1 00:00:00,120 --> 00:00:04,440 Speaker 1: Well, as we know, BWS Airport Drive reopened yesterday following 2 00:00:04,440 --> 00:00:07,760 Speaker 1: the tragic death of Deckland Lavity earlier this year. Now, 3 00:00:07,800 --> 00:00:11,480 Speaker 1: BWS so that their priority remains the safety and the 4 00:00:11,520 --> 00:00:14,600 Speaker 1: well being of their team members and the broader community 5 00:00:14,640 --> 00:00:17,239 Speaker 1: when shopping. Joining me on the line to talk more 6 00:00:17,280 --> 00:00:21,560 Speaker 1: about this from the workers perspective is the SDA Secretary 7 00:00:21,840 --> 00:00:26,639 Speaker 1: Josh Peek. Good morning to you, Josh, having thanks so 8 00:00:26,760 --> 00:00:29,600 Speaker 1: much for your time this morning. Josh, have you spoken 9 00:00:29,680 --> 00:00:32,720 Speaker 1: to any of those workers and how are they feeling 10 00:00:32,760 --> 00:00:34,400 Speaker 1: after the shop opened yesterday? 11 00:00:35,920 --> 00:00:39,839 Speaker 2: Well, we visited the site two days ago and in 12 00:00:39,880 --> 00:00:42,360 Speaker 2: the lead up to it being open, and I think, 13 00:00:43,680 --> 00:00:45,960 Speaker 2: you know, there's a whole bunch of mixed, mixed feelings. 14 00:00:46,440 --> 00:00:50,840 Speaker 2: What occurred at the store was tragic and that lives 15 00:00:50,880 --> 00:00:53,319 Speaker 2: with workers every single day as they go go there. 16 00:00:53,360 --> 00:00:55,240 Speaker 2: It and reminds the workers, you know, there is a 17 00:00:55,280 --> 00:00:59,600 Speaker 2: constant reminder of that, and there's a reminder the staff 18 00:00:59,600 --> 00:01:03,320 Speaker 2: across the nt who work in retail on the front 19 00:01:03,360 --> 00:01:07,720 Speaker 2: line that they're working dangerous and so you know, there's 20 00:01:07,800 --> 00:01:10,240 Speaker 2: obviously they're living with that trauma. And for some of 21 00:01:10,280 --> 00:01:13,200 Speaker 2: the newer employees who weren't there, it's still it's still 22 00:01:13,200 --> 00:01:16,520 Speaker 2: a worry for them. Of course, they're pleas are their 23 00:01:16,520 --> 00:01:19,480 Speaker 2: stores reopened as well. They want to go back to 24 00:01:19,720 --> 00:01:22,440 Speaker 2: some normality. They want to go back to doing their job. So, 25 00:01:23,240 --> 00:01:25,800 Speaker 2: you know, it's complex, and I think, you know it's 26 00:01:25,840 --> 00:01:27,640 Speaker 2: fair to say how workers are feeling. I think it's 27 00:01:27,640 --> 00:01:30,840 Speaker 2: really mixed. And you know, we you know, we just 28 00:01:30,880 --> 00:01:33,760 Speaker 2: constantly continue to think of, you know, the tragic loss 29 00:01:33,760 --> 00:01:36,720 Speaker 2: of decline, and our thoughts are with his family as well. 30 00:01:37,160 --> 00:01:39,280 Speaker 1: Yeah, your spot on it, you know, like it would 31 00:01:39,319 --> 00:01:41,800 Speaker 1: be a really hard situation. I would, I would suspect 32 00:01:41,840 --> 00:01:45,639 Speaker 1: for his co workers, for everybody stepping back into that shop, 33 00:01:45,720 --> 00:01:49,880 Speaker 1: because it is, you know, it's forever going to be 34 00:01:49,920 --> 00:01:53,240 Speaker 1: a tragic, tragic reminder of exactly what has gone on 35 00:01:53,320 --> 00:01:53,760 Speaker 1: in there. 