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Speaker 1: It's the Happy Families podcast.

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Speaker 2: It's the podcast for the time poor parent who just

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Speaker 2: wants answers now. So it almost is like a global

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Speaker 2: experiment putting smartphones and devices and social media in the

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Speaker 2: hands of children from literally their toddler years. And this

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Speaker 2: is the first generation to have that. And now here's

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Speaker 2: the stars of our show, my mum and dad.

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Speaker 3: Gooday.

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Speaker 4: This is doctor Justin Coulson, the author of a bunch

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Speaker 4: of books about raising happy families, like Misconnection, While your

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Speaker 4: teenage daughter hates you, expects the world needs to talk

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Speaker 4: and twenty one days to a happier family. Here with Kylie,

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Speaker 4: my podcast partner and my life partner, wife and mum

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Speaker 4: to our six kids, and Kylie. Today we're having a

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Speaker 4: conversation with the author of a book called Generation Alpha,

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Speaker 4: Understanding our children and helping them thrive. Mark McCrindle joins us. Now,

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Speaker 4: welcome Mark.

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Speaker 2: Thanks so much, Justin, Kylie. Great to be with you,

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Speaker 2: and Justin love your work and find it really for

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Speaker 2: myself so great to be talking with you.

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Speaker 3: Well, that's so nice. It's great to be with you. Mark.

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Speaker 4: Have been playing around with your brand new book, Generation

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Speaker 4: Alpha and flicking through reading a good portion of it.

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Speaker 3: Haven't gotten to the end yet.

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Speaker 4: I have to confess that I hate saying that on

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Speaker 4: a podcast interview, but I just I want to be transparent.

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Speaker 4: But I've read a good portion of it now and

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Speaker 4: I love this conversation about the different generations.

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Speaker 3: I've always resisted it.

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Speaker 4: I feel like I'm a gen Xer, and I kind

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Speaker 4: of never felt like I really was a gen X

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Speaker 4: person until I read your book and I was like, man,

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Speaker 4: that's exactly who I am, and I felt.

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Speaker 3: A little bit annoying.

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Speaker 4: So for parents who are not familiar with the different generations,

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Speaker 4: can you just walk us through from the baby Boomers,

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Speaker 4: the gen X gen y into where we are now

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Speaker 4: with our generation Alpha, the kids that are being born

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Speaker 4: right now.

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Speaker 2: Sure. Well, I'm a fellow gen Xer myself. So the

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Speaker 2: generation before us, as you said, are the Baby Boomers.

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Speaker 2: They're the grandparents of today now. I excited for them

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Speaker 2: to move into that next stage with kids. And then

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Speaker 2: it came us to us gen Xes and just the

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Speaker 2: reason for that label. In the early nineties, as the

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Speaker 2: gen X cohort was emerging, we didn't have a label.

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Speaker 2: An American actually Canadian writer said hey, we're not like

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Speaker 2: the boomers. Just call us X, you know, we defire label,

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Speaker 2: and that anti label became the label not only for

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Speaker 2: Generation X, but then Generation Y, also called the millennials.

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Speaker 2: But the Gen y's are now hitting their forties, so

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Speaker 2: they are in the parenting years, right in the middle

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Speaker 2: of it. And then we get to Generation Z, which

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Speaker 2: are the teenagers and twenty somethings, and we got to

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Speaker 2: the end of the alphabet. And so a few years

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Speaker 2: ago I was looking at all this, we need to

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Speaker 2: think about this next generation because they're about to be born,

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Speaker 2: and I just followed the scientific approach, which is using

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Speaker 2: the Greek alphabet. So Generation ALPHA are those born from

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Speaker 2: twenty ten through to twenty twenty four. So obviously the

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Speaker 2: children young children of today and will continue to be born,

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Speaker 2: six thousand of them being born in Australia every single week,

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Speaker 2: and they'll be quite a large generation in the end.

