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Speaker 1: As I said, the Treasurer, Evil Laula is going to

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Speaker 1: be in the hot seat today at budget estimates, after

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Speaker 1: what was an interesting day for the Deputy Chief Minister

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Speaker 1: Nicole Madison yesterday. And I'll get to that in a moment.

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Speaker 1: But joining me on the line right now is the

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Speaker 1: opposition leader Leah Finocchiaro. Good morning to you, Leah.

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Speaker 2: Good morning Katie and to your listeners.

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Speaker 1: Now, Leah, I understand that there has been some questions

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Speaker 1: asked this morning about the payout made to the former

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Speaker 1: Northern Territory Police Commissioner Jamie Chalker.

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Speaker 2: Yes, I've been in estimates this morning, grilling the Treasurer

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Speaker 2: and of course asked where that money for the payout

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Speaker 2: has come from, and astonishingly it has come from the

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Speaker 2: police bottom line. That means the police budget has suffered.

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Speaker 2: Whatever this mysterious figure is of mister Chalker's payout, that's

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Speaker 2: come directly from a police budget which already under pressure

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Speaker 2: under resol So why.

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Speaker 1: Why has the Northern Territory Police, Fire and Emergency Services

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Speaker 1: budget had to take had to take that hit.

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Speaker 2: Had to take that hit. That's a great question and

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Speaker 2: it's exactly what I asked, because people will be very

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Speaker 2: angry to find out that this bungle, which is all

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Speaker 2: the making of Natasha Farles, has not only cost taxpayers,

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Speaker 2: however much it might be, but that that's come from

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Speaker 2: the police resource budget. Now I asked why Treasury hadn't

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Speaker 2: paid for that, why a top up hadn't been provided

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Speaker 2: to our police to supplement that figure that they've had

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Speaker 2: to pay, and the Treasurer tried to brush it off

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Speaker 2: as some sort of HR issue and that this is

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Speaker 2: all very very normal practice across government. But I think

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Speaker 2: territories will be horrified to hear, you know, about this

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Speaker 2: coming from that bottom line, particularly off the back of

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Speaker 2: the budget, not really providing any more money to our police,

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Speaker 2: who we know are under resource, overworked of finding a

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Speaker 2: tremendous crime crisis that keeps escalating in its severity. And

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Speaker 2: yet once again our police have asked to do more

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Speaker 2: with less.

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Speaker 1: So they let me just get to the bottom of this.

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Speaker 1: So you've asked the Treasurer where that money has come from.

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Speaker 1: She's confirmed that it's come from the budget of the

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Speaker 1: Police Foreign emergency services. Now do we know how much?

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Speaker 2: No, we don't know how much. I asked on several

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Speaker 2: occasions and she said she didn't know the amount. She

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Speaker 2: directed me to ask the question of the Public Employment

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Speaker 2: Commissioner or the Police Commissioner, which of course we will

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Speaker 2: I'm sorry, not police commissioner, the Police Minister, which of

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Speaker 2: course we will over the course of the next two weeks.

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Speaker 2: But I was astonished to see that police had to

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Speaker 2: suffer that blow, particularly at a time out.

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Speaker 1: Well, this is the thing. There's a lot of reasons

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Speaker 1: why that is quite surprising to me. I mean, for one,

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Speaker 1: I will say that I think that our Northern Territory

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Speaker 1: Police could certainly use additional resources. I don't know how

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Speaker 1: much money they've got there that is in the bank,

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Speaker 1: ready to to be paid out to former commissioners as required.

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Speaker 1: But the other part of this is we've also got

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Speaker 1: because correct me if I'm wrong, my understanding is that

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Speaker 1: we've got a bucket of money that is for the

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Speaker 1: Northern Territory Police, Fire and emergency services. You've also got

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Speaker 1: a situation where you've got fieries right now who are

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Speaker 1: still struggling over their pay dispute.

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Speaker 2: That's exactly right, Katie. And we know that there are

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Speaker 2: not enough fieries across the territory. Tenant Creek at the

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Speaker 2: moment is being filled with people on a rotating roster

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Speaker 2: from Taiwan. There are no full time fieries based in

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Speaker 2: Tenant Creek and that situation is replicated right across the territory.

