1 00:00:00,440 --> 00:00:03,119 Speaker 1: When you make yourself a slice of toast in the morning, 2 00:00:03,279 --> 00:00:06,000 Speaker 1: what is your go to spread? Do you have a 3 00:00:06,040 --> 00:00:09,879 Speaker 1: tub of margarine that you routinely go to or do 4 00:00:09,960 --> 00:00:12,560 Speaker 1: you pay a little bit extra and buy the cholesterol 5 00:00:12,560 --> 00:00:16,120 Speaker 1: lowering margarines or are you someone for who. 6 00:00:15,960 --> 00:00:17,520 Speaker 2: It is butter all the way. 7 00:00:18,200 --> 00:00:21,360 Speaker 1: On today's episode of the Nutrition Couch Podcast, Leanne and 8 00:00:21,400 --> 00:00:24,400 Speaker 1: I debate one of the big nutrition questions. 9 00:00:24,480 --> 00:00:27,320 Speaker 2: Is it butter or should it be margarine? And you 10 00:00:27,440 --> 00:00:29,639 Speaker 2: might be a little bit surprised with what we have 11 00:00:29,720 --> 00:00:30,080 Speaker 2: to say. 12 00:00:30,600 --> 00:00:33,080 Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Susie Burrow and I'm Liam Wood and each 13 00:00:33,080 --> 00:00:35,839 Speaker 1: week we bring you the Nutrition Couch Podcast, a bi 14 00:00:35,840 --> 00:00:38,320 Speaker 1: weekly chat on everything that is hot in the world 15 00:00:38,320 --> 00:00:41,440 Speaker 1: of nutrition, as well as popular spreads. Today we're going 16 00:00:41,520 --> 00:00:44,240 Speaker 1: to have a look at the latest research on diet 17 00:00:44,280 --> 00:00:47,519 Speaker 1: and breast cancer and Leanne has a really interesting listener 18 00:00:47,600 --> 00:00:50,760 Speaker 1: question that's come through all about our caffeine and coffee 19 00:00:50,760 --> 00:00:54,960 Speaker 1: intake and the effect on calcium absorption. But before we 20 00:00:55,000 --> 00:00:57,440 Speaker 1: get going today, Leanne, I think we can share with 21 00:00:57,520 --> 00:01:00,480 Speaker 1: our listeners we've got a few exciting little projects coming up. 22 00:01:00,520 --> 00:01:03,800 Speaker 1: Of course, we toured recently this year the Eastern States 23 00:01:03,840 --> 00:01:05,960 Speaker 1: and got to meet a lot of our listeners and 24 00:01:06,000 --> 00:01:07,520 Speaker 1: there was a lot of interest in that. And we 25 00:01:07,600 --> 00:01:12,480 Speaker 1: are currently about to finalize our Nutrition Couch podcast product guide, 26 00:01:12,720 --> 00:01:14,480 Speaker 1: which will have an in depth look at some of 27 00:01:14,480 --> 00:01:17,760 Speaker 1: our supermarket favorites. And indeed we do cover that on 28 00:01:17,840 --> 00:01:21,240 Speaker 1: our weekly episode when we pick different supermarket products and 29 00:01:21,240 --> 00:01:23,360 Speaker 1: go through it, but this is slightly different because we're 30 00:01:23,360 --> 00:01:26,199 Speaker 1: really going through different areas of the supermarket and making 31 00:01:26,200 --> 00:01:28,520 Speaker 1: our pick. So that will be available we're thrilled to 32 00:01:28,560 --> 00:01:31,320 Speaker 1: share in a couple of weeks. But we're also planning 33 00:01:31,360 --> 00:01:34,200 Speaker 1: a little bit of a summer nutrition book as well, 34 00:01:34,200 --> 00:01:34,679 Speaker 1: aren't we. 35 00:01:35,120 --> 00:01:38,160 Speaker 3: A little sort of twenty twenty three summer reset. So 36 00:01:38,200 --> 00:01:40,160 Speaker 3: it's not a diet, it's not a detox, it's not 37 00:01:40,200 --> 00:01:42,480 Speaker 3: a shred, it's not a full week challenge. It's just 38 00:01:42,520 --> 00:01:44,360 Speaker 3: a little bit of a reset for those of us 39 00:01:44,360 --> 00:01:47,160 Speaker 3: who have strayed from good habits. We have become a 40 00:01:47,160 --> 00:01:50,440 Speaker 3: little bit overwhelmed with the silly season and the holiday 41 00:01:50,440 --> 00:01:52,920 Speaker 3: period and who was just not feeling like their best 42 00:01:52,920 --> 00:01:55,320 Speaker 3: selves at the moment. So our goal is to reset 43 00:01:55,360 --> 00:01:58,160 Speaker 3: your healthy habits, give you more energy, help you fuel 44 00:01:58,200 --> 00:01:59,960 Speaker 3: your body a little bit better, and focus on a 45 00:02:00,040 --> 00:02:02,280 Speaker 3: couple of good key habits that we know can make 46 00:02:02,360 --> 00:02:04,320 Speaker 3: the world of different. So it's a sort of a 47 00:02:04,400 --> 00:02:06,560 Speaker 3: summer reset. We don't want you to think of it 48 00:02:06,600 --> 00:02:09,840 Speaker 3: like a restrictive or like a time frame dependent thing. 49 00:02:09,880 --> 00:02:12,360 Speaker 3: It'll be a full week guide very likely, but we 50 00:02:12,400 --> 00:02:14,160 Speaker 3: want you to continue on with it. Well after the 51 00:02:14,160 --> 00:02:15,440 Speaker 3: four weeks is finished. 52 00:02:15,160 --> 00:02:17,840 Speaker 1: And we're just currently debating titles, we're going to put 53 00:02:17,840 --> 00:02:19,880 Speaker 1: it to instead to see what everyone thinks the title 54 00:02:19,919 --> 00:02:22,800 Speaker 1: should be. So watch this space that will be coming 55 00:02:23,040 --> 00:02:25,480 Speaker 1: very soon. All right, Leanne, Well, this is actually a 56 00:02:25,480 --> 00:02:28,920 Speaker 1: topic that I'm surprised we haven't covered in almost eighteen 57 00:02:28,960 --> 00:02:33,640 Speaker 1: months of potty Chitchat episodes we've had, because you know, 58 00:02:33,760 --> 00:02:35,639 Speaker 1: there's questions that come up in the world of nutrition 59 00:02:35,720 --> 00:02:37,960 Speaker 1: all the time. There's the ones on eggs. You know, 60 00:02:38,120 --> 00:02:40,720 Speaker 1: eggs high in cholesterol, and his fruit got too much 61 00:02:40,800 --> 00:02:44,080 Speaker 1: sugar and skim milk got more sugar than full cream. 62 00:02:45,120 --> 00:02:49,400 Speaker 1: But we haven't tackled butter or margarine. Now, when I 63 00:02:49,400 --> 00:02:52,400 Speaker 1: studied dietetics in the mid nineteen nineties, it was margarine 64 00:02:52,520 --> 00:02:55,760 Speaker 1: all the way. The cholesterol loring margarines had sort of 65 00:02:55,800 --> 00:02:57,880 Speaker 1: just hit the market in Australia and they were big. 66 00:02:57,919 --> 00:03:00,959 Speaker 1: We were certainly told that vegetable oil was a much 67 00:03:00,960 --> 00:03:04,200 Speaker 1: better option than saturated fat based products that were butter. 68 00:03:04,720 --> 00:03:08,040 Speaker 1: So certainly margarine was big, as it had been sort 69 00:03:08,040 --> 00:03:11,959 Speaker 1: of right through the seventies and eighties in Australia. So 70 00:03:12,080 --> 00:03:14,320 Speaker 1: when I said this to you, when you brought it up, 71 00:03:14,760 --> 00:03:17,280 Speaker 1: we had slightly different opinions on it, which was a 72 00:03:17,280 --> 00:03:20,800 Speaker 1: bit of a surprise because usually we're pretty in agreeance 73 00:03:20,840 --> 00:03:24,080 Speaker 1: on most things. So I thought, you know, it's always 74 00:03:24,080 --> 00:03:25,959 Speaker 1: a good chat to have. And I've got some clients 75 00:03:26,000 --> 00:03:28,720 Speaker 1: who are so deeply dedicated to their butter they literally 76 00:03:28,800 --> 00:03:31,320 Speaker 1: measure it out untill me they're having eight grams. So 77 00:03:31,520 --> 00:03:33,040 Speaker 1: just in I might start off with a little bit 78 00:03:33,040 --> 00:03:35,200 Speaker 1: of context and then you can share what your thoughts 79 00:03:35,200 --> 00:03:38,560 Speaker 1: are on it. So in the diet, when we're consuming 80 00:03:38,560 --> 00:03:43,000 Speaker 1: different types of fat, there are poly unsaturated fats, mono 81 00:03:43,080 --> 00:03:46,720 Speaker 1: unsaturated fats, and saturated fats, and so fats are generally 82 00:03:46,720 --> 00:03:49,320 Speaker 1: a mix of those different types. So for example, when 83 00:03:49,360 --> 00:03:52,440 Speaker 1: you have some avocado or some olive oil, you will 84 00:03:52,440 --> 00:03:56,240 Speaker 1: actually get some saturated fat and then predominantly mono unsaturated fat, 85 00:03:56,280 --> 00:03:58,040 Speaker 1: which is why we call it a good fat. But 86 00:03:58,080 --> 00:04:00,440 Speaker 1: there is also some saturated fat in there. Those foods 87 00:04:00,440 --> 00:04:03,160 Speaker 1: are a mix. In the case of animal foods, it's 88 00:04:03,200 --> 00:04:06,120 Speaker 1: predominantly saturated fat, and we know that that doesn't have 89 00:04:06,160 --> 00:04:09,640 Speaker 1: a huge functional role in the body, whereas the poly 90 00:04:09,720 --> 00:04:13,320 Speaker 1: and monounsaturated fats are sort of slightly healthier fats and 91 00:04:13,440 --> 00:04:16,200 Speaker 1: better for us and if anything, neutral when it comes 92 00:04:16,240 --> 00:04:19,240 Speaker 1: to blood cholesterol and heart disease risk a little bit different. 