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Speaker 1: Now we know that the Royal Commission's seventh hearing is

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Speaker 1: going to be held at the Hilton Darwin Hotel from

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Speaker 1: tomorrow and Commissioners Nick Caldas APM and doctor Peggy Brown AO,

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Speaker 1: along with the Royal Commission staff last week went to

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Speaker 1: Larichie Defense Precinct. They also went to HMAS Koonawara. This

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Speaker 1: week they are due to go to the Raft based

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Speaker 1: Tindall and Well and Catherine today. We also know though

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Speaker 1: that the Commissioner also headed to a number of different locations. Well,

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Speaker 1: you know, real grassroots, I think you'd have to say,

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Speaker 1: towards the end of last week. And joining me in

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Speaker 1: the studio this morning is Sam Weston. Now he is

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Speaker 1: indeed a veteran and also the owner of the Mad

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Speaker 1: Snake Cafe, a place where many current and former defense

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Speaker 1: personnel meet and really support each other. He joins me

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Speaker 1: in the studio right now. Good morning to you, Sam.

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Speaker 1: Morning now, mate, you had the commissioners in your cafe

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Speaker 1: on Thursday last week, didn't you.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: I had both of them come in meet a couple

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Speaker 3: of US veterans and it was really nice to meet

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Speaker 3: them and they were so down to earth and I

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Speaker 3: guess that. Yeah, I think there's that little bit of

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Speaker 3: worry amongst veterans to meeting them and talking to them,

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Speaker 3: and you have my word on it, veterans out there

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Speaker 3: that they are here to help us get through this.

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Speaker 1: Why do you reckon there is that worry.

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Speaker 3: I think a lot of veterans have just been shafted

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Speaker 3: and by you know, so many people. Now that's just

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Speaker 3: here we go again type of thing, you know, and

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Speaker 3: maybe and I understand that, but like.

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Speaker 2: I said, these guys are here to help us.

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Speaker 3: This is our chance to you know, you can put

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Speaker 3: in a submission, you can go and chat to them.

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Speaker 3: This is our chance to get it out there. So

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Speaker 3: I really recommend all veterans out there or family members

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Speaker 3: of veterans.

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Speaker 2: That's the other one.

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Speaker 3: You know, this has affected a lot of families as well, wives, husbands, kids,

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Speaker 3: have a chat, put forward your thoughts and obviously from

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Speaker 3: this they're going to come up with an outcome and

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Speaker 3: hopefully that changes for a positive.

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Speaker 1: Sam. I know that there's heaps of people that listen

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Speaker 1: to the show that would know just how you know,

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Speaker 1: how massive the defense representation here in the Northern Territory is.

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Speaker 1: There are others that maybe don't have a real clear understanding.

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Speaker 1: But you know from your perspective at the Mad Snake,

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Speaker 1: and you know through what you do in terms of

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Speaker 1: veterans and also current personnel meeting there and chatting with

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Speaker 1: each other. You know, what is the sense amongst our

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Speaker 1: defense force and those that have left, you know, how

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Speaker 1: are they feeling with the way that the system.

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Speaker 3: They're let down? Like I'm not, It's not just a

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Speaker 3: couple of bit of twisted. This is the majority of

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Speaker 3: people I speak to have been let down in some way,

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Speaker 3: whether it be from the Defense Force or the Transition deva,

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Speaker 3: the claims, all the stuff that's going to come out

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Speaker 3: in this Royal Commission is exactly why veterans and their

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Speaker 3: families have been in you know and not listened to.

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Speaker 3: And like I said to Commissioner Pegney when Peggy I

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Speaker 3: had an interview with her, and I said, what's going

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Speaker 3: to what came out in the intim report was exactly

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Speaker 3: what I've moaned and bitched about for the past five years.

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Speaker 3: It's all of this is stuff that we knew was

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Speaker 3: and it's finally taken a commission or Royal Commission for

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Speaker 3: them to actually do something about it and bearing your mind.

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Speaker 3: You know, a lot of people did on this Royal Commission.

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Speaker 3: Devia didn't want it. Some of these those didn't want it.

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Speaker 3: Even the government at the time didn't really want it.

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Speaker 2: So we will.

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Speaker 3: It's almost like we've been fighting for something which you know,

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Speaker 3: you look at your DVA. These are claims. These are

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Speaker 3: things people are entitled to. We've asked people for twenty

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Speaker 3: two years now to go to war multiple times. Some

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Speaker 3: of these people have gone, and then when they come

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Speaker 3: back we can't look after them.

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Speaker 2: That's really poor formed.

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Speaker 3: So that's why I've been quite passionate and vocal and

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Speaker 3: annoying because I feel.

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Speaker 2: Like there was a stage of thought. I was the

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Speaker 2: only one that was that actually gave a whot about.