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Speaker 2: I think we've all seen the fire trucks driving around

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Speaker 2: expressing their grave distaste for the government and their inability

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Speaker 2: to get to the bottom of this pay deal off

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Speaker 2: the back of course of the absurd public servants pay

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Speaker 2: frees and all the other rubbish we've seen over the

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Speaker 2: last couple of years. So this is emergency services in crisis.

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Speaker 2: Of course, as you know, Katie, we have tried seven

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Speaker 2: times in Parliament to have an inquiry into this issue,

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Speaker 2: which the government have shot down. But this is just

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Speaker 2: another blow for our police, another example of labor turning

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Speaker 2: their back on the front line and not supporting our

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Speaker 2: men and women in blue pop well every day.

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Speaker 1: I really hope, I really hope that we're able to

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Speaker 1: get to the bottom of how much money we are

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Speaker 1: talking about here. I think that you know that our

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Speaker 1: rank and file officers, our fieries, our emergency services, all

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Speaker 1: Territorians really have a right to know how taxpayers dollars

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Speaker 1: are being spent lea. I do want to ask you

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Speaker 1: any questions asked this morning from you about the damage

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Speaker 1: to Howard Springs and how much that's cost.

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Speaker 2: Indeed, and again the Treasurer said she would not answer

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Speaker 2: that this morning, she would answer it later today when

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Speaker 2: we get to the infrastructure section of the budget. So

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Speaker 2: that was disappointing. I again asked us who would be

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Speaker 2: taking the blow for that cost, and that will be

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Speaker 2: the infrastructure budget and she tried to pass it off

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Speaker 2: as saying, oh, well, departments have to have a bit

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Speaker 2: of money spare for incidentals and things that you couldn't predict.

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Speaker 2: But I don't think the infrastructure budget would have predicted

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Speaker 2: the multimillion dollar cost at Howard Springs is inevitably going

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Speaker 2: to cost the taxpayer. And that means that that money

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Speaker 2: isn't going into roads or upgrading infrastructure in our schools

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Speaker 2: and all the other priorities that Territorians would have preferred

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Speaker 2: it to go to. So yet again another department being

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Speaker 2: dished out the blow of government failure, and it's just

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Speaker 2: going to mean less services for Territorians on the ground,

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Speaker 2: and of course this is their money. And I went

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Speaker 2: very hard on that. I said Treasurer. This is not

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Speaker 2: your money, Treasury, This is not your money. It's not

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Speaker 2: my money. Our territorians go to work every single day,

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Speaker 2: to work hard. They pay their dues through tax and

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Speaker 2: expect services in exchange for that tax. And you know,

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Speaker 2: this is just another example of tax dollars being wasted

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Speaker 2: at a time when Territorians are struggling to get food

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Speaker 2: on the table the cost of living.

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Speaker 1: Well, Leah, we've got a comment here, I guess from

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Speaker 1: Grumpy and Catherine. He'd said, good morning, Katie. I wonder

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Speaker 1: if Evil Lula is going to be quizzed about the

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Speaker 1: cost for the internal repairs at the Howard Springs facility.

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Speaker 1: It might be another question for Lea Finocchiaro to ask.

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Speaker 1: And Leah, you've already asked that question, and you're going

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Speaker 1: to ask it again by the sounds of things, later

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Speaker 1: on today. Please stay to Yeah, please do keep us

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Speaker 1: up to date and let us know whether any of

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Speaker 1: that detail is actually provided, because I think it's imperative

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Speaker 1: that territorians actually do get that level of detail. As

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Speaker 1: I said earlier, and we're talking about, you know, about

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Speaker 1: the payout to the former Northern Territory Police Commissioner, it

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Speaker 1: is taxpayers dollars and I think that we've all got

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Speaker 1: the right to know exactly how much money is being

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Speaker 1: spent and in different areas, and also that is the

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Speaker 1: whole purpose of the process of budget estimates. Leah, I

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Speaker 1: do want to ask you. I know that yesterday during

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Speaker 1: question time the Deputy Chief Minister, or sorry not question time,

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Speaker 1: we could almost call it that during questions during estimates. Well,

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Speaker 1: questioning did reveal that the Deputy Chief Minister, Nicole Madison

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Speaker 1: said that crime is not the biggest concern among travelers

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Speaker 1: choosing not to come to the Northern Territory. So Nicole

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Speaker 1: Madison said cost of living and other outside pressures such

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Speaker 1: as airline connectivity and a trend towards traveling overseas again

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Speaker 1: were leading to a downturn in some markets. Leah, what

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Speaker 1: do you think do you think that the crime crisis

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Speaker 1: is having an impact on tourism or is cost of

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Speaker 1: living more significant?

