviously you don't have 482 00:22:06,840 --> 00:22:09,720 Speaker 1: performance reviews with your friends. 483 00:22:09,840 --> 00:22:11,280 Speaker 3: If you did, any concerned. 484 00:22:10,920 --> 00:22:13,000 Speaker 5: That would be really interesting. 485 00:22:13,640 --> 00:22:16,800 Speaker 2: How you've done such a clear top three, You've been. 486 00:22:16,760 --> 00:22:20,560 Speaker 3: Right off four coffee was. 487 00:22:20,520 --> 00:22:23,440 Speaker 2: Good, You've got a top twenty? Don't you ranked? 488 00:22:23,480 --> 00:22:23,960 Speaker 1: And ordered? 489 00:22:24,320 --> 00:22:28,320 Speaker 2: Single file? No show us the grid? Where's the spreadsheet? 490 00:22:28,920 --> 00:22:32,439 Speaker 2: Number of coffee dates, Christmas presents. 491 00:22:32,119 --> 00:22:34,800 Speaker 5: Quality of conversation. I'm joking, dug and dragging nut. 492 00:22:35,359 --> 00:22:36,880 Speaker 4: So I don't. 493 00:22:38,040 --> 00:22:40,240 Speaker 1: But what I've had to relabel is so I've always 494 00:22:40,240 --> 00:22:43,439 Speaker 1: thought of if I was going to share feedback with 495 00:22:43,720 --> 00:22:46,920 Speaker 1: or not even feedback, just how I was feeling with 496 00:22:47,119 --> 00:22:49,120 Speaker 1: maybe we'll use Seph for example. With Steph, I would 497 00:22:49,200 --> 00:22:51,320 Speaker 1: think of that as I have to go and have 498 00:22:51,400 --> 00:22:56,320 Speaker 1: confrontation with Steph. But I've reframed that into I have 499 00:22:56,359 --> 00:23:00,280 Speaker 1: to go communicate with Steph and have a conversation about 500 00:23:00,320 --> 00:23:04,280 Speaker 1: how I'm feeling. Yeah, and so in trying to remove 501 00:23:04,359 --> 00:23:06,439 Speaker 1: that thing of this has to be an argument, This 502 00:23:06,520 --> 00:23:08,320 Speaker 1: has to be a confrontation, And it's how you approach 503 00:23:08,359 --> 00:23:11,480 Speaker 1: it to Like if I went to someone in my life, 504 00:23:11,520 --> 00:23:13,359 Speaker 1: or if anyone listening, you go to someone in your 505 00:23:13,359 --> 00:23:16,200 Speaker 1: life and you say, I really don't like how you're 506 00:23:16,200 --> 00:23:18,080 Speaker 1: doing X, Y and Z, and it's making me feel 507 00:23:18,119 --> 00:23:19,720 Speaker 1: like shit, and you're doing it on purpose, and obviously 508 00:23:20,000 --> 00:23:22,520 Speaker 1: that's taking everything personally. It's like having all of these 509 00:23:22,560 --> 00:23:25,200 Speaker 1: assumptions of you know, why they might be doing whatever 510 00:23:25,240 --> 00:23:27,720 Speaker 1: their behavior is that they're doing is because of you, 511 00:23:27,800 --> 00:23:29,800 Speaker 1: and it's in spite of you and all these things 512 00:23:29,800 --> 00:23:32,639 Speaker 1: you make up in our head. Instead of that leading 513 00:23:32,720 --> 00:23:35,760 Speaker 1: with I suppose just with how you're feeling, and hey, 514 00:23:35,800 --> 00:23:38,280 Speaker 1: I know it's not it's going in not assuming the 515 00:23:38,280 --> 00:23:41,320 Speaker 1: worst of that person, assuming the best. And if you 516 00:23:41,440 --> 00:23:44,400 Speaker 1: start a conversation like that is very rare it will 517 00:23:44,520 --> 00:23:47,879 Speaker 1: end up in an argument or in a confrontation. So 518 00:23:47,960 --> 00:23:50,320 Speaker 1: I think it's just reframing that when we share out 519 00:23:50,320 --> 00:23:53,400 Speaker 1: how we're actually feeling and in conversations it might be uncomfortable, 520 00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:56,680 Speaker 1: it doesn't have to be an argument or confrontational. 521 00:23:56,960 --> 00:23:58,959 Speaker 3: Yeah, it's almost like meeting it with a curiosity. 522 00:23:59,240 --> 00:23:59,680 Speaker 4: Exactly. 523 00:24:00,000 --> 00:24:03,080 Speaker 3: I'm furious about why I'm feeling this way. Let's talk 524 00:24:03,119 --> 00:24:03,600 Speaker 3: about it now. 525 00:24:03,600 --> 00:24:05,440 Speaker 5: I have to pay you one hundred and eighty dollars. 526 00:24:05,200 --> 00:24:11,199 Speaker 3: Yes, actually more for you. I Actually I don't use 527 00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:14,080 Speaker 3: the word feedback. I use the word advice. I don't 528 00:24:14,119 --> 00:24:16,560 Speaker 3: know why, but that totally shifts it for me, because 529 00:24:16,560 --> 00:24:19,439 Speaker 3: for me, the word feedback means I'm looking in the 530 00:24:19,480 --> 00:24:21,920 Speaker 3: past at maybe something I did poorly, and that can 531 00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:23,760 Speaker 3: be a bit of a negative cycle for me. But 532 00:24:23,800 --> 00:24:26,600 Speaker 3: if someone says almost the same thing but goes, hey, 533 00:24:26,720 --> 00:24:29,600 Speaker 3: I've got some advice for you, it frames my mind 534 00:24:29,640 --> 00:24:31,920 Speaker 3: to look forward and then I don't get bogged down 535 00:24:31,920 --> 00:24:34,160 Speaker 3: in it. Yeah, I don't know. People might enjoy. 536 00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:34,560 Speaker 5: That very good. 537 00:24:34,920 --> 00:24:38,320 Speaker 2: There might be a nice note for people that are 538 00:24:38,320 --> 00:24:40,159 Speaker 2: listening because just a few of things I've picked up 539 00:24:40,240 --> 00:24:44,240 Speaker 2: that you're saying, Laura, is this idea of reframing or intention, 540 00:24:44,480 --> 00:24:48,080 Speaker 2: which is something that you know. I can just hear 541 00:24:48,200 --> 00:24:53,520 Speaker 2: the therapy coming out of you because I've had the 542 00:24:53,560 --> 00:24:57,959 Speaker 2: same chats. But it is a really really important and 543 00:24:58,000 --> 00:25:02,280 Speaker 2: really nice if you don't do it already, because you 544 00:25:02,320 --> 00:25:04,520 Speaker 2: can't trust your emotions, you can't trust your gut, you 545 00:25:04,520 --> 00:25:06,440 Speaker 2: can't trust your intuition. They're all going to tell you 546 00:25:06,600 --> 00:25:09,719 Speaker 2: things that you know they just want to feed themselves. 547 00:25:10,080 --> 00:25:12,919 Speaker 2: So it can be a really good thing before you 548 00:25:13,000 --> 00:25:14,520 Speaker 2: are sort of sharing how you're going or if you 549 00:25:14,600 --> 00:25:17,320 Speaker 2: are talking to someone about how they're going, to like 550 00:25:17,400 --> 00:25:19,639 Speaker 2: sit down with them and it might sound clunky and 551 00:25:19,680 --> 00:25:22,399 Speaker 2: it might feel awkward, but just to tell them why 552 00:25:22,440 --> 00:25:25,840 Speaker 2: you're doing it at the start. And I think that 553 00:25:26,280 --> 00:25:30,600 Speaker 2: I think like that's kind of been proved through testing 554 00:25:30,640 --> 00:25:34,280 Speaker 2: that that is the best way to give somebody feedback 555 00:25:34,840 --> 00:25:37,040 Speaker 2: is because it used to be the old shit sandwich. 556 00:25:37,119 --> 00:25:39,840 Speaker 2: You know, the problem with the ship sandwich was that 557 00:25:39,880 --> 00:25:42,640 Speaker 2: you just knew that when they gave you the good said, 558 00:25:42,640 --> 00:25:44,159 Speaker 2: people didn't listen to the good thing at the end 559 00:25:44,200 --> 00:25:46,600 Speaker 2: because they were focusing on sandwich. 560 00:25:46,800 --> 00:25:48,960 Speaker 1: So I had to announce something to the team, and 561 00:25:48,960 --> 00:25:52,719 Speaker 1: our advisor was there and I was it was uncomfortable 562 00:25:52,720 --> 00:25:53,520 Speaker 1: for me to say. 563 00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:56,679 Speaker 2: And sorry I should say. People aren't across the ship sandwich. 564 00:25:56,680 --> 00:26:00,160 Speaker 2: It's basically a good thing at the start, and you 565 00:26:00,160 --> 00:26:01,920 Speaker 2: you cover the ship thing that you're going to give 566 00:26:01,920 --> 00:26:04,040 Speaker 2: someone feedback on or advice on in the middle with 567 00:26:04,119 --> 00:26:06,679 Speaker 2: two good things either end, so your bookend, your bookend it. 568 00:26:07,040 --> 00:26:11,840 Speaker 2: But the issue is that people now intrinsically, just through 569 00:26:11,880 --> 00:26:15,120 Speaker 2: hearing your tone when you start giving them feedback, they 570 00:26:15,240 --> 00:26:18,200 Speaker 2: know that something bad is coming, so they don't listen 571 00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:20,200 Speaker 2: to the good thing at the start because they're waiting 572 00:26:20,200 --> 00:26:21,679 Speaker 2: for the bad thing. And then when they hear the 573 00:26:21,680 --> 00:26:23,240 Speaker 2: bad thing, they don't hear the good thing at the 574 00:26:23,320 --> 00:26:25,520 Speaker 2: end because they're concentrating on the bad thing. So it 575 00:26:25,640 --> 00:26:28,159 Speaker 2: is entirely flawed, or. 576 00:26:28,119 --> 00:26:30,080 Speaker 1: You can totally make it up like I do and 577 00:26:30,359 --> 00:26:33,280 Speaker 1: have eighty five thousand pieces of bread the skinniest piece. 