Speaker 1: Welcome back to TV Reload. My name's Benjamin Norris, and
Speaker 1: on this podcast, I'll be going behind the scenes with
Speaker 1: the biggest players in television.
Speaker 2: Kicking off today's episode. I think you.
Speaker 1: May notice, but I have a cold. It's been a
Speaker 1: shocking week for me and the main piece of advice
Speaker 1: that I have for you all is lock your phones
Speaker 1: and don't bummdll celebrities in the middle of the night.
Speaker 1: Imagine the most famous person in your phone and then
Speaker 1: imagine you called them at an ungodly hour. I am
Speaker 1: simply mortified. This week in TV land, RuPaul's down Under
Speaker 1: has launched on stand and I'm super excited about what
Speaker 1: audiences think about that. So hit me up on Twitter
Speaker 1: and let me know your thoughts.
Speaker 2: How do we.
Speaker 1: Compare against the other international formats. I also want to
Speaker 1: recommend that everyone start watching Mayor of Easttown. It's on
Speaker 1: Binge and it's one of the best scripto dramas I've
Speaker 1: ever seen. It's stars Kate Winslett and you won't believe
Speaker 1: me until you've seen it, but it is easily her
Speaker 1: best role. Today on today's episod so I'll be chatting
Speaker 1: with co CEOs at Eureka Production. These boys have taken
Speaker 1: their incredible knowledge producing shows on Channel nine ten seven
Speaker 1: a SBS plus Foxtelle and gone large by taking on
Speaker 1: the world. In twenty sixteen, both Chris Culvinor and Paul
Speaker 1: Franklin co founded Eureka and with their position as co CEO,
Speaker 1: they have led the company to be a world leader
Speaker 1: in unscripted Today, Eureka Productions has launched over twenty fourth
Speaker 1: series in the United States, Canada and Australia, and in
Speaker 1: twenty nineteen the company produced over ninety hours of programming.
Speaker 1: This year alone, we have seen shows like Holy Moly
Speaker 1: on Channel seven, Amazing Race on Channel ten making a
Speaker 1: big splash, and there is plenty.
Speaker 2: More to come.
Speaker 1: So let's get started with today's guests. It's Chris Culvinor
Speaker 1: and Paul Franklin.
Speaker 3: As much as people say they might dislike elements of
Speaker 3: the shew we dislike the show, doesn't.
Speaker 4: Mean they're not watching it. This is Holy molyy.
Speaker 3: We obviously work with Disney on the Holy Molly format
Speaker 3: internationally and they were blown away.
Speaker 5: Welcome to the Amazing Rights Australia.
Speaker 3: The shows are only as good as the people making them.
Speaker 2: They're some of the greatest stories that's in Australia and
Speaker 2: the history.
Speaker 5: We try to empower people so that they feel like
Speaker 5: they've got a real voice in the room. When it
Speaker 5: comes to creativity.
Speaker 1: We're all about carrying on in our dad's footsteps.
Speaker 4: Crigy. It's the OI.
Speaker 3: The truth is everyone at Eureka, and Paul and I included,
Speaker 3: are very passionate about the shows that we make.
Speaker 2: Well Gooday, guys, how are you both?
Speaker 4: Yeah? Very well, that's mate, How are you you good?
Speaker 2: I'm really good.
Speaker 1: But I understand that you two are the busiest people
Speaker 1: in show business, so I am so grateful for your time.
Speaker 4: We never do this stuff. Yeah, you're the only person
Speaker 4: who've done something Eye is with.
Speaker 1: So yeah, guys, we're doing the research for today's podcast.
Speaker 1: I spoke with a lot of the industry peers, and
Speaker 1: every single person I spoke to they said that you're
Speaker 1: both great to work with. People really admire you. They
Speaker 1: all want to work with you, which is great. Paul,
Speaker 1: is it a challenge or a choice to try and
Speaker 1: create such a fun but productive production space that crews
Speaker 1: want to work on.
Speaker 5: Well, it's a challenge in the sense that you do
Speaker 5: want everyone to have a fun time, but you've got
Speaker 5: to get a big job to get done well. What
Speaker 5: we've found is especially in the Australian market because we
Speaker 5: make shows for here, but also the US, there's a
Speaker 5: attraction I think to work on fresh products, and I
Speaker 5: think people get enjoyment and fun out of that. I mean,
Speaker 5: I'm inclined to sort of tell people when we make
Speaker 5: a new show it's like, well, I don't know how
Speaker 5: to make it either, So if you want to come
Speaker 5: on an adventure with people who might not know exactly
Speaker 5: what we're.
Speaker 4: Doing, we could use your help. I mean, that's the
Speaker 4: secret to any people people involved. But we try to
Speaker 4: keep it fun. I mean, you know, the shows are
Speaker 4: what it's all about at the end of the day.
Speaker 5: I mean, I think Chris and I are smart enough
Speaker 5: to know that it's actually the people that make the shows.
Speaker 4: It's not just the two of us trying to work
Speaker 4: out how to make and we need a great.
Speaker 5: Team around us, which we try to empower people so
Speaker 5: that they feel like they've got a real voice in
Speaker 5: the room when it comes to creativity.
Speaker 4: And yeah, I think that's part of the pill.
Speaker 2: Chris.
Speaker 1: I can imagine trust as a producer is via. Do
Speaker 1: you find that creating that trust I guess with the
Speaker 1: talent on screen and the people that are working for
Speaker 1: you is important?
Speaker 3: Yeah? Absolutely. I mean I think trust on every level
Speaker 3: is important. As you said, it's the trust of the
Speaker 3: broadcast or the platform that they have in Eureka, it's
Speaker 3: the trust that we have in our staff. And what
Speaker 3: Paul said then is the shows are only as good
Speaker 3: as the people making them, So a lot of what
Speaker 3: we do is attracting the best talent, nurturing the best talent,
Speaker 3: and trying to foster the best talent. So there needs
Speaker 3: to be trust there, but equally, there needs to be
Speaker 3: an environment for people to really have a go and
Speaker 3: really kind.
Speaker 4: Of prove themselves.
Speaker 3: So absolutely trust is essential and key and certainly something
Speaker 3: I don't think we've had.
Speaker 4: Any real problems with.
Speaker 3: Because the truth is, everyone at Eureka, and Paul and
Speaker 3: I included, are very passionate about the shows that we make,
Speaker 3: and so that passion is really what drives all the
Speaker 3: sort of creative forces behind it.
Speaker 1: Well, Chris, while we've got to there, just ask how
Speaker 1: did you Rica Productions get started?
