1 00:00:00,720 --> 00:00:02,960 Speaker 1: Did you know that if you make a mistake and 2 00:00:03,000 --> 00:00:06,400 Speaker 1: beat yourself up about it, you're actually just making yourself 3 00:00:06,519 --> 00:00:10,480 Speaker 1: even less productive. It turns out that if we applied 4 00:00:10,520 --> 00:00:13,640 Speaker 1: self compassion in those moments, not only would we be 5 00:00:13,800 --> 00:00:17,439 Speaker 1: kinder to ourselves, but we'd also handle our workload a 6 00:00:17,440 --> 00:00:21,360 Speaker 1: whole work better. Professor Kristin Neff is a pioneer in 7 00:00:21,360 --> 00:00:25,000 Speaker 1: the study of self compassion and was the first person 8 00:00:25,120 --> 00:00:28,480 Speaker 1: to actually operationally define and measure it more than twenty 9 00:00:28,560 --> 00:00:31,760 Speaker 1: years ago. Her work on self compassion has led her 10 00:00:31,800 --> 00:00:35,440 Speaker 1: to become one of the most recognized and influential scholars 11 00:00:35,440 --> 00:00:38,720 Speaker 1: in the field of psychology. Since then, she has gone 12 00:00:38,760 --> 00:00:41,880 Speaker 1: on to write several best selling books about self compassion 13 00:00:42,240 --> 00:00:45,199 Speaker 1: and is an associate professor at the University of Texas 14 00:00:45,240 --> 00:00:49,080 Speaker 1: at Austin. In this episode, we discuss what self compassion 15 00:00:49,240 --> 00:00:52,320 Speaker 1: actually is, how you can use it to better handle 16 00:00:52,400 --> 00:00:56,160 Speaker 1: mistakes and failure, and how you can more easily say 17 00:00:56,320 --> 00:00:59,360 Speaker 1: no to things that will leave you exhausted and tired 18 00:01:00,000 --> 00:01:09,320 Speaker 1: about feeling guilty. Welcome to How I Work, a show 19 00:01:09,440 --> 00:01:13,840 Speaker 1: about habits, rituals, and strategies for optimizing your dat I'm 20 00:01:13,880 --> 00:01:17,600 Speaker 1: your host, Doctor Amantha imber To, start things off, I 21 00:01:17,640 --> 00:01:20,679 Speaker 1: wanted Kristen to help clear up a little bit of terminology. 22 00:01:21,240 --> 00:01:24,640 Speaker 1: The terms self care and self compassion get thrown around 23 00:01:24,640 --> 00:01:27,720 Speaker 1: a lot, but what's the actual difference between the two 24 00:01:28,040 --> 00:01:30,559 Speaker 1: and which one is really going to help us out 25 00:01:30,640 --> 00:01:36,840 Speaker 1: in the long term. I would love to start by 26 00:01:37,520 --> 00:01:42,080 Speaker 1: talking and understanding the difference between self care and self compassion, 27 00:01:42,319 --> 00:01:43,920 Speaker 1: because I feel like a lot of people get confused 28 00:01:43,959 --> 00:01:44,680 Speaker 1: with those terms. 29 00:01:45,000 --> 00:01:48,160 Speaker 2: Typically, when people are talking about self care, they're talking 30 00:01:48,200 --> 00:01:52,760 Speaker 2: about behaviors you engage in to help yourself, like maybe 31 00:01:52,880 --> 00:01:56,440 Speaker 2: you know, taking naps or eating well, or visiting with 32 00:01:56,560 --> 00:01:59,360 Speaker 2: friends or having some me time, those types of things. 33 00:02:00,280 --> 00:02:03,720 Speaker 2: So compassion is, first of all, it's in the context 34 00:02:03,840 --> 00:02:07,200 Speaker 2: of suffering in particular, and normally we think of that as, 35 00:02:07,440 --> 00:02:09,200 Speaker 2: you know, how do we show up for other people 36 00:02:09,200 --> 00:02:12,160 Speaker 2: when they're struggling. In the case of self compassion, it's 37 00:02:12,200 --> 00:02:14,519 Speaker 2: how do we show up for ourselves when we're struggling, 38 00:02:15,440 --> 00:02:18,440 Speaker 2: And so practicing self care might be one way we 39 00:02:18,560 --> 00:02:20,960 Speaker 2: help that. Maybe we're stressed and over worked and we 40 00:02:21,000 --> 00:02:23,040 Speaker 2: need to, you know, have some me time or take 41 00:02:23,080 --> 00:02:25,919 Speaker 2: a bubble bath, whatever. This there's nothing wrong with that, 42 00:02:26,960 --> 00:02:29,800 Speaker 2: but sentiences you may not have time to practice self care. 43 00:02:29,960 --> 00:02:31,519 Speaker 2: You know, if you're in the middle of a busy 44 00:02:31,600 --> 00:02:34,000 Speaker 2: meeting and you know your boss has said something you 45 00:02:34,040 --> 00:02:35,680 Speaker 2: can't like, say I'm sorry, I'm going to go take 46 00:02:35,720 --> 00:02:40,200 Speaker 2: a bubble bath now, you know. So compassion is how 47 00:02:40,200 --> 00:02:42,440 Speaker 2: do you show up for yourself and those tough moments 48 00:02:42,480 --> 00:02:45,080 Speaker 2: in life. And so it refers a little bit more 49 00:02:45,120 --> 00:02:49,200 Speaker 2: to emotional self care being aware that we're struggling. So 50 00:02:49,240 --> 00:02:53,359 Speaker 2: the three elements mindfulness, being aware that we're struggling, kindness, 51 00:02:53,480 --> 00:02:56,640 Speaker 2: warm support, encouragement like having your own back like you 52 00:02:56,639 --> 00:02:59,880 Speaker 2: would do a good friend. And then a really important 53 00:03:00,120 --> 00:03:03,679 Speaker 2: makes it self. Compassion and not self pity is a 54 00:03:03,760 --> 00:03:06,200 Speaker 2: sense of our humanity, Like you know, it's not really 55 00:03:06,280 --> 00:03:09,440 Speaker 2: even though the word self is there, it's just remembering, Hey, 56 00:03:09,480 --> 00:03:11,920 Speaker 2: we are a human being doing the best we can. 57 00:03:12,440 --> 00:03:15,600 Speaker 2: We aren't alone. You know, all people struggle. There's something 58 00:03:15,720 --> 00:03:19,080 Speaker 2: wrong with us for struggling. This is the shared human condition. 59 00:03:19,400 --> 00:03:21,640 Speaker 1: I would love to know you around about some of 60 00:03:21,680 --> 00:03:25,160 Speaker 1: the rituals that you have around self compassion. I love 61 00:03:25,240 --> 00:03:29,040 Speaker 1: understanding people's morning rituals and evening rituals, ither things that 62 00:03:29,080 --> 00:03:32,840 Speaker 1: you do on a daily basis to help foster self compassion. 