1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:02,840 Speaker 1: Joining us in the studio right now is the Senator 2 00:00:02,920 --> 00:00:05,600 Speaker 1: for the Northern Territory, the COLP Senator Sam McMahon. 3 00:00:05,640 --> 00:00:07,600 Speaker 2: Good morning to you. Yeah, good morning, Katie. How are 4 00:00:07,600 --> 00:00:08,720 Speaker 2: you very well now? 5 00:00:08,760 --> 00:00:12,120 Speaker 1: Senator obviously just talking to Alex Bruce from Hospitality into 6 00:00:12,480 --> 00:00:15,560 Speaker 1: about the need for a firm date, a freedom date, 7 00:00:15,640 --> 00:00:16,599 Speaker 1: I think he's called it. 8 00:00:16,920 --> 00:00:18,360 Speaker 2: When it comes to our borders. 9 00:00:19,200 --> 00:00:21,639 Speaker 1: Do you think that the staged approach that the Chief 10 00:00:21,640 --> 00:00:23,759 Speaker 1: Minister is taking right now is a good one or 11 00:00:23,800 --> 00:00:26,400 Speaker 1: do we really need to lock in a firm date 12 00:00:26,480 --> 00:00:28,760 Speaker 1: like we're seeing in other states around Australia. 13 00:00:29,120 --> 00:00:29,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, Okatie. 14 00:00:29,680 --> 00:00:31,480 Speaker 3: I mean the problem is there is no clarity at 15 00:00:31,480 --> 00:00:35,479 Speaker 3: the moment. There absolutely is no clarity about when that 16 00:00:35,600 --> 00:00:38,320 Speaker 3: date will be or even if we will have that date. 17 00:00:38,600 --> 00:00:42,640 Speaker 3: I mean at the moment, we've got several Indigenous communities 18 00:00:42,680 --> 00:00:46,760 Speaker 3: out there that have got vaccination rates in the single digits. 19 00:00:47,159 --> 00:00:50,479 Speaker 3: So where a community, and these are sizeable communities, have 20 00:00:50,640 --> 00:00:54,400 Speaker 3: less than ten percent people fully vaccinated. So if Michael 21 00:00:54,440 --> 00:00:56,720 Speaker 3: Gunn is going to stick to what he's been saying 22 00:00:57,080 --> 00:00:59,240 Speaker 3: and say that we need to get to eighty percent 23 00:00:59,520 --> 00:01:01,840 Speaker 3: across all jurisdictions in the Northern territory. 24 00:01:02,200 --> 00:01:04,839 Speaker 2: When is that date going to be? Nobody knows. 25 00:01:05,000 --> 00:01:09,000 Speaker 1: Well, I mean he's flagged January eighteen as being when 26 00:01:09,040 --> 00:01:11,240 Speaker 1: we do get there, but I suppose for some of 27 00:01:11,280 --> 00:01:13,400 Speaker 1: those industries that's quite a while to wait. 28 00:01:14,200 --> 00:01:17,720 Speaker 3: Yeah, look, look it is. And also, you know, I 29 00:01:17,760 --> 00:01:20,240 Speaker 3: think if he comes out with a hard and fast 30 00:01:20,319 --> 00:01:24,480 Speaker 3: date and says, irrespective of where we're at with vaccination figures, 31 00:01:24,840 --> 00:01:27,280 Speaker 3: this is the date that we're going to open our borders. 32 00:01:27,280 --> 00:01:28,679 Speaker 3: This is a date that we're going to have people 33 00:01:28,720 --> 00:01:32,360 Speaker 3: come in going freely, then at least industry and the 34 00:01:32,400 --> 00:01:35,880 Speaker 3: general public out there has clarity. They know what's going on. 35 00:01:36,400 --> 00:01:39,960 Speaker 3: But he keeps shifting the date because his vaccination rates 36 00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:40,720 Speaker 3: aren't getting there. 