1 00:00:00,680 --> 00:00:02,840 Speaker 1: Mix one O four point nine dot com dot you 2 00:00:03,200 --> 00:00:06,640 Speaker 1: for all the latest news and information. Now three sixty 3 00:00:06,720 --> 00:00:10,000 Speaker 1: with Katie Wolf. Everyone is listening Mix one oh four 4 00:00:10,000 --> 00:00:11,800 Speaker 1: point nine, one hundred percent. 5 00:00:12,520 --> 00:00:15,720 Speaker 2: Now I know that as the COVID nineteen vaccine rolls 6 00:00:15,760 --> 00:00:19,200 Speaker 2: out around Australia, plenty of people are wondering, well if 7 00:00:19,239 --> 00:00:23,200 Speaker 2: their workplaces might make it well, might make it compulsory 8 00:00:23,239 --> 00:00:27,720 Speaker 2: to actually get that vaccine? And well are those you know? 9 00:00:27,840 --> 00:00:31,280 Speaker 2: Are those workplaces able to make it compulsory? And what 10 00:00:31,360 --> 00:00:33,479 Speaker 2: are our rights I suppose, and how can it all 11 00:00:33,600 --> 00:00:34,479 Speaker 2: roll out? Well? 12 00:00:34,560 --> 00:00:36,840 Speaker 3: Joining us on the line to tell us a little bit. 13 00:00:36,680 --> 00:00:41,599 Speaker 2: More is the Silver Hebron Barristers and Solicitors, Special counsel 14 00:00:41,720 --> 00:00:45,360 Speaker 2: Peter or good morning Peter, Katie, how are you really well? 15 00:00:45,360 --> 00:00:48,560 Speaker 2: Thanks so much for your time this morning, Peter. As 16 00:00:48,600 --> 00:00:51,160 Speaker 2: the vaccine rolls out, as I said, plenty of people 17 00:00:51,200 --> 00:00:54,240 Speaker 2: are wondering if their workplaces might make it compulsory to 18 00:00:54,280 --> 00:01:00,880 Speaker 2: get that vaccine? Can workplaces actually make the vaccine compulsory? Is? 19 00:01:00,920 --> 00:01:04,960 Speaker 4: There's really no easy answer to that question. A lot 20 00:01:05,000 --> 00:01:07,360 Speaker 4: of it will depend or most of it will depend 21 00:01:07,440 --> 00:01:12,520 Speaker 4: on the industry that the employer works in. For example, 22 00:01:13,000 --> 00:01:18,480 Speaker 4: in some industries where it's an inherent requirement of the 23 00:01:18,600 --> 00:01:23,080 Speaker 4: job to deal with people at risks, such as health 24 00:01:23,720 --> 00:01:28,600 Speaker 4: age care facilities, then an employer is likely to have 25 00:01:28,680 --> 00:01:33,160 Speaker 4: the ability to issue a lawful and reasonable direction that 26 00:01:33,319 --> 00:01:38,440 Speaker 4: its employees be vaccinated. I note in Victoria they've introduced 27 00:01:38,440 --> 00:01:44,399 Speaker 4: some legislation, the Health Services Amendment Managery Vaccination of healthcare workers, 28 00:01:45,520 --> 00:01:48,400 Speaker 4: and that allows the Secretary of the Department of Human 29 00:01:48,480 --> 00:01:53,480 Speaker 4: Services to direct public hospitals and health service establishments to 30 00:01:53,560 --> 00:01:57,840 Speaker 4: require that the employees are to be vaccinated again specified diseases. 31 00:01:58,680 --> 00:02:04,840 Speaker 4: That's the only legislation aware of. During the pandemic, most 32 00:02:04,880 --> 00:02:09,200 Speaker 4: of the station and territories issued public orders which required 33 00:02:10,120 --> 00:02:16,120 Speaker 4: people involved in age care to have vaccinations against the influenza. 34 00:02:16,240 --> 00:02:21,600 Speaker 4: So I think the bottom line is that if you 35 00:02:21,760 --> 00:02:25,440 Speaker 4: work in an industry where it's a hot well would 36 00:02:25,440 --> 00:02:30,919 Speaker 4: be designated as a high risk industry, then it's likely 37 00:02:31,000 --> 00:02:34,720 Speaker 4: that it'll be an inherent requirement of your role to 38 00:02:34,840 --> 00:02:38,519 Speaker 4: come into contact with high risk people, and the employer 39 00:02:38,600 --> 00:02:41,160 Speaker 4: is likely to be able to issue a lawful and 40 00:02:41,240 --> 00:02:44,080 Speaker 4: reasonable direction. If you work