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Speaker 2: I think this government is so hypocritical. We've got tread

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Speaker 2: that the Deputy Chief Minister saying that she had boken

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Speaker 2: to people in Alice Springs who are having a bumper

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Speaker 2: season but couldn't name us. Sing I was in Alice

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Speaker 2: Springs last week speaking to Tourism Central Australia and I

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Speaker 2: can assure you people are down compared to any other

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Speaker 2: year and that crime is having a major impact. Now

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Speaker 2: for the Deputy Chief Minister to turn around yesterday and

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Speaker 2: blame the downturn in visitation on cost of living, yet

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Speaker 2: in the same breath have done nothing to advance our

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Speaker 2: cause in getting cheaper flights in and out of the

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Speaker 2: territory just shows that this government is completely out of touch,

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Speaker 2: out of ideas, and they've dropped the ball. They are

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Speaker 2: not fighting for cheaper flights, they are not fighting to

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Speaker 2: bring down those costs so that people can come to

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Speaker 2: the territory. They've got a complete hands off approach. And

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Speaker 2: yet this is the number one thing when you talk

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Speaker 2: to people in Darwin and Catherine Tenant, Alice, wherever, people

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Speaker 2: are talking about the cost of flights. I was door

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Speaker 2: knocking in Alice Springs a couple of weeks ahow and

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Speaker 2: a lady said she'd be leaving because she couldn't afford

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Speaker 2: to spend the same amount on and it was like

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Speaker 2: the cost of flying back to her family in Sydney

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Speaker 2: was the same as traveling to Europe, and she said

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Speaker 2: that is just ridiculous, and yet our Minister for Tourism

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Speaker 2: had no answers on that what she was doing to

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Speaker 2: pressure airlines to increase competition.

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Speaker 1: I mean it comes down to though, doesn't it Like

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Speaker 1: it comes down to demand. It's one thing for the

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Speaker 1: minister to be fighting for, you know, for additional flights,

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Speaker 1: but if we don't have the demand there, I mean,

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Speaker 1: how can you expect an airline to make a commercial

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Speaker 1: decision to put on additional flights to the territory.

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Speaker 2: Well, we need to create the demand by making sure

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Speaker 2: the territory is safe. But let's not forget the aide

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Speaker 2: Triple C put out a report just a week or

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Speaker 2: two ago saying that the price of jet fuel had

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Speaker 2: decreased and that airlines weren't passing on those savings. And

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Speaker 2: this is where being an active, proactive, you know, fighter

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Speaker 2: of a minister is so important. Unfortunately in the territory

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Speaker 2: we just don't have that. There's no one championing or

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Speaker 2: putting pressure on airlines to say, on a second, we

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Speaker 2: need a good deal. We're disadvantaged in the regions, we

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Speaker 2: live far away from everything, and ultimately that's their job

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Speaker 2: to go in and fight tooth and nail every single day.

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Speaker 2: And what we saw yesterday was a tourism minister who

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Speaker 2: doesn't have any fight in her and I think that's

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Speaker 2: at a huge detriment to our economy. And of course

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Speaker 2: you know this time of year is where our tourism

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Speaker 2: ministry make their money for the rest of the year

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Speaker 2: so they can get through to the next season, Katie,

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Speaker 2: and if they can't, I'm so terrified to think of

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Speaker 2: the jobs and businesses we will lose over this coming

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Speaker 2: web thas Lia.

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Speaker 1: Just on that, just on the flights, because again, like

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Speaker 1: you've touched on, it's something that's being raised with you

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Speaker 1: when you're out on the doors. It's something that gets

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Speaker 1: raised with us very often. It's something that I myself.

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Speaker 1: You know, you go to book flights and you think, goodness, me,

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Speaker 1: I can't go and visit my family because it is

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Speaker 1: so incredibly expensive. But what would you do differently, How

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Speaker 1: would you do things differently if you were in power

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Speaker 1: to try to reduce these costs and try to enable

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Speaker 1: Territorians to be able to fly and see their families.

