1 00:00:03,040 --> 00:00:09,080 Speaker 1: Episode three, The Sees Scandals, Sarah Stevenson's popularity was through 2 00:00:09,119 --> 00:00:12,920 Speaker 1: the roof, fresh from activating hashtag milflife after the birth 3 00:00:12,920 --> 00:00:16,200 Speaker 1: of her son Fox Ocean, Sarah had managed to sidestep 4 00:00:16,239 --> 00:00:20,239 Speaker 1: Heer Sin three scandal, replacing controversy with baby Spam and 5 00:00:20,280 --> 00:00:23,440 Speaker 1: their new house. Rnos and the masses were loving it. 6 00:00:24,000 --> 00:00:26,799 Speaker 2: But no one could have predicted what twenty twenty would 7 00:00:26,840 --> 00:00:29,520 Speaker 2: hold for Sarah's day, let alone the world. 8 00:00:29,960 --> 00:00:32,000 Speaker 3: There are fears more than a thousand people could be 9 00:00:32,000 --> 00:00:35,479 Speaker 3: infected with the deadly SARS like virus in China. The 10 00:00:35,600 --> 00:00:39,920 Speaker 3: World Health Organization has declared coronavirus a global pandemic. 11 00:00:40,120 --> 00:00:43,120 Speaker 1: The COVID nineteen pandemic changed life as we knew it. 12 00:00:43,520 --> 00:00:46,040 Speaker 1: Locked inside our homes with more free time than ever, 13 00:00:46,400 --> 00:00:50,600 Speaker 1: public sentiment towards influences began to change and cancel culture 14 00:00:50,640 --> 00:00:53,680 Speaker 1: took hold. The same year, the Black Lives Matter movement 15 00:00:53,760 --> 00:00:56,760 Speaker 1: shook the world, with protests breaking out across the globe 16 00:00:56,760 --> 00:00:58,720 Speaker 1: following the murder of George Floyd. 17 00:00:59,160 --> 00:01:02,000 Speaker 3: Cities across the United States remained in a state of 18 00:01:02,120 --> 00:01:05,559 Speaker 3: high tension tonight, as the country braces itself for another 19 00:01:05,640 --> 00:01:08,400 Speaker 3: wave of protests over the death of George Floyd. 20 00:01:09,000 --> 00:01:11,720 Speaker 1: Twenty twenty was a horror year for everyone, but for 21 00:01:11,800 --> 00:01:14,759 Speaker 1: Sarah it was the year she got canceled as three 22 00:01:14,800 --> 00:01:17,240 Speaker 1: of her biggest controversies played out in front of a 23 00:01:17,240 --> 00:01:18,960 Speaker 1: captive audience in Lockdown. 24 00:01:19,760 --> 00:01:22,560 Speaker 2: We are journalist Amy Kay and Sophie Torbert and this 25 00:01:22,800 --> 00:01:26,920 Speaker 2: is outspoken Plus in. 26 00:01:26,880 --> 00:01:28,240 Speaker 4: Episode two, we Left You. 27 00:01:28,280 --> 00:01:32,720 Speaker 1: In late twenty nineteen, in Australia, bushfires were ravishing the country. 28 00:01:33,040 --> 00:01:36,280 Speaker 1: The new year brought further devastation as fires continued to 29 00:01:36,280 --> 00:01:37,480 Speaker 1: burn out of control. 30 00:01:37,800 --> 00:01:41,080 Speaker 3: New South Wales, Victoria and South Australia are waking up 31 00:01:41,080 --> 00:01:44,360 Speaker 3: to widespread fire damage. We know properties have been lost, 32 00:01:44,400 --> 00:01:46,960 Speaker 3: we know many towns are without power, but the true 33 00:01:47,000 --> 00:01:49,240 Speaker 3: extent is being assessed right now. 34 00:01:49,480 --> 00:01:52,040 Speaker 1: More than forty six million acres were burnt during the 35 00:01:52,040 --> 00:01:56,160 Speaker 1: twenty nineteen and twenty twenty bushfires, and devastatingly, thirty four 36 00:01:56,200 --> 00:01:59,200 Speaker 1: people were killed and nearly three billion animals. 37 00:01:58,720 --> 00:02:00,520 Speaker 4: Lost their lives or were placed. 38 00:02:01,000 --> 00:02:03,560 Speaker 1: All anyone could talk about was what could be done 39 00:02:03,600 --> 00:02:06,720 Speaker 1: to help. Influencers and brands jumped on the cause and 40 00:02:06,760 --> 00:02:10,760 Speaker 1: began sharing ways followers could help those impacted. I remember 41 00:02:10,800 --> 00:02:13,160 Speaker 1: at the time Mitch Orville was getting a lot of 42 00:02:13,200 --> 00:02:15,919 Speaker 1: attention because he managed to raise over two hundred and 43 00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:20,360 Speaker 1: seventy thousand dollars alongside his brand Hooded Smile, and Sarah's 44 00:02:20,400 --> 00:02:23,280 Speaker 1: Day was quick to follow this trend. In November, she 45 00:02:23,320 --> 00:02:26,000 Speaker 1: announced that one dollar from each of her products sold 46 00:02:26,040 --> 00:02:28,760 Speaker 1: on the Bang Body would go towards a Saint Vincent 47 00:02:28,800 --> 00:02:32,880 Speaker 1: Bushfire appeal Now. To put that donation into perspective, Sarah's 48 00:02:32,960 --> 00:02:36,920 Speaker 1: Lebang Body products ranged from sixty ninety five to fifty 49 00:02:36,919 --> 00:02:41,359 Speaker 1: eight ninety five now. The backlash was swift. People labeled Sarah's. 50 00:02:41,040 --> 00:02:44,600 Speaker 2: Promotion as an underwhelming offer of charity, while others said 51 00:02:44,639 --> 00:02:48,200 Speaker 2: one dollar per product was a cop out. Another commenter wrote, 52 00:02:48,360 --> 00:02:50,880 Speaker 2: go fifty percent or one hundred percent of proceeds for 53 00:02:50,880 --> 00:02:53,680 Speaker 2: forty eight hours to be genuine. It's currently a cheap 54 00:02:53,720 --> 00:02:55,519 Speaker 2: trick to boost profit now. 55 00:02:55,639 --> 00:02:58,560 Speaker 1: Sarah jumped onto her stories on the afternoon of the 56 00:02:58,560 --> 00:03:02,240 Speaker 1: fundraiser announcement, complaining that she couldn't train because she was 57 00:03:02,320 --> 00:03:03,840 Speaker 1: receiving so much hate. 58 00:03:04,200 --> 00:03:05,040 Speaker 4: Here's what she said. 59 00:03:05,840 --> 00:03:08,760 Speaker 5: The amount of hate we just got is actually disgusting. 60 00:03:08,800 --> 00:03:10,799 Speaker 5: Like we were trying to do something fun that was 61 00:03:10,840 --> 00:03:13,240 Speaker 5: going to give back to everyone, and yeah, I'm really 62 00:03:13,240 --> 00:03:17,960 Speaker 5: disappointed in like twenty percent of the people because this 63 00:03:18,120 --> 00:03:22,560 Speaker 5: was coming from a really honest, authentic giving place, like 64 00:03:22,880 --> 00:03:28,120 Speaker 5: bushfires is something really real and like personal in my family. 65 00:03:28,560 --> 00:03:31,280 Speaker 5: And when Labang called me with the idea, I was like, Yeah, 66 00:03:31,360 --> 00:03:33,240 Speaker 5: why would I say no? Like this is awesome. 67 00:03:34,280 --> 00:03:37,080 Speaker 1: Sarah was late slam for her use of the word fun, 68 00:03:37,200 --> 00:03:41,000 Speaker 1: which people found insensitive and said she didn't understand the issue. 69 00:03:41,320 --> 00:03:44,000 Speaker 1: Sarah went on to say this this. 70 00:03:44,080 --> 00:03:46,480 Speaker 5: Is a classic example of your damned if you do, 71 00:03:46,600 --> 00:03:49,080 Speaker 5: you're damned if you don't. Like if I hadn't done 72 00:03:49,160 --> 00:03:52,360 Speaker 5: anything with my products to support the Bushfire Foundation, I 73 00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:55,800 Speaker 5: would have got hate. If I promote one hundred percent 74 00:03:55,840 --> 00:03:58,160 Speaker 5: of the profits, I still get hate for promoting my products. 75 00:03:58,360 --> 00:04:01,480 Speaker 5: We say a dollar activation, still get hate. 76 00:04:01,600 --> 00:04:05,160 Speaker 2: The story made mainstream media and the campaign was stopped, 77 00:04:05,160 --> 00:04:09,480 Speaker 2: with no party disclosing if the money raise was donated. Now, 78 00:04:09,520 --> 00:04:13,120 Speaker 2: off the back of this initial failed campaign, Sarah launched 79 00:04:13,200 --> 00:04:15,680 Speaker 2: a three day e book sale to raise money for 80 00:04:15,720 --> 00:04:17,320 Speaker 2: bush fire relief charities. 81 00:04:17,680 --> 00:04:19,080 Speaker 4: The three charities. 82 00:04:18,720 --> 00:04:22,640 Speaker 2: Chosen were Food Bank Australia, New South Wales, Rural Fire Service, 83 00:04:22,920 --> 00:04:25,000 Speaker 2: Port Macquarie, Kohala Hospital and. 84 00:04:24,880 --> 00:04:26,080 Speaker 4: The Salvation Army. 85 00:04:26,480 --> 00:04:29,440 Speaker 2: As part of the promotion, Sarah discounted her ebooks by 86 00:04:29,480 --> 00:04:32,000 Speaker 2: twenty percent, and this time she said she would donate 87 00:04:32,120 --> 00:04:34,760 Speaker 2: one hundred percent of the sales made to her four 88 00:04:34,880 --> 00:04:38,520 Speaker 2: nominated charities. Now, Sarah announced that the sale raised a 89 00:04:38,520 --> 00:04:41,800 Speaker 2: whopping three hundred and ninety one thousand, six hundred and 90 00:04:41,880 --> 00:04:44,880 Speaker 2: sixty dollars, with the profits said to be split equally 91 00:04:45,000 --> 00:04:46,480 Speaker 2: between the four charities. 