1 00:00:02,680 --> 00:00:05,000 Speaker 1: My name is Lily Maddon and I'm a proud Arunda 2 00:00:05,200 --> 00:00:10,000 Speaker 1: Bunjelung Calcuttin woman from Gadighal Country. The Daily oz acknowledges 3 00:00:10,080 --> 00:00:12,280 Speaker 1: that this podcast is recorded on the lands of the 4 00:00:12,280 --> 00:00:15,840 Speaker 1: Gadighl people and pays respect to all Aboriginal and Torres 5 00:00:15,840 --> 00:00:18,759 Speaker 1: Strait Island and nations. We pay our respects to the 6 00:00:18,800 --> 00:00:21,560 Speaker 1: first peoples of these countries, both past and present. 7 00:00:25,520 --> 00:00:28,320 Speaker 2: Good morning and welcome to the Daily os. It's Wednesday, 8 00:00:28,360 --> 00:00:29,440 Speaker 2: the sixth of December. 9 00:00:29,600 --> 00:00:30,720 Speaker 3: I'm Zara, I'm Sam. 10 00:00:30,800 --> 00:00:33,840 Speaker 2: Coles and Woolies are set to front a Senate inquiry 11 00:00:33,960 --> 00:00:37,400 Speaker 2: over allegations they might be overcharging their customers. 12 00:00:37,560 --> 00:00:40,960 Speaker 4: Coles and Woolworths will be grilled via Senate inquiry to 13 00:00:41,080 --> 00:00:44,280 Speaker 4: investigate their market power and pricing decisions. 14 00:00:44,320 --> 00:00:47,319 Speaker 2: So what exactly are the supermarkets accused of and how 15 00:00:47,360 --> 00:00:51,840 Speaker 2: does this story play out against a backdrop of record profits. Well, 16 00:00:51,920 --> 00:00:53,840 Speaker 2: we'll tell you what you need to know in today's 17 00:00:53,840 --> 00:00:56,160 Speaker 2: deep dive. But first Sam the headlines. 18 00:00:56,800 --> 00:01:01,200 Speaker 3: Victoria Police have confirmed a third recently released immigration detainee 19 00:01:01,240 --> 00:01:04,200 Speaker 3: has been arrested. The thirty three year old failed to 20 00:01:04,240 --> 00:01:07,240 Speaker 3: regularly report to police, which he is required to do 21 00:01:07,360 --> 00:01:10,680 Speaker 3: as a registered sex offender. The High Court of Australia 22 00:01:10,760 --> 00:01:15,360 Speaker 3: ruled that indefinite immigration detention was unlawful in November, prompting 23 00:01:15,400 --> 00:01:19,119 Speaker 3: the release of over one hundred and forty detainees. This week, 24 00:01:19,200 --> 00:01:22,760 Speaker 3: Border Force officials said a recently released detainee was arrested 25 00:01:22,760 --> 00:01:25,520 Speaker 3: in New South Wales over drug possession, while a third 26 00:01:25,520 --> 00:01:28,560 Speaker 3: person was charged with indecent assault in South Australia. 27 00:01:29,280 --> 00:01:33,120 Speaker 2: Australian universities have been accused of underpaying staff one hundred 28 00:01:33,120 --> 00:01:36,120 Speaker 2: and fifty nine million dollars. A new report from the 29 00:01:36,200 --> 00:01:40,200 Speaker 2: National Tertiary Education Union claims the University of Melbourne has 30 00:01:40,280 --> 00:01:44,280 Speaker 2: underpaid over thirty thousand employees a total of forty five 31 00:01:44,360 --> 00:01:48,720 Speaker 2: million dollars. The University of Wollongong totaled eighteen million dollars 32 00:01:48,760 --> 00:01:51,600 Speaker 2: in alleged wage theft, while the union said that the 33 00:01:51,720 --> 00:01:55,280 Speaker 2: University of Sydney owed staff fourteen point six million dollars. 