WEBVTT - Influencer Break Ups, When Private Facebook Groups Turn Public & Suddenly 30 0:00:00.200 --> 0:00:03.160 This is Outspoken. The podcast is not afraid to say 0:00:03.360 --> 0:00:06.640 exactly what you're thinking. Our names are Amy Kate and 0:00:06.680 --> 0:00:10.520 Sophie Torba. We're identical triplets, but we often don't have 0:00:10.600 --> 0:00:15.680 identical opinions, so sometimes things can get heated. Outspoken covers 0:00:15.720 --> 0:00:20.600 all things reality TV, influencers, entertainment, and issues facing women. 0:00:21.400 --> 0:00:22.759 That is so fat. 0:00:23.320 --> 0:00:23.680 Thank you. 0:00:25.600 --> 0:00:29.160 Welcome to Outspoken Fridays Now. A post by a Stan 0:00:29.440 --> 0:00:32.760 of Anna Paul has got us thinking today because this 0:00:32.840 --> 0:00:36.519 fan shared a tattoo she had of Anna Poul in 0:00:36.600 --> 0:00:41.279 bikinis on her arm. I really wanted to know if 0:00:41.320 --> 0:00:44.199 you guys had to get a tattoo of someone in 0:00:44.240 --> 0:00:47.879 pop culture, an influencer, a celebrity, and so if you 0:00:47.880 --> 0:00:51.480 can't say your dog Archie, who would it be? Well, 0:00:51.520 --> 0:00:54.200 I do remember seeing there was a fan of Money 0:00:54.240 --> 0:00:57.440 Heist who got a big tattoo of Tokyo, one of 0:00:57.440 --> 0:01:00.520 the characters on his leg, and he met her at 0:01:00.520 --> 0:01:03.360 the Red carpet and she just was like, it's such shock. 0:01:04.000 --> 0:01:06.080 I love Money highst. I can't actually imagine getting a 0:01:06.160 --> 0:01:08.680 Money Highest tattoo, though, Well, you got to come up 0:01:08.680 --> 0:01:10.880 with something. Who would you get? Actually also reminds me 0:01:10.959 --> 0:01:13.520 of the time that Saffron Barker tricked her mum that 0:01:13.560 --> 0:01:15.640 she got her mum's face tattooed on a leg. Can 0:01:15.680 --> 0:01:19.080 we for our parents on LG No, at at all. 0:01:19.400 --> 0:01:21.760 It has to be pop culture related. I might even 0:01:21.800 --> 0:01:24.360 make it more specific. If you guys had to get 0:01:24.400 --> 0:01:28.560 an Australian influencer on your arm, who would it be? Oh? 0:01:28.560 --> 0:01:31.600 My god, can I say Bindi Shinny Grumman's dog. Oh, 0:01:32.480 --> 0:01:33.479 she's pretty iconic. 0:01:35.080 --> 0:01:35.679 I don't know. 0:01:35.800 --> 0:01:38.040 I can't think of anybody. I mean, I just I'm 0:01:38.080 --> 0:01:41.479 not a tattoo person. So the thought of having an 0:01:41.480 --> 0:01:44.400 influencer's face on my arm, I just I can't even 0:01:44.440 --> 0:01:47.720 imagine it. Can you imagine in twenty years time coming 0:01:47.720 --> 0:01:50.440 to your kids and they're like, who's that on your arm? Mum? 0:01:50.440 --> 0:01:53.000 And you're like, oh, just an influencer I used to follow. Well, 0:01:53.040 --> 0:01:55.120 you know what, this girl had some pretty cool body art, 0:01:55.200 --> 0:01:57.200 so it wasn't just I mean, if you Sophie just 0:01:57.240 --> 0:02:00.560 got one random tattoo at a peril days he slapped 0:02:00.680 --> 0:02:04.360 my arm, Kate, what about you? Is anyone you'd ever 0:02:04.400 --> 0:02:07.920 consider getting tattooed on your arm in the pop culture space? Well, look, no, 0:02:08.080 --> 0:02:10.160 I would never do it, but if I had to 0:02:10.240 --> 0:02:14.120 pick someone, I'd probably say Taylor Swift. Feel he's not 0:02:14.240 --> 0:02:16.119 an influencer, but she's in the set in the pop 0:02:16.120 --> 0:02:18.560 culture space. Okay, we're gonna put a thread in our 0:02:18.600 --> 0:02:21.760 Facebook community. We'd love to know which influencer or person 0:02:21.800 --> 0:02:24.480 in pop culture you would get tattooed on your arm. 0:02:24.880 --> 0:02:28.960 Entire Channel four News team. I'm Veronica Corningstone. 0:02:28.200 --> 0:02:29.480 And I'm Ron Burgundy. 0:02:30.200 --> 0:02:31.920 Goof yourself, san Diego. 