Speaker 3: So Paul and I had been working together almost for
Speaker 3: about twelve years prior to starting Eureka, so we'd worked
Speaker 3: at Fremantle Australia, Shine Australia, and then most recently we
Speaker 3: were both living in the States working for Shine America.
Speaker 3: So I was running development there and Paul was running programming,
Speaker 3: and our contracts both ended at the same time. We
Speaker 3: looked at each other and thought we'd been doing this
Speaker 3: for other people for a long time, sort of you know,
Speaker 3: two sides of the coin. And we both knew we
Speaker 3: had very different skill sets, but complementary skill sets. So
Speaker 3: I guess, bravely or naively or stupidly, however you want
Speaker 3: to look at it, we just thought let's take a
Speaker 3: risk and let's go out on our own. And there's
Speaker 3: been huge amounts of learning in the last six years
Speaker 3: of growing Eureka. There's been ups and downs ause. I'm
Speaker 3: sure everyone in this industry experiences, but really we started
Speaker 3: from you know, with Paul and I in a we
Speaker 3: work space six years ago and it was a company
Speaker 3: that didn't have any pipeline at all. We didn't have,
Speaker 3: you know, a great big format in the bank. It
Speaker 3: literally was like, let's start with a whiteboard and let's
Speaker 3: start with the relationships that we had, and I think
Speaker 3: one of the things that we're really grateful for is, yes,
Speaker 3: we took a risk, but there's so many broadcasters and
Speaker 3: networks around the world that took a risk on us,
Speaker 3: and certainly we wouldn't be where we're at without that
Speaker 3: support and that belief as well.
Speaker 1: You know, I was looking at the amount of shows
Speaker 1: that you guys are making at the moment.
Speaker 2: And it's madness. It's actual madness.
Speaker 1: Paul, in the last five years, did you expect that
Speaker 1: the business would grow so big so quickly?
Speaker 4: Maybe not so quickly.
Speaker 5: I think because Chris and I came out of big
Speaker 5: companies like Freemantle and AENEML, Sean and Sean America, and
Speaker 5: you get used to having the big corporate business with
Speaker 5: toys around you and access to a lot of support,
Speaker 5: I guess, and I think because we were coming out
Speaker 5: of that, it doesn't work like that. You do go
Speaker 5: back to pretty much a standing start, to Chris point,
Speaker 5: so you haven't got a big show in your back
Speaker 5: pocket that you know is going to generate money coming
Speaker 5: through the door. So I think at the outset we
Speaker 5: probably had, we probably thought we would have done better
Speaker 5: in the first year or two, but it's a hard,
Speaker 5: hard grind. It might feel quick people on the outside,
Speaker 5: but it's been six years, so to us it's been
Speaker 5: a bit of a mountain the whole way. It still
Speaker 5: feels like a mountain every day. So so it doesn't
Speaker 5: feel as rapid as it might appear in a couple
Speaker 5: of sentences when you describe that way.
Speaker 1: Nothing ever happens in a straight line. You know, when
Speaker 1: you read people's autobiographies, you're always like, Wow, these people
Speaker 1: just must have been really lucky. But you know, you
Speaker 1: delete so much space, you know, and the bits in between,
Speaker 1: you know, you just sort of keep it rolling. But
Speaker 1: you both have contributed to the landscape of television consistently
Speaker 1: for your entire working careers. I like to ask, at
Speaker 1: what stage in your career did you realize that you
Speaker 1: know you've made it, Chris, what show was it for
Speaker 1: you where you thought, I'm good at this and I'm
Speaker 1: proud of the work that I'm doing.
Speaker 3: I think every single show that you go into, I
Speaker 3: think there's a level of passion and there has to be.
Speaker 3: You know, you're right, like, we've both been doing this
Speaker 3: for a long time, and I think you can look
Speaker 3: at shows that seeing pivotal in your career. One thing
Speaker 3: that I look back on it I'm very proud of.
Speaker 3: It's not a show that I created or did anything
Speaker 3: like that. I worked with the Fantasies bringing The Apprentice
Speaker 3: to Australia and that show had never been done in
Speaker 3: Australia and it was a show that I was a
Speaker 3: huge fan of. And you know, I worked with the
Speaker 3: CEOs of that company at the time to help bring
Speaker 3: it out and that was just an incredible experience of
Speaker 3: building a format from the ground up. And I remember
Speaker 3: Paul and I doing the first screen test with Mark
Speaker 3: Burris back in the day to try and find who
Speaker 3: is going to be that boss figure.
Speaker 6: The team that makes the most money wins, get on Twitter,
Speaker 6: get on Facebook, get on the telephone, raise money for
Speaker 6: your charity. Of course, there's another side, there'll be a
Speaker 6: losing team. From the losing team, someone will be fired.
Speaker 3: So that was a show that really out as a
Speaker 3: kind of a turning point in my career.
Speaker 4: And then I think in terms of a show.
Speaker 3: At Eureka that was pivotal to our success was a
Speaker 3: show we did for Netflix called Dating Around, which was
Speaker 3: an original take and a twist on the dating genre,
Speaker 3: and it was one of Netflix's first unscripted shows. So
Speaker 3: from I guess a company trajectory point of view, that
Speaker 3: proved to the marketplace that not only could we execute shows,
Speaker 3: but we were able to come up with new takes
Speaker 3: on genres and original ideas, and that put us on
Speaker 3: the path for a lot of networks around the world
Speaker 3: trusting us with new ideas, and so that one stands
Speaker 3: out as well as an original show that was really
Speaker 3: defining for our company.
Speaker 2: S Oh hi, are you Nick?
Speaker 6: Yes, I'm nervous, but like I've never been on bline
Speaker 6: people before.
Speaker 1: So me there, I'm like the bitty girl, but I've
Speaker 1: never done in drug and y oh yeah, I love them.
Speaker 5: Oh my god, this conversation just took a really interesting turn.
Speaker 4: Just to first Blaine Dads, who, well, what was it
Speaker 4: with your work?
Speaker 1: I mean, Master Chef. I can imagine taking Master Chef overseas.
Speaker 1: That must have been a moment.
Speaker 3: I mean, look, you, Master Chef's been very good to me,
Speaker 3: you know, having been there from the first series in
Speaker 3: Australia and going out to England and you know, researching
Speaker 3: it and working out the format and all the rest.
Speaker 3: And then getting like I spent six months traveling helping
Speaker 3: roll it out on the place like France and significantly
Speaker 3: in the US.
Speaker 4: But when I think back, two shows stand out for me.
