Speaker 1: Orderary speaking, I'm known as the first Sudanese footballer, but
Speaker 1: ultimately I'm a family man.
Speaker 2: Fathering a son.
Speaker 3: Takes time. Hello and welcome to this week's episode of
Speaker 3: Ordinarily Speaking. I'm narrowly Meadows. Majack daw has got a
Speaker 3: second chance at life, and he's using it to try
Speaker 3: and help others. The AFL player wants his little boy, Hendrix,
Speaker 3: to grow up in a world open to conversations around
Speaker 3: mental health. Born in Sedan, Madjack spent three years as
Speaker 3: a refugee in Egypt before relocating to Australia, where he
Speaker 3: became the first Sudanese born player in the AFL. In
Speaker 3: twenty fifteen, Madjack was found not guilty of three counts
Speaker 3: of rape, dating back to an allegation from two thousand
Speaker 3: and seven when he was sixteen years old. He now
Speaker 3: believes that court case led to a severe decline in
Speaker 3: his mental health. In December twenty eighteen, Majack attempted to
Speaker 3: take his own life in a moment of clarity. He
Speaker 3: immediately regretted the decision. As you listen to this episode,
Speaker 3: please know Lifeline can be reached on one three, double
Speaker 3: one one four. Beyond Blue dot org dot au is
Speaker 3: another place you can seek help. This is a story
Speaker 3: of a complex life told in Majack's own words. At
Speaker 3: the heart of it all, the importance of family shines through. Well.
Speaker 3: Thanks so much for agreeing to do this match. I
Speaker 3: really appreciate it. I wanted to start by asking you
Speaker 3: about your little boy, Hendrix. Biggest smile comes across your
Speaker 3: face at the moment I bring him up. What does
Speaker 3: he mean to you?
Speaker 1: I mean, I just I don't know, like coming from
Speaker 1: you know, one of nine kids, always always grown up
Speaker 1: with having little little children in my family, and then
Speaker 1: you know, when Hendrix came along, there was all these
Speaker 1: sorts of I guess, uh fears, probably.
Speaker 2: That's the right word.
Speaker 1: But as he's grown up, I've just I don't think
Speaker 1: i've I've ever loved anyone as much as as I
Speaker 1: love him. And yeah, he's just growing and just being
Speaker 1: able to teach him things as he gets older. Every
Speaker 1: time I see him, he runs over, it gives me
Speaker 1: a cuddle and you know, kiss his dad and like
Speaker 1: that's I never I never gave my dad a hug
Speaker 1: when I was growing up. So yeah, he means it
Speaker 1: well to me. Hendrix and.
Speaker 3: Why did you never hug your daughter? Just wasn't the
Speaker 3: way he did things.
Speaker 1: Or it's really not in the in my culture to
Speaker 1: show it, to show affection or anything like that. Even
Speaker 1: growing up, I just just never saw examples of it.
Speaker 1: But I mean, now I'll give my dad a hug
Speaker 1: and you know, he might feel it a bit awkward,
Speaker 1: but but yeah, just he's just so affectionate Hendrix, and
Speaker 1: he reminds he reminds me of myself a lot, and
Speaker 1: he's got so much love.
Speaker 3: And yeah, is the best thing about being dad the
Speaker 3: fact that you get to now make your dad jokes without.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think it's I can probably get away with
Speaker 1: it now, and yeah, even though they're bad, but he's not,
Speaker 1: he's not ready.
Speaker 2: To hear them.
Speaker 3: Once you go to a dad joke around the footy club,
Speaker 3: I don't.
Speaker 1: Know put me on the spot there, but I think
Speaker 1: since since coming to Melbourne, a bit a bit of
Speaker 1: Alarican when I was at North and you enjoy going
Speaker 1: into the club and making the boys laugh. But as
Speaker 1: I've got one of the older boys at Melbourne, I've
Speaker 1: got an axles.
Speaker 3: Got to be granddad instead of dad jokes. You sort
Speaker 3: of mentioned it a little bit off the top. But
Speaker 3: when you look at Hendrix and you reflect on when
Speaker 3: you were a little boy and the relationship that you
Speaker 3: had with your parents, how do you feel about yourself
Speaker 3: looking back at that little boy.
Speaker 1: You know, I was pretty lucky in terms of, you know,
Speaker 1: what mom and dad were able to do for me
Speaker 1: and my siblings. And you know, looking back, I remember
Speaker 1: you'd go out and have days out. Dad would take
Speaker 1: me to a museum or you know, go to work
Speaker 1: with him on school holidays. So I did spend a
Speaker 1: lot of time with my dad. But now when I've
Speaker 1: got Hendrix, you know, it's sort of similar kind of thing.
Speaker 1: He just wants to do things. He wants to go
Speaker 1: out once, go footy, loves basketball. You know, I would
Speaker 1: sit there even days when we don't go outside. He
Speaker 1: is into Spider Man, loves Spider Man. So just been
Speaker 1: able to do things with him. I'm just really proud
Speaker 1: that someone like Hendricks is. Yeah, he's proud to call
Speaker 1: me his dad, and he relies on me to do
Speaker 1: everything for him. So I do I do really take
Speaker 1: take pride in that, and it just reminds me of
Speaker 1: what my parents were able to do to do for
Speaker 1: me when I was younger, and yeah, it's my turn
Speaker 1: now to sort of do that with my son.
Speaker 3: So what kind of advice would your parents give you
Speaker 3: when you're a kid.
Speaker 1: I was pretty naughty, so.
Speaker 2: I didn't quite you know.
Speaker 1: I hurt myself a lot when I was younger, so
Speaker 1: my poor mum, she was in tears a lot, and
Speaker 1: I just just had so much energy. So I kind
Speaker 1: of a little bit like Hendrix now. And yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: but I guess it's probably taught me to just have
Speaker 1: a go at things within reason, no fear, and barely
Speaker 1: not back down. It's probably not the right word, but yeah,
Speaker 1: I love it. And people doubt me and then I
Speaker 1: prove them wrong. So that's what's kind of taught me
Speaker 1: a little bit.
Speaker 3: You've done that a few times. When you close your
Speaker 3: eyes and you think back to sit, doan what springs
Speaker 3: to mind for you? What sort of smells and senses
Speaker 3: and memories.
Speaker 1: I guess in the summer, it's really dry, very hot.
Speaker 1: You know where we lived, just outskirts of the city.
Speaker 1: You know that it would be so dry that the
Speaker 1: ground will crack. You know, those sorts of things you
Speaker 1: see in the at back and country. Victoria just very
Speaker 1: dry and the wet season it rained heavily to the
Speaker 1: point where there was an area in front of the
Speaker 1: house and turned it almost it would turn into a
Speaker 1: pond and it'd get all these birds and all these vegetation.
Speaker 1: I guess it's more family when I look back. Yeah,
Speaker 1: And that's when that's one of the biggest things I
Speaker 1: sort of missed out on because you know, I moved
Speaker 1: from Sedan to Egypt and now living here in Australia,
Speaker 1: just not growing up with my grandparents, my cousins, although
Speaker 1: I've got a big family, so it doesn't really seem
Speaker 1: seem seem that much of a bit of a difference.
Speaker 1: But those things that I could never missed out on.
Speaker 3: So I love when you talk about it, you sort
Speaker 3: of look ahead of you as though you can imagine
Speaker 3: that the pond of water in front, like you're back
Speaker 3: there when you're looking back. How unsafe was it for
Speaker 3: your family in Sadan growing up?