0:02:32.200 --> 0:02:35.360 When Lilah Vocalin turned to a closed women's Facebook group 0:02:35.400 --> 0:02:38.760 to ask for advice, she never imagined her private messages 0:02:38.800 --> 0:02:41.920 would end up in the mainstream media. Lila asked group 0:02:41.960 --> 0:02:44.720 members of the Tea Time Facebook community what she should 0:02:44.720 --> 0:02:48.079 do after she realized her psychologist had liked and messaged 0:02:48.120 --> 0:02:51.280 her on dating app Hinge. Now, Amy, can you explain 0:02:51.440 --> 0:02:55.400 more so, Lilah shared screenshots of messages on Hinge from 0:02:55.400 --> 0:02:58.400 a man who she says is her psychologist. The first 0:02:58.440 --> 0:03:01.720 message from the man read hey with love heart eye emojis. 0:03:01.760 --> 0:03:05.000 He wrote, I feel like we've matched before. Leela responded, 0:03:05.040 --> 0:03:07.960 aren't you my psych to which he replied, oh that's 0:03:08.000 --> 0:03:10.440 why you look familiar. Sorry, I deal with lots of 0:03:10.440 --> 0:03:12.760 clients and it's hard to keep up. How have you 0:03:12.840 --> 0:03:15.959 been so as you can see, Instead of shutting down 0:03:16.120 --> 0:03:20.079 the conversation, it appeared her psychologists tried to keep initiating 0:03:20.120 --> 0:03:23.960 conversation between the pair on the dating app. Now, according 0:03:24.000 --> 0:03:27.640 to APPRA, which is the Australian Health Practitioner Regulation Agency, 0:03:27.880 --> 0:03:31.359 practitioners are expected to act in their patient's best interests 0:03:31.360 --> 0:03:33.640 and not use their position of power and trust to 0:03:33.720 --> 0:03:39.200 exploit patients physically, sexually, emotionally or psychologically. Now, not only 0:03:39.240 --> 0:03:42.080 does Lila say that her post in the private Facebook 0:03:42.120 --> 0:03:45.520 group was leaked to the psychologist, who has since threatened 0:03:45.560 --> 0:03:49.000 to sue her for defamation, which is just disgusting in itself, 0:03:49.320 --> 0:03:52.840 she also woke up to find that numerous online articles 0:03:53.040 --> 0:03:57.600 were written by mainstream media publications about her post. Now, 0:03:57.640 --> 0:04:01.520 according to the Facebook group's rules, this is a privacy breach. 0:04:01.800 --> 0:04:05.280 Wila also says she was never contacted for comment. Now, 0:04:05.400 --> 0:04:07.880 Wila is kindly joining us. Thank you so much for 0:04:07.920 --> 0:04:10.760 coming on the show. Firstly, we're just so sorry to 0:04:10.800 --> 0:04:12.880 hear about how all of this has blown up. How 0:04:12.960 --> 0:04:15.839 are you feeling very overwhelmed? 0:04:16.600 --> 0:04:17.120 Anxious? 0:04:17.839 --> 0:04:20.200 Kind of like everything's out of my control, but there's 0:04:20.320 --> 0:04:22.080 not really anything I can do, So I'm kind of 0:04:22.200 --> 0:04:25.200 just sitting back and seeing what happens. 0:04:25.680 --> 0:04:28.279 And how did you feel when you first realized that 0:04:28.360 --> 0:04:32.200 you had matched with your psychologist on hinge? 0:04:32.240 --> 0:04:34.440 It raised a lot of red flags for me. 0:04:35.480 --> 0:04:39.359 I didn't I don't really think that I kind of 0:04:39.400 --> 0:04:43.239 gathered what was happening initially. I just knew it was wrong, 0:04:43.560 --> 0:04:46.680 and I kind of quick Google, like is this okay? 0:04:46.880 --> 0:04:49.400 Like I know, you know, like teacher student relationships, Like 0:04:49.440 --> 0:04:50.840 that's not all right. 0:04:51.600 --> 0:04:54.000 And after you found out that you had matched with 0:04:54.120 --> 0:04:57.280 him on hinge, you then decided to post about your 0:04:57.400 --> 0:05:00.680 experience on a Facebook group called Tea Time. Can you 0:05:00.680 --> 0:05:03.200 tell us what you wrote and also why you felt 0:05:03.200 --> 0:05:05.600 compelled to share that experience on Tea Time. 0:05:06.080 --> 0:05:08.799 I don't like saying that I matched with him because 0:05:08.800 --> 0:05:10.520 I think that he was the one that kind of 0:05:10.520 --> 0:05:13.000 first instigated the compact. Like with the way that hinge 0:05:13.040 --> 0:05:15.160 works is that you can see who liked you first. 