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Speaker 1: We know that budget estimates continue in the Northern Territory today.

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Speaker 1: Minister Brent Potter has been in the hot seat for

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Speaker 1: about the last hour as I understand it, answering questions,

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Speaker 1: no doubt about the police portfolio. If he hasn't yet,

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Speaker 1: he will be Naria kiss in the chair of the TSAVO.

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Speaker 1: They're scheduled to run until ten thirty tonight. Now. I

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Speaker 1: know that probably a lot of people aren't feeling really

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Speaker 1: sorry for our police having to work that late, but

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Speaker 1: it is a very long day and a little unusual

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Speaker 1: I think. But joining me live from Parliament House right

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Speaker 1: now is the Independent member Farra lu And Robin Lamley.

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Speaker 1: Good morning to you, Robin, Hello, Katy, good to have

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Speaker 1: you on the show.

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Speaker 2: Robin.

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Speaker 1: You've been going for about an hour so far this

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Speaker 1: morning with Brent Potter answering questions.

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Speaker 2: What's been on the agenda.

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Speaker 3: We had, Katie, We started to eight. The first area

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Speaker 3: that he's down to talk on is alcohol policy, which

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Speaker 3: is just so critically important to our entire way of

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Speaker 3: life in the Northern Territory. That's been pretty interesting so far.

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Speaker 3: And next we have police which should come up in

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Speaker 3: probably the next half an hour.

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Speaker 1: Now I understand yesterday you'd ask some questions about alcohol

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Speaker 1: management plans in communities and it was learned that forty

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Speaker 1: five communities have expressed interest in being able to access alcohol.

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Speaker 2: Is that right?

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Speaker 3: Well, the figures they gave us today are a bit interest,

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Speaker 3: a bit different. So what they've initiated is a program

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Speaker 3: that will span over two years that is essentially inviting

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Speaker 3: Aboriginal communities that are currently grog free to put forward

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Speaker 3: a plan as to how they're going to manage alcohol

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Speaker 3: and ultimately most of them will want it turned on.

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Speaker 3: So they Bred Potter, the Minister for Alcohol Policy and Police,

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Speaker 3: just told us that there've been one hundred and two

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Speaker 3: expressions of interest in this. So that's one hundred and

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Speaker 3: two Aboriginal community. Thirty five of those are proceeding to

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Speaker 3: develop their what they call a community alcohol plan, and

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Speaker 3: four of those are just about ready to lodge. So yeah,

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Speaker 3: things are moving in this space. And quite frankly, Katie,

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Speaker 3: I'm very concerned about this. We had a horrific experience

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Speaker 3: back in twenty two twenty three when we saw those

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Speaker 3: the impact of the Stronger Futures alcohol bands lifted, particularly

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Speaker 3: in Central Australia it was carnage. People were hurt, women

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Speaker 3: and children, mainly through domestic violence, and for them to

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Speaker 3: be even contemplating doing this at this stage, despite the

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Speaker 3: loveliness of self determination and control, I just think it's

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Speaker 3: the wrong move. Well, Andy, I'm absolutely opposed to it.

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Speaker 1: The other aspect, I think Robin that's going to be

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Speaker 1: interesting is then once the police come up for questioning

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Speaker 1: is are the communities areas where you know, are they

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Speaker 1: communities where there is a police presence and what impact

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Speaker 1: could it have, like you know, what do the police

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Speaker 1: sort of think about it too?

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Speaker 3: Well? Locally in Alice Springs. Those questions have already been

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Speaker 3: asked of the police Minister Katie and his answer on

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Speaker 3: ABC Ala Springs yesterday was to the effect that he

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Speaker 3: would not be requiring that there be a full time

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Speaker 3: police presence in these communities in which alcohol may be

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Speaker 3: turned on that he felt that the night patrols, the

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Speaker 3: different Aboriginal patrols, and the health services that exist on

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Speaker 3: those communities could manage with the fallout from alcohol being introduced,

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Speaker 3: which is just rubbish. I mean, everything that we know

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Speaker 3: about how alcohol affects Aboriginal communities just doesn't fit with

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Speaker 3: that at all.

