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Speaker 1: And joining me in the studio right now from the

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Speaker 1: union which represents our retail workers, the SDA secretary, Josh Pete.

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Speaker 1: Good morning to.

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Speaker 2: You, Josh, good Akatie. Great to be here, and good

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Speaker 2: morning to all of your listeners as well.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, good to have you on the show again. And

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Speaker 1: what a good time to have you here, because there

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Speaker 1: is quite a bit going on in Catherine at the

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Speaker 1: moment and the fact that Woolies in Catherine has been

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Speaker 1: well on a number of occasions deemed a close contact spot.

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Speaker 1: Have you been in contact with those workers from the

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Speaker 1: Woolies and various other retail outlets in Katherine and how

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Speaker 1: are they going at the moment.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, Look, we're been in close contact with our members

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Speaker 2: in Catherine but also Wilworth as well as the government

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Speaker 2: to really try to map through this has been an

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Speaker 2: incredibly stressful time. Good news today is that the store

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Speaker 2: has resumed normal trading hours, which is great. We've got

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Speaker 2: a lot of test results back and a lot of

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Speaker 2: negative test results meaning that a lot of workers are

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Speaker 2: able to return to their usual hours. But lord, it

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Speaker 2: has been pretty difficult time, and I mean I think

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Speaker 2: it just reiterates once again the work that a supermarket

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Speaker 2: worker does is absolutely essential to our society functioning. Catherine

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Speaker 2: can't eat left unless that store is open and trading properly.

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Speaker 2: So it really has again demonstrated the essential work that

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Speaker 2: those those workers do. It's been a very difficult couple

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Speaker 2: of weeks and COVID. Whenever we have some kind of

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Speaker 2: COVID exposure, it's retail out outlets that are always amongst

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Speaker 2: the cod COVID exposure sites, and it's incredibly difficult for

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Speaker 2: those workers knowing that COVID's potentially been getting walked into

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Speaker 2: their supermarket and then workplace.

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Speaker 1: And it would be so tough, particularly and Catherine right

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Speaker 1: now when it has been deemed an exposure site on

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Speaker 1: numerous occasions and then meaning that those Woolies employees for example,

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Speaker 1: having to go and get tested I'm assuming a couple

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Speaker 1: of times, or has it just sort of been the

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Speaker 1: once and then making sure that they're isolating.

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Speaker 2: So each time there's an exposure, which i think is

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Speaker 2: now seven times in that store there's been an exposure time,

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Speaker 2: all of the staff that are working at that particular

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Speaker 2: time need to then go into ice isolation and away

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Speaker 2: a negative result. So if you're someone who happens to

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Speaker 2: have been at one of the previous exposures, then come

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Speaker 2: out being tested, then been there again at a second

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Speaker 2: time when there's been a further exposure, then you would

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Speaker 2: have been required to have a couple of tests for

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Speaker 2: each exposure. But if you are only working that particular

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Speaker 2: one shift when the exposure occurred, so everyone's going to

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Speaker 2: have a different experience. But as multiple exposures occurred, it

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Speaker 2: effectively knocked out different shifts of workers and got the

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Speaker 2: store to a point where it wasn't able to trade.

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Speaker 2: We were looking at whether it wasn't able to trade

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Speaker 2: its full hours. We were looking at whether it was

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Speaker 2: possible to bring workers down to Darwin. We tried to

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Speaker 2: then navigate away from that because if workers were having

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Speaker 2: to go into Catherine from Darwin and effectively then come

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Speaker 2: out of the Catherine bubble, that have to then go

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Speaker 2: into isolation here. So we didn't want to see that happen.

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Speaker 2: I think we've managed to avoid it, which is great news.