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Speaker 2: You've got to increase competition. So firstly, we need to

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Speaker 2: tackle crime and rebuild our reputation so we can get

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Speaker 2: our economy moving. If we tackle crime, more people will

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Speaker 2: want to come and that deals with demand. Then in

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Speaker 2: terms of getting more airlines to the territory, we have

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Speaker 2: to be in their faith every single day, fighting the

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Speaker 2: good fight, putting the case forward, finding out what's stopping

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Speaker 2: them at their end, and working out if there is

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Speaker 2: something government can do to facilitate a better outcome for

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Speaker 2: its people. And whether it's working with our airport corporations,

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Speaker 2: whether it's incentives, whether it's marketing strategies, all of these

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Speaker 2: things are options. But if you have a government sitting

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Speaker 2: back and hoping that things are magically going to happen,

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Speaker 2: they won't. And time has shown that laziness on behalf

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Speaker 2: on the part of labor government ministers is not leading

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Speaker 2: to better outcome for Territorians. I'm gobsmack that this minister

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Speaker 2: has not been on the phone to the PM, the

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Speaker 2: National Tourism Minister, fighting for better airline access, better prices

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Speaker 2: in the regions and in the Bush. It is a

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Speaker 2: number one issue people are talking about outside crime is

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Speaker 2: cost of living and the dire impact of having connectivity

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Speaker 2: to family means a lot of people are making the

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Speaker 2: decision to lead because if they can't see friends and family,

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Speaker 2: then they feel too isolated to live here. And that's

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Speaker 2: not okay, Lea.

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Speaker 1: Just moving on, We are going to have to get

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Speaker 1: ready to wrap up. But what else is going to

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Speaker 1: be on the agenda for you for the COLP today

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Speaker 1: when it comes to estimates and the questioning of evil

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Speaker 1: Aula who has indeed got the portfolios of Treasury as

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Speaker 1: well as Transport, Infrastructure Logistics, a number of other portfolios

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Speaker 1: like education as well.

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Speaker 2: That's right, so Howard Springs would definitely be on the list.

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Speaker 2: Of course, a failure to deliver any major projects over

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Speaker 2: the last six years, the fact that we've got reports

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Speaker 2: like Deloitte and Concept and the ABS saying our economy

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Speaker 2: is one of the worst, if not the worst performing

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Speaker 2: in the nation. The fact that we have a ten

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Speaker 2: billion dollar debt. Of course, education, the crisis around school

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Speaker 2: counselors and support for our teachers, teachers being abused at school.

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Speaker 2: All of those types of things we're going to forensically

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Speaker 2: go through over the whole course of today. But already

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Speaker 2: one day in, I mean it was shocking yesterday under

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Speaker 2: the Mining Minister we unveiled that it takes three to

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Speaker 2: five years for this government to approve a mining exploration

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Speaker 2: license when it only takes two hundred and eighty six

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Speaker 2: days in WA and last year there were twenty one

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Speaker 2: minds seeking approval and this year do you know how

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Speaker 2: many are still seeking approval?

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Speaker 1: Cadi? How many?

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Speaker 2: Twenty one? Yeah? Right, So in our whole twelve months,

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Speaker 2: not a single mind has been approved. This government has

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Speaker 2: totally dropped the ball, lost its fight and has no

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Speaker 2: idea how to get the territory moving again.

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Speaker 1: Lea, we are going to have to wrap up. I

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Speaker 1: know you've got to get back in there and continue

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Speaker 1: asking those questions. Do you think that we're going to

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Speaker 1: get an answer when it comes to how much was

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Speaker 1: paid out to the former police commissioner.

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Speaker 2: I don't think so. I think this government will stop

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Speaker 2: at nothing to continue to keep that a secret. But

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Speaker 2: what I know is if the police are having to

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Speaker 2: pay for a stuff up of Natasha files, that this

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Speaker 2: government has completely dropped the ball on what is important

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Speaker 2: to the community, where its priority should be. And I

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Speaker 2: think territori and would judge them extremely harshly for this disaster.

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Speaker 1: Well, Lea Fanocchiaro, the opposition leader really appreciate you stepping

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Speaker 1: out of estimates this morning to speak with us. Thanks

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Speaker 1: so much for your time.

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Speaker 2: No worries, take care everyone.

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Speaker 1: Thank you,