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Speaker 5: So Mark, I've got a question for you. How do

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Speaker 5: you characterize millennials. I mean, they're are main parents of

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Speaker 5: today's children.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, the little ones.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Well, these millennials, also called Generation Y, were born

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Speaker 2: from nineteen eighty through to nineteen ninety four. So if

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Speaker 2: you're a parent, a new parent, a young parent. Chances

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Speaker 2: that you're in that age group, and this is the

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Speaker 2: generation that we're coming of age as technology was. Of course,

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Speaker 2: the Gen Wise will remember, you know, they had the Internet,

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Speaker 2: They even had very early devices pretty much laptops, but

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Speaker 2: they didn't have the digital technology that their children are

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Speaker 2: now having, these Alphas are having. And so you know,

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Speaker 2: these millennials were different to us Gen x's. They were

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Speaker 2: a bit more globally connected, a bit more into the technology,

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Speaker 2: had mobile phones from a young age, but not the

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Speaker 2: smart devices of today. So even between the Gen Wise

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Speaker 2: and their children, there's quite a digital gap.

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Speaker 4: Mark that brings us to the reality that children today,

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Speaker 4: this Generation Alpha, are pretty much born with a screen

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Speaker 4: in their hand. People have always joked about that as

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Speaker 4: we were growing up, even these kids were addicted to screens,

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Speaker 4: But nowadays kids it's such an integral part of their life.

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Speaker 4: And in Generation al for you talk about the great

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Speaker 4: screen age, can you tell us what you discovered in

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Speaker 4: your research about kids today who are being raised in

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Speaker 4: this technologically advanced world.

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Speaker 2: Well, they definitely are this digital, globally connected, screen based

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Speaker 2: technology saturated generation. And as you say, you know, born

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Speaker 2: into this world of screens. That's literally the case because

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Speaker 2: the year they began being born twenty ten was the

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Speaker 2: year that the iPad came out, the first of the tablet,

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Speaker 2: and the year that the word of the year was

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Speaker 2: the word app the year that Instagram was launched. So

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Speaker 2: tells us something about the visual and social media world

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Speaker 2: that they have only ever known. And so it almost

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Speaker 2: is like a global experiment putting smartphones and devices and

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Speaker 2: social media in the hands of children from literally their

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Speaker 2: toddler years, and this is the first generation to have that.

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Speaker 2: So the touch screen, the interaction of that social connection

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Speaker 2: through device, and really the compulsive nature of the gamification

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Speaker 2: of their world is at a whole new level for

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Speaker 2: this young generation.

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Speaker 4: It's so funny hearing you say that when we talk

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Speaker 4: to our kids about life when we were growing up,

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Speaker 4: they can't conceive, literally cannot conceive of the idea that

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Speaker 4: Google wasn't a thing, and that we didn't all have

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Speaker 4: laptops or a computer in our pocket.

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Speaker 3: It's just so foreign to them.

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Speaker 4: When we come back after the break, we want to

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Speaker 4: ask you Mark a little bit about what it's like

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Speaker 4: to be a parent for generation out for the kinds

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Speaker 4: of things that kids need because of the world that

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Speaker 4: they've been born into, and we also want to find

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Speaker 4: out a bit about what's going to happen for them

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Speaker 4: from a work perspective. Everyone always talks about the incredible

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Speaker 4: pace at which the workplace is changing. That's coming up

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Speaker 4: in just a second.

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Speaker 3: It's a Happy Famili's.

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Speaker 1: Podcast for a happier family. Try a Happy Families membership,

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Speaker 1: because a happy family doesn't just happen. Details at happy

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Speaker 1: families dot com dot au.

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Speaker 5: It's the Happy Families Podcast, the podcast with a time

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Speaker 5: poor parent who just wants answers now. And today we're

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Speaker 5: talking with Mark McCrindle, author of Generation Alpha. Mike, I'm

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Speaker 5: thinking about our children today and the pressures on them

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Speaker 5: to perform and to learn in ways that we've never

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Speaker 5: seen in the history of humanity, and I'm wondering what

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Speaker 5: implication this has on them as they move through their

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Speaker 5: studies and into the workforce. What does your study actually

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Speaker 5: show us about education and the things that we need

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Speaker 5: to know as parents to help out you chldren move

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Speaker 5: through their education process and into the workforce.