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Speaker 2: We've had some workers do some really extraordinary hours, and

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Speaker 2: I think the other thing that's really bothering us at

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Speaker 2: the moment is that, and it's just a reminder to

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Speaker 2: the community. We know that COVID brings along anxiety. It's

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Speaker 2: already a stressful time in the lead in the lead

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Speaker 2: up to Christmas. But if you are feeling anxious, there's

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Speaker 2: absolutely no excuse to abuse a retail worker. And so

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Speaker 2: when you are shopping, if you are in Catherine and

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Speaker 2: you're seeing those Woolies workers, even if you're feeling anxious,

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Speaker 2: the best thing you can do is say thank you

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Speaker 2: to them for their service over the last couple of

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Speaker 2: weeks going to work, not being able to stay at home,

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Speaker 2: having to continue to rock up to work each day

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Speaker 2: amidst all this anxiety. It is really important that we

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Speaker 2: spare a thought for our retil workers that have been putting.

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Speaker 3: Up with so much.

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Speaker 1: Do you think to yourself, you may be feeling anxious

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Speaker 1: as a customer, Imagine how those staff are feeling when

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Speaker 1: they're being exposed to this. They've literally had a situation

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Speaker 1: where seven times I believe wool Works was announced as

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Speaker 1: an exposure site. You cannot treat people that way. You

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Speaker 1: cannot take your anxiety out on others regularly, those who

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Speaker 1: are on the front line working and making sure that

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Speaker 1: you're able to get in there and get your growth race.

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Speaker 2: Look retail workers have put up with a lot over

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Speaker 2: the last eighteen months, and to think that it's their

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Speaker 2: workplace that is having COVID walked in walked into it randomly.

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Speaker 2: We don't know by who, We don't know when, we

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Speaker 2: don't you know, you can't predict that it's going to occur.

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Speaker 2: It's just it is nerve wracking for them. It's nerve wracking.

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Speaker 2: Then they're going into isolation, having to test for those

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Speaker 2: that aren't. They're having to put up with all the

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Speaker 2: additional workload. We've got workers pulling double shifts, you know,

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Speaker 2: under extreme pressure. It's just so important that we treat

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Speaker 2: these workers with respect too. As I said before, Katie

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Speaker 2: Catherine doesn't eat without those workers. Going to work and

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Speaker 2: getting supplied is such an important job that they're doing

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Speaker 2: in the midst of this pandemic. We need to be

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Speaker 2: thanking them, not making their lives even harder.

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Speaker 1: Now, speaking of life being hard for some of our

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Speaker 1: retail workers, we learned yesterday that it's a situation inside

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Speaker 1: Casuarina Shopping Center where there was a young person allegedly

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Speaker 1: with a knife with an aged weapon. I believe the

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Speaker 1: Northern Territory Police described it as who threatened a worker

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Speaker 1: inside a shop and a customer then had to try

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Speaker 1: to help that worker inside the shop. Do you have

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Speaker 1: much further detail on what's happened and whether the worker

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Speaker 1: inside that retail story is okay.

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Speaker 3: Look, it's a really shocking incident.

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Speaker 2: And actually we had SDA organizers visiting Casarina at that

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Speaker 2: exact time, and we're there at the scene of the

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Speaker 2: incident moments after it had occurred, and the customer was

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Speaker 2: actually cut and during during the incident's well, so, I

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Speaker 2: mean that customer was, you know, just did such a

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Speaker 2: good thing standing up for that for that worker who

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Speaker 2: was put in an incredibly dangerous sit situation. We understand

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Speaker 2: the police are obviously doing their their their investigation, so

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Speaker 2: we don't want to prejudice anything there, but look, it

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Speaker 2: just reminds us again that retail workers are on the

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Speaker 2: front line. They put up with some extraordinary situations. You know,

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Speaker 2: we've been calling for greater protections at Casorina for some

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Speaker 2: for some time and increased police presence in that center

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Speaker 2: because unfortunately, it is something that you know, we don't

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Speaker 2: see violence with a knife or edged instrument very often,

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Speaker 2: but we do know that there are incidents that occurred

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Speaker 2: daily in that shopping center. Of the security under enormous

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Speaker 2: pressure as well, we do think there can be some

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Speaker 2: more that can can be done to protect workers.

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Speaker 3: It is a just we're in the lead, we're in

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Speaker 3: the lead up to Christmas.

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Speaker 2: We've already talked about addition weighing anxiety amongst the community.

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Speaker 2: But to see violent incidents like this is true, truly shocking.