Speaker 5: One is back in the nineties, I worked to Channel
Speaker 5: nine as like a field producer and I got to
Speaker 5: ask to work on a show called Changing Rooms, which
Speaker 5: not many people.
Speaker 4: Would remember they might do from back in the day.
Speaker 5: It was very, very popular at the time, and when
Speaker 5: I went for the job interview, I said I know
Speaker 5: nothing about home renovation. I like, I don't think I'm
Speaker 5: the guy, and they said, no, no, we've heard you get
Speaker 5: along long with people want you to do it. It
Speaker 5: was Eric Dwyer and David Barbert and David Barbat does
Speaker 5: block now. And I did the show and it did
Speaker 5: really well, and then I moved to London. It was
Speaker 5: like nineteen ninety nine and I was like, oh, well,
Speaker 5: I've done that show. I don't want to do that
Speaker 5: show again. And I got approached by the BBC to
Speaker 5: make Changing Rooms for the BBC One and naively, I
Speaker 5: didn't realize.
Speaker 4: Just how big the show was. And I tried to
Speaker 4: do other shows and what else have you gotten? And
Speaker 4: they said we really want you to do this show
Speaker 4: and I did.
Speaker 5: It, and in England that was kind of a turning
Speaker 5: point because it was like, I think we're getting like
Speaker 5: fifteen million viewers on a Monday night.
Speaker 4: You know, it's just massive. In the year two thousand
Speaker 4: and I was, I.
Speaker 5: Was show running that and I don't think I quite
Speaker 5: realized until later just how big it was. But because
Speaker 5: of that, it opened a lot of doors in London
Speaker 5: for me. I lived in London for about seven years,
Speaker 5: so that was a really significant format. Interestingly, started in Australia,
Speaker 5: got to London and that's where it took off.
Speaker 4: The flip of that.
Speaker 3: The next show that which was pivotal for me, was
Speaker 3: Biggest Loser, because I did the Biggest Loser in England.
Speaker 3: I did the first series there and it was a nightmare.
Speaker 3: It was just like there was no budget.
Speaker 4: It was had leaning on the show.
Speaker 5: It was like eight episodes and it was I was
Speaker 5: literally geting up at five am, driving into the countryside,
Speaker 5: shooting waynes eliminations, grabbing the tapes, driving back at midnight
Speaker 5: and walking the edit the next day.
Speaker 4: I was a really Skelton crew.
Speaker 5: The reason that was SIGNIFICA was a really classic reality
Speaker 5: storytelling and that's where I really learned most of my
Speaker 5: chops in the reality space because I had to because
Speaker 5: it was a skeleton crew. And again it was at
Speaker 5: that time that the Mark and carf Fantasy or a
Speaker 5: Crackerjack rang me up and said we want to do
Speaker 5: it six nights a week, which is consider coming back
Speaker 5: to live in Australia. And that's when I came back,
Speaker 5: and so all the skills, the hard week that I've
Speaker 5: done in London was down. Of course, that show, the
Speaker 5: first season was massive when it came out. They're probably
Speaker 5: the ones where I benefited immensely. And you know, Master
Speaker 5: Chef obviously is a significant product, but you know a
Speaker 5: lot of what Master.
Speaker 3: Chef has was born out of learning how to strip
Speaker 3: a show, like we did with The Biggest Loser. That's
Speaker 3: where the basis of a challenge of night and all
Speaker 3: that sort of thing we did that in Loser and
Speaker 3: then and then of recent stuff, Holy Moley is kind
Speaker 3: of our biggest show, and especially in America. I just
Speaker 3: came back from filming season three and four, and yeah,
Speaker 3: the show is it's just it's just such a great show.
Speaker 5: It's a real calling card for our company over there.
Speaker 5: So it's my favorite.
Speaker 1: Some of the shows that are in production at the moment,
Speaker 1: like you know, Holly Molly USA and Lux Listening Byron
Speaker 1: Bays Full Bloom and Frogger. Just cherry picking two of
Speaker 1: these shows, Paul, can you talk to me about Froger?
Speaker 1: Immediately I thought of the Arcade game because that's my jam.
Speaker 1: I grew up in the eighties. So am I writer?
Speaker 1: Is that basically what that show is based on.
Speaker 5: Chris was the one who had the idea for the show,
Speaker 5: so and he spotted the brand, and you should.
Speaker 4: Answer this, yeah.
Speaker 3: I mean, I think with the success of Holy Molly
Speaker 3: in the States, a lot of people were coming to
Speaker 3: Eureka and asking what was our next big physical competition show.
Speaker 3: And it took us a bit of time to find,
Speaker 3: you know, what it should be. And I was actually
Speaker 3: at MIP and I was walking past a Konami stand.
Speaker 3: Kanami are the publishers of the actual video game, and
Speaker 3: there was a big Frogger logo, which was they were
Speaker 3: actually trying to pitch the show as an animation. But
Speaker 3: in that moment when I looked at this logo and
Speaker 3: I just saw that word Froger it just occurred to me, like,
Speaker 3: what a great brand, what a great platform for building
Speaker 3: an unscripted competition series from because very rarely does one
Speaker 3: word just elicit nostalgia, illicit fun, and you can almost
Speaker 3: envisage the show just by hearing that one word. So
Speaker 3: you're as exactly right. The show is going to be
Speaker 3: based on the video game, obviously, but it is like
Speaker 3: stepping into an eighties video game. We're actually shooting that
Speaker 3: in Sydney and we've got two Olympic sized above ground
Speaker 3: pools that we're building with these incredible worlds based on
Speaker 3: the video game level.
Speaker 4: It is possibly the biggest.
Speaker 3: Unscripted show that's ever been made in the country, and
Speaker 3: it's really exciting to have the opportunity to make it
Speaker 3: in Australia with local talent, with local producers, for an
Speaker 3: international audience. We're very, very excited by the show and
Speaker 3: can't wait for the world to see it.
Speaker 1: And then Paul I guess I'll go with you this
Speaker 1: time with lux listening. Is this an Australian version of
Speaker 1: Selling Sunset?
Speaker 3: It is?
Speaker 5: Yeah, it's got a bit of the Selling Sunset to it,
Speaker 5: you know, big characters, glamorous looks, it's a great way
Speaker 5: to showcase Sydney in the East and summers of Sydney
Speaker 5: in the real estate market. It's got a bit of
Speaker 5: that million dollar listening to it as well. But yeah,
Speaker 5: it is of that world as much as it is
Speaker 5: about buying and selling houses, it's about the people who
Speaker 5: exist in that world and how they operate day to day.