63 00:03:32,919 --> 00:03:35,480 Speaker 2: Well, there are The most common thing I do is 64 00:03:35,520 --> 00:03:38,480 Speaker 2: whenever I notice any pain or discomfort coming out best 65 00:03:38,560 --> 00:03:42,440 Speaker 2: primarily when I practice self compassion. So again and when 66 00:03:42,440 --> 00:03:46,280 Speaker 2: suffering arises the passion, I am calm, I'm with it 67 00:03:46,360 --> 00:03:49,680 Speaker 2: in a kind supportive way. So yesterday I was at 68 00:03:49,680 --> 00:03:52,440 Speaker 2: a place I was doing this dance group I go 69 00:03:52,520 --> 00:03:54,960 Speaker 2: to sometimes, and I have some painful memories come up. 70 00:03:55,400 --> 00:03:58,120 Speaker 2: So I actually left to the side and actually sat 71 00:03:58,160 --> 00:04:00,480 Speaker 2: there and put my hand on my heart. I was is, okay, 72 00:04:00,520 --> 00:04:03,839 Speaker 2: the painful memories are coming up, and this was there 73 00:04:03,960 --> 00:04:07,720 Speaker 2: for myself. Just I was with myself until I felt 74 00:04:07,720 --> 00:04:10,720 Speaker 2: like I tended to what I needed that I went 75 00:04:11,000 --> 00:04:13,520 Speaker 2: back into the dance. So that happens a lot, right, 76 00:04:13,600 --> 00:04:16,520 Speaker 2: So anytime any painful thought or emotion or memory or 77 00:04:16,560 --> 00:04:20,360 Speaker 2: stressor comes up, I'll practice self compassion in the moment. 78 00:04:20,520 --> 00:04:22,520 Speaker 1: Can you tell me a bit of more about what's 79 00:04:22,560 --> 00:04:24,320 Speaker 1: going on for you in the moment, like what you're 80 00:04:24,360 --> 00:04:28,919 Speaker 1: doing with your body and what the thoughts are that 81 00:04:28,960 --> 00:04:30,839 Speaker 1: are going on in your mind to help you through 82 00:04:30,880 --> 00:04:31,400 Speaker 1: that moment. 83 00:04:31,680 --> 00:04:34,280 Speaker 2: So the reason I almost ows use self touch as 84 00:04:34,320 --> 00:04:38,159 Speaker 2: an aspect of self compassion, as we know scientifically that 85 00:04:38,200 --> 00:04:40,160 Speaker 2: it's one of the most reliable ways to give our 86 00:04:40,200 --> 00:04:43,400 Speaker 2: self compassion because it works through our nervous system. So 87 00:04:44,400 --> 00:04:46,200 Speaker 2: I'm gonna have to get a little technical here, but 88 00:04:47,360 --> 00:04:51,800 Speaker 2: normally when we're suffering or something painful happens, we feel threatened. Right, 89 00:04:51,839 --> 00:04:54,479 Speaker 2: it's just something's wrong, right, this is a problem, So 90 00:04:54,520 --> 00:04:57,280 Speaker 2: we go into fight flight or freeze. We activate the 91 00:04:57,320 --> 00:05:01,039 Speaker 2: sympathetic nervous system. We get aroused the problem, which is 92 00:05:01,040 --> 00:05:04,159 Speaker 2: often ourselves, so we criticize ourselves, or we flee into 93 00:05:04,160 --> 00:05:06,680 Speaker 2: a sense of shame or isolation, or we freeze and 94 00:05:06,760 --> 00:05:10,160 Speaker 2: we get stuck. And that's normal. It's natural. It's actually 95 00:05:10,760 --> 00:05:13,800 Speaker 2: the most natural response when we notice some problem. We 96 00:05:13,880 --> 00:05:17,080 Speaker 2: go into fight flight or freeze. Now, when our friends 97 00:05:17,080 --> 00:05:19,440 Speaker 2: are good friends and loved ones, when they have a problem, 98 00:05:19,640 --> 00:05:23,599 Speaker 2: we don't feel so personally threatened typically, and so that 99 00:05:23,640 --> 00:05:26,880 Speaker 2: way we can use another system, which is the care system. 100 00:05:27,200 --> 00:05:30,920 Speaker 2: So the care system is linked to the parasympathetic nervous system. 101 00:05:31,080 --> 00:05:34,760 Speaker 2: Tendem to befriend. It's also a natural instinct for others 102 00:05:35,080 --> 00:05:37,160 Speaker 2: to be there for others to be kind and supportive, 103 00:05:37,160 --> 00:05:39,680 Speaker 2: and that helps them feel calmed down, also helps us 104 00:05:39,680 --> 00:05:42,320 Speaker 2: feel calmed down. As well, so what we're doing when 105 00:05:42,320 --> 00:05:45,600 Speaker 2: we touch our bodies, and we have research shows, for instance, 106 00:05:45,600 --> 00:05:48,920 Speaker 2: if someone puts her hand on your shoulder activates para 107 00:05:48,960 --> 00:05:52,039 Speaker 2: sympathetic nervous system response. If you put your own hands 108 00:05:52,040 --> 00:05:55,839 Speaker 2: on your heart, it activates para sympathetic nervous response, reduces 109 00:05:55,839 --> 00:05:59,040 Speaker 2: cortisol linked to fight flight or freeze. If you think 110 00:05:59,120 --> 00:06:02,159 Speaker 2: about it a baby, you know that we're born to 111 00:06:02,360 --> 00:06:05,400 Speaker 2: interpret touches the signal of care. Well before you understand 112 00:06:05,400 --> 00:06:07,160 Speaker 2: what your parents are saying to you, like I'm here 113 00:06:07,200 --> 00:06:09,479 Speaker 2: for you, I love you, sweetheart. You don't understand anything 114 00:06:09,480 --> 00:06:13,000 Speaker 2: as an infant, you do understand the soothing, warm touch, 115 00:06:13,760 --> 00:06:15,800 Speaker 2: and so that's why it kind of is the immediate 116 00:06:15,920 --> 00:06:18,760 Speaker 2: kind of bypasses. The brain almost goes straight to helping 117 00:06:18,760 --> 00:06:21,360 Speaker 2: your body feel safe and cared for, and then it's 118 00:06:21,400 --> 00:06:24,280 Speaker 2: actually easier for the mind to follow. So that's why 119 00:06:24,640 --> 00:06:27,799 Speaker 2: it is such a feely but it's scientific touchy feely 120 00:06:27,839 --> 00:06:30,839 Speaker 2: because it works as there's you know, real reasons why 121 00:06:30,920 --> 00:06:34,120 Speaker 2: it works. So you usually put hands somewhere. And by 122 00:06:34,120 --> 00:06:36,200 Speaker 2: the way, if the stress or is your boss, you 123 00:06:36,200 --> 00:06:37,640 Speaker 2: don't want to go like that, so you can just 124 00:06:37,680 --> 00:06:39,680 Speaker 2: like fold your arms or any sort of touch is 125 00:06:39,720 --> 00:06:43,880 Speaker 2: a really good way to ground yourself physiologically in your 126 00:06:43,880 --> 00:06:45,520 Speaker 2: own care and support. 127 00:06:45,320 --> 00:06:47,320 Speaker 1: And so to describe what you're doing for people and 128 00:06:47,400 --> 00:06:50,159 Speaker 1: not watching the video. Sorry, all right, okay, yeah, sorry. 129 00:06:50,400 --> 00:06:54,160 Speaker 1: First instinct putting your hands or even laughing of your heart, this. 130 00:06:54,200 --> 00:06:56,320 Speaker 2: Is a good one. It doesn't work for everyone. There's 131 00:06:56,640 --> 00:06:59,440 Speaker 2: different types of touch that feel soothing and supportive for 132 00:06:59,440 --> 00:07:02,320 Speaker 2: different people. So putting both hands over your heart center. 133 00:07:02,880 --> 00:07:04,920 Speaker 2: You can also cradle your own face the way you 134 00:07:05,000 --> 00:07:07,719 Speaker 2: might cradle the face of a child. You can give 135 00:07:07,720 --> 00:07:11,080 Speaker 2: yourself a hug, or you can just kind of fold 136 00:07:11,120 --> 00:07:13,920 Speaker 2: your arms in a way that isn't so obvious, but 137 00:07:13,960 --> 00:07:16,320 Speaker 2: if you do it with the intention like I'm here 138 00:07:16,360 --> 00:07:19,720 Speaker 2: for myself, you know, I'm present, I care about myself. 