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Speaker 2: And you know, the union's been been running a campaign

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Speaker 2: against customer of it's an abuse for some time because

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Speaker 2: it is just something that retail workers put up with

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Speaker 2: far too often.

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Speaker 1: Well, and this is bloody scary. You know, you're talking

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Speaker 1: about a store where there are often a lot of

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Speaker 1: young women in there, a lot of young people in there.

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Speaker 1: I think it's quite heroic the fact that there was

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Speaker 1: a customer in there who then tried to assist in

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Speaker 1: this situation, and you said that person received a cut.

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Speaker 3: That's our understanding here, which is very frightening.

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Speaker 1: But I'm interested then to hear that you'd said as well,

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Speaker 1: there does need to be greater protections for the staff.

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Speaker 1: They're at Casarina. How often are we seeing different incidents

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Speaker 1: for some of those different shops inside the shopping center. Well.

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Speaker 3: Look, customer violence and abuse is a huge, huge ISSHU.

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Speaker 2: Our national survey indicates about eighty five percent of our

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Speaker 2: members are abused or assaulted on the job each year,

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Speaker 2: so it's an extremely big problem. Finding a solution is difficult.

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Speaker 2: Add to this, because shops are open, right, that's how

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Speaker 2: they work. We can't control necessarily who's walking into shopping centers.

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Speaker 2: We have looked at whether we can pursue changes to

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Speaker 2: trespass law, for example, to give the greater protections. We've

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Speaker 2: only got a twenty four hour ban process that occurs

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Speaker 2: in the Northern Territory, whereas liquor banding orders for example,

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Speaker 2: are a lot stronger than that. But again it's then

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Speaker 2: working out of raging that can actually be policed, but

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Speaker 2: then also has fairness as well. So finding solutions to

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Speaker 2: this problem are very difficult. We've looked at the examples

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Speaker 2: out of Europe where there's stronger penalties in place for

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Speaker 2: workers that are assaulted, and one of the things we've

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Speaker 2: been calling for for some time is creating an essential

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Speaker 2: status for retail workers to give them greater protection. So

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Speaker 2: there's certainly are policy solutions here, but in many cases

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Speaker 2: it really just does come down to a risk assessment

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Speaker 2: in that workplace as to what's necessary, and ultimately there

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Speaker 2: is a requirement on the shopping center owner as well

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Speaker 2: if they do believe there is a risk, which I

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Speaker 2: think you know often there can be, that they do

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Speaker 2: ensure there's appropriate security on and they work closely with

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Speaker 2: police to make sure that their support. Ultimately, the employer

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Speaker 2: is the one that's responsible for providing the safe workplace,

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Speaker 2: but it's very difficult sometimes when you're in one of

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Speaker 2: these shopping centers and they're so open the way they are.

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Speaker 2: So we just are constantly engaging with both the employer

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Speaker 2: and also the shopping center to make sure the protections

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Speaker 2: are in place.

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Speaker 1: And our members concerned. Have you got have you got

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Speaker 1: members that work at the shops here in Darwin who

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Speaker 1: are quite concerned about that situation?

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Speaker 2: Absolutely, And we've run a number of campaigns at Casuarina

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Speaker 2: before and you know, we used to have a police

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Speaker 2: shop front there that was them removed and there's a

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Speaker 2: whole bunch of stuff that we've been campaigning on at

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Speaker 2: the casual and shopping center for some time, and particularly

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Speaker 2: the car park around it is as as as well

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Speaker 2: to protect workers not only whilst they're working, but also

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Speaker 2: when they're leaving after hours and walking to their cars.

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Speaker 2: So you know, we certainly believe that the to be

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Speaker 2: great greater protections. It's just getting that policy balance from it.

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Speaker 1: And it must be tough, I would imagine for the

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Speaker 1: shopping center as well, because there is you know, like

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Speaker 1: while you can have security on there and try your

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Speaker 1: best to make sure that all those different shops and

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Speaker 1: everybody inside is kept safe, you know, it's it is

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Speaker 1: difficult to have, you know, to have the right number

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Speaker 1: of security staff there, I'm assuming, and some of that

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Speaker 1: work needs to be done by other authorities.

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Speaker 3: Absolutely.