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Speaker 2: Well, this generation is going to have more jobs than

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Speaker 2: ever before. Our estimation is eighteen separate employers in their

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Speaker 2: lifetime and across an estimated six different careers, so they

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Speaker 2: will be lifelong learners. They'll have to upskill and retrain

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Speaker 2: as they go along. They will have to remain ever

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Speaker 2: nimble to adjust and adapt as they go and they'll

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Speaker 2: work in jobs that don't yet exist, just as some

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Speaker 2: of them are working in jobs now some of the

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Speaker 2: school leaders that didn't exist when they began their school,

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Speaker 2: you know, cybersecurity or app development, or robotics or virtual reality, blockchain,

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Speaker 2: you know, whole new areas and industries have emerged in

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Speaker 2: the last decade and that will continue to be the case.

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Speaker 2: So having some digital literacy is useful. But even more

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Speaker 2: than that, having the people's skills is going to be essential.

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Speaker 2: Being able to be creative and resilient and adaptive and

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Speaker 2: adjust as their career goes along will be essential because

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Speaker 2: the fact is that if they're really good at coding

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Speaker 2: and technology but not so good on the life skills,

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Speaker 2: the character and the people's skills, well they're going to

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Speaker 2: have a challenge because anything that can be automated will

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Speaker 2: be anything we can get computers to do in the future,

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Speaker 2: we will, but computers and technology is not great at

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Speaker 2: that human interface and understanding complexity and making decisions in

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Speaker 2: an era of ambiguity. And that's that decision making, that innovation,

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Speaker 2: that entrepreneurialism is what we need to equip our children

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Speaker 2: with to thrive in an unknown future.

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Speaker 4: Mike, that's a really nice link into the question that

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Speaker 4: I was going to ask, and that is if I'm

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Speaker 4: a parent raising a generation al for a child, and

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Speaker 4: I know what you've just told me. That is that

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Speaker 4: most work will be able to be done by robots,

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Speaker 4: and it's the quality of our interpersonal dynamics, our ability

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Speaker 4: to have empatheater to work with people, to lead to

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Speaker 4: be resilient. What are the kinds of things that parents

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Speaker 4: need to be focused on to give their children the

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Speaker 4: very best opportunities as they launch into adulthood in another ten, fifteen,

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Speaker 4: twenty years from now.

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Speaker 2: A lot of parents are really focused when it comes

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Speaker 2: to education on looking for an outcome that will create

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Speaker 2: a holistic development in their child. You know, I think

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Speaker 2: that's important. They don't just want the numerous in literacy,

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Speaker 2: they don't just want better and better exam results. They

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Speaker 2: want their child to develop in perhaps music or artistic areas.

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Speaker 2: They want them to develop spiritually. They want them to

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Speaker 2: develop socially and with sporting or coordination skills, and I

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Speaker 2: think that's important, that's essential, and they need to think

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Speaker 2: about that in their own raising of the children. In

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Speaker 2: other words, we want our children to really be well

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Speaker 2: developed across a broad range of areas, not just to

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Speaker 2: be digitally savvy and you know, academically focused, because you know,

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Speaker 2: the future is going to belong to those who can

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Speaker 2: be leaders, make decisions, understand complexity, adapt relate well across diversity,

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Speaker 2: which is our modern community and workplace, and that is

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Speaker 2: best developed by getting a range of experiences, going to

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Speaker 2: camps and having broader experiences, whether that be in social

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Speaker 2: context or youth development programs, being able to engage in

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Speaker 2: the outdoors, you know, not just spend all of the

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Speaker 2: time on screens and indoors. So if we can give

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Speaker 2: our children these broader experiences, that will set them up

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Speaker 2: well to holistically flourish.