578 00:26:33,040 --> 00:26:39,520 Speaker 5: Of hair, and that's what happened. Our adviser was like, 579 00:26:40,040 --> 00:26:41,879 Speaker 5: so it kind of got lost. 580 00:26:43,640 --> 00:26:44,160 Speaker 2: What do you mean? 581 00:26:47,400 --> 00:26:47,480 Speaker 3: So? 582 00:26:47,600 --> 00:26:50,280 Speaker 5: Yeah, so telling them now I don't do it, how 583 00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:51,120 Speaker 5: much doesn't it doesn't. 584 00:26:51,240 --> 00:26:51,440 Speaker 6: Don't. 585 00:26:51,480 --> 00:26:54,560 Speaker 2: It's awful, and I think again proven I can't remember 586 00:26:54,600 --> 00:26:56,520 Speaker 2: where I heard this. It might have been an ad 587 00:26:57,119 --> 00:27:01,000 Speaker 2: grant thing, but it was. He said, if you tell 588 00:27:01,080 --> 00:27:06,240 Speaker 2: someone why, then the whole thing gets reframed through the why. 589 00:27:06,640 --> 00:27:08,000 Speaker 2: So it's like, hey, look, this is why I'm telling 590 00:27:08,080 --> 00:27:09,919 Speaker 2: you because I think X Y and z ED. I 591 00:27:09,960 --> 00:27:11,480 Speaker 2: know this is going to suck, but just so you know, 592 00:27:11,560 --> 00:27:13,760 Speaker 2: it's trying to make you better or in a relationship 593 00:27:13,800 --> 00:27:15,679 Speaker 2: because I love you, because I don't feel like I 594 00:27:15,720 --> 00:27:19,040 Speaker 2: can be myself and it's amazing how that works. Now. 595 00:27:19,119 --> 00:27:20,800 Speaker 2: We could keep talking about that forever, but we've got 596 00:27:20,800 --> 00:27:23,399 Speaker 2: so many more things to talk to you about. I 597 00:27:23,480 --> 00:27:24,920 Speaker 2: really want to talk to you about this because I 598 00:27:25,000 --> 00:27:27,240 Speaker 2: think there's heaps here and this is something we haven't 599 00:27:27,280 --> 00:27:30,560 Speaker 2: covered off on Share my mood, but this is the 600 00:27:30,640 --> 00:27:35,119 Speaker 2: physiological relationship between how you feel and how you express 601 00:27:35,240 --> 00:27:43,680 Speaker 2: how you feel and consequently exercise and food, or your 602 00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:46,360 Speaker 2: relationship with your gut, because you know, you can listen 603 00:27:46,440 --> 00:27:48,680 Speaker 2: to anyone talk about this these days, but is obviously 604 00:27:48,720 --> 00:27:51,320 Speaker 2: and you'd know within your own experience there's so clearly 605 00:27:51,359 --> 00:27:54,200 Speaker 2: a relationship between your mind and your gut and your body. 606 00:27:55,080 --> 00:27:58,840 Speaker 2: I want to start with. Let's start with running, because 607 00:27:59,520 --> 00:28:01,840 Speaker 2: I had this experience the other day, and I actually 608 00:28:01,840 --> 00:28:03,159 Speaker 2: thought of you, because I remember when I was on 609 00:28:03,320 --> 00:28:05,800 Speaker 2: the kick Pod with you guys, you were talking about 610 00:28:05,840 --> 00:28:09,760 Speaker 2: how running was like a meditation for you, and I 611 00:28:09,760 --> 00:28:11,280 Speaker 2: had this experience the other day. I've had a bit 612 00:28:11,320 --> 00:28:13,320 Speaker 2: going on in my personal life recently. But I went 613 00:28:13,359 --> 00:28:18,639 Speaker 2: for a run and I finished, and I saw and 614 00:28:18,680 --> 00:28:21,879 Speaker 2: I immediately started crying as soon as I finished, And 615 00:28:21,920 --> 00:28:25,119 Speaker 2: it was almost like I'd been working so hard to 616 00:28:25,200 --> 00:28:28,520 Speaker 2: keep everything under my lid that it was the endorphin 617 00:28:29,000 --> 00:28:31,080 Speaker 2: rush that I got from running, which kind of helped 618 00:28:31,080 --> 00:28:34,199 Speaker 2: me access what was going on, which again was just 619 00:28:34,480 --> 00:28:37,520 Speaker 2: so clear to me how powerful this is. Do you 620 00:28:37,600 --> 00:28:42,960 Speaker 2: see exercise as a means of expressing how you're feeling? 621 00:28:43,680 --> 00:28:45,880 Speaker 2: Do you see absolutely, really. 622 00:28:45,640 --> 00:28:47,640 Speaker 5: Especially like running is my meditation. 623 00:28:48,000 --> 00:28:50,480 Speaker 1: Yes, and that's why, and that for me has been 624 00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:55,400 Speaker 1: a total rebuilding. I grew up having great relationship with exercise, 625 00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:59,680 Speaker 1: as in school, sport and things. Then I had a 626 00:28:59,720 --> 00:29:03,440 Speaker 1: horror relationship with both exercise and food when I was 627 00:29:03,640 --> 00:29:07,960 Speaker 1: modeling in Italy, and then also when I came back 628 00:29:07,960 --> 00:29:11,240 Speaker 1: from the pressures of social media, and also being a 629 00:29:11,360 --> 00:29:14,440 Speaker 1: very disciplined person and type a personality. 630 00:29:14,480 --> 00:29:15,400 Speaker 5: When I and. 631 00:29:15,360 --> 00:29:22,200 Speaker 1: Control, that was a bad mix, a bad mix mix 632 00:29:22,280 --> 00:29:24,920 Speaker 1: for me, and it totally changed my relationship with exercise 633 00:29:24,920 --> 00:29:28,000 Speaker 1: and running in particular. Running became this thing that was 634 00:29:28,040 --> 00:29:31,120 Speaker 1: purely to make my body really small and about punishment, 635 00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:32,640 Speaker 1: and I was in pain all the time, and it 636 00:29:32,720 --> 00:29:36,280 Speaker 1: wasn't a healthy kind of relationship. And then now I've 637 00:29:36,280 --> 00:29:38,600 Speaker 1: been able to rebuild that through you know, the work, 638 00:29:38,600 --> 00:29:40,960 Speaker 1: and that that's why we started Kick, through the work 639 00:29:41,000 --> 00:29:43,520 Speaker 1: we do with Kick, and it's been interesting because. 640 00:29:43,280 --> 00:29:45,720 Speaker 2: Sorry, that's the reason you started Kicked because of the 641 00:29:45,960 --> 00:29:48,760 Speaker 2: step went through. I know Steph had a similar story, 642 00:29:48,800 --> 00:29:52,120 Speaker 2: but that was your coming together moment. I thought. I 643 00:29:52,120 --> 00:29:54,400 Speaker 2: didn't I didn't know what the origin story was. 644 00:29:54,840 --> 00:29:56,320 Speaker 4: I thought you. 645 00:29:57,240 --> 00:29:58,560 Speaker 2: I didn't know that you were both. 646 00:29:58,840 --> 00:30:02,200 Speaker 3: I did my research before podcast. I've got your whole I. 647 00:30:05,680 --> 00:30:07,640 Speaker 2: Knew, but I didn't know that that was like you 648 00:30:07,720 --> 00:30:12,520 Speaker 2: kind of had that shared trauma. Don't do this, I 649 00:30:12,520 --> 00:30:14,440 Speaker 2: will turn it back on you. 650 00:30:14,520 --> 00:30:19,760 Speaker 1: I know you don't want I don't really don't know. 651 00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:26,160 Speaker 2: So it was this shared trauma about your experience with 652 00:30:26,200 --> 00:30:28,240 Speaker 2: this stuff, which then obviously gave you this idea to 653 00:30:28,280 --> 00:30:28,720 Speaker 2: do this thing. 654 00:30:28,920 --> 00:30:31,400 Speaker 5: Yeah, because we wanted with Kick, we wanted to. 655 00:30:31,320 --> 00:30:34,080 Speaker 1: Create a place where because for Sef and I and 656 00:30:34,120 --> 00:30:35,960 Speaker 1: I don't know if for both of you, when you 657 00:30:36,000 --> 00:30:39,120 Speaker 1: were growing up your relationship with exercises and food. But 658 00:30:39,200 --> 00:30:42,560 Speaker 1: I grew up loving sport, which is a privilege because 659 00:30:42,560 --> 00:30:43,880 Speaker 1: a lot of kids go through. 660 00:30:43,680 --> 00:30:45,120 Speaker 5: School and hate sport. 661 00:30:45,520 --> 00:30:47,640 Speaker 1: They have a like the beep test is a super 662 00:30:47,680 --> 00:30:49,720 Speaker 1: formative experience for so many people, and if they have 663 00:30:49,760 --> 00:30:51,720 Speaker 1: a ship time and they're embarrassed or whatever it might be, 664 00:30:51,760 --> 00:30:53,600 Speaker 1: they often will never run again. 665 00:30:54,680 --> 00:30:56,840 Speaker 5: Yeah, if you were, I'm guessing you were. 666 00:30:56,800 --> 00:30:58,480 Speaker 4: Athletic, I loved the best. 667 00:30:58,560 --> 00:31:00,120 Speaker 2: Yeah, she's pointing, which. 668 00:31:01,920 --> 00:31:04,479 Speaker 3: I set up my own beep test, as in, like 669 00:31:04,520 --> 00:31:06,480 Speaker 3: I figured out the distance and then you. 670 00:31:06,400 --> 00:31:08,720 Speaker 5: Could train it so I could train you want a great. 671 00:31:09,920 --> 00:31:13,920 Speaker 3: I love sport, Yeah, love sport. But then I think 672 00:31:14,400 --> 00:31:18,960 Speaker 3: somewhere along the way, exercise started getting a little bit. 673 00:31:20,040 --> 00:31:25,760 Speaker 3: Yeah the bit may be unhealthy, too much, too much? Yeah, 674 00:31:25,840 --> 00:31:30,560 Speaker 3: I definitely. I definitely over exercised. Yeah, which I'm sure 675 00:31:31,040 --> 00:31:31,680 Speaker 3: you were similar. 676 00:31:31,800 --> 00:31:34,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, definitely, And that's that's what happened. And so but yeah, 677 00:31:34,960 --> 00:31:37,320 Speaker 1: before that, I didn't I had a great relationship with exercise, 678 00:31:37,400 --> 00:31:40,400 Speaker 1: and also food, and with food, growing up in a 679 00:31:40,400 --> 00:31:44,040 Speaker 1: household where you are taught it kind of empowered with 680 00:31:44,080 --> 00:31:47,320 Speaker 1: tools to understand how to eat healthy is also a privilege, 681 00:31:47,320 --> 00:31:50,000 Speaker 1: and a lot of people don't grow up with those tools. 