Speaker 4: And you know, we're really proud of that show. It's
Speaker 4: really slick.
Speaker 5: Amazon have been great partners on it in supporting it,
Speaker 5: like they've really backed it, and the marketing for it's
Speaker 5: going to be massive. It's a big swing for them,
Speaker 5: and I think I think you'd be pretty impressed how
Speaker 5: it showcases the city.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and i'd just add to that.
Speaker 3: I mean, I think where it's distinctively different from the
Speaker 3: shows you mentioned.
Speaker 4: Is just the characters that we've found.
Speaker 3: And I think the great thing about the sort of
Speaker 3: docu soap genre is they're really defined by the characters
Speaker 3: in the shows. So we've got three incredible agents which
Speaker 3: are obviously kind of unlocking this incredible real estate in
Speaker 3: the Eastern suburbs, and hand on heart, it's some of
Speaker 3: the most incredible real estate that.
Speaker 4: I think has ever been seen on a TV show.
Speaker 3: I mean, you can only imagine the sorts of houses
Speaker 3: that we can have a window into. And that's where
Speaker 3: I think this show will not only showcase the Sydney
Speaker 3: market to Australia, but I think the well will just
Speaker 3: be blown away by some of the property.
Speaker 4: Oh yeah, being on set was I was in awe
Speaker 4: of some of the property.
Speaker 5: If you forget how beautiful Sydney is, and I think
Speaker 5: that's a good point. The international market will just go,
Speaker 5: oh my god, because you know, we've there no expense
Speaker 5: on the visuals, you know, with the harbor.
Speaker 4: As that backdrop, and Chris is right.
Speaker 3: The agent's three agents that we feature are just compelling characters,
Speaker 3: you know as they go through the highs and lows
Speaker 3: and buying and selling houses and the people they interact with.
Speaker 1: Well a little Bertie told me that the casting is
Speaker 1: so good on that show that there's some one person
Speaker 1: that's been cast that is like when you cast Generallyana
Speaker 1: on a Real Housewives of Melbourne, like just something really
Speaker 1: iconic and something really excited to look forward to. So
Speaker 1: I got no more details than that. I don't know
Speaker 1: if that person's male or female, but I did hear
Speaker 1: that it's some amazing casting.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's a plus talent and they're equally it's their
Speaker 3: talent who have been so open and generous with their lives.
Speaker 3: I mean, often, you know, you find people who are
Speaker 3: quite guarded, understandably so, but the three real estate agents
Speaker 3: who we're working with, they just like opened up their
Speaker 3: lives and it's a really compelling watch.
Speaker 1: Stepping back just a little bit and thinking about you know,
Speaker 1: you guys sounding so Australian, Paul, was it really hard
Speaker 1: to crack into the US market the way that you did?
Speaker 1: I mean, you've made such a big splash with such
Speaker 1: an iconic show like Holy Molly over there, and I'm
Speaker 1: sure that there's so many people in Australia that would
Speaker 1: love to crack the US market. Was it hard to
Speaker 1: do that?
Speaker 4: It's hard?
Speaker 5: I mean, I think a lot of people ask advice
Speaker 5: in Australia out going over there and having a crack
Speaker 5: at getting a job over there.
Speaker 4: It's a cliche, but it's the first job you get.
Speaker 5: I think, you know, for Ozzie's if you're any good
Speaker 5: at the job you do.
Speaker 4: Once you get that first job, you'll go places over there.
Speaker 5: I mean the American market, it's a fun crazy it's
Speaker 5: having worked in England for a long time, it's not
Speaker 5: like the UK production market and business markets work and
Speaker 5: it's different. Again, it operates and when you dive in
Speaker 5: that river, you have to swim with it, you can't
Speaker 5: swim against it. For producers and program makers who go
Speaker 5: over there, because Australians tend to be brought up through
Speaker 5: the ranks of you being a research or being a
Speaker 5: runner or whatever it might be to get to where
Speaker 5: they get to as a producer or a director, or
Speaker 5: they have a lot of strings to their bow kind
Speaker 5: of and the Brits have this as well in the States,
Speaker 5: and that's what they tend to do well there as well.
Speaker 5: The Americans are really talented, but they do tend to
Speaker 5: have their one lane that they go to. So if
Speaker 5: you're good in the field, you're good in the field
Speaker 5: and that's what you do. Or if you're good at
Speaker 5: directing OSSI, they can go into an edit suite.
Speaker 3: They can quite often write a script and then they
Speaker 3: go into the field and make it happen as well.
Speaker 5: So for anyone who's thinking about going over there, if
Speaker 5: you can crack it and get in there, you love it,
Speaker 5: you'll really enjoy it, but it's hard work to get through.
Speaker 5: I mean, Chris and I were very, very fortunate when
Speaker 5: we first started China America that we kind of got
Speaker 5: dropped into decent roles within a production company at the
Speaker 5: time had biggest loser firing on NBC.
Speaker 4: It had mastershef firing.
Speaker 5: On Fox, and so we're already in an established company,
Speaker 5: which was you know, we're very fortunate, and I meant
Speaker 5: we could see the landscape and at our high level
Speaker 5: and understand how it worked. And then when we came
Speaker 5: back to it as Eureka, we kind of knew who
Speaker 5: all the players were. And when we're at Shina America,
Speaker 5: you know, cable was much much bigger. And now that
Speaker 5: we're in Eureka, you know, you've seen the streamers open up.
Speaker 5: I think broadcast television in the US and the streaming
Speaker 5: services especially is you know, they're big clients for us,
Speaker 5: and a lot of the people that we.
Speaker 3: Worked our way up through shows when we were in
Speaker 3: the States, they're our running those networks at a high level.
Speaker 3: So it's actually there's a group of people that we
Speaker 3: all know each other and it's helped a lot in
Speaker 3: having friends in the right places over there to be honest, but.
Speaker 4: Look, it's a tough part to crack.
Speaker 3: But I do think for people thinking of going and
Speaker 3: having go it, you should because it's an exciting one.
Speaker 1: Were Eureka Productions is making a lot of shows for
Speaker 1: you know, Amazon, Netflix, some of these streaming services. Chris,
Speaker 1: is that about going to places and spaces where audiences
Speaker 1: are now more likely to consume content listen.