92 00:04:46,839 --> 00:04:47,039 Speaker 3: Now. 93 00:04:47,160 --> 00:04:49,920 Speaker 1: Rather than being met with great fanfare like Mitch Aorble, 94 00:04:50,279 --> 00:04:53,400 Speaker 1: Sarah's fans started getting agitated when she did not provide 95 00:04:53,440 --> 00:04:56,520 Speaker 1: an update on the status of the donation. So six 96 00:04:56,600 --> 00:04:59,479 Speaker 1: days after the sale ended, Sarah released a vlog where 97 00:04:59,480 --> 00:05:02,640 Speaker 1: she briefly touched on the fundraiser. She explained that she 98 00:05:02,680 --> 00:05:04,839 Speaker 1: had emailed the charities to let them know they would 99 00:05:04,880 --> 00:05:07,760 Speaker 1: be receiving a huge donation and asked them how to 100 00:05:07,800 --> 00:05:11,280 Speaker 1: go about transferring the money to them. Now despite confirming 101 00:05:11,360 --> 00:05:13,760 Speaker 1: she was in talks with the four charities, a member 102 00:05:13,800 --> 00:05:17,080 Speaker 1: of gossip forum Guru Gossip, she had an open letter 103 00:05:17,160 --> 00:05:19,800 Speaker 1: to Sarah where they revealed they had reported her to 104 00:05:19,880 --> 00:05:23,640 Speaker 1: scam Watch for not showing receipts of the donations she made. 105 00:05:23,760 --> 00:05:26,080 Speaker 1: The user wrote, I believe you will donate and this 106 00:05:26,240 --> 00:05:28,640 Speaker 1: was a genuine good deed you were doing. But this 107 00:05:28,800 --> 00:05:31,520 Speaker 1: is just a gentle nudge in the right direction. It's 108 00:05:31,560 --> 00:05:34,039 Speaker 1: too much money and too important a cause for you 109 00:05:34,120 --> 00:05:37,080 Speaker 1: not to have posted an update yet, especially when other 110 00:05:37,160 --> 00:05:40,599 Speaker 1: influencers have now. This letter spurred on others to start 111 00:05:40,640 --> 00:05:44,640 Speaker 1: contacting the Australian media publications who had covered the initial 112 00:05:44,720 --> 00:05:47,320 Speaker 1: story about the one dollar bushfire appeal. 113 00:05:47,839 --> 00:05:50,800 Speaker 2: It's safe to say by now the pressure was mounting 114 00:05:50,839 --> 00:05:53,920 Speaker 2: on Sarah. People were beginning to lash out on Instagram, 115 00:05:53,920 --> 00:05:57,680 Speaker 2: with many comments getting swiftly deleted. This stress led to 116 00:05:57,720 --> 00:06:00,880 Speaker 2: Sarah having a complete meltdown in her outside of a 117 00:06:00,960 --> 00:06:04,560 Speaker 2: bank ten days after the fundraiser had ended. So the 118 00:06:04,680 --> 00:06:07,400 Speaker 2: day prior, she had updated her followers saying that she 119 00:06:07,480 --> 00:06:10,600 Speaker 2: was unable to donate to the Koala Hospital because her 120 00:06:10,640 --> 00:06:13,400 Speaker 2: bank wouldn't allow her to make a transaction that big. 121 00:06:13,839 --> 00:06:16,640 Speaker 2: So the following day, Sarah complained the bank had only 122 00:06:16,720 --> 00:06:19,320 Speaker 2: let her transfer money to two of the four charities 123 00:06:19,600 --> 00:06:21,800 Speaker 2: because of the transfer limit, and that she would need 124 00:06:21,839 --> 00:06:24,480 Speaker 2: to come back the next day. It's important to note 125 00:06:24,520 --> 00:06:26,839 Speaker 2: that Sarah did visit the bank at four pm when 126 00:06:26,839 --> 00:06:29,440 Speaker 2: it was closing. She said I'm just trying to do 127 00:06:29,520 --> 00:06:31,680 Speaker 2: this nice thing and donate all this money for my 128 00:06:31,720 --> 00:06:34,520 Speaker 2: country and the animals. Sarah went on to complain that 129 00:06:34,560 --> 00:06:36,880 Speaker 2: she'd been trying to pay everyone for over a week, 130 00:06:36,960 --> 00:06:39,480 Speaker 2: but none of the charities were accepting the bank transfers 131 00:06:39,480 --> 00:06:41,960 Speaker 2: because the daily limit on her account was one hundred 132 00:06:42,040 --> 00:06:45,479 Speaker 2: thousand dollars. Now, when you consider that Sarah was trying 133 00:06:45,520 --> 00:06:49,640 Speaker 2: to transfer each charity around eighty nine thousand dollars, wouldn't 134 00:06:49,680 --> 00:06:52,440 Speaker 2: have only taken her four days to finalize these transfers. 135 00:06:52,600 --> 00:06:52,840 Speaker 4: Yeah. 136 00:06:52,880 --> 00:06:55,520 Speaker 1: I think the fact that she was complaining and putting 137 00:06:55,560 --> 00:06:58,520 Speaker 1: a lot of the blame on the charities really caused 138 00:06:58,520 --> 00:07:01,120 Speaker 1: a sour taste in people's mind. I mean, obviously it 139 00:07:01,160 --> 00:07:03,400 Speaker 1: sounds like it was a bit of a complex process 140 00:07:03,480 --> 00:07:07,000 Speaker 1: to do, but I think, don't share the struggles. 141 00:07:06,440 --> 00:07:09,040 Speaker 4: That you're having with online. Yeah. 142 00:07:09,080 --> 00:07:12,080 Speaker 2: So, on the twenty second of January, five days after 143 00:07:12,200 --> 00:07:15,320 Speaker 2: Sarah's meltdown at the bank, Sarah confirmed that all four 144 00:07:15,440 --> 00:07:19,360 Speaker 2: charities had received their donations. Sarah shared a screenshot of 145 00:07:19,400 --> 00:07:23,880 Speaker 2: handwritten calculations and wrote, all charities have received their donations? 146 00:07:24,160 --> 00:07:26,800 Speaker 2: Were who When I contacted the charities to let them 147 00:07:26,800 --> 00:07:29,640 Speaker 2: know they'd be getting eighty nine thousand, thirteen dollars and 148 00:07:29,720 --> 00:07:33,320 Speaker 2: seventy five cents. They were absolutely overwhelmed and so grateful. 149 00:07:33,680 --> 00:07:37,520 Speaker 1: Originally some people were complaining that the sum Sarah provided 150 00:07:37,640 --> 00:07:40,640 Speaker 1: didn't add up, but they were forgetting about the GST. 151 00:07:40,800 --> 00:07:43,239 Speaker 1: So it's important to note that according to a chartered 152 00:07:43,280 --> 00:07:46,880 Speaker 1: tax accountant, Sarah did everything completely within the rules of 153 00:07:46,920 --> 00:07:49,080 Speaker 1: the tax legislation in Australia. 154 00:07:49,120 --> 00:07:50,760 Speaker 4: It's very likely that she would. 155 00:07:50,600 --> 00:07:53,920 Speaker 1: Have an accountant providing advice on how to maximize their 156 00:07:53,960 --> 00:07:56,800 Speaker 1: profit and cash. So in this case, what people appeared 157 00:07:56,800 --> 00:07:59,120 Speaker 1: to have an issue with is with Sarah promoting that 158 00:07:59,160 --> 00:08:02,120 Speaker 1: she would donate one hundred percent of sales rather than 159 00:08:02,160 --> 00:08:04,840 Speaker 1: saying one hundred percent of profits. I mean, I think 160 00:08:04,880 --> 00:08:06,520 Speaker 1: it's a bit tit for tat at this stage. 161 00:08:06,760 --> 00:08:08,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, in this instance, I do feel like people were 162 00:08:09,080 --> 00:08:11,480 Speaker 2: very harsh on Sarah, considering that she did raise such 163 00:08:11,520 --> 00:08:14,440 Speaker 2: a huge amount of money for charity. I do think 164 00:08:14,480 --> 00:08:17,320 Speaker 2: people are forgetting that there were so many celebrities and 165 00:08:17,400 --> 00:08:20,920 Speaker 2: influencers jumping in and trying to raise money without actually 166 00:08:21,000 --> 00:08:23,360 Speaker 2: thinking through the process of how they would end up 167 00:08:23,520 --> 00:08:26,480 Speaker 2: transferring such a huge amount of money to a charity. 168 00:08:26,640 --> 00:08:27,640 Speaker 4: I think if this was a. 169 00:08:27,600 --> 00:08:30,000 Speaker 2: Campaign that she had set up with a lot of 170 00:08:30,120 --> 00:08:33,000 Speaker 2: preparation time, it would have been fair to sort of 171 00:08:33,120 --> 00:08:35,920 Speaker 2: launch this criticism at her, But considering it was something 172 00:08:35,960 --> 00:08:38,360 Speaker 2: done on the fly, I do think it was a 173 00:08:38,400 --> 00:08:39,240 Speaker 2: little bit unfair. 