34 00:01:55,360 --> 00:01:58,760 Speaker 2: It's at almost one hundred thousand university employees are owed money, 35 00:01:58,800 --> 00:02:01,400 Speaker 2: with further reviews of uns university wages to come. 36 00:02:01,880 --> 00:02:05,040 Speaker 3: Global carbon emissions from fossil fuels have risen to record 37 00:02:05,240 --> 00:02:08,560 Speaker 3: levels in twenty twenty three. That's according to the latest 38 00:02:08,639 --> 00:02:12,960 Speaker 3: Global Carbon Budget report. The report said Earth's carbon emissions 39 00:02:12,960 --> 00:02:17,519 Speaker 3: will exceed forty billion tons this year. Emissions are projected 40 00:02:17,520 --> 00:02:21,000 Speaker 3: to increase significantly in India and China, the countries with 41 00:02:21,080 --> 00:02:23,000 Speaker 3: the world's largest populations. 42 00:02:23,320 --> 00:02:26,240 Speaker 2: And the good news, the oldest living land animal has 43 00:02:26,280 --> 00:02:29,480 Speaker 2: turned one hundred and ninety one years old. Jonathan the 44 00:02:29,520 --> 00:02:32,799 Speaker 2: tortoise is believed to have been born around eighteen thirty two, 45 00:02:32,919 --> 00:02:36,360 Speaker 2: based on conservative estimates, meaning that he could be even 46 00:02:36,360 --> 00:02:40,359 Speaker 2: older the average life expectancy for giant tortoises. Like Jonathan, 47 00:02:40,360 --> 00:02:42,840 Speaker 2: he's over one hundred years, although he can no longer 48 00:02:42,880 --> 00:02:45,600 Speaker 2: smell or see. He lives on a South Atlantic island 49 00:02:45,639 --> 00:02:48,720 Speaker 2: with three other giant tortoises, Emma, David and fred. 50 00:02:52,240 --> 00:02:52,320 Speaker 4: So. 51 00:02:52,440 --> 00:02:55,520 Speaker 2: This week it was announced that Coles and Woolies, our 52 00:02:55,560 --> 00:02:59,680 Speaker 2: biggest supermarkets, will front a Senate inquiry into claims that 53 00:02:59,720 --> 00:03:03,840 Speaker 2: they are overcharging customers during a cost of living crisis. 54 00:03:04,480 --> 00:03:07,359 Speaker 2: That I should add is an accusation that both retailers 55 00:03:07,400 --> 00:03:08,320 Speaker 2: have rejected. 56 00:03:08,480 --> 00:03:10,760 Speaker 3: And before we start wandering down the aisles and looking 57 00:03:10,840 --> 00:03:13,040 Speaker 3: at the prices of the goods that we like to 58 00:03:13,080 --> 00:03:16,240 Speaker 3: buy every day, why don't we start with what. 59 00:03:16,360 --> 00:03:20,520 Speaker 2: Started so strong with that analysis just and so far 60 00:03:20,600 --> 00:03:22,560 Speaker 2: away from where you need it to be. But what 61 00:03:22,639 --> 00:03:23,160 Speaker 2: was your question? 62 00:03:23,360 --> 00:03:26,280 Speaker 3: Well, my question was, can we start with the Senate 63 00:03:26,320 --> 00:03:29,320 Speaker 3: inquiry as an idea? What exactly does that mean? 64 00:03:29,560 --> 00:03:32,680 Speaker 2: Essentially, at a high level, all a Senate inquiry is 65 00:03:32,680 --> 00:03:36,200 Speaker 2: is the opportunity for Senators to ask public officials, ask 66 00:03:36,280 --> 00:03:39,320 Speaker 2: people that are running these big companies or whoever they 67 00:03:39,360 --> 00:03:43,120 Speaker 2: are inquiring into some tough questions. So in this case, 68 00:03:43,200 --> 00:03:45,920 Speaker 2: there is a Senate inquiry into how Coals and will 69 00:03:45,960 --> 00:03:49,040 Speaker 2: Lease are setting their prices, what is happening there, and 70 00:03:49,080 --> 00:03:52,000 Speaker 2: how that's all happening amid a cost of living crisis. 71 00:03:52,160 --> 00:03:54,000 Speaker 2: That's all we're really talking about when we talk about 72 00:03:54,000 --> 00:03:54,880 Speaker 2: a Senate inquiry. 73 00:03:54,960 --> 00:03:57,640 Speaker 3: So what's happened here so that Cols and Willworth have 74 00:03:57,680 --> 00:03:59,240 Speaker 3: landed up in a Senate inquiry? 