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Speaker 1: Yeah and Sam. The thing I suppose that a lot

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Speaker 1: of people probably weren't realize is that unless you've had

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Speaker 1: to go through that system as well, you have no

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Speaker 1: understanding of how difficult it is then to try and

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Speaker 1: get what you're actually entitled to.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and this is where I think it's not just me.

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Speaker 3: I've got a group of us that hang around the cafe,

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Speaker 3: all veterans. If we can help people with the things

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Speaker 3: where we didn't have help at the time or guide

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Speaker 3: them or you know.

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Speaker 2: Speak to the right people.

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Speaker 3: That that's where we're at the Mad Snake with counseled

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Speaker 3: Australian veterans, just trying to help people, you know, with

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Speaker 3: the supper I went through, you know, learn from my

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Speaker 3: mistakes and hopefully we can help, particularly Darwin. It to

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Speaker 3: me because Northern Territory is so small, there's only so

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Speaker 3: many of US veterans up here. We shouldn't we should

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Speaker 3: all know what's happening up here. And so that's why

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Speaker 3: I feel we've let them down up here. So big changes,

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Speaker 3: I hope.

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Speaker 1: What was it like for you when you did leave

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Speaker 1: the Defense Force and then transitioning back into normal everyday life.

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Speaker 3: Well, I mean at the time reflection now, I obviously

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Speaker 3: mental health, my mental health wasn't right. I was drinking

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Speaker 3: a lot, I was probably doing a fair bit of drugs,

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Speaker 3: but I wouldn't have known at the time. That was

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Speaker 3: how I dealt with it because obviously the Army didn't

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Speaker 3: help me with my.

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Speaker 1: Transition.

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Speaker 2: Transition, yeah for sure. So yeah, I went I went hard.

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Speaker 3: I had a good couple of years, but I went mentally,

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Speaker 3: I went hard, and looking back now that wasn't a

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Speaker 3: good thing. And you know, I speak to guys that

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Speaker 3: have done twenty thirty years getting out now that really

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Speaker 3: is a big step. And this is where we maybe

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Speaker 3: we're lacking a bit also up here is you know,

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Speaker 3: trying to hard. It's so hard to explain, like joining

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Speaker 3: the army is just a different world. And then you

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Speaker 3: just get well, my generation, we just got kicked out.

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Speaker 3: See you later. And it's probably taken me fifteen years

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Speaker 3: to deal with that, to be honest with you, And

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Speaker 3: it's been a massive learning curve of me. Helping other

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Speaker 3: veterans you know, has helped me as well, Like they're

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Speaker 3: helping me. Don't tell them that, but they're helping me

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Speaker 3: here as well, so you know, And it's just getting

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Speaker 3: that word out there for me, the Royal Commission. I

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Speaker 3: want the public to know what we've been winging and

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Speaker 3: moaning about. And also the parents of veterans that have

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Speaker 3: killed themselves, like they've been pushing this for years. We

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Speaker 3: haven't listened to them. It's almost like we've all been

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Speaker 3: a pain in someone's rear.

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Speaker 2: You know.

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Speaker 3: We just care about We generally care about veterans and

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Speaker 3: you know, we want to stop. It's not just suicides,

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Speaker 3: it's the mental health, it's the alcohol, the drugs, the

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Speaker 3: marriage breakdown. Like it's so much about it. Sometimes you

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Speaker 3: feel like you're hitting your head on that wall. And

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Speaker 3: I think that's where a lot of veterans feel. But

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Speaker 3: I'm just letting people know now, these guys seem to

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Speaker 3: be here to help us, and please get involved any

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Speaker 3: way you can.

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Speaker 1: I really hope. So Hey, you know, honestly, I'm not

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Speaker 1: looking at it very much from the outside in. I'm

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Speaker 1: not involved. You know, I don't have any veterans in

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Speaker 1: my family. I'm very much looking at it from the

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Speaker 1: outside in. But you know, when you look at the

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Speaker 1: parents of those who've taken their lives, who've fought for this,

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Speaker 1: you know, for such an incredibly long period of time.

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Speaker 1: When I speak to people like you, I've had other

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Speaker 1: veterans you know who've spoken to me before. You know,

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Speaker 1: the reeling for veterans mob and the wonderful work that

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Speaker 1: they do. But when you look at how tough it's

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Speaker 1: been for so many of our young Aussies and what

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Speaker 1: you've had to then try to do to get yourselves

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Speaker 1: right after you've been serving our great country, it just

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Speaker 1: shouldn't be that way.

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Speaker 3: No, it's pretty sad, isn't it. And I think we

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Speaker 3: all need everyone needs to take a bit of responsibility

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Speaker 3: for what we've done. And yeah, it is upset. That's

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Speaker 3: why I've been caring. It's why people think I'm a

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Speaker 3: crazy pork job and I am crazy, But this is

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Speaker 3: why I've been doing it because I felt like veterans

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Speaker 3: haven't had a voice, particularly in Darwin. Yeah, you know,

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Speaker 3: we've had three veteran suicides up here this year. We

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Speaker 3: all take that personally every time one of these things happen,

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Speaker 3: and you know, yeah, I hope the community and people

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Speaker 3: like yourself can understand what we're going on about now

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Speaker 3: and the problems.