Speaker 1: I was, I was relatively safe, but I think as
Speaker 1: I got older started understanding, I guess the world around me,
Speaker 1: and I was unfolding at the time, the Civil war
Speaker 1: in Sedan between North and South, and you know, my
Speaker 1: dad was heavily in the church. You know, he was
Speaker 1: helping rescuing some of the kids who were becoming child soldiers,
Speaker 1: and I saw a bit of that, and I think
Speaker 1: in the book I do mention when he was arrested
Speaker 1: by the government in the middle of the night, and
Speaker 1: that's the reason why we left. In the end, it
Speaker 1: just wasn't safe for our family. But I think he
Speaker 1: spent around six months in prison, and I was shielded
Speaker 1: a lot from all was happening. But I think around
Speaker 1: seven or eight it's just started and I guess understanding
Speaker 1: more and.
Speaker 2: How unsafe it was.
Speaker 1: But we were really lucky to be able to escape
Speaker 1: down at that time, because as soon as we left,
Speaker 1: it just the country wasn't safe and a lot of
Speaker 1: people lost their lives and detained a lot of people
Speaker 1: put in prison for very very minor reasons.
Speaker 3: So what do you remember from that that night that
Speaker 3: your like, when did you realize that your dad had
Speaker 3: been taken?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I was.
Speaker 1: I was really close. I mean I was obsessed with
Speaker 1: my dad, and I was when I was young, and
Speaker 1: you know, I was comeld. I was maybe seven or so,
Speaker 1: and if I couldn't sleep some nights, i'd go and
Speaker 1: sleep with my dad, and you know, it just happened
Speaker 1: to me that night, and you know, there was a
Speaker 1: big knock on the door and they came barging in
Speaker 1: and soldiers with guns and took him in the back
Speaker 1: of the back of the car and just remember running
Speaker 1: after the car. And it's very clear that incident. And
Speaker 1: I never asked him, you know, as I was growing
Speaker 1: up about that about that incident or or never went
Speaker 1: into too much detailed with him, but my older brothers
Speaker 1: they filled me in with a fair bit. So and
Speaker 1: then when I was writing the book, I was I
Speaker 1: was finally able to, you know, ask him properly without
Speaker 1: feeling like I am not disrespecting him, but yeah, because
Speaker 1: it's not an easy conversation to have with you have
Speaker 1: with your parent, and you know, the things he told me.
Speaker 1: He was tortured in prison, had to walk around with
Speaker 1: the toothbrush and just he just he just didn't know
Speaker 1: whether he was going to come home that day, so
Speaker 1: they told him he could be detained anytime. So I
Speaker 1: just had to I just had to be really careful.
Speaker 3: So so you were literally laying next to him and
Speaker 3: they essentially ripped him from your arms. Is that.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, God, that's terrifying.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, it's a it's one of those things,
Speaker 1: and I mean, growing up over the years, I found
Speaker 1: it hard to believe. But also it's also one of
Speaker 1: those parts of my life that have I found really
Speaker 1: hard to share with other people because of how really
Speaker 1: how real it is. You know, people would think it's
Speaker 1: something out of a movie. But I think that's why
Speaker 1: I really, being a father to Hendrix, I just want
Speaker 1: to you know, I just want to protect him as
Speaker 1: much as I can and never have to never have
Speaker 1: to go through anything like that with him or any kids.
Speaker 2: I haven't going forward, so.
Speaker 3: That, Yeah, how did how did it feel when you
Speaker 3: when you finally spoke to your dad about that? Because
Speaker 3: I imagine you're you carry something like that internally, you
Speaker 3: never talk about it and so it just sits there
Speaker 3: for years. How did it feel to have that conversation
Speaker 3: with him?
Speaker 1: It was a bit of a relief, just just to
Speaker 1: finally hear him speak about it. He was an uncomfortable
Speaker 1: or anything, And I guess, you know, that's why I
Speaker 1: look up to my parents. You know, he's throughout throughout
Speaker 1: all my life, you know, everything that they've done for us,
Speaker 1: and and to think, you know, there's some of the
Speaker 1: challenges he's been through and to do with the brave
Speaker 1: face raise nine kids travel across the world. Yeah, that's
Speaker 1: again I gain a lot of my strength.
Speaker 2: From that.
Speaker 3: Did you hug after that conversation?
Speaker 1: We shook hands?
Speaker 3: Oh goodness, that's quite funny. Actually you end up in Egypt.
Speaker 3: How many years were in Egypt?
Speaker 2: For three years?
Speaker 3: Three years? And so you were still a little tacker
Speaker 3: then around nine years of age, right, Yeah, How tough
Speaker 3: was that? You write? You write in the book, which
Speaker 3: the book is amazing by the way your voice really
Speaker 3: comes through in it, which I think is the most
Speaker 3: beautiful thing about it. Is it really you are telling
Speaker 3: your story and it's such a strong voice. The time
Speaker 3: in Egypt. How tough was that because you leave a
Speaker 3: place where you know you're inherently unsafe and you get
Speaker 3: to another place where you're made to feel ostracized and
Speaker 3: suffer quite significant racism as well. How challenging was that
Speaker 3: as a little kid?
Speaker 1: Yeah, Like, it was really tough because I mean those
Speaker 1: I think it was a period of six months where
Speaker 1: it was just my mom and now and my siblings,
Speaker 1: and I think just the living conditions, sharing sharing a
Speaker 1: house with three other families, just never felt comfortable at all,
Speaker 1: not at home, not in the street. The racism that
Speaker 1: we faced. There was just so much hate towards people
Speaker 1: like me at the time in Egypt, and there was
Speaker 1: always a constant reminder to the point where I tell
Speaker 1: my mom, yes, I know, because I guess for her
Speaker 1: to let us at the house or go to the shops.
Speaker 1: She was really scared. But although in saying that, I
Speaker 1: think there were some great people we met along the
Speaker 1: way in Egypt. But yeah, just the whole time, I
Speaker 1: just never never felt comfortable until my dad, until he
Speaker 1: came and he finally got a house. There was just
Speaker 1: a lot of unrest and just so much stress between
Speaker 1: the families. Yeah, until my dad came and we were
Speaker 1: finally able to just have a house not have to
Speaker 1: worry about, you know, sharing the living room with other people.
Speaker 1: And you know that it's funny looking back because you
Speaker 1: just slept wherever you could, you know, mattresses in the
Speaker 1: living room.
Speaker 2: So it's quite humbling.
Speaker 3: So you use the word hate before that it's such
Speaker 3: a strong word and to feel like there was hatred
Speaker 3: coming towards you when you're just nine years of age. God,
Speaker 3: how tough was that?
Speaker 1: Yeah, it was just it was just so hard to believe.
Speaker 1: I mean, and in this and nine year old, I'm
Speaker 1: not a threat to anyone. Yeah, like just you know,
Speaker 1: maybe my skin color or the way I look, I
Speaker 1: don't know, because I spoke Arabic. I mean I could
Speaker 1: do everything and anything that any nine year old could
Speaker 1: do an Egyptian kid, and.
Speaker 2: Just that hate.
Speaker 1: I mean, it's really tough. It's really hard to explain
Speaker 1: because it's almost to the point where they don't want
Speaker 1: you to exist. So but we had some fun in
Speaker 1: Egypt as well. I mean used to play soccer in
Speaker 1: the street and when Ramadan come around, you see the
Speaker 1: goodness and some people's heart.
Speaker 2: It was predominantly Muslim country.
Speaker 3: But yeah, so you get to Australia and unfortunately here
Speaker 3: there were still situations where we you copped that crap.