Speaker 3: I think ultimately their new clients. So yes, obviously audiences
Speaker 3: are going to them. But the exciting thing about you know,
Speaker 3: Netflix starting to buy unscripted, or HBO Max starting to
Speaker 3: buy unscripted, or Amazon is it allows production companies to
Speaker 3: work with those platforms to come up with new, fresh,
Speaker 3: and defining shows. So we were really fortunate to have
Speaker 3: one of Netflix's first show with Dating around one of
Speaker 3: HbA of Max's first shows with Full Bloom. And so
Speaker 3: for us, what's been really fun with working with those
Speaker 3: streaming platforms is trying formats and trying twists on genres
Speaker 3: which might not have been sort of as sellable to
Speaker 3: traditional broadcast networks in both the States and Australia. So
Speaker 3: with new clients, there's kind of new creative opportunities.
Speaker 4: Now, I think.
Speaker 3: We're seeing audiences go to these platforms and that's something
Speaker 3: that's going to be playing out for next ten plus years.
Speaker 3: I think is how audiences consume media differently. But for us,
Speaker 3: it always comes down to the creative of the show
Speaker 3: and the idea and the format where that show lives.
Speaker 3: To be honest, I often find and this sounds a
Speaker 3: little bit, it sounds a little bit odd, but the
Speaker 3: show often finds the platform or the network it deserves
Speaker 3: to be on. And that's something like Holy Moley feels
Speaker 3: like it should be on ABC, while something like Wading
Speaker 3: Around I can't imagine anywhere else except on a Netflix
Speaker 3: because it is a little bit nuanced. So yeah, the
Speaker 3: show often finds the platform it deserves to be on.
Speaker 1: Is there any chance like all of that when you
Speaker 1: stack that up, are you stepping away from well, is
Speaker 1: Eureka stepping away from Australian freedoware television network because there
Speaker 1: is more work in other places?
Speaker 4: No? Absolutely not. In fact the opposite.
Speaker 3: I've actually seen a resurgence of Australian broadcast networks taking
Speaker 3: creative risks and buying in big, confident ways to frankly,
Speaker 3: I think the rise at streaming network So you look
Speaker 3: at what seven, nine and ten have done over the
Speaker 3: last year. They're extremely strong slates and you know, taking
Speaker 3: creative swings that I think we haven't seen in some time.
Speaker 4: So if we look at our business and we look
Speaker 4: at you know.
Speaker 3: Who we sell for and who we create for, broadcast
Speaker 3: in Australia is a huge part of that and I
Speaker 3: think it will continue to it.
Speaker 4: Thinks the nature of the world too.
Speaker 3: Everyone's consuming things quicker, they're turning over into something new quicker.
Speaker 3: Whereas bigger shows could sit somewhere for a longer period
Speaker 3: of time in many years and return and return.
Speaker 4: There's less of that going on.
Speaker 3: It still does happen, and some networks having more luck
Speaker 3: with that than others. But there's a need to go, okay,
Speaker 3: this is how do we how are we going to
Speaker 3: cut through?
Speaker 4: And I think because of that, creatively, they they've got to.
Speaker 5: Go and take more swings at more more formats and
Speaker 5: more different products.
Speaker 4: I think the industry in Australia's for production companies and
Speaker 4: producers and things is super super healthy.
Speaker 3: I mean it's a struggle to get the eyeballs to
Speaker 3: free to wear obviously because and that's not Australia, you know,
Speaker 3: it's the same conversation that they're having in London and
Speaker 3: they're having in.
Speaker 4: New York and LA And I was like, how do
Speaker 4: we get the get them in? And you know, I
Speaker 4: think the Austraine markets as busy as ever. You've see
Speaker 4: more and more shows, maybe sometimes short of lived. Well.
Speaker 1: I think the ratings of free towear shows like Maths
Speaker 1: for instance, proves that, you know that there's ways to
Speaker 1: still have event television on free to wear.
Speaker 2: I think there's some proof there.
Speaker 1: But you know, Paul, does that say that the Australian
Speaker 1: market is tuning in for a particular type of content?
Speaker 1: Is that Maths show resonating? Is that the kind of
Speaker 1: content that do you think Australia is thirsty for?
Speaker 5: I mean that show is human drama playing out and
Speaker 5: so I think that's why it resonates through.
Speaker 4: I mean, you know, it's.
Speaker 3: Truly some people say they you know, they love shows
Speaker 3: and then they say they hate them.
Speaker 4: You know, it's a little bit.
Speaker 5: We used to do research on one of our shows
Speaker 5: in the US, which was Master Chef for Fox many
Speaker 5: years ago, and they.
Speaker 4: Were talking about heroes and villains. This is the whole
Speaker 4: Fox research department.
Speaker 5: And they were saying, well, you know, people don't like this,
Speaker 5: this and this, and then we you know enough the conversations,
Speaker 5: like they were picking out certain characters, you know, in
Speaker 5: the in the cart but then the discussion and I
Speaker 5: was like, well that's fine, you know, and especially in America,
Speaker 5: they want heroes in villains. So just because they say
Speaker 5: that ain't like Chris, who's one of the chefs on
Speaker 5: the show, It's like, well, but that's okay, you know,
Speaker 5: because people I don't like him, but I will watch
Speaker 5: the show because I like the push and pull of characters.
Speaker 5: And I think it's I'm not knowing if it's exactly that,
Speaker 5: but I think there's an element of that there. So
Speaker 5: as much as people say they might dislike elements of
Speaker 5: the show or dislike the show, doesn't mean they're not
Speaker 5: watching it.
Speaker 2: It's the human moment.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I think you're absolutely correct, And I think some
Speaker 1: of the things that we're the most repulsed by become
Speaker 1: the things that we're kind of we can't turn away from.
Speaker 1: It's kind of the car accident. But at the same time,
Speaker 1: if it represents moments that we have in our own
Speaker 1: lives and we feel represented on screen. I guess then
Speaker 1: it sort of comes alive, you know, and then you
Speaker 1: can't deny it.
Speaker 4: I think you're right.
Speaker 3: I mean, you know, the shows are moments. They are moments,
Speaker 3: and people see themselves in people.
Speaker 5: I don't recognize it sometimes, you know, and that's where
Speaker 5: things are sticky for the individual and that's through their lens.
Speaker 4: And they interpret themselves.
Speaker 5: But I mean, Our Mass is a show that dominates
Speaker 5: in the ratings, so I think there's an audience out.
Speaker 4: There for it.
Speaker 5: And look, I think for the other shows that are
Speaker 5: out there that maybe aren't rating as highly, I think
Speaker 5: there's other places to find that. And that's where you
Speaker 5: got that little dilution a bit on what those viewers
Speaker 5: are looking for, so that they don't get that bigger
Speaker 5: net around an audience in that way.