in an industry that's not 41 00:02:44,400 --> 00:02:48,200 Speaker 4: high risk, then that's where it's probably going to become 42 00:02:48,240 --> 00:02:54,240 Speaker 4: a little bit more problematic. Each industry and each employment 43 00:02:54,280 --> 00:03:00,440 Speaker 4: situation is going to be unique. The reasons if whatmployee 44 00:03:00,440 --> 00:03:04,080 Speaker 4: puts forward as to why they would object is also 45 00:03:04,160 --> 00:03:09,359 Speaker 4: going to be a factory What reasonable steps an employer 46 00:03:09,440 --> 00:03:16,680 Speaker 4: could take to accommodate an employee's objection, and what are 47 00:03:16,720 --> 00:03:21,760 Speaker 4: the inherent requirements of the role? Yeah, so a combination 48 00:03:21,800 --> 00:03:25,400 Speaker 4: of a lot of factors, for example, would be a 49 00:03:25,520 --> 00:03:28,560 Speaker 4: ca Can the employer allow the employee to work from home? 50 00:03:29,960 --> 00:03:35,120 Speaker 4: Is that a reasonable compromise? Things about nature? 51 00:03:35,440 --> 00:03:37,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, Look, I find this really fascinating because I know 52 00:03:38,320 --> 00:03:40,800 Speaker 2: some people are a bit sort of worried, I guess 53 00:03:40,880 --> 00:03:44,320 Speaker 2: about about having that vaccine. But in reality, like you said, 54 00:03:44,640 --> 00:03:46,240 Speaker 2: you know, if we've got people who are working in 55 00:03:46,280 --> 00:03:50,160 Speaker 2: those frontline positions, it may be necessary for them to 56 00:03:50,200 --> 00:03:53,280 Speaker 2: have the vaccine. But I guess it also sounds like 57 00:03:54,000 --> 00:03:59,520 Speaker 2: legislation implemented or introduced by the parliament whichever state you're in, 58 00:03:59,640 --> 00:04:02,040 Speaker 2: is going to have a big part to play as well. 59 00:04:03,320 --> 00:04:07,720 Speaker 4: It is. But my concern is that, I mean Victoria 60 00:04:07,760 --> 00:04:11,960 Speaker 4: obviously has, but whether political parties in power are willing 61 00:04:12,080 --> 00:04:16,360 Speaker 4: to step up to the plate so to speak, and 62 00:04:16,440 --> 00:04:21,120 Speaker 4: introduce that legislation. I noticed there's been a few protests. 63 00:04:21,760 --> 00:04:23,920 Speaker 4: There was one in Dawen, I think on Saturday, and 64 00:04:24,000 --> 00:04:28,600 Speaker 4: a few other states where people were objecting against managery vaccination. 65 00:04:30,680 --> 00:04:34,719 Speaker 4: Political parties, probably in government, probably don't want to take 66 00:04:34,720 --> 00:04:38,159 Speaker 4: any steps that may be perceived as being unpopular, and 67 00:04:38,279 --> 00:04:42,279 Speaker 4: that may well depend on whether it becomes an issue. 68 00:04:42,720 --> 00:04:45,760 Speaker 4: So is there going to be a large percentage of 69 00:04:45,839 --> 00:04:51,320 Speaker 4: employees who object. If so, then the parliaments may look 70 00:04:51,360 --> 00:04:55,320 Speaker 4: at legislation and Peter, we. 71 00:04:55,400 --> 00:04:58,120 Speaker 2: Heard or we have sort of heard businesses such as 72 00:04:58,279 --> 00:05:01,360 Speaker 2: Quantas say that people may not be able to fly 73 00:05:01,560 --> 00:05:05,320 Speaker 2: internationally if they don't have the vaccine. Is that something 74 00:05:05,360 --> 00:05:07,240 Speaker 2: that a business can actually implement. 75 00:05:08,560 --> 00:05:13,560 Speaker 4: Look, if you want to fly with Kantus, or you 76 00:05:13,640 --> 00:05:17,400 Speaker 4: want to buy products or use services for any business, 77 00:05:17,480 --> 00:05:22,840 Speaker 4: it's a contractual relationship and so on its face, a 78 00:05:22,920 --> 00:05:28,240 Speaker 4: business can restrict the provision of the services to whom 79 00:05:28,279 --> 00:05:34,560 Speaker 4: it wants. However, that may be subject to anti discrimination legislation. 