Speaker 3: For anyone who is listening who just doesn't get it,
Speaker 3: can you put into words how you feel or when
Speaker 3: when somebody says stuff or does stuff that makes you
Speaker 3: feel othered.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Like, I mean there are examples, I mean from school,
Speaker 1: even playing footy. It just sort of for some reason,
Speaker 1: I mean like now I'm older, I mean I can
Speaker 1: deal with it a bit better. You just you just
Speaker 1: feel like you're not good enough. And it's one of
Speaker 1: those things people will singly out about you, especially in
Speaker 1: footy when it when it did happen when I was playing,
Speaker 1: when I was playing footy, and you know, when I
Speaker 1: came here, did and speak a word of English, you know,
Speaker 1: finished school and all that stuff, playing AFL footy and
Speaker 1: still there's just there's just that reminder maybe you're not
Speaker 1: one of us, or you're not good enough, and you know,
Speaker 1: that feeling is is quite painful to deal with.
Speaker 3: What's really stuck out to me when I was reading
Speaker 3: your book was whether it was you know, in wart On,
Speaker 3: Sudan or Egypt or Australia, or you know, first at
Speaker 3: school or playing footy for the first time, all anyone
Speaker 3: really wants in life is to feel accepted, to feel safe,
Speaker 3: and to belong and that's anyone. Yeah, and all these
Speaker 3: times it was like you were getting the complete opposite
Speaker 3: of that. Does it take a toll on someone to
Speaker 3: keep on copying that?
Speaker 2: Yeah? It does.
Speaker 1: I mean it constantly have to remind yourself to be
Speaker 1: grateful for things, for me. I mean the things I've
Speaker 1: been able to do and achieve in life, and you know,
Speaker 1: I'm proud of some of them. I'm proud of I'm
Speaker 1: proud of them.
Speaker 2: But now.
Speaker 1: I'm really looking forward to seeing Hendrix growing up and
Speaker 1: you know, just and less opportunities and go to school uninterrupted.
Speaker 1: I want to play footy, go to UNI, do all
Speaker 1: these do all these things that I am that I
Speaker 1: missed out on.
Speaker 2: And I think, you know, coming.
Speaker 1: Back to your point where when there's when there's constant hardship,
Speaker 1: all these setbacks, the reality is, I mean it's for
Speaker 1: me deep down now, I know if I give up,
Speaker 1: then I miss out on all those opportunities to be
Speaker 1: able to try and achieve those things. You know, I
Speaker 1: might not get there, but you know, at least I
Speaker 1: I'll get closer.
Speaker 3: Yeah, at least you gave it a crack. What were
Speaker 3: your favorite things about coming here for the first time
Speaker 3: in Australia. What were the things that you talk about.
Speaker 3: You know that there's positives in amongst the hardships, you
Speaker 3: smile on your face. What were some of the things
Speaker 3: that you know, whether it's little little things as it,
Speaker 3: you know, youngster, that you weren't. That's awesome.
Speaker 1: I think it's just the freedom really put aside all
Speaker 1: the hardships that.
Speaker 2: We've been through.
Speaker 1: But I think living in the Egypt, it was just
Speaker 1: it was just apartment There was never spaces, having a
Speaker 1: big backyard, eating healthy food, things like that, and I
Speaker 1: don't know, even you know, Mum and Dad driving us
Speaker 1: around in the car. There was just there's just so
Speaker 1: many things. Good healthcare, you know, even the ability to
Speaker 1: be able to help out other family members who are
Speaker 1: back in Sadan financially and you know, helping other families
Speaker 1: come to Australia or organize their visas.
Speaker 2: My dad did that a lot.
Speaker 1: So just being able to help other people because you know,
Speaker 1: someone else gave us the chance, and I think it's
Speaker 1: one of those great things that we've been.
Speaker 2: Able to do.
Speaker 3: So I also think that one of the amazing things
Speaker 3: out of everything that you've said is you speak three languages.
Speaker 3: That's impressive. And they're not just like, oh, you know,
Speaker 3: French and Italian all those sort of things, Arabic, DNA
Speaker 3: and English all completely.
Speaker 1: Fluently, all completely affluently.
Speaker 3: Like that alone is I mean.
Speaker 2: English was pretty to learn.
Speaker 1: Like the writing aspect of English, because there's just so
Speaker 1: many ways to describe describe things.
Speaker 2: We're in Arabic and Dinker.
Speaker 1: They're complex in terms of the writing and stuff, but
Speaker 1: it's not you know, it's very direct. So yeah, that
Speaker 1: makes sense.
Speaker 3: Yeah. What do you speak with your family Dinker?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Yeah, some of my some of my siblings who who
Speaker 1: were born in Egypt or when too young, they speak
Speaker 1: a little bit of Dinker and English.
Speaker 3: And your littlest brother, yeah, he.
Speaker 2: Was born here.
Speaker 1: He is half and halfs There's some things you can
Speaker 1: say in Dinker and there'll beig conversations. Where's half Dinker
Speaker 1: half English? You particularly in these cops in the household. Yeah,
Speaker 1: it's just one of those things. I mean, it's that's
Speaker 1: that's how he's grown up here.
Speaker 3: So would you want Hendrix to know how to speak Dinker?
Speaker 2: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Yeah, I would take him, take him to my mum
Speaker 1: and dads when I when I get the chance. But
Speaker 1: Hendrix is so auzzy, I mean, he's just he has
Speaker 1: vegemindin vegemardin toast and wheat bogs for breakfast.
Speaker 3: He's I love the way you say he's so busy,
Speaker 3: like I'm so disappointed.
Speaker 2: He's just I mean it's, you know, try our best.
Speaker 1: But I think I've got I've got I've got I've
Speaker 1: got little nieces and nephews. He's got so much family
Speaker 1: that he can grow up with, and I'm sure he'll
Speaker 1: be able to pick up some words along the way.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I love it. Reflecting back now, when do you
Speaker 3: think your mental health took a turn?
Speaker 1: I think it was after the court case twenty fourteen
Speaker 1: or something like that. Back then, in hindsight, I should
Speaker 1: have taken, you know, a bit of time away from
Speaker 1: footy and go look after myself. It was just it
Speaker 1: was just mentally and physically exhausting. An at the time,
Speaker 1: all my teammates everyone were in Utah doing the preseason
Speaker 1: camp while I was still back here. One of my
Speaker 1: I was living with one of my teammates at the time.
Speaker 1: He was away as also, so I was going home
Speaker 1: each day and just on my own and dealing with
Speaker 1: what's unfolded that day. It was probably lack of knowledge
Speaker 1: and education around mental health. Because my management they advised me,
Speaker 1: they said, look, if you need to take some time off,
Speaker 1: take some time off. But I was also excited to
Speaker 1: see the boys because I hadn't seen them for over
Speaker 1: three weeks, and so I went got back straight into
Speaker 1: training and I did the best I can and then
Speaker 1: I guess over the over that little period till twenty eighteen,
Speaker 1: some surgeries, you know, playing with the broken foot for
Speaker 1: the whole season, getting an injection before every game and
Speaker 1: then going home after games, you know AFL matches finished
Speaker 1: pretty late, and having to deal with the pain, not
Speaker 1: being able to go to sleep and all that stuff.
Speaker 1: I just thought I'd be able to shrug it off
Speaker 1: or cope, yeah, or go through it like any other
Speaker 1: challenges that I've that I've that I've faced, But I
Speaker 1: think this time around it was It's probably.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was probably too much.
Speaker 3: So what do you think about the court case that
Speaker 3: took its toll was because there's so many aspects of that.
Speaker 2: I think.