93 00:04:19,279 --> 00:04:21,159 Speaker 1: In the case of saturated fat, we don't need a 94 00:04:21,160 --> 00:04:24,480 Speaker 1: lot of it, and it can in some people increase 95 00:04:24,520 --> 00:04:28,640 Speaker 1: saturated fat and inflammation in the body. And Australians get 96 00:04:28,720 --> 00:04:31,160 Speaker 1: plenty of saturated fat, and they get plenty because we 97 00:04:31,200 --> 00:04:35,480 Speaker 1: love our fast food and we love our processed snack foods, 98 00:04:35,480 --> 00:04:37,840 Speaker 1: which have a heavy palm oil base which tends to 99 00:04:37,880 --> 00:04:40,920 Speaker 1: be highly saturated, and of course we also love cheese 100 00:04:41,000 --> 00:04:43,440 Speaker 1: and we love dairy, so it's not a problem getting 101 00:04:43,440 --> 00:04:45,480 Speaker 1: saturated fat in our diets. We tend to get a lot. 102 00:04:46,000 --> 00:04:48,400 Speaker 1: So when you spread some butter, if you spread sort 103 00:04:48,400 --> 00:04:50,240 Speaker 1: of a tea spoon of butter, you're getting sort of 104 00:04:50,279 --> 00:04:53,040 Speaker 1: at least four grams of saturated fat and you probably 105 00:04:53,080 --> 00:04:55,760 Speaker 1: only need max. Twenty maybe thirty a day. You really 106 00:04:55,800 --> 00:04:58,440 Speaker 1: don't need it, so it doesn't have a huge functional role. 107 00:04:59,200 --> 00:05:02,279 Speaker 1: So when I'm giving recommendations on spreads myself, I'm a 108 00:05:02,279 --> 00:05:04,920 Speaker 1: bit like, well, the less of any spread really, because 109 00:05:05,000 --> 00:05:07,719 Speaker 1: if I'm modeling a diet, I want my clients to 110 00:05:07,720 --> 00:05:09,840 Speaker 1: get their good fats from foods like their nuts and 111 00:05:09,839 --> 00:05:12,800 Speaker 1: their extravagin olive oil and avocado. You know, I don't 112 00:05:13,040 --> 00:05:15,120 Speaker 1: I'd rather have an egg on toast. You probably don't 113 00:05:15,160 --> 00:05:18,920 Speaker 1: really need much spread. But if I'm cooking and baking, 114 00:05:18,960 --> 00:05:22,520 Speaker 1: I absolutely use butter. I wouldn't use a margarine for that, 115 00:05:23,320 --> 00:05:25,400 Speaker 1: but I think it. You know, it's different strokes for 116 00:05:25,440 --> 00:05:27,839 Speaker 1: different folks because you had a slightly different sort of 117 00:05:27,880 --> 00:05:32,320 Speaker 1: opinion on margarine, which I think is good to discuss, 118 00:05:32,400 --> 00:05:34,400 Speaker 1: you know, just to get some different perspectives about where 119 00:05:34,400 --> 00:05:35,279 Speaker 1: it fits in the diet. 120 00:05:35,360 --> 00:05:37,240 Speaker 2: So what do you have at home? What do you use? 121 00:05:37,760 --> 00:05:38,480 Speaker 2: I don't use a lot. 122 00:05:38,520 --> 00:05:40,600 Speaker 3: I sort of have a bit of an olive oil spread, 123 00:05:40,720 --> 00:05:42,600 Speaker 3: or sometimes I use a nan alexis sort of non 124 00:05:42,680 --> 00:05:46,320 Speaker 3: dairy based one for no other reason that I just 125 00:05:46,360 --> 00:05:48,279 Speaker 3: sort of like it and it spreads quite well. I'm 126 00:05:48,320 --> 00:05:50,279 Speaker 3: just I'm not a butter fan because it's hard to 127 00:05:50,400 --> 00:05:52,520 Speaker 3: spread like I just I don't like making holes in 128 00:05:52,560 --> 00:05:53,920 Speaker 3: my bread if I'm going to spread it. If I'm 129 00:05:53,960 --> 00:05:56,120 Speaker 3: being honest, I just like the spreadableness of it. So 130 00:05:56,400 --> 00:05:58,080 Speaker 3: I don't use a lot like I reckon, I would 131 00:05:58,200 --> 00:06:02,160 Speaker 3: use some sort of butter slash much slash spread once 132 00:06:02,160 --> 00:06:03,880 Speaker 3: every two to three weeks, like I'm really not. 133 00:06:03,920 --> 00:06:04,440 Speaker 2: I don't need a lot. 134 00:06:04,480 --> 00:06:06,720 Speaker 3: I'm not a sandwich kind of person. If I'm having toast, 135 00:06:06,760 --> 00:06:09,680 Speaker 3: I'd much rather put avocado or tahini or recorder or 136 00:06:09,720 --> 00:06:12,280 Speaker 3: something like that on it instead. I don't really use 137 00:06:12,320 --> 00:06:14,000 Speaker 3: but i much And I'm not a big baker either, 138 00:06:14,360 --> 00:06:17,120 Speaker 3: And so I don't think we necessarily have a difference 139 00:06:17,160 --> 00:06:19,120 Speaker 3: of opinions. But I think it's just important to sort 140 00:06:19,160 --> 00:06:22,440 Speaker 3: of bring up the whole margarine debate because, very much 141 00:06:22,480 --> 00:06:24,320 Speaker 3: like you, when I went through university was one hundred 142 00:06:24,320 --> 00:06:29,880 Speaker 3: percent margarine. The cholesterol lowering margarines were quite popular, quite trendy. 143 00:06:29,880 --> 00:06:32,400 Speaker 3: It was absolutely what we were recommending for clients in 144 00:06:32,440 --> 00:06:35,200 Speaker 3: the clinics and that sort of thing. But I think 145 00:06:35,360 --> 00:06:37,960 Speaker 3: where a lot of the misconception comes from with margarine 146 00:06:38,040 --> 00:06:39,919 Speaker 3: is that a lot of people think that it's that 147 00:06:40,080 --> 00:06:44,200 Speaker 3: hydrogenated trans fat and Indeed, when margarine first came about 148 00:06:44,480 --> 00:06:47,919 Speaker 3: prior to the nineteen nineties, it absolutely was. So margarine 149 00:06:48,000 --> 00:06:52,200 Speaker 3: was predominantly, you know, eighty ninety percent hydrogenated trans fat. 150 00:06:52,240 --> 00:06:55,760 Speaker 3: They were making, They were you know, artificially creating it 151 00:06:55,800 --> 00:06:58,120 Speaker 3: to be something that was really solid at room temperature. 