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Speaker 3: Mark.

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Speaker 4: I know that there's more that we could talk about

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Speaker 4: with Generation Alpha, but I really want to pick you

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Speaker 4: up on some of the things that you've highlighted there

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Speaker 4: because of just the supreme importance of what you've highlighted

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Speaker 4: and the fact that our world seems to be moving

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Speaker 4: away from much of what you've described. We seem to

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Speaker 4: be pushing for early specialization, we seem to be focusing

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Speaker 4: our children on.

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Speaker 3: Early technical skills.

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Speaker 4: They're not getting that holistic childhood because we're so focused

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Speaker 4: on unintentionally applying pressure with the best of intentions so

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Speaker 4: that they can be successful. But it doesn't seem to

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Speaker 4: me that as parents in today's increasingly busy pressured world,

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Speaker 4: that we're getting that right. When you were doing your research,

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Speaker 4: did anything stand out to you along those lines that

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Speaker 4: you could point to that might be helpful for parents

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Speaker 4: to maybe pull back a bit where they need to

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Speaker 4: and get the balance right.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, definitely, And I think it is particularly around controlling

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Speaker 2: or at least bracketing the use of screens in their world,

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Speaker 2: because we found in this research that's seventy five percent

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Speaker 2: of the discretionary time, the after school, after chor's time

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Speaker 2: that children have is spent on screens. So if you

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Speaker 2: give your child a choice, or if you give them

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Speaker 2: free time, they're going to grab the screen. That's the

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Speaker 2: go to. It's easy, it's addictive in terms of its interaction,

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Speaker 2: and therefore, if we can constrain that somewhat it'll free

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Speaker 2: up space to do those other things so that they

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Speaker 2: can holistically develop, which is so key. Are we say

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Speaker 2: in the book, we've got lots of tips in it,

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Speaker 2: but partly at things like setting the example ourselves. A

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Speaker 2: lot of the times, you know, we stort of saying, hey,

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Speaker 2: off the screen while we're scrolling through something. If we

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Speaker 2: can put them to bed the way our grandparents did

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Speaker 2: you know a good old story and reflecting on the day,

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Speaker 2: if we can have maybe a reset, maybe we're all

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Speaker 2: just two screen addicted. Maybe we have screen free Sundays,

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Speaker 2: or maybe we have a three day break in the

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Speaker 2: holidays where there's just no screens. Maybe we use the screens,

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Speaker 2: but we have a shared screen experience. Hey, we're going

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Speaker 2: to watch a family movie night on Friday night instead

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Speaker 2: of everyone just just dissipating off to their own screen experience.

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Speaker 2: We put in the book a four letter acronym that

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Speaker 2: came through the research that might help parents DCBA, and

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Speaker 2: the D stands for delay the access to the device

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Speaker 2: or just limit the device use. Rather than give the

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Speaker 2: eight or nine or ten year old their own device,

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Speaker 2: wait until they maybe hit the teenagers. If we can.

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Speaker 2: Sure they might for their schooling need access to ours

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Speaker 2: or for a little bit of that screen time, but

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Speaker 2: at least if it's not their own, they don't have

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Speaker 2: two for seven use of it, and that's going to

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Speaker 2: delay some of the use. And then the C is

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Speaker 2: communicate the values, communicate what we're about so that they

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Speaker 2: can start to make the right decisions as to what

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Speaker 2: games or interactions they have and how they behave online.

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Speaker 2: That the B is the behavioral skills. Let's give them

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Speaker 2: some skills, some social skills so that they can self

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Speaker 2: limit and when they have the urge just to reach

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Speaker 2: for the screen, they can say, actually, I've learned to

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Speaker 2: go for a walk, or kick a soccer ball around

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Speaker 2: or something else. So behavioral skills, because their life is

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Speaker 2: going to be filled with impulses and with the opportunities

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Speaker 2: just to grab onto what makes them feel good. But

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Speaker 2: if they can develop some self restraint, that's great. And

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Speaker 2: the A stands for accountability. Ultimately, parents have to provide

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Speaker 2: a safe environment for the children. And if we can

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Speaker 2: have accountability around how much time they're spending or where

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Speaker 2: they're going, or even checking on some of the social

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Speaker 2: media or some of the screen use that's going to

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Speaker 2: be healthy for them and keep them accountable as they

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Speaker 2: make their own improved choices in life.

