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Speaker 1: It's the Happy Families podcast. It's the podcast for.

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Speaker 2: The time poor parent who just wants answers.

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Speaker 1: Now, this is my life lesson from twenty five years

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Speaker 1: of marriage. Farts a gross You don't have to see

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Speaker 1: and hear everything that your partner's doing.

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Speaker 2: And now here's the scars of our show my mum

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Speaker 2: and dad.

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Speaker 1: Hello, this is doctor Justin Colson, the founder of Happy

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Speaker 1: Families dot com dot you. We really hope that you

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Speaker 1: enjoyed yesterday's episode of The Happy Family's podcast. Kylie and

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Speaker 1: I were sharing twenty five life lessons about marriage because

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Speaker 1: we're celebrating our twenty fifth wedding anniversary this week. It

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Speaker 1: was actually yesterday that we had twenty five years of

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Speaker 1: life literally betrothed, not betrothed, wedded, lawfully and legally wedded,

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Speaker 1: and whatever else you want to call. We got married

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Speaker 1: in the late nineteen It was nineteen ninety eight. Nineteen

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Speaker 1: ninety eight, which.

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Speaker 2: Doesn't like a lifetime ago.

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Speaker 1: It doesn't seem that long ago. I feel like we're

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Speaker 1: going to be married a couple of years. Kylie shared

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Speaker 1: what was supposed to be twelve was to be twelve

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Speaker 1: lessons that she's learned about marriage, marriage specifically because of me.

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Speaker 2: Don't keep count is my number twelve?

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Speaker 1: Oh wow? Okay, well that ties in with one of

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Speaker 1: the ones that I'm going to share it short as well.

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Speaker 1: Kylie missed one, so we needed one extra. Don't keep score?

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Speaker 1: Is that what you're saying, I don't keep count? Okay, well,

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Speaker 1: now it's my turn. So well, I.

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Speaker 2: Am so excited to hear what I've taught.

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Speaker 1: You, now, what we've learned together. Okay, this is what

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Speaker 1: we've learned together. I want to be really careful because

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Speaker 1: the first one, the first one is going to sound

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Speaker 1: really bad if it's about what you've taught me. So

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Speaker 1: it's what we've learned together. My first of I'm going

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Speaker 1: to go with thirteen because twelve from you plus thirteen

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Speaker 1: from me takes us to the twenty five. My first

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Speaker 1: of thirteen is it's not brilliant all the time.

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Speaker 2: It's time.

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Speaker 1: In fact, sometimes sometimes it feels like you are being

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Speaker 1: dragged through the very cols of hell with flaming bamboo

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Speaker 1: shoots stuck under your fingernails and somebody ripping out your

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Speaker 1: teeth with their I don't know, with a paraply or something.

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Speaker 1: It's just okay. Sometimes it's really hard. Sometimes it's and

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Speaker 1: that's often, in fact, often kindlie, the hardest times in

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Speaker 1: our marriage have not actually been because of you, but

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Speaker 1: because of me, at least for me. Does that make sense.

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Speaker 1: I remember our very first conflict. We had been married.

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Speaker 1: I reckon for about nine months before we ever had

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Speaker 1: any kind of conflict, and we had our first blow

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Speaker 1: up about nine months in, and I just couldn't believe it.

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Speaker 1: I thought, Oh my goodness, this is it, this is

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Speaker 1: what happens, this is the beginning of the end. It's

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Speaker 1: all over. But that conflict, I still remember the fight

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Speaker 1: that we were having ended up turning into a I

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Speaker 1: guess I turned it into a pity party about how

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Speaker 1: pathetic I was because I felt so bad that we

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Speaker 1: were having this fight, and I just knew that it

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Speaker 1: was because of my inability to regulate and be selfless

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Speaker 1: and all that kind of thing. But it's it's not

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Speaker 1: always perfect. In fact, sometimes it's really hard, really horrible.

