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Speaker 1: My name is Lily Madden and I'm a proud Arunda

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Speaker 1: bunge Lung Chalcotin woman from Gadigl Country. The Daily oz

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Speaker 1: acknowledges that this podcast is recorded on the lands of

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Speaker 1: the Gadighl people and pays respect to all Aboriginal and

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Speaker 1: Torres Strait Island and nations. We pay our respects to

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Speaker 1: the first peoples of these countries, both past and present.

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Speaker 2: Good morning and welcome to the Daily os I'm Zara

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Speaker 2: and over the next two weeks we're going to be

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Speaker 2: bringing you a bonus series featuring our favorite deep dives

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Speaker 2: from twenty twenty three. We've put together the best deep

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Speaker 2: dives to listen to on the beach, road, tripping when

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Speaker 2: you don't want to speak to the person next to you,

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Speaker 2: or just reflecting on the year that was. Welcome to

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Speaker 2: tda's summer series. If you turn on the radio or

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Speaker 2: look at what's trending in the music world, chances are

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Speaker 2: you're going to hear music by global superstars like Harry Styles,

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Speaker 2: Beyonce or Ed Sheeran. But what about Ossie artists. Why

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Speaker 2: are they not being recognized on things like Australian music

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Speaker 2: charts and what impact has TikTok had on all of

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Speaker 2: this Well, I was curious about the answers to these questions,

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Speaker 2: so I put it to Annabel Heard. She's the CEO

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Speaker 2: of ARIA, which is the Australian Recording Industry Association. You

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Speaker 2: might know of ARIA because of its annual awards night,

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Speaker 2: but on every other day of the year it acts

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Speaker 2: as an advocate for the music industry here in Australia.

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Speaker 2: Here is my chat with Annabel Annabell, thanks for joining

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Speaker 2: us on the Daily Ohs. Before I jumped onto this call,

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Speaker 2: I was looking up the ARIA Top fifty Singles chart

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Speaker 2: and found that this week it includes two Ossie songs,

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Speaker 2: one of which is actually a song from twenty thirteen.

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Speaker 2: Is this a one off or is it becoming a

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Speaker 2: trend that we're seeing fewer and fewer Aussie songs on

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Speaker 2: an Aussie chart?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean it's certainly a bit of an alarming situation.

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Speaker 3: At the moment. The charts this year have not been

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Speaker 3: great for Australian artists. There's no denying that. You know.

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Speaker 3: There's a range of reasons why we think that is happening,

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Speaker 3: and one of them is that there is so much

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Speaker 3: listening to catalog and older music at the moment. So

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Speaker 3: you know, the resurgence of a song from twenty thirteen

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Speaker 3: is not unusual at the moment.

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Speaker 2: Is that big au of TikTok it's TikTok sometimes, or.

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Speaker 3: It's a big TV show or a big ad or something.

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Speaker 3: Those one off events are really driving streaming and listening

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Speaker 3: and that's what's pushing this older music back into the charts.

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Speaker 2: And so why then are we not seeing Ozzie songs there,

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Speaker 2: even older Auzzi songs. What's the reason behind that?

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Speaker 3: We are now competing with so much music? You know,

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Speaker 3: the stat is that one hundred thousand songs are added

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Speaker 3: to Spotify every day. Now, I'm sure a lot of

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Speaker 3: those are not tracks that many people are going to

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Speaker 3: be listening to. But even if it's ten thousand that

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Speaker 3: are competitives, how to earth do Australian tracks stand out

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Speaker 3: in that crowd? People are telling me that eighty percent

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Speaker 3: of new music discoveries of old music, So in other words,

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Speaker 3: kids who are discovering new music, eighty percent of that

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Speaker 3: is actually catalog music and only twenty percent is new.

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Speaker 3: And in that it's the latest tell us with Harry Beyonce,

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Speaker 3: you know, so how do we find our audience when

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Speaker 3: we're competing against that much music. I think COVID has

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Speaker 3: had a bit of a delayed impact on recorded music

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Speaker 3: and streaming for as the artists, because we basically had

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Speaker 3: two nearly three years of no even domestic touring. Like

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Speaker 3: most countries, you were still able to tour testically, but

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Speaker 3: here are borders were closed, so there was no touring,

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Speaker 3: no promo and those are so such important opportunities and

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Speaker 3: platforms for artis to connect with new audiences and it

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Speaker 3: just didn't happen. Yeah, it's a bit of a worry.

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Speaker 2: It is a worry, and it's also a huge shame

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Speaker 2: and we have so much home grown talent that just

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Speaker 2: aren't you know, getting their moment in the spotlight. Another

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Speaker 2: issue we hear a lot about is this perpetual underfunding

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Speaker 2: of the arts. And of course we had the federal

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Speaker 2: budget handed down last week and there was money allocated

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Speaker 2: to ME Music Australia, which I saw that ARIA welcomed.

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Speaker 2: We have also had the Federal Arts Policy that was

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Speaker 2: announced earlier this year. How do you think that investment

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Speaker 2: in the arts is tracking? Do you see that as

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Speaker 2: part of the problem or part of the solution. What

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Speaker 2: do you feel about it?

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Speaker 3: Look, I like the screen industry in this country, music

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Speaker 3: has never really asked for much funding. You know, it's

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Speaker 3: been pretty successful business. We've done really well locally, we've

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Speaker 3: done really well overseas, but things have changed. It's as

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Speaker 3: much about looking for funding investment as it is for

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Speaker 3: just like a body within government whose job is to

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Speaker 3: put a plan together to get this industry back to

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Speaker 3: the level of commercial success that it has been out

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Speaker 3: in the past. We advocated very heavily over a couple

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Speaker 3: of years with our industry colleagues to create music Australia.