139 00:07:19,760 --> 00:07:22,200 Speaker 2: That that type of feeling tone with the ad gesture 140 00:07:22,280 --> 00:07:25,640 Speaker 2: folding your arms, it actually does. Research shows that changes 141 00:07:25,680 --> 00:07:29,200 Speaker 2: your physiology. So that's one thing that's kind of step one. 142 00:07:29,280 --> 00:07:33,000 Speaker 2: And then I usually add some language. I often add 143 00:07:33,040 --> 00:07:36,240 Speaker 2: language kind of just acknowledging the different parts of me 144 00:07:36,320 --> 00:07:38,840 Speaker 2: that may be hurting. And I say parts of me, 145 00:07:38,960 --> 00:07:41,600 Speaker 2: because sometimes there's a part of me that hurts, some 146 00:07:41,680 --> 00:07:43,880 Speaker 2: part of me that does a part of me that's afraid, 147 00:07:44,000 --> 00:07:45,840 Speaker 2: another part of me that's angry. So we're kind of 148 00:07:45,880 --> 00:07:48,200 Speaker 2: we're complex. So I usually direct it to parts of 149 00:07:48,240 --> 00:07:52,520 Speaker 2: myself and kind of really acknowledge again that I'm hurting 150 00:07:52,560 --> 00:07:54,559 Speaker 2: in some way. I ask myself, what do I need? 151 00:07:55,160 --> 00:07:59,200 Speaker 2: I usually talk to myself, not out loud, usually silently, 152 00:07:59,280 --> 00:08:01,920 Speaker 2: like you know, I'm here for you, or I will 153 00:08:01,920 --> 00:08:04,400 Speaker 2: protect you, I will stand up for you. It sounds 154 00:08:04,400 --> 00:08:06,640 Speaker 2: funny at first, it really does. You get used to it. 155 00:08:07,040 --> 00:08:09,840 Speaker 2: You talk to yourself just like you would a really 156 00:08:09,840 --> 00:08:12,560 Speaker 2: good friend or loved one or a close colleague in 157 00:08:12,640 --> 00:08:15,560 Speaker 2: terms of showing your warmth, support and care and really 158 00:08:15,720 --> 00:08:19,760 Speaker 2: commitment having your own back. It's so huge. Think about it. 159 00:08:19,760 --> 00:08:21,800 Speaker 2: Most of us we do not have our own back. 160 00:08:22,400 --> 00:08:24,960 Speaker 2: We cut ourselves down, We shame ourselves like we kick 161 00:08:25,000 --> 00:08:27,880 Speaker 2: ourselves when we're already down. We make things worse, and 162 00:08:27,920 --> 00:08:30,560 Speaker 2: the research shows it does make things worth both mentally 163 00:08:30,600 --> 00:08:33,840 Speaker 2: and physically. So making that commitment to being there for 164 00:08:33,920 --> 00:08:36,079 Speaker 2: yourself in a supportive way, just as like a good 165 00:08:36,160 --> 00:08:38,400 Speaker 2: friend or a really good parent would, or a good 166 00:08:38,440 --> 00:08:41,679 Speaker 2: mentor good coach, makes all the difference in our feelings 167 00:08:41,679 --> 00:08:43,880 Speaker 2: of strength and resilience and ability to cope with the 168 00:08:43,880 --> 00:08:47,160 Speaker 2: tough stuff. So I might say that so like, for instance, 169 00:08:47,320 --> 00:08:50,480 Speaker 2: I had these bad memories actually because it was something 170 00:08:50,520 --> 00:08:52,600 Speaker 2: that happened that I wasn't happy with what happened, and 171 00:08:52,640 --> 00:08:55,240 Speaker 2: I said, Kristen, I promise I will try not to 172 00:08:55,280 --> 00:08:58,440 Speaker 2: ever let that happen again. I can't say that for sure, 173 00:08:58,720 --> 00:09:01,680 Speaker 2: but it's like that commitment meant to you know, I'm 174 00:09:01,679 --> 00:09:03,640 Speaker 2: going to really try not to put myself in that 175 00:09:03,720 --> 00:09:06,559 Speaker 2: vulnerable position again where I was mistreated and you know, 176 00:09:06,600 --> 00:09:08,520 Speaker 2: I'm so sorry this happened and I'm here for you, 177 00:09:08,559 --> 00:09:13,320 Speaker 2: and that kind of speaking to myself it just really helped. 178 00:09:13,520 --> 00:09:18,240 Speaker 1: Can I ask, is there a person or someone that 179 00:09:18,920 --> 00:09:21,199 Speaker 1: you channel in terms of that language, because it sounds 180 00:09:21,240 --> 00:09:25,080 Speaker 1: like such kind language and the language that a lot 181 00:09:25,160 --> 00:09:29,079 Speaker 1: of us probably wouldn't use when you know, to ourselves 182 00:09:29,120 --> 00:09:31,560 Speaker 1: when we're going through a tough time. So I guess 183 00:09:32,000 --> 00:09:34,200 Speaker 1: earlier in the days when you started, you know, first 184 00:09:34,200 --> 00:09:37,320 Speaker 1: started researching self compassion, who were you thinking about to 185 00:09:37,520 --> 00:09:38,760 Speaker 1: access that voice? 186 00:09:38,880 --> 00:09:42,640 Speaker 2: I was thinking about myself. Everyone already knows how to 187 00:09:42,679 --> 00:09:46,120 Speaker 2: be compassionate to other people. So what I did do 188 00:09:46,200 --> 00:09:48,800 Speaker 2: at first, and this can be very helpful. Is I 189 00:09:48,840 --> 00:09:50,800 Speaker 2: thought like, oh, what would I say to my son 190 00:09:50,880 --> 00:09:54,640 Speaker 2: in this situation? Or you know, it's very easy just 191 00:09:54,679 --> 00:09:57,319 Speaker 2: to think about what would I say to someone else 192 00:09:57,360 --> 00:10:00,680 Speaker 2: I cared about. We already have the compassion and template, 193 00:10:01,080 --> 00:10:04,160 Speaker 2: and by the way, this is also inborn as mammals. 194 00:10:04,200 --> 00:10:07,080 Speaker 2: We have the compassion template. We just have to remember, 195 00:10:07,760 --> 00:10:10,440 Speaker 2: I think even more important than remember it, give ourselves 196 00:10:10,520 --> 00:10:12,280 Speaker 2: permission to use it with ourselves. 