1 00:00:03,440 --> 00:00:05,519 Speaker 1: It's the Happy Families podcast. 2 00:00:05,880 --> 00:00:07,000 Speaker 2: It's the podcast for. 3 00:00:07,000 --> 00:00:10,080 Speaker 1: The time poor parent who just wants answers. 4 00:00:10,160 --> 00:00:10,400 Speaker 3: Now. 5 00:00:10,680 --> 00:00:14,160 Speaker 1: Hello, this is doctor Justin Coulson. A little while ago, 6 00:00:14,200 --> 00:00:17,840 Speaker 1: we did this really cool, really cool summit with Happy Families. 7 00:00:17,840 --> 00:00:20,360 Speaker 1: It was called Little People, Big Feelings. And one of 8 00:00:20,360 --> 00:00:22,959 Speaker 1: my favorite Americans, a lady by the name of Reenie Jane, 9 00:00:23,000 --> 00:00:24,599 Speaker 1: who runs a website that you might have heard of 10 00:00:24,760 --> 00:00:28,479 Speaker 1: called go Zen with loads of fantastic resources. You have 11 00:00:28,480 --> 00:00:31,600 Speaker 1: to check out go Zen. Rene joined me on the 12 00:00:31,640 --> 00:00:35,560 Speaker 1: Little People, Big Feelings Summit to talk about well, anxiety 13 00:00:35,640 --> 00:00:38,400 Speaker 1: and all those other big feelings that little kids have. 14 00:00:38,800 --> 00:00:41,920 Speaker 1: I asked Renie about anxiety. I asked her, how do 15 00:00:41,920 --> 00:00:44,360 Speaker 1: we define it? How do we see it in children, 16 00:00:44,560 --> 00:00:47,000 Speaker 1: especially young kids under six? And here's what she said. 17 00:00:50,440 --> 00:00:54,440 Speaker 2: I define it in a very lay way, which is 18 00:00:54,880 --> 00:00:58,240 Speaker 2: a message that your body is sending you. And I 19 00:00:58,320 --> 00:01:01,160 Speaker 2: know that doesn't sound like what does that mean? Right? 20 00:01:01,280 --> 00:01:04,360 Speaker 2: But that is the definition for me of any emotion. 21 00:01:05,000 --> 00:01:09,640 Speaker 2: Your emotions, your feelings are essentially messengers, their data points, 22 00:01:09,640 --> 00:01:13,840 Speaker 2: their pieces of communication. So anxiety is just one of 23 00:01:13,880 --> 00:01:18,400 Speaker 2: those things. How it manifests in our little ones can 24 00:01:18,480 --> 00:01:21,280 Speaker 2: be in many, many different ways. Most of the time, 25 00:01:21,760 --> 00:01:24,240 Speaker 2: child under the age of six is not going to 26 00:01:24,280 --> 00:01:29,160 Speaker 2: say I'm feeling anxious, right, We're going to see it manifesting, 27 00:01:29,640 --> 00:01:34,720 Speaker 2: perhaps in a meltdown. Maybe they'll say my tummy feels funny. 28 00:01:35,040 --> 00:01:37,400 Speaker 2: Maybe they'll say I'm having a hard time sleeping. So 29 00:01:37,440 --> 00:01:41,319 Speaker 2: there can be many, many manifestations of it, but it 30 00:01:41,360 --> 00:01:46,199 Speaker 2: is it's a feeling, right. So, anxiety, like many many 31 00:01:46,200 --> 00:01:49,080 Speaker 2: other feelings on the spectrum of human emotions, is just 32 00:01:49,280 --> 00:01:52,360 Speaker 2: another one of our feelings that appears. 33 00:01:53,200 --> 00:01:55,640 Speaker 3: The fact that it's just this information coming through feelings 34 00:01:55,640 --> 00:01:59,040 Speaker 3: to a child, Some children get very very anxious about 35 00:01:59,080 --> 00:02:02,720 Speaker 3: their anxiety, and parents get very very anxious about their 36 00:02:02,800 --> 00:02:06,280 Speaker 3: children's anxiety. When does anxiety become a problem, Because the 37 00:02:06,320 --> 00:02:09,760 Speaker 3: reality is, all of our feelings kind of do exactly 38 00:02:09,760 --> 00:02:13,440 Speaker 3: what you're talking about, right, They convey this information to us. 39 00:02:14,600 --> 00:02:18,440 Speaker 3: But anxiety becomes problematic sometimes and at other times it's 40 00:02:18,440 --> 00:02:23,919 Speaker 3: actually perfectly healthy. It's normal. It's actually functional rather than dysfunctional. 