682 00:31:50,080 --> 00:31:53,239 Speaker 1: And so with KICK, it is so important because when 683 00:31:53,240 --> 00:31:54,920 Speaker 1: you as we just spoke about, when you lead a 684 00:31:54,920 --> 00:31:57,840 Speaker 1: healthy life, sole movement can be your form of meditation. 685 00:31:58,000 --> 00:32:01,000 Speaker 1: It's proven to help with stress and so many things, 686 00:32:01,080 --> 00:32:03,840 Speaker 1: and also like to live longer. It's it's incredibly important 687 00:32:03,880 --> 00:32:06,360 Speaker 1: to move our bodies and to eat well and look 688 00:32:06,400 --> 00:32:09,600 Speaker 1: after ourselves. But we wanted so with Kick, we wanted 689 00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:11,560 Speaker 1: to create a place where we could give people those 690 00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:14,640 Speaker 1: tools but without all of the kind of toxic diet 691 00:32:14,720 --> 00:32:16,840 Speaker 1: culture that goes with it, like in terms of before 692 00:32:16,840 --> 00:32:20,640 Speaker 1: and after photos and weighing yourself and having calories in 693 00:32:20,720 --> 00:32:22,440 Speaker 1: the app, and because for me that I went through 694 00:32:22,440 --> 00:32:24,600 Speaker 1: a really bad stage with a calorie counting app where 695 00:32:25,120 --> 00:32:29,960 Speaker 1: everything I ate I put into the app. But what 696 00:32:30,000 --> 00:32:31,360 Speaker 1: that means is when you're trying to go out for 697 00:32:31,400 --> 00:32:34,080 Speaker 1: dinner with your friends and things you can't or you 698 00:32:34,120 --> 00:32:36,520 Speaker 1: have anxiety the entire time because I'm thinking like, oh 699 00:32:36,520 --> 00:32:37,920 Speaker 1: my god, I don't know how much eat how much 700 00:32:37,960 --> 00:32:41,480 Speaker 1: oil they're using on my fish and vegetables, and I 701 00:32:41,520 --> 00:32:43,200 Speaker 1: can't put that in my app And you know, olive 702 00:32:43,200 --> 00:32:45,959 Speaker 1: oil has so such high calorie thing, and all I 703 00:32:46,000 --> 00:32:48,040 Speaker 1: wasn't thinking about food is fuel at all. It was 704 00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:50,200 Speaker 1: all about just how do I eat as less and 705 00:32:50,280 --> 00:32:51,240 Speaker 1: exercise as much? 706 00:32:51,280 --> 00:32:53,320 Speaker 3: And how would you thank you if you knew you 707 00:32:53,400 --> 00:32:55,920 Speaker 3: went over your calorie? Can I say, you did go 708 00:32:55,960 --> 00:32:57,840 Speaker 3: to the dinner and you went, well, this is my 709 00:32:57,840 --> 00:33:00,400 Speaker 3: friend's birthday dinner. I have to eat this, even though 710 00:33:00,400 --> 00:33:02,600 Speaker 3: I don't know what's going in there the next day 711 00:33:02,760 --> 00:33:05,280 Speaker 3: or straight after, even during how are you feeling? 712 00:33:05,360 --> 00:33:05,920 Speaker 5: Oh shocking. 713 00:33:06,000 --> 00:33:09,200 Speaker 1: It consumes when you're in that mindset. It consumes honestly 714 00:33:09,280 --> 00:33:12,400 Speaker 1: ninety five percent of your mental space, which is incredibly 715 00:33:12,480 --> 00:33:14,640 Speaker 1: unhealthy and so much to consume. It's that you think 716 00:33:14,680 --> 00:33:18,360 Speaker 1: about food all the time, and so for me it. 717 00:33:18,320 --> 00:33:20,120 Speaker 4: Would be just just quickly. 718 00:33:20,160 --> 00:33:21,959 Speaker 2: So I find this really because I don't think I've 719 00:33:21,960 --> 00:33:24,400 Speaker 2: ever spoken to someone about this before, because obviously we 720 00:33:24,440 --> 00:33:27,680 Speaker 2: talk about let's just deal with anorexia as a disease 721 00:33:27,680 --> 00:33:30,600 Speaker 2: of the mind, right, So like it's something that you 722 00:33:30,640 --> 00:33:33,320 Speaker 2: see yourself a certain way, and you have to continue 723 00:33:33,320 --> 00:33:37,880 Speaker 2: to perpetuate that image of yourself or you see yourself 724 00:33:37,880 --> 00:33:43,600 Speaker 2: differently to how everybody else sees you. Like behind that though, 725 00:33:45,720 --> 00:33:49,120 Speaker 2: do you feel like you can't tell people what's going on? 726 00:33:49,360 --> 00:33:51,360 Speaker 5: It's so embarrassing because right, so. 727 00:33:51,840 --> 00:33:54,640 Speaker 2: It's just the embarrassment. It's just yeah, it's a shame. 728 00:33:54,680 --> 00:33:55,720 Speaker 5: It's a shame about. 729 00:33:55,480 --> 00:33:57,760 Speaker 4: It because because you know that it's wrong. 730 00:33:57,920 --> 00:33:59,440 Speaker 1: You know you well, I did. I mean, I can't 731 00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:01,360 Speaker 1: speak everyone. For me, I knew, I knew. It wasn't 732 00:34:01,400 --> 00:34:03,240 Speaker 1: like you don't talk to people like you. I wouldn't 733 00:34:03,240 --> 00:34:04,920 Speaker 1: be at dinner with my friends and they're all eating 734 00:34:04,960 --> 00:34:06,760 Speaker 1: and not thinking about food, and all I can do 735 00:34:06,840 --> 00:34:09,120 Speaker 1: is think about it. I'm not going to say like, oh, 736 00:34:09,160 --> 00:34:12,239 Speaker 1: are you worried a that like that? It is shameful 737 00:34:12,480 --> 00:34:13,160 Speaker 1: to talk about it. 738 00:34:13,200 --> 00:34:17,160 Speaker 2: So you know that your behavior is irrational, like you, Yes. 739 00:34:17,320 --> 00:34:19,640 Speaker 1: You do know, like you know that I shouldn't be 740 00:34:19,640 --> 00:34:21,760 Speaker 1: thinking about Well, for me, I knew that I shouldn't 741 00:34:21,800 --> 00:34:24,319 Speaker 1: be thinking about food that much. And I could see 742 00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:26,160 Speaker 1: all these other people around me that were just enjoying 743 00:34:26,200 --> 00:34:29,440 Speaker 1: and living their lives and not consumed by this thought process. 744 00:34:29,960 --> 00:34:33,799 Speaker 1: But that doesn't help you get out of it in 745 00:34:33,840 --> 00:34:34,320 Speaker 1: any way. 746 00:34:34,200 --> 00:34:35,920 Speaker 2: What's yeah. Sure. So it's like someone who's addicted to 747 00:34:36,000 --> 00:34:38,080 Speaker 2: smoking being like, I know this is going to give 748 00:34:38,120 --> 00:34:42,400 Speaker 2: me cancer, but Jeseid killed for a dut Yeah, yeah right. 749 00:34:43,040 --> 00:34:43,839 Speaker 5: It's kind of like that. 750 00:34:44,080 --> 00:34:46,279 Speaker 1: And so for me it was it did take me 751 00:34:46,320 --> 00:34:48,279 Speaker 1: a long time to kind of rebuild out of that, 752 00:34:48,320 --> 00:34:49,400 Speaker 1: and same with Stephan. 753 00:34:49,480 --> 00:34:50,680 Speaker 5: It was once we had kind of. 754 00:34:50,640 --> 00:34:53,239 Speaker 1: Rebuilt our relationships with food and exercise that we then 755 00:34:54,040 --> 00:34:57,200 Speaker 1: started Kick to be able to help people do the 756 00:34:57,280 --> 00:35:00,680 Speaker 1: same thing. And that's how mission at kick to help 757 00:35:00,719 --> 00:35:03,880 Speaker 1: rebuild the relationship people have with exercise or health and wellness, 758 00:35:03,880 --> 00:35:06,800 Speaker 1: but most importantly themselves, because it is so much about 759 00:35:07,080 --> 00:35:10,839 Speaker 1: your relationship with yourself and how you Because when you 760 00:35:10,920 --> 00:35:15,560 Speaker 1: are heavily restricting yourself with food and excessively exercising, like 761 00:35:15,800 --> 00:35:18,160 Speaker 1: in a punishment kind of the words of punishment, guilt 762 00:35:18,200 --> 00:35:21,840 Speaker 1: around food, all those things, you're doing that because mostly 763 00:35:22,040 --> 00:35:23,880 Speaker 1: you hate your body because you're like, I need to 764 00:35:23,960 --> 00:35:24,600 Speaker 1: change my body. 765 00:35:24,800 --> 00:35:25,480 Speaker 5: I hate it. 766 00:35:26,120 --> 00:35:30,080 Speaker 1: But what we do with Kick is, and it's amazing, 767 00:35:30,160 --> 00:35:33,040 Speaker 1: we've been able to help so many people to reframe 768 00:35:33,080 --> 00:35:35,080 Speaker 1: that to they do it because they want to take 769 00:35:35,120 --> 00:35:36,600 Speaker 1: care of their body. 770 00:35:36,960 --> 00:35:38,520 Speaker 5: And then the language completely changes. 771 00:35:38,560 --> 00:35:42,600 Speaker 1: You don't use the word punishment or guilt or deprivation anymore. 772 00:35:42,680 --> 00:35:43,480 Speaker 5: That just goes. 773 00:35:43,520 --> 00:35:46,400 Speaker 1: It's just about finding ways to take care of yourself. 774 00:35:46,440 --> 00:35:49,960 Speaker 1: And what's been really interesting in coming back to running. 775 00:35:50,080 --> 00:35:53,600 Speaker 1: So I on Saturday did my first half marathon i'd 776 00:35:53,640 --> 00:35:56,880 Speaker 1: done in a really long time, which last year I 777 00:35:56,920 --> 00:35:59,840 Speaker 1: went through I was for about nine months, I was injured, 778 00:36:00,120 --> 00:36:02,040 Speaker 1: was over, I was didn't have a good balance with 779 00:36:02,120 --> 00:36:05,640 Speaker 1: work and life, and I was I put ted a 780 00:36:05,719 --> 00:36:07,280 Speaker 1: ligaman in my knee, and then I had a bolshes 781 00:36:07,400 --> 00:36:08,759 Speaker 1: in my dack back and then I. 782 00:36:08,680 --> 00:36:09,239 Speaker 2: Split my. 783 00:36:15,080 --> 00:36:18,040 Speaker 3: So we all three sorry, but like, were you just 784 00:36:18,160 --> 00:36:19,799 Speaker 3: like continuing to exercise? 