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Speaker 4: Wow, DCBA, that's a great idea. I've been teaching this

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Speaker 4: stuff for a long time and I haven't come across that,

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Speaker 4: but I really like that little acronym.

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Speaker 3: Thank you for that, Mike. We'll put that into the

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Speaker 3: show notes.

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Speaker 5: Marc, this has been such a great conversation. I'm wondering

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Speaker 5: what would you want the take home message of your

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Speaker 5: book to be When you think about everything that we've

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Speaker 5: talked about today, what do you want parents of Generation

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Speaker 5: Alpha to really know that.

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Speaker 2: This is such a critical generation being shaped at such

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Speaker 2: a unique time, with such incredible opportunities, the digital, the

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Speaker 2: global the education. They are the most formally educated generation ever,

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Speaker 2: the most materially endowed generation ever in our world. What

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Speaker 2: an opportunity. And we also as parents or educators, as

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Speaker 2: those in their world, have this unique window of opportunity

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Speaker 2: to shape them, because if we don't, society will, and

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Speaker 2: the screens and the devices will, and that's not necessarily

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Speaker 2: going to be in accordance with what we would want

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Speaker 2: as an outcome. So the takeaway message from the book

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Speaker 2: is source ship hearenting, don't think that the school will

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Speaker 2: educate and the screens will equip and I'm sure our

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Speaker 2: careers advisor will help them find the career pathway in life. Yes,

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Speaker 2: we're all busy. We're jugging multiple roles. You know, You've

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Speaker 2: got pure six kids and me with mine. We've got

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Speaker 2: a lot going on in our world and with our kids.

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Speaker 2: But we can't afford to let this window of shaping

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Speaker 2: and formative years fly by without us being intentional. So

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Speaker 2: I would say it is about being clear on the direction,

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Speaker 2: you know, focused on the children, building those relationships, setting

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Speaker 2: them up for a win, and ultimately that comes down

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Speaker 2: to good relationships and really good modeling of the outcomes

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Speaker 2: that we want.

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Speaker 4: Great advice, Thanks so much, Mark, thanksin that's Mark McCrindle.

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Speaker 4: He's the author of Generation Alpha Understanding Our Children and

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Speaker 4: Helping Them Thrive. He wrote it with Ashley phil and

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Speaker 4: Sam Buckerfield. Do we really hope you enjoyed that conversation?

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Speaker 4: Mark's insights are just fascinating and so well articulated.

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Speaker 3: What a great conversation.

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Speaker 4: The Happy Family PODC is produced by Justin Ruland for

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Speaker 4: Bridge Media and Craig Bruce is our executive producer. Next

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Speaker 4: week we'll be having a conversation with Kimberly Ewittz. She's

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Speaker 4: written a brand new book about separation and divorce. We

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Speaker 4: get so many questions via podcasts at happy families dot

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Speaker 4: com dot Au from parents who are going through some

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Speaker 4: real struggles with their families and in so many cases

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Speaker 4: unfortunately needing a feeling a.

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Speaker 3: Need to separate their families.

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Speaker 4: And Kimberly Ewitts is going to be talking about her

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Speaker 4: research and the things that she's learned about what gives

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Speaker 4: us the best possible outcomes in those extraordinary and very

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Speaker 4: challenging circumstances.

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Speaker 3: So please join us for that.

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Speaker 4: We hope that you've enjoyed everything that Mark has talked

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Speaker 4: about today, and if you'd like more and fo about

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Speaker 4: making your family happier, you can find it at happyfamilies

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Speaker 4: dot com dot Au.