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Speaker 2: I mean security guards I only have certain powers. I

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Speaker 2: mean they're not police, and we do need to make

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Speaker 2: sure there's appropriate police presence at Kazurin a shopping center

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Speaker 2: and the other major shopping centers across Darwin to ensure

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Speaker 2: that workers are safe and feel safe, but also to

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Speaker 2: send a message to people who are going in there

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Speaker 2: to do the wrong thing. I mean, let's understand this.

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Speaker 2: You walk into a shop with a knife, You're going

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Speaker 2: in there through the wrong thing, you know, and being

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Speaker 2: able to identify who that person is beforehand is pretty difficult.

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Speaker 2: But if there's additional police presence, if there's security presence,

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Speaker 2: people are going to hopefully think twice before going in

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Speaker 2: and doing carrying on in such an appalling way.

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Speaker 3: Now, Josh, before I.

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Speaker 1: Let you go, we know that there is an announcement

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Speaker 1: that the government has made today that Boxing Day, So

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Speaker 1: Sunday the twenty sixth is going to be recognized as

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Speaker 1: a public holiday. So it also means though that obviously

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Speaker 1: the twenty eighth is going to be recognized, So it

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Speaker 1: means essentially there's going to be an additional public holiday.

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Speaker 1: I know that this will be something that a lot

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Speaker 1: of workers are incredibly happy about. A lot of businesses

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Speaker 1: may be feeling a little bit worried about the additional

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Speaker 1: costs and maybe choosing to not open as a result.

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Speaker 2: Well, look, Boxing Day itself is an incredibly busy trading

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Speaker 2: day in the retail sector. I don't think we'll see

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Speaker 2: retail stores not open on Boxing Day because of the

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Speaker 2: public holiday being declared. Prior to today's announcement, the Territory was

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Speaker 2: the only place in mainland Australia where the twenty sixth

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Speaker 2: of December was not a public holiday. Every other jurisdiction

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Speaker 2: has both days, Sunday and the Tuesday. We've been calling

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Speaker 2: for some time for the entire Public Holidays Acts to

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Speaker 2: be fixed to resolve this problem going forward, and so

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Speaker 2: we can insure businesses have certainty the next time this occurs,

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Speaker 2: so that they know what's going to be our public holiday.

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Speaker 2: But it is good news that those workers, well, one,

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Speaker 2: if they are working the day after Christmas, an incredibly

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Speaker 2: busy time, you know, missing out on that time with

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Speaker 2: family and friends, that they are going to work the

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Speaker 2: day after Christmas, they will wear in public holiday penalty rates.

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Speaker 2: Many of them under our agreements will also have the

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Speaker 2: right to not work as well. There's a voluntary work

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Speaker 2: provision in most of our agreements for public holidays, so

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Speaker 2: that will give a lot of workers the opportunity to

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Speaker 2: have the day off. But it's not just retail CADI.

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Speaker 2: It's right across industries. So whether it be disability care

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Speaker 2: workers going to work to care for our disabled, whether

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Speaker 2: we work is in our hospital or our emergency serve services,

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Speaker 2: they will now be getting public holiday penalty rates on

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Speaker 2: Boxing Day, and that's a really good thing. Let's think

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Speaker 2: about who the people are that are working Boxing day,

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Speaker 2: and it sort of goes back to what we're saying

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Speaker 2: at the very start of this.

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Speaker 3: They are our essential workers.

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Speaker 2: They're the workers that have kept the territory going over

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Speaker 2: the last eighteen months throughout lockdowns.

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Speaker 3: They're the ones that are rocked up to work.

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Speaker 2: To think they would be going to be going to

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Speaker 2: be going to work on the day after Christmas and

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Speaker 2: not earning and public holiday penalty rates, I think was

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Speaker 2: a big, big problem, and we're incredibly pleased that the

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Speaker 2: Gunner government has recognized the central role they play and

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Speaker 2: done the right thing here.

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Speaker 1: Well, Josh Peek, the Workers Union, the SDA, the union

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Speaker 1: for our retail workers Secretary, I really appreciate your time

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Speaker 1: this morning. Thanks so much for coming on.

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Speaker 3: Thanks Catie, great to be here.