785 00:36:20,160 --> 00:36:20,719 Speaker 5: No, I was. 786 00:36:20,840 --> 00:36:23,120 Speaker 1: I was resting, But then I was just I wasn't 787 00:36:23,160 --> 00:36:25,799 Speaker 1: putting time into my physio or like any I. 788 00:36:25,719 --> 00:36:26,080 Speaker 5: Was just thinking. 789 00:36:26,200 --> 00:36:27,400 Speaker 1: I was like, I don't have time to do that, 790 00:36:27,600 --> 00:36:28,719 Speaker 1: and then I just kept getting. 791 00:36:28,520 --> 00:36:29,640 Speaker 5: Re injured and re injured. 792 00:36:29,680 --> 00:36:32,400 Speaker 1: And so this year I put myself first for the 793 00:36:32,440 --> 00:36:34,120 Speaker 1: first time in a very long time. And that's not 794 00:36:34,160 --> 00:36:35,759 Speaker 1: in a way that I was selfish, but it was 795 00:36:35,840 --> 00:36:38,359 Speaker 1: just me having to overcome that feeling of like I 796 00:36:38,400 --> 00:36:40,560 Speaker 1: can go to a physio appointment at three thirty in 797 00:36:40,600 --> 00:36:42,440 Speaker 1: the day if like that's the only time the physio 798 00:36:42,520 --> 00:36:43,279 Speaker 1: can fit me. 799 00:36:43,200 --> 00:36:45,400 Speaker 5: In, and I know I will work, you know. 800 00:36:45,440 --> 00:36:47,120 Speaker 1: And also I'm no one tells me what to do 801 00:36:47,160 --> 00:36:49,239 Speaker 1: at work, like I'm I'm the boss. You know. 802 00:36:49,280 --> 00:36:51,879 Speaker 5: It's sad, but I'm like, oh, I'm going to get 803 00:36:51,920 --> 00:36:53,280 Speaker 5: like I just feel so guilty. 804 00:36:53,600 --> 00:36:56,000 Speaker 1: Yes, and so I had to work through I had 805 00:36:56,000 --> 00:36:56,759 Speaker 1: to work through that. 806 00:36:56,880 --> 00:37:00,120 Speaker 2: But in doing that, So so how did that go? Going? 807 00:37:00,280 --> 00:37:03,520 Speaker 2: Like I've got all this stuff that's you know, I 808 00:37:03,920 --> 00:37:05,640 Speaker 2: feel like I need to do, and then I've got 809 00:37:05,680 --> 00:37:08,600 Speaker 2: this stuff that I need to look after, and then 810 00:37:08,600 --> 00:37:11,359 Speaker 2: you've got because I think this kind of comes back 811 00:37:11,360 --> 00:37:13,799 Speaker 2: to this using exercise and health as a way to 812 00:37:13,800 --> 00:37:16,560 Speaker 2: express yourself because that's your pillar, right like if you're 813 00:37:16,600 --> 00:37:21,040 Speaker 2: looking at like you know, running is your meditation. And 814 00:37:21,080 --> 00:37:22,960 Speaker 2: then I just came along and was like, Okay, I'm 815 00:37:22,960 --> 00:37:26,160 Speaker 2: going to take the thing which is the way that 816 00:37:26,200 --> 00:37:28,840 Speaker 2: you get most release. Because I'm sure a lot of 817 00:37:28,880 --> 00:37:30,799 Speaker 2: people have had this civil work through injury in their time. 818 00:37:30,960 --> 00:37:33,759 Speaker 2: And whether you're a professional athlete or you just pulled 819 00:37:33,800 --> 00:37:36,880 Speaker 2: the muscle and you can't run, how did you go 820 00:37:36,920 --> 00:37:40,400 Speaker 2: about that? Woul Did you find other ways of getting 821 00:37:40,400 --> 00:37:41,719 Speaker 2: in touch with Hay or you just feel in a heap. 822 00:37:41,920 --> 00:37:44,440 Speaker 5: I just I just I wasn't. I just didn't feel myself. 823 00:37:44,480 --> 00:37:47,120 Speaker 5: It was interesting. It was two parts one part I. 824 00:37:47,200 --> 00:37:49,000 Speaker 1: And this is because of and it's not to say 825 00:37:49,040 --> 00:37:51,440 Speaker 1: I never have bad body image days, but I actually 826 00:37:51,560 --> 00:37:54,919 Speaker 1: didn't really because when i'd been injured in the past, 827 00:37:54,920 --> 00:37:57,280 Speaker 1: when I had a horrible relationship with food and exercise. 828 00:37:57,320 --> 00:37:59,400 Speaker 5: If I was injured, that to me was so scary. 829 00:37:59,560 --> 00:38:01,359 Speaker 4: Exactly exercise I can't like. 830 00:38:01,880 --> 00:38:03,680 Speaker 5: But I didn't. That was I didn't have any of 831 00:38:03,719 --> 00:38:06,320 Speaker 5: those thoughts. But what it meant. 832 00:38:06,400 --> 00:38:09,040 Speaker 1: Was instead of because I couldn't run, instead of and 833 00:38:09,080 --> 00:38:11,040 Speaker 1: I did, I did like a few polate sessions a 834 00:38:11,040 --> 00:38:13,240 Speaker 1: week in things, but I kind of thought, well, I 835 00:38:13,320 --> 00:38:16,960 Speaker 1: just can't do it. So I did nothing or hardly 836 00:38:17,000 --> 00:38:19,799 Speaker 1: anything for that period. It was very kind of. I 837 00:38:19,840 --> 00:38:22,440 Speaker 1: probably ran like every three when I wasn't injured, and 838 00:38:23,680 --> 00:38:26,480 Speaker 1: I just worked. So what I was doing was I 839 00:38:26,520 --> 00:38:28,640 Speaker 1: was getting to going to work, like leaving at seven 840 00:38:28,680 --> 00:38:31,600 Speaker 1: and then getting home at eight, and we did. We 841 00:38:31,640 --> 00:38:33,040 Speaker 1: had a lot on last year and it was like 842 00:38:33,120 --> 00:38:35,680 Speaker 1: work eight ebbs and flows, and you know it needs 843 00:38:35,719 --> 00:38:38,640 Speaker 1: sometimes it needs more of you than other times, but 844 00:38:38,880 --> 00:38:42,560 Speaker 1: I was not putting any boundaries in for myself, Like 845 00:38:42,600 --> 00:38:44,080 Speaker 1: there was things that I could do, like instead of 846 00:38:44,080 --> 00:38:46,640 Speaker 1: getting up and going on my emails the second I 847 00:38:46,680 --> 00:38:47,080 Speaker 1: wake up. 848 00:38:47,120 --> 00:38:48,000 Speaker 5: Or going on social media. 849 00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:49,880 Speaker 1: It's like I could have gone outside and had my 850 00:38:49,880 --> 00:38:52,400 Speaker 1: coffee outside and that takes five minutes. But the difference 851 00:38:52,440 --> 00:38:55,560 Speaker 1: that makes my mental health in the day is instrumental. 852 00:38:56,320 --> 00:38:58,439 Speaker 1: But I think I just didn't. It's like I didn't 853 00:38:58,480 --> 00:39:01,799 Speaker 1: give myself permission to do that. It was like, no, 854 00:39:01,920 --> 00:39:06,240 Speaker 1: everything else is so much more important. I put myself last. 855 00:39:06,920 --> 00:39:09,759 Speaker 1: And so this year and doing the half marathon on Saturday, 856 00:39:10,600 --> 00:39:12,880 Speaker 1: I was so proud of myself because I wouldn't have 857 00:39:12,880 --> 00:39:14,920 Speaker 1: got there if I didn't do my rehab exercises and 858 00:39:14,960 --> 00:39:15,560 Speaker 1: things properly. 859 00:39:15,600 --> 00:39:17,920 Speaker 5: But it was to me proof that this year I 860 00:39:18,080 --> 00:39:19,759 Speaker 5: have I have kind of. 861 00:39:21,440 --> 00:39:23,600 Speaker 1: Been okay with the fact that, like I am good 862 00:39:23,760 --> 00:39:26,960 Speaker 1: enough to take care of myself, which was last year 863 00:39:27,000 --> 00:39:28,680 Speaker 1: I just couldn't. It was like, I don't I'm not 864 00:39:28,719 --> 00:39:31,279 Speaker 1: deserving of that. But it's like I was really proud 865 00:39:31,320 --> 00:39:35,120 Speaker 1: because I do that moment, Like it wasn't about the 866 00:39:35,200 --> 00:39:37,960 Speaker 1: run even, it was just that like I've shown up 867 00:39:37,960 --> 00:39:40,880 Speaker 1: for myself. Yeah, and I'm not working less or anything. 868 00:39:40,880 --> 00:39:41,239 Speaker 5: I'm better. 869 00:39:41,360 --> 00:39:42,800 Speaker 1: I'm better at my work this year. I'm like, I 870 00:39:42,800 --> 00:39:45,319 Speaker 1: feel like a totally different person than I was last year. 871 00:39:45,640 --> 00:39:49,040 Speaker 1: But it was that reframing of my mindset that enabled 872 00:39:49,040 --> 00:39:49,560 Speaker 1: me to do that. 873 00:39:50,080 --> 00:39:52,040 Speaker 3: And convincing yourself as well, and which is true. I 874 00:39:52,080 --> 00:39:54,760 Speaker 3: don't need to convince yourself. But like as you said, 875 00:39:54,960 --> 00:39:57,160 Speaker 3: like you may not work the same hours as when 876 00:39:57,160 --> 00:40:00,280 Speaker 3: you did last year, but you're probably doing better work 877 00:40:00,520 --> 00:40:04,840 Speaker 3: because you're in a great mindset. It's a very traditional 878 00:40:04,920 --> 00:40:07,719 Speaker 3: way of viewing work is like no, hard work is 879 00:40:08,120 --> 00:40:11,080 Speaker 3: how long you work for. Whereas I think we are 880 00:40:11,200 --> 00:40:13,799 Speaker 3: moving past that. I think most people are coming on 881 00:40:13,800 --> 00:40:16,000 Speaker 3: that train. Some people are still maybe stuck in the 882 00:40:16,040 --> 00:40:17,960 Speaker 3: past a little bit there, but it's like, just do 883 00:40:18,000 --> 00:40:19,600 Speaker 3: what you need to do to do your best work. 884 00:40:19,920 --> 00:40:22,000 Speaker 3: I'm so happy to hear that you feel. It feels 885 00:40:22,000 --> 00:40:23,000 Speaker 3: like you've got to that space. 886 00:40:23,160 --> 00:40:25,280 Speaker 5: Thank you, No, it is, I am. I'm really proud. 