197 00:10:12,480 --> 00:10:15,760 Speaker 1: I would love to know from my reading self compassion 198 00:10:15,800 --> 00:10:19,480 Speaker 1: is particularly important when you're facing a setback or when 199 00:10:19,480 --> 00:10:22,560 Speaker 1: there's some kind of a failure. And I think about 200 00:10:22,559 --> 00:10:25,840 Speaker 1: this particularly because this podcast is largely around work and 201 00:10:25,880 --> 00:10:28,360 Speaker 1: we all face failures at work. I would love to 202 00:10:28,360 --> 00:10:30,960 Speaker 1: know in your life whether there have been times where 203 00:10:31,480 --> 00:10:36,120 Speaker 1: you've had failure or setbacks and how you've used self 204 00:10:36,120 --> 00:10:40,000 Speaker 1: compassion or practices around self compassion to help you through that. 205 00:10:40,280 --> 00:10:43,800 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, absolutely what it does. And so it hasn't 206 00:10:44,040 --> 00:10:47,000 Speaker 2: prevented me from making mistakes. To be honest, I still 207 00:10:47,000 --> 00:10:49,920 Speaker 2: make mistakes, but it does mean that when I do 208 00:10:50,000 --> 00:10:53,520 Speaker 2: make mistakes, first of all, I don't shame myself for them, 209 00:10:53,800 --> 00:10:56,480 Speaker 2: that I don't add to it by saying, yes, you're horrible. Christen, 210 00:10:56,480 --> 00:10:59,080 Speaker 2: You're a bad person. I hate you. I just might know. 211 00:10:59,240 --> 00:11:02,760 Speaker 2: Ooh that felt feelings of shame arise. Well, it happens 212 00:11:02,800 --> 00:11:05,599 Speaker 2: to everyone, you know, everyone makes mistakes and it is 213 00:11:05,679 --> 00:11:08,160 Speaker 2: how we learn. You know, what can I learn from this? 214 00:11:08,400 --> 00:11:08,520 Speaker 1: Well? 215 00:11:08,520 --> 00:11:10,640 Speaker 2: How can I grow from this? And when you do that? 216 00:11:10,720 --> 00:11:14,440 Speaker 2: It's really interesting. So this research showing that people respect 217 00:11:14,559 --> 00:11:19,239 Speaker 2: self compassionate leaders more. It's also for people in the workplace. 218 00:11:19,280 --> 00:11:23,320 Speaker 2: The ability to give yourself compassion means, for instance, this 219 00:11:23,440 --> 00:11:26,520 Speaker 2: is a really good one. It increases work performance. Of 220 00:11:26,559 --> 00:11:29,120 Speaker 2: course it does. When you make a mistake and you 221 00:11:29,200 --> 00:11:31,559 Speaker 2: kick yourself and you shame yourself, and you know, it's 222 00:11:31,600 --> 00:11:33,440 Speaker 2: not really going to help you get a pup back 223 00:11:33,480 --> 00:11:35,080 Speaker 2: on your feet again. It's just going to make you 224 00:11:35,120 --> 00:11:39,520 Speaker 2: distracted and nervous and even more stressed. You look at me, right, 225 00:11:39,559 --> 00:11:43,000 Speaker 2: So I've achieved some success and I have had setback. 226 00:11:43,040 --> 00:11:45,320 Speaker 2: So of course I have had setbacks, you know, and 227 00:11:45,480 --> 00:11:49,120 Speaker 2: worked and people criticizing this, you know it's academy or 228 00:11:49,320 --> 00:11:52,280 Speaker 2: very political, people criticizing the scale I wrote and said 229 00:11:52,280 --> 00:11:55,640 Speaker 2: I was crap and like almost literally things like that. 230 00:11:56,080 --> 00:11:58,600 Speaker 2: You know, I didn't fold. When people criticize my scale 231 00:11:58,720 --> 00:12:02,720 Speaker 2: actually teamed up with a kick ass psychometrician who said, no, actually, 232 00:12:03,080 --> 00:12:05,560 Speaker 2: once you do it the right way, it shows that 233 00:12:05,600 --> 00:12:08,280 Speaker 2: the scale is very good. You know, So I could 234 00:12:08,480 --> 00:12:10,800 Speaker 2: I thought back, so to speak, but not from a 235 00:12:10,840 --> 00:12:13,720 Speaker 2: place of defensiveness, but from a place that no, I think, 236 00:12:13,800 --> 00:12:15,680 Speaker 2: I think the scale is good. I think it works, 237 00:12:16,000 --> 00:12:18,320 Speaker 2: and how can I learn? And so I actually asked 238 00:12:18,360 --> 00:12:21,240 Speaker 2: around my statistician friends, and I found someone who had 239 00:12:21,240 --> 00:12:22,920 Speaker 2: the way to model the structure of the scale in 240 00:12:22,920 --> 00:12:25,920 Speaker 2: a way that was actually superior. You know that that's 241 00:12:25,960 --> 00:12:27,560 Speaker 2: the way it works. 242 00:12:27,800 --> 00:12:30,439 Speaker 1: I would love to know when you're like aware of 243 00:12:30,480 --> 00:12:34,880 Speaker 1: yourself talk around self compassion. I They have phrases or 244 00:12:35,000 --> 00:12:38,319 Speaker 1: mantras or things that are quite helpful to come back 245 00:12:38,360 --> 00:12:38,640 Speaker 1: to you. 246 00:12:38,720 --> 00:12:41,560 Speaker 2: One of the things we teach, you know, I teach 247 00:12:41,679 --> 00:12:44,680 Speaker 2: my books and my workshops and lectures is called a 248 00:12:44,760 --> 00:12:47,960 Speaker 2: self compassion break. And it's a nice term because you know, 249 00:12:48,000 --> 00:12:49,839 Speaker 2: when you're at work, you take a coffee break, or 250 00:12:49,920 --> 00:12:53,160 Speaker 2: you take a bathroom break. Whenever you're struggling or stressed, 251 00:12:53,160 --> 00:12:55,920 Speaker 2: you can take a self compassion break. It doesn't take long, 252 00:12:56,000 --> 00:12:58,880 Speaker 2: could take maybe two or three minutes, and all you 253 00:12:58,920 --> 00:13:04,199 Speaker 2: do is you intentionally bring in the three components of self, compassion, mindfulness. 254 00:13:04,400 --> 00:13:07,200 Speaker 2: Just likecknows, this is hard. I'm hurting this, I'm scared 255 00:13:07,280 --> 00:13:09,520 Speaker 2: or I'm stressed or whatever it is you're feeling, I'm hurt. 256 00:13:09,920 --> 00:13:12,800 Speaker 2: Bringing in common humanity, this is part of life. I'm 257 00:13:12,800 --> 00:13:15,240 Speaker 2: not alone. You know, it's only human to feel this way. 258 00:13:15,280 --> 00:13:17,959 Speaker 2: There's nothing wrong with me for feeling this way. When 259 00:13:18,040 --> 00:13:20,280 Speaker 2: we forget this and we think there's something wrong with 260 00:13:20,400 --> 00:13:23,679 Speaker 2: us and we feel isolated and alone, it makes it 261 00:13:23,720 --> 00:13:26,400 Speaker 2: ten times worse. And it's also not true, you know, 262 00:13:26,400 --> 00:13:28,680 Speaker 2: it's the fallacy of the mind. So you bring in 263 00:13:28,679 --> 00:13:31,360 Speaker 2: that common humanity, and then you bring in some words 264 00:13:31,360 --> 00:13:34,760 Speaker 2: of kindness. I'm especially powerful of combined with the touch. 265 00:13:35,320 --> 00:13:37,800 Speaker 2: So maybe put your hands in your heart or full 266 00:13:37,880 --> 00:13:41,080 Speaker 2: d arms or whatever it's appropriate, and then just say 267 00:13:41,120 --> 00:13:44,600 Speaker 2: some encouraging words. So for me, you know, people are different. 