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Speaker 1: So, Robin, what is your major concern with that alcohol

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Speaker 1: going back into communities, because I know that there'll be

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Speaker 1: people listening who are sort of saying, well, you know,

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Speaker 1: if they've got a one, if it is at a

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Speaker 1: canteen area, or they're only you know, it's people only

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Speaker 1: having a couple of drinks at the end of the day,

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Speaker 1: surely they're entitled to do the same as what we

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Speaker 1: can in a broader community.

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Speaker 3: In an ideal world. I couldn't agree with you more.

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Speaker 3: But that's not the way it plays out. I don't.

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Speaker 3: I think there's very little evidence or examples of that

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Speaker 3: actually working. The introduction of alcohol on Aboriginal communities triggers misery,

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Speaker 3: and there's just a huge amount of evidence to indicate

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Speaker 3: that in an ideal world, yes, let's turn it on,

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Speaker 3: but don't forget back. In January of last year, the

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Speaker 3: Prime Minister had to come into Alice Springs for a

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Speaker 3: couple of hours and basically tell this mod the Northern

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Speaker 3: Territory Labor government to wake up to themselves. And at

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Speaker 3: that point, Katie, he talked about how policy shouldn't be

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Speaker 3: based on ideology, and I agree with Albanezi and I

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Speaker 3: get totally what he was doing talking about in an

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Speaker 3: ideal world, Yes, it's ideologically sound to give everyone the

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Speaker 3: right to drink and enjoy a happy life and making

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Speaker 3: their own choices and decisions. But the reality is very different.

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Speaker 3: And the people that were impacted by the lifting of

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Speaker 3: the Stronger Futures legislation were mainly women and children mattered

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Speaker 3: and belted and abused, and the fallout in terms of

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Speaker 3: crime and lawlessness across the whole entire length and breadth

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Speaker 3: of Central Australia was unprecedended. And I will never forget that.

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Speaker 3: It is the single worst policy, most dangerous policy of

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Speaker 3: any government I have ever witnessed in my time as

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Speaker 3: a member of Parliament fourteen years.

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Speaker 1: And look, I think the point that you're raised there

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Speaker 1: about women and children being vulnerable in these situations is

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Speaker 1: a really, really important one. And you know, the thing

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Speaker 1: that I wonder about as well is even with these

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Speaker 1: alcohol management plans being put together, are those voices going

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Speaker 1: to be heard and are they going to be listened

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Speaker 1: to if they raise those concerns, you know, depending on

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Speaker 1: where they're based.

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Speaker 3: Yes, we were just told that sixty percent of the

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Speaker 3: community have to support these community alcohol plans. Yeah, I

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Speaker 3: don't think that's enough. Six that's four out of ten

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Speaker 3: people who don't agree with it, six out of ten

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Speaker 3: who do. And we know that, you know a lot

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Speaker 3: of people will be have their arms twisted they too agree,

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Speaker 3: because that's the way these things work.

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Speaker 1: Robn just very quickly, do you know which four communities

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Speaker 1: are basically ready to lodge?

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Speaker 2: It was that level of detail, provider.

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Speaker 3: Well, my main question around that. I did ask the question,

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Speaker 3: but from a different angle. My concern is that they'll

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Speaker 3: turn on the grog in the town camps in Our Springs,

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Speaker 3: which will be an absolute disaster, given that the town

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Speaker 3: camps are a part of a broader community called our

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Speaker 3: Ae Springs and town camps are notoriously bad for domestic

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Speaker 3: violence and crime and all the rest of it. So

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Speaker 3: my question was, are any of these four town camps?

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Speaker 3: And after some consideration and back and forth, they said, no,

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Speaker 3: I don't know what these four community the communities these are,

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Speaker 3: but they're not town camps, and for me that was

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Speaker 3: an enormous relief.