887 00:40:25,280 --> 00:40:26,719 Speaker 5: But I think the other thing I've had to work 888 00:40:26,760 --> 00:40:29,759 Speaker 5: through with that is I have hit. 889 00:40:30,040 --> 00:40:32,600 Speaker 1: I hide behind. People often say that you work so hard. 890 00:40:32,680 --> 00:40:34,279 Speaker 1: It's like when people say you're selfless, and then I'm 891 00:40:34,280 --> 00:40:37,600 Speaker 1: like Okay, if I don't work really hard, what the 892 00:40:37,640 --> 00:40:40,480 Speaker 1: fuck am I good at? And so I've had to 893 00:40:40,600 --> 00:40:44,400 Speaker 1: really work on that because otherwise it's like a shield 894 00:40:45,000 --> 00:40:46,719 Speaker 1: and no one's like, no one's asking me to work 895 00:40:46,760 --> 00:40:48,480 Speaker 1: this hard. I just I do it because I think 896 00:40:48,680 --> 00:40:50,799 Speaker 1: it was like it is. And I'm still working through 897 00:40:50,840 --> 00:40:54,400 Speaker 1: this my shield of because no one questions. 898 00:40:54,640 --> 00:40:57,000 Speaker 2: And you never stopped working through it, Laura, Yeah. 899 00:40:57,160 --> 00:41:00,759 Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, how are you going on that? 900 00:41:01,280 --> 00:41:01,680 Speaker 4: Tell me. 901 00:41:03,760 --> 00:41:07,160 Speaker 2: You won't. I can speak on behalf of us. 902 00:41:09,040 --> 00:41:09,560 Speaker 6: Who we are. 903 00:41:10,719 --> 00:41:13,120 Speaker 2: It's funny just listening to talk about the exercise thing. 904 00:41:13,200 --> 00:41:16,600 Speaker 2: It's exactly the same framing, right. It's like the harder 905 00:41:16,640 --> 00:41:21,120 Speaker 2: I work here, then the more value I make, a 906 00:41:21,239 --> 00:41:23,640 Speaker 2: value I make myself. And you know it's you know, 907 00:41:23,719 --> 00:41:28,919 Speaker 2: listening to your childhood again carely, but you if you're 908 00:41:28,960 --> 00:41:32,200 Speaker 2: not standing out, if you're not doing stuff to value yourself, 909 00:41:32,200 --> 00:41:35,319 Speaker 2: and again you feel get scared about what you look 910 00:41:35,480 --> 00:41:39,160 Speaker 2: like without it. But the irony I found, and I'm 911 00:41:39,200 --> 00:41:41,360 Speaker 2: sure you're and it sounds like through your journey with 912 00:41:41,400 --> 00:41:44,839 Speaker 2: the injury, with running, you found the same thing. The 913 00:41:44,880 --> 00:41:50,839 Speaker 2: irony is the more that you stop, then the more 914 00:41:50,880 --> 00:41:56,880 Speaker 2: capacity you have to keep going. So and it takes 915 00:41:57,800 --> 00:41:59,760 Speaker 2: I don't know how many times it took me burning 916 00:41:59,760 --> 00:42:04,560 Speaker 2: out to realize that. And even now I probably get 917 00:42:04,719 --> 00:42:08,919 Speaker 2: right to the edge where I'm like, whoa, okay, and 918 00:42:08,960 --> 00:42:12,680 Speaker 2: it'll take Sam. I don't know if Dalton says it's 919 00:42:12,680 --> 00:42:15,160 Speaker 2: to you, but her just going to me, well, I'm 920 00:42:15,239 --> 00:42:18,560 Speaker 2: sure that works a good idea today, or because you 921 00:42:18,719 --> 00:42:23,319 Speaker 2: don't we're so identified with that mode that you don't 922 00:42:23,360 --> 00:42:25,840 Speaker 2: even pick up on it when you're in it. In fact, 923 00:42:26,000 --> 00:42:28,879 Speaker 2: the really fucked thing is and they're going to feel 924 00:42:28,880 --> 00:42:31,680 Speaker 2: like I can speak to you it feels really good. Yeah, 925 00:42:31,680 --> 00:42:32,160 Speaker 2: it's true. 926 00:42:32,400 --> 00:42:35,880 Speaker 1: Yeah, Yeah, it's like a drug feels really good. 927 00:42:36,280 --> 00:42:37,240 Speaker 3: It's working hard. 928 00:42:37,600 --> 00:42:40,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, when you're in the thinker of my drug, I 929 00:42:40,040 --> 00:42:43,440 Speaker 2: know it's so. And for everyone else it's like we 930 00:42:43,480 --> 00:42:48,160 Speaker 2: are talking in like Japanese, but for us to have 931 00:42:48,280 --> 00:42:51,000 Speaker 2: like sometimes I will get like a bit of a 932 00:42:51,080 --> 00:42:53,400 Speaker 2: rush on my phone if I open like an email 933 00:42:53,440 --> 00:42:55,000 Speaker 2: and I've got like a few other messages, and I 934 00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:57,239 Speaker 2: know I can just like I've got ten minutes here 935 00:42:57,280 --> 00:42:59,279 Speaker 2: to kick some ass, like I will fly. 936 00:43:02,160 --> 00:43:04,360 Speaker 5: It's fucked how you talk to your partner too in 937 00:43:04,360 --> 00:43:05,080 Speaker 5: that moment. 938 00:43:04,840 --> 00:43:06,680 Speaker 1: Because when Dolson says that to me, Like, you don't 939 00:43:06,680 --> 00:43:08,719 Speaker 1: fucking know, you don't know, you don't get it, you 940 00:43:08,760 --> 00:43:09,320 Speaker 1: don't get. 941 00:43:09,200 --> 00:43:13,680 Speaker 5: It, Okay, I have to do this. It's like who why? 942 00:43:13,760 --> 00:43:14,200 Speaker 3: Who is? 943 00:43:14,239 --> 00:43:16,359 Speaker 1: Like is Seph like on the other line telling you 944 00:43:16,400 --> 00:43:17,440 Speaker 1: she's gonna fire you? 945 00:43:17,640 --> 00:43:20,400 Speaker 3: Like no, no, You're doing it yourself. 946 00:43:20,640 --> 00:43:21,440 Speaker 5: He's like, well what are you? 947 00:43:21,520 --> 00:43:23,680 Speaker 1: And then but it's funny because I've learned a lot 948 00:43:23,719 --> 00:43:27,239 Speaker 1: through my coaching sessions. And then I come home and 949 00:43:27,239 --> 00:43:30,080 Speaker 1: I'm like, so, this is what I learned today. He's like, cool, 950 00:43:30,080 --> 00:43:31,279 Speaker 1: I've been saying that for five years. 951 00:43:32,800 --> 00:43:34,759 Speaker 4: I'm glad now that was me. 952 00:43:35,000 --> 00:43:35,480 Speaker 3: That was me. 953 00:43:35,640 --> 00:43:37,040 Speaker 2: I came up with that all by myself. 954 00:43:39,080 --> 00:43:41,120 Speaker 3: Can I focus on one other things here, which is 955 00:43:41,320 --> 00:43:45,839 Speaker 3: so you talk about wanting these five minutes outside with 956 00:43:45,880 --> 00:43:49,279 Speaker 3: your coffee and you're doing things for you and maybe 957 00:43:49,360 --> 00:43:52,600 Speaker 3: that's also the physio sessions and the run. And I 958 00:43:52,640 --> 00:43:58,440 Speaker 3: can personally, I can get very obsessive with what I 959 00:43:58,640 --> 00:44:02,440 Speaker 3: do in the morning and I and I try very 960 00:44:02,520 --> 00:44:04,880 Speaker 3: very hard to make space for there's certain thing I 961 00:44:05,000 --> 00:44:06,640 Speaker 3: go through it, but there's certain things that I do 962 00:44:06,719 --> 00:44:09,640 Speaker 3: every single morning to make sure my mind is right 963 00:44:09,680 --> 00:44:10,759 Speaker 3: and I feel good for the day. 964 00:44:11,840 --> 00:44:14,520 Speaker 2: The one how can I ask how lot how long 965 00:44:14,800 --> 00:44:17,520 Speaker 2: is that? Two hours? And it's like two it's like 966 00:44:17,520 --> 00:44:19,200 Speaker 2: one hundred and twenty minutes on the dot right, Like 967 00:44:19,239 --> 00:44:19,919 Speaker 2: it's so. 968 00:44:20,000 --> 00:44:22,839 Speaker 3: I wake up at five every morning because I the 969 00:44:22,880 --> 00:44:24,560 Speaker 3: best part of my morning every morning is waking up 970 00:44:24,560 --> 00:44:27,399 Speaker 3: for me at seven. But so but to make sure 971 00:44:27,440 --> 00:44:29,520 Speaker 3: I get my stuff done, I get up at five. 972 00:44:30,080 --> 00:44:31,240 Speaker 3: So I've got this two hour. 973 00:44:31,320 --> 00:44:33,320 Speaker 5: Is that also why you have such big muscles? 974 00:44:33,640 --> 00:44:33,920 Speaker 3: Thank you? 975 00:44:34,080 --> 00:44:35,880 Speaker 5: That way they and I see the veins. 976 00:44:36,040 --> 00:44:40,320 Speaker 4: Thank you, thanks, thank you, thank you for our routine. 977 00:44:40,320 --> 00:44:44,359 Speaker 3: I appreciate that. So okay, So that's that's that's that's 978 00:44:44,400 --> 00:44:45,440 Speaker 3: something that I and. 979 00:44:50,800 --> 00:44:53,000 Speaker 4: I started this way of the blood. 980 00:44:56,400 --> 00:45:05,640 Speaker 7: Stop looking at me, general lights off that God is 981 00:45:06,080 --> 00:45:06,920 Speaker 7: oranges as well. 982 00:45:07,280 --> 00:45:09,760 Speaker 2: I think there's a spray tan regime in there somewhere 983 00:45:09,760 --> 00:45:11,120 Speaker 2: as well. I swear to God, I've. 984 00:45:11,040 --> 00:45:11,640 Speaker 3: Got two hours. 985 00:45:12,840 --> 00:45:14,040 Speaker 2: What he is ken. 986 00:45:16,400 --> 00:45:22,200 Speaker 3: So that got tricky for me when Remy came into 987 00:45:22,200 --> 00:45:24,200 Speaker 3: the world. Stop looking at my arms and look into 988 00:45:24,239 --> 00:45:28,360 Speaker 3: my eyes when my daughter Remy came into the world, 989 00:45:28,640 --> 00:45:31,719 Speaker 3: because I mean, now I'm in a great routine because 990 00:45:31,719 --> 00:45:34,160 Speaker 3: she sleeps through till seven. But there was a stage 991 00:45:34,200 --> 00:45:37,560 Speaker 3: there where it was like anything can happen, I might 992 00:45:37,600 --> 00:45:40,800 Speaker 3: be up all night. What does that mean for the routine? 