80 00:05:35,680 --> 00:05:40,200 Speaker 4: And once again that comes back to whether if a 81 00:05:40,240 --> 00:05:42,800 Speaker 4: person has a special need, such as I have a 82 00:05:42,800 --> 00:05:46,479 Speaker 4: special need not to get vaccinated because of health. I don't, 83 00:05:46,560 --> 00:05:50,719 Speaker 4: but that's what I'm saying, and therefore, can the airline 84 00:05:50,760 --> 00:05:56,119 Speaker 4: do something to accommodate that. I don't think they probably can, 85 00:05:56,880 --> 00:06:01,359 Speaker 4: given how contagious the virus is, but that would be 86 00:06:01,400 --> 00:06:05,599 Speaker 4: certainly something they would have to consider and come to 87 00:06:05,680 --> 00:06:09,600 Speaker 4: a conclusion so as to have a defense if there 88 00:06:09,720 --> 00:06:13,240 Speaker 4: was a claim brought against them under the anti discrimination legislation. 89 00:06:13,839 --> 00:06:16,120 Speaker 2: Well there, it sounds like it's going to be an 90 00:06:16,120 --> 00:06:19,800 Speaker 2: interesting area to navigate potentially over the coming months. But 91 00:06:20,760 --> 00:06:23,240 Speaker 2: you know, as you sort of mentioned as well, there 92 00:06:23,320 --> 00:06:25,920 Speaker 2: might need to be some tough decisions made by different 93 00:06:25,960 --> 00:06:29,919 Speaker 2: governments around Australia also at some point in time in 94 00:06:30,040 --> 00:06:32,240 Speaker 2: terms of whether they do call for this to be 95 00:06:32,320 --> 00:06:33,080 Speaker 2: mandatory or not. 96 00:06:34,279 --> 00:06:38,160 Speaker 4: I think so. I think it's if it certainly make 97 00:06:38,279 --> 00:06:42,520 Speaker 4: it a lot more straightforward for employers. I think it's 98 00:06:42,640 --> 00:06:47,520 Speaker 4: unfair to some extent to put the owners onto employers 99 00:06:48,520 --> 00:06:53,080 Speaker 4: and potentially cause disruption in their relationship with their employees. 100 00:06:54,200 --> 00:06:58,000 Speaker 4: But what I would suggest that employers start giving some 101 00:06:58,080 --> 00:07:03,760 Speaker 4: consideration to whether they are going to require their employees 102 00:07:03,800 --> 00:07:07,160 Speaker 4: to get vaccinated and enter into a little bit of 103 00:07:07,240 --> 00:07:16,640 Speaker 4: a consultation process with the employees. People by nature are 104 00:07:16,880 --> 00:07:22,280 Speaker 4: generally happy to comply with what's required. If there's discussion 105 00:07:22,320 --> 00:07:26,520 Speaker 4: and they're a part of the forum as opposed to 106 00:07:26,560 --> 00:07:28,239 Speaker 4: being told you must do this. 107 00:07:29,080 --> 00:07:30,160 Speaker 3: It's a very good point. 108 00:07:30,920 --> 00:07:35,240 Speaker 4: If employers take that stance, then it's more likely that 109 00:07:36,760 --> 00:07:40,360 Speaker 4: they will be able to work with their employees, either 110 00:07:40,440 --> 00:07:43,320 Speaker 4: to get the vaccine or to reach some sort of 111 00:07:43,320 --> 00:07:44,000 Speaker 4: a compromise. 112 00:07:44,680 --> 00:07:49,679 Speaker 2: Well, Peter or the Silver Heirbrown Barristers and Solicitors' Special Counsel, 113 00:07:49,840 --> 00:07:52,240 Speaker 2: I really appreciate your time this morning. Thanks so much 114 00:07:52,280 --> 00:07:53,680 Speaker 2: for having a chat with us about that. 115 00:07:54,200 --> 00:07:54,800 Speaker 4: My pleasure. 116 00:07:54,960 --> 00:07:57,720 Speaker 3: Thank you, And I'll tell you what it sounds like. 117 00:07:57,760 --> 00:08:00,720 Speaker 2: It is going to be interesting as we're just there 118 00:08:00,760 --> 00:08:04,480 Speaker 2: from Peter and will we see you know, governments around 119 00:08:04,480 --> 00:08:09,000 Speaker 2: the nation decide to implement legislation or introduce legislation that 120 00:08:09,120 --> 00:08:11,080 Speaker 2: does make this vaccine compulsory. 121 00:08:11,720 --> 00:08:13,040 Speaker 3: Let's wait and see what happens.