37 00:01:41,319 --> 00:01:43,800 Speaker 1: Well, it is something that's going to be a real focus, 38 00:01:43,840 --> 00:01:45,840 Speaker 1: I think for so many as we lead into Christmas. 39 00:01:45,920 --> 00:01:47,680 Speaker 1: It's something a lot of people are wondering when they're 40 00:01:47,680 --> 00:01:49,560 Speaker 1: going to be able to have family come and visit, 41 00:01:49,680 --> 00:01:51,560 Speaker 1: when they're maybe going to be able to travel around 42 00:01:51,560 --> 00:01:54,080 Speaker 1: the nation to see family and then get back in 43 00:01:54,120 --> 00:01:55,360 Speaker 1: to the Northern Territory. 44 00:01:55,920 --> 00:01:57,640 Speaker 2: But Senator I do want to ask you. 45 00:01:57,720 --> 00:02:00,160 Speaker 1: We know that you are still holding out hope the 46 00:02:00,240 --> 00:02:04,000 Speaker 1: Territory Rights Bill could still pass parliament. It is, despite 47 00:02:04,000 --> 00:02:06,160 Speaker 1: the fact that the government that you're part of have 48 00:02:06,280 --> 00:02:08,440 Speaker 1: said a couple of weeks ago that there's still no 49 00:02:08,600 --> 00:02:11,600 Speaker 1: plans to help repeal the federal ban on the Northern 50 00:02:11,680 --> 00:02:17,280 Speaker 1: Territory making our own euthanasia laws. Senator, why do you 51 00:02:17,320 --> 00:02:19,200 Speaker 1: think that this time it could be different? 52 00:02:19,760 --> 00:02:23,239 Speaker 3: Yeah, Katie, Look, there's a lot of confusion out there. Yes, 53 00:02:23,320 --> 00:02:26,440 Speaker 3: the government did come out and say that the government 54 00:02:26,560 --> 00:02:29,800 Speaker 3: has no plans to repeal the laws, and that's quite 55 00:02:29,800 --> 00:02:33,919 Speaker 3: correct because it wasn't the government that put the ban 56 00:02:34,040 --> 00:02:37,320 Speaker 3: in place in the first place. It was the Parliament 57 00:02:37,720 --> 00:02:40,480 Speaker 3: and that is quite different to the government. So the 58 00:02:40,520 --> 00:02:43,919 Speaker 3: government didn't do it. The government isn't planning to repeal it, 59 00:02:45,360 --> 00:02:48,040 Speaker 3: but obviously I am, and I am planning to put 60 00:02:48,080 --> 00:02:51,600 Speaker 3: it before Parliament where the Parliament will decide. 61 00:02:51,919 --> 00:02:54,440 Speaker 2: So, yes, how would that work? I suppose? How is 62 00:02:54,480 --> 00:02:55,040 Speaker 2: that different? 63 00:02:55,080 --> 00:02:57,440 Speaker 1: You know to lots of punters out there listening this morning, 64 00:02:57,480 --> 00:02:59,240 Speaker 1: they might be thinking, how is it? 65 00:02:59,600 --> 00:03:01,680 Speaker 2: You know, how is it different whether the government passes 66 00:03:01,720 --> 00:03:03,280 Speaker 2: it or whether the Parliament passes it. 67 00:03:03,639 --> 00:03:05,160 Speaker 3: Yeah, Well, as I said, that's what happened in the 68 00:03:05,160 --> 00:03:07,560 Speaker 3: first place. It was Andrew's bill. It was a private 69 00:03:07,560 --> 00:03:11,680 Speaker 3: member's bill and that passed through parliament. Obviously, the government 70 00:03:12,240 --> 00:03:15,880 Speaker 3: is the coalition, whereas the Parliament is made up of 71 00:03:16,760 --> 00:03:19,679 Speaker 3: Coalition members, Labor members, Greens. 