993 00:45:40,840 --> 00:45:43,319 Speaker 3: And da da da da. I know you're doing a 994 00:45:43,360 --> 00:45:46,120 Speaker 3: new podcast where you are working through this idea of 995 00:45:46,680 --> 00:45:48,279 Speaker 3: whether you want to have a baby or not. 996 00:45:49,120 --> 00:45:51,800 Speaker 4: Is that a big factor control? 997 00:45:52,600 --> 00:45:55,680 Speaker 3: Well, this idea of what your day needs to look like, 998 00:45:55,719 --> 00:45:59,520 Speaker 3: whether that's working a certain amount or doing things to 999 00:45:59,560 --> 00:46:03,040 Speaker 3: get your helf right. And when we can speak from 1000 00:46:03,080 --> 00:46:06,439 Speaker 3: experience here, a child can just throw that right up. 1001 00:46:06,320 --> 00:46:08,320 Speaker 5: In the air there one hundred percent. 1002 00:46:08,680 --> 00:46:10,400 Speaker 3: How is that sitting with you? And I don't know 1003 00:46:10,440 --> 00:46:12,919 Speaker 3: exactly where you're up to in the podcast as yet 1004 00:46:13,000 --> 00:46:16,160 Speaker 3: or whether you've come to a decision either, But is 1005 00:46:16,200 --> 00:46:18,839 Speaker 3: that is that a big factor that you're currently thinking through? 1006 00:46:19,000 --> 00:46:20,680 Speaker 5: One d I think that's so. 1007 00:46:20,840 --> 00:46:22,359 Speaker 2: I thought law it was a mirror image of maybe, 1008 00:46:22,360 --> 00:46:24,680 Speaker 2: but maybe she's like Captain Planet, you know, by our 1009 00:46:24,719 --> 00:46:27,640 Speaker 2: powers combined. It's really weird thing. 1010 00:46:27,600 --> 00:46:30,319 Speaker 3: Going on around like half and half of you as well. 1011 00:46:30,400 --> 00:46:32,200 Speaker 2: She kind of combines us together. 1012 00:46:32,280 --> 00:46:37,400 Speaker 3: I know, this is really really shame you and me 1013 00:46:37,520 --> 00:46:38,040 Speaker 3: had a love. 1014 00:46:38,000 --> 00:46:38,600 Speaker 6: Child and. 1015 00:46:45,000 --> 00:46:47,880 Speaker 2: That's crook anyway, No, no, you've taken the best of 1016 00:46:47,880 --> 00:46:52,719 Speaker 2: both of us. I'm really rattled by that. Sorry, back 1017 00:46:52,760 --> 00:46:53,239 Speaker 2: to your question. 1018 00:46:53,640 --> 00:46:58,000 Speaker 1: So, yes, control so for me in because I'm thirty 1019 00:46:58,040 --> 00:47:01,719 Speaker 1: one now, and I think in getting to the kind 1020 00:47:01,760 --> 00:47:05,520 Speaker 1: of in quotation mark's child bearing age or closer to 1021 00:47:06,320 --> 00:47:09,879 Speaker 1: you know, the age that know, biologically, I do need 1022 00:47:09,960 --> 00:47:12,320 Speaker 1: to start thinking about having children. Saying that in the 1023 00:47:12,360 --> 00:47:15,719 Speaker 1: podcast series, we've actually interviewed interviewed an incredible woman who 1024 00:47:15,760 --> 00:47:18,279 Speaker 1: had her first child at forty three, So you know, 1025 00:47:18,360 --> 00:47:20,319 Speaker 1: it is there is that kind of We've had that 1026 00:47:20,360 --> 00:47:24,960 Speaker 1: conversation too, around the kind of I suppose judgment from 1027 00:47:25,000 --> 00:47:27,720 Speaker 1: society on like in quotation marks being an older parent 1028 00:47:27,760 --> 00:47:29,960 Speaker 1: and there being nothing wrong with that. But I think 1029 00:47:30,000 --> 00:47:33,200 Speaker 1: for me, when I was younger, I kind of all 1030 00:47:33,280 --> 00:47:36,160 Speaker 1: everyone just you just kind of assume, especially as a woman, 1031 00:47:36,160 --> 00:47:37,920 Speaker 1: that you're going to have kids, because. 1032 00:47:37,640 --> 00:47:41,000 Speaker 5: That's what society tells you is like a successful life. 1033 00:47:41,960 --> 00:47:44,280 Speaker 4: In you from you see, yeah, exactly. 1034 00:47:44,800 --> 00:47:48,160 Speaker 1: And so I suppose I hadn't really thought about it, 1035 00:47:48,200 --> 00:47:50,840 Speaker 1: but because of that assumption, I suppose I just assumed, oh, Okay, 1036 00:47:50,880 --> 00:47:54,239 Speaker 1: I'll have kids, That's what everyone does. And then as 1037 00:47:54,280 --> 00:47:57,239 Speaker 1: I've started to get kind of into my thirties, when 1038 00:47:57,280 --> 00:47:59,680 Speaker 1: my friends and now a lot of them have had children, 1039 00:48:00,640 --> 00:48:02,839 Speaker 1: I thought that the closer I got to the age 1040 00:48:02,880 --> 00:48:05,000 Speaker 1: that I thought I was going to have children, the 1041 00:48:05,080 --> 00:48:07,960 Speaker 1: more ready I would feel. But it has been the 1042 00:48:08,160 --> 00:48:12,400 Speaker 1: complete opposite. And I think I've seen I've seen firsthand 1043 00:48:12,400 --> 00:48:15,359 Speaker 1: from so many of my friends and also on social 1044 00:48:15,440 --> 00:48:19,520 Speaker 1: media how hard parenting can be and things like for me, 1045 00:48:20,120 --> 00:48:24,040 Speaker 1: I mean, my career is a big one and like 1046 00:48:24,280 --> 00:48:26,719 Speaker 1: and in the podcast we kind of explore can we 1047 00:48:26,800 --> 00:48:27,200 Speaker 1: do both? 1048 00:48:27,280 --> 00:48:28,280 Speaker 4: Is that possible? 1049 00:48:28,960 --> 00:48:32,080 Speaker 1: Then? Also the yeah, the control element of like I 1050 00:48:32,160 --> 00:48:35,400 Speaker 1: love my life the way it is now, like I 1051 00:48:35,600 --> 00:48:37,720 Speaker 1: my relate, I know it also can put huge stress 1052 00:48:37,719 --> 00:48:40,480 Speaker 1: on relationships and in marriages, and so it's all of 1053 00:48:40,520 --> 00:48:43,359 Speaker 1: these kind of I started the series with a lot 1054 00:48:43,360 --> 00:48:47,360 Speaker 1: of fears around kind of my relationship, like just having 1055 00:48:47,480 --> 00:48:50,080 Speaker 1: been out of make sporadic plans like my morning routine, 1056 00:48:50,120 --> 00:48:52,839 Speaker 1: like things like that, just being in control of my 1057 00:48:53,200 --> 00:48:59,280 Speaker 1: life and wondering like how would a kid fit into 1058 00:48:59,320 --> 00:49:01,840 Speaker 1: this and will be able to because I don't have this. 1059 00:49:01,920 --> 00:49:03,640 Speaker 1: I think one of the biggest questions to me was 1060 00:49:03,960 --> 00:49:06,319 Speaker 1: because I'm not I don't feel innately like so many 1061 00:49:06,360 --> 00:49:09,319 Speaker 1: people around me feel innately like, oh, of course I 1062 00:49:09,360 --> 00:49:11,040 Speaker 1: want to have children like it, And that's something that 1063 00:49:11,080 --> 00:49:13,359 Speaker 1: Sef speaks about like she's always wanted to be a mother. 1064 00:49:14,360 --> 00:49:16,719 Speaker 1: I had this fear of, well, if I don't really 1065 00:49:16,800 --> 00:49:20,240 Speaker 1: know one hundred percent, will the want be strong enough 1066 00:49:20,480 --> 00:49:22,759 Speaker 1: to kind of combat how hard it is, and like 1067 00:49:22,800 --> 00:49:26,200 Speaker 1: will I not be able to cope? And so I 1068 00:49:26,280 --> 00:49:29,080 Speaker 1: really didn't know, And that's what we've kind of worked 1069 00:49:29,080 --> 00:49:32,520 Speaker 1: through in the podcast of I didn't know if I 1070 00:49:32,560 --> 00:49:34,680 Speaker 1: did want to have kids, but then I also definitely 1071 00:49:34,719 --> 00:49:36,040 Speaker 1: wasn't at the point where I was like, no, I 1072 00:49:36,080 --> 00:49:38,200 Speaker 1: don't want to have kids. And it's kind of this 1073 00:49:38,280 --> 00:49:40,680 Speaker 1: fear of like will you regret it or will you 1074 00:49:40,840 --> 00:49:44,560 Speaker 1: like either way whatever decision that you make. And then 1075 00:49:44,680 --> 00:49:47,520 Speaker 1: another thing that was really important to explore was around 1076 00:49:47,960 --> 00:49:50,239 Speaker 1: a lot of people say that, and obviously everyone has 1077 00:49:50,239 --> 00:49:52,759 Speaker 1: their own personal experience, but when they say like you 1078 00:49:52,800 --> 00:49:55,279 Speaker 1: won't have love, like you won't love and you won't 1079 00:49:55,320 --> 00:49:57,400 Speaker 1: know what love is until you have a child like, 1080 00:49:57,440 --> 00:49:59,480 Speaker 1: stuff like that is actually very hard to hear for 1081 00:49:59,520 --> 00:50:04,120 Speaker 1: people that a child less by choice or because of infertility. 1082 00:50:04,160 --> 00:50:06,040 Speaker 1: So I think that's something else that's so important. One 1083 00:50:06,080 --> 00:50:10,360 Speaker 1: in six couples actually experience infertility in Australia, which is 1084 00:50:10,400 --> 00:50:12,760 Speaker 1: devastating and so even if you want to have children, 1085 00:50:12,760 --> 00:50:16,080 Speaker 1: it's not always something that you can do. And so 1086 00:50:16,280 --> 00:50:18,560 Speaker 1: I think I really wanted to challenge the idea that 1087 00:50:18,600 --> 00:50:22,040 Speaker 1: to have joy and love and community in your life 1088 00:50:22,880 --> 00:50:26,120 Speaker 1: you need to have children to be able to have that. 1089 00:50:26,239 --> 00:50:28,920 Speaker 1: And we spoke to some incredible women that don't have children, 1090 00:50:29,000 --> 00:50:33,120 Speaker 1: that have a fantastic, wonderful life and they are really happy, 1091 00:50:33,120 --> 00:50:37,239 Speaker 1: and that was really special kind of to hear. But yeah, 1092 00:50:37,239 --> 00:50:40,600 Speaker 1: it's something that I'm still still working through. But what 1093 00:50:40,719 --> 00:50:43,719 Speaker 1: the podcast has helped the most in is going deep 1094 00:50:43,800 --> 00:50:47,760 Speaker 1: within me and not making like how someone else's parents 1095 00:50:47,800 --> 00:50:50,160 Speaker 1: is not how I need If I do decide I 1096 00:50:50,160 --> 00:50:52,799 Speaker 1: want to have children, needs a parent, And I think 1097 00:50:52,840 --> 00:50:54,000 Speaker 1: I felt this like, oh well. 1098 00:50:53,920 --> 00:50:55,799 Speaker 5: This person says this, and this person says this, So 1099 00:50:55,840 --> 00:50:58,760 Speaker 5: that's exactly how I need to do it. But you don't. 1100 00:50:58,840 --> 00:51:01,440 Speaker 5: You can do it, you know your way if you 1101 00:51:01,520 --> 00:51:02,600 Speaker 5: choose to do it. 1102 00:51:02,960 --> 00:51:07,480 Speaker 3: Yeah, definitely, definitely. And how does the conversations with Dalton 1103 00:51:07,680 --> 00:51:11,000 Speaker 3: around this like are you are you on a similar page? 1104 00:51:11,000 --> 00:51:12,320 Speaker 3: Are you on different pages? 