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Speaker 2: Robin.

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Speaker 1: Moving along, we know that Brent Potter is also the

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Speaker 1: Minister for Police. What are you keen to sort of

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Speaker 1: find out more about given the situation you've seen in

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Speaker 1: Ella Springs that led to the first ever curfew for

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Speaker 1: the Northern Territory and some of those real issues with

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Speaker 1: crime that we have seen I'm going to be blunt

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Speaker 1: about it over more than the last four years.

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Speaker 3: Yes, Katie, so really putting it simply an ongoing commitment

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Speaker 3: to consider our needs and make sure that we're properly resourced,

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Speaker 3: which I have to say Potter is making all the

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Speaker 3: right noises, but you know, there's always situations that arise

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Speaker 3: that need to be responded to immediately or yesterday, and

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Speaker 3: you know, just putting the pressure on people like Brent

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Speaker 3: Potter constantly is the only way to get the results

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Speaker 3: in the service delivery we need. But you know, sadly,

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Speaker 3: today I think questioning will go to the integrity of

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Speaker 3: the Police Minister and the Police Commissioner. I mean, I

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Speaker 3: don't think we can sit in front of these two

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Speaker 3: today for hours without talking about allegations of racism against

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Speaker 3: both of them and how they've responded and how this

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Speaker 3: will play out in terms of addressing the systemic racism

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Speaker 3: or allegations of systemic racism throughout the police force. I

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Speaker 3: know that the police force are generally disgruntled and unhappy

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Speaker 3: with what's been going on in terms of the Minister

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Speaker 3: and the Commissioner, and these things have to be addressed.

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Speaker 3: They're difficult conversations and no doubt the former Chief Minister

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Speaker 3: who's chair of the Estimates Committee, Natasha Files, will try

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Speaker 3: and shut it down. But this is what people want

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Speaker 3: to know. How will this government, how will this minister

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Speaker 3: and commissioner handle very very serious allegations around integrity.

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Speaker 1: Now, before I let you go, I understand estimates are

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Speaker 1: due to run untill about ten thirty tonight for the

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Speaker 1: next few nights. In fact, now, I don't know that

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Speaker 1: anybody's going to complain about long days for politicians, but

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Speaker 1: is it a bit unusual.

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Speaker 3: It's not entirely unusual, but it's entirely unnecessary. I mean,

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Speaker 3: who can work for fourteen and a half hours two

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Speaker 3: days in a row. I've spoken to my union Katie.

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Speaker 3: Her name's Robin Lamley, and she'll probably be going home

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Speaker 3: a bit early because she's going to put a foot

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Speaker 3: down the Union of Robin Lamley and some of some

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Speaker 3: of it we had out before ten thirty, some of

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Speaker 3: our police and you're half asleep Katie.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, well that's true.

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Speaker 1: But look, some of our police and nurses and healthcare

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Speaker 1: workers listening at the moment might be thinking to themselves,

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Speaker 1: we welcome to a day in the life of us.

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Speaker 3: Absolutely.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Look, I'm not saying it's it's something that other people

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Speaker 3: don't have to endure and perhaps for the sake of territory. Azul, Yeah,

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Speaker 3: suck it up.

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Speaker 2: I know you will. I know you will, Robin, I

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Speaker 2: know you will. You'll stay in there.

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Speaker 1: There is no way you'll be able to get you

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Speaker 1: out once you get down a line of questioning that

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Speaker 1: you want some answers to that I can be sure of.

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Speaker 2: Robin Lamley, Independent Member for Our Lord.

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Speaker 1: Always good to catch up with you, and I believe

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Speaker 1: we've got you on Friday for the week that was. Yes,

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Speaker 1: you have.

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Speaker 3: I'm looking forward to it, Katie

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Speaker 2: Wonderful, Thank you, Thanks Robin,