Speaker 1: So well, Chris, I want to ask you one of
Speaker 1: my favorite shows this year in Australia was Holy Molly,
Speaker 1: and my partner, who hates Freedoware Television, came in and
Speaker 1: sat down and watched it with me, and we watched
Speaker 1: like three episodes in a row, and I honestly think
Speaker 1: it was because We both are fans of Best in Show,
Speaker 1: which is, you know, a really funny movie, and I
Speaker 1: just felt like I resonated with that. So we just
Speaker 1: sat there and laughed like it was our sense of humor.
Speaker 1: We loved watching people fall down. So it was like
Speaker 1: just everything came together. But why do you think though
Speaker 1: Holy Molly in Australia didn't resonate as much as it
Speaker 1: did in the US USA?
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean, I think it's always difficult to kind
Speaker 3: of quart a you know, Monday morning quarterback, why something
Speaker 3: did or didn't resonate.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 3: I think in the States it ran one night a week,
Speaker 3: sixty minutes, and it continues to kind of be a
Speaker 3: bit of a powerhouse there. I think potentially, in hindsight,
Speaker 3: running it multiple nights a week but not necessarily having
Speaker 3: the arc through the series might have hurt the show.
Speaker 3: So if the shows once a week, I think the
Speaker 3: audience kind of are happy with it being closed ended.
Speaker 3: If they're watching it night on night out, they're probably
Speaker 3: looking for more of that arc, more of the soap opera,
Speaker 3: like we were just discussing. So potentially that's one of
Speaker 3: the reasons I.
Speaker 5: Mean I started jumping over it I mean, seven didn't
Speaker 5: amazing job marketing it, and I think that brought a
Speaker 5: lot of eyeballs.
Speaker 4: Yeah, you know to the premiere of it, which was
Speaker 4: huge numbers.
Speaker 5: But I think to what Chris is saying and going
Speaker 5: back to what you mentioned about Best in Show, Like
Speaker 5: when we sat down with the American hosts, Rob Riggle
Speaker 5: and his Color to Go called Joe tessitour who calls
Speaker 5: NFL in the States, and we sat down and we
Speaker 5: were in a tent on the site, you know, dust
Speaker 5: blowing through and all the rest we did. It's kind
Speaker 5: of table read and that's what we discussed. We discussed exactly.
Speaker 4: You hit the name on. He Regle said, again, it's
Speaker 4: Best in Show. That's what we're gonna do. You know.
Speaker 4: So that was the plan, well well identified.
Speaker 5: But also you know, Best in Show is a comedy,
Speaker 5: you know, so effectively.
Speaker 4: Holy moly, it's a show about mini golf and wacky
Speaker 4: people and all the rest. Hit the channel.
Speaker 2: We could have a hole in one here, what.
Speaker 5: Do they get stuck in urinas and then the ball
Speaker 5: gets stuck on uranus here.
Speaker 4: I'm sorry, I'm sorry, No, I just didn't hear you
Speaker 4: say it again?
Speaker 2: Please, Joe, please, this is wholesome.
Speaker 5: It's a comedy show. So but potentially, you know, comedy
Speaker 5: stripped across multiple nights is hard, well, potentially a harder,
Speaker 5: harder thing to break through in a market whereas comedy
Speaker 5: often lives on one night a week. So that might
Speaker 5: have been a bit of it too, maybe, But I
Speaker 5: would say I'm so exxtremely proud of the Australian version.
Speaker 3: I think the production team did an incredible job. I
Speaker 3: think Seven were incredibly supportive and to this day it
Speaker 3: is one of the shows I'm most proud of as
Speaker 3: a finished product.
Speaker 4: I think it was world class.
Speaker 3: And you know, we obviously work with Disney on the
Speaker 3: Holy Molly format internationally, so every other market has seen
Speaker 3: that Australian version, and some like it more than the
Speaker 3: ABC version.
Speaker 4: I'll tell you that, like they were blown away.
Speaker 3: By what was achieved in Australia, and so I think
Speaker 3: it's testament to the Australian team and to Seven for
Speaker 3: what went out there. And you know, we would absolutely
Speaker 3: love to do it again because you know, it got
Speaker 3: off to a huge start and sort of started to
Speaker 3: lose momentum at the end, but it certainly was something
Speaker 3: that we think was a really high class product.
Speaker 1: Can you tell me if it's coming back? Are we're
Speaker 1: getting it next year a sequel?
Speaker 3: It's still very much in discussion with Channel seven and
Speaker 3: we have a holy Moly hub up in the Queensland
Speaker 3: which many international countries play to shoot on as soon
Speaker 3: as travel opens up, and that is part of the
Speaker 3: discussions with Channel seven as well. So Channel seven, you know,
Speaker 3: loved the show, as do we and it's you know,
Speaker 3: really just about finding the timing and frankly budget to
Speaker 3: make it all work.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 1: A lot was said about Australia's Denise Drysdale in her accident,
Speaker 1: but in the end it didn't really seem like much.
Speaker 2: Can you set the story straight on Ding Dong?
Speaker 4: Listen?
Speaker 3: Denise is fantastic and she's been She was was such
Speaker 3: a great sport on the night and it was really
Speaker 3: unfortunate what happened.
Speaker 4: I mean, honestly, I don't think there's there's much.
Speaker 3: To talk about because it was shown on the TV
Speaker 3: show in its entirety, so I guess it was really unfortunate.
Speaker 3: She's been such a great sport about it. We've been
Speaker 3: in contact since and she's she's obviously now recovered and
Speaker 3: doing very well.
Speaker 4: So I think she's just.
Speaker 5: Such an icon of Australian TV, like she's she's just
Speaker 5: part of, you know, the heritage, and I think that's
Speaker 5: that's why I got so much attention.
Speaker 4: She was like, oh you know what's happened to Yeah,
Speaker 4: she's a national treasure. It was she's been on stamp.
Speaker 1: She's on Australian stamp before people have licked the back
Speaker 1: of her.
Speaker 2: So I guess people get really.
Speaker 4: And Bradbury got to do a Bradbury so ironically.
Speaker 1: Yeah, at the moment, there's a mass shortage of good
Speaker 1: crew in Australia with so many shows being made. I mean,
Speaker 1: it's actually quite amazing that this is happening. Executive producers
Speaker 1: are struggling to find, you know, editors and production managers. Paul,
Speaker 1: you know, how are you coping with that?