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Speaker 3: But as soon as that body comes together, it has

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Speaker 3: to get in the room, get the best heads together

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Speaker 3: and just say what are we going to do about

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Speaker 3: this crisis of Australian listening that we have at the moment.

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Speaker 3: Where are we going to invest? Because I don't think

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Speaker 3: there are obvious answers. There's no one thing that's going

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Speaker 3: to fix the issue. It's complex. So there's you know,

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Speaker 3: touring promoters, artists, managers, recorded side. We need to get

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Speaker 3: in a room and say, Okay, what is happening and

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Speaker 3: how do we address it?

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Speaker 2: I mean, it sounds like there's a lot to address

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Speaker 2: and there could be a lot of different answers, as

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Speaker 2: you've said, and many minds have to come together for that.

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Speaker 2: But in your eyes, what do you think the priority

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Speaker 2: here is? Like, what is step one here?

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Speaker 3: I think step one is looking at opportunities for our artists,

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Speaker 3: both locally and overseas. You know, the cost of everything

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Speaker 3: at the moment is having a huge impact on our

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Speaker 3: disability to get overseas and fight audiences there. And we

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Speaker 3: know that if you have success overseas, it often means

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Speaker 3: that you're going to have success locally. And we've got

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Speaker 3: some huge artists having big success overseas like flum Roofers

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Speaker 3: DMAs have been in the UK charts recently, So supporting

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Speaker 3: that export, given air faares and given the cost of

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Speaker 3: touring at the moment, is a really big number one priority.

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Speaker 3: And then I think it's about what do we do

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Speaker 3: about discoverability? Where are people listening to music right now?

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Speaker 3: Where are they finding music right now? And how do

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Speaker 3: we support that? And then I do think, you know,

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Speaker 3: there's an element of the touring. Are we doing everything

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Speaker 3: we can to make sure that touring is vital? It

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Speaker 3: is definitely working really well, at a certain level, so

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Speaker 3: people are buying tickets for big events for huge artists,

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Speaker 3: but there's a level where people I think is still

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Speaker 3: a little bit nervous. Ticket buying is really late, which

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Speaker 3: is very difficult for promoters.

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Speaker 2: You mentioned their discoverability, and of course the first thing

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Speaker 2: that comes to mind there is TikTok and I know

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Speaker 2: personally that I have discovered a lot of new artists

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Speaker 2: through TikTok, but admittedly I can't say many of them

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Speaker 2: would be Australian. Do you see a future where TikTok

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Speaker 2: actually helps the cause there and that that discoverability element

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Speaker 2: is actually helping the industry.

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Speaker 3: Look, I mean we've had some issues with TikTok recently

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Speaker 3: because they decided to choose Australia as a test market

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Speaker 3: to turn off the access to music for certain users

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Speaker 3: of a certain artists. We'll see how that pans out.

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Speaker 3: They clearly are a very very important path to discovery now,

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Speaker 3: especially for that sort of sixteen to twenty five devo,

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Speaker 3: So we can't ignore TikTok. I mean, music is incredibly

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Speaker 3: important to that platform. TikTok wouldn't be TikTok without music.

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Speaker 3: I think we need to sort out some issues about

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Speaker 3: how much they value music, but it is really important.

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Speaker 3: Most listening to music is now through streaming. Getting on

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Speaker 3: a playlist is a game changer really in terms of

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Speaker 3: getting into the local charts but also getting into the

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Speaker 3: global charts.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. And I mean it's even the same with podcasting

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Speaker 2: now that you have to be included in charts in

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Speaker 2: order for anyone to find you. So I feel that

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Speaker 2: I think I want to end on perhaps an optimistic note.

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Speaker 2: It depends on what your answer is here actually, but

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Speaker 2: I'm curious to know whether you're hopeful that the industry

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Speaker 2: can in the future continue to nurture and to support

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Speaker 2: new Australian talent in months and years to come.

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Speaker 3: I am one hundred set hopeful. You know. I spent

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Speaker 3: a lot of time talking to two artists and to

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Speaker 3: music people, and as you said before, the talent is there.

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Speaker 3: If we had a problem with talent, yeah, maybe then

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Speaker 3: we've got a bit of issue. We don't. We've got

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Speaker 3: the talent, we just need to get them to the audience.

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Speaker 3: You know, things like the aur Awards are really important

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Speaker 3: to do that. It's a hugely important showcase night for

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Speaker 3: Rozzie Music. There are some really great green shoots. You know,

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Speaker 3: there's some artists having cool success. Peach obviously was number

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Speaker 3: one album the other week. There's a song called Missus

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Speaker 3: Hollywood by artists called Gojo, which has gone viral and

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Speaker 3: doing some really exciting things. We've got some Colony releases

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Speaker 3: coming later this year. We just need to rebuild. I

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Speaker 3: think there's a lot of optimism. I'm certainly very optimistic.

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Speaker 2: What do you think our listeners can do to support

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Speaker 2: their favorite kind of local uzzie performers, artists so on.

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Speaker 3: You can definitely make a bit of an effort to

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Speaker 3: sort of discover more music on streaming, so streaming their

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Speaker 3: music going and seeing them like they're really good. It's

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Speaker 3: really fun by merch merchants super cool at the moment,

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Speaker 3: there's so much that people are doing. Those are three

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Speaker 3: things that you can definitely do straight away. Love it.

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Speaker 2: Thanks so much for your time, Annabel Pleasure. Thanks for

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Speaker 2: joining us on the Daily OZ. If you learned something

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Speaker 2: from today's episode, don't forget to hit subscribe. So there's

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Speaker 2: a TDA episode waiting for you every weekday morning. We'll

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Speaker 2: be back again tomorrow, but until then, have a fab

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Speaker 2: date