0:05:16.440 --> 0:05:18.839 And because it was under a fake name, there were 0:05:18.880 --> 0:05:21.640 two people in the photo. I didn't really realize at 0:05:21.640 --> 0:05:25.080 the time until he sent that message through. Yeah, so 0:05:25.160 --> 0:05:27.400 I posted in tea time. I was talking to my 0:05:27.480 --> 0:05:29.440 housemate about it and kind of said, like, this is 0:05:29.480 --> 0:05:31.400 just what's happened, Like what do you think? 0:05:32.040 --> 0:05:33.880 And she was like, nah, like that's not. 0:05:33.920 --> 0:05:36.680 Okay, but like can she She actually was the one 0:05:36.680 --> 0:05:38.719 who told me about tea time, and she said that 0:05:39.120 --> 0:05:41.960 there's a really good girls group. It's very supportive, like 0:05:42.120 --> 0:05:45.000 very feminist, like they're quick to call things out. Why 0:05:45.040 --> 0:05:47.359 don't you like post in there, have a like, have 0:05:47.440 --> 0:05:49.920 a look at what those girls have to say, and 0:05:49.960 --> 0:05:52.760 then yeah, make a decision from there. So yeah, I 0:05:52.800 --> 0:05:55.560 kind of I was just seeking out women's support and 0:05:55.640 --> 0:05:56.880 advice really. 0:05:57.520 --> 0:06:00.320 And that's why everyone our kind of age does, isn't it. 0:06:00.360 --> 0:06:03.080 These groups have sort of become a safe place for 0:06:03.160 --> 0:06:05.520 women to be able to share this sort of information, 0:06:05.680 --> 0:06:08.320 And it's also good to get other people's opinions maybe 0:06:08.320 --> 0:06:11.120 on what to do and how best to tackle the situation. 0:06:11.240 --> 0:06:13.599 So I definitely think if I was in a similar situation, 0:06:13.680 --> 0:06:16.000 I'd want to reach out to, you know, like minded 0:06:16.000 --> 0:06:18.200 people online and get that sort of support too. 0:06:19.120 --> 0:06:19.600 Exactly. 0:06:19.800 --> 0:06:22.440 Yep, And you raised a really good point. You said 0:06:22.440 --> 0:06:26.120 that you didn't actually match with your psychologists. Are you 0:06:26.200 --> 0:06:28.520 able to explain because there's been a bit of misinformation 0:06:28.680 --> 0:06:30.680 going on. I think a lot of people just think 0:06:30.680 --> 0:06:32.960 of Tinder when they think of dating apps, but Hinge 0:06:33.000 --> 0:06:34.600 is obviously a little bit different. 0:06:35.880 --> 0:06:36.080 Yeah. 0:06:36.120 --> 0:06:39.599 So the way that Hinge works is that there's a 0:06:39.600 --> 0:06:42.640 little icon there that you click on and you can 0:06:42.680 --> 0:06:46.680 see everybody who has like like like you, and you 0:06:46.680 --> 0:06:54.640 can actually send messages without the other person matching with you. Basically. Yeah, 0:06:54.640 --> 0:06:56.560 so I just went into that little icon. I was 0:06:56.640 --> 0:07:00.120 just mindlessly scrolling in a bit of a zombie mode, 0:07:00.240 --> 0:07:04.160 and I pressed the tick and like, because his name 0:07:04.480 --> 0:07:08.200 was a fake name, there were two people in his photo, 0:07:09.080 --> 0:07:10.600 and yes, I. 0:07:10.560 --> 0:07:11.240 Clicked on him. 0:07:12.440 --> 0:07:16.560 This was I think on Tuesday, February fifteenth, and I 0:07:16.600 --> 0:07:19.240 don't even think I saw the message until three or 0:07:19.240 --> 0:07:22.440 four days later when he did send me that message 0:07:23.760 --> 0:07:25.960 like with the hey, with the love hard eyes, haven't 0:07:25.960 --> 0:07:30.280 we matched before? Kind of insinuating that I looked familiar, 0:07:30.320 --> 0:07:33.000 which makes me think that he definitely did know who 0:07:33.040 --> 0:07:34.800 I was when he sent that. 0:07:35.680 --> 0:07:39.200 And you immediately tried to shut this conversation down. You 0:07:39.240 --> 0:07:41.480 were like, aren't you my psychologist? 