268 00:13:44,679 --> 00:13:47,120 Speaker 2: I think based on my history, a really good phrase 269 00:13:47,160 --> 00:13:49,839 Speaker 2: for me is I will not abandon you. It's kind 270 00:13:49,840 --> 00:13:53,040 Speaker 2: of like that part of myself, that caring, loving part 271 00:13:53,080 --> 00:13:56,400 Speaker 2: of myself that often that many people they abandon that 272 00:13:56,440 --> 00:13:58,720 Speaker 2: part of themselves. It's like, no, I'm just I don't 273 00:13:58,720 --> 00:14:01,840 Speaker 2: deserve kindness or I don't deserve support or you know, 274 00:14:01,840 --> 00:14:04,439 Speaker 2: I'm just going to shame myself, like we're abandon it 275 00:14:04,440 --> 00:14:07,319 Speaker 2: in ourselves in that moment. Not only do we abandon ourselves, 276 00:14:07,360 --> 00:14:10,000 Speaker 2: we kick ourselves when we're down. So you know I 277 00:14:10,000 --> 00:14:12,439 Speaker 2: will not abandon you. I'm here for you. How can 278 00:14:12,480 --> 00:14:15,400 Speaker 2: I help? What do you need? Care about you? All 279 00:14:15,440 --> 00:14:17,400 Speaker 2: those things that you just might naturally say to you 280 00:14:17,400 --> 00:14:20,000 Speaker 2: a friend or a close coworker or something like that, 281 00:14:20,840 --> 00:14:21,960 Speaker 2: it's really helpful. 282 00:14:22,160 --> 00:14:24,240 Speaker 1: I love the idea of a self compassion break, and 283 00:14:24,240 --> 00:14:26,520 Speaker 1: it's just so practical. I think, when you're at work 284 00:14:26,520 --> 00:14:28,560 Speaker 1: and you're having just one of those days, at one 285 00:14:28,600 --> 00:14:32,480 Speaker 1: of those moments, would you be able to talk us 286 00:14:32,520 --> 00:14:35,880 Speaker 1: through a self compassion break? Almost narrated, I can be 287 00:14:35,960 --> 00:14:37,960 Speaker 1: one and happy to I would love you to lead 288 00:14:38,040 --> 00:14:39,320 Speaker 1: one for us. And when I'm going to. 289 00:14:39,320 --> 00:14:41,080 Speaker 2: Ask you, Amantha, I get to ask you to do 290 00:14:41,120 --> 00:14:42,560 Speaker 2: it in real time, and then I'm going to ask 291 00:14:42,600 --> 00:14:44,960 Speaker 2: you about how it went for you. Okay, you don't 292 00:14:45,000 --> 00:14:47,800 Speaker 2: have to share what you're having ade me toward, but 293 00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:51,440 Speaker 2: just the process excellent, all right. So we might want 294 00:14:51,480 --> 00:14:53,200 Speaker 2: to close your eyes. You don't have to close your 295 00:14:53,200 --> 00:14:55,240 Speaker 2: eyes in real life, but it helps, especially in this 296 00:14:55,320 --> 00:14:59,560 Speaker 2: context to go inward. Okay, And so I'd invite you 297 00:14:59,600 --> 00:15:04,480 Speaker 2: to think about something in your life that's troubling you 298 00:15:04,600 --> 00:15:08,600 Speaker 2: or causing you stress. Perhaps it is something that works 299 00:15:08,600 --> 00:15:12,640 Speaker 2: some stress or you're experiencing, or maybe you've made some 300 00:15:12,800 --> 00:15:16,720 Speaker 2: mistake or feel like a failure at something. It also 301 00:15:16,800 --> 00:15:19,800 Speaker 2: might be in your personal life, a relationship issue, or 302 00:15:20,200 --> 00:15:24,000 Speaker 2: even be a health issue. I would invite people listening 303 00:15:24,040 --> 00:15:27,119 Speaker 2: to this not to think of anything that's too stressful 304 00:15:27,200 --> 00:15:29,840 Speaker 2: or overwhelming, because if you're overwhelmed, you are even going 305 00:15:29,840 --> 00:15:32,720 Speaker 2: to be able to learn the practice. So choose something 306 00:15:32,760 --> 00:15:37,920 Speaker 2: that's mild to moderately distressing. Call the situation to mind, 307 00:15:37,960 --> 00:15:44,840 Speaker 2: what's happening, what's going on. See if you can feel 308 00:15:44,920 --> 00:15:51,040 Speaker 2: the discomfort of what's happening in your body. Notice usually 309 00:15:51,040 --> 00:15:59,200 Speaker 2: those feelings of contraction or unease. Well, bring in mindfulness, 310 00:15:59,360 --> 00:16:03,640 Speaker 2: just to become aware of and be present with the 311 00:16:03,680 --> 00:16:09,080 Speaker 2: fact that it's hard to be feeling this or it's 312 00:16:09,200 --> 00:16:14,640 Speaker 2: hard to be in this situation. I'm hurting. We don't 313 00:16:14,640 --> 00:16:17,000 Speaker 2: want to ignore it. The other hand, we don't want 314 00:16:17,040 --> 00:16:19,640 Speaker 2: to lose ourselves with it. We just want to see it, 315 00:16:19,720 --> 00:16:24,080 Speaker 2: be with it as it is. This is hard and 316 00:16:24,160 --> 00:16:27,920 Speaker 2: also to remember that things like this they're part of 317 00:16:27,960 --> 00:16:33,400 Speaker 2: being human. There are probably literally millions of people experiencing 318 00:16:33,520 --> 00:16:38,640 Speaker 2: something similar, you know, some some worse, maybe not as bad, 319 00:16:38,640 --> 00:16:41,920 Speaker 2: but that the point is mainly that you are a 320 00:16:42,080 --> 00:16:45,800 Speaker 2: human being. This is part of the shared human experience. 321 00:16:46,520 --> 00:16:52,680 Speaker 2: You are not alone. There's nothing wrong with you or 322 00:16:52,720 --> 00:16:56,560 Speaker 2: whatever it is you're worried about or thinking about. And 323 00:16:56,720 --> 00:16:59,320 Speaker 2: this is part for the course, it's part of being 324 00:16:59,320 --> 00:17:04,600 Speaker 2: a human being. We make mistakes, we struggle, stuff happens. 325 00:17:06,240 --> 00:17:11,080 Speaker 2: We aren't perfect. No one's perfect. No one's life is perfect. 326 00:17:12,359 --> 00:17:14,560 Speaker 2: Know it about you too. Go ahead and put maybe 327 00:17:14,640 --> 00:17:17,600 Speaker 2: both hands on your heart, or fold your arms, or 328 00:17:17,600 --> 00:17:20,960 Speaker 2: maybe cradle your face, use some sort of physical gesture. 329 00:17:22,400 --> 00:17:26,040 Speaker 2: It really brings some physical warmth and support to yourself. 330 00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:35,080 Speaker 2: Express our kindness through touch and also any words of support, 331 00:17:35,480 --> 00:17:40,080 Speaker 2: kindness and encouragement that are exactly what you need to 332 00:17:40,119 --> 00:17:45,400 Speaker 2: hear right now, whatever your situation is. You know, perhaps 333 00:17:45,400 --> 00:17:49,919 Speaker 2: it's something like you're doing the best you can or 334 00:17:50,320 --> 00:17:55,280 Speaker 2: you've got this, I'm here for you, I won't abandon you. 335 00:17:57,480 --> 00:18:02,840 Speaker 2: What do you need? And in fact, you might imagine 336 00:18:03,560 --> 00:18:06,479 Speaker 2: what you would say to a friend who was in 337 00:18:06,520 --> 00:18:10,200 Speaker 2: the exact same situation you were, Maybe easier to think 338 00:18:10,240 --> 00:18:12,159 Speaker 2: of the appropriate thing to say if you think of 339 00:18:12,880 --> 00:18:14,639 Speaker 2: what if you had a good friend it was in 340 00:18:14,680 --> 00:18:18,760 Speaker 2: the exact same situation you were. Would you say to 341 00:18:18,800 --> 00:18:26,720 Speaker 2: be supportive and kind and helpful, encouraging, maybe just validating, 342 00:18:29,760 --> 00:18:33,000 Speaker 2: and then see if you can say something similar to 343 00:18:33,040 --> 00:18:46,159 Speaker 2: yourself okay, and then you can open your eyes. So 344 00:18:46,200 --> 00:18:48,680 Speaker 2: I did a slightly longer one to show the steps, 345 00:18:48,720 --> 00:18:51,080 Speaker 2: but you can do it really quick. So what was 346 00:18:51,119 --> 00:18:52,200 Speaker 2: that like for you? Amantha? 