72 00:03:19,520 --> 00:03:20,040 Speaker 2: Et cetera. 73 00:03:20,440 --> 00:03:22,720 Speaker 3: So they are two different bodies. And it was the 74 00:03:22,720 --> 00:03:25,360 Speaker 3: Parliament that passed these laws in the first place, and 75 00:03:25,400 --> 00:03:27,960 Speaker 3: it is the parliament that I'm intending to or that 76 00:03:28,040 --> 00:03:31,760 Speaker 3: I am going to bring the bill before in this instance, 77 00:03:31,800 --> 00:03:33,560 Speaker 3: so I will bring it to the Senate and the 78 00:03:33,600 --> 00:03:35,360 Speaker 3: whole Senate will get to vote on it. 79 00:03:35,600 --> 00:03:37,000 Speaker 1: I know that you hit a bit of a snag 80 00:03:37,120 --> 00:03:39,600 Speaker 1: yesterday from what I can gather. According to a report 81 00:03:39,600 --> 00:03:41,960 Speaker 1: in the Canberra Times, Labor have said that they won't 82 00:03:42,000 --> 00:03:45,720 Speaker 1: support that private member's bill and as a result, you've 83 00:03:45,760 --> 00:03:47,120 Speaker 1: actually made some changes. 84 00:03:48,280 --> 00:03:51,720 Speaker 2: What have you changed? So, yes, look, it was disappointing. 85 00:03:51,800 --> 00:03:54,240 Speaker 3: Labour talks the big game when it comes to territory rights, 86 00:03:54,520 --> 00:03:57,280 Speaker 3: but when they had the opportunity to open the batting, 87 00:03:57,680 --> 00:03:59,840 Speaker 3: they were nowhere to be seen. They'd abandon their crease. 88 00:04:00,360 --> 00:04:02,640 Speaker 3: So you know, the things that they that I have 89 00:04:02,680 --> 00:04:05,240 Speaker 3: heard reported that were sticking points for them were the 90 00:04:05,240 --> 00:04:08,640 Speaker 3: two parts of the bill that dealt with the acquisition 91 00:04:08,680 --> 00:04:12,240 Speaker 3: of property and also the ability to make legislation around 92 00:04:12,320 --> 00:04:16,960 Speaker 3: fair work. Now, those are reasonably minor things in that 93 00:04:16,960 --> 00:04:20,400 Speaker 3: bill to territorians, in fact, most territories. Why were they 94 00:04:20,440 --> 00:04:23,320 Speaker 3: parts of that bill because this was a bill about 95 00:04:23,440 --> 00:04:27,159 Speaker 3: territory rights, and so I looked into all of the 96 00:04:27,200 --> 00:04:30,200 Speaker 3: aspects where the territory doesn't have the same rights as 97 00:04:30,200 --> 00:04:33,279 Speaker 3: the states, and those were aspects that we don't have 98 00:04:33,320 --> 00:04:36,800 Speaker 3: the ability to legislate on. So I put them into 99 00:04:36,800 --> 00:04:40,679 Speaker 3: the bill as a territory rights bill. Now, unfortunately, Labor 100 00:04:40,760 --> 00:04:43,240 Speaker 3: said they don't understand those things, so they're not going 101 00:04:43,279 --> 00:04:46,800 Speaker 3: to support them. So I'm like, that's fine. I Am 102 00:04:46,839 --> 00:04:49,159 Speaker 3: not going to die on a ditch over those aspects. 103 00:04:50,000 --> 00:04:53,320 Speaker 3: I am happy to amend the legislation to take them 104 00:04:53,360 --> 00:04:56,000 Speaker 3: out if that's what it's going to take to get 105 00:04:56,000 --> 00:04:56,839 Speaker 3: this over the line. 106 00:04:56,880 --> 00:04:58,520 Speaker 2: And do you reckon it's going to get it across 107 00:04:58,520 --> 00:04:58,919 Speaker 2: the line? 108 00:04:58,920 --> 00:05:03,000 Speaker 1: Do you think that, realistically, after all of these years, 109 00:05:03,480 --> 00:05:05,320 Speaker 1: that we're going to get to the point where we 110 00:05:05,560 --> 00:05:06,640 Speaker 1: have the right to choose. 