152 00:06:58,120 --> 00:06:59,279 Speaker 2: So it wasn't a good. 153 00:06:59,120 --> 00:07:01,400 Speaker 3: Type of fact for us at all. It was highly 154 00:07:01,440 --> 00:07:04,240 Speaker 3: refined and it was not you know, it was supposed 155 00:07:04,240 --> 00:07:06,599 Speaker 3: to be a healthier alternative to butter, but I think 156 00:07:06,760 --> 00:07:08,920 Speaker 3: sitting here and looking back then we can really say 157 00:07:08,920 --> 00:07:11,920 Speaker 3: that it probably wasn't really that healthier alternative because it 158 00:07:11,960 --> 00:07:14,200 Speaker 3: had really high levels of trans fats in it. But 159 00:07:14,360 --> 00:07:17,920 Speaker 3: margarine these days isn't actually really high in trans fat, 160 00:07:18,080 --> 00:07:20,840 Speaker 3: especially in Australa and the UK. Now, I do believe 161 00:07:20,840 --> 00:07:23,040 Speaker 3: that American it is made differently, so I probably would 162 00:07:23,080 --> 00:07:26,400 Speaker 3: never recommend something like margarine in America. But most of 163 00:07:26,400 --> 00:07:29,200 Speaker 3: what is available in terms of margarines and spreads in 164 00:07:29,240 --> 00:07:32,320 Speaker 3: austral in the UK are made up of some sort 165 00:07:32,360 --> 00:07:34,760 Speaker 3: of vegetable oil, olive oil, or some sort of rape 166 00:07:34,760 --> 00:07:38,040 Speaker 3: seed oil. So these oils are I would say, largely 167 00:07:38,120 --> 00:07:41,200 Speaker 3: better for you than things like the saturated fat and butter, 168 00:07:41,400 --> 00:07:43,520 Speaker 3: and they actually contained a little bit of a better 169 00:07:43,640 --> 00:07:46,400 Speaker 3: sort of mix of unsaturated spread. So depending on what 170 00:07:46,440 --> 00:07:48,520 Speaker 3: the oil or the spread is made up of, it 171 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:50,240 Speaker 3: will depend on sort of whether it's more of a 172 00:07:50,280 --> 00:07:52,120 Speaker 3: polly or a money or you know, if it's got 173 00:07:52,120 --> 00:07:54,080 Speaker 3: a bit of saturated fat in there as well. So 174 00:07:54,320 --> 00:07:56,119 Speaker 3: I'm like you, I have the belief that you should 175 00:07:56,120 --> 00:07:58,680 Speaker 3: only be using a really small amount, but I really 176 00:07:58,720 --> 00:08:00,200 Speaker 3: do think that it comes down to kind of a 177 00:08:00,240 --> 00:08:02,600 Speaker 3: taste preference. If you are only using a small amount, 178 00:08:02,640 --> 00:08:04,880 Speaker 3: if you're a butter person, absolutely do it, but you 179 00:08:04,920 --> 00:08:06,720 Speaker 3: need to be making sure you're having small amounts. If 180 00:08:06,760 --> 00:08:09,480 Speaker 3: you're baking regularly for the kids every single week, if 181 00:08:09,480 --> 00:08:12,920 Speaker 3: you're spreading it onto toast most mornings, I really think 182 00:08:12,960 --> 00:08:16,000 Speaker 3: that perhaps you either need to consider it an alternative 183 00:08:16,360 --> 00:08:18,160 Speaker 3: or you just need to look at your general overall 184 00:08:18,160 --> 00:08:20,400 Speaker 3: health in your diet. If you're someone who likes a 185 00:08:20,400 --> 00:08:22,760 Speaker 3: lot of meat, likes things you know, your family has 186 00:08:22,840 --> 00:08:25,440 Speaker 3: sausages and chops and steak, you're already getting in a 187 00:08:25,480 --> 00:08:27,920 Speaker 3: lot of saturated fat in your diet. Plus take away 188 00:08:27,920 --> 00:08:29,400 Speaker 3: once or twice a week, you like a bit of 189 00:08:29,400 --> 00:08:31,800 Speaker 3: bacon with your eggs on the weekend. That would be 190 00:08:31,880 --> 00:08:34,840 Speaker 3: where I'd be really careful and cautious of the type 191 00:08:34,840 --> 00:08:37,640 Speaker 3: of spread that you choose all the alternative like something 192 00:08:37,679 --> 00:08:40,720 Speaker 3: like avocado or tahini or a nut butter instead. But 193 00:08:41,440 --> 00:08:44,480 Speaker 3: if you're following a largely vegetarian type diet, you only 194 00:08:44,559 --> 00:08:46,600 Speaker 3: have meat, you know, maybe once a week if that, 195 00:08:46,920 --> 00:08:49,680 Speaker 3: you have a lot of good quality healthy fats, nuts, salmon, 196 00:08:49,800 --> 00:08:52,280 Speaker 3: use a lot of extraversion olive oil. I really don't 197 00:08:52,520 --> 00:08:54,440 Speaker 3: I'm not going to sort of debate what type would 198 00:08:54,480 --> 00:08:56,440 Speaker 3: be best for you, Like I really think choose, choose 199 00:08:56,480 --> 00:08:58,360 Speaker 3: the one that you like, Choose the one that you enjoy. 200 00:08:58,720 --> 00:08:59,920 Speaker 3: But I think there is a little bit of miss 201 00:09:00,040 --> 00:09:02,360 Speaker 3: inception around the whole. You know, Marjorie used to be 202 00:09:02,400 --> 00:09:04,480 Speaker 3: the best, butter was so bad then, you know, the 203 00:09:04,520 --> 00:09:07,720 Speaker 3: tables turn in terms of saturated fat, particularly within dairy 204 00:09:07,760 --> 00:09:10,640 Speaker 3: and things like butter probably about what five six seven 205 00:09:10,720 --> 00:09:12,680 Speaker 3: years ago now, and it was really like I remember 206 00:09:12,679 --> 00:09:15,360 Speaker 3: the cover of New York Times like fat is back, Baby, 207 00:09:15,400 --> 00:09:17,520 Speaker 3: and it was all like everyone was like, yeah, saturated 208 00:09:17,559 --> 00:09:19,880 Speaker 3: fat is good for us. But I think that messaging 209 00:09:19,920 --> 00:09:21,640 Speaker 3: got a bit mixed up and a lot of what 210 00:09:21,679 --> 00:09:24,559 Speaker 3: we think about with dairy. Isn't that saturated fat as good? 211 00:09:24,679 --> 00:09:27,680 Speaker 3: It was really the messaging was saturated fat as neutral. 212 00:09:27,880 --> 00:09:30,079 Speaker 3: It's not as bad as what we thought in terms 213 00:09:30,080 --> 00:09:32,680 Speaker 3: of it being available in dairy, but it's actually not 214 00:09:32,760 --> 00:09:35,440 Speaker 3: good for our health either, And so for me with 215 00:09:35,520 --> 00:09:38,480 Speaker 3: my clients, I generally do recommend lower fat dairy, but 216 00:09:38,600 --> 00:09:40,360 Speaker 3: if they want to have full fat dairy, I'm happy 217 00:09:40,400 --> 00:09:42,560 Speaker 3: with it if they can cut down the rest of 218 00:09:42,559 --> 00:09:44,960 Speaker 3: the saturated fat in the bulk of their diet as well. 219 00:09:45,040 --> 00:09:47,640 Speaker 3: So I don't have a hard stance on butter or marge, 220 00:09:47,640 --> 00:09:49,920 Speaker 3: but I personally would use something that just spreads a 221 00:09:49,920 --> 00:09:52,679 Speaker 3: little bit better on the slight occasion that I do 222 00:09:52,720 --> 00:09:52,960 Speaker 3: have it. 223 00:09:53,120 --> 00:09:55,079 Speaker 1: I think that one of the issues in the margarine 224 00:09:55,120 --> 00:09:58,400 Speaker 1: slash butter section is they're quite misleading because there's quite 225 00:09:58,400 --> 00:10:01,240 Speaker 1: a few tubs that mask a ray as a butter spread. 226 00:10:01,280 --> 00:10:03,400 Speaker 1: But when you take a closer look at the ingredient list, 227 00:10:03,440 --> 00:10:05,679 Speaker 1: they actually have a vegetable oil base with some butter. 228 00:10:06,200 --> 00:10:10,240 Speaker 1: There's actually only one fully one hundred percent butter that's spreadable. 229 00:10:10,280 --> 00:10:12,319 Speaker 1: I think it's the mainland one out of New Zealand, 230 00:10:12,720 --> 00:10:14,640 Speaker 1: Whereas you know some of them like the lurpack. It's 231 00:10:14,640 --> 00:10:16,560 Speaker 1: actually vegetable oil with a little bit of butter, so 232 00:10:16,840 --> 00:10:19,240 Speaker 1: you have to be careful with that and really check. 233 00:10:19,280 --> 00:10:22,520 Speaker 1: And the same with things like the avocado spread or 234 00:10:22,559 --> 00:10:25,640 Speaker 1: the olive oil spread. When you actually look, the olive 235 00:10:25,640 --> 00:10:28,200 Speaker 1: oil or the avocado are much lower on the ingredient list, 236 00:10:28,280 --> 00:10:31,560 Speaker 1: so it's not healthier necessarily. So I'm with you, you know, 237 00:10:31,600 --> 00:10:34,120 Speaker 1: if you want a little bit for your vegemite toast, 238 00:10:34,200 --> 00:10:35,679 Speaker 1: I think one of the better ones is like the 239 00:10:35,760 --> 00:10:36,640 Speaker 1: Nutterleg's light. 