0:07:42.400 --> 0:07:43.480 Exactly? Yep. 0:07:44.560 --> 0:07:47.640 It's just such a gross breach of power. I just 0:07:47.640 --> 0:07:49.760 can't believe that these sort of things going on, and 0:07:50.200 --> 0:07:52.880 I just can't imagine. Also, how you must have felt 0:07:52.960 --> 0:07:56.000 when you woke up in the morning and saw your 0:07:56.080 --> 0:07:58.640 story plastered all over mainstream media. 0:07:59.240 --> 0:08:03.480 Yeah, that was a real shock to the system, just 0:08:03.600 --> 0:08:09.360 because I had posted in a closed, private women's Facebook 0:08:09.400 --> 0:08:14.720 group just asking for advice. Turns out that journalist Matilda 0:08:14.840 --> 0:08:19.280 Rudd was in that group. She stole my story, and yeah, 0:08:19.320 --> 0:08:22.960 now it's everywhere. It was on Daily Mail, it was 0:08:23.000 --> 0:08:27.760 on these random US news sites, Channel seven news dot com. 0:08:27.800 --> 0:08:30.680 Now it's very overwhelming, but. 0:08:30.920 --> 0:08:33.520 Yeah, it must be, especially because in the group it 0:08:33.600 --> 0:08:36.880 clearly states there are rules that there is privacy for 0:08:36.960 --> 0:08:40.600 members and that journalists are not able to take information 0:08:40.760 --> 0:08:43.800 and share it. Were you ever actually contacted by the 0:08:43.880 --> 0:08:45.400 journalists who wrote the story? 0:08:46.640 --> 0:08:49.680 So there's been three journalists who have written stories now, 0:08:49.960 --> 0:08:52.520 so Matilda Rudd was the first one that was for 0:08:52.600 --> 0:08:56.880 Daily Mail. She never contacted me. I actually made an 0:08:56.920 --> 0:09:00.600 attempt to contact her when I first saw that the 0:09:00.679 --> 0:09:02.360 news article had been published. 0:09:03.000 --> 0:09:04.920 I first contacted Daily Mail. 0:09:06.280 --> 0:09:09.080 To issue a complaint asking them to take it down, 0:09:09.080 --> 0:09:13.040 but I never heard back, and then I contacted Matilda 0:09:13.120 --> 0:09:17.120 through her Instagram DMS. I sent her a very polite 0:09:17.160 --> 0:09:20.880 message just saying that I wasn't ready for this to 0:09:20.960 --> 0:09:23.200 be publicized, because you please take it down. 0:09:23.960 --> 0:09:26.280 I never heard back from her either. Part of me 0:09:26.440 --> 0:09:28.040 does want to. 0:09:28.000 --> 0:09:30.000 Have this publicized, because I do want to speak out, 0:09:30.000 --> 0:09:32.920 but I think that I also want to wait until 0:09:33.360 --> 0:09:35.760 just to see what happens with Opera and the hate 0:09:35.760 --> 0:09:39.160 Treple C and to see if I can actually publicize 0:09:39.160 --> 0:09:41.280 his name, because right now I can't say his name 0:09:41.320 --> 0:09:44.920 at all, which I think he deserves to have his 0:09:45.480 --> 0:09:46.079 name out there. 0:09:46.880 --> 0:09:49.280 I mean, definitely, I suppose that's been the issue with 0:09:49.480 --> 0:09:51.439 the reporting. I mean that Sofa and I have witnessed 0:09:51.440 --> 0:09:54.640 so far is that it's all sort of been on you, 0:09:54.760 --> 0:09:57.600 and I feel like, because you are young and you're attractive, 0:09:57.720 --> 0:10:01.200 they've chosen a lot of photos of you, taken stuff 0:10:01.240 --> 0:10:03.840 you've said out of context, and that's obviously led to 0:10:03.960 --> 0:10:06.640 a lot of commentary online as well that hasn't been 0:10:07.080 --> 0:10:10.760 so nice. How have you felt reading some of these 0:10:10.800 --> 0:10:15.040 comments from people who were almost blaming you. I mean, 0:10:15.120 --> 0:10:17.439 we personally think there's a lot of victim blaming going on. 0:10:18.360 --> 0:10:19.520 Oh one hundred percent. 