36 00:01:55,440 --> 00:01:59,640 Speaker 2: Yeah, and look, I mean I think you know it. 37 00:02:01,440 --> 00:02:03,280 Speaker 2: We've talked for some time and I think I've even't 38 00:02:03,280 --> 00:02:05,600 Speaker 2: been on your show before his death about the sort 39 00:02:05,600 --> 00:02:10,840 Speaker 2: of you know, exposure to risk our members and workers 40 00:02:10,840 --> 00:02:13,960 Speaker 2: in this sector face. And you know, it shouldn't take 41 00:02:14,000 --> 00:02:17,160 Speaker 2: a death for people to be taking it more more seriously. 42 00:02:17,240 --> 00:02:19,440 Speaker 2: I mean, we are really pleased they are. We are 43 00:02:19,480 --> 00:02:24,400 Speaker 2: really pleased that hopefully out of this tragedy. Something good 44 00:02:24,440 --> 00:02:27,160 Speaker 2: can come of it, which is that people recognize that 45 00:02:27,440 --> 00:02:31,560 Speaker 2: the jobs that our members do, particularly in these exposed locations, 46 00:02:32,200 --> 00:02:35,120 Speaker 2: is inherently risk risky and that of the community we 47 00:02:35,160 --> 00:02:38,839 Speaker 2: need to do more, but employers need to do more 48 00:02:38,880 --> 00:02:41,120 Speaker 2: as well. And the law's pretty clear on this, and 49 00:02:41,280 --> 00:02:45,080 Speaker 2: the law says that an employer must take all reasonable 50 00:02:45,080 --> 00:02:48,280 Speaker 2: steps to keep their workers safe. And that is about 51 00:02:48,639 --> 00:02:53,639 Speaker 2: addressing known risks. And we know violent and abusive customers 52 00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:56,520 Speaker 2: are a risk. They are a known risk, and we 53 00:02:56,560 --> 00:02:58,960 Speaker 2: need to be making sure we've got really strong practice 54 00:02:58,960 --> 00:03:02,919 Speaker 2: in practices in in place across the board to keep 55 00:03:03,360 --> 00:03:06,560 Speaker 2: workers safe. And that's why it's been really important for 56 00:03:06,639 --> 00:03:09,040 Speaker 2: us to say to the NT government and work safe NT. 57 00:03:10,040 --> 00:03:12,920 Speaker 2: Let's get over this question of a debate about what 58 00:03:13,040 --> 00:03:17,359 Speaker 2: is reasonable, because that's half the problem here. We try 59 00:03:17,360 --> 00:03:19,960 Speaker 2: to enforce certain protections, employers might say, well, that's not 60 00:03:20,000 --> 00:03:23,000 Speaker 2: reasonable in these circumstances. We then getting into this bizarre 61 00:03:23,080 --> 00:03:26,799 Speaker 2: roundabout question. Always saying really clearly is develop a code 62 00:03:26,840 --> 00:03:30,919 Speaker 2: of practice, develop a guide that says, in these high 63 00:03:31,000 --> 00:03:33,440 Speaker 2: risk establishments, these are the things that they must do. 64 00:03:33,840 --> 00:03:36,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, Josh, tell me, I know that there have been 65 00:03:36,560 --> 00:03:40,920 Speaker 1: a number of changes made to the BWS Airport drive 66 00:03:41,720 --> 00:03:45,440 Speaker 1: for it to reopen yesterday, Like what safety measures are 67 00:03:45,480 --> 00:03:46,279 Speaker 1: in place. 68 00:03:47,440 --> 00:03:49,680 Speaker 2: Well, there's a few things, and I think they still 69 00:03:49,680 --> 00:03:52,119 Speaker 2: needs to be more done. I don't want to be 70 00:03:52,320 --> 00:03:55,720 Speaker 2: critical of Endeavor because I think they have tried really 71 00:03:55,760 --> 00:03:58,320 Speaker 2: hard over the last couple of months to listen to 72 00:03:58,320 --> 00:04:00,800 Speaker 2: their team, engage with the union, and to put certain 73 00:04:00,800 --> 00:04:02,600 Speaker 2: things in place. So we do think there's still some 74 00:04:03,040 --> 00:04:05,840 Speaker 2: stronger measures that that should come. But one of the 75 00:04:05,840 --> 00:04:09,640 Speaker 2: most important things for us in every exposed location is 76 00:04:09,720 --> 00:04:12,960 Speaker 2: workers must have an escape route. They must have somewhere 77 00:04:12,960 --> 00:04:15,440 Speaker 2: to go. And in the way many of these establishments 78 00:04:15,440 --> 00:04:17,559 Speaker 2: have been built right across the charity and right across 79 00:04:17,600 --> 00:04:20,360 Speaker 2: the countries, workers don't have a secondary exit, so if 80 00:04:20,360 --> 00:04:23,880 Speaker 2: they are confronted by someone, they've got nowhere to actually 81 00:04:23,960 --> 00:04:26,920 Speaker 2: escape to. So the store now has two exit pathways 82 00:04:27,240 --> 00:04:30,839 Speaker 2: that's a big improvement, and a safe room where workers 83 00:04:30,839 --> 00:04:33,400 Speaker 2: can lock themselves in should something go particularly wrong and 84 00:04:33,480 --> 00:04:36,320 Speaker 2: they can't use one of those escape routes, so that's good. 85 00:04:36,800 --> 00:04:39,400 Speaker 2: The counter yet at this stage, has not yet been 86 00:04:39,440 --> 00:04:41,200 Speaker 2: moved to the front of that escape room. That's what 87 00:04:41,320 --> 00:04:44,440 Speaker 2: needs needs to have, needs to happen. They have put 88 00:04:44,440 --> 00:04:49,760 Speaker 2: in locked cases for a whole bunch of liquor products, 89 00:04:49,760 --> 00:04:52,320 Speaker 2: so that means that you know, there's less likely of 90 00:04:52,360 --> 00:04:56,840 Speaker 2: a smash and grab type arrangement. But we still think 91 00:04:56,880 --> 00:04:58,719 Speaker 2: more needs to be done, particularly around them, location of 92 00:04:58,720 --> 00:05:03,000 Speaker 2: the counter and also some screens. They're currently operating a 93 00:05:03,040 --> 00:05:05,359 Speaker 2: seven pm closure, so that's an improvement in relation to 94 00:05:05,360 --> 00:05:08,039 Speaker 2: trading out. I mean, people aren't workings late at nighttect 95 00:05:08,600 --> 00:05:12,039 Speaker 2: and potentially exposed to greater risk. I've committed to ensuring 96 00:05:12,080 --> 00:05:14,600 Speaker 2: there's always maybe two staff one closure as well. So 97 00:05:15,400 --> 00:05:17,640 Speaker 2: they're some of the things that have been done, but 98 00:05:17,680 --> 00:05:19,800 Speaker 2: I will say that there is still more to be done, 99 00:05:19,920 --> 00:05:22,359 Speaker 2: not just at this site, but across every site that 100 00:05:22,400 --> 00:05:24,960 Speaker 2: has potential for workers working alone late at night. 101 00:05:25,480 --> 00:05:27,720 Speaker 1: Look is you know, it does sound like a good 102 00:05:27,720 --> 00:05:30,360 Speaker 1: thing that there is that escape room. Now, that's there 103 00:05:30,640 --> 00:05:33,080 Speaker 1: another exit for people to be able to get out 104 00:05:33,080 --> 00:05:37,760 Speaker 1: when they are working should a violent and frightening situation unfold. 105 00:05:38,200 --> 00:05:40,440 Speaker 1: I do want to ask you, Josh, just stepping away, 106 00:05:40,800 --> 00:05:42,760 Speaker 1: I guess from bottle shops for a moment and looking 107 00:05:42,800 --> 00:05:46,760 Speaker 1: more broadly at our retail workers. I've been contacted by 108 00:05:46,800 --> 00:05:48,800 Speaker 1: a couple of listeners over the last couple of days 109 00:05:48,800 --> 00:05:51,920 Speaker 1: about different incidents at Casuarina. How are things going from 110 00:05:51,920 --> 00:05:55,080 Speaker 1: your perspective, look. 111 00:05:54,880 --> 00:05:57,080 Speaker 2: It's Saturday. Not well. I mean, I think most of 112 00:05:57,120 --> 00:06:01,360 Speaker 2: our members are reporting arise on anti social but the behavior. 