240 00:10:37,200 --> 00:10:38,840 Speaker 2: But I am absolutely like you. 241 00:10:38,880 --> 00:10:41,680 Speaker 1: There's very few reasons I think you need it, because 242 00:10:41,720 --> 00:10:44,400 Speaker 1: if you're having toast, well, I'm probably going to want 243 00:10:44,440 --> 00:10:46,959 Speaker 1: you to have it with protein. So whether it's eggs, well, 244 00:10:46,960 --> 00:10:48,760 Speaker 1: you don't need a spread. If having eggs because the 245 00:10:48,800 --> 00:10:51,400 Speaker 1: eggs are running, or if you're having nuts spread, you 246 00:10:51,440 --> 00:10:54,040 Speaker 1: don't need butter as well, you know, So I think 247 00:10:54,040 --> 00:10:55,920 Speaker 1: there's a lot of opportunity to cut right back on it. 248 00:10:55,960 --> 00:10:58,480 Speaker 1: The same if you're making a wrap or use avocado thin, 249 00:10:58,800 --> 00:11:01,600 Speaker 1: you know, or some tahini or some hommus, they're going 250 00:11:01,640 --> 00:11:04,160 Speaker 1: to be much much better to zeki, you know, they're 251 00:11:04,280 --> 00:11:06,840 Speaker 1: much better choices to sort of get that baseline out 252 00:11:06,840 --> 00:11:10,640 Speaker 1: of the overall diet. And yeah, I hear what you're 253 00:11:10,640 --> 00:11:13,480 Speaker 1: saying about the butter in terms of spreadable and as 254 00:11:13,480 --> 00:11:15,280 Speaker 1: I said that, the mainland one is actually the only 255 00:11:15,280 --> 00:11:17,600 Speaker 1: one that is one hundred percent butter. But I think 256 00:11:17,679 --> 00:11:19,640 Speaker 1: for both of us, the take home message is the 257 00:11:19,720 --> 00:11:23,480 Speaker 1: less of both the better, because nutritionally we don't need either, 258 00:11:24,040 --> 00:11:26,640 Speaker 1: and it's more if it's playing a functional role, you know, 259 00:11:26,679 --> 00:11:28,679 Speaker 1: you want to go for as little as possible or 260 00:11:28,760 --> 00:11:31,839 Speaker 1: substituted in. But I think another thing we both wanted 261 00:11:31,840 --> 00:11:34,360 Speaker 1: to talk about was the cholesterol lowering margarine. 262 00:11:34,480 --> 00:11:36,480 Speaker 2: So they're still on the market. Now. 263 00:11:36,520 --> 00:11:38,959 Speaker 1: A cholesterol margarine has a plant sterol in it. It's 264 00:11:39,000 --> 00:11:43,240 Speaker 1: a naturally occurring compound that's been concentrated because there is 265 00:11:43,320 --> 00:11:45,360 Speaker 1: good evidence to show that two to three grams of 266 00:11:45,360 --> 00:11:48,360 Speaker 1: plant sterols per day can block basically pops into the 267 00:11:48,360 --> 00:11:50,840 Speaker 1: spot of cholesterol in the body and helps to reduce 268 00:11:50,920 --> 00:11:52,880 Speaker 1: cholesterol levels I want to say by about ten percent, 269 00:11:52,960 --> 00:11:56,960 Speaker 1: so a clinically significant level. Now, the issue with those 270 00:11:57,200 --> 00:12:01,520 Speaker 1: is that adding plant sterols into margarine processed food and 271 00:12:01,559 --> 00:12:04,040 Speaker 1: having to use you know, two three tablespoons a day 272 00:12:04,080 --> 00:12:07,560 Speaker 1: to me is ridiculous because you're basically encouraging people to 273 00:12:07,600 --> 00:12:11,040 Speaker 1: add more vegetable oil into their diet to get this bonus. 274 00:12:11,360 --> 00:12:13,320 Speaker 1: When you can get plant sterols and some milks in 275 00:12:13,360 --> 00:12:16,240 Speaker 1: some cholesterolwering oh it's Carmen's Due, and wheatbeaks have got 276 00:12:16,280 --> 00:12:19,160 Speaker 1: a cholesterolwering cereal. I think also Callogg's one of their 277 00:12:19,160 --> 00:12:22,800 Speaker 1: ore brands, it's cholesterol lowering or Guardian. So there's much 278 00:12:22,880 --> 00:12:27,080 Speaker 1: better foods to get plant sterols from then proactively, and 279 00:12:27,080 --> 00:12:29,720 Speaker 1: I think that was one of the names of the margarine. Actually, yeah, 280 00:12:29,720 --> 00:12:33,240 Speaker 1: them pro actively adding all that vegetable oil back into 281 00:12:33,280 --> 00:12:36,360 Speaker 1: the diet. So two to three tablespoons of margarine per day, 282 00:12:36,440 --> 00:12:38,880 Speaker 1: even in a reduced fat variety, is ridiculous to be 283 00:12:39,000 --> 00:12:42,520 Speaker 1: doing that. So I certainly do not recommend that to anyone. 284 00:12:42,559 --> 00:12:45,440 Speaker 1: And if I recommend plant sterols, it's certainly not via margarine. 285 00:12:45,480 --> 00:12:47,880 Speaker 1: I'm doing it via the milk or the cereals that 286 00:12:47,920 --> 00:12:49,880 Speaker 1: you can find. And I think there'll be a growing 287 00:12:49,960 --> 00:12:52,400 Speaker 1: range of foods, as there is in Europe that also 288 00:12:52,480 --> 00:12:55,400 Speaker 1: contain those concentrated amounts of plant sterols. You certainly don't 289 00:12:55,440 --> 00:12:58,600 Speaker 1: need to be adding margarine and eating more bread to 290 00:12:58,679 --> 00:13:01,080 Speaker 1: get those cholesterol lowering betters. You know, you're just going 291 00:13:01,120 --> 00:13:03,800 Speaker 1: to be as good with ten walnuts a day and 292 00:13:03,880 --> 00:13:05,440 Speaker 1: losing a bit of weight and some more oily fish, 293 00:13:05,520 --> 00:13:08,200 Speaker 1: let alone adding sort of margarine back in. So we 294 00:13:08,320 --> 00:13:11,080 Speaker 1: both you know, feel quite strongly about that that they're 295 00:13:11,160 --> 00:13:14,600 Speaker 1: certainly not necessary. And if you must get a margarine, 296 00:13:14,600 --> 00:13:16,760 Speaker 1: I'd get a light one and use it very sparingly, 297 00:13:16,800 --> 00:13:18,800 Speaker 1: and the same if your preference is to spend more 298 00:13:18,840 --> 00:13:20,640 Speaker 1: and get the butter, because let's be honest, the butters 299 00:13:20,640 --> 00:13:23,360 Speaker 1: are expensive. You know, I think two hundred and fifty 300 00:13:23,360 --> 00:13:26,160 Speaker 1: grams of unsold butter is over three bucks. Now, you 301 00:13:26,200 --> 00:13:28,920 Speaker 1: know it's not insignificant in the household spend. So yeah, 302 00:13:28,920 --> 00:13:30,800 Speaker 1: the more you can substitute it for things like a 303 00:13:30,840 --> 00:13:33,560 Speaker 1: bit of homus or tazeki thin or one hundred percent 304 00:13:33,640 --> 00:13:35,360 Speaker 1: nuts spread, or skip it all together, a bit of 305 00:13:35,720 --> 00:13:38,000 Speaker 1: vegimie and an egg on toast, you got to be 306 00:13:38,080 --> 00:13:41,840 Speaker 1: much better for the entire family than thinking that you 307 00:13:41,920 --> 00:13:44,000 Speaker 1: need it or there's some better fit to adding that 308 00:13:44,040 --> 00:13:44,679 Speaker 1: into the diet. 309 00:13:44,760 --> 00:13:46,800 Speaker 3: Couldn't agree more And I'll just make the final point 310 00:13:46,800 --> 00:13:50,520 Speaker 3: with those cholesterol lowering margarines. So if you're not having 311 00:13:50,559 --> 00:13:53,160 Speaker 3: that two to three tablespoons a day, you're not getting 312 00:13:53,160 --> 00:13:55,400 Speaker 3: in the clinical effects. So a lot of people will, 313 00:13:55,640 --> 00:13:58,160 Speaker 3: you know, they buy those Marjories and they're not too bither. 