0:10:20.640 --> 0:10:23.679 I've been reading the comments on The comments on the 0:10:23.760 --> 0:10:25.280 news dot com. 0:10:24.960 --> 0:10:30.400 Article on Facebook particularly bad. A lot of old men. 0:10:31.120 --> 0:10:35.280 I think I read one saying, well, she's a basket case. 0:10:35.400 --> 0:10:38.000 She sees a psychologist. He knew what he was getting 0:10:38.000 --> 0:10:41.560 into her, getting in with her, dodged a bullet. There 0:10:42.240 --> 0:10:45.960 a lot of things like that, things like well she's 0:10:46.000 --> 0:10:48.640 wearing a swimsuit, like, what does she expect? 0:10:48.880 --> 0:10:51.679 That was one of them. 0:10:51.800 --> 0:10:57.240 Yeah, just really really nasty, misogynistic victim blaming comments. 0:10:57.720 --> 0:11:00.400 Now, you did make a really great point on Instagram 0:11:00.440 --> 0:11:04.280 how when women speak out about male's predatory behavior, they're 0:11:04.320 --> 0:11:07.680 often slap with legal action. What has the fallout been 0:11:08.000 --> 0:11:09.040 from the psychologist. 0:11:09.440 --> 0:11:12.280 I haven't heard from him since he threatened me, so 0:11:13.160 --> 0:11:17.400 basically oft he must have seen the tea time post, 0:11:17.840 --> 0:11:19.440 like the initial one that I posted. 0:11:20.400 --> 0:11:23.800 It got leaked to him somehow, and he sent me. 0:11:23.760 --> 0:11:26.520 A message saying that I should expect to be hearing 0:11:26.520 --> 0:11:29.360 from his lawyer over the next week or so. In 0:11:29.400 --> 0:11:34.720 regards to defamation, that didn't really scare me much because 0:11:35.040 --> 0:11:39.760 I know there's no grounds for defamation there. But I 0:11:39.800 --> 0:11:43.520 think that it's all too common that when a man 0:11:43.720 --> 0:11:46.640 is in a position of power, not even necessarily in 0:11:46.679 --> 0:11:49.080 a position of power, just men. They just want to 0:11:49.080 --> 0:11:52.280 intimidate women, and like they throw around, throw around these 0:11:52.280 --> 0:11:55.880 words like legal action just to try and scare you 0:11:55.920 --> 0:11:59.160 pretty much and try and get you to back down 0:11:59.320 --> 0:12:00.360 and try and. 0:12:00.280 --> 0:12:02.440 Get you off their case. But like in this case, 0:12:02.480 --> 0:12:03.240 it's not going to work. 0:12:03.520 --> 0:12:06.440 I love that, and that is so true, and it's 0:12:06.520 --> 0:12:09.400 quite interesting because I feel like your story has raised 0:12:09.400 --> 0:12:12.679 a lot of questions about just how private these facebooks 0:12:12.679 --> 0:12:15.800 actually are, especially groups like Tea Time, which have so 0:12:15.840 --> 0:12:18.880 many thousands of followers. What would be your advice to 0:12:19.000 --> 0:12:21.439 people who do post on these groups in the future. 0:12:21.840 --> 0:12:24.360 I think with social media, you're always taking a risk 0:12:24.480 --> 0:12:25.800 with what you put out there. 0:12:26.080 --> 0:12:27.240 I had to look at the Tea. 0:12:27.080 --> 0:12:32.320 Time members and it is something like eighty thousand, so 0:12:33.040 --> 0:12:35.080 I didn't realize it was that big, but I guess, yeah, 0:12:35.080 --> 0:12:38.160 I was taking a risk. But it was also a 0:12:38.200 --> 0:12:42.200 closed women's Facebook group, and you know, in our day 0:12:42.240 --> 0:12:45.680 and age, there's so much like going around, like especially 0:12:45.679 --> 0:12:50.280 on social media, about like women's empowerment, women supporting one another, 0:12:51.080 --> 0:12:54.840 and yeah, to have a woman do this to. 0:12:54.720 --> 0:12:57.880 Me is it's a really gross violation. 0:12:58.640 --> 0:13:02.560 So I know, of Tea Time, you can post anonymously 0:13:02.840 --> 0:13:07.160 if you If you private message the admins, they'll post 0:13:07.440 --> 0:13:07.880 for you. 0:13:07.960 --> 0:13:09.559 So I'd say yeah. 0:13:09.400 --> 0:13:11.880 In the future, if there's any girls who think that 0:13:11.960 --> 0:13:15.079 what they what they want to post could be a 0:13:15.120 --> 0:13:18.120 bit risky, did I just posted anonymously? 