113 00:06:02,120 --> 00:06:05,320 Speaker 2: We've done a recent survey following the incident the b 114 00:06:05,600 --> 00:06:08,160 Speaker 2: WS store, and we've asked our members how they currently 115 00:06:08,200 --> 00:06:11,880 Speaker 2: feel feeling and whether they are they're feeling more at 116 00:06:11,960 --> 00:06:14,240 Speaker 2: risk and the answer to those questions is yes, they're 117 00:06:14,279 --> 00:06:17,080 Speaker 2: not feeling as safe as as they were there seeing 118 00:06:17,400 --> 00:06:21,200 Speaker 2: that there's an increase in antisocial behavior in their workplaces, 119 00:06:21,279 --> 00:06:25,520 Speaker 2: and we are really engaging with employers to say, you know, 120 00:06:25,600 --> 00:06:27,479 Speaker 2: more must be done to make sure that workers are 121 00:06:27,480 --> 00:06:30,520 Speaker 2: feeling safe and are in fact safe were within within 122 00:06:30,560 --> 00:06:33,960 Speaker 2: their their their their establishments. So there's a whole range 123 00:06:34,000 --> 00:06:35,600 Speaker 2: of things, and you know, we've gone through lots of 124 00:06:35,640 --> 00:06:38,680 Speaker 2: those around you know, making sure we've got appropriate signedge, 125 00:06:38,680 --> 00:06:41,839 Speaker 2: we've got appropriate screen protection, we've got enough staff on 126 00:06:42,920 --> 00:06:44,600 Speaker 2: you know, a lot of this stuff is also because 127 00:06:44,600 --> 00:06:48,200 Speaker 2: there is insufficient staff security guards establishments where we know 128 00:06:48,320 --> 00:06:51,560 Speaker 2: there is a known risk, the availability of police when 129 00:06:51,600 --> 00:06:56,200 Speaker 2: stores need need them. The Trespass Reform is positive, but 130 00:06:56,240 --> 00:06:58,680 Speaker 2: we need to make sure it's enforced and and it 131 00:06:58,720 --> 00:07:03,120 Speaker 2: actually occurs. So, you know, our feedback from members on 132 00:07:03,160 --> 00:07:07,080 Speaker 2: the ground in the NT is things aren't great. And 133 00:07:07,720 --> 00:07:09,280 Speaker 2: you know, I think the roundtable that we're going to 134 00:07:09,320 --> 00:07:12,760 Speaker 2: be engaging with the government and is really important because workers' 135 00:07:12,800 --> 00:07:17,440 Speaker 2: voices need to be heard and employees also need to 136 00:07:17,480 --> 00:07:19,600 Speaker 2: be taken appropriate steps to keep their workers. 137 00:07:19,600 --> 00:07:22,000 Speaker 1: So, Josh, when's that roundtable due to happen. 138 00:07:23,480 --> 00:07:25,560 Speaker 2: I don't have an answer to that question. I understand 139 00:07:27,080 --> 00:07:30,679 Speaker 2: we are keen to see it soon and we're looking forward. 140 00:07:30,520 --> 00:07:32,920 Speaker 1: To an answer from the government, just a very quick one. 141 00:07:32,920 --> 00:07:34,560 Speaker 1: And I was at the shops the other day and 142 00:07:34,600 --> 00:07:36,400 Speaker 1: I was in one of the supermarkets and a whole 143 00:07:36,440 --> 00:07:39,600 Speaker 1: group of young boys walked in. The older lady that 144 00:07:39,680 --> 00:07:41,280 Speaker 1: was working at the counter there said to me, do 145 00:07:41,360 --> 00:07:43,320 Speaker 1: you know what they come in every day and they 146 00:07:43,360 --> 00:07:46,200 Speaker 1: steal things and we just have to let them go. 147 00:07:47,400 --> 00:07:50,080 Speaker 1: How often are you hearing stories like that that we've 148 00:07:50,160 --> 00:07:52,680 Speaker 1: You know