41 00:02:24,240 --> 00:02:25,560 Speaker 3: Where's that line? How do we know? 42 00:02:26,560 --> 00:02:30,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, so when we are not able to navigate through 43 00:02:30,880 --> 00:02:34,080 Speaker 2: our feelings, we're not able to actually process the worry, 44 00:02:34,680 --> 00:02:37,040 Speaker 2: that's when it becomes a problem. When it starts to 45 00:02:37,639 --> 00:02:41,440 Speaker 2: interrupt our general functioning, when it starts to create disturbance 46 00:02:41,480 --> 00:02:44,360 Speaker 2: to the point where we can't sleep, you know, or 47 00:02:44,360 --> 00:02:47,040 Speaker 2: maybe not able to do our school work. We are 48 00:02:47,080 --> 00:02:49,239 Speaker 2: complaining about it all the time. Maybe there are other 49 00:02:49,520 --> 00:02:53,000 Speaker 2: manifestations such as anger or eruptions, you know, when it 50 00:02:53,040 --> 00:02:57,600 Speaker 2: becomes when it starts to interrupt our ability to function generally, 51 00:02:57,720 --> 00:03:01,000 Speaker 2: then it starts to become a problem. Really, the issue 52 00:03:01,280 --> 00:03:05,119 Speaker 2: is and sometimes it just sounds so simple that it's 53 00:03:05,120 --> 00:03:07,679 Speaker 2: like that can't be the issue. I mean, the diagnosis 54 00:03:07,760 --> 00:03:12,120 Speaker 2: is rampant, right, the problem is pervasive. It's a global epidemic, 55 00:03:12,200 --> 00:03:19,639 Speaker 2: frankly anxiety. But really the issue is their unprocessed emotions. Right. 56 00:03:20,000 --> 00:03:24,280 Speaker 2: We're having these flare ups of worry, and that triggers 57 00:03:24,320 --> 00:03:26,880 Speaker 2: a flare up of worry, as you said justin within 58 00:03:27,320 --> 00:03:29,760 Speaker 2: the parent, Oh my goodness, my child is worried. So 59 00:03:29,880 --> 00:03:33,120 Speaker 2: now I'm worried, and so we start to do things 60 00:03:33,200 --> 00:03:35,960 Speaker 2: like quash the worry, run away from the worry, ignore 61 00:03:36,040 --> 00:03:40,240 Speaker 2: the worry. Right. We don't sit with it. We don't 62 00:03:40,240 --> 00:03:42,760 Speaker 2: listen to the message it's sending. We don't try to 63 00:03:42,800 --> 00:03:45,480 Speaker 2: figure out, well, what signal am I getting? What should 64 00:03:45,480 --> 00:03:48,640 Speaker 2: I do with this worry, we think it's something wrong 65 00:03:48,680 --> 00:03:52,080 Speaker 2: with us, and so that's when it starts to become 66 00:03:52,080 --> 00:03:54,000 Speaker 2: a problem, when it's not processed. 67 00:03:55,000 --> 00:03:56,840 Speaker 3: There's so many different directions that I want to take 68 00:03:56,920 --> 00:03:59,240 Speaker 3: that last comment and I'm going to try to tase 69 00:03:59,320 --> 00:04:02,240 Speaker 3: them a pot bit by bit. The first thing that 70 00:04:02,480 --> 00:04:05,040 Speaker 3: really stands out to me is you're talking about it's 71 00:04:05,200 --> 00:04:10,440 Speaker 3: an unprocessed emotion. And yet for our little people, for 72 00:04:10,520 --> 00:04:15,160 Speaker 3: our children, children under five or six, they I mean, 73 00:04:15,200 --> 00:04:18,560 Speaker 3: every emotion is unprocessed, isn't it. They don't really have 74 00:04:18,600 --> 00:04:21,159 Speaker 3: the developmental capacity to process their emotions. 