75 00:03:59,800 --> 00:04:03,440 Speaker 2: The Greens were the party that led the call for 76 00:04:03,680 --> 00:04:07,320 Speaker 2: this Senate inquiry, And essentially what they're accusing Coals and 77 00:04:07,320 --> 00:04:10,520 Speaker 2: Woolies of is setting these really really high prices for 78 00:04:10,600 --> 00:04:13,920 Speaker 2: food and drink and whatever else, which anytime you go, yeah, 79 00:04:13,960 --> 00:04:16,520 Speaker 2: you go to the grocery shop, whatever your grocery shop 80 00:04:16,720 --> 00:04:19,240 Speaker 2: was two years ago or a year ago, it's very 81 00:04:19,279 --> 00:04:22,760 Speaker 2: different picture today. What the Greens are saying is essentially 82 00:04:22,760 --> 00:04:27,479 Speaker 2: that this could be on purpose for profits purpose, and 83 00:04:27,560 --> 00:04:29,640 Speaker 2: so they want to inquire into how this has happened, 84 00:04:29,640 --> 00:04:30,880 Speaker 2: what has actually happened. 85 00:04:31,000 --> 00:04:32,719 Speaker 3: But of course this is all against the backdrop of 86 00:04:32,760 --> 00:04:33,919 Speaker 3: inflation though, right. 87 00:04:33,800 --> 00:04:36,440 Speaker 2: Yeah, So that's part of what the inquiry wants to 88 00:04:36,480 --> 00:04:40,360 Speaker 2: look at, because Colson will was would naturally just default 89 00:04:40,360 --> 00:04:42,480 Speaker 2: to the fact that, you know, we are seeing high 90 00:04:42,560 --> 00:04:47,760 Speaker 2: inflation everywhere. According to the latest data, rising prices or 91 00:04:47,800 --> 00:04:51,800 Speaker 2: inflation increased overall by four point nine percent between October 92 00:04:52,160 --> 00:04:55,520 Speaker 2: of last year and this year. Food and drink rose 93 00:04:55,600 --> 00:04:58,640 Speaker 2: five point three percent during that time, so actually rose 94 00:04:58,680 --> 00:05:01,279 Speaker 2: by more. That was down from a peak of nine 95 00:05:01,320 --> 00:05:04,440 Speaker 2: point six percent in September twenty twenty two. Those so, 96 00:05:05,040 --> 00:05:07,840 Speaker 2: despite easing from that twenty twenty two peak, food inflation 97 00:05:08,000 --> 00:05:11,400 Speaker 2: is still higher than overall inflation. On this Coals and 98 00:05:11,400 --> 00:05:14,039 Speaker 2: Woollies have said that everything along the supply chain is 99 00:05:14,040 --> 00:05:16,280 Speaker 2: more expensive than it used to be and that that 100 00:05:16,440 --> 00:05:19,560 Speaker 2: is being passed on to higher costs of groceries and 101 00:05:19,640 --> 00:05:21,960 Speaker 2: therefore we are paying more. That's what they say. 102 00:05:22,160 --> 00:05:23,880 Speaker 3: I think that's a really interesting point to sit on. 103 00:05:23,880 --> 00:05:25,920 Speaker 3: There and I was talking to Chloe, one of our 104 00:05:25,960 --> 00:05:28,800 Speaker 3: journalists in the newsroom about this that if inflation is 105 00:05:28,839 --> 00:05:31,400 Speaker 3: impacting the economy, then farmers are feeling it, and then 106 00:05:32,120 --> 00:05:34,320 Speaker 3: the wholesalers are feeling it, and then the retailers are 107 00:05:34,360 --> 00:05:36,400 Speaker 3: feeling it, and then where as the consumers are feeling it, 108 00:05:36,839 --> 00:05:39,479 Speaker 3: but everywhere along that supply chain. When you talked about 109 00:05:39,480 --> 00:05:41,760 Speaker 3: supply chain, it's really a really interesting point. 