111 00:05:07,200 --> 00:05:09,640 Speaker 3: Well, look, I certainly hope so, and I believe so. 112 00:05:10,200 --> 00:05:15,560 Speaker 3: It's it's obviously be very helpful if Labor senators and 113 00:05:15,600 --> 00:05:17,640 Speaker 3: members are allowed to have a conscience vote on it, 114 00:05:18,000 --> 00:05:22,040 Speaker 3: and that's what I'm hoping for. Now. They've put roadblocks 115 00:05:22,200 --> 00:05:25,160 Speaker 3: around it. They say they support territory rights, but they 116 00:05:25,200 --> 00:05:27,800 Speaker 3: put roadblocks there. But I'm happy to remove them. I'm 117 00:05:27,800 --> 00:05:30,640 Speaker 3: happy to remove every roadblock i can to make it 118 00:05:30,680 --> 00:05:33,680 Speaker 3: as easy as possible for them to step up and 119 00:05:33,760 --> 00:05:34,320 Speaker 3: support this. 120 00:05:34,520 --> 00:05:36,600 Speaker 1: Of course, it's not just labor members though, that you're 121 00:05:36,600 --> 00:05:39,040 Speaker 1: going to need to support it. It is also are 122 00:05:39,080 --> 00:05:41,359 Speaker 1: those in the coalition? Have you got their support? 123 00:05:42,320 --> 00:05:44,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, look, I've got I've got a lot of support. 124 00:05:44,480 --> 00:05:47,000 Speaker 3: There's there's quite clearly some people that have said to 125 00:05:47,040 --> 00:05:49,839 Speaker 3: me they can't support it because of their own personal beliefs. 126 00:05:51,000 --> 00:05:55,960 Speaker 3: That's fine, I understand that. But overwhelmingly there is a 127 00:05:56,040 --> 00:05:59,760 Speaker 3: lot of support out there amongst amongst many members and 128 00:05:59,800 --> 00:06:04,280 Speaker 3: so so amongst the Coalition, amongst the Greens, and amongst 129 00:06:04,279 --> 00:06:06,360 Speaker 3: individual labor. 130 00:06:06,480 --> 00:06:07,440 Speaker 2: When's it going to happen? 131 00:06:08,000 --> 00:06:11,600 Speaker 3: Look, I'm hoping it's going to happen at the next sittings. Obviously, 132 00:06:11,600 --> 00:06:14,480 Speaker 3: we've just finished a week of sittings in Canberra. We're 133 00:06:14,480 --> 00:06:18,360 Speaker 3: in Senate estimates this week, but Parliament will come back 134 00:06:18,360 --> 00:06:21,359 Speaker 3: in November, so mid to late to November. There's a 135 00:06:21,360 --> 00:06:23,800 Speaker 3: couple of weeks there, and that is when I propose 136 00:06:23,880 --> 00:06:24,359 Speaker 3: to bring it on. 137 00:06:24,640 --> 00:06:27,000 Speaker 1: Well, Senator Sam McMahon, please keep us up to date 138 00:06:27,040 --> 00:06:29,320 Speaker 1: and let us know how it goes and whether that 139 00:06:29,360 --> 00:06:31,880 Speaker 1: does indeed happen in November. I know that a lot 140 00:06:31,920 --> 00:06:34,360 Speaker 1: of listeners will be very keen to find out and 141 00:06:34,400 --> 00:06:36,200 Speaker 1: get that update as we get a bit closer to 142 00:06:36,240 --> 00:06:36,680 Speaker 1: that date. 143 00:06:36,920 --> 00:06:39,080 Speaker 2: Yep, absolutely thank you for your time this morning. We 144 00:06:39,120 --> 00:06:39,800 Speaker 2: appreciate it.