1105 00:51:12,920 --> 00:51:14,719 Speaker 5: So we actually what would you know when this is 1106 00:51:14,719 --> 00:51:15,360 Speaker 5: coming out. 1107 00:51:17,120 --> 00:51:17,520 Speaker 2: Next week? 1108 00:51:17,600 --> 00:51:17,920 Speaker 3: Next week? 1109 00:51:18,080 --> 00:51:18,720 Speaker 5: Next week? Okay? 1110 00:51:18,719 --> 00:51:18,959 Speaker 6: Cool? 1111 00:51:19,080 --> 00:51:22,240 Speaker 2: So to come out the week after Okay, the episode 1112 00:51:22,239 --> 00:51:26,160 Speaker 2: with you have you have an episode with Dalton, Yes, 1113 00:51:26,239 --> 00:51:26,680 Speaker 2: coming up. 1114 00:51:26,880 --> 00:51:29,120 Speaker 1: So the last episode of the podcast is and it 1115 00:51:29,200 --> 00:51:32,319 Speaker 1: was very good. Dalton was a good sport in being 1116 00:51:32,320 --> 00:51:38,200 Speaker 1: open to doing this. But I do say having when 1117 00:51:38,200 --> 00:51:39,760 Speaker 1: you married me you knew I did content. 1118 00:51:42,520 --> 00:51:42,920 Speaker 7: It is. 1119 00:51:46,600 --> 00:51:48,560 Speaker 5: No but in something like this we would have we 1120 00:51:48,600 --> 00:51:50,319 Speaker 5: would have spoken about it. If you know, it would 1121 00:51:50,320 --> 00:51:50,759 Speaker 5: have been come. 1122 00:51:50,719 --> 00:51:56,719 Speaker 4: To of course, he also loves it. He loves Okay. 1123 00:51:56,760 --> 00:51:59,719 Speaker 1: So anyway, we had the conversation. So we kind of 1124 00:51:59,760 --> 00:52:02,040 Speaker 1: had spoken about where we were both at before I 1125 00:52:02,080 --> 00:52:04,480 Speaker 1: started the podcast, but I had so many questions that 1126 00:52:04,520 --> 00:52:08,520 Speaker 1: I just wanted to explore and ask and we then hadn't. 1127 00:52:08,239 --> 00:52:09,880 Speaker 5: Spoken about it. 1128 00:52:10,000 --> 00:52:11,680 Speaker 1: Actually, it was funny because at the start of the podcast, 1129 00:52:11,719 --> 00:52:13,560 Speaker 1: I was like, I didn't even ask you if it 1130 00:52:13,600 --> 00:52:14,800 Speaker 1: was okay I was doing this podcast. 1131 00:52:14,840 --> 00:52:16,200 Speaker 5: I really talked to you about it either. 1132 00:52:16,000 --> 00:52:19,080 Speaker 1: But maybe I need to apply the communication things in 1133 00:52:19,160 --> 00:52:19,839 Speaker 1: my marriage too. 1134 00:52:20,440 --> 00:52:22,400 Speaker 5: Anyway, but he was like, nah, you do you you know? 1135 00:52:23,280 --> 00:52:27,279 Speaker 1: Anyway, but we were on Mike so and then at 1136 00:52:27,280 --> 00:52:29,440 Speaker 1: the end of the so in that episode we then 1137 00:52:29,719 --> 00:52:31,839 Speaker 1: both shared I kind of shared what I learned through 1138 00:52:31,840 --> 00:52:33,520 Speaker 1: the series and where I was at in terms of 1139 00:52:33,600 --> 00:52:35,960 Speaker 1: the decision, and so did he and that was amazing. 1140 00:52:36,080 --> 00:52:37,640 Speaker 5: What was really interesting in. 1141 00:52:37,640 --> 00:52:40,919 Speaker 1: Episode six, so we'll be out in a few days 1142 00:52:40,960 --> 00:52:45,080 Speaker 1: after this episode comes out. We spoke with a relationship 1143 00:52:45,120 --> 00:52:48,359 Speaker 1: counselor about it because I wanted to ask her if 1144 00:52:48,400 --> 00:52:51,440 Speaker 1: one person wants to have kids and the other doesn't, do. 1145 00:52:51,480 --> 00:52:52,399 Speaker 5: You have to break up? 1146 00:52:53,880 --> 00:52:58,040 Speaker 1: And it was really interesting because in her experience in 1147 00:52:58,120 --> 00:53:01,839 Speaker 1: working with lots and lots of client what she had 1148 00:53:01,880 --> 00:53:04,640 Speaker 1: seen is if one person does and one person doesn't, 1149 00:53:04,760 --> 00:53:08,399 Speaker 1: then there's always resentment for whichever one didn't get what 1150 00:53:08,440 --> 00:53:09,319 Speaker 1: they wanted. 1151 00:53:08,960 --> 00:53:11,880 Speaker 5: Because it is it's a huge it's a huge it's almost. 1152 00:53:11,600 --> 00:53:13,440 Speaker 1: Like a value if you want to have children or not. 1153 00:53:13,600 --> 00:53:17,520 Speaker 1: It's life altering decision. And what happens in those relationships 1154 00:53:17,600 --> 00:53:20,439 Speaker 1: is so for example, if the maybe the dad doesn't 1155 00:53:20,440 --> 00:53:22,360 Speaker 1: want to have kids and the mum does, then on 1156 00:53:22,400 --> 00:53:24,279 Speaker 1: a Saturday, the mom's like, oh, I was going to 1157 00:53:24,320 --> 00:53:26,240 Speaker 1: catch up with a friend today. The dad's like, well 1158 00:53:26,320 --> 00:53:27,480 Speaker 1: you I didn't want this. 1159 00:53:27,600 --> 00:53:28,520 Speaker 5: You wanted this like. 1160 00:53:28,480 --> 00:53:33,000 Speaker 1: I'm going or vice or vice versa, and the resentment. 1161 00:53:33,000 --> 00:53:35,040 Speaker 1: And she said that she has never seen a couple 1162 00:53:35,120 --> 00:53:39,319 Speaker 1: that has one has wanted and one hasn't openly and 1163 00:53:39,520 --> 00:53:43,479 Speaker 1: it's worked out for their relationships, and it just made 1164 00:53:43,480 --> 00:53:45,400 Speaker 1: me realize that it's not and I didn't before we 1165 00:53:45,640 --> 00:53:46,640 Speaker 1: started the podcast series. 1166 00:53:46,680 --> 00:53:47,319 Speaker 5: I did not think this. 1167 00:53:47,440 --> 00:53:50,000 Speaker 1: But it's not just it is a decision you make together, 1168 00:53:50,600 --> 00:53:53,239 Speaker 1: but you need to decide what you both want separately, 1169 00:53:53,520 --> 00:53:56,000 Speaker 1: not together. And I feel like it's always been or 1170 00:53:56,000 --> 00:53:57,680 Speaker 1: for me sold to me like, oh, it's something we 1171 00:53:57,719 --> 00:54:00,440 Speaker 1: decide we want together, but it's separate and then you 1172 00:54:00,480 --> 00:54:01,600 Speaker 1: come together and make the decision. 1173 00:54:01,600 --> 00:54:04,359 Speaker 2: It's the same as your relationship with Steph, right, same 1174 00:54:04,400 --> 00:54:05,160 Speaker 2: sort of principle. 1175 00:54:05,400 --> 00:54:07,360 Speaker 4: Yeah, ultimately exactly, you had to. 1176 00:54:07,320 --> 00:54:09,239 Speaker 2: Look after yourself before you're looking after the two of you. 1177 00:54:10,400 --> 00:54:11,920 Speaker 3: Very honest and can I. 1178 00:54:11,880 --> 00:54:16,160 Speaker 2: Say like it in a like truly complimentary form, like 1179 00:54:16,200 --> 00:54:18,680 Speaker 2: there is so I know that obviously this is content 1180 00:54:18,760 --> 00:54:22,680 Speaker 2: and it sounds like the podcast is really great. I 1181 00:54:22,719 --> 00:54:24,840 Speaker 2: like it is a really good thing I think for 1182 00:54:24,880 --> 00:54:28,200 Speaker 2: people to listen to to before they have kids, because 1183 00:54:28,880 --> 00:54:32,160 Speaker 2: I know that I certainly felt the societal thing pre 1184 00:54:32,360 --> 00:54:35,319 Speaker 2: having kids. I don't Sam was openly very keen, but 1185 00:54:35,400 --> 00:54:39,239 Speaker 2: I don't think I think we also. I think we 1186 00:54:39,280 --> 00:54:40,840 Speaker 2: also had a horrible moment. I'm sure a lot of 1187 00:54:40,840 --> 00:54:42,400 Speaker 2: the parents have this, but I remember I was holding 1188 00:54:42,440 --> 00:54:45,160 Speaker 2: Max in the kitchen. Sam couldn't hold her anymore because 1189 00:54:45,320 --> 00:54:47,960 Speaker 2: like her back was cooked because she had she had 1190 00:54:47,960 --> 00:54:50,200 Speaker 2: to have an emergency cesarian, so she couldn't hold her 1191 00:54:50,200 --> 00:54:52,000 Speaker 2: because the something was cooked, and then like her back 1192 00:54:52,080 --> 00:54:54,480 Speaker 2: was cooked. And then she worked me up and I'd 1193 00:54:54,560 --> 00:54:56,600 Speaker 2: just been up with her for like three hours and 1194 00:54:56,640 --> 00:54:58,440 Speaker 2: I had worked the next day, and she was standing 1195 00:54:58,440 --> 00:55:01,440 Speaker 2: in the kitchen I think a month in or something 1196 00:55:01,520 --> 00:55:04,840 Speaker 2: like that, and she was like, can you come and 1197 00:55:04,840 --> 00:55:06,520 Speaker 2: take her? And I was like sure, And I remember 1198 00:55:06,560 --> 00:55:10,520 Speaker 2: holding her in the kitchen and just thinking like I can't. 1199 00:55:11,040 --> 00:55:13,040 Speaker 2: I just can't do this. And I said to Sam, 1200 00:55:13,080 --> 00:55:15,080 Speaker 2: I was like, I think we made