Speaker 5: I think, you know, it's fairly it's fairly on only
Speaker 5: we post I mean post shows for the American market
Speaker 5: in America, but we post shows here as well for
Speaker 5: the US market, so we have a lot of post
Speaker 5: production going on, and so from a staffing point of view,
Speaker 5: it is a challenge. You'll hit periods where it's harder
Speaker 5: to get people on board. But really I think it's
Speaker 5: just timing. I think there's just little areas on the
Speaker 5: on the calendar of the year where there's a bit
Speaker 5: of a hot spot with productions going on. And part
Speaker 5: of the reason I think post production works for us
Speaker 5: in the Australian market is there's such a high caliber
Speaker 5: of producers and editors down here, especially in US. Even
Speaker 5: when I started Biggest Lose, it was a crackerjack. At
Speaker 5: the time, there was Big Brother and there wasn't that many.
Speaker 5: There was no stripped reality shows. I think Biggest Loser
Speaker 5: was one. And suddenly you know, you've got six nights
Speaker 5: a week and you've got a lot of people who
Speaker 5: hadn't worked in that kind of genre before, and they
Speaker 5: are different shows, be a Survivor or a Big Brother
Speaker 5: now whatever, but it is that same reality space. And
Speaker 5: so over the last fifteen years there's a whole generation
Speaker 5: of skilled people who have been coming through.
Speaker 4: And you're seeing it now. The people in the edits
Speaker 4: are getting younger.
Speaker 5: And younger who are behind the controls and they're brilliant
Speaker 5: and they're all match fit. Because the industry here is
Speaker 5: stripping reality shows and unscripted shows. Unscripted is much bigger
Speaker 5: here than scripted is for the amount of content that's
Speaker 5: being churned out.
Speaker 4: So there's a way even of.
Speaker 5: The generations I say in the production space, especially in
Speaker 5: post production, that are really match fit, brilliant at what
Speaker 5: they do. And it's easy to say that and then
Speaker 5: you know, Monday, I'll go, why are we going to
Speaker 5: start on something? But actually people are out there and
Speaker 5: it's just a timing thing. I know people complain about
Speaker 5: it and stuff, but I know, I just get really
Speaker 5: encouraged went I see the people coming through who were
Speaker 5: an assist or a runner and something.
Speaker 4: They're sitting in the editew, I know your face.
Speaker 5: It's like you worked for your teen years ago in
Speaker 5: your coffee and now making shows.
Speaker 1: That's it's enticing, you know, young people to come into
Speaker 1: this industry, which is an amazing industry. You know, like
Speaker 1: if publication was to come out and say something from
Speaker 1: the two of you about resourcing talent and enticing people
Speaker 1: in this industry, is there a message that you could
Speaker 1: say to them.
Speaker 3: I can tell you something that we hold close to
Speaker 3: our heart at Eureka, and that is that we genuinely
Speaker 3: believe that Australia has some of the best creatives in
Speaker 3: the world, the hands down, and part of what we
Speaker 3: set up here at Eureka is we want to take
Speaker 3: those incredible creatives in Australia and showcase them for the world.
Speaker 3: And so what I'm getting at is like Australians can
Speaker 3: absolutely play it a world class level. And what I
Speaker 3: would say to young people out there is, please, you know,
Speaker 3: this is a really rewarding, really creative hard Yes, but
Speaker 3: I think really satisfying job and career. It's not just
Speaker 3: about you know, showing your best to the country that
Speaker 3: you live in, but also potentially showcasing your skills to
Speaker 3: the world as well. And that's something you know, I'm
Speaker 3: really proud of. Like, Holy Moly, America is one of
Speaker 3: you know, the most watched on scripted shows in the
Speaker 3: country that's edited by people in Saint Leonard's and that,
Speaker 3: and you know, I think that's really significant and something
Speaker 3: that I'm really really proud of.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I was talking to Jamie Wiggins the other day and
Speaker 1: he was, you know, they think about him. He's an
Speaker 1: editor who was editing the American Holy Moly. You know,
Speaker 1: that's amazing that that content's being captured overseas and sent
Speaker 1: home here to Australia to create jobs for young people
Speaker 1: who are passionate about what they do. I just think
Speaker 1: that's something really important.
Speaker 3: Well, and not only that they've knocked it out of
Speaker 3: the park, you know what I mean, Like, not only
Speaker 3: have they got the opportunity but created something that's a
Speaker 3: phenomenon over there like that, and that's down to them.
Speaker 5: And it's a significant one for us too, because when
Speaker 5: we went with season one being edited in Australia, you know,
Speaker 5: there was ABC were a bit okay, you know, this
Speaker 5: is ABC America and what We're going.
Speaker 4: To edit a show in Saint Lanta's and Sydney. What's
Speaker 4: all that about?
Speaker 5: So there was that they were a bit anxious to
Speaker 5: begin with, but when they saw the results, they were
Speaker 5: blown away.
Speaker 4: And actually the industry over there people comment on.
Speaker 5: The editing of Holy Moley and they don't even know
Speaker 5: it's edited in Australia, but you know, you get accolades
Speaker 5: for how it's a heavily edited show.
Speaker 4: You know, it pops all over the place.
Speaker 5: And that that's part of the reason why I think
Speaker 5: we've we've it's been a big part of why we
Speaker 5: aid any more shows down here, because it's like, wow,
Speaker 5: they can cut that kind of stuff in Sydney. My god, Yeah, okay,
Speaker 5: we don't mind if you cut it down there kind
Speaker 5: of thing. So we have been able to do more
Speaker 5: more shows down here. But I think I think back
Speaker 5: to I used to do the Biggest Loser conferences and
Speaker 5: Mass Chief conferences and where they bring all the different
Speaker 5: formats together and as Ossie would be really arrogant.
Speaker 4: Like, well, we've got the best version. You know, there's
Speaker 4: none of this US has got the best version or
Speaker 4: anything like that, and you do.
Speaker 5: You know, and I think Ozzie have you know, we
Speaker 5: are competitive and for many years other always had thought.
Speaker 5: You know, even if it's a format from overseas, you know,
Speaker 5: it's like here's the American version.
Speaker 4: Okay, they've got a bigger budget. Okay, we're going to
Speaker 4: make a better version of it.
Speaker 5: You've got to go into it with that mentality, you know,
Speaker 5: you've got to shoot for the stars and at the
Speaker 5: very least you'll hit them, like you just got to
Speaker 5: go for it. If you say that to people, I go, yep, okay,
Speaker 5: we're going to make a better version than that. I
Speaker 5: don't know if we can or not. But if I
Speaker 5: say it, they might believe it and they might work,
Speaker 5: you know.
Speaker 1: So I think it is good to be competitive though.
Speaker 1: I think competition in any industry is good.
Speaker 4: And then you don't know where you're going to end
Speaker 4: up in it.