75 00:04:21,960 --> 00:04:24,800 Speaker 2: You know what's so funny. I actually think they come 76 00:04:24,839 --> 00:04:29,920 Speaker 2: into the world as masters at emotional processing, because when 77 00:04:29,960 --> 00:04:33,560 Speaker 2: you see a very young child, you will see that 78 00:04:33,600 --> 00:04:36,400 Speaker 2: they can go from zero to one hundred, you know, 79 00:04:36,440 --> 00:04:39,200 Speaker 2: in a moment. Let's take an example of two siblings 80 00:04:39,200 --> 00:04:41,679 Speaker 2: fighting with each other, right, they're fighting over a toy, 81 00:04:41,760 --> 00:04:43,720 Speaker 2: They're yelling at each other, they're screaming, maybe one of 82 00:04:43,760 --> 00:04:46,760 Speaker 2: them's in the corner, and then three minutes later they're 83 00:04:46,800 --> 00:04:51,400 Speaker 2: best friends. That is the ultimate ability to process the emotion. 84 00:04:51,520 --> 00:04:55,200 Speaker 2: The emotion actually comes into them, it's temporary, they feel it, 85 00:04:55,680 --> 00:04:59,479 Speaker 2: they show it right, So there's a manifestation of the 86 00:04:59,520 --> 00:05:03,839 Speaker 2: emotion and then it passes. So for many of us, 87 00:05:03,960 --> 00:05:07,680 Speaker 2: it is unprocessed because we don't allow it to pass. 88 00:05:07,960 --> 00:05:10,120 Speaker 2: We don't allow the feeling to come into us, send 89 00:05:10,120 --> 00:05:14,200 Speaker 2: the message, and then interact with it. Right, there's no relationship. 90 00:05:14,440 --> 00:05:16,719 Speaker 2: We basically try to ignore it or get rid of it. 91 00:05:16,760 --> 00:05:19,599 Speaker 2: So I actually think in their own way, and I 92 00:05:19,680 --> 00:05:21,360 Speaker 2: know what you're saying. You know, they don't know how 93 00:05:21,360 --> 00:05:24,280 Speaker 2: to process these big feelings. They might not know what 94 00:05:24,440 --> 00:05:26,880 Speaker 2: to do with them, but I feel like they can 95 00:05:27,040 --> 00:05:31,960 Speaker 2: naturally process them if we as parents allow the space 96 00:05:32,000 --> 00:05:34,200 Speaker 2: for it and then facilitate the processing. 97 00:05:37,600 --> 00:05:39,760 Speaker 3: We're going to talk about the facilitation in just to say, 98 00:05:39,800 --> 00:05:43,479 Speaker 3: but I got to say what you've just described infuriates 99 00:05:43,520 --> 00:05:47,560 Speaker 3: parents because it's like you kids were just throwing blocks 100 00:05:47,600 --> 00:05:49,120 Speaker 3: at each other's heads. You know, you've got a three 101 00:05:49,160 --> 00:05:51,240 Speaker 3: year old and a four year old try to beat 102 00:05:51,279 --> 00:05:53,800 Speaker 3: each other up, and they're biting and pulling hair and scratching, 103 00:05:53,800 --> 00:05:58,120 Speaker 3: and it's so frustrating for a parent, and the parent 104 00:05:58,240 --> 00:06:02,000 Speaker 3: wants to do all this stuff. And literally ninety seconds later, 105 00:06:02,040 --> 00:06:04,080 Speaker 3: these two kids are best friends again. They're hugging and 106 00:06:04,120 --> 00:06:05,760 Speaker 3: they're playing and it's like it never happened. 107 00:06:06,200 --> 00:06:09,760 Speaker 2: They've processed their emotions, they've done their own conflict resolution, 108 00:06:09,920 --> 00:06:13,600 Speaker 2: they've figured it out. Meanwhile, our hair has turned completely 109 00:06:13,640 --> 00:06:15,320 Speaker 2: gray right there. 