174 00:08:39,400 --> 00:08:41,480 Speaker 1: I think it is really interesting to look back at 175 00:08:41,480 --> 00:08:44,160 Speaker 1: this scandal three years on when you're removed from the 176 00:08:44,280 --> 00:08:48,160 Speaker 1: emotions of the situation. So in times of crisis, when 177 00:08:48,160 --> 00:08:51,160 Speaker 1: people feel out of control, generally they do look for 178 00:08:51,240 --> 00:08:54,600 Speaker 1: someone to blame, and at the time, influencers around Australia 179 00:08:54,679 --> 00:08:57,800 Speaker 1: really were being put under the microscope by sections of 180 00:08:57,840 --> 00:09:00,640 Speaker 1: the Internet who were trying to determine whether or not 181 00:09:00,840 --> 00:09:03,760 Speaker 1: influencers were trying to help out out of the goodness 182 00:09:03,800 --> 00:09:06,679 Speaker 1: of their hearts, or whether they saw this situation as 183 00:09:06,720 --> 00:09:10,760 Speaker 1: an opportunity for self promotion and being charitable at the 184 00:09:10,840 --> 00:09:12,640 Speaker 1: end of the day is good for your brand, but 185 00:09:12,720 --> 00:09:15,240 Speaker 1: it's also something I would like to think that a 186 00:09:15,280 --> 00:09:17,760 Speaker 1: lot of people genuinely do to help out and make 187 00:09:17,800 --> 00:09:21,360 Speaker 1: a difference. And I personally felt uncomfortable by the backlash 188 00:09:21,400 --> 00:09:23,920 Speaker 1: that was thrown at Sarah during this time because, as 189 00:09:23,960 --> 00:09:26,160 Speaker 1: you say, Kate, she did use her platform to raise 190 00:09:26,200 --> 00:09:29,559 Speaker 1: over three hundred thousand dollars for animals and communities in need. 191 00:09:29,840 --> 00:09:32,040 Speaker 1: And I'm sure if she didn't use her platform, she 192 00:09:32,040 --> 00:09:34,320 Speaker 1: would have copt the same amount of flack and abuse. 193 00:09:34,720 --> 00:09:36,440 Speaker 1: And it sort of was a situation at the time 194 00:09:36,480 --> 00:09:38,480 Speaker 1: you're either damned if you do damned if you don't. 195 00:09:38,640 --> 00:09:40,719 Speaker 2: Yeah, I actually remember she did say that. And it's 196 00:09:40,760 --> 00:09:43,960 Speaker 2: important to remember that whilst influencers may come across as 197 00:09:44,000 --> 00:09:47,480 Speaker 2: these huge entities, most of the time they are individuals 198 00:09:47,600 --> 00:09:50,480 Speaker 2: running startups which don't have the support of a professional 199 00:09:50,559 --> 00:09:53,839 Speaker 2: team or strategists or lawyers behind them helping them make 200 00:09:53,880 --> 00:09:56,480 Speaker 2: these big business decisions. And I think there's a lot 201 00:09:56,520 --> 00:09:58,520 Speaker 2: of talk about how Sarah is in a bit of 202 00:09:58,559 --> 00:10:01,720 Speaker 2: a cronulla bubble, and I don't think equips herself with 203 00:10:01,800 --> 00:10:05,600 Speaker 2: the right team. She often employs friends or relatives, and 204 00:10:05,640 --> 00:10:08,199 Speaker 2: I think this is a situation where perhaps she didn't 205 00:10:08,200 --> 00:10:09,720 Speaker 2: have the right guidance in place. 206 00:10:10,040 --> 00:10:10,240 Speaker 6: Yeah. 207 00:10:10,240 --> 00:10:12,720 Speaker 1: And in terms of the criticism about her not donating 208 00:10:12,760 --> 00:10:14,839 Speaker 1: the money quick enough, I think over time it has 209 00:10:14,880 --> 00:10:18,400 Speaker 1: become quite evident that donating large sums of money isn't 210 00:10:18,440 --> 00:10:21,120 Speaker 1: as easy as it looks. And this was the case 211 00:10:21,120 --> 00:10:24,720 Speaker 1: for Australian comedian Celeste Barber, who raised fifty one point 212 00:10:24,800 --> 00:10:28,520 Speaker 1: three million dollars in a record breaking Facebook fundraiser for 213 00:10:28,559 --> 00:10:32,320 Speaker 1: the New South Wales Rural Fire Service and brigades donation funds. 214 00:10:32,360 --> 00:10:35,560 Speaker 1: So Celess said that as donations grew and grew, she 215 00:10:35,679 --> 00:10:38,840 Speaker 1: attracted a fuck ton of people telling her what she 216 00:10:38,920 --> 00:10:42,000 Speaker 1: should do with it. And things got really complicated when 217 00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:45,040 Speaker 1: the deed which governed the New South Wales Rural Fire 218 00:10:45,120 --> 00:10:49,120 Speaker 1: Service Trust outlined that money donated could only be spent 219 00:10:49,200 --> 00:10:54,000 Speaker 1: on purchasing and maintaining equipment, training and administration cost So 220 00:10:54,120 --> 00:10:57,280 Speaker 1: this meant that the money wasn't really allowed to go 221 00:10:57,520 --> 00:11:00,320 Speaker 1: directly to those who had been impacted by the fire. 222 00:11:00,679 --> 00:11:03,080 Speaker 2: And I'm sure Celeste never imagined that she would have 223 00:11:03,240 --> 00:11:06,400 Speaker 2: raised that amount of money, and I'm assuming donors would 224 00:11:06,400 --> 00:11:08,800 Speaker 2: have thought that she would have the ability to allocate 225 00:11:08,840 --> 00:11:12,599 Speaker 2: funds to other bushfire charities if necessary. Now there was 226 00:11:12,640 --> 00:11:14,920 Speaker 2: a court case and the court ruled that money could 227 00:11:14,920 --> 00:11:17,760 Speaker 2: be given to the families of Fullen firefighters and used 228 00:11:17,800 --> 00:11:20,720 Speaker 2: for trauma counseling, but could not be given to charities 229 00:11:20,760 --> 00:11:23,600 Speaker 2: like the Australian Red Cross or animal welfare groups, which 230 00:11:23,640 --> 00:11:28,040 Speaker 2: upset many of those who donated their money. One month later, 231 00:11:28,200 --> 00:11:32,360 Speaker 2: Sarah's bushfire fundraiser controversy was all but forgotten as the 232 00:11:32,400 --> 00:11:34,520 Speaker 2: COVID pandemic took over our lives. 233 00:11:34,720 --> 00:11:39,280 Speaker 3: The World Health Organization has declared coronavirus a global pandemic. 234 00:11:39,720 --> 00:11:42,200 Speaker 1: As our lives ascended into the unknown. With stay at 235 00:11:42,200 --> 00:11:45,800 Speaker 1: home orders and five kilometer radius parameters in place, we 236 00:11:45,880 --> 00:11:50,160 Speaker 1: became increasingly infuriated by anyone breaking the rules or those 237 00:11:50,200 --> 00:11:53,880 Speaker 1: in positions of privilege complaining about being confined to their mansions. 238 00:11:54,360 --> 00:11:56,240 Speaker 1: Influencer behavior became a. 239 00:11:56,120 --> 00:11:57,360 Speaker 4: Major talking point. 240 00:11:57,720 --> 00:12:00,800 Speaker 1: We were beginning to question whether influencers were doing enough 241 00:12:00,840 --> 00:12:03,000 Speaker 1: to deserve the privileges bestowed. 242 00:12:02,600 --> 00:12:03,760 Speaker 4: Upon them now. 243 00:12:03,800 --> 00:12:06,760 Speaker 2: On the twenty fifth of May twenty twenty, George Floyd, 244 00:12:06,800 --> 00:12:09,840 Speaker 2: a black man living in Minneapolis, was murdered by police 245 00:12:09,840 --> 00:12:13,800 Speaker 2: officer Derek Sharvin. After being handcuffed and pinned to the ground, 246 00:12:14,120 --> 00:12:17,200 Speaker 2: Floyd repeatedly told the police officer he could not breathe 247 00:12:17,240 --> 00:12:20,160 Speaker 2: as the officer knelt on his neck. The horrific event 248 00:12:20,240 --> 00:12:27,880 Speaker 2: was captured on camera, sparking protests around the world. 249 00:12:27,960 --> 00:12:32,120 Speaker 3: Chaos, violence, fire, and looty unfolding on the streets of Minneapolis. 250 00:12:32,440 --> 00:12:35,480 Speaker 2: Black matters were at the forefront of the public psyche. 