0:13:18.720 --> 0:13:21.120 Well, thank you so much for joining us, and congratulations 0:13:21.160 --> 0:13:24.840 on taking a stance against this type of behavior. Because 0:13:25.200 --> 0:13:28.120 your statement that you put up on Instagram was amazing 0:13:28.120 --> 0:13:29.880 and we'll have to link it in our show notes 0:13:29.920 --> 0:13:31.800 everyone can have a read. And also the fact that 0:13:31.840 --> 0:13:33.960 you are twenty one. It blows my mind. You have 0:13:34.080 --> 0:13:37.480 just spoken so articulately and also so bravely, as Amy said, 0:13:37.559 --> 0:13:40.800 especially when this person is obviously sought out to try 0:13:40.840 --> 0:13:43.920 and silence you. So congratulations for the amazing way that 0:13:43.960 --> 0:13:45.160 you have responded to it. 0:13:45.440 --> 0:13:45.840 Thank you. 0:13:48.559 --> 0:13:51.360 This week, Brittany Hockley confirmed she has split with tennis 0:13:51.400 --> 0:13:54.960 player boyfriend Jordan Thompson. She made the tiery announcement on 0:13:55.000 --> 0:13:58.600 her Life Uncut podcast after months of rumors. The former 0:13:58.640 --> 0:14:02.600 Bachelor star explained our constant speculation had strained her relationship 0:14:02.720 --> 0:14:05.480 as the pair tried to make a decision about the future, 0:14:06.080 --> 0:14:08.600 and it was really hard not to feel extremely sorry 0:14:08.640 --> 0:14:11.079 for Britt. As she shared the update, she spoke about 0:14:11.080 --> 0:14:13.520 how she couldn't get out of bed and couldn't stop crying, 0:14:13.640 --> 0:14:16.880 all while dealing with the media and fans demanding an update. 0:14:17.520 --> 0:14:20.960 So BRIT's situation got me thinking about how much privacy 0:14:21.040 --> 0:14:23.960 influences and public figures should be afforded when it comes 0:14:23.960 --> 0:14:26.680 to breakups. Do we have the right to know exactly 0:14:26.760 --> 0:14:28.920 when it happens? Shall we get to know the ins 0:14:28.960 --> 0:14:31.440 and outs and the reason for the breakup? And why 0:14:31.480 --> 0:14:33.800 do we think we deserve to know? What do you 0:14:33.800 --> 0:14:37.040 guys think? Well, I've previously discussed on the podcast how 0:14:37.040 --> 0:14:40.320 I do think influencers who monetize their relationships on the 0:14:40.360 --> 0:14:45.240 platform are somewhat indebted to sharing relationship updates. However, BRIT's 0:14:45.280 --> 0:14:48.040 reaction has really made me see another side to it, 0:14:48.120 --> 0:14:49.840 and it kind of makes me reflect on my own 0:14:49.960 --> 0:14:53.880 breakup experiences and I can't imagine how difficult it would be, 0:14:54.200 --> 0:14:56.480 particularly when a lot of the time when you do 0:14:56.560 --> 0:14:58.760 break up with someone, there is that period where you 0:14:58.840 --> 0:15:01.880 get back together. I feel like when an influencer is 0:15:01.960 --> 0:15:04.760 going through that phase of on and off again relationship, 0:15:05.160 --> 0:15:08.000 it's really hard to then inform everyone's what's happening, because 0:15:08.040 --> 0:15:10.360 most of the time you don't really know what's going 0:15:10.440 --> 0:15:15.200 on in your relationship yourself, particularly in their situation where 0:15:15.320 --> 0:15:17.720 it sounds like it was pretty amicable and the only 0:15:17.800 --> 0:15:20.320 reason they really were breaking up was because of the 0:15:20.320 --> 0:15:23.160 long distance nature of their relationship. And I feel like 0:15:23.200 --> 0:15:25.960 brit was quite quick to point out that they're breaking 0:15:26.040 --> 0:15:27.760 up for now, but you never know what is going 0:15:27.800 --> 0:15:30.200 to happen in the future. And personally, I would find 0:15:30.240 --> 0:15:32.920 that really difficult to then jump on a mic and 0:15:33.040 --> 0:15:36.280 dissect that relationship, because, as she said, it would almost 0:15:36.320 --> 0:15:39.800 be easier if you hated that person. I know, when 0:15:39.800 --> 0:15:42.640 I was going through a breakup, I had that little 0:15:42.680 --> 0:15:45.160 glimmer of hope that maybe we were going to get 0:15:45.200 --> 0:15:48.160 back together. And on a lesser scale, it's kind of 0:15:48.200 --> 0:15:50.440 like when you have a bitch to your friends about 0:15:50.840 --> 0:15:53.760 your ex boyfriend and what a dickhead they've been, and 0:15:53.800 --> 0:15:56.040 then suddenly you think it's back on again, and you've 0:15:56.120 --> 0:15:58.040 kind of got to, you know, come crawling back to 0:15:58.080 --> 0:16:02.360 everyone saying how wonderful they are trying to win people over. Gosh. 0:16:02.440 --> 0:16:05.640 I have been there so many times in my first relationship, 0:16:05.640 --> 0:16:08.400 because my first relationship was very toxic. It was very 0:16:08.440 --> 0:16:11.360 off and on, and I remember feeling so embarrassed when 0:16:11.400 --> 0:16:13.720 I have to tell you guys or Mum or any 0:16:13.720 --> 0:16:16.560 of my friends that, hey, actually I've accepted that behavior 0:16:16.600 --> 0:16:18.360 and taken him back. And I'm not saying that is 0:16:18.400 --> 0:16:20.600 at all what's going on with Britt and Jordan. But 0:16:21.160 --> 0:16:23.640 you know, when you reflect back on your relationships and 0:16:23.720 --> 0:16:26.200 the terminals that you've gone through, it's hard not to 0:16:26.200 --> 0:16:28.160 feel sorry for someone in the public eye that then 0:16:28.240 --> 0:16:32.200 has to communicate outwardly to followers and media about their 0:16:32.240 --> 0:16:36.160 relationship and what's happened in those everyday situations. It's really 0:16:36.200 --> 0:16:39.400 awkward for the friend as well who has had the 0:16:39.440 --> 0:16:42.280 person bitch to them, because half the time you end 0:16:42.360 --> 0:16:44.480 up putting your foot in it, agreeing with your friend 0:16:44.520 --> 0:16:47.200 who's been dumbed, And then when that person comes back 0:16:47.240 --> 0:16:49.720 in the picture, it's always very awkward, yeah, because you 0:16:49.800 --> 0:16:52.280 almost need to hold your tongue the first time someone 0:16:52.320 --> 0:16:55.640 says they've broken up with somebody because you say what 0:16:55.680 --> 0:16:57.800 you honestly thought of them, and then next week they're 0:16:57.840 --> 0:17:00.640 back together, but just circling back to Brits so her 0:17:00.720 --> 0:17:03.960 announcing the split to all of the life uncut followers. 0:17:04.000 --> 0:17:06.719 That is the final nail in the coffin of this relationship. 0:17:06.720 --> 0:17:08.520 And as you said, she might have held hope that 0:17:08.560 --> 0:17:11.080 maybe she and Jordan would get back together. Well, it 0:17:11.080 --> 0:17:13.720 seems like that two weeks over Samma was very much 0:17:13.840 --> 0:17:16.240 them seeing what it would be like and maybe having 0:17:16.320 --> 0:17:20.040 those difficult conversations about where is this going. And it 0:17:20.080 --> 0:17:23.400 would be really difficult to have those conversations when there 0:17:23.440 --> 0:17:26.720 is a lot of speculation going on about it online. 0:17:26.760 --> 0:17:29.400 In terms of followers feeling like they deserve to know 0:17:29.520 --> 0:17:32.560 the ins and outs of influencers breakups, I really feel 0:17:32.560 --> 0:17:35.679 like it comes down to parasocial relationships that we build 0:17:35.720 --> 0:17:38.320 with influencers online, And for those who don't know, a 0:17:38.359 --> 0:17:43.359 parasocial relationship is essentially a one way relationship with an influencer, celebrity, 0:17:43.480 --> 0:17:46.720 or brand that feels like a two way relationship. So 0:17:46.720 --> 0:17:51.280 social media has really increased these parasocial relationships we have 0:17:51.359 --> 0:17:54.600 because it provides an intimate and personal look into someone's 0:17:54.640 --> 0:17:56.800 life and it gives us a feeling that we know 0:17:56.920 --> 0:17:59.359 them when we really don't. So I think that we 0:17:59.440 --> 0:18:01.600 believe we're in titled to know what's going on with 0:18:01.680 --> 0:18:05.160 these influencer