347 00:18:52,920 --> 00:18:56,640 Speaker 1: Ah? I feel very calm and relaxed now, that's for sure. 348 00:18:57,080 --> 00:19:00,480 Speaker 1: And I think some of the phrase is that you 349 00:19:01,560 --> 00:19:05,040 Speaker 1: said they just they hit me, and it's like, oh, yeah, 350 00:19:05,400 --> 00:19:09,080 Speaker 1: that's so true. You know, I'm not alone. And then 351 00:19:09,119 --> 00:19:11,320 Speaker 1: there are yeah, a couple of other ones that I 352 00:19:11,320 --> 00:19:15,199 Speaker 1: can't remember now, but it was, yeah, like the words 353 00:19:15,240 --> 00:19:19,480 Speaker 1: really resonated, and it was interesting when I moved to 354 00:19:19,520 --> 00:19:22,600 Speaker 1: put my hands on my heart that it just had 355 00:19:22,840 --> 00:19:27,760 Speaker 1: such ad to really calming and warming effect as opposed 356 00:19:27,760 --> 00:19:30,720 Speaker 1: to when I started the exercise in my hands were 357 00:19:30,800 --> 00:19:35,080 Speaker 1: just by my side on the chair, So even that physicality, 358 00:19:35,800 --> 00:19:37,920 Speaker 1: it made the experience feel very different. 359 00:19:38,440 --> 00:19:40,439 Speaker 2: Yeah, you could put on your hands first, if you 360 00:19:40,480 --> 00:19:42,640 Speaker 2: wann't as well. I kind of do it to emphasize 361 00:19:42,720 --> 00:19:44,840 Speaker 2: the warmth of the physical touch, but you can do 362 00:19:44,880 --> 00:19:48,800 Speaker 2: it at any point because it's largely working through your physiology, 363 00:19:49,320 --> 00:19:53,679 Speaker 2: your activating and your comparisympathetic over system, the tandem affriend system, 364 00:19:53,720 --> 00:19:55,359 Speaker 2: and that's probably why you feel calmer. 365 00:19:55,480 --> 00:19:58,040 Speaker 1: Thank you for taking us through that, and I think 366 00:19:58,119 --> 00:20:01,719 Speaker 1: for listeners, make a note of wherever that it was 367 00:20:01,880 --> 00:20:04,240 Speaker 1: in the episode so you can come back to it. 368 00:20:04,320 --> 00:20:06,080 Speaker 1: I know I will definitely be coming back to it. 369 00:20:06,600 --> 00:20:09,639 Speaker 1: We will be back with Kristen soon. When we return, 370 00:20:09,720 --> 00:20:12,480 Speaker 1: we'll be revealing strategies you can use to say no 371 00:20:12,800 --> 00:20:16,040 Speaker 1: to offers and interactions that might leave you feeling drained 372 00:20:16,160 --> 00:20:19,800 Speaker 1: or exhausted. We'll also get answers on how you can 373 00:20:19,880 --> 00:20:22,960 Speaker 1: use self compassion when you're out and about and not 374 00:20:23,080 --> 00:20:29,760 Speaker 1: just when you're quietly sitting at home without distractions. If 375 00:20:29,800 --> 00:20:32,439 Speaker 1: you're looking for more tips to improve the way you 376 00:20:32,520 --> 00:20:35,679 Speaker 1: work can live. I write a short weekly newsletter that 377 00:20:35,760 --> 00:20:39,240 Speaker 1: contains tactics I've discovered that have helped me personally. You 378 00:20:39,280 --> 00:20:42,600 Speaker 1: can sign up for that at Amantha dot com. That's 379 00:20:42,800 --> 00:20:52,040 Speaker 1: Amantha dot com. I'm wondering like about self compassion exercises 380 00:20:52,119 --> 00:20:54,359 Speaker 1: or practices that we can do when we're out and 381 00:20:54,400 --> 00:20:57,920 Speaker 1: about and moving, like, what does that look like? Because 382 00:20:57,920 --> 00:21:00,439 Speaker 1: that was one that I guess was you know, involved 383 00:21:00,480 --> 00:21:02,720 Speaker 1: stillness simply you know the way we did it then, 384 00:21:02,960 --> 00:21:06,160 Speaker 1: but what does it look like at the other end, right, right. 385 00:21:06,160 --> 00:21:09,120 Speaker 2: So there's a lot of different practices you could do 386 00:21:09,320 --> 00:21:12,359 Speaker 2: so when you're interacting with others. So, for instance, we 387 00:21:12,520 --> 00:21:15,480 Speaker 2: trained a bunch of doctors and nurses at the local 388 00:21:15,600 --> 00:21:18,160 Speaker 2: children's hospital here and they didn't have time to take 389 00:21:18,160 --> 00:21:20,160 Speaker 2: a self compassion break. There were on the ward they 390 00:21:20,160 --> 00:21:23,480 Speaker 2: were seeing sick kids of their parents. So we actually 391 00:21:23,560 --> 00:21:26,920 Speaker 2: taught them a practice where you'd say breathing and they 392 00:21:26,960 --> 00:21:29,639 Speaker 2: imagine as they are breathing out that they are breathing 393 00:21:29,680 --> 00:21:32,720 Speaker 2: out compassion for the parents and the kids they were seeing. 394 00:21:33,040 --> 00:21:35,000 Speaker 2: But then when they breathe in, they were breathing in 395 00:21:35,040 --> 00:21:39,399 Speaker 2: compassion for themselves. So they actually did that practice on 396 00:21:39,520 --> 00:21:41,679 Speaker 2: the wards they're going from room to room. You know, 397 00:21:41,720 --> 00:21:43,920 Speaker 2: you have to breathe in and out or shall die, 398 00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:46,440 Speaker 2: so you could you know, you also have to give 399 00:21:46,480 --> 00:21:48,760 Speaker 2: yourself compassion as well as others, or else you will 400 00:21:48,800 --> 00:21:52,280 Speaker 2: get drained and depleted. And burned out. So that's something 401 00:21:52,320 --> 00:21:55,400 Speaker 2: you can do. You can focus on the breath anytime, 402 00:21:55,440 --> 00:21:57,840 Speaker 2: you can just say something kind of kind of supportive 403 00:21:57,880 --> 00:22:00,600 Speaker 2: to yourself, like you got this, or you're doing the 404 00:22:00,640 --> 00:22:03,359 Speaker 2: best you can, or you know, just just so you 405 00:22:03,400 --> 00:22:06,000 Speaker 2: know it's okay, I'm here for you. Any little thing 406 00:22:06,119 --> 00:22:07,840 Speaker 2: like that. You can kind of whisper in your own 407 00:22:07,880 --> 00:22:11,479 Speaker 2: ears as you're walking. There's also some things you can 408 00:22:11,520 --> 00:22:14,960 Speaker 2: do that are slightly different, but this is actually more 409 00:22:14,960 --> 00:22:18,399 Speaker 2: of a self care practice. But again, self care is 410 00:22:18,440 --> 00:22:20,840 Speaker 2: an act of self compassion, and that when we practice 411 00:22:20,840 --> 00:22:24,959 Speaker 2: self care, it helps leviat our suffering. So just noticing 412 00:22:25,680 --> 00:22:28,920 Speaker 2: beauty when you actually when you're when you're out walking, 413 00:22:29,080 --> 00:22:32,119 Speaker 2: just instead of just focusing on problem solving or not 414 00:22:32,160 --> 00:22:35,199 Speaker 2: even ignoring your surroundings. This is really great to do 415 00:22:35,240 --> 00:22:39,000 Speaker 2: if you're outdoors, maybe walking to your car or walking outside, 416 00:22:39,520 --> 00:22:42,480 Speaker 2: but even inside, just taking a few moments to kind 417 00:22:42,520 --> 00:22:46,440 Speaker 2: of nourish yourself by noticing whatever's beautiful or pleasant, a 418 00:22:46,560 --> 00:22:49,560 Speaker 2: practice called savoring. Again, there's a lot of research that 419 00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:53,840 Speaker 2: shows that savoring also gratitude, be grateful what's good as 420 00:22:53,840 --> 00:22:56,520 Speaker 2: well as you know, noticing what's broken. That's the way 421 00:22:56,560 --> 00:22:59,280 Speaker 2: of replenishing and nourishing ourself as well, and that can 422 00:22:59,359 --> 00:23:02,639 Speaker 2: be done on the go when you're active in your life. 423 00:23:02,840 --> 00:23:06,040 Speaker 1: Which practices do you find yourself coming back to again 424 00:23:06,080 --> 00:23:09,280 Speaker 1: and again? Because I'm curious, is it personal preference in 425 00:23:09,359 --> 00:23:12,280 Speaker 1: terms of which of the many self compassion strategies that 426 00:23:12,320 --> 00:23:15,439 Speaker 1: you talk about in research that we use, or some 427 00:23:15,520 --> 00:23:16,560 Speaker 1: more powerful than others? 428 00:23:16,880 --> 00:23:19,280 Speaker 2: I know it's really the most powerful ones are the 429 00:23:19,280 --> 00:23:22,240 Speaker 2: ones that work for you personally. There's really no right 430 00:23:22,359 --> 00:23:24,200 Speaker 2: or wrong way to do it. So if you go 431 00:23:24,280 --> 00:23:26,920 Speaker 2: to my website, I have a ton of different practices, 432 00:23:27,240 --> 00:23:30,160 Speaker 2: or in the Mindful Self Compassion Workbook which I wrote 433 00:23:30,160 --> 00:23:33,320 Speaker 2: with college Chris Germro, you've got like thirty eight different practices. 434 00:23:33,880 --> 00:23:37,119 Speaker 2: So really the best practice is the one that feels 435 00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:38,920 Speaker 2: right for you in the moment, and also the one 436 00:23:38,920 --> 00:23:41,840 Speaker 2: that you enjoy doing. If it feels like work or 437 00:23:41,880 --> 00:23:45,199 Speaker 2: really makes very stressful, you know you're going to do it, 438 00:23:45,320 --> 00:23:45,960 Speaker 2: that's not good. 439 00:23:47,400 --> 00:23:49,040 Speaker 1: And how about for you? What are the ones the 440 00:23:49,040 --> 00:23:51,760 Speaker 1: practices that you find yourself coming back to again and again. 441 00:23:52,000 --> 00:23:55,560 Speaker 2: It's interesting another kind of angle I've been working on. 442 00:23:55,600 --> 00:23:57,440 Speaker 2: I actually wrote a book a couple of years ago 443 00:23:57,520 --> 00:23:59,920 Speaker 2: based out of my own personal experience. Often at work 444 00:24:00,359 --> 00:24:04,879 Speaker 2: it's called fear self compassion. So fear self compassion I 445 00:24:05,080 --> 00:24:07,520 Speaker 2: like to call it mama bear self compassion. It's a 446 00:24:07,600 --> 00:24:12,240 Speaker 2: fierce protective energy. Sometimes it comes out as anger or 447 00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:16,399 Speaker 2: just like real bravery or courage. And so because I 448 00:24:16,440 --> 00:24:19,000 Speaker 2: had some work situations going on and I was being 449 00:24:19,000 --> 00:24:22,080 Speaker 2: treated well, I felt at least unfairly at work, I 450 00:24:22,160 --> 00:24:26,480 Speaker 2: was having these fierce reactions, and I realized that by 451 00:24:27,000 --> 00:24:31,000 Speaker 2: harnessing that fierceness and channeling it. So when it's aimed 452 00:24:31,040 --> 00:24:34,119 Speaker 2: at people, make anger or fierceness is actually not helpful. 453 00:24:34,119 --> 00:24:36,439 Speaker 2: And also it doesn't go along with my values. But 454 00:24:36,480 --> 00:24:39,000 Speaker 2: when you can aim at not at people, but it 455 00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:42,479 Speaker 2: just like at events, kind of clarity, this is not okay, 456 00:24:42,600 --> 00:24:45,439 Speaker 2: this unfair treatment is not okay, or this isn'tjus and 457 00:24:45,480 --> 00:24:48,800 Speaker 2: there was some gender stuff going on, then it can 458 00:24:48,840 --> 00:24:52,800 Speaker 2: be very helpful. So the fear self compassion practice might 459 00:24:52,840 --> 00:24:56,679 Speaker 2: be something like realizing that I need to standing up 460 00:24:56,720 --> 00:24:59,800 Speaker 2: for myself, speaking up and again, as long as it 461 00:24:59,800 --> 00:25:03,920 Speaker 2: does to humanize anyone or it's not personal, but speaking 462 00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:08,639 Speaker 2: your truth, protecting yourself. Drawing boundaries say no right. So, 463 00:25:08,720 --> 00:25:10,600 Speaker 2: for instance, a lot of people ask me to do 464 00:25:10,680 --> 00:25:13,080 Speaker 2: stuff and I often have to say no. And so 465 00:25:13,160 --> 00:25:16,919 Speaker 2: that's kind of a fierce self compassion practice that I 466 00:25:17,000 --> 00:25:19,960 Speaker 2: use a lot, especially in my work life. And then 467 00:25:20,000 --> 00:25:22,040 Speaker 2: if I forget and I do make it personal, I 468 00:25:22,119 --> 00:25:24,840 Speaker 2: use tender self compassion to forgive myself and I ask 469 00:25:24,880 --> 00:25:25,560 Speaker 2: for forgiveness. 470 00:25:26,520 --> 00:25:27,120 Speaker 1: It happens. 471 00:25:27,840 --> 00:25:28,439 Speaker 2: Sometimes. 472 00:25:29,400 --> 00:25:33,720 Speaker 1: It's interesting that you saying NAR is an active self compassion. 473 00:25:33,760 --> 00:25:38,159 Speaker 1: I love that absolutely. What strategies do you use to 474 00:25:38,240 --> 00:25:38,680 Speaker 1: say NAR? 475 00:25:39,240 --> 00:25:43,240 Speaker 2: You know again, I try to usually express the gratitude 476 00:25:43,320 --> 00:25:46,879 Speaker 2: for someone being interested enough to ask me to do something. 