251 00:12:35,559 --> 00:12:38,440 Speaker 2: We were just two months into the pandemic and tensions 252 00:12:38,440 --> 00:12:41,800 Speaker 2: were boiling over. Social media was a wash with support 253 00:12:41,840 --> 00:12:44,560 Speaker 2: for the Black Lives Matter movement, with black tile shared 254 00:12:44,600 --> 00:12:47,840 Speaker 2: on June second, twenty twenty to show solidarity for the 255 00:12:47,880 --> 00:12:50,160 Speaker 2: protests and riots happening in the US. 256 00:12:50,840 --> 00:12:54,160 Speaker 1: Meanwhile, back in Cronulla, Sarah was getting set to launch 257 00:12:54,160 --> 00:12:58,080 Speaker 1: her third active web collaboration with White Fox Boutique. The 258 00:12:58,160 --> 00:13:01,320 Speaker 1: campaign was called Reboot and was based around the idea 259 00:13:01,400 --> 00:13:05,160 Speaker 1: that her line was being elevated. Sarah took followers along 260 00:13:05,200 --> 00:13:07,920 Speaker 1: for the ride, capturing behind the scenes footage of her 261 00:13:07,960 --> 00:13:12,640 Speaker 1: campaign shoot. Followers were left astounded when Sarah revealed how 262 00:13:12,679 --> 00:13:17,040 Speaker 1: she had been styled. She was unrecognizable. Her short blonde 263 00:13:17,040 --> 00:13:20,480 Speaker 1: hair had been woven into thick fluot braids, and she 264 00:13:20,600 --> 00:13:23,280 Speaker 1: was quickly accused of cultural appropriation. 265 00:13:24,000 --> 00:13:27,360 Speaker 2: Now, for those who are unsure, cultural appropriation occurs when 266 00:13:27,400 --> 00:13:30,520 Speaker 2: members of a majority group adopt cultural elements of a 267 00:13:30,559 --> 00:13:35,600 Speaker 2: minority group in an exploitative, disrespectful, stereotypical way. This can 268 00:13:35,640 --> 00:13:39,480 Speaker 2: include a hairstyle, piece of clothing, and a manner of speaking. Now, 269 00:13:39,520 --> 00:13:42,400 Speaker 2: to put all of this into context. Just three days 270 00:13:42,440 --> 00:13:45,280 Speaker 2: after the murder of George Floyd, Sarah's Day was forced 271 00:13:45,320 --> 00:13:49,240 Speaker 2: to pull her new reboot activewear campaign. She did decide 272 00:13:49,240 --> 00:13:52,080 Speaker 2: to reshoot the campaign with a different look a couple 273 00:13:52,080 --> 00:13:55,240 Speaker 2: of days later. Now, I remember the moment I saw 274 00:13:55,320 --> 00:13:59,840 Speaker 2: Sarah's hairstyle on Instagram. I instantly screenshot it and sent 275 00:14:00,040 --> 00:14:02,720 Speaker 2: it to you, because I couldn't believe that she didn't 276 00:14:02,720 --> 00:14:05,720 Speaker 2: foresee that this would be a problem, especially considering what 277 00:14:05,880 --> 00:14:06,880 Speaker 2: was going on in the world. 278 00:14:06,960 --> 00:14:08,480 Speaker 4: It was just so tone deaf. 279 00:14:08,760 --> 00:14:11,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, the fact that Sarah's Day, as well as the 280 00:14:11,200 --> 00:14:15,120 Speaker 1: White Fox boutique team thought that this was acceptable really 281 00:14:15,160 --> 00:14:15,640 Speaker 1: shocked me. 282 00:14:15,679 --> 00:14:17,640 Speaker 4: How did no one flag this with her? 283 00:14:17,960 --> 00:14:21,200 Speaker 2: Oh? I mean, the hairstyle was just highly inappropriate. West 284 00:14:21,240 --> 00:14:24,320 Speaker 2: African woman Safie, who chose not to give her last name, 285 00:14:24,680 --> 00:14:27,880 Speaker 2: gave some really insightful comments to news dot Com about 286 00:14:27,920 --> 00:14:30,479 Speaker 2: the incident because at the time, there seemed. 287 00:14:30,240 --> 00:14:31,400 Speaker 4: To be a real divide. 288 00:14:31,400 --> 00:14:34,200 Speaker 2: There were those who were deeply offended and then those 289 00:14:34,240 --> 00:14:38,440 Speaker 2: who didn't understand the gravity of the situation. So Safie said, 290 00:14:38,440 --> 00:14:42,360 Speaker 2: for her, it came down to differentiating cultural appropriation and 291 00:14:42,440 --> 00:14:47,040 Speaker 2: cultural appreciation. She said, sadly, so many people can't tell 292 00:14:47,080 --> 00:14:49,880 Speaker 2: the difference. She explained that what Sarah did was take 293 00:14:49,920 --> 00:14:53,560 Speaker 2: this hairstyle, capitalize on her refer to it as ghetto, 294 00:14:54,000 --> 00:14:57,160 Speaker 2: a neglect to pay proper homage or acknowledge that she 295 00:14:57,240 --> 00:15:01,040 Speaker 2: was inspired by women of color. She continued to quite simply, 296 00:15:01,120 --> 00:15:03,800 Speaker 2: she used a significant part of our culture to make 297 00:15:03,880 --> 00:15:06,320 Speaker 2: money off it. This is what so many black women 298 00:15:06,360 --> 00:15:10,160 Speaker 2: of color, like myself class as cultural appropriation. Had she 299 00:15:10,280 --> 00:15:14,160 Speaker 2: done her research and understood the cultural significance of this hairstyle, 300 00:15:14,240 --> 00:15:17,760 Speaker 2: it would be considered cultural appreciation, but she didn't. 301 00:15:17,920 --> 00:15:21,840 Speaker 1: Now Following the backlash online, Sarah released a three hundred 302 00:15:21,840 --> 00:15:25,520 Speaker 1: and eighty word apology on her Instagram feed alongside a 303 00:15:25,560 --> 00:15:29,520 Speaker 1: series of Instagram stories to her one point one million followers. 304 00:15:29,920 --> 00:15:34,160 Speaker 1: Sarah apologized for the hairstyle, causing any offense, and explained 305 00:15:34,160 --> 00:15:37,240 Speaker 1: why she made the decision to wear braids. She basically 306 00:15:37,280 --> 00:15:39,800 Speaker 1: said it was her idea to wear braids because she 307 00:15:39,880 --> 00:15:43,640 Speaker 1: always wears them and wanted to incorporate Coachella and festival 308 00:15:43,720 --> 00:15:45,120 Speaker 1: vibes into the campaign. 309 00:15:45,720 --> 00:15:46,640 Speaker 4: Let's throw to what she. 310 00:15:46,640 --> 00:15:49,760 Speaker 5: Said, so specifically, we need to talk about the braids 311 00:15:49,800 --> 00:15:53,359 Speaker 5: because this is where the controversy comes and the accusations 312 00:15:53,400 --> 00:15:57,080 Speaker 5: and issue of cultural appropriation. So in the first and 313 00:15:57,320 --> 00:15:59,640 Speaker 5: in no way I've said this in the caption, I'm 314 00:15:59,680 --> 00:16:03,240 Speaker 5: not made excuses or trying to justify. I'm literally just 315 00:16:03,280 --> 00:16:06,400 Speaker 5: trying to give reasoning because everyone's asking me questions, like 316 00:16:06,720 --> 00:16:09,640 Speaker 5: even if they're mean questions, Everyone's like, why the f 317 00:16:09,720 --> 00:16:11,840 Speaker 5: do you think it's okay to wear braids? Like this 318 00:16:11,920 --> 00:16:13,400 Speaker 5: is me answering, This is me answering. 319 00:16:13,480 --> 00:16:15,800 Speaker 6: Yeah, this is a very serious topic and like for 320 00:16:15,880 --> 00:16:17,960 Speaker 6: us to be put in this category, it's very scary 321 00:16:17,960 --> 00:16:19,960 Speaker 6: for us because this is the complete opposite of what 322 00:16:20,000 --> 00:16:20,440 Speaker 6: we're about. 323 00:16:20,560 --> 00:16:24,680 Speaker 5: Yeah, I'm I'm like the last person to judge anyone 324 00:16:24,880 --> 00:16:30,760 Speaker 5: or to try to be controversial or cultural appropriate, Like 325 00:16:30,840 --> 00:16:33,760 Speaker 5: I just want everyone to be happier. What everyone anyway, 326 00:16:33,840 --> 00:16:38,360 Speaker 5: I'm derailing. So I was the one who first came 327 00:16:38,440 --> 00:16:41,560 Speaker 5: up with the braid idea, and I showed I make 328 00:16:41,640 --> 00:16:43,800 Speaker 5: a mood board for everything. I made a Pinterest with 329 00:16:43,880 --> 00:16:47,120 Speaker 5: like mostly Coachella stuff. It was like these big braids 330 00:16:47,120 --> 00:16:48,880 Speaker 5: and they were pink and it was fun, and so 331 00:16:49,120 --> 00:16:50,920 Speaker 5: most of the pictures that I showed everyone were like 332 00:16:50,960 --> 00:16:52,120 Speaker 5: Coachella festival. 333 00:16:52,160 --> 00:16:52,960 Speaker 4: It was really fun. 334 00:16:54,040 --> 00:16:54,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, So that was the pin. 335 00:16:54,920 --> 00:16:56,840 Speaker 6: I had that like electric feel that was tied in 336 00:16:56,960 --> 00:16:59,360 Speaker 6: nicely to the whole idea of this campaign that we 337 00:16:59,480 --> 00:17:01,160 Speaker 6: sort of up with in the first place. 338 00:17:01,360 --> 00:17:03,600 Speaker 5: And that's the thing. I don't know if I'm just 339 00:17:03,720 --> 00:17:05,480 Speaker 5: like not educated. 