314 00:13:58,160 --> 00:14:00,600 Speaker 3: There's six seven eight bucks a tub and just using 315 00:14:00,640 --> 00:14:02,839 Speaker 3: like half a teaspoon off that you will not get 316 00:14:02,880 --> 00:14:06,200 Speaker 3: the full benefits unless you're using a couple of tablespoons 317 00:14:06,240 --> 00:14:09,000 Speaker 3: every day, which for most people with high cholesterol, let's 318 00:14:09,000 --> 00:14:11,480 Speaker 3: be honest, they probably should be losing weight as well, 319 00:14:11,559 --> 00:14:13,640 Speaker 3: so it's really not something that's going to be conducive 320 00:14:13,679 --> 00:14:15,960 Speaker 3: to a healthy diet. So I'm like you, Susie, I 321 00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:18,559 Speaker 3: never really ever recommend them. I would much do something 322 00:14:18,559 --> 00:14:20,720 Speaker 3: like the cholesterol lowering rootbigs or the milk if they 323 00:14:20,760 --> 00:14:23,360 Speaker 3: have like regular coffee drinks as well, which brings us 324 00:14:23,440 --> 00:14:25,960 Speaker 3: nicely into the last sort of listener question this week. 325 00:14:26,000 --> 00:14:28,200 Speaker 3: But before we do that, we're going to jump into 326 00:14:28,200 --> 00:14:31,360 Speaker 3: a little chit chat on diet and breast cancer because 327 00:14:31,360 --> 00:14:33,360 Speaker 3: this is sort of a great little media article that 328 00:14:33,440 --> 00:14:35,440 Speaker 3: came through. There's a little bit of sort of new 329 00:14:35,520 --> 00:14:40,080 Speaker 3: research and evidence around breast cancer and diet, which we 330 00:14:40,120 --> 00:14:42,920 Speaker 3: know it's a very large cancer in Australia, and you 331 00:14:42,960 --> 00:14:45,960 Speaker 3: know also around the rest of the world. Whenever we see, 332 00:14:46,280 --> 00:14:48,920 Speaker 3: I guess, new research and data with breast cancer, particularly 333 00:14:48,920 --> 00:14:51,560 Speaker 3: related to nutrients and food, it always sort of, you know, 334 00:14:51,640 --> 00:14:54,840 Speaker 3: sparks our interest as dietitians. So the study that we're 335 00:14:54,880 --> 00:14:59,000 Speaker 3: looking at is essentially the Nutrient White Association Study of 336 00:14:59,120 --> 00:15:02,800 Speaker 3: ninety two Food and nutrients and their Risk on breast cancer. 337 00:15:03,000 --> 00:15:06,120 Speaker 3: So this is a fairly recent study twenty twenty and 338 00:15:06,200 --> 00:15:09,640 Speaker 3: it was published in the journal of the journal was 339 00:15:09,680 --> 00:15:12,800 Speaker 3: BMC and published under the Breast Cancer Research sort of 340 00:15:12,920 --> 00:15:15,360 Speaker 3: arm of that. So I will let you talk our 341 00:15:15,360 --> 00:15:17,960 Speaker 3: listeners through this study today, SUSI, because I think you're 342 00:15:17,960 --> 00:15:19,480 Speaker 3: a little bit more across it than I am. 343 00:15:20,000 --> 00:15:21,560 Speaker 1: I wanted to still lead in because it is one 344 00:15:21,560 --> 00:15:25,200 Speaker 1: of the most common cancers in females, second after skin cancer, 345 00:15:25,560 --> 00:15:28,320 Speaker 1: and close to twenty thousand women a year in Australia 346 00:15:28,320 --> 00:15:31,640 Speaker 1: are diagnosed with breast cancer, and because the survival rates 347 00:15:31,640 --> 00:15:33,840 Speaker 1: are so much better than they once were. You know, 348 00:15:33,840 --> 00:15:37,560 Speaker 1: we've got about eighty thousand women living and managing ongoing 349 00:15:37,560 --> 00:15:40,720 Speaker 1: symptoms or recovering from breast cancer. And of course some 350 00:15:40,760 --> 00:15:43,880 Speaker 1: of the latest drugs like tomoxyphen that people will be 351 00:15:43,960 --> 00:15:46,480 Speaker 1: on for many years can have a profound effect on 352 00:15:46,520 --> 00:15:49,280 Speaker 1: appetite and weight. So a lot of women in my 353 00:15:49,360 --> 00:15:52,560 Speaker 1: experience going through breast cancer treatment really do struggle with 354 00:15:52,600 --> 00:15:53,200 Speaker 1: weight control. 355 00:15:53,240 --> 00:15:54,560 Speaker 2: So I thought it was a really good topic. 356 00:15:54,640 --> 00:15:57,000 Speaker 1: Knowing that a lot of our listeners are females, I'm 357 00:15:57,040 --> 00:16:00,480 Speaker 1: sure if it's not someone that you know, there's probably 358 00:16:00,480 --> 00:16:02,160 Speaker 1: had breast cancer or will pop up. 359 00:16:02,240 --> 00:16:05,960 Speaker 2: Unfortunately, because it's I think one in seven. 360 00:16:06,000 --> 00:16:07,200 Speaker 1: I have a look at that stat in the second 361 00:16:07,240 --> 00:16:09,960 Speaker 1: when Land's talking, But you know, a really high proportion 362 00:16:10,000 --> 00:16:12,320 Speaker 1: of women are exposed to that hormonal cancer or can 363 00:16:12,360 --> 00:16:17,000 Speaker 1: be hormonal cancer and lifestyle. You know, factors are related. 364 00:16:17,120 --> 00:16:20,359 Speaker 1: So when we have a look at the overall data 365 00:16:20,480 --> 00:16:24,720 Speaker 1: or a summary data, one of the biggest risk factors 366 00:16:24,800 --> 00:16:28,560 Speaker 1: from a dietary perspective is alcohol intake. Now I would 367 00:16:28,600 --> 00:16:31,720 Speaker 1: say anecdotally weight is also associated. I think we know 368 00:16:31,840 --> 00:16:34,800 Speaker 1: that from the evidence that eight and obesity is a 369 00:16:34,880 --> 00:16:38,000 Speaker 1: risk for many different types of cancer. But one of 370 00:16:38,080 --> 00:16:41,160 Speaker 1: the specific areas that we do know is that in 371 00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:45,920 Speaker 1: this pool of fifty three studies, women who had two 372 00:16:45,960 --> 00:16:48,800 Speaker 1: to three alcoholic drinks per day had a twenty percent 373 00:16:48,880 --> 00:16:52,400 Speaker 1: higher risk of developing breast cancer overall. So if you 374 00:16:52,440 --> 00:16:56,040 Speaker 1: were targeting one specific food type. Certainly alcohol can be 375 00:16:56,320 --> 00:16:59,960 Speaker 1: significantly increase risk because there are different types of ca 376 00:17:00,000 --> 00:17:04,040 Speaker 1: anser and some of them are estrogen receptor related cancers. Certainly, 377 00:17:04,119 --> 00:17:08,000 Speaker 1: people who have a particularly high vegetable intake have a 378 00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:12,880 Speaker 1: lower risk of the estrogen receptor negative breast cancer. So 379 00:17:13,160 --> 00:17:16,480 Speaker 1: again coming back to that Mediterranean style approach, really loading 380 00:17:16,560 --> 00:17:20,520 Speaker 1: up on the vegetable is highly protective against specifically some 381 00:17:20,680 --> 00:17:22,960 Speaker 1: types of cancer. And then when we have a look 382 00:17:23,000 --> 00:17:27,439 Speaker 1: at overall risk and managing and trying to prevent recurrence 383 00:17:27,800 --> 00:17:33,800 Speaker 1: and supporting longevity when living or surviving breast cancer, it 384 00:17:33,840 --> 00:17:39,160 Speaker 1: does come backly onto that anti inflammatory diet Mediterranean style approach. 385 00:17:39,720 --> 00:17:45,119 Speaker 1: And now the area specifically related is plant based diets 386 00:17:45,119 --> 00:17:49,160 Speaker 1: have a significantly reduced risk of developing breast cancer. So 387 00:17:49,440 --> 00:17:53,680 Speaker 1: it's about different sort of picking out different parts, but 388 00:17:53,800 --> 00:17:57,639 Speaker 1: there's some of the key dietary determinants. So again it 389 00:17:57,680 --> 00:18:00,720 Speaker 1: comes back to more plant based foods, less processed foods 390 00:18:00,760 --> 00:18:04,280 Speaker 1: in general, and certainly alcohol is an independent risk factor 391 00:18:04,800 --> 00:18:06,960 Speaker 1: with the diet in general. So for people who have 392 00:18:07,040 --> 00:18:11,080 Speaker 1: sort of got that wine habit that's crept in, certainly 393 00:18:11,160 --> 00:18:13,320 Speaker 1: it's something to look at particularly if there's a family 394 00:18:13,400 --> 00:18:15,199 Speaker 1: history of breast cancer or you are aware that you 395 00:18:15,240 --> 00:18:17,280 Speaker 1: may have one of those genes as we learn more 396 00:18:17,320 --> 00:18:20,480 Speaker 1: about the gene and genetic risk. But what I will 397 00:18:20,480 --> 00:18:23,480 Speaker 1: also say is that in my