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Speaker 2: You know, Over the years we have we've had some

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Speaker 2: really really hard times. But no matter how hard it gets,

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Speaker 2: the thing that I keep coming back to is that

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Speaker 2: if I have to do hard, there's no one else

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Speaker 2: I'd rather do hard.

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Speaker 1: With You're the best. Seriously, I appreciate that so much.

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Speaker 1: It's number two, we're not the same people. We're not

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Speaker 1: the same people, and sometimes we actually marry somebody and

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Speaker 1: we try to turn them into who we are, or

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Speaker 1: we try to get them to want to be the

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Speaker 1: same as us, to have our values, to share our

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Speaker 1: interests and likes, to I don't know, to be us.

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Speaker 1: And something that I have just loved about being married

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Speaker 1: to you is You've let me be me, and you've

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Speaker 1: also been completely satisfied in who you are as a person.

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Speaker 1: As much as you've grown and developed and become so

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Speaker 1: much better, you've been satisfied in your identity, your sense

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Speaker 1: of self, and you've been okay to be you. And

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Speaker 1: I feel like we've allowed one another to be to

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Speaker 1: be ourselves. Does that make sense?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, totally. For me, I see it a little bit differently.

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Speaker 2: I think that while there has been a part of

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Speaker 2: me that has been really happy to be me, there's

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Speaker 2: also been another part of me that's tried to keep

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Speaker 2: up with you for so long. And it's only been

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Speaker 2: in the last couple of years that I've actually recognized

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Speaker 2: that you need me to actually do the slow pace.

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Speaker 1: It's not good when we're both a bit like me. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: because I'm a lite.

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Speaker 2: It it's taken me all these years to work that out.

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Speaker 2: I thought my job was to actually keep up with you.

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Speaker 2: My job is not actually to keep up with you.

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Speaker 2: It's actually to slow you down so that you can

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Speaker 2: have the downtime that you actually need. And as you're

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Speaker 2: getting older, you're needing that more and more.

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Speaker 1: I mean, as I'm getting older. This is supposed to

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Speaker 1: be a love fest. We're supposed to be talking about

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Speaker 1: what we love about each other, and you're telling me

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Speaker 1: that I'm getting older. I mean, next thing, you're going

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Speaker 1: to point out my wrinkles or something.

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Speaker 2: What's number three?

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Speaker 1: Okay? So a third one, really simple one. The big

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Speaker 1: values matter. So as much as we can be individuals

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Speaker 1: and live our lives the way that it sort of

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Speaker 1: suits us, there are some things that really do matter

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Speaker 1: a lot. And over the last twenty five years, what

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Speaker 1: I've discovered is if we can maintain harmony and be

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Speaker 1: together on those big things, the other stuff doesn't need

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Speaker 1: to matter as much. And so we've done I think

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Speaker 1: a reasonably good job of getting clear on the biggest

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Speaker 1: things that matter and being pretty relaxed about the other stuff.

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Speaker 2: One of the things that I love from the memory

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Speaker 2: box is when we first met, you were just incessant

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Speaker 2: with your questions. We used to call them hypotheticals, and

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Speaker 2: you we'd sit in the car and you would just

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Speaker 2: throw all of these hypothetical situations. Then I'm a curious

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Speaker 2: guy at me as an eighteen year old kid, and

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Speaker 2: you'd want to know what I thought was going to

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Speaker 2: happen if we had three kids and one of them

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Speaker 2: decided to leave home at fifteen, or they decided they

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Speaker 2: were going to do drugs or whatever it was. There

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Speaker 2: was just there was these conversations that we had around

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Speaker 2: what life would look like and what it could look

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Speaker 2: like and how would I respond, And obviously, without having

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Speaker 2: experienced any of those things, I had no idea. But

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Speaker 2: through the process of sharing what your thoughts were and

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Speaker 2: what my thoughts were, we came to understand what our

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Speaker 2: big rocks were, what our value systems were in relation

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Speaker 2: to those things. And so when we got married, there

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Speaker 2: were a lot of surprises along the way, and there

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Speaker 2: was a lot of hard like we've already said yesterday,

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Speaker 2: but we already knew where we stood with them. And

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Speaker 2: while some of our ideals have changed, our values have

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Speaker 2: changed over time, what has been most important is that

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Speaker 2: we've actually been able to change together.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, we've remained aligned on the biggest things, the things

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Speaker 1: that matter the most.