relationships because we feel like we've gone through 0:18:05.200 --> 0:18:08.800 the experience with the influencer. And I think another aspect 0:18:08.800 --> 0:18:13.040 comes down to Instagram's algorithm, because the platform really rewards 0:18:13.160 --> 0:18:17.040 users for going big with their posts and sometimes monetizing them. So, 0:18:17.160 --> 0:18:20.320 for example, you'll notice that announcements around big life events 0:18:20.400 --> 0:18:24.879 like engagements and pregnancies often garner the most likes for influencers, 0:18:25.040 --> 0:18:27.359 and it's also the case for normal people as well. 0:18:27.720 --> 0:18:31.200 And this then results in influencers curating their feed only 0:18:31.240 --> 0:18:33.800 to show the highlights, and they end up presenting the 0:18:33.840 --> 0:18:37.040 best possible view without the whole story. And this all 0:18:37.080 --> 0:18:40.160 has a trickle down effect to normal Instagram users as well, 0:18:40.480 --> 0:18:43.120 And I feel like due to this highlight sharing, Instagram 0:18:43.119 --> 0:18:45.719 has become a place where people go and see content 0:18:45.760 --> 0:18:49.280 that makes them sometimes feel inadequate or jealous about their 0:18:49.280 --> 0:18:53.000 own lives. And inadequacy is often felt about people's own 0:18:53.040 --> 0:18:55.480 relationships when they compare them to everyday life to the 0:18:55.560 --> 0:18:59.080 highlight reel of influencers. So when influencers do break up 0:18:59.119 --> 0:19:01.280 with their partners, it kind of feels like a car 0:19:01.320 --> 0:19:04.320 crash scenario where you know you should look away, but 0:19:04.400 --> 0:19:07.480 you just can't because you're so curious about what's happened 0:19:07.720 --> 0:19:10.800 and how this perfect relationship failed. I think the other 0:19:10.880 --> 0:19:14.320 thing is just human nature. When you do start dating 0:19:14.400 --> 0:19:17.680 someone and it's the honeymoon stage, you do post more 0:19:17.720 --> 0:19:20.600 about that person because you're really excited to let everyone 0:19:20.600 --> 0:19:22.680 know that you're in a new relationship. And I think 0:19:22.920 --> 0:19:26.280 that's obviously the case for everyday people and influencers, and 0:19:26.359 --> 0:19:30.480 unfortunately for influencers, because we are so interested in their 0:19:30.520 --> 0:19:33.480 lives and comparing how they are to theirs. I think 0:19:33.480 --> 0:19:36.560 a lot of followers pick up when things start to 0:19:36.640 --> 0:19:39.480 slow down. So suddenly, when we don't see that relationship 0:19:39.520 --> 0:19:42.439 online anymore, a bit like with Britt and Jordan, we 0:19:42.560 --> 0:19:45.360 begin to speculate why, and it just kind of builds 0:19:45.720 --> 0:19:49.159 that anticipation and that appetite to know what happened, and 0:19:49.400 --> 0:19:51.359 you know, we also think that there must be way 0:19:51.440 --> 0:19:54.640 more to it than they're so invested. You're so invested 0:19:54.680 --> 0:19:58.159 sometimes in these people you don't know'se relationships than in 0:19:58.200 --> 0:20:01.359 your friends relationships. It's so it's true, so strange, and 0:20:01.400 --> 0:20:04.960 I do feel like some people actually use influencers pitfalls 0:20:05.000 --> 0:20:07.560 as a way to keep their behavior in check as well. 0:20:07.840 --> 0:20:10.399 So if the influencer does something in their relationship that 0:20:10.400 --> 0:20:13.280 doesn't align with your values. When they do break up, 0:20:13.320 --> 0:20:15.680 you kind of see that as a win to yourself, like, oh, well, 0:20:15.720 --> 0:20:18.520 I wouldn't have done that, so that means I'm correct 0:20:18.600 --> 0:20:22.280 in my behavior and how I navigate relationships. I also 0:20:22.400 --> 0:20:24.639 think it must be quite difficult for people in the 0:20:24.680 --> 0:20:29.080 public eye to openly speak about relationship breakdowns when they 0:20:29.119 --> 0:20:32.159