340 00:17:05,040 --> 00:17:07,880 Speaker 4: In this or it's like I don't know, because not. 341 00:17:07,920 --> 00:17:10,760 Speaker 5: Once did I even think about cultural appropriation. If that 342 00:17:10,880 --> 00:17:13,160 Speaker 5: even crossed my mind, I wouldn't have done it, because 343 00:17:13,200 --> 00:17:15,480 Speaker 5: you guys know, I hate conflict, I hate controversy. I 344 00:17:15,480 --> 00:17:18,240 Speaker 5: don't want to offend anyone. If I thought it would 345 00:17:18,280 --> 00:17:21,080 Speaker 5: offend anyone, I would have never, ever, ever, ever done it. 346 00:17:21,480 --> 00:17:24,600 Speaker 5: So again not making excuses, but you guys know, I 347 00:17:24,600 --> 00:17:27,639 Speaker 5: always wear two braids. Even when I had long blonde extensions, 348 00:17:27,680 --> 00:17:30,600 Speaker 5: I got my hair braided, and even now I'm not 349 00:17:30,640 --> 00:17:33,240 Speaker 5: gonna lie even doing Yeah, I'd be lying if I 350 00:17:33,280 --> 00:17:37,080 Speaker 5: said I completely understood what's okay and what's not okay, 351 00:17:37,160 --> 00:17:42,000 Speaker 5: Because even after researching so much, asking people, asking my friends, 352 00:17:42,000 --> 00:17:45,760 Speaker 5: of all different cultural backgrounds, of all different races, everyone 353 00:17:45,840 --> 00:17:48,760 Speaker 5: has a different opinion, everyone has a different It's a. 354 00:17:48,800 --> 00:17:51,280 Speaker 6: Very fine line. So I don't know. 355 00:17:51,480 --> 00:17:53,680 Speaker 5: So I don't know what's offensive. I don't know what 356 00:17:53,840 --> 00:17:56,080 Speaker 5: is cultural. I don't know, so That's why I'm like, 357 00:17:56,080 --> 00:17:57,200 Speaker 5: you know what, we had a call. 358 00:17:57,080 --> 00:17:58,679 Speaker 4: With White Fox. White Fox. 359 00:17:59,080 --> 00:18:02,000 Speaker 5: They don't want to offend anyone, Like the whole team 360 00:18:02,040 --> 00:18:04,680 Speaker 5: who worked on this campaign are heartbroken. That would put us. 361 00:18:04,800 --> 00:18:06,879 Speaker 6: We worked on it for like three months or so 362 00:18:07,040 --> 00:18:10,679 Speaker 6: in the making, and now read for everyone, it's okay. 363 00:18:11,520 --> 00:18:15,040 Speaker 1: Initially, many people took Sarah's apology on face value and 364 00:18:15,119 --> 00:18:18,840 Speaker 1: accepted that she was ignorant and uneducated. It is important 365 00:18:18,840 --> 00:18:21,479 Speaker 1: to note, however, that the apology was not directed at 366 00:18:21,520 --> 00:18:24,359 Speaker 1: white people, but at people of color. Therefore, it's not 367 00:18:24,480 --> 00:18:28,240 Speaker 1: up to us to accept the apology. Opinions started shifting though, 368 00:18:28,280 --> 00:18:31,400 Speaker 1: when it appeared Sarah wasn't as remorseful as she had 369 00:18:31,400 --> 00:18:34,879 Speaker 1: made out originally. Firstly, both Sarah and Kirk kept the 370 00:18:34,920 --> 00:18:38,639 Speaker 1: sneak peak of the campaign up despite deciding to pull it. 371 00:18:38,920 --> 00:18:42,320 Speaker 1: The video included Sarah wearing the braids the evening of 372 00:18:42,320 --> 00:18:43,040 Speaker 1: her apology. 373 00:18:43,200 --> 00:18:45,120 Speaker 4: Sarah was also very passive. 374 00:18:44,840 --> 00:18:48,600 Speaker 2: Aggressive on her Instagram story about having to reshoot the campaign. 375 00:18:48,920 --> 00:18:51,360 Speaker 2: Now it was very clear she was feeling sorry for herself. 376 00:18:51,359 --> 00:18:53,720 Speaker 2: She made a snide comment about it apparently being a 377 00:18:53,760 --> 00:18:57,520 Speaker 2: tough day for everyone, not just her, to make matters worse, 378 00:18:57,720 --> 00:19:01,120 Speaker 2: a screenshot from Sarah's Day's Facebook came unity surfaced where 379 00:19:01,119 --> 00:19:04,840 Speaker 2: she was warned of the cultural appropriation weeks before when 380 00:19:04,840 --> 00:19:08,400 Speaker 2: she first posted about the campaign to her story. However, 381 00:19:08,480 --> 00:19:11,800 Speaker 2: at the time, the post was deleted and deemed as trolling. 382 00:19:12,200 --> 00:19:16,240 Speaker 2: Sarah's apology post was also highly moderated. It only had 383 00:19:16,320 --> 00:19:20,040 Speaker 2: messages of support. The original comments calling out the hairstyle 384 00:19:20,119 --> 00:19:25,680 Speaker 2: as cultural appropriation were also deleted, despite it being an educational, 385 00:19:25,800 --> 00:19:29,639 Speaker 2: well balanced discussion. Now, White Fox Boutique did not comment 386 00:19:29,720 --> 00:19:33,720 Speaker 2: on the controversy or issue an apology for their involvement, 387 00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:37,359 Speaker 2: and I thought this was really poor because it wasn't 388 00:19:37,440 --> 00:19:41,119 Speaker 2: solely Sarah's decision to launch the campaign, yet she was 389 00:19:41,200 --> 00:19:42,520 Speaker 2: the only one who. 390 00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:45,720 Speaker 1: Faced up and apologized to it. Yes, the apology was 391 00:19:45,760 --> 00:19:48,320 Speaker 1: not fantastic and it did not seem genuine, But I 392 00:19:48,400 --> 00:19:51,560 Speaker 1: find it really strange that White Fox Boutique, which is 393 00:19:51,600 --> 00:19:54,920 Speaker 1: a large brand, didn't come out and give a statement 394 00:19:54,960 --> 00:19:57,520 Speaker 1: and apologize because they at the end of the day, 395 00:19:57,880 --> 00:20:00,200 Speaker 1: they gave the all clear for this. This was their 396 00:20:00,280 --> 00:20:01,879 Speaker 1: brand putting out the activewear. 397 00:20:02,359 --> 00:20:05,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, they were collaborating with Sarah's Day on the project. 398 00:20:05,000 --> 00:20:06,879 Speaker 2: You think they'd have a say in the campaign. 399 00:20:07,280 --> 00:20:10,120 Speaker 1: They really seemed to hang her out to dry, which 400 00:20:10,160 --> 00:20:12,560 Speaker 1: is really confusing because they still do use her as 401 00:20:12,600 --> 00:20:14,320 Speaker 1: the face of many of their campaigns. 402 00:20:14,600 --> 00:20:15,840 Speaker 4: Yeah, it was very odd. 403 00:20:16,240 --> 00:20:18,600 Speaker 2: Now it didn't take long for people to start piling 404 00:20:18,640 --> 00:20:20,720 Speaker 2: on Sarah. It got to the point where Sarah and 405 00:20:20,760 --> 00:20:24,280 Speaker 2: her young son Fox were receiving death threats. Receipts also 406 00:20:24,440 --> 00:20:27,280 Speaker 2: started coming out of the woodwork. An alleged image of 407 00:20:27,320 --> 00:20:31,200 Speaker 2: Sarah's husband Kurt, playing scrabble emerged with a homophobic slur 408 00:20:31,359 --> 00:20:34,360 Speaker 2: spelled out on the board. A screenshot of an apparent 409 00:20:34,440 --> 00:20:37,320 Speaker 2: Bible verse Sarah shared saying people who don't believe in 410 00:20:37,359 --> 00:20:41,440 Speaker 2: God will get COVID also spread around. Despite the backlash, 411 00:20:41,560 --> 00:20:45,199 Speaker 2: Sarah's activewear campaign sold out in a matter of minutes, 412 00:20:45,480 --> 00:20:49,160 Speaker 2: and in October, they launched a restock of the Reboot collection. 413 00:20:49,760 --> 00:20:50,480 Speaker 4: As part of the. 414 00:20:50,440 --> 00:20:54,399 Speaker 1: Restock, they filmed a new video campaign, which Kurt directed, 415 00:20:54,760 --> 00:20:57,119 Speaker 1: and of course, Sarah v log behind the scenes of 416 00:20:57,160 --> 00:21:01,160 Speaker 1: this campaign. She described the campaign as the most extravagant 417 00:21:01,160 --> 00:21:05,280 Speaker 1: and highly planned, biggest campaign they've ever done. It sounded 418 00:21:05,400 --> 00:21:08,399 Speaker 1: strange to describe a restock campaign as that, but it 419 00:21:08,480 --> 00:21:10,679 Speaker 1: was quite clear they were trying to make up for 420 00:21:10,720 --> 00:21:11,760 Speaker 1: the canceled campaign. 421 00:21:12,240 --> 00:21:12,919 Speaker 4: Yeah it was. 422 00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:15,800 Speaker 2: And what I found very odd was the actual concept 423 00:21:15,880 --> 00:21:19,159 Speaker 2: of this video. So the new video campaign slogan was 424 00:21:19,280 --> 00:21:22,800 Speaker 2: rise above. And the video starts out with Sarah driving 425 00:21:22,800 --> 00:21:25,040 Speaker 2: in a g wagon and she flicks around on the 426 00:21:25,119 --> 00:21:28,480 Speaker 2: radio channel and there's a news report saying good afternoon. 427 00:21:28,800 --> 00:21:31,040 Speaker 2: She then flicks to another channel that says. 428 00:21:31,280 --> 00:21:34,000 Speaker 3: God comefully she actually wore that, which he. 429 00:21:33,960 --> 00:21:35,400 Speaker 1: Is so canceled. 