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Speaker 2: Mate.

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Speaker 1: I don't think you're a crazy pork chop. I think

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Speaker 1: what you do through the cafes excellent. Actually, I think

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Speaker 1: it's really great the way that you help other people out,

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Speaker 1: and like you said, you know it helps you as well.

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Speaker 1: But I think it's fantastic. And you know, you see

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Speaker 1: how many people are rolling in there all the time.

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Speaker 1: I see the photos on the socials. You guys are

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Speaker 1: there all supporting each other.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it's good. It's such a good little setting. Down

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Speaker 2: there as well. And it's not just me, there's so

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Speaker 2: many people involved. Like it's just and.

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Speaker 3: Again it's veterans out there that are having a hard time.

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Speaker 3: Come in on a Friday for a coffee or just

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Speaker 3: get in contact with us and we'll find a way. Fishing, cycling,

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Speaker 3: we'll find something to try and help you at that moment.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, thank you mate.

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Speaker 1: What just before I let you go, what do you

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Speaker 1: hope that you see from this Royal Commission? What are

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Speaker 1: you genuinely hoping we see change in Australia when it

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Speaker 1: comes to this.

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Speaker 3: I think obviously the DVA in the claim system needs

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Speaker 3: a complete overhaul. I was talking to Jesse Bird's mum.

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Speaker 3: She came into my cafe last year. He was a

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Speaker 3: young veteran that killed himself and you hear his story

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Speaker 3: that morning he rang up DVA begging for he had

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Speaker 3: no job, mental health. They were pretty much nothing we

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Speaker 3: can do for you, and then unfortunately he killed himself.

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Speaker 3: So if we can alleviate that for me personally, I'd

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Speaker 3: like someone to come out and just say I'm sorry,

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Speaker 3: like someone in a high position, and go the way

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Speaker 3: you guys were treated over the past so many years,

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Speaker 3: We're sorry for that, and I think.

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Speaker 2: That would me personally. That's what I'm looking.

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Speaker 3: For also with the mental health thing, I think the

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Speaker 3: breakdown of mental health, Like I think we're slowly talking

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Speaker 3: about it. Yeah, it's okay to be and again to

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Speaker 3: your viewers, it's okay to be messed up everyone, because

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Speaker 3: I've been there.

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Speaker 2: You know, we've all been there. There's just it's how

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Speaker 2: you move on from that.

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Speaker 3: And I think the more we talk about it, the

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Speaker 3: more we interact, the better it's going to be from

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Speaker 3: the mental health community.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, that's what I'm hoping.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, look, we'll be keeping a really close on it.

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Speaker 1: I know that you'll be keeping a very very close

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Speaker 1: on things jar and you'll be there. I mean, is

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Speaker 1: that the message for people as well? Just make sure

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Speaker 1: that you do have your voice heard by these commissioners.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, you can either so you can have a sit

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Speaker 3: down chat with them, or you can do a submission,

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Speaker 3: or you can go and see you can go in

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Speaker 3: for two weeks, you can go and watch it. And again,

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Speaker 3: even if you don't want to write it, there's people

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Speaker 3: that get paid to write it up for you. Like

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Speaker 3: we have been really supportive of this commission. So yeah,

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Speaker 3: if anyone needs to put in and you hear some

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Speaker 3: people what's it going to do? And it's like, well,

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Speaker 3: maybe this is the thing that is going to make

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Speaker 3: a difference. You know, this is the most positive thing

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Speaker 3: that I've seen in regards to veterans. So I think

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Speaker 3: we should take it serious. And yeah, I please everyone

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Speaker 3: that can, particularly you know, the bad not the bad experiences,

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Speaker 3: but just what they think we can change. The more

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Speaker 3: people they're going to hear about the same thing, all right,

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Speaker 3: that's what we can fix.

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Speaker 2: I agree.

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Speaker 1: I agree with you, and I think you've got to

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Speaker 1: make sure that your voice is heard. I know that

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Speaker 1: you must feel as though it's you know, it's taken

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Speaker 1: so long to even get to this point and you

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Speaker 1: just want something to change. But you've got to make

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Speaker 1: sure that you have those voices heard. And they have

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Speaker 1: to listen. How can they not, you know, really, when

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Speaker 1: you've got this volume of former current family members coming

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Speaker 1: out saying something's got to change, they have to listen. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, it's ten years overdue, but it's happening. So let's

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Speaker 3: take advantage of it as much as we can.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Sam Western, good to speak to you this morning.

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Speaker 1: I really appreciate your time and good on you continuing

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Speaker 1: to run that wonderful cafe.

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Speaker 2: Thank you, thank you,