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Speaker 2: Was that number three or number four.

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Speaker 1: Number four is coming, and this is my life lesson

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Speaker 1: from twenty five years of marriage. Farts are gross. You

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Speaker 1: don't have to see and hear everything that your partner

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Speaker 1: is doing. I'm a really big believer in bathroom doors.

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Speaker 1: I'm just put it out there. That's number four. We

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Speaker 1: don't need to talk any more about things.

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Speaker 2: Doesn't matter if there's a door in my honey, I

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Speaker 2: don't say this like that.

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Speaker 1: We don't need to say anything else about that one.

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Speaker 1: It's just a life lesson. We don't need to explore it.

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Speaker 1: We don't need to dive any deeper. We're just going

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Speaker 1: to move to the next one. Okay. Going to bed

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Speaker 1: mad is okay. So there's that marriage advice that you

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Speaker 1: get that you should never go to bed on an argument,

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Speaker 1: and over the years, I think we've proven that that's

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Speaker 1: really bad advice. Try to stay up to resolve things,

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Speaker 1: but because we're exhausted, it actually just gets worse right

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Speaker 1: an emotional state my intelligence, low emotions low. I can't

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Speaker 1: even say it right now. High emotion is low intelligence.

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Speaker 1: You're throw in a bit of tiredness, but a hunger,

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Speaker 1: bit of stress and overwhelm. Nine times are horrible like that.

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Speaker 1: Sometimes it's been better for us to just look at

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Speaker 1: each other and say, not doing well, love you like crazy.

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Speaker 1: Let's wait until tomorrow before we talk about this.

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Speaker 2: I can add on from that. And it's something that

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Speaker 2: you've been really really good at over the years, is

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Speaker 2: that each new day is a fresh start.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. I love fresh starts.

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Speaker 2: You don't hold on to things. That's not a strong

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Speaker 2: point of mind at all. But you have always woken

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Speaker 2: up with just unconditional love, ready to start a new day,

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Speaker 2: and more times than not, that's been able to pull

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Speaker 2: me out of whatever funk I'm in.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. I'm really big on repair, really big on speedy,

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Speaker 1: speedy repair, and just not hanging on to stuff. Like seriously,

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Speaker 1: I said I was marrying you literally to the end

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Speaker 1: of time, and it turned it in forever and ever

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Speaker 1: and ever. And there's nothing for us to gain by

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Speaker 1: maintaining any kind of rage towards one another. There's nothing

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Speaker 1: to be gained by being ongoing.

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Speaker 2: With frustrate that rage.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I know, So what we go up to number six?

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Speaker 1: What have you got for me? Okay? Number six is

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Speaker 1: that we need to balance our mutual loves with personal interests.

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Speaker 1: I love the fact that you I mean, it drives

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Speaker 1: me up the wall. I really wish that you would

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Speaker 1: sit on the beach and watch me surf at least once.

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Speaker 1: But you're not interested in sitting on the beach and

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Speaker 1: watching some guy surf Like.

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Speaker 2: Well, because usually I'm looking at the wrong guy.

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Speaker 1: I kep saying I'm the guy out there on the

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Speaker 1: white surfboard with the black board shorts. And it was

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Speaker 1: like every guy in the water is on a white

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Speaker 1: surfboard with black board shorts.

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Speaker 2: But once upon a time you actually brought a red surfboard,

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Speaker 2: which happens to be my favorite colors, just to help me.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, but you still never watch me surf, even on

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Speaker 1: that board. No. But over the years, I mean, you've

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Speaker 1: got all these things that you love and you're crazy about,

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Speaker 1: and you haven't sacrificed them because I'm not into them.