Speaker 1: The biggest thing is, you know, being accused of something
Speaker 1: like that and not being given the chance to to
Speaker 1: go through it properly. You know, the media were quite
Speaker 1: we're quite nasty. I mean, I didn't mind it. It's
Speaker 1: not that I didn't mind, but they can come after
Speaker 1: me and stuff and stuff like that. But I think,
Speaker 1: you know, there were there were mum and mum and
Speaker 1: Dad's house, these cameras there trying to get a word
Speaker 1: out of my siblings, and I really struggle with that aspect.
Speaker 1: I mean, being able to play footy and having a profile,
Speaker 1: but then also when it starts impacting other family members,
Speaker 1: that was pretty hard to deal with.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and then it just goes on your shoulders.
Speaker 1: Then I feel like it's my responsibility, you know. I
Speaker 1: guess if I didn't have the profile, I didn't play footy,
Speaker 1: then they wouldn't put them in that position.
Speaker 2: But although although.
Speaker 1: You know, I was innocent and found not guilty of
Speaker 1: any of the charges, just the damage it's done to
Speaker 1: my image. And I think that's one of those things.
Speaker 1: I mean speaking to friends and family and then I'll
Speaker 1: bring it up with them and they say, look, you know,
Speaker 1: there's nothing, you don't need to worry about anything. But
Speaker 1: I think people can be nasty, and you know, walking
Speaker 1: down the streets or if I'm out somewhere, someone might
Speaker 1: say a comment and do.
Speaker 3: You still get that dude here and there?
Speaker 2: Yeah, here and there.
Speaker 1: But I think even they will forever be on the internet.
Speaker 1: There's just some things that can't turn.
Speaker 3: Back, can't be un said.
Speaker 2: Yeah, So, and I.
Speaker 1: Think just the ability for people to write things about
Speaker 1: you and there's no responsibility on their behalf.
Speaker 3: So yeah, from a mental health perspective, what were some
Speaker 3: of the signs that you were seeing about yourself.
Speaker 1: I just stopped going home, seeking my family, withdrawing from friends,
Speaker 1: and heavily drinking. This is later on twenty eighteen, and
Speaker 1: I was just stop doing things that I really enjoyed.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: I used to go fishing a lot, Yeah, like as
Speaker 1: make up excuses not to go see people. And I
Speaker 1: was just spending a lot of time by myself. So
Speaker 1: there were some of the signs.
Speaker 3: And yeah, when you say you're drinking too much? How much?
Speaker 3: How often?
Speaker 1: You know, even like twenty eighteen, that off season, I
Speaker 1: was probably drinking a fair bit during the week. You know,
Speaker 1: I knew well I shouldn't be, but you know, Emily
Speaker 1: pulled me up a fair bit, and you know, would
Speaker 1: have a friend's engagement or someone's birthday and I just
Speaker 1: do it without even noticing, And it wasn't for enjoyment
Speaker 1: or anything like that. So because you when someone tells
Speaker 1: you something that's true and you know you deny it
Speaker 1: and you know they're right. But yeah, so I felt
Speaker 1: like I was doing that a fair bit. And yeah,
Speaker 1: poor Emily, she had to put up with a fair bit.
Speaker 1: And then at the same time, when I was doing
Speaker 1: some work with you know, with the psychs and psychiatrist,
Speaker 1: I wasn't.
Speaker 2: I wasn't.
Speaker 1: I wasn't being truthful and as honest as as I
Speaker 1: as I could have been.
Speaker 3: Why not, do you think?
Speaker 1: Ah, For some reason, I just thought, you know, I'd
Speaker 1: just get through it in a couple of months and
Speaker 1: I should be fine. I learned a lot working with them.
Speaker 1: But then, you know, until until things got really serious.
Speaker 1: Then I realized, well, I have to do this properly.
Speaker 1: There's there's there's no other way around it but to
Speaker 1: just be honest and truthful.
Speaker 3: So, yeah, how destructive with your behavior do you think
Speaker 3: at the time, both to yourself and your relationships and
Speaker 3: the people around you.
Speaker 2: I was, Yeah, I was. I was.
Speaker 1: I was a bit reckless, you know, because I wasn't
Speaker 1: spending a lot of time with my family, and you know,
Speaker 1: I was going out a lot with.
Speaker 2: Some of the boys, and.
Speaker 1: I guess every opportunity where I could, I was going
Speaker 1: to a lot of events, and not that I needed
Speaker 1: to you, but I guess it was just an excuse
Speaker 1: to go and have a drink with.
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was. It was reckless.
Speaker 3: Why do you think you avoided your family and shut
Speaker 3: yourself away from them when you reflect back at it now, what? Yeah,
Speaker 3: what do you think it was?
Speaker 1: They know me pretty well, you know, like I mean,
Speaker 1: I'm not I'm not a vocal person in social settings.
Speaker 1: I'm usually pretty quiet, even if it's coming back this
Speaker 1: pre season and seeing my family over the last a
Speaker 1: little bit when we had off and mom and dad
Speaker 1: are like, oh, you lost weight, I'm like, yeah, I've been.
Speaker 2: I've been training.
Speaker 1: And even my sister the other day when I went
Speaker 1: home and she's likes everything all right, I'm like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I just just the whole COVID stuff, you know, isolating
Speaker 1: for so long and so my family know when things
Speaker 1: aren't going well, and that's why I avoided. I avoided
Speaker 1: going home because I just didn't want to answer the
Speaker 1: questions because eventually I'd have to tell them the truth.
Speaker 3: So do you wish it did now?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Definitely wish because I could have you know, I
Speaker 1: could not have been around. And that's one of those
Speaker 1: things I'm grateful for. I'm grateful for my life, but
Speaker 1: also at the same time knowing if I asked my
Speaker 1: family and my friends for help before things got really bad,
Speaker 1: I knew they would to help me. And like I like,
Speaker 1: I saw countless examples they really did pick me up,
Speaker 1: and you know, they got me through some of the
Speaker 1: worst times in my life.
Speaker 3: You're listening to ordinarily speaking with Madjack daw when you
Speaker 3: were isolating yourself, what were some of the conversations you
Speaker 3: were having with yourself in your own mind? What were
Speaker 3: you telling yourself?
Speaker 1: Look, I mean it was just it was just creeping up.
Speaker 1: I mean in terms of just I didn't want to
Speaker 1: accept that, you know, until I had the conversation with
Speaker 1: the club doctor. You know, just being able to utter
Speaker 1: those words that you know, I think I've got the
Speaker 1: depression or I think I've got poor mental health. It's
Speaker 1: really hard to accept that's where you are in your
Speaker 1: life because like the stigma around it, which is why
Speaker 1: I wrote this book. I want that to change. It
Speaker 1: doesn't mean, you know, you're any less of a human
Speaker 1: or you're weak. And I think the best description I've
Speaker 1: heard from my cycle is, you know, it's like professional development.
Speaker 1: If you need some work around around your career, you
Speaker 1: go and do a course, or if you need to
Speaker 1: learn something, you go and learn it. That's exactly the
Speaker 1: same with mental health, because if your mind is poor,
Speaker 1: you've got poor mental health, then you can do something
Speaker 1: about it. And then on, once you've done the work,
Speaker 1: or once you feel confident enjoying life again, then you're thriving.
Speaker 1: And I think that's one of those things I want
Speaker 1: people with mental health issues to understand. When you're thriving,
Speaker 1: I mean, your life is so much better. I mean
Speaker 1: you go see your family, you catch up with your friends,
Speaker 1: you drink responsibly.
Speaker 3: Yeah, tell me about the first night that you tried
Speaker 3: to take your own life of whatever you're comfortable sharing.