work, I've never worked 398 00:18:23,520 --> 00:18:27,359 Speaker 1: directly with people who are managing cancer and particularly when 399 00:18:27,359 --> 00:18:30,280 Speaker 1: they're going through treatment. But I have seen a lot 400 00:18:30,280 --> 00:18:32,239 Speaker 1: of women who have had breast cancer and are then 401 00:18:32,359 --> 00:18:36,240 Speaker 1: looking at the subsequent weight gain many years later and 402 00:18:36,240 --> 00:18:39,360 Speaker 1: trying to keep it at bay. So this is anecdotally, 403 00:18:39,359 --> 00:18:41,280 Speaker 1: but this is just my experience of working with these 404 00:18:41,320 --> 00:18:43,680 Speaker 1: women who are trying to support their health long term. 405 00:18:44,080 --> 00:18:48,000 Speaker 1: They will often come out of the treatment significantly higher 406 00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:49,959 Speaker 1: weights than when they went in because it can make 407 00:18:50,000 --> 00:18:53,200 Speaker 1: them feel quite nauseous. It's very difficult to eat well 408 00:18:53,240 --> 00:18:55,880 Speaker 1: when you're going through terrible treatment. They retain a lot 409 00:18:55,880 --> 00:18:58,280 Speaker 1: of fluid, they have a general puffiness, and they're certainly 410 00:18:58,480 --> 00:19:01,520 Speaker 1: in many cases because eating sometimes throughout the treatment will 411 00:19:01,520 --> 00:19:05,439 Speaker 1: make you feel better and support reduce that nausea that 412 00:19:05,480 --> 00:19:09,520 Speaker 1: you can experience. So the first sort of part working 413 00:19:09,600 --> 00:19:11,800 Speaker 1: on is just trying to get their energy back. There's 414 00:19:11,840 --> 00:19:15,240 Speaker 1: often an ongoing fatigue that is associated for several years 415 00:19:15,320 --> 00:19:19,120 Speaker 1: after breast cancer treatment where you feel extremely tired, want 416 00:19:19,160 --> 00:19:22,040 Speaker 1: to sleep a lot. You know, it really does take 417 00:19:22,080 --> 00:19:23,560 Speaker 1: quite a lot of time to get what we would 418 00:19:23,560 --> 00:19:26,840 Speaker 1: describe as your energy back. So it's about balancing the 419 00:19:26,920 --> 00:19:33,000 Speaker 1: nutrient requirements with your energy levels and energy demands. But certainly, 420 00:19:33,480 --> 00:19:37,159 Speaker 1: you know there is evidence and suggestion that actively working 421 00:19:37,240 --> 00:19:40,439 Speaker 1: to keep weight under control and reduce excess weight is 422 00:19:40,440 --> 00:19:43,560 Speaker 1: a key part of that. And really shifting the diet 423 00:19:43,600 --> 00:19:45,960 Speaker 1: to have a much higher proportion of plants, so really 424 00:19:45,960 --> 00:19:48,440 Speaker 1: paying a lot more attention to how often you're having 425 00:19:48,440 --> 00:19:53,280 Speaker 1: red meat, focusing on those thirty different plant sources each week, 426 00:19:53,520 --> 00:19:56,080 Speaker 1: you know, really considering a plant based diet a lot 427 00:19:56,119 --> 00:19:58,840 Speaker 1: more of the time, and really being quite strict on 428 00:19:58,880 --> 00:20:01,639 Speaker 1: things like your sugar, your process foods, and your alcohol. 429 00:20:02,200 --> 00:20:05,639 Speaker 1: One with the goal of helping reduce that risk in 430 00:20:05,680 --> 00:20:09,760 Speaker 1: general of malignancy occurring again. But second, trying to reduce weight, 431 00:20:09,920 --> 00:20:12,600 Speaker 1: because we know that when there are weight issues there 432 00:20:12,640 --> 00:20:15,440 Speaker 1: and if insulin's working over time, it is a growth hormone. 433 00:20:15,680 --> 00:20:19,040 Speaker 1: So keeping inchulin under control and eating according to those principles, 434 00:20:19,080 --> 00:20:22,280 Speaker 1: where you're perhaps having longer periods of time in between meals, 435 00:20:22,320 --> 00:20:25,320 Speaker 1: you're reducing the carbohydrate load of the diet. You may 436 00:20:25,359 --> 00:20:29,400 Speaker 1: also introduce some regular fasting days to give that metabolic benefit, 437 00:20:29,680 --> 00:20:33,080 Speaker 1: because again when we look at some of the fasting benefits, 438 00:20:33,520 --> 00:20:37,840 Speaker 1: having lower calorie days is significantly shown to help improve 439 00:20:37,880 --> 00:20:41,960 Speaker 1: metabolic function, improve immune system function, and that's above and 440 00:20:42,040 --> 00:20:46,199 Speaker 1: beyond weight loss. So certainly clinically, these are some of 441 00:20:46,240 --> 00:20:49,199 Speaker 1: the areas that you can actively intervene if that you 442 00:20:49,280 --> 00:20:51,920 Speaker 1: have had that treatment and really trying long term to 443 00:20:51,960 --> 00:20:56,360 Speaker 1: promote longevity and reduce risk of cancer recurrence. They would 444 00:20:56,400 --> 00:20:58,520 Speaker 1: all be areas that I would be encouraging people to 445 00:20:58,560 --> 00:21:01,720 Speaker 1: give a go because there is good evidence to show 446 00:21:01,760 --> 00:21:06,679 Speaker 1: there's numerous cellular and hormonal benefits from incorporating some regular 447 00:21:06,720 --> 00:21:09,560 Speaker 1: lo calorie days as part of that active management. Once 448 00:21:09,600 --> 00:21:12,000 Speaker 1: you get kind of your energy back after the treatment, 449 00:21:12,359 --> 00:21:14,520 Speaker 1: that's not the time to be sort of dieting strictly. 450 00:21:14,560 --> 00:21:17,560 Speaker 1: It certainly once you're on that path where you're feeling 451 00:21:18,200 --> 00:21:20,600 Speaker 1: a bit normally getting fully recovered, that we would try 452 00:21:20,640 --> 00:21:22,240 Speaker 1: some of those dietary interventions. 453 00:21:22,440 --> 00:21:24,280 Speaker 3: Yeah, I really like this study because I think it 454 00:21:24,400 --> 00:21:28,199 Speaker 3: highlights the need just for general well balanced health and 455 00:21:28,240 --> 00:21:30,760 Speaker 3: the two things is study really identify that the two 456 00:21:30,880 --> 00:21:33,400 Speaker 3: key besides olcohol, like you mentioned, t have the key 457 00:21:33,560 --> 00:21:36,720 Speaker 3: dietary factors that actually influence things like breast cancer and 458 00:21:36,800 --> 00:21:40,920 Speaker 3: risk long term with fiber intake. And also it said fruit, 459 00:21:41,000 --> 00:21:43,399 Speaker 3: but specifically it's said apples, So it's sort of like 460 00:21:43,440 --> 00:21:45,120 Speaker 3: that saying, what is it an apple a day keeps 461 00:21:45,119 --> 00:21:47,480 Speaker 3: the doctor away. So apples were shown for you really 462 00:21:47,520 --> 00:21:51,119 Speaker 3: protective against breast cancer risk and overall fiber intake. So 463 00:21:51,240 --> 00:21:53,879 Speaker 3: just making sure you're not doing anything that's silly or 464 00:21:53,880 --> 00:21:56,840 Speaker 3: overly restrictive, like a chutogenic diet or doing anything that's 465 00:21:56,880 --> 00:22:00,680 Speaker 3: super low carbohydrate, because although things like fasting and reducing 466 00:22:00,720 --> 00:22:04,240 Speaker 3: carbs down might be ideal for weight loss, high fiber 467 00:22:04,320 --> 00:22:08,080 Speaker 3: intake was positively associated with reducing breast cancer. So we 468 00:22:08,119 --> 00:22:10,240 Speaker 3: definitely don't want to cut out all calms, but we 469 00:22:10,320 --> 00:22:12,720 Speaker 3: have to be smart with the types of carbohydrates that 470 00:22:12,760 --> 00:22:15,639 Speaker 3: we're choosing and really aiming for thirty grams if not 471 00:22:15,840 --> 00:22:19,000 Speaker 3: higher in terms of our general fiber intakes each day. 472 00:22:19,119 --> 00:22:21,800 Speaker 3: And that's a general recommendation. You know, people are very different. 