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Speaker 1: You've just kept on doing them. And same with me.

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Speaker 1: I've got those things that I love to do. You

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Speaker 1: have no interest in them whatsoever, But we don't resent

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Speaker 1: one another for them. We just find time for them.

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Speaker 1: We do them where it works, and it actually rounds

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Speaker 1: us out. It makes us whole, and it gives us.

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Speaker 1: It gives us a break some time away. It helps

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Speaker 1: us to come back and replenish and rejuvenate. But it

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Speaker 1: also gives us relationships outside of our marriage, which is

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Speaker 1: so important to take the pressure off one another as

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Speaker 1: being the one and only supportive person in each other's

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Speaker 1: lives to get through it all. I just think we

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Speaker 1: need to make sure that we that we have personal

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Speaker 1: interests and we explore them and enjoy them, and that's

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Speaker 1: balance with the stuff that we love to do together,

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Speaker 1: because there are also things that you and I just

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Speaker 1: cherish together.

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Speaker 2: I guess there's an add on to that is that

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Speaker 2: while we've had our own interests, we've always been considerate

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Speaker 2: with the other's needs and the timing of things. And

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Speaker 2: it's meant that we've had to be flexible with the

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Speaker 2: time of day and how many times a week we

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Speaker 2: get to do the.

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Speaker 1: Things that we like. That there are times where I've

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Speaker 1: given up writing completely, Like now, for example, I'm just

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Speaker 1: not writing because it doesn't suit and you've got priorities

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Speaker 1: that I've got to balance what's important to both of

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Speaker 1: us with what's important to me, and I'm happy to

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Speaker 1: do it because I'm crazy about you and I think

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Speaker 1: that it's worth sacrificing the cycling.

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Speaker 2: Thanks, honey. Okay, what's number seven?

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Speaker 1: Always? Always, always, always order extra red roles when you

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Speaker 1: sit down in a restaurant for dinner, because guarantee, miss Happy,

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Speaker 1: you're sitting next to me is going to steal in

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Speaker 1: red role. It just happened every single time. Number are never, ever, ever,

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Speaker 1: ever measure contribution. Fifty to fifty doesn't cut it, like, well.

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Speaker 2: It doesn't exist right if you're going to do somethings.

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Speaker 2: So growing up, I was always taught if you're going

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Speaker 2: to do something, to it right, yeah the first time?

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Speaker 2: And how is fifty percent?

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Speaker 1: Ever?

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Speaker 2: So, depending on the stages and seasons of life, there

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Speaker 2: are times where my one hundred percent has looked like

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Speaker 2: twenty percent, sure, because I don't have the capacity that

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Speaker 2: my full capacity range that I would normally have. But

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Speaker 2: it's still my one hundred percent. It's what I have

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Speaker 2: right now to give. But for me to just sit

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Speaker 2: back and kind of look at what needs to be

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Speaker 2: done and go, you know what, I'm just going to

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Speaker 2: give you half of me today.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. It kind of tilles you with that idea. It's

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Speaker 1: not my job. Yeah, and that's something that there are

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Speaker 1: a halful of things that you do far better than me,

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Speaker 1: and I really appreciate it when you do them, and

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Speaker 1: I do my best to not do them because when

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Speaker 1: I do them, we end up with a substandard outcome.

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Speaker 1: Like if I'm going to cook dinner, it's only a

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Speaker 1: couple of meals that we really trust me to cook.

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Speaker 1: I just don't do them very well. But if I've

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Speaker 1: got to, I will get in there and I'll do it.

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Speaker 1: You went away recently, had that time at the health retreat.