110 00:06:15,120 --> 00:06:17,360 Speaker 3: In the moment they're having the emotion, and then they 111 00:06:17,360 --> 00:06:20,559 Speaker 3: seem to move through it and get on with life. 112 00:06:21,040 --> 00:06:22,960 Speaker 3: Like you said, we seem to want to sit with it. 113 00:06:23,000 --> 00:06:26,320 Speaker 3: So I guess to pull the threads from the previous 114 00:06:26,360 --> 00:06:29,000 Speaker 3: question this one together and move to the practical stuff. 115 00:06:29,400 --> 00:06:31,720 Speaker 3: A couple of times now, you've talked about this idea 116 00:06:31,760 --> 00:06:36,120 Speaker 3: of allowing the emotion to be of helping. Well, I 117 00:06:36,120 --> 00:06:38,400 Speaker 3: guess we've probably got to do a bit of work ourselves. 118 00:06:38,760 --> 00:06:42,360 Speaker 3: But how do we What are the mistakes that parents 119 00:06:42,400 --> 00:06:44,640 Speaker 3: are making. Let's talk about the mistakes first, and then 120 00:06:44,680 --> 00:06:47,920 Speaker 3: how we can overcome those mistakes to get the kinds 121 00:06:47,920 --> 00:06:53,800 Speaker 3: of outcomes that we're looking that is balanced, happy little people. 122 00:06:54,160 --> 00:06:56,800 Speaker 2: Yeah. I mean, the first mistake that we make is 123 00:06:56,839 --> 00:07:01,000 Speaker 2: we're taking, probably for many men of us, the training 124 00:07:01,040 --> 00:07:04,680 Speaker 2: that we had as kids with our parents in assuming 125 00:07:04,720 --> 00:07:06,880 Speaker 2: that there are a certain set of emotions that we 126 00:07:06,920 --> 00:07:08,919 Speaker 2: need to see from our kids. We want them to 127 00:07:08,920 --> 00:07:10,680 Speaker 2: be happy, we want them to be joyful, we want 128 00:07:10,680 --> 00:07:12,480 Speaker 2: them to be grateful, we want them to be cheery, 129 00:07:12,720 --> 00:07:14,880 Speaker 2: and when we see the other ones, we see anger, 130 00:07:14,960 --> 00:07:17,040 Speaker 2: and we see jealousy, and we see worry, and we 131 00:07:17,080 --> 00:07:20,960 Speaker 2: see all of these other bad emotions. It scares us, right, 132 00:07:21,360 --> 00:07:25,760 Speaker 2: and so we are afraid of half of the human 133 00:07:25,920 --> 00:07:30,040 Speaker 2: spectrum of emotions, which is a problem. Obviously. We don't 134 00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:33,400 Speaker 2: see purpose in those emotions, and so as soon as 135 00:07:33,480 --> 00:07:37,160 Speaker 2: we see it as a parent, we get triggered. We're triggered, 136 00:07:37,520 --> 00:07:40,000 Speaker 2: and then with the triggering, you know, this can go 137 00:07:40,080 --> 00:07:44,360 Speaker 2: in so many different directions. Sometimes we are catastrophic thinkers. 138 00:07:44,400 --> 00:07:48,160 Speaker 2: Not sometimes oftentimes, oh, my goodness, my child is worrying 139 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:51,600 Speaker 2: at this young age of under six. They're five years old, 140 00:07:51,680 --> 00:07:54,080 Speaker 2: and maybe they worry so much they have to sleep 141 00:07:54,120 --> 00:07:55,960 Speaker 2: next to me at night, and you know, or they 142 00:07:55,960 --> 00:07:57,760 Speaker 2: can't do something, they can't go to school, or they 143 00:07:57,760 --> 00:08:00,520 Speaker 2: don't want to socialize, and so how are they going 144 00:08:00,560 --> 00:08:05,000 Speaker 2: to handle life? My goodness. Catastrophic thinking goes in usually 145 00:08:05,040 --> 00:08:07,960 Speaker 2: three directions. It ends up where your child is either 146 00:08:08,000 --> 00:08:10,560 Speaker 2: going to be in jail on drugs or homeless, right 147 00:08:10,640 --> 00:08:13,960 Speaker 2: like they're always My five year old can't sleep alone 148 00:08:14,000 --> 00:08:17,000 Speaker 2: at night, So therefore they're never going to get a job, right, 149 00:08:17,080 --> 00:08:20,120 Speaker 2: So we go wrong in thinking that there's going to 150 00:08:20,160 --> 00:08:25,080 Speaker 2: be some tragic ripple effect, and we are again based 151 00:08:25,120 --> 00:08:29,560 Speaker 2: on our own conditioning of being scared of these big feelings. 