that you've got groups of kids just thinking 149 00:07:52,680 --> 00:07:54,960 Speaker 1: that they can really do what they want and it 150 00:07:55,040 --> 00:07:57,840 Speaker 1: must be incredibly frustrating. And it seemed as it was 151 00:07:57,920 --> 00:08:00,400 Speaker 1: upsetting for the staff that I spoke to the other 152 00:08:00,520 --> 00:08:03,760 Speaker 1: day where you know, where people are just have some 153 00:08:03,840 --> 00:08:06,320 Speaker 1: people I just got no respect at this point in 154 00:08:06,360 --> 00:08:09,040 Speaker 1: time for you know, for the for what goes on 155 00:08:09,160 --> 00:08:13,000 Speaker 1: in the shopping center, for having to pay for things. 156 00:08:13,040 --> 00:08:16,920 Speaker 2: You know, most of our members are proud workers. You know, 157 00:08:17,000 --> 00:08:19,360 Speaker 2: they don't like to see their work and their environment 158 00:08:19,440 --> 00:08:21,760 Speaker 2: treated in such a guard So when they see people 159 00:08:21,800 --> 00:08:23,640 Speaker 2: coming and treat it with disrespect or skill stuff that 160 00:08:24,040 --> 00:08:28,680 Speaker 2: it's personally insulting for them and incredibly upsetting. You know. 161 00:08:28,760 --> 00:08:30,560 Speaker 2: I was going to say, if if an employer and 162 00:08:30,560 --> 00:08:33,600 Speaker 2: a shop like that knows that they're having a lot 163 00:08:33,600 --> 00:08:36,440 Speaker 2: of things stolen off them every single day, the question 164 00:08:36,480 --> 00:08:39,240 Speaker 2: we also should be asking is why hasn't the company 165 00:08:39,240 --> 00:08:41,920 Speaker 2: put on a security guard to help prevent it. Surely 166 00:08:42,000 --> 00:08:44,080 Speaker 2: they're losing more in product loss and they would be 167 00:08:44,120 --> 00:08:46,520 Speaker 2: in the cost of employing a security guard. If what 168 00:08:46,559 --> 00:08:49,439 Speaker 2: that that, if what you've been told is such a 169 00:08:49,480 --> 00:08:51,800 Speaker 2: common occurrence, I mean, that seems to be, you know, 170 00:08:52,360 --> 00:08:54,640 Speaker 2: just a strange thing that they're on one side, they're 171 00:08:54,640 --> 00:08:57,560 Speaker 2: trying to save costs by not putting in place security, 172 00:08:57,559 --> 00:09:00,640 Speaker 2: but on the other on the other hand, allowing people 173 00:09:00,679 --> 00:09:03,000 Speaker 2: just to walk out with whatever they need to. Our 174 00:09:03,040 --> 00:09:06,439 Speaker 2: advice to members, though, is their job is to serve customers, 175 00:09:06,800 --> 00:09:08,880 Speaker 2: not be some kind of law enforcer. Their job is 176 00:09:08,920 --> 00:09:13,640 Speaker 2: to make sure that people are given good customer service, 177 00:09:13,720 --> 00:09:16,880 Speaker 2: not chased down per perpetrators. And if we know these 178 00:09:16,960 --> 00:09:21,160 Speaker 2: locations are particularly risk then it really is on obviously 179 00:09:21,240 --> 00:09:23,559 Speaker 2: the police to be on the out, on the lookout 180 00:09:23,600 --> 00:09:27,400 Speaker 2: for it and attend these situations when they occur, but 181 00:09:27,440 --> 00:09:30,920 Speaker 2: it's also on the employer to put in appropriate mechanisms 182 00:09:30,920 --> 00:09:32,480 Speaker 2: to prevent this from continuing to occur. 183 00:09:32,960 --> 00:09:37,120 Speaker 1: Well, Josh Peak, the SDA Secretary always appreciate your time. 184 00:09:37,160 --> 00:09:39,120 Speaker 1: Thanks so much for having a chat with us this morning. 185 00:09:40,040 --> 00:09:41,319 Speaker 2: Thanks cutie, Thank you.