430 00:21:35,800 --> 00:21:39,000 Speaker 2: Sarah then struts into this garage past a flickering TV 431 00:21:39,119 --> 00:21:42,800 Speaker 2: that has Sarah's Day's campaign on the TV screen. She 432 00:21:42,880 --> 00:21:45,520 Speaker 2: walks up to this motorbike and then is shown waving 433 00:21:45,600 --> 00:21:49,280 Speaker 2: flags as two motorcycles speed pass and do big jumps 434 00:21:49,320 --> 00:21:51,639 Speaker 2: on their bikes. There's a lot of fire, which to 435 00:21:51,720 --> 00:21:55,800 Speaker 2: me suggests this rising from the ASHES messaging. And one 436 00:21:55,880 --> 00:21:59,159 Speaker 2: noticeable addition to the campaign are the models Kate Jones 437 00:21:59,200 --> 00:22:02,359 Speaker 2: and Lola tomp So. Kate is a curve model and 438 00:22:02,520 --> 00:22:06,439 Speaker 2: content creator. She's known as Dedicated Lifestyles on Instagram and 439 00:22:06,480 --> 00:22:09,400 Speaker 2: it has one hundred and eighty five thousand followers, while 440 00:22:09,440 --> 00:22:12,880 Speaker 2: Lola Thompson is a black model, dancer and content creator 441 00:22:12,920 --> 00:22:16,040 Speaker 2: with one hundred and eleven thousand Instagram followers and one 442 00:22:16,160 --> 00:22:19,480 Speaker 2: hundred and thirty thousand on TikTok, Sophie, did you think 443 00:22:19,480 --> 00:22:22,399 Speaker 2: it was a deliberate move to have more inclusive models 444 00:22:22,400 --> 00:22:23,120 Speaker 2: in this campaign? 445 00:22:23,560 --> 00:22:24,399 Speaker 4: One hundred percent. 446 00:22:24,480 --> 00:22:27,159 Speaker 1: This was a deliberate move, and I think after the backlash, 447 00:22:27,160 --> 00:22:30,040 Speaker 1: Sarah needed to be more inclusive in the campaign. But 448 00:22:30,200 --> 00:22:33,960 Speaker 1: it just made it feel really awkward and tokenistic. There 449 00:22:34,040 --> 00:22:35,520 Speaker 1: was it was very performative. 450 00:22:35,920 --> 00:22:38,439 Speaker 2: Yeah, I did find it really awkward. I do remember 451 00:22:38,440 --> 00:22:41,359 Speaker 2: that many people were surprised that Kate and Lola agreed 452 00:22:41,400 --> 00:22:43,199 Speaker 2: to be in the ad, but to be fair, it 453 00:22:43,240 --> 00:22:46,280 Speaker 2: was a big opportunity for their modeling careers. 454 00:22:46,080 --> 00:22:48,600 Speaker 1: And for Kate and Lola, it was an opportunity for 455 00:22:48,680 --> 00:22:51,479 Speaker 1: them to reach out to a section of Sarah's audience 456 00:22:51,520 --> 00:22:54,199 Speaker 1: who probably hasn't felt heard or seen before. 457 00:22:54,680 --> 00:22:55,879 Speaker 4: Yeah, I totally agree. 458 00:22:55,920 --> 00:22:57,960 Speaker 2: Now, at the end of the vlog, when Sarah and 459 00:22:58,040 --> 00:23:00,840 Speaker 2: Kurt throw to the finish clip of the video, Kurt 460 00:23:00,840 --> 00:23:03,800 Speaker 2: looks visibly agitated and he makes what appears to be 461 00:23:03,880 --> 00:23:08,760 Speaker 2: a snide remark, saying enjoy rise above. Now. Interestingly, in 462 00:23:08,800 --> 00:23:10,760 Speaker 2: this part of the video, I noticed that there was 463 00:23:10,800 --> 00:23:13,240 Speaker 2: an awkward cut which makes it seem like Kurt was 464 00:23:13,240 --> 00:23:15,880 Speaker 2: actually edited and that what he said in full wasn't 465 00:23:15,920 --> 00:23:19,480 Speaker 2: included in the video. To me, the messaging was all 466 00:23:19,520 --> 00:23:22,880 Speaker 2: about rising above the backlash they received, and I think 467 00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:25,520 Speaker 2: it was a strange concept to follow and came across 468 00:23:25,520 --> 00:23:28,960 Speaker 2: as very petty and unremorseful. This campaign had to be 469 00:23:29,080 --> 00:23:33,240 Speaker 2: reshot because of cultural appropriation. Don't use this as an 470 00:23:33,240 --> 00:23:36,000 Speaker 2: opportunity to talk about your own agenda. 471 00:23:36,359 --> 00:23:36,680 Speaker 3: It does. 472 00:23:37,000 --> 00:23:39,760 Speaker 1: It doesn't come across that they're very remorseful or sorry 473 00:23:39,760 --> 00:23:40,480 Speaker 1: for what they did. 474 00:23:40,680 --> 00:23:42,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, it was almost like they were the victims in 475 00:23:42,520 --> 00:23:46,000 Speaker 2: the situation because they had to reshoot a campaign. Now, 476 00:23:46,160 --> 00:23:49,600 Speaker 2: Sarah's horror year wasn't done yet, if you can believe it. 477 00:23:49,760 --> 00:23:53,840 Speaker 2: Sarah's final major scandal for twenty twenty was sparked by 478 00:23:53,880 --> 00:23:55,919 Speaker 2: missing rock and pillow inserts. 479 00:23:56,280 --> 00:23:56,520 Speaker 3: Yeah. 480 00:23:56,560 --> 00:23:59,680 Speaker 1: On the sixteenth of November twenty twenty, Sarah decided to 481 00:23:59,680 --> 00:24:03,760 Speaker 1: puply name and shame small business Sabi and Soul under 482 00:24:03,800 --> 00:24:06,760 Speaker 1: the guise of helping others. She shared a total of 483 00:24:06,800 --> 00:24:10,120 Speaker 1: thirteen Instagram stories where she alleged that the brand had 484 00:24:10,160 --> 00:24:13,560 Speaker 1: debited one hundred dollars from her account but not delivered 485 00:24:13,560 --> 00:24:17,680 Speaker 1: the three Moroccan cushion inserts she had ordered. Sarah provided 486 00:24:17,720 --> 00:24:20,280 Speaker 1: screenshots that showed she had placed the order on the 487 00:24:20,320 --> 00:24:25,080 Speaker 1: fifteenth of October, alongside unanswered follow up emails and Instagram 488 00:24:25,160 --> 00:24:28,840 Speaker 1: dms to Sabi and Seoul. After sharing the apparent receipts, 489 00:24:29,200 --> 00:24:32,159 Speaker 1: Sarah finished up by writing, so now I'm just like, 490 00:24:32,480 --> 00:24:36,639 Speaker 1: okay cool. Was that a scam or She then went 491 00:24:36,680 --> 00:24:39,119 Speaker 1: on to say it wasn't about the money, because she 492 00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:42,280 Speaker 1: is financially comfortable, but it's about the customers who saved 493 00:24:42,400 --> 00:24:45,880 Speaker 1: up their menial wages only to be scammed. She said, 494 00:24:45,960 --> 00:24:48,560 Speaker 1: I remember working in a fast food job getting paid 495 00:24:48,600 --> 00:24:51,280 Speaker 1: around twelve dollars an hour. If this happened to me, 496 00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:54,240 Speaker 1: I would have been so devastated that essentially a ten 497 00:24:54,320 --> 00:24:57,200 Speaker 1: hour shift had gone down the drain. Thank god, she's 498 00:24:57,200 --> 00:24:59,360 Speaker 1: looking up for the little guys, isn't it. She went 499 00:24:59,400 --> 00:25:01,800 Speaker 1: on to say. Anyway, I'm genuinely not doing this to 500 00:25:01,840 --> 00:25:04,720 Speaker 1: hate on that brand. I'm just sharing my frustration of 501 00:25:04,760 --> 00:25:08,119 Speaker 1: this brand's negligence and lack of customer care. I could 502 00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:12,280 Speaker 1: never imagine doing this to my ebook Activewear, Body Bloom, 503 00:25:12,320 --> 00:25:16,119 Speaker 1: First Protein Pity Party, or Butter Me Up customers. Humble 504 00:25:16,119 --> 00:25:18,960 Speaker 1: Brag I put so much effort, time and care into 505 00:25:19,000 --> 00:25:21,359 Speaker 1: customer service and the teams that run them on my 506 00:25:21,640 --> 00:25:24,720 Speaker 1: end that I simply cannot understand when a brand chooses 507 00:25:24,760 --> 00:25:28,600 Speaker 1: to go mia on emails dispatching, but yet continues to 508 00:25:28,600 --> 00:25:32,119 Speaker 1: take people's money with nothing in return. That's just fraud, 509 00:25:32,200 --> 00:25:32,720 Speaker 1: my friend. 510 00:25:32,960 --> 00:25:36,200 Speaker 2: I found it really amusing that Sarah had to itemize 511 00:25:36,240 --> 00:25:39,800 Speaker 2: each individual product she has sold with Trepeka and Lebang 512 00:25:39,880 --> 00:25:42,439 Speaker 2: to make herself sound more important. As you said, it 513 00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:45,080 Speaker 2: was a bit of a humble brag. It's a strange 514 00:25:45,119 --> 00:25:47,679 Speaker 2: flex though, because apart from her ebook, all of the 515 00:25:47,680 --> 00:25:50,800 Speaker 2: products that she listed are owned by separate businesses who 516 00:25:50,880 --> 00:25:53,320 Speaker 2: have their own customer service team, so she's got nothing 517 00:25:53,359 --> 00:25:54,520 Speaker 2: to do with that process. 