Speaker 5: I remember at one point I just I was just
Speaker 5: obsessed with becoming a music video director.
Speaker 4: I never have been and I never have done.
Speaker 5: But at least I got in and went, okay, I
Speaker 5: want to I'm heading towards something. And I guess to
Speaker 5: anyone who's trying to get into the business, just get
Speaker 5: in there and apply yourself, you know, chase your dreams
Speaker 5: and have goals, but just say yes to whatever you know.
Speaker 4: Do you want to come and do this?
Speaker 3: Okay?
Speaker 5: Just try different things, experience different things, and then you're
Speaker 5: your course correct.
Speaker 4: You'll make the right decisions for yourself.
Speaker 5: If you've got a positive attitude, you know, and the
Speaker 5: right work ethic, you can do whatever you want in
Speaker 5: this business. You can pivot and go into a different
Speaker 5: you can go from being the production side of things.
Speaker 5: You see it and people go, I want to be
Speaker 5: a producer, and sometimes they try producing.
Speaker 4: Having been on the production management side of things, and
Speaker 4: they go, oh my god, this is horrible. I'm going
Speaker 4: to make to it, you know.
Speaker 5: But it provides those kinds of opportunities. There's no degree
Speaker 5: that you get that says, right, this is what you're
Speaker 5: qualified to do, and that's it.
Speaker 4: I think that's part of the excitement of the industry. Really,
Speaker 4: you're real. There's so many avenues that you can go down,
Speaker 4: and it's kind of hodly.
Speaker 1: It's on you how much of what people say on
Speaker 1: social media reflect what audiences are truly thinking. Because I
Speaker 1: can imagine being in your industry where you know, it's
Speaker 1: commentated on by the general public and TV commentators and
Speaker 1: things like that. But quite often the comments that people
Speaker 1: make on social media doesn't necessarily reflect the wider opinion
Speaker 1: about something. So do you shut yourselves off from that?
Speaker 4: Listen?
Speaker 3: I think you have to be aware of social media,
Speaker 3: but I think you can't live and die by it either,
Speaker 3: because I think it's fair to say that a lot
Speaker 3: of social media tends to be negative. Very rarely do
Speaker 3: people go on Twitter and go, I really love this show.
Speaker 3: It's fantastic, it's perfect. In fact, I think the opposite
Speaker 3: is true. So I think you listen, you have to
Speaker 3: be responsive to what the audience is telling you back.
Speaker 4: But I think you touched on the point. Is some you.
Speaker 3: Know, some people on social media reflective of the true audience.
Speaker 3: I don't think it necessarily is. And you know, you
Speaker 3: kind of raise the point earlier about Maths as an example,
Speaker 3: where a lot of people are anti and a lot
Speaker 3: of people like I would never watch it, but you
Speaker 3: look at those overnight numbers and they're pretty significant. So
Speaker 3: I think it's a balance. I think it's fair to
Speaker 3: say when people are loving our shows on social media,
Speaker 3: I'll relish in it and reread it. When they're not
Speaker 3: so favorable, I think it's.
Speaker 4: Probably not so warranted.
Speaker 3: So I think you have to kind of really believe
Speaker 3: in the show that you're making, really believe in the
Speaker 3: show that the broadcaster commissioned, and just make the best
Speaker 3: version of it.
Speaker 4: And that's all you can do.
Speaker 1: Stay true to yourself, I think, and stay true to
Speaker 1: the original idea. I think my last question that I
Speaker 1: ask everybody is interesting because I normally ask this to
Speaker 1: one person, but kind of put this together. Is there
Speaker 1: a funny story from behind the scenes of the two
Speaker 1: of you working together, something funny that happened behind the
Speaker 1: scenes of making television that stays in your mind that
Speaker 1: you tell people as like a funny anecdote.
Speaker 3: There was one moment, and it was Paul and I
Speaker 3: together where we were actually screen testing Mark Burris for
Speaker 3: The Apprentice. We knew he had the goods, but we
Speaker 3: wanted to get it on tape to prove that, you know,
Speaker 3: he could command the boardroom and he had the sort
Speaker 3: of the presence of that boss.
Speaker 4: So we had him, you know, at this boardroom set.
Speaker 3: We had all these kind of cast members who were
Speaker 3: playing the roles, and he was, you know, really articulating
Speaker 3: all things you loved and things you didn't like.
Speaker 4: And then literally we hear this bang.
Speaker 3: Behind him and we're on this like I would say,
Speaker 3: forty story building and then you hear you hear a
Speaker 3: bang behind him in shot and then you hear it.
Speaker 4: And there's a window wash out literally in shot behind
Speaker 4: him like squeezing.
Speaker 5: On such capsules, yeah, on some suction cap ones on
Speaker 5: his knees, in his hands.
Speaker 4: And the thing was Boris didn't break. So there, right,
Speaker 4: this is his test audition. He's ripped into people in
Speaker 4: the room. This guy is just going behind him like
Speaker 4: Spider Man just with this.
Speaker 1: And like you, I mean, they didn't turn around and
Speaker 1: go you're fired.
Speaker 3: But yeah, so, I mean that's an amusing story. And
Speaker 3: I listen, I think you know, being on the set
Speaker 3: of Holy Moly is just amusing into itself. I mean,
Speaker 3: I remember the first time we stepped onto the set
Speaker 3: in the US.
Speaker 4: It's like this theme.
Speaker 3: Park and you have Holy Moly testers. So you have
Speaker 3: these like brave individual souls who throw themselves into windmills
Speaker 3: and throw themselves off poles.
Speaker 4: Because they love minigolf.
Speaker 3: I still don't actually know why, but like just being
Speaker 3: a part of those worlds and seeing those super funny
Speaker 3: and super fun.
Speaker 5: Like it's a pretty weird job, isn't it. One minute
Speaker 5: fashion show? It makes you beating people up with windmills.
Speaker 1: Well, I just want to say to the two of you,
Speaker 1: you're both doing such an amazing job. I think it's
Speaker 1: so impressive to be able to see original ideas coming out,
Speaker 1: and I think that's something that the two of you
Speaker 1: can hang your hat on, is bringing original ideas and
Speaker 1: original content and making them exciting for television. So congratulations
Speaker 1: with that, and I just want to say thank you
Speaker 1: so much for taking part it's heavy reload and being
Speaker 1: able to share some of these stories.
Speaker 3: No, thank you, and then you know, I think it's
Speaker 3: great what you're doing, you know, interviewing people in the business,
Speaker 3: and and so thank you.
Speaker 4: It's been a pleasure. Thanks Ben, it's been fun.