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Speaker 1: I looked after meals for a week and the kids

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Speaker 1: didn't start. They were okay, we were fine. I mean

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Speaker 1: the kids cooked a couple of meals as well to

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Speaker 1: get us through, but we were fine. But in terms

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Speaker 1: of efficiency and in terms of the overall enjoyment that

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Speaker 1: everyone gets when you do it, it just works better when

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Speaker 1: you do that. Likewise, you can go and earn some

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Speaker 1: money for our family, but I'm more effective as a

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Speaker 1: breadwinner because of the way that our lives have played out,

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Speaker 1: and we don't look at each other and go, well,

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Speaker 1: I'm the one that earns the money, so you're the

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Speaker 1: one who has to do that. It's just we do

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Speaker 1: what we need to do.

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Speaker 2: But that's part of being our team. Yeah, right, So

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Speaker 2: not everyone's the shooter.

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Speaker 1: Right right. Yeah, you've got guards and you've got points,

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Speaker 1: and you've got wings and whatever else. Yeah, and everyone's

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Speaker 1: got their role. But you can always sub in. You

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Speaker 1: can always cover for someone if they're out of position.

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Speaker 1: You can always help out. And I guess it's not

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Speaker 1: my job. Fifty to fifty doesn't cut it. Never ever,

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Speaker 1: ever measure contribution number ten. No, we're up to number nine.

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Speaker 1: Number nine, you rush me through. So number nine. Based

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Speaker 1: on our conversation yesterday, this will not come as a

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Speaker 1: surprise to you that I'm going to say that prioritizing

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Speaker 1: intimacy needs to be a really big like, it really

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Speaker 1: matters relationships that are devoid of intimacy. I think what

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Speaker 1: they can be improved with that when we prioritize it

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Speaker 1: and make sure that we've got a little bit of

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Speaker 1: closed your ears kids sexy time. So I just think

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Speaker 1: I'm putting them in. It's number nine. We don't have

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Speaker 1: to go any deeper. If you don't want to, let's

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Speaker 1: just move on to number ten, unless you you don't

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Speaker 1: want to ask anything. Okay, Confirmation bias can be really strong.

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Speaker 1: That's how we are as humans. Where wired to notice

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Speaker 1: things that conform to what we already believe. That's confirmation bias.

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Speaker 1: So let's talk about politics for a second. If I've

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Speaker 1: got really strong political views to either the right or

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Speaker 1: the left of center, whenever anything happens it's.

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Speaker 2: In the news, sound very romantic.

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Speaker 1: I'll find a way to make sure that it confirms

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Speaker 1: my already pre existing political beliefs. And it's the same

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Speaker 1: with our relationships. If I believe that you really are

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Speaker 1: everything that I think that you are just literally the

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Speaker 1: most incredible, impeccable choice of a wife that I could

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Speaker 1: have possibly made. If I believe that and I do,

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Speaker 1: that means that what I'm going to do is I'm

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Speaker 1: going to find ways to confirm that, not intentionally but subconsciously.

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Speaker 1: Everything you do is going to be a subconscious confirmation

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Speaker 1: to me that my bias was correct. And if you

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Speaker 1: do things that go against that confirmation, bias. I'm usually

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Speaker 1: going to become dismissive and say, oh, it was a

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Speaker 1: one off. That's not who Kylie usually is. That was

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Speaker 1: an unusual circumstance. Confirmation bias is strong, and we need

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Speaker 1: to make sure we use it to our advantage because

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Speaker 1: I've used the positive example of that, but can also

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Speaker 1: spin around the other way. It can become quite negative.

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Speaker 1: And if you've got this bias in your mind that

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Speaker 1: your partner's always a pain, they're always late, they're always tardy,

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Speaker 1: they're always lazy, they're this, they're that, then you will

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Speaker 1: start to notice those things as well.

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Speaker 2: Just like yesterday, my last point was just about perspective

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Speaker 2: and how it's if we wrote the list of things

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Speaker 2: we fell in love with and then we actually married

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Speaker 2: it up with the things that drive us crazy, we'll

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Speaker 2: probably find that those lists were very similar.

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Speaker 1: You loved my energy, I loved your energy, enthusiast my curiosity.