473 00:22:21,840 --> 00:22:23,399 Speaker 3: If you've got a sense it about a bit of 474 00:22:23,480 --> 00:22:26,120 Speaker 3: ibs or you've got some sort of you know, stricturing 475 00:22:26,280 --> 00:22:28,320 Speaker 3: type disease or issues with your bower, you might need 476 00:22:28,400 --> 00:22:32,359 Speaker 3: significantly less fiber, but for the large majority, most people 477 00:22:32,400 --> 00:22:34,639 Speaker 3: that they sort of studied and look back on really 478 00:22:34,840 --> 00:22:36,840 Speaker 3: did much better and how to reduce risk with a 479 00:22:36,960 --> 00:22:39,800 Speaker 3: higher fiber, more plant based index. So just I guess 480 00:22:39,840 --> 00:22:43,000 Speaker 3: the final summary is just a well balanced, healthy diet 481 00:22:43,160 --> 00:22:45,439 Speaker 3: and if you're struggling to understand how to increase the 482 00:22:45,440 --> 00:22:48,000 Speaker 3: amount of fiber in your diet or what you know, 483 00:22:48,160 --> 00:22:50,680 Speaker 3: more plant based eating looks like, definitely link in one 484 00:22:50,680 --> 00:22:52,560 Speaker 3: on one with a dietician to really give you some 485 00:22:52,640 --> 00:22:54,359 Speaker 3: of that personalized advice for that. 486 00:22:54,760 --> 00:22:57,600 Speaker 1: And I think just specifically looking at the fiber, I 487 00:22:57,680 --> 00:22:59,800 Speaker 1: think someone as we assume they am, we're having enough 488 00:23:00,040 --> 00:23:03,280 Speaker 1: dietary fiber. So the recommendation for dietary fiber is thirty 489 00:23:03,320 --> 00:23:07,000 Speaker 1: grams per day, so a guarantee if you're not having 490 00:23:07,040 --> 00:23:09,439 Speaker 1: a whole grain cereal in the morning for breakfast, So 491 00:23:09,480 --> 00:23:12,879 Speaker 1: if you're reaching for a slice of plain, a toast 492 00:23:13,000 --> 00:23:15,560 Speaker 1: or a wrap in the morning, and then you might 493 00:23:15,560 --> 00:23:17,760 Speaker 1: have salad at lunchtime, which can be a little bit 494 00:23:17,800 --> 00:23:21,320 Speaker 1: lower in dietary fiber than vegetables, and then in the 495 00:23:21,359 --> 00:23:24,600 Speaker 1: afternoon you might grab I don't know berries, You might 496 00:23:24,640 --> 00:23:28,000 Speaker 1: grab some crackers, some cheese, and then at dinner time 497 00:23:28,080 --> 00:23:30,480 Speaker 1: you might have one or two veggies. Your fiber will 498 00:23:30,480 --> 00:23:32,800 Speaker 1: be about half what you need it to be. So 499 00:23:33,520 --> 00:23:35,880 Speaker 1: to get that thirty grams of dietary fiber a day, 500 00:23:35,920 --> 00:23:37,480 Speaker 1: you really need to have a couple of serves of 501 00:23:37,480 --> 00:23:40,440 Speaker 1: whole grain bread or whole grain cereal to start the day. 502 00:23:40,920 --> 00:23:43,080 Speaker 1: You need two to three cups of salad at lunch, 503 00:23:43,160 --> 00:23:45,520 Speaker 1: and then another two to three cups at veggies at 504 00:23:45,520 --> 00:23:49,159 Speaker 1: dinner to get anywhere near thirty grams of dietary fiber 505 00:23:49,160 --> 00:23:51,480 Speaker 1: per day. And I think something we've talked about on 506 00:23:51,520 --> 00:23:55,200 Speaker 1: the potty before lean is that you sometimes see these 507 00:23:55,359 --> 00:24:00,199 Speaker 1: new higher fiber kind of wraps and snack bars, but 508 00:24:00,280 --> 00:24:02,479 Speaker 1: the kind of fiber they have in them is that 509 00:24:02,560 --> 00:24:06,120 Speaker 1: kind of we've talked about this before, more processed dietary fiber. 510 00:24:06,440 --> 00:24:07,720 Speaker 3: It's always refined fiber. 511 00:24:08,000 --> 00:24:11,480 Speaker 1: Yeah, and so it's certainly not as good as the 512 00:24:11,640 --> 00:24:14,120 Speaker 1: vegetable fiber that we get, the fiber we get from 513 00:24:14,119 --> 00:24:17,280 Speaker 1: the skin on fresh fruits and vegetables, which is particularly 514 00:24:17,280 --> 00:24:20,480 Speaker 1: relevant coming into stonefruit season in the apples as well, 515 00:24:20,560 --> 00:24:22,280 Speaker 1: not by chance, because that's where a lot of those 516 00:24:22,320 --> 00:24:26,760 Speaker 1: antioxidant pheneral compounds are, which are the anti cancer molecules, 517 00:24:27,920 --> 00:24:30,880 Speaker 1: and then the whole grain breads and cereals, which people 518 00:24:30,960 --> 00:24:33,480 Speaker 1: sometimes on a gluten free diet may have eliminated or 519 00:24:33,560 --> 00:24:36,520 Speaker 1: they might be choosing raps instead because they're perceived as healthier. 520 00:24:36,920 --> 00:24:39,160 Speaker 1: And so if you haven't listened to our wrap episode, 521 00:24:39,200 --> 00:24:42,480 Speaker 1: it's worth listening to because whilst on the label they 522 00:24:42,520 --> 00:24:45,119 Speaker 1: say high in fiber, it's not the same kind of 523 00:24:45,240 --> 00:24:48,760 Speaker 1: natural fiber that you're getting from grain, seeds, nuts, And 524 00:24:48,840 --> 00:24:51,760 Speaker 1: if you're actively keeping it on your carbohydrate intake and 525 00:24:51,960 --> 00:24:54,480 Speaker 1: or buying a lot of food away from the home, 526 00:24:54,920 --> 00:24:57,440 Speaker 1: I guarantee you a't be getting anywhere near that source 527 00:24:57,480 --> 00:25:00,159 Speaker 1: of dietary fiber. So if you are listening in you 528 00:25:00,200 --> 00:25:02,399 Speaker 1: know you've got a particular breast cancer risk or you 529 00:25:02,440 --> 00:25:05,360 Speaker 1: have had breast cancer, just really have a quick look 530 00:25:05,359 --> 00:25:08,440 Speaker 1: at actually how much real quality dietary fiber you're including. 531 00:25:08,680 --> 00:25:12,440 Speaker 1: And of course we haven't mentioned the super veggies when 532 00:25:12,440 --> 00:25:14,679 Speaker 1: it comes to cancer risk, which we probably should have 533 00:25:14,720 --> 00:25:19,320 Speaker 1: specifically mentioned because in the case of breast cancer prostate cancer, 534 00:25:19,680 --> 00:25:23,040 Speaker 1: the best veggies or the strongest veggie links are the 535 00:25:23,119 --> 00:25:26,480 Speaker 1: cruciferous group of vegetables, so that's our cauliflower, are broccoli, 536 00:25:26,880 --> 00:25:31,040 Speaker 1: Brussels sprouts, kale. These have these very powerful anti cancer 537 00:25:31,040 --> 00:25:33,639 Speaker 1: molecules in them and they are specifically linked actually just 538 00:25:33,680 --> 00:25:36,880 Speaker 1: thinking about it, to a reduction in specific types of cancer, 539 00:25:37,040 --> 00:25:40,080 Speaker 1: including breast cancer. So you would want to be including 540 00:25:40,119 --> 00:25:44,080 Speaker 1: at least one serve, if not two, of broccoli cauliflower 541 00:25:44,119 --> 00:25:47,080 Speaker 1: each day, particularly if this is you and you're at 542 00:25:47,119 --> 00:25:49,720 Speaker 1: risk or you're recovering and want to reduce your risk 543 00:25:49,800 --> 00:25:53,320 Speaker 1: long term of recurrence. So those super green veggies are 544 00:25:53,359 --> 00:25:56,200 Speaker 1: known as that for a reason, and they have these 545 00:25:56,280 --> 00:25:58,720 Speaker 1: very very powerful anti cancer molecules in there, and they're 546 00:25:58,720 --> 00:26:02,040 Speaker 1: also very very high in dietary but certainly foods that 547 00:26:02,040 --> 00:26:03,960 Speaker 1: you would want to really be targeting in the diet 548 00:26:04,440 --> 00:26:07,919 Speaker 1: to help reduce cancer risk. All right, Well, that then 549 00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:11,040 Speaker 1: leads us on to a topic much more palatable than 550 00:26:11,160 --> 00:26:13,280 Speaker 1: a coffee, because we all like a bit of coffee 551 00:26:13,320 --> 00:26:16,040 Speaker 1: gets us through our day, might be the highlight of 552 00:26:16,040 --> 00:26:19,320 Speaker 1: the day for some of us. But your question, I 553 00:26:19,320 --> 00:26:22,199 Speaker 1: think came from a client of yours calcium and what 554 00:26:22,280 --> 00:26:25,680 Speaker 1: do you do to help optimize calcium absorption If you're 555 00:26:25,680 --> 00:26:28,320 Speaker 1: a bit of a coffee fan, So the question. 