477 00:25:47,480 --> 00:25:49,920 Speaker 2: I might even say something like, you know I need 478 00:25:49,960 --> 00:25:52,560 Speaker 2: to take care of myself. I say no. I wish 479 00:25:52,640 --> 00:25:54,480 Speaker 2: I could help you, but you know I can't. And 480 00:25:54,520 --> 00:25:56,360 Speaker 2: so I feel like when I do that, I don't 481 00:25:56,359 --> 00:25:58,440 Speaker 2: know other people take it, but I'm kind of modeling 482 00:25:58,520 --> 00:26:01,360 Speaker 2: that you have permission to do the same. Everyone has 483 00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:04,760 Speaker 2: permission to take care of themselves by saying no, and 484 00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:06,160 Speaker 2: in fact, it is a kindness. 485 00:26:06,359 --> 00:26:10,560 Speaker 1: I had a question around making progress around self compassion 486 00:26:10,600 --> 00:26:13,240 Speaker 1: because I feel like I need work in this area, 487 00:26:13,280 --> 00:26:15,040 Speaker 1: which is one of the reasons why I reached out 488 00:26:15,040 --> 00:26:18,240 Speaker 1: to you to have you on the show and One 489 00:26:18,240 --> 00:26:20,480 Speaker 1: of the things I did in preparation for the interview 490 00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:24,400 Speaker 1: is I did the self compassion quiz that's on your website, 491 00:26:24,400 --> 00:26:27,200 Speaker 1: which I will link to in the show notes. And 492 00:26:27,520 --> 00:26:30,439 Speaker 1: I am a little bit below average, I mean the 493 00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:37,080 Speaker 1: average range, though, But is this something that with practicing 494 00:26:37,240 --> 00:26:40,600 Speaker 1: the practices that we've talked about, will I see progress? 495 00:26:40,680 --> 00:26:43,280 Speaker 1: Will I see improvement in how self compassionate I am? 496 00:26:43,320 --> 00:26:45,240 Speaker 1: If I did that test, say in a month's time. 497 00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:49,000 Speaker 2: Yes, absolutely. We have a lot of longitudein or researchery 498 00:26:49,119 --> 00:26:52,760 Speaker 2: track people using the scale over time, and people do improve. 499 00:26:52,800 --> 00:26:54,560 Speaker 2: I mean, this is a great thing. It is a 500 00:26:54,640 --> 00:26:58,080 Speaker 2: learnable skill. I mean, some people, based on how they 501 00:26:58,080 --> 00:26:59,960 Speaker 2: were raised tend to have a little more self compare 502 00:27:00,359 --> 00:27:02,880 Speaker 2: than others. Or it can also be based on genetics 503 00:27:03,000 --> 00:27:05,760 Speaker 2: or on culture. There's a lot of reasons why we 504 00:27:05,880 --> 00:27:10,200 Speaker 2: lack self compassion is natural, but anyone, even people who 505 00:27:10,280 --> 00:27:14,199 Speaker 2: come from really abusive homes, especially like with therapy. One 506 00:27:14,280 --> 00:27:16,440 Speaker 2: of the things therapy does. We know it does matter 507 00:27:16,440 --> 00:27:20,440 Speaker 2: what style of therapy. Good therapy teaches self compassion. That's 508 00:27:20,480 --> 00:27:23,320 Speaker 2: part of what it is. Anyone can learn the skill, 509 00:27:23,880 --> 00:27:26,480 Speaker 2: and again sometimes it does help to have a therapist 510 00:27:26,760 --> 00:27:30,040 Speaker 2: or someone to kind of hold your hands, so to speak. 511 00:27:30,240 --> 00:27:33,440 Speaker 2: And also I should just mention briefly, sometimes as we're 512 00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:37,119 Speaker 2: talking about people maybe with early family trauma, sometimes we 513 00:27:37,160 --> 00:27:40,159 Speaker 2: open our hearts to ourselves. We open our hearts and 514 00:27:40,200 --> 00:27:42,359 Speaker 2: like all the pain we've been holding inside of us 515 00:27:42,400 --> 00:27:45,159 Speaker 2: comes rushing out, and so we want it. Sometimes we 516 00:27:45,160 --> 00:27:48,440 Speaker 2: need to practice self compassion slowly. We need to ty 517 00:27:48,520 --> 00:27:50,919 Speaker 2: trate the amount of pain we touch, because if you 518 00:27:50,920 --> 00:27:53,960 Speaker 2: think about self compassion, what it's referring to is the 519 00:27:54,000 --> 00:27:57,119 Speaker 2: ability to be with pain in a supportive way. But 520 00:27:57,160 --> 00:27:59,040 Speaker 2: if we have a lot of pain, or the pain 521 00:27:59,080 --> 00:28:02,840 Speaker 2: comes too quickly, and that's actually not compassionate. So sometimes 522 00:28:02,840 --> 00:28:05,120 Speaker 2: we just need to go slowly and you know, learn 523 00:28:05,160 --> 00:28:07,080 Speaker 2: the skill, maybe get a little help someone to help 524 00:28:07,160 --> 00:28:09,520 Speaker 2: us hold it could be really a kind thing to 525 00:28:09,520 --> 00:28:10,600 Speaker 2: do for ourself as well. 526 00:28:10,800 --> 00:28:14,479 Speaker 1: Oh, Kristin, it has been so great to connect. And 527 00:28:14,520 --> 00:28:18,359 Speaker 1: thank you for saying yes and not no to my 528 00:28:18,600 --> 00:28:22,000 Speaker 1: request for your time. I am very very grateful and 529 00:28:22,200 --> 00:28:24,520 Speaker 1: I've loved this time that we've been able to spend together. 530 00:28:24,720 --> 00:28:26,320 Speaker 2: It's been my pleasure. Thank you. 531 00:28:27,560 --> 00:28:30,040 Speaker 1: I hope you love this chat with Kristin as much 532 00:28:30,080 --> 00:28:32,879 Speaker 1: as I did. I thought her example of a self 533 00:28:32,880 --> 00:28:35,919 Speaker 1: compassion break was really interesting, and I know I'll be 534 00:28:36,040 --> 00:28:38,880 Speaker 1: listening back to that section at some point to help 535 00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:42,000 Speaker 1: me take my own self compassion breaks. You can find 536 00:28:42,120 --> 00:28:44,880 Speaker 1: links to Kristen's website in the show notes, as well 537 00:28:44,880 --> 00:28:48,000 Speaker 1: as links to her self Compassion Quiz and her self 538 00:28:48,040 --> 00:28:51,320 Speaker 1: Compassion Community. If you like today's show, make sure you 539 00:28:51,400 --> 00:28:54,440 Speaker 1: hit follow on your podcast app to be alerted when 540 00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:57,800 Speaker 1: new episodes drop. How I Work was recorded on the 541 00:28:57,800 --> 00:29:00,680 Speaker 1: traditional land of the Warrangery people, part of the Colon 542 00:29:00,800 --> 00:29:01,000 Speaker 1: Nation