110 00:05:41,880 --> 00:05:46,200 Speaker 2: Sure, And on that the Farmers Federation, so the group 111 00:05:46,240 --> 00:05:50,560 Speaker 2: that's representing farmers' interests, has said that Coals and Woolworths 112 00:05:50,600 --> 00:05:54,920 Speaker 2: aren't being transparent about their supply chain costs because they 113 00:05:54,960 --> 00:05:56,960 Speaker 2: say that the gap between what they're paid to grow 114 00:05:57,000 --> 00:05:59,400 Speaker 2: crops and what we are going and paying at the 115 00:05:59,400 --> 00:06:03,560 Speaker 2: supermarket is, in their words, shrouded in secrecy. So it 116 00:06:03,600 --> 00:06:06,960 Speaker 2: appears that not every step of that supply chain seems 117 00:06:07,000 --> 00:06:10,039 Speaker 2: to be in lockstep about how prices are being set 118 00:06:10,120 --> 00:06:13,520 Speaker 2: and what's actually happening along the way. The other issue 119 00:06:13,920 --> 00:06:17,360 Speaker 2: that the Greens have identified, and again they're the ones 120 00:06:17,360 --> 00:06:20,360 Speaker 2: that have called for this Senate inquiry, is the fact 121 00:06:20,400 --> 00:06:23,440 Speaker 2: that while ossies are paying more for their food at 122 00:06:23,480 --> 00:06:29,560 Speaker 2: the supermarket, Coals and Woolworths are making record profits. It's 123 00:06:29,600 --> 00:06:32,039 Speaker 2: something that we've reported on a fair bit this year. 124 00:06:32,080 --> 00:06:34,960 Speaker 2: It seems to be this incongruence between a cost of 125 00:06:35,000 --> 00:06:38,039 Speaker 2: living crisis and these record profits. So, just to paint 126 00:06:38,080 --> 00:06:40,360 Speaker 2: a bit of a picture, for the last financial year 127 00:06:40,480 --> 00:06:43,520 Speaker 2: after tax, Coals made one point one billion dollars and 128 00:06:43,640 --> 00:06:46,960 Speaker 2: wool Is raked in one point six two billion dollars. 129 00:06:47,600 --> 00:06:51,320 Speaker 2: And so the Green Senator Nick McKim, who announced the 130 00:06:51,360 --> 00:06:54,840 Speaker 2: preparations for the inquiry, said, quote Coals and Woolworths are 131 00:06:54,839 --> 00:06:57,680 Speaker 2: making billions because they feel that they can overcharge people 132 00:06:57,680 --> 00:07:01,080 Speaker 2: without repercussions. We want to see is to justify their 133 00:07:01,120 --> 00:07:02,839 Speaker 2: decisions in a public hearing. 134 00:07:03,240 --> 00:07:05,240 Speaker 3: And that is part of the dynamic of being a 135 00:07:05,240 --> 00:07:08,240 Speaker 3: private company is that they're trying to make profits for 136 00:07:08,279 --> 00:07:11,960 Speaker 3: their shareholders and they don't have you know, it's not 137 00:07:12,000 --> 00:07:15,360 Speaker 3: like a public utility where it's tightly controlled by the government. 138 00:07:15,400 --> 00:07:16,760 Speaker 3: They can set their own prices. 139 00:07:17,040 --> 00:07:20,840 Speaker 2: But I mean to counter that cosenwooll Was together make 140 00:07:20,960 --> 00:07:25,160 Speaker 2: up two thirds of the country's entire supermarket industry. So 141 00:07:25,280 --> 00:07:28,120 Speaker 2: it goes to very important questions I think about like 142 00:07:28,200 --> 00:07:30,400 Speaker 2: a duopoly and about what happens when there's a lot 143 00:07:30,400 --> 00:07:34,160 Speaker 2: of power concentrated in one space, and the fact that 144 00:07:34,520 --> 00:07:37,160 Speaker 2: you know, perhaps there aren't many other competitors or there 145 00:07:37,160 --> 00:07:40,360 Speaker 2: aren't any other options for Aussies who can't afford to 146 00:07:40,400 --> 00:07:42,600 Speaker 2: be paying these prices but have nowhere else to turn. 147 00:07:42,680 --> 