518 00:25:54,880 --> 00:25:57,000 Speaker 4: And as for her ebook, the customer. 519 00:25:56,640 --> 00:25:59,399 Speaker 2: Service is taken care by the company that created it, 520 00:25:59,560 --> 00:26:03,919 Speaker 2: which is Hello Hello Studios. So a very strange brag. 521 00:26:04,160 --> 00:26:06,639 Speaker 1: And Sarah was quick to update her followers that she 522 00:26:06,760 --> 00:26:09,600 Speaker 1: wasn't the only one who had been scammed by Sabi 523 00:26:09,680 --> 00:26:12,840 Speaker 1: and Soul. She claimed that she had received over twenty 524 00:26:12,920 --> 00:26:16,560 Speaker 1: dms from her followers, claiming they had also fallen victim 525 00:26:16,680 --> 00:26:19,520 Speaker 1: to the small business. She ended up sharing three of 526 00:26:19,560 --> 00:26:22,000 Speaker 1: the dms she received. It is important to note that 527 00:26:22,040 --> 00:26:25,480 Speaker 1: she blurred out the senders identifying features. You could see 528 00:26:25,480 --> 00:26:28,480 Speaker 1: that Sarah had responded personally to their messages. One of 529 00:26:28,520 --> 00:26:31,040 Speaker 1: the messages said, I just ordered off them. I bought 530 00:26:31,080 --> 00:26:33,960 Speaker 1: some pillows intending to give them to my mum for Christmas. 531 00:26:34,280 --> 00:26:36,639 Speaker 1: I'm only thirteen and I worked for that money. 532 00:26:36,840 --> 00:26:40,080 Speaker 2: I think it was this screenshot which had people quite confused, 533 00:26:40,080 --> 00:26:41,920 Speaker 2: because they're like, how does a thirteen year old have 534 00:26:41,960 --> 00:26:44,159 Speaker 2: a debit card or access to PayPal? You've got to 535 00:26:44,200 --> 00:26:48,400 Speaker 2: be eighteen to have a PayPal account. And people started thinking, well, 536 00:26:48,440 --> 00:26:51,160 Speaker 2: maybe Sarah's Day Stands are just coming up with these 537 00:26:51,200 --> 00:26:54,320 Speaker 2: fake claims to actually talk to her, because she was 538 00:26:54,400 --> 00:26:58,960 Speaker 2: responding individually to these people's dms. Now, it wasn't long 539 00:26:59,040 --> 00:27:02,880 Speaker 2: until Sarah's Stands had flooded Sabi and Soul's Instagram account 540 00:27:02,880 --> 00:27:06,000 Speaker 2: with hate. There were negative comments on nearly every single 541 00:27:06,040 --> 00:27:09,160 Speaker 2: one of Sabi and Soul's posts, with people writing scam 542 00:27:09,280 --> 00:27:12,640 Speaker 2: or scammers, and people also began claiming that they had 543 00:27:12,680 --> 00:27:17,080 Speaker 2: experienced bad customer service too. Interestingly, the comment section was 544 00:27:17,119 --> 00:27:21,200 Speaker 2: a mix of Sarah's Stands and Sarah's Day haters. Now, 545 00:27:21,240 --> 00:27:23,760 Speaker 2: the owner of Sabian Stole went on the defense and 546 00:27:23,800 --> 00:27:26,960 Speaker 2: started responding to the hate. She wrote, if everyone from 547 00:27:27,000 --> 00:27:30,080 Speaker 2: Sarah's Day's followers could please cease messaging me while I 548 00:27:30,119 --> 00:27:32,879 Speaker 2: resolved this with Sarah. There has simply been a huge 549 00:27:32,920 --> 00:27:36,399 Speaker 2: misunderstanding here. I will explain more soon, but there is 550 00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:40,040 Speaker 2: no scam, just a genuine human error now. The business 551 00:27:40,040 --> 00:27:43,719 Speaker 2: went on to call Sarah's claims slanderous and misinformed. The 552 00:27:43,760 --> 00:27:46,800 Speaker 2: owner also hit back at people's claims of being scammed, 553 00:27:46,840 --> 00:27:51,080 Speaker 2: writing people are desperate for attention from influencers, unfortunately saying 554 00:27:51,240 --> 00:27:51,840 Speaker 2: me too. 555 00:27:52,280 --> 00:27:52,440 Speaker 6: Now. 556 00:27:52,440 --> 00:27:55,520 Speaker 2: The owner also challenged those claiming that they were scammed, 557 00:27:55,640 --> 00:27:59,199 Speaker 2: asking them to provide details around their identification so she 558 00:27:59,240 --> 00:28:02,600 Speaker 2: could look into the system. There was a particular person 559 00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:05,359 Speaker 2: from South Africa who was a nurse that she looked 560 00:28:05,440 --> 00:28:07,360 Speaker 2: up and said that there was no record of her 561 00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:10,000 Speaker 2: ever purchasing, so a lot of people were confused if 562 00:28:10,040 --> 00:28:13,280 Speaker 2: these were actual customers or just Sarah's stans trying to 563 00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:14,320 Speaker 2: get Sarah's attention. 564 00:28:15,119 --> 00:28:17,439 Speaker 1: The owner of Sabi and Soul also shared that it 565 00:28:17,480 --> 00:28:20,560 Speaker 1: stated on the Frequently Asked Questions page that as of 566 00:28:20,600 --> 00:28:24,000 Speaker 1: August twenty twenty, cushion inserts had to be purchased with 567 00:28:24,160 --> 00:28:27,760 Speaker 1: cushion covers, and those who purchased only inserts would have 568 00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:32,520 Speaker 1: their orders automatically canceled due to limited stock. Unfortunately, this 569 00:28:32,640 --> 00:28:36,359 Speaker 1: information was not available on the individual product page, but 570 00:28:36,640 --> 00:28:39,800 Speaker 1: was added the day Sarah called out the brand. Now, 571 00:28:39,920 --> 00:28:43,520 Speaker 1: seeing if Sarah only ordered pillow inserts, it appears her 572 00:28:43,640 --> 00:28:47,480 Speaker 1: order was automatically canceled the moment she placed it. However, 573 00:28:47,520 --> 00:28:50,160 Speaker 1: there weren't any follow up customer service emails to let 574 00:28:50,240 --> 00:28:53,000 Speaker 1: her know that this was the case, or any replies 575 00:28:53,040 --> 00:28:55,960 Speaker 1: to her follow up emails. After all of the backlash, 576 00:28:56,000 --> 00:28:59,640 Speaker 1: Sarah ended up deleting her Instagram stories and shared an update. 577 00:29:00,080 --> 00:29:03,120 Speaker 1: She wrote, Okay, I've written this post numerous times, but 578 00:29:03,240 --> 00:29:05,600 Speaker 1: let me get straight to the point. I've decided to 579 00:29:05,640 --> 00:29:08,560 Speaker 1: delete my previous stories about how money was taken out 580 00:29:08,600 --> 00:29:11,280 Speaker 1: of my account for a product I never received. I 581 00:29:11,360 --> 00:29:14,320 Speaker 1: made an online purchase for our homewares. I stand by 582 00:29:14,360 --> 00:29:17,040 Speaker 1: everything I said, and I don't want any other customers 583 00:29:17,080 --> 00:29:20,040 Speaker 1: falling victim to this. But I've seen the negativity it 584 00:29:20,080 --> 00:29:23,000 Speaker 1: has created on this brand's page and that doesn't sit 585 00:29:23,080 --> 00:29:25,280 Speaker 1: well with me. I just don't like that kind of 586 00:29:25,320 --> 00:29:29,480 Speaker 1: commenting and language. I value honesty, kindness, and compassion, and 587 00:29:29,520 --> 00:29:32,400 Speaker 1: I am now practicing the third. Yes, the money was 588 00:29:32,440 --> 00:29:35,360 Speaker 1: taken out of my account and the issue remains, but 589 00:29:35,440 --> 00:29:38,120 Speaker 1: I have this platform to promote kindness and love above 590 00:29:38,160 --> 00:29:41,720 Speaker 1: anything else. Yes, I feel a responsibility to spread awareness 591 00:29:41,720 --> 00:29:44,680 Speaker 1: and protect others from potentially having the same issues as me, 592 00:29:45,080 --> 00:29:48,040 Speaker 1: But I want to spread happiness even more. Anyway, It's 593 00:29:48,080 --> 00:29:51,080 Speaker 1: all good, guys. Let's just be good people. Research before 594 00:29:51,120 --> 00:29:53,960 Speaker 1: you purchase online, and don't leave hate comments no matter 595 00:29:54,000 --> 00:29:55,400 Speaker 1: what the circumstances. 596 00:29:55,680 --> 00:29:58,920 Speaker 2: Jeez, that's a very interesting update from Sarah. 