Speaker 1: Look, that night was we just had a we just
Speaker 1: had a friend's thirty, if you know, Like someone said
Speaker 1: a comment about Emily and I said it directly to me,
Speaker 1: and I just took that to I just took that
Speaker 1: too literally, like took.
Speaker 2: It to heart.
Speaker 1: And when I look back, you know, like I barely
Speaker 1: know this guy, So I could have just brushed it
Speaker 1: off and not waded in too much into it. But
Speaker 1: then around that time, that's when I was heavily drinking,
Speaker 1: So I just continued drinking more and I told Emily
Speaker 1: that I was going home.
Speaker 2: I left.
Speaker 1: I went home, and I started drinking more and my
Speaker 1: thoughts got the better of me, and I took some
Speaker 1: sleeping tablets and then finally realizing, look, I need I
Speaker 1: need to tell someone what's going on. So I rang Joey,
Speaker 1: I rang Pete, and then I rang another friend, Rory,
Speaker 1: and they came around early that morning, and you know,
Speaker 1: I just basically told them everything and they were very understanding.
Speaker 2: But yeah, I was just just at my lowest. Really.
Speaker 1: I didn't go to training that day. I didn't go
Speaker 1: to training the following day. I stayed home for a
Speaker 1: couple of days, and Pete told the club that, you know,
Speaker 1: I seek and stuff. So the next month was really tough.
Speaker 1: I was in rehab, just had surgery on my foot.
Speaker 1: I really struggled to the people in the eye at
Speaker 1: the time because just just in case they might ask
Speaker 1: us everything all right, and and then you know, either
Speaker 1: lighted them more. So I've ordered eye contact a lot,
Speaker 1: and I just found it hard to go into training
Speaker 1: and do what I needed to dote. Pete encouraged me
Speaker 1: to tell the coach and let him know what's going
Speaker 1: on and speak to some of my teammates. But I
Speaker 1: was just just scared how they'd perceive it and stuff.
Speaker 3: So what were you mostly scared of?
Speaker 1: Ah, just the questions? What am I struggling with? I
Speaker 1: guess I was probably in my own mind really, because
Speaker 1: you know, hindsight's a great thing because they whatever I
Speaker 1: was scared of, it would have been there to help
Speaker 1: me straight away.
Speaker 3: So what happens from there?
Speaker 1: You know, the drinking got worse. Like I was saying earlier,
Speaker 1: I was catching up with the psych and just wasn't
Speaker 1: being truthful and honest with them. And I remember Emily
Speaker 1: and I we had a pretty argument.
Speaker 2: We came back from Balley.
Speaker 1: We had the miscarriage, and I was pretty tough just
Speaker 1: just seeing her in that state where you know, we're
Speaker 1: in a foreign country. Yeah, it was just just it
Speaker 1: was supposed to be a celebration her mom sixtieth and
Speaker 1: tend o to be this massive disaster, and we were
Speaker 1: really vulnerable, both of us, and we're looking after each other.
Speaker 1: And then we came back and I was still going
Speaker 1: through my struggles and.
Speaker 2: We had an argument one night.
Speaker 1: She left and I continued drinking, and my thoughts got
Speaker 1: the better of me, and yeah, that's when I decided
Speaker 1: to jump in the car and I headed to the
Speaker 1: balted bridge. So look, that person is me back then.
Speaker 1: You know, it's pretty scary. I was what I tried
Speaker 1: to do to myself. And I'm not that person anymore.
Speaker 1: You know, it's I am, I'm thriving, I'm enjoying life.
Speaker 1: But I learned a pretty tough lesson just because you
Speaker 1: know the pain I put my family through, people around me,
Speaker 1: but even myself, you know, the injuries that are sustained.
Speaker 1: You know, it was really humbling getting around in a wheelchair,
Speaker 1: spending a lot of time with elderly people. It was
Speaker 1: like I didn't I don't belong here. But I think
Speaker 1: I needed to do the work, you know, work on
Speaker 1: myself because the psychiatrist said, you know, I'm not going
Speaker 1: to put your medication if you, you know, do your
Speaker 1: rehab to the best of your ability. And I think
Speaker 1: three weeks, three weeks in hospital, I got off the medication,
Speaker 1: the painkillers and stuff, and that was that was really challenging,
Speaker 1: not being able to sleep at night, and I.
Speaker 2: Just had to deal with it.
Speaker 1: And yeah, I celebrated the milestones, walking, running and all
Speaker 1: this stuff. So, but you know, not everyone's as lucky
Speaker 1: as I am in that sense. And you know, despite
Speaker 1: being in the hospital for so long, and yeah, I
Speaker 1: mean I know a lot of families family members through
Speaker 1: mental health and stuff and those kind of things. You
Speaker 1: know that they take my position and have their have
Speaker 1: their family members here.
Speaker 3: So do you remember that night or is it a blur?
Speaker 3: Like do you remember the moment?
Speaker 1: I remember clearly. I think just the impact of the
Speaker 1: water and I think because yeah, I think I blacked
Speaker 1: out and then.
Speaker 2: I just.
Speaker 1: I just remember wanting to wanting to live, and just
Speaker 1: to regret immediately after jumping. And but yeah, I think
Speaker 1: it's it's just one of those things, you know, just
Speaker 1: so lucky. I missed a pylon under the bridge by
Speaker 1: a couple of meters.
Speaker 3: And.
Speaker 1: You know, in a in a in a tragic time
Speaker 1: of my life, a lot of things went right.
Speaker 3: So you did you literally have a moment like when
Speaker 3: you're falling and thought, I don't want to do this anymore.
Speaker 1: Yeah, And I think it's it's not too you know,
Speaker 1: I don't want not to encourage anyone to do anything
Speaker 1: like that, because it's just realizing, you know, there's there's
Speaker 1: no coming back, you know. So it's a that's one
Speaker 1: thing that sticks in my mind quite clearly. You know,
Speaker 1: if you're not around, you're not around, that's a that's reality.
Speaker 1: And I think taking that type of risk, that's what
Speaker 1: could happen.
Speaker 3: So just provided a sharp moment of clarity. Yeah, when
Speaker 3: you say that the impact, when you say you remember that,
Speaker 3: what do you remember from that moment just.
Speaker 2: Hitting the water?
Speaker 1: I think maybe is because I couldn't sleep for a
Speaker 1: while and I had had trouble going to sleep and
Speaker 1: waking up and pull a sweats and I just just
Speaker 1: kept kept on playing in my mind and it's just
Speaker 1: the impact from my back and palvis breaking. So and
Speaker 1: I think it's a, you know, one of those things
Speaker 1: that I've learned to to to deal with and.
Speaker 2: Not be okay with.
Speaker 1: But except that, that's they are the facts, and and
Speaker 1: just work on myself.
Speaker 3: Yeah, so you have nightmares about I used to Yeah,
Speaker 3: how often would you have them?
Speaker 1: I was regularly, Like I mean, it would be every
Speaker 1: night because I try to do a lot of mindfulness
Speaker 1: And even then I struggled to close my eyes because
Speaker 1: that just that thought you'd just keep coming back to
Speaker 1: my mind and I think instead of keeping that to myself,
Speaker 1: I spoke to my psych and and he's, you know,
Speaker 1: gave me some tools and helped me get through it
Speaker 1: so well.
Speaker 3: And you don't have to share what kind of tools
Speaker 3: were you using it.
Speaker 1: He just said to just try and just try and
Speaker 1: work on your breathing, maybe do your mindfulness with your
Speaker 1: eyes open, you know, doing puzzles.