00:07:44,280 Speaker 3: And I think that's you've hit the nail on the 148 00:07:44,320 --> 00:07:47,240 Speaker 3: head there, that we're talking about essential food and we're 149 00:07:47,240 --> 00:07:49,560 Speaker 3: talking about something that we all need, especially you know, 150 00:07:49,960 --> 00:07:52,040 Speaker 3: Sarah Hanson Young talked about the importance of it this 151 00:07:52,080 --> 00:07:52,840 Speaker 3: time of year. 152 00:07:52,760 --> 00:07:54,720 Speaker 4: So you know, cost of living is going through the 153 00:07:54,800 --> 00:07:57,840 Speaker 4: roof right now. People are finding it really tough, and 154 00:07:57,840 --> 00:07:59,520 Speaker 4: in the lead up to Christmas, I think people are 155 00:07:59,520 --> 00:08:03,640 Speaker 4: feeling that more than ever, the cost of people's supermarket 156 00:08:03,680 --> 00:08:06,560 Speaker 4: trolley at the end of the week is becoming a 157 00:08:06,640 --> 00:08:09,080 Speaker 4: really hard thing to bear week in, week out. 158 00:08:09,280 --> 00:08:11,360 Speaker 3: So in light of all of that, what is exactly 159 00:08:11,760 --> 00:08:13,600 Speaker 3: going to be the focus of the inquiry. 160 00:08:13,680 --> 00:08:15,680 Speaker 2: The Greens have sat out a number of priorities that 161 00:08:15,720 --> 00:08:19,440 Speaker 2: they want this inquiry to look at, so it'll examine 162 00:08:19,440 --> 00:08:23,520 Speaker 2: things like whether advertised discounts are actually discount. 163 00:08:23,120 --> 00:08:25,920 Speaker 3: We've seen some stuff in the comments sections around members discounts. 164 00:08:25,960 --> 00:08:27,480 Speaker 3: It's really interesting. 165 00:08:27,280 --> 00:08:30,520 Speaker 2: And we've already mentioned the high profits posted by the supermarkets, 166 00:08:30,560 --> 00:08:32,959 Speaker 2: so that will be something and the main other thing 167 00:08:33,080 --> 00:08:35,600 Speaker 2: the inquiry will look at is whether Colson Woolies have 168 00:08:35,800 --> 00:08:38,360 Speaker 2: been doing what's known as price gouging. 169 00:08:38,000 --> 00:08:39,640 Speaker 3: And just explain that term to me. 170 00:08:39,880 --> 00:08:43,760 Speaker 2: So, price gouging is when companies unreasonably increase the cost 171 00:08:43,920 --> 00:08:47,440 Speaker 2: of their products. And we've seen the HC step in 172 00:08:47,520 --> 00:08:50,840 Speaker 2: a few times before to monitor price gouging, like when 173 00:08:50,880 --> 00:08:53,640 Speaker 2: no one could get a rat and some places worth 174 00:08:53,679 --> 00:08:56,520 Speaker 2: selling them for seventy dollars a pop. There are rules 175 00:08:56,520 --> 00:08:59,400 Speaker 2: in place saying you can't really do that and it's 176 00:08:59,440 --> 00:09:02,040 Speaker 2: not illegal to increase prices by a lot, but it 177 00:09:02,160 --> 00:09:05,440 Speaker 2: is illegal to make false or misleading claims about why 178 00:09:05,520 --> 00:09:08,839 Speaker 2: prices are that high. A price gouging inquiry that was 179 00:09:08,920 --> 00:09:12,080 Speaker 2: launched earlier this year by the Australian Council of Trade 180 00:09:12,200 --> 00:09:15,319 Speaker 2: Unions has already said that thirty percent of the submissions 181 00:09:15,360 --> 00:09:19,800 Speaker 2: it's received has flagged supermarkets as their main concern, which 182 00:09:19,800 --> 00:09:20,959 Speaker 2: is interesting. 183 00:09:20,679 --> 00:09:23,120 Speaker 3: Very interesting. When are we going to see all of 184 00:09:23,120 --> 00:09:25,280 Speaker 3: this kickoff the inquiry? 