a really bad choice, 1201 00:55:15,840 --> 00:55:17,880 Speaker 2: Like I just remember having that for I was like, 1202 00:55:18,360 --> 00:55:23,600 Speaker 2: this was dumb, Like this was really dumb and it wasn't. 1203 00:55:23,800 --> 00:55:28,400 Speaker 2: Turns out it wasn't. But in saying that, I didn't 1204 00:55:28,680 --> 00:55:35,160 Speaker 2: think that we'd sufficiently spoken about it. And that is 1205 00:55:35,239 --> 00:55:38,880 Speaker 2: what that conversation made scary for me is because I 1206 00:55:38,960 --> 00:55:44,239 Speaker 2: was like, I remember thinking to myself the thought this 1207 00:55:44,280 --> 00:55:46,879 Speaker 2: is a bad decision, but I didn't want to say 1208 00:55:46,880 --> 00:55:50,239 Speaker 2: it out loud because I was like, well, We've got 1209 00:55:50,239 --> 00:55:52,400 Speaker 2: a fucking kid now there's nothing we can do about it, 1210 00:55:52,480 --> 00:55:56,160 Speaker 2: so it's here. So why would I say that? But 1211 00:55:56,200 --> 00:55:59,360 Speaker 2: I remember being angry. We're not angry, but like, I 1212 00:55:59,360 --> 00:56:03,440 Speaker 2: feel like I let myself down by not sitting down 1213 00:56:03,520 --> 00:56:08,840 Speaker 2: with her and making and having a really boring, scientific 1214 00:56:08,960 --> 00:56:12,959 Speaker 2: conversation about what our lives would look like. We didn't 1215 00:56:13,000 --> 00:56:14,839 Speaker 2: do that because it was just like, we're in love. 1216 00:56:14,920 --> 00:56:16,520 Speaker 2: We want to have kids. That's the first thing she 1217 00:56:16,520 --> 00:56:17,840 Speaker 2: said to me the first day we went on, just like, 1218 00:56:17,880 --> 00:56:19,840 Speaker 2: I really want to have kids. I remember saying that, 1219 00:56:19,880 --> 00:56:21,279 Speaker 2: and I was like, great, I really want to have kids. 1220 00:56:21,280 --> 00:56:24,319 Speaker 2: Who can't wait? But we never I mean we didn't. 1221 00:56:24,880 --> 00:56:26,960 Speaker 2: We didn't do a podcast about it. We certainly didn't 1222 00:56:26,960 --> 00:56:28,160 Speaker 2: do a podcast about it. But we didn't have a 1223 00:56:28,200 --> 00:56:30,480 Speaker 2: conversation about it. And I just don't think there are 1224 00:56:30,480 --> 00:56:33,120 Speaker 2: that many people that do at all. And I know 1225 00:56:33,440 --> 00:56:35,440 Speaker 2: even the thought of having a second one for us 1226 00:56:36,280 --> 00:56:38,480 Speaker 2: is heavily because we've spoken about it a lot since 1227 00:56:38,480 --> 00:56:45,399 Speaker 2: then predicated with we need to talk about what and why? 1228 00:56:45,680 --> 00:56:48,080 Speaker 2: More more importantly, why, like why do we feel like 1229 00:56:48,080 --> 00:56:50,839 Speaker 2: because a lot of the time, well, certainly with having 1230 00:56:50,840 --> 00:56:53,560 Speaker 2: a second one, the idea is everyone else is doing it. 1231 00:56:54,080 --> 00:56:56,960 Speaker 2: And there's this really strange logic with having a second one, 1232 00:56:57,000 --> 00:57:01,000 Speaker 2: which is, well, let's just get them all out, and 1233 00:57:01,040 --> 00:57:03,120 Speaker 2: it's also get more right. 1234 00:57:04,040 --> 00:57:06,280 Speaker 1: There's a lot of from society like it's the shame 1235 00:57:06,320 --> 00:57:08,759 Speaker 1: of not having children is very big, or not knowing 1236 00:57:08,760 --> 00:57:10,920 Speaker 1: if you want them, but also having one child, and 1237 00:57:10,960 --> 00:57:12,480 Speaker 1: a lot of people have sent that in that have 1238 00:57:12,600 --> 00:57:15,160 Speaker 1: been listening, not just because they've had one, like they've 1239 00:57:15,160 --> 00:57:16,840 Speaker 1: had one child and now they're trying to decide if 1240 00:57:16,840 --> 00:57:19,840 Speaker 1: they want to have a second one, because I do 1241 00:57:19,920 --> 00:57:23,040 Speaker 1: think society tells us a successful life is having two 1242 00:57:23,120 --> 00:57:26,560 Speaker 1: children and two parents, and that's which is obviously not. 1243 00:57:26,480 --> 00:57:27,360 Speaker 4: The case at all. 1244 00:57:27,880 --> 00:57:30,320 Speaker 1: But it is that pressure of like, oh, well, won't 1245 00:57:30,320 --> 00:57:32,400 Speaker 1: you will your kid be like selfish if they're just 1246 00:57:32,440 --> 00:57:35,280 Speaker 1: like like all of these judgments. 1247 00:57:34,920 --> 00:57:36,560 Speaker 3: That are waiting for me to confide. 1248 00:57:36,600 --> 00:57:38,800 Speaker 5: I'm going to open the WhatsApp. Hang on, what's it called? 1249 00:57:38,840 --> 00:57:39,000 Speaker 1: Is it? 1250 00:57:39,040 --> 00:57:44,280 Speaker 5: I think it's called dinner. We must get together for dinner. 1251 00:57:45,320 --> 00:57:49,120 Speaker 3: That's the name of what's happened. We're waiting on you, 1252 00:57:48,680 --> 00:57:50,640 Speaker 3: you said, I said. 1253 00:57:52,160 --> 00:57:54,040 Speaker 2: Who's sitting in the bloor? Who's sitting in the bloor? 1254 00:57:54,480 --> 00:57:55,560 Speaker 2: In the blue. Do you reply? 1255 00:57:56,000 --> 00:58:04,440 Speaker 1: It's you said, the longer, the anti anticipation for this 1256 00:58:04,480 --> 00:58:06,680 Speaker 1: dinner is awesome. So for everyone listening, we've been trying 1257 00:58:06,680 --> 00:58:10,360 Speaker 1: to plan a dinner with all six of us, our 1258 00:58:10,480 --> 00:58:12,600 Speaker 1: respective partners and. 1259 00:58:12,520 --> 00:58:15,840 Speaker 2: Us which partners I wasn't telling partners. 1260 00:58:16,680 --> 00:58:23,520 Speaker 6: I don't know for absolutely shattered. Let kids welcome, so 1261 00:58:23,960 --> 00:58:28,200 Speaker 6: absolutely not. This is kids, Absolutely. 1262 00:58:30,520 --> 00:58:32,080 Speaker 5: No kid, what's time? I don't have any break. 1263 00:58:33,800 --> 00:58:36,240 Speaker 2: This is you bring your best friend. I bring my 1264 00:58:36,560 --> 00:58:39,000 Speaker 2: best friend and we sit down and we have a 1265 00:58:39,000 --> 00:58:41,240 Speaker 2: few wines and talk about the pitfalls of being in 1266 00:58:41,240 --> 00:58:42,160 Speaker 2: a business relationship. 1267 00:58:42,320 --> 00:58:44,640 Speaker 1: Sure, and so we've been trying to book this dinner 1268 00:58:44,680 --> 00:58:46,720 Speaker 1: and I'm actually embarrassed, but I reckon it's true years 1269 00:58:46,720 --> 00:58:49,560 Speaker 1: and we have this WhatsApp threads and the last message 1270 00:58:49,560 --> 00:58:52,720 Speaker 1: from what he is the anticipation for the dinner is awesome. 1271 00:58:52,960 --> 00:58:55,160 Speaker 1: The longer we leave it, the more it builds. It's 1272 00:58:55,200 --> 00:58:59,120 Speaker 1: bloody sensational. I think daily about what almet I will 1273 00:58:59,120 --> 00:59:01,920 Speaker 1: wear and what my opening question will be to instigate 1274 00:59:01,960 --> 00:59:03,000 Speaker 1: spicy conversation. 1275 00:59:03,080 --> 00:59:09,480 Speaker 2: And yet, okay, that is a thread killer. 1276 00:59:10,840 --> 00:59:11,600 Speaker 4: Will you reply? 1277 00:59:12,040 --> 00:59:14,280 Speaker 1: And then you said I like Saturday afternoons, which can 1278 00:59:14,320 --> 00:59:18,280 Speaker 1: go into the evening and Thursday nights, almost all can 1279 00:59:18,320 --> 00:59:21,080 Speaker 1: be made available for a catch up like this, and 1280 00:59:21,120 --> 00:59:23,200 Speaker 1: then nothing from it. And then you did a laugh 1281 00:59:23,280 --> 00:59:27,360 Speaker 1: face and we have read since the twenty third of April. 1282 00:59:27,720 --> 00:59:30,360 Speaker 2: That was last time. That was a month ago. That 1283 00:59:30,480 --> 00:59:31,080 Speaker 2: was a month ago. 1284 00:59:31,880 --> 00:59:33,160 Speaker 5: I am, I am sorry? 1285 00:59:33,320 --> 00:59:36,360 Speaker 3: Were in fact clearly duo. 1286 00:59:37,200 --> 00:59:40,480 Speaker 2: We've just treated that. I feel like I'm going fine, 1287 00:59:40,480 --> 00:59:43,360 Speaker 2: but I've been tied to Woody who is just dragged 1288 00:59:43,400 --> 00:59:45,360 Speaker 2: me down with a lead balloon and the chat that's 1289 00:59:45,400 --> 00:59:47,720 Speaker 2: a bad message. If you want to go and hear 1290 00:59:47,800 --> 00:59:52,000 Speaker 2: Laura's podcast, do I want kids, you can get it 1291 00:59:52,000 --> 00:59:54,080 Speaker 2: wherever you get your podcasts. Good luck with the next 1292 00:59:54,120 --> 00:59:56,560 Speaker 2: episode with Dolton. Thank you, that's going to be exciting, 1293 00:59:56,600 --> 00:59:59,160 Speaker 2: and thanks coming on. It's such a such a good jet, 1294 00:59:59,240 --> 01:00:01,400 Speaker 2: such an interesting chat. And I'm sure if anyone wants 1295 01:00:01,440 --> 01:00:04,080 Speaker 2: to hear more of Laura than you hear the kickpod 1296 01:00:04,240 --> 01:00:06,320 Speaker 2: or go on download Kick? Is it just kick as 1297 01:00:06,360 --> 01:00:07,760 Speaker 2: an app these days? How? 1298 01:00:07,880 --> 01:00:08,240 Speaker 4: I see? 1299 01:00:08,360 --> 01:00:08,560 Speaker 6: Wow? 1300 01:00:08,680 --> 01:00:10,960 Speaker 2: No, I didn't need to because I've got it already, 1301 01:00:10,960 --> 01:00:12,960 Speaker 2: so I don't need to say how it's spelt. That's 1302 01:00:13,040 --> 01:00:16,240 Speaker 2: that comes naturally to me. Thanks Laura. 1303 01:00:16,920 --> 01:00:17,040 Speaker 3: So