556 00:26:28,160 --> 00:26:31,800 Speaker 3: Was really around does coffee reduce calcium absorption? So my 557 00:26:31,880 --> 00:26:34,399 Speaker 3: client was sort of she basically said to me, Okay, 558 00:26:34,440 --> 00:26:36,520 Speaker 3: I have a cup of like she has a milky coffee. 559 00:26:36,600 --> 00:26:39,199 Speaker 3: She said, can I count that in my caffeine intake? 560 00:26:39,440 --> 00:26:43,040 Speaker 3: And does coffee actually reduce my calcium absorption and make 561 00:26:43,119 --> 00:26:46,440 Speaker 3: my bones weaker over time? So she was following she's 562 00:26:46,440 --> 00:26:48,760 Speaker 3: not anymore, but following some pages that we're giving out 563 00:26:48,840 --> 00:26:51,520 Speaker 3: some non evidence based nutrition advice or should I say, 564 00:26:51,560 --> 00:26:54,159 Speaker 3: some influences online, and she was really worried that she 565 00:26:54,200 --> 00:26:57,680 Speaker 3: should stop drinking coffee altogether because her bones would come, 566 00:26:57,880 --> 00:26:59,920 Speaker 3: you know, become brittle and lead to sort of osteoporo. 567 00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:03,000 Speaker 3: So let's set the record straight once and for all. So, 568 00:27:03,119 --> 00:27:06,119 Speaker 3: if you're adding milk to your coffee, the calcium in 569 00:27:06,200 --> 00:27:09,040 Speaker 3: that counts okay. So if you're having a standard latte 570 00:27:09,600 --> 00:27:13,400 Speaker 3: from the Barista daily, that amount of calcium in your 571 00:27:13,400 --> 00:27:15,520 Speaker 3: milk will count. Of course, if the milk is either 572 00:27:15,600 --> 00:27:17,800 Speaker 3: cow's milk or soy milk, you're getting that calcium in. 573 00:27:18,080 --> 00:27:19,879 Speaker 3: If it's more of a plant based milk, like an 574 00:27:19,920 --> 00:27:22,200 Speaker 3: almond milk or an oat milk, you probably want to 575 00:27:22,240 --> 00:27:24,560 Speaker 3: check the brand that your brist is actually using because 576 00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:27,640 Speaker 3: we can't just guarantee that it's actually fortified with calcium. 577 00:27:27,920 --> 00:27:30,080 Speaker 3: So if you're adding some sort of milk that has 578 00:27:30,200 --> 00:27:32,119 Speaker 3: got calcium in it, that will count in terms of 579 00:27:32,200 --> 00:27:37,000 Speaker 3: your coffee. Now, where the caffeine and calcium are link 580 00:27:37,080 --> 00:27:40,600 Speaker 3: comes from, So caffeine in coffee or caffeine in general 581 00:27:40,640 --> 00:27:46,040 Speaker 3: and anything can actually slightly decrease calcium absorption in your body. 582 00:27:46,520 --> 00:27:49,520 Speaker 3: So the research is actually shown that although there is 583 00:27:49,560 --> 00:27:53,760 Speaker 3: this link there, it is very very minimal, and in fact, 584 00:27:53,920 --> 00:27:57,119 Speaker 3: the amount of calcium that's actually lost through having something 585 00:27:57,200 --> 00:28:00,000 Speaker 3: like a caffeinated drink is so small that you can 586 00:28:00,160 --> 00:28:03,680 Speaker 3: totally offset this by simply adding. The research is shown 587 00:28:03,720 --> 00:28:06,440 Speaker 3: as little as one tablespoon of milk to each cup 588 00:28:06,480 --> 00:28:08,800 Speaker 3: of coffee that you drink. So essentially, if you were 589 00:28:08,840 --> 00:28:11,200 Speaker 3: having black coffee and that was all you were drinking, 590 00:28:11,240 --> 00:28:13,680 Speaker 3: and you were drinking multiple cups per day, I'm talking 591 00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:16,760 Speaker 3: upwards of three or four cups per day, you probably 592 00:28:16,800 --> 00:28:19,240 Speaker 3: will be losing a little bit of the calcium absorption 593 00:28:19,400 --> 00:28:22,119 Speaker 3: from the caffeine. But if you just added as little 594 00:28:22,160 --> 00:28:25,680 Speaker 3: as a tablespoon of milk into each cup of black coffee, 595 00:28:25,760 --> 00:28:29,360 Speaker 3: you could offset that decrease in calcium absorption, So it's 596 00:28:29,400 --> 00:28:33,159 Speaker 3: not an issue unless you're drinking multiple, multiple cups of 597 00:28:33,160 --> 00:28:36,160 Speaker 3: black coffee every single day. That would be my only 598 00:28:36,200 --> 00:28:38,640 Speaker 3: concern with that. And if you do have a concern, 599 00:28:38,720 --> 00:28:40,840 Speaker 3: I would recommend that you went and got something like 600 00:28:40,920 --> 00:28:43,360 Speaker 3: a dexa scan, which essentially is a scan of your 601 00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:46,240 Speaker 3: whole body. It shows you what your bone mineral density is, 602 00:28:46,280 --> 00:28:48,480 Speaker 3: your muscle mass, and also your fat mass as well. 603 00:28:48,600 --> 00:28:51,800 Speaker 3: It gives you a really good indication of a if 604 00:28:51,800 --> 00:28:54,320 Speaker 3: you have osteoporosis or if you're setting yourself up for 605 00:28:54,360 --> 00:28:57,440 Speaker 3: that risk longer term, because you have a low level 606 00:28:57,440 --> 00:29:01,040 Speaker 3: of bone mineral density. So nobody really needs concerned that 607 00:29:01,080 --> 00:29:04,800 Speaker 3: the coffee is leasing calcium from their bones unless you're 608 00:29:04,880 --> 00:29:07,920 Speaker 3: drinking it black, and unless you're having multiple multiple cups 609 00:29:07,920 --> 00:29:10,360 Speaker 3: of it per day and you're having no other real 610 00:29:10,480 --> 00:29:13,640 Speaker 3: you know, calcium sources in your diet. So I think 611 00:29:13,680 --> 00:29:15,560 Speaker 3: for a lot of us, we're having, you know, I hope, 612 00:29:15,680 --> 00:29:18,120 Speaker 3: well balanced nutrition. Most of us are adding milk to 613 00:29:18,160 --> 00:29:21,200 Speaker 3: our coffee because, let's be honest, honestly, taste better like that. 614 00:29:21,480 --> 00:29:23,800 Speaker 3: And i'd only really be worried if you're having upwoods 615 00:29:23,840 --> 00:29:25,520 Speaker 3: of three or four cups of coffee a day and 616 00:29:25,560 --> 00:29:26,320 Speaker 3: it's totally black. 617 00:29:26,600 --> 00:29:29,600 Speaker 1: Great advice because there's plenty of coffee drinkers and plenty 618 00:29:29,600 --> 00:29:32,120 Speaker 1: of people who need more calcium. All right, Anne, Well, 619 00:29:32,160 --> 00:29:34,120 Speaker 1: that brings us to the end of the Nutrition Couch 620 00:29:34,120 --> 00:29:36,800 Speaker 1: for another Sunday. If you haven't done so, please subscribe 621 00:29:36,840 --> 00:29:38,720 Speaker 1: and feel free to leave us a review or post 622 00:29:38,760 --> 00:29:40,640 Speaker 1: some picks of you listening to us. We love to 623 00:29:40,680 --> 00:29:42,880 Speaker 1: see that and we love to repost it. We will 624 00:29:42,920 --> 00:29:45,959 Speaker 1: see you Wednesday morning for our regular product review segment, 625 00:29:46,320 --> 00:29:48,600 Speaker 1: and we of course have more information on our website 626 00:29:48,600 --> 00:29:52,200 Speaker 1: about our products available, which is the nutritioncouch dot com. 627 00:29:52,400 --> 00:30:03,880 Speaker 2: Have a great week to the no sm