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Speaker 2: I loved your curiosity, and yet it just drives me

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Speaker 2: insane so many times. And if I don't remind myself

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Speaker 2: that they are the very things that drew me to you, yeah,

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Speaker 2: they will literally drive me over the years.

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Speaker 1: So that's a combination of both reframing and confirmation bias.

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Speaker 1: You're getting that bias confirmed, and now you've got to

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Speaker 1: remember that was a good thing, not a bad thing.

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Speaker 1: That's right, all right? Or eleven on my list is

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Speaker 1: that no issue should ever be allowed to be bigger

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Speaker 1: than the love that we share. Now, we covered that

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Speaker 1: yesterday because it was similar to something that you said,

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Speaker 1: so I don't think that we need to emphasize that

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Speaker 1: any further today other than to say that I remember

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Speaker 1: saying literally to you one day when we were in

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Speaker 1: the middle of a heated argument and we weren't making

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Speaker 1: progress because you were stonewalling and you didn't want to

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Speaker 1: give me anything, and I just said along the lines

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Speaker 1: of that, I said, clog, no matter what this issue

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Speaker 1: is that's upsetting you, it doesn't matter in comparison to

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Speaker 1: how I feel about you. My love for you is

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Speaker 1: always going to be far bigger than whatever this issue is,

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Speaker 1: which means we can talk about this issue and it

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Speaker 1: can't possibly affect how I feel about you. And I

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Speaker 1: feel like that's been something that has really what's the

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Speaker 1: word anchored our relationship. I feel like it's something that's

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Speaker 1: really held us strong. When if we go back to

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Speaker 1: Number one, it's not brilliant all the time.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I think that there's been a lot of baggage

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Speaker 2: that I've brought into the relationship and having not felt

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Speaker 2: like I've experienced unconditional love until you. I've waited so

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Speaker 2: many times for you to just kind of say this

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Speaker 2: too much, and yet you've proven time and time again

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Speaker 2: that they're just there. Literally is nothing that's bigger than

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Speaker 2: the love that you have for me.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, there is nothing that is too much. Number twelve Okay,

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Speaker 1: I've got two to go. Number twelve is never add

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Speaker 1: to your spouse's struggle. I'm saying never add to your

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Speaker 1: spouse's struggle because every now and again we do and

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Speaker 1: say things that are not helpful. And if you're in

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Speaker 1: a conflict, if you're having a hard time, if your

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Speaker 1: marriage or relationships a bit rocky, that means that your

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Speaker 1: spouse or partner is almost certainly struggling. The last thing

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Speaker 1: they need is for you to make it harder. So

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Speaker 1: that's why that's my number twelve. My thirteenth and final

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Speaker 1: idea lesson from twenty five years of marriage is that

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Speaker 1: you need to marry the person that you love being

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Speaker 1: with more than anyone else, and then you've got to

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Speaker 1: work super hard to keep it that way and missus

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Speaker 1: Happy Families. There is no one, not a single person

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Speaker 1: on the entire planet that I love being with more

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Speaker 1: than you, and I'm going to keep on working to

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Speaker 1: keep it that way. Happy anniversary, Thanks my honey. The

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Speaker 1: Happy Families Podcasts is produced by Justin Roland from Bridge Media.

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Speaker 1: Craig brus is our executive producer. We hope that you

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Speaker 1: haven't minded the last two days of a little bit

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Speaker 1: of personal indulgence as we've reflected on what makes marriages work,

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Speaker 1: or at least what has made ours work, and the

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Speaker 1: lessons that we've learned from it. Thank you so much

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Speaker 1: for listening. We'd love to know what you think makes

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Speaker 1: your marriage your partnership strong. You can email us podcasts

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Speaker 1: at Happy families dot com dot au and for more

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Speaker 1: information about making your family happier for you to join

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Speaker 1: us at our Happy Families memberships. You can find all

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Speaker 1: the information about the monthly ongoing calm credible support that

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Speaker 1: we give at Happy families dot com dot aun.

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Speaker 2: Oh Always Lucky