Speaker 2: Because I couldn't.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's just because I had to fill in fill
Speaker 1: in a lot of time, three times a day doing rehab,
Speaker 1: and then when I'd come back to my room where
Speaker 1: I was staying, there was a lot of downtime and
Speaker 1: they had to really cut down the visiting hours because
Speaker 1: I needed to rest. I think I was sleeping something
Speaker 1: like three times a day, just learning how to be
Speaker 1: okay to sit by yourself.
Speaker 3: For a period of time without going back to that thought.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I was just that it's okay to be by yourself.
Speaker 1: And because I mean, my family were terrified, you know,
Speaker 1: they thought I was I would kill myself or try
Speaker 1: to kill myself. And if I gave in to everyone worrying,
Speaker 1: everyone worrying around me, at some point, I'm going to
Speaker 1: start believing that.
Speaker 2: So I had to yeah, I had to really.
Speaker 1: Trust myself and that that I'm okay to be alone
Speaker 1: and everyone around me from then on will will be
Speaker 1: comfortable leaving me alone or not speaking to me for
Speaker 1: a couple of days because I was getting phone calls, text.
Speaker 2: Message, fever checking in.
Speaker 1: It was kind of from a great place, but also
Speaker 1: at the same time, I needed I needed to show
Speaker 1: them that I can trust myself.
Speaker 3: So did you have to show yourself that you could
Speaker 3: trust yourself as well? Yeah? Yeah, is that almost the
Speaker 3: hardest person to convince.
Speaker 2: Yeah, But like it was just the circumstances I was in.
Speaker 1: I think because I think how old I think, twenty
Speaker 1: seven at the time, relatively young and practicing gratitude things
Speaker 1: that I'm grateful for in life, and I think I
Speaker 1: didn't want to be in that position, and I wanted
Speaker 1: to come back and play footy. So if I wanted
Speaker 1: to do those things, I had to get better more
Speaker 1: mentally than physically, because you know, as soon as my
Speaker 1: mind's strong again, you know, I just improved so much
Speaker 1: through my rehab.
Speaker 3: Have the nightmare stopped or do you still get them occasionally?
Speaker 2: They've stopped? Yeah? Thank god?
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, that's so good. So talking about stuff does
Speaker 3: actually help, then it does.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you've trust the right people.
Speaker 3: What do you remember from your first conversation with your parents?
Speaker 3: Because they had no idea right that any any of
Speaker 3: this was going through your mind.
Speaker 1: They had no idea, And I think I break my parents' heart,
Speaker 1: and it's just one of those things that I minute
Speaker 1: never be able to take back the pain that I've
Speaker 1: put them through. Even Emily, they were really upset that
Speaker 1: they were the first people that I came and asked
Speaker 1: for help or told them what was going on. To
Speaker 1: the point where my dad and I had a falling
Speaker 1: out for a period of time when I was still
Speaker 1: in hospital.
Speaker 3: That sounds like it was a really hard thing to
Speaker 3: cope with on top of everything else.
Speaker 1: I just thought he might sorry. At my lowest, I
Speaker 1: thought my dad would I understand more and be there
Speaker 1: for me. But also he was struggling with his own
Speaker 1: the way I look at it, if Hendricks was going
Speaker 1: through something like that, he'd come to me first for help.
Speaker 2: That makes sense.
Speaker 3: When you say that sentence, Are you feeling that you
Speaker 3: couldn't go to your dad?
Speaker 1: I just I thought he wouldn't understand.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and that's why you desperately want Hendrix to come
Speaker 3: to you.
Speaker 1: But then at the same time, when things got better
Speaker 1: and we finally had a conversation, he said he was
Speaker 1: grateful that at the time, I told Joey and Rory
Speaker 1: your best mate, that I was lucky to have people
Speaker 1: like that in my life to still go to if
Speaker 1: I couldn't go to him. So, but now I understand
Speaker 1: as a parent how hard it would be. You know,
Speaker 1: if your child goes through something like that, you'd want
Speaker 1: to help them and protect them.
Speaker 3: Are you closer now with your dads for all of this?
Speaker 1: Yeah, much, I'm much more closer with both my parents.
Speaker 1: I mean, I think I should mention also my mum.
Speaker 1: She was really strong throughout the whole time, and you know,
Speaker 1: she was the rock of the family of its usually are.
Speaker 1: But yeah, me and my dad are close. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's probably brought us a lot closer as a family.
Speaker 1: And even when I was writing the book, I was
Speaker 1: I was a bit scared about opening up around the
Speaker 1: mental health chapter and being so open and honest, you know,
Speaker 1: because there are some private things that I put out
Speaker 1: there about my family throughout that time. So but they
Speaker 1: were really they were really supportive and wanted me to
Speaker 1: to help other people because they don't want other families
Speaker 1: to go through what we went through.
Speaker 3: So your little brother, that was pretty tough for you,
Speaker 3: right when you first saw him in hospital.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just didn't think he would understand, but I mean,
Speaker 1: surely enough he understood, and you know, he just broke
Speaker 1: down crying, and it.
Speaker 2: Was pretty It was pretty hard to.
Speaker 1: I guess to witness. And yeah, when I was in
Speaker 1: that hospital, but I couldn't. I couldn't escape, you know,
Speaker 1: I couldn't go anywhere. It's probably the reality because I
Speaker 1: think because if I could escape, I probably would have.
Speaker 1: But you know, there's a lesson in there somewhere that
Speaker 1: it's our responsibility to look our after our mental health
Speaker 1: because it not only affects us but like other people
Speaker 1: around us.
Speaker 3: So better to confront things away from How old was
Speaker 3: your little brother.
Speaker 2: It would have been eleven.
Speaker 3: Kids always think it's their fault, right that they did
Speaker 3: something that made the adults feel a certain way. Yeah,
Speaker 3: that's tough. The physical injuries. I mean, incredibly lucky, as
Speaker 3: you said, not to have worse ones, but they were
Speaker 3: still really bad. How bad were they?
Speaker 2: I couldn't.
Speaker 1: I just remember trying to every night going to sleep,
Speaker 1: just moving from one's just changing positions. If I'm sleeping
Speaker 1: on my right shoulder moving to my left, you know,
Speaker 1: my hips when united, so I'd have to move one
Speaker 1: leg to a just.
Speaker 3: Positions in bed to physically move it with your hand.
Speaker 2: With my hand.
Speaker 1: So that's how painful it was. I couldn't sit down
Speaker 1: for too long. I just couldn't do simple things. I
Speaker 1: couldn't shell myself for a long time, even coughing. My
Speaker 1: groin is pretty pretty badly damaged. So it was I
Speaker 1: just had to learn to deal with a lot of pain.
Speaker 1: Even the exercises I was doing, just had to push
Speaker 1: through so much pain. But yeah, and that was part
Speaker 1: of the process of trusting, trusting in my own body,
Speaker 1: of trusting myself that it's fine to go through this
Speaker 1: pain if I want to improve. So yeah, it wasn't easy.
Speaker 3: But someone as competitive and strong as you, how humbling
Speaker 3: was it to literally not be able to stand walk
Speaker 3: all of those things?
Speaker 2: Yeah, it was.
Speaker 1: I think just just being in a wheelchair for I
Speaker 1: wasn't allowed to go home for three months, and I
Speaker 1: speaking to Rama, I thought I'd be in hospital for
Speaker 1: at least two three weeks and then no one was
Speaker 1: being honest with me, and and then I just rang
Speaker 1: him and spoke to him, and he said, look, man,
Speaker 1: you're going to be in here for at least.