185 00:09:25,400 --> 00:09:28,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, well there's no locked in dates yet. Obviously we're 186 00:09:28,679 --> 00:09:32,240 Speaker 2: at kind of end of year. Everyone's calling it for 187 00:09:32,240 --> 00:09:34,960 Speaker 2: the year, but I do expect to hear a lot 188 00:09:35,000 --> 00:09:37,600 Speaker 2: more about it as soon as the Senate Committee actually 189 00:09:37,720 --> 00:09:41,640 Speaker 2: takes shape. So the Senate Committee runs the inquiry and 190 00:09:41,679 --> 00:09:44,520 Speaker 2: the Senate Committee will need to meet and set up 191 00:09:44,520 --> 00:09:44,840 Speaker 2: all of that. 192 00:09:45,000 --> 00:09:46,920 Speaker 3: And you said before the push was led by the Greens, 193 00:09:46,960 --> 00:09:49,400 Speaker 3: did they give any details around when it could start. 194 00:09:49,520 --> 00:09:53,200 Speaker 2: Well, Nick mckim's office told us it's expected that hearings 195 00:09:53,240 --> 00:09:55,640 Speaker 2: will kick off at the start of next year. Parliament 196 00:09:55,720 --> 00:09:58,080 Speaker 2: is set to finish up for the year tomorrow, so 197 00:09:58,120 --> 00:09:59,640 Speaker 2: there's not that much time this year. 198 00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:03,520 Speaker 3: Importantly to this story, what do the supermarkets have to 199 00:10:03,559 --> 00:10:04,280 Speaker 3: say to all of this. 200 00:10:04,480 --> 00:10:07,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, So we reached out to both Coals and Woolies 201 00:10:07,520 --> 00:10:10,480 Speaker 2: and they have both defended their records of what they 202 00:10:10,559 --> 00:10:15,240 Speaker 2: say is providing quality products for good prices. A Coal 203 00:10:15,320 --> 00:10:18,520 Speaker 2: spokesperson told us that the company is always looking for 204 00:10:18,559 --> 00:10:21,320 Speaker 2: ways to reduce the cost of its items, saying that 205 00:10:21,400 --> 00:10:24,080 Speaker 2: it is quote not immune to the increased cost of 206 00:10:24,160 --> 00:10:28,359 Speaker 2: doing business. Then Woolworth's told us that it understands Australians 207 00:10:28,360 --> 00:10:30,600 Speaker 2: are feeling strained by the cost of living and said 208 00:10:30,600 --> 00:10:34,960 Speaker 2: that it is working to deliver relief in their grocery shops. 209 00:10:35,080 --> 00:10:37,079 Speaker 2: I think this has got to be one of the 210 00:10:37,120 --> 00:10:42,000 Speaker 2: only times where our two biggest supermarkets, the two biggest rivals, 211 00:10:42,040 --> 00:10:45,760 Speaker 2: the only kind of real rivals, are actually being put 212 00:10:45,880 --> 00:10:47,200 Speaker 2: in the same basket. 213 00:10:47,040 --> 00:10:49,520 Speaker 3: In such a good part. That is a fantastic pun. 214 00:10:49,679 --> 00:10:52,280 Speaker 2: I think that we should end this podcast here on 215 00:10:52,320 --> 00:10:53,280 Speaker 2: that excellent note. 216 00:10:53,360 --> 00:10:57,000 Speaker 3: And if you enjoyed this podcast, especially our supermarket puns, 217 00:10:57,440 --> 00:11:00,160 Speaker 3: we'd love you to leave a review and rate it. 218 00:11:00,280 --> 00:11:02,400 Speaker 3: You can do that on Spotify. You can leave a 219 00:11:02,400 --> 00:11:04,240 Speaker 3: comment on Spotify and tell us what you thought of 220 00:11:04,280 --> 00:11:06,520 Speaker 3: this episode. It only takes a couple of minutes, but 221 00:11:06,559 --> 00:11:09,720 Speaker 3: it really does help us grow. We'll be back again tomorrow. 222 00:11:09,840 --> 00:11:14,320 Speaker 3: Have a great day.