152 00:08:29,600 --> 00:08:33,600 Speaker 2: They make us incredibly uncomfortable. So the messaging that we're 153 00:08:33,679 --> 00:08:37,360 Speaker 2: often sending to our kids with great intention and trust me, 154 00:08:37,440 --> 00:08:39,400 Speaker 2: I have a seven and eight year old and they 155 00:08:39,400 --> 00:08:44,480 Speaker 2: are very loud spirited kids with big feelings, right. But 156 00:08:44,559 --> 00:08:47,160 Speaker 2: the message we often send to our young ones is 157 00:08:47,200 --> 00:08:51,760 Speaker 2: listen your big feelings. They're making me uncomfortable. I would 158 00:08:51,800 --> 00:08:54,599 Speaker 2: like you to go into a calm down corner. You know, 159 00:08:54,640 --> 00:08:57,480 Speaker 2: if we're very conscious, we're not putting them in time out. 160 00:08:56,880 --> 00:09:00,880 Speaker 2: We're in a time in right, and go get rid 161 00:09:00,920 --> 00:09:03,120 Speaker 2: of those big feelings and come back when you have 162 00:09:03,280 --> 00:09:07,280 Speaker 2: the feelings that I'm more comfortable with. So the first 163 00:09:07,360 --> 00:09:10,480 Speaker 2: message that we need to send our kids is your 164 00:09:10,480 --> 00:09:14,440 Speaker 2: feelings are valid. You know I can hold space for them, 165 00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:19,480 Speaker 2: I can handle them. I understand that when you're disregulated 166 00:09:20,120 --> 00:09:24,240 Speaker 2: that you need me to lean on. You need my regulation, 167 00:09:24,440 --> 00:09:26,840 Speaker 2: you need to borrow mine. But I can only do 168 00:09:26,880 --> 00:09:30,800 Speaker 2: that if I'm able to stand strong in my own 169 00:09:30,960 --> 00:09:32,880 Speaker 2: understanding that this is all okay. 170 00:09:36,080 --> 00:09:39,880 Speaker 1: That's Renie Jane, the founder of go Zen. You can 171 00:09:39,880 --> 00:09:42,760 Speaker 1: find her online by doing a quick google Reniere n 172 00:09:42,800 --> 00:09:46,200 Speaker 1: double e Jane j A I n Renie Jane from 173 00:09:46,240 --> 00:09:49,440 Speaker 1: go Zen. And that was the part of a conversation 174 00:09:49,480 --> 00:09:51,959 Speaker 1: that we were having about little people and big feelings 175 00:09:51,960 --> 00:09:55,040 Speaker 1: from the Little People Big Feelings Summit. If you'd like 176 00:09:55,040 --> 00:09:56,840 Speaker 1: more information about how you can help you little people 177 00:09:56,880 --> 00:09:58,839 Speaker 1: deal with their big feelings, but please check out the summit, 178 00:09:58,920 --> 00:10:02,400 Speaker 1: just google Happy families dot com dot au and type 179 00:10:02,440 --> 00:10:04,480 Speaker 1: in little People, Big Feelings. The summer will come up 180 00:10:04,480 --> 00:10:06,040 Speaker 1: and you can grab hold of that for a lot 181 00:10:06,080 --> 00:10:09,000 Speaker 1: of really useful resources. The Happy Families podcast is produced 182 00:10:09,000 --> 00:10:11,800 Speaker 1: by Justin Roland from Bridge Media. Craig Bruce is our 183 00:10:11,960 --> 00:10:14,719 Speaker 1: executive producer, and if you'd like more info about how 184 00:10:14,720 --> 00:10:17,360 Speaker 1: to make your family happier, visit us at happy families 185 00:10:17,440 --> 00:10:18,640 Speaker 1: dot com dot au.