Speaker 2: You know, for a while.
Speaker 1: So the news eve came. All my family and friends.
Speaker 1: They had a barbecue for me back at my place
Speaker 1: and I remember Emily wheeling me around to get to
Speaker 1: the to the house.
Speaker 2: So that that was. That was quite humbling.
Speaker 1: And you know, I made some friends with some of
Speaker 1: the elderly that were in the hospital. You know, they
Speaker 1: were really lovely. Yeah, and I think just when I
Speaker 1: started walking, when I got off crutches I had, I
Speaker 1: had a limp for a long time and I lost
Speaker 1: so much weight. So I just had to I just
Speaker 1: had to put myself out there.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: Friends wanted to catch up with me for a coffee
Speaker 1: or go out to lunch. I'd walk down or they'd
Speaker 1: come and picked me up. And people would noticed straight away.
Speaker 1: And that was one of the hardest things because in
Speaker 1: their mind, that's you know, that's that's the guy I
Speaker 1: tried to kill himself. And yeah, so that was that
Speaker 1: was pretty hard. And my brother, eldest brother, he used
Speaker 1: to work at the arby a float and he said
Speaker 1: come down while he was working, and I just completely forgot,
Speaker 1: you know, I drive pick my car and I walked
Speaker 1: down and as soon as I walked in, and I'm like,
Speaker 1: oh God, like there's so many people here, and I
Speaker 1: was wearing a shirt and it was just drenched and sweat.
Speaker 2: Just my social anxiety got got the better of me.
Speaker 1: But you know, friends around me they knew, and family
Speaker 1: around me they knew that they also had to help me.
Speaker 1: And because I told him I'm so nervous, and he said,
Speaker 1: look it's fine.
Speaker 2: It's.
Speaker 1: And five ten minutes later, yeah I was fine.
Speaker 2: Everyone else was just.
Speaker 1: Going on about their day. But yeah, that was hard.
Speaker 3: People really only want to talk about themselves, Like.
Speaker 2: No one's even looking at me.
Speaker 1: So but yeah, I had I had to go. I
Speaker 1: had to go through that just so I can live
Speaker 1: my life again. And yeah, because you can just sit
Speaker 1: at home and not enjoy life. And but you know,
Speaker 1: you have to go through. You have to go through.
Speaker 1: It can't hide.
Speaker 3: I mean, we all care about what other people think
Speaker 3: about us, right, as much as we say we don't,
Speaker 3: we all do. And that's part of society and everything.
Speaker 3: But You've had to deal without it many many times
Speaker 3: across your life. Have you gotten good at it? Do
Speaker 3: you think?
Speaker 1: I just I just keep it really simple these days.
Speaker 1: I don't take on too much. I know, if I'm
Speaker 1: really tired, I just I just just rest up. And
Speaker 1: I used to be a bit of a yes man
Speaker 1: as well, you know, try to please people. I can't
Speaker 1: keep everyone happy. If I'm not happy, then you know.
Speaker 1: It's Becoming a dad is really simplified life for me.
Speaker 1: Every spare time that I have I'm with Hendrix to
Speaker 1: you know, go pick him up and he loves a baby.
Speaker 1: Yeah that that keeps me on a straight narrow everything
Speaker 1: just about him now.
Speaker 3: And yeah, so you come back obviously wasn't straightforward. You
Speaker 3: had injuries, you had so many steps along the way.
Speaker 3: You know, you're first walking, first running, all of that
Speaker 3: sort of stuff. But I just want to skip to
Speaker 3: you run out there for your first AFL game. It
Speaker 3: was in twenty twenty, so it was in amongst COVID
Speaker 3: and everyone needed a good story and you were it.
Speaker 3: And I get goose bumps just remembering it. But what
Speaker 3: were your reflections on that day and that game? Given
Speaker 3: everything you've been through.
Speaker 1: It was a relief because I mean I could have
Speaker 1: played a lot earlier. And then I tear my peck,
Speaker 1: So I was like, geez, you know, when when is
Speaker 1: it going to get When is it going to happen
Speaker 1: at all? And I remember the day res Shaw told
Speaker 1: told me I had to had a meeting. I had
Speaker 1: a personal meeting that I had to do in the morning,
Speaker 1: so I missed. I missed the training meeting. We went
Speaker 1: to the ground after and then you know, before before
Speaker 1: we started training, he announced it to the boys, and
Speaker 1: that was pretty cool.
Speaker 3: You got such a big smile on your face right now.
Speaker 1: Because I mean it was I think training might have
Speaker 1: been on Wednesday or Thursday, so.
Speaker 2: I was like Jesus still at least two to.
Speaker 1: Three days before the game, uh, which was which was
Speaker 1: good because then I was got back to everyone that
Speaker 1: wished me well. And then on game day, because I've
Speaker 1: been rehabbing for so long that I was just ready
Speaker 1: to go and play. And I think I didn't have
Speaker 1: any doubt in back in my mind because I knew
Speaker 1: it was it was a long and hard rehabit, so yeah,
Speaker 1: I was confident in my body. And then I think
Speaker 1: for me, that's why it was. It was such a
Speaker 1: big goal to come back and play footy because that's
Speaker 1: what I saw myself doing before my mental health battles,
Speaker 1: and yeah, that's me at my best and playing half
Speaker 1: of foot is is what I love doing.
Speaker 3: So yeah, taught me through the goal.
Speaker 1: I was searching for a goal all day.
Speaker 3: You could envision the highlights on the tab and everything
Speaker 3: could you were this moment asked happened?
Speaker 2: Is going to come? And it came the last quarter.
Speaker 1: But before that, I tried to kick goal from outside fifty.
Speaker 2: I got called to come to the bench and got sprayed.
Speaker 3: Was like, what was that, Fray.
Speaker 1: It's like, you know, there's not too many people on
Speaker 1: this team that have a license from outside fifty and
Speaker 1: you're certainly not one of them.
Speaker 3: I don't care what your story is. Don't bomb from
Speaker 3: outside fifty.
Speaker 1: I went back out there and sure nat Leek finally
Speaker 1: kicked the ball and marked the ball, and Sean Higgins
Speaker 1: came around past me and he said, you know you've
Speaker 1: done this a thousand times before, you know, just go
Speaker 1: through routine and kick the goal. And it's a bit
Speaker 1: arrogant than me, but I didn't even watch the goal
Speaker 1: go through I was just so confident. Yeah, and all
Speaker 1: the boys around from everywhere. That was a pretty special moment.
Speaker 3: It was one of the best moments footy has ever
Speaker 3: seen sport in this kind. True, it doesn't matter what
Speaker 3: words or sentiment you put to it. That's it was
Speaker 3: that big a deal. Did you You knew in that
Speaker 3: moment how significant it was, right, not just for you,
Speaker 3: but for yeah.
Speaker 1: Because I think it's just the amount of people that
Speaker 1: have helped me along my journey and even through my
Speaker 1: mental health stuff. You know, like they're a great moment
Speaker 1: in life. And you know, with all the racism stuff,
Speaker 1: all the hardship, people were generally happy for me.
Speaker 2: So yeah, that was pretty cool.
Speaker 3: Have you ever thought back and thought about the alternative
Speaker 3: if you didn't survive that night?
Speaker 1: Ah, Yeah, I think you know, it'd be pretty It
Speaker 1: would have been pretty hard for my family. I mean,
Speaker 1: for obvious reasons. But I think I've met I've met
Speaker 1: a lot of people in my lifetime, and a lot
Speaker 1: of people have had positive impact on my life and
Speaker 1: vice versa. And yeah, look, you know there's only one
Speaker 1: of us. You know, there's only one nearly and there's
Speaker 1: only one magic.