597 00:29:59,040 --> 00:29:59,280 Speaker 4: Now. 598 00:29:59,320 --> 00:30:01,920 Speaker 2: We covered this story on our podcast at the time, 599 00:30:01,960 --> 00:30:04,200 Speaker 2: and we ended up following up with the owner of 600 00:30:04,240 --> 00:30:06,600 Speaker 2: Sabi and Sal to hear her side. 601 00:30:06,320 --> 00:30:07,000 Speaker 4: Of the story. 602 00:30:07,200 --> 00:30:09,800 Speaker 2: Now, she was willing to share a few details with us, 603 00:30:09,840 --> 00:30:13,080 Speaker 2: but she did say she was taking legal action against Sarah, 604 00:30:13,160 --> 00:30:16,320 Speaker 2: so couldn't say too much. She did share a screenshot 605 00:30:16,400 --> 00:30:18,400 Speaker 2: with us, though, which appeared to show that she had 606 00:30:18,440 --> 00:30:21,120 Speaker 2: given Sarah a refund on the day that Sarah had 607 00:30:21,160 --> 00:30:25,040 Speaker 2: purchased the pillow insert, which was on October fifteenth. Looking 608 00:30:25,080 --> 00:30:27,160 Speaker 2: back at this drama, it just shows how sure you 609 00:30:27,280 --> 00:30:30,360 Speaker 2: need to be as an influencer before you start calling 610 00:30:30,400 --> 00:30:33,400 Speaker 2: out a brand because there's no denying that the customer 611 00:30:33,440 --> 00:30:36,200 Speaker 2: service was very poor and the communication should have been 612 00:30:36,280 --> 00:30:39,600 Speaker 2: a lot better. However, the fact that Sarah had received 613 00:30:39,640 --> 00:30:42,880 Speaker 2: a refund immediately and didn't bother to check her account 614 00:30:42,920 --> 00:30:46,320 Speaker 2: before calling out the business publicly is really terrible, I know, 615 00:30:46,560 --> 00:30:49,880 Speaker 2: especially labeling the brand as a fraud and scammer. It's 616 00:30:50,000 --> 00:30:52,280 Speaker 2: just affametory and I'd love to know if the brand 617 00:30:52,400 --> 00:30:54,880 Speaker 2: ended up taking legal action against Sarah. 618 00:30:55,040 --> 00:30:57,680 Speaker 1: Yeah, particularly because at the time, Sarah had one point 619 00:30:57,720 --> 00:31:00,960 Speaker 1: one million followers on Instagram, and by sagging Sabi and 620 00:31:01,040 --> 00:31:03,520 Speaker 1: Soul in her stories and saying that she'd been scammed, 621 00:31:03,960 --> 00:31:07,400 Speaker 1: she literally directed one point one million people over to 622 00:31:07,440 --> 00:31:10,840 Speaker 1: their Instagram account as retribution. And she would have known, 623 00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:13,760 Speaker 1: as Stanz would cause drama and that's probably why she 624 00:31:13,920 --> 00:31:14,520 Speaker 1: tagged them. 625 00:31:14,720 --> 00:31:17,280 Speaker 2: Oh it's just crazy to think how much damage this 626 00:31:17,360 --> 00:31:20,720 Speaker 2: actually caused this small brand, And when you think about 627 00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:23,280 Speaker 2: the fact that Sarah's job is to influence people and 628 00:31:23,320 --> 00:31:27,320 Speaker 2: she literally sent people after this brand, it's really heartbreaking. 629 00:31:27,360 --> 00:31:29,280 Speaker 2: I mean, at the time, we were in the midst 630 00:31:29,280 --> 00:31:32,960 Speaker 2: of COVID, small businesses were really struggling to stay afloat, 631 00:31:33,160 --> 00:31:35,680 Speaker 2: and then something like this happens for this brand. It 632 00:31:35,720 --> 00:31:39,000 Speaker 2: appears that Sabi and Soul have sadly shut down, since 633 00:31:39,040 --> 00:31:42,479 Speaker 2: their Instagram page hasn't been updated since March twenty twenty, 634 00:31:42,800 --> 00:31:46,000 Speaker 2: and their online store no longer exists. This was a 635 00:31:46,080 --> 00:31:48,840 Speaker 2: one woman show that was trying to operate during COVID, 636 00:31:48,960 --> 00:31:51,080 Speaker 2: and from a PR perspective, it is just such a 637 00:31:51,120 --> 00:31:53,920 Speaker 2: shame that the owner didn't notice that Sarah had placed 638 00:31:53,920 --> 00:31:56,880 Speaker 2: an order, because it really could have been turned into 639 00:31:56,960 --> 00:32:00,000 Speaker 2: great brand exposure. A lot of people do follow Sarah 640 00:31:59,920 --> 00:32:00,680 Speaker 2: for her style. 641 00:32:01,000 --> 00:32:04,360 Speaker 1: Obviously she talks a lot about her home renovations, and 642 00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:06,640 Speaker 1: it could have been something where it could have kept 643 00:32:06,640 --> 00:32:08,960 Speaker 1: her business afloat and really got her name out there. 644 00:32:09,240 --> 00:32:12,120 Speaker 2: I do really question Sarah's claims that she was trying 645 00:32:12,120 --> 00:32:13,480 Speaker 2: to warn her followers. 646 00:32:13,880 --> 00:32:15,480 Speaker 4: Sarbi and Soul was a small. 647 00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:17,600 Speaker 2: Business, which we have mentioned several times. I mean, they 648 00:32:17,640 --> 00:32:21,320 Speaker 2: only had around two thousand followers on Instagram. It's not 649 00:32:21,440 --> 00:32:23,880 Speaker 2: this big business that a lot of people were going 650 00:32:23,880 --> 00:32:26,440 Speaker 2: to get scanned by. And I stand by what I 651 00:32:26,440 --> 00:32:28,600 Speaker 2: said back in the podcast in twenty twenty that I 652 00:32:28,640 --> 00:32:31,400 Speaker 2: think it was immature and reckless of Sarah to call 653 00:32:31,440 --> 00:32:32,960 Speaker 2: out the brand yeah. 654 00:32:32,760 --> 00:32:34,640 Speaker 1: And the owner of Sabi and Soeul they did share 655 00:32:34,680 --> 00:32:37,160 Speaker 1: with us back in twenty twenty that Sarah had purchased 656 00:32:37,160 --> 00:32:40,560 Speaker 1: the cushion inserts through PayPal, and PayPal is of course 657 00:32:40,600 --> 00:32:43,560 Speaker 1: renowned for its scam protection because there's a simple process 658 00:32:43,600 --> 00:32:45,240 Speaker 1: you can go through to get a refund. So I 659 00:32:45,240 --> 00:32:48,120 Speaker 1: don't understand why she didn't do that instead of publicly 660 00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:50,040 Speaker 1: slamming a small business during COVID. 661 00:32:50,160 --> 00:32:52,240 Speaker 2: I did have a laugh because I remember back in 662 00:32:52,320 --> 00:32:55,680 Speaker 2: twenty twenty that taddle Life suggested starting a go fund 663 00:32:55,720 --> 00:32:59,120 Speaker 2: Me page to help fund Sabi and sols legal claims 664 00:32:59,160 --> 00:33:00,320 Speaker 2: against Sarah. 665 00:33:00,480 --> 00:33:02,120 Speaker 4: I would love to know what happened. 666 00:33:02,160 --> 00:33:05,440 Speaker 2: If the owner of Sabian Soul is listening, please reach 667 00:33:05,440 --> 00:33:06,720 Speaker 2: out to us, so if anyone knows. 668 00:33:06,560 --> 00:33:08,200 Speaker 4: Any more about it, I would love to know. 669 00:33:09,120 --> 00:33:11,160 Speaker 1: How do you come back from the worst year of 670 00:33:11,200 --> 00:33:13,960 Speaker 1: your life when the brand you build has been battered 671 00:33:13,960 --> 00:33:17,040 Speaker 1: and your army of followers have turned to detractors. In 672 00:33:17,120 --> 00:33:21,080 Speaker 1: next week's final installment, we cover Sarah's attempt at a rebrand, 673 00:33:21,320 --> 00:33:24,440 Speaker 1: how the Wellness Warrior tried to evolve into a wholesome, 674 00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:28,720 Speaker 1: pilates loving mum with strong Christian roots with lucrative brand 675 00:33:28,720 --> 00:33:31,480 Speaker 1: deals to compete for, and a hungry community of new 676 00:33:31,560 --> 00:33:35,120 Speaker 1: mums yearning for connection. Mummy blogging is a high stakes 677 00:33:35,200 --> 00:33:38,600 Speaker 1: business venture, but what happens when your kids start becoming 678 00:33:38,640 --> 00:33:41,880 Speaker 1: content and a heartbreaking diagnosis makes. 679 00:33:41,680 --> 00:33:45,240 Speaker 2: You evaluate at all. That's on next week's final installment. 680 00:33:45,560 --> 00:33:48,560 Speaker 1: This podcast was recorded on the traditional land of the 681 00:33:48,560 --> 00:33:51,400 Speaker 1: Ganna people of the Adelaide Planes. We pay respect to 682 00:33:51,480 --> 00:33:54,760 Speaker 1: elders past and present. If you are enjoying this series 683 00:33:54,760 --> 00:33:56,920 Speaker 1: on Outspoken Plus, we would love to see you post 684 00:33:56,960 --> 00:34:01,320 Speaker 1: it on your Instagram story.