Speaker 3: So particularly our names.
Speaker 1: You know, you currently place individuals like that, and I
Speaker 1: think that's also one of the biggest driving factors for
Speaker 1: me that I also need to keep working on my
Speaker 1: mental health. You know, it's just not something that just
Speaker 1: goes away. You have to continue work at it. If
Speaker 1: I don't, I could potentially find myself in that position
Speaker 1: again because I can't say, you know, challenge is going
Speaker 1: to stop. You know, there'll be big challenges going forward,
Speaker 1: and how I deal with them is ultimately how strong
Speaker 1: my mental health is.
Speaker 3: So I'm so glad Hendrix has you because the alternative
Speaker 3: just it just doesn't sit right that you would have
Speaker 3: missed his life.
Speaker 1: Yeah, nothing, that opportunity to to be a dad to him.
Speaker 1: I look now and I just can't imagine my life
Speaker 1: without him really.
Speaker 2: You know.
Speaker 1: Well it's hard work sometimes, but.
Speaker 3: You know it's does your dad hug him?
Speaker 2: Yeah? He loves my dad.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's funny. I bring him away over It's like
Speaker 1: Dad's big child and he's playing with him, and I'm
Speaker 1: just I've just never seen him, seen him like that before.
Speaker 1: Even with my little nieces and nephews, they get so
Speaker 1: much enjoyment.
Speaker 3: Yeah, you have a little glint in your eye when
Speaker 3: you spoke about your dad, Hendrick, and I don't know
Speaker 3: whether it's it's the love or the fact that it's
Speaker 3: seeing the playful side of your dad that brings that
Speaker 3: out of you.
Speaker 1: I did take a photo so I send it to you,
Speaker 1: and he's just in the living room playing with him
Speaker 1: and I'm just I was like, I've never seen that before.
Speaker 2: So, yeah, that's all.
Speaker 3: Before I let you go in. I really appreciate all
Speaker 3: the time that you've given. I know it's even though
Speaker 3: you've spoken about this a few times, it can't ever
Speaker 3: be easy to talk about it. But I wanted to
Speaker 3: ask you about the Demons because you've you've moved there
Speaker 3: now and they won the flag and you obviously didn't
Speaker 3: didn't play in the Grand Final. But one of my favorite,
Speaker 3: and I think lots of people's favorite things about that
Speaker 3: premiership is how hard you celebrated your teammates. You like,
Speaker 3: and it seemed from the outside looking in, it was
Speaker 3: genuine joy. They didn't seem to be jealousy of what
Speaker 3: they were going through. You seem to just really want
Speaker 3: to celebrate them. Tell me about it.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think you know. I've put some photos up
Speaker 1: on my social media, and you know, playing for so long,
Speaker 1: played in one final, so just seeing how hard they
Speaker 1: worked all year, and I think we used to beat Melbourne,
Speaker 1: you know when I was at North Melbourne, and just
Speaker 1: seeing the team have success and how hard they worked
Speaker 1: and believed in each other. It would have been nice
Speaker 1: to have played, but yeah, I was just generally just
Speaker 1: so excited and happy for them and the fans back home.
Speaker 1: And I've got a lot of family friends who are
Speaker 1: Melbourne supporters, so they were they were really excited. Hendrix's
Speaker 1: grandfather is a Melbourne supporter, so yeah, it was so cool.
Speaker 1: I've never had a team that I supported along the
Speaker 1: years or over the years when I flagg in my lifeter.
Speaker 3: So you found yourself in the middle of the celebration.
Speaker 3: The cup did a tour of everyone's home. Did it
Speaker 3: go to your home?
Speaker 2: Yeah? I went to my mom and dads.
Speaker 3: Yeah, what was that like?
Speaker 1: It was?
Speaker 3: It was?
Speaker 1: It was pretty nice just to share the joy. We
Speaker 1: took it to Emily's mom and dads. I really enjoyed it,
Speaker 1: took photos with it. You know, once you hold the
Speaker 1: cup and realize it's actually quite heavy for you, but
Speaker 1: it's just it's just so physical. You can say, oh,
Speaker 1: you know, Richmond won the flag the year before and
Speaker 1: stuff like that, until you're holding the cup. It's just
Speaker 1: it's so real. Yeah, to bring it brings generine excitement
Speaker 1: and enjoy to people.
Speaker 3: So your parents got hold of the physical cup.
Speaker 1: Yeah, they got to hold the physical cup.
Speaker 3: What did they think of it? I mean that's kind
Speaker 3: of one of those moments as well where you look
Speaker 3: back and you they must have just been sitting there going,
Speaker 3: what we didn't even know about this, you know, twenty
Speaker 3: years ago?
Speaker 1: What the hell? I mean, I couldn't believe it that
Speaker 1: everyone could take the cup home. So that was the
Speaker 1: coolest thing about it. They were just so happy. I
Speaker 1: mean if I played in it, I couldn't imagine the
Speaker 1: joy in their hearts. But they were just so happy after.
Speaker 1: I guess all these years are playing footy although I
Speaker 1: didn't play in it, but me being part of a
Speaker 1: team that that's that wins a flag.
Speaker 3: So you got another year?
Speaker 1: Yeah, enough to work and keep being optimistic. I think
Speaker 1: that's my driving factor.
Speaker 3: I want to finish by asking you. I know you
Speaker 3: get asked this all the time, but when you really
Speaker 3: genuinely think about it and everything you've been through, being
Speaker 3: the first Sudanese born footballer to play in the AFL,
Speaker 3: and now the story that you have that goes alongside it.
Speaker 3: Do you take to heart what that means and what
Speaker 3: you've done for so many people.
Speaker 2: I never used to accept.
Speaker 1: I guess the credit to some of my friends of
Speaker 1: whoever that when they say, you know, you're the first
Speaker 1: one to start it, I just I just never felt satisfied.
Speaker 1: Just I think because I'm still playing. Until Mac Andrew
Speaker 1: went pick five, I was so happy and so emotional,
Speaker 1: and I think being drafted as a rookie I've only
Speaker 1: played fifty four games, so for multi culture footballers, when
Speaker 1: recognized for a long time and drafted for other reasons
Speaker 1: to build the game, which is fine, but I think
Speaker 1: when you finally have someone back taking a big five, yeah,
Speaker 1: I think I can be proud of that.
Speaker 3: So you did that? Yeah, like you actually you did that.
Speaker 4: When I win the flag, I'll thank you, not just
Speaker 4: for today, but you've always been so polite and generous
Speaker 4: with your time, and you were so bad at taking compliments.
Speaker 3: You're constantly looking away from it as I'm saying nice
Speaker 3: things to you. But I'm so glad you're still here,
Speaker 3: and I know I messaged you that at the time,
Speaker 3: like a bazillion other people, but there's so much love
Speaker 3: for you and respect for you, and you have enriched
Speaker 3: the game tenfold, so I really appreciate it and appreciate you.
Speaker 2: Thank you. It's more a pleasure time.
Speaker 3: Thanks for listening to this episode of ordinarily speaking. If
Speaker 3: you want to discover more about mad Jack's life, and
Speaker 3: I highly recommend it, check out his book mad Jack
Speaker 3: by mad Jack daw Please remember you can reach Lifeline
Speaker 3: on one three double one one four, or head to
Speaker 3: Beyond Blue dot org dot AU. A new episode will
Speaker 3: drop on Wednesday. Don't forget to hit subscribe and tell
Speaker 3: your mates U