WEBVTT - PART 3 - Micro Aggression with Matt Okine - LIVE SHOW BONUS 0:00:00.880 --> 0:00:05.280 Life Uncut podcast acknowledges the traditional custodians of country throughout 0:00:05.320 --> 0:00:09.120 Australia and their connections to land, sea and community. We 0:00:09.160 --> 0:00:11.920 pay our respect to their elders past and present and 0:00:12.039 --> 0:00:15.280 extend that respect to all Aboriginal and Torres Strait Island 0:00:15.360 --> 0:00:16.120 peoples today. 0:00:16.320 --> 0:00:19.599 This episode is recorded on Gadiger Land of the Aurora Nation. 0:00:39.000 --> 0:00:41.880 Hey guys, welcome back to another episode of A Life Uncut. 0:00:41.960 --> 0:00:45.040 I'm Brittain and I'm Laura and this is a. 0:00:45.080 --> 0:00:48.680 Little packaged up bonus episode from you. We are putting 0:00:48.680 --> 0:00:51.159 all these little pieces together from the live show with 0:00:51.200 --> 0:00:53.280 all of our guests. So this is part three, so 0:00:53.440 --> 0:00:56.360 obviously done Part one and two. Part three is Matt o'kine. Now, 0:00:56.400 --> 0:01:00.320 Mattokine is one of those amazing, super annoying people that 0:01:00.360 --> 0:01:04.679 can do everything. He's an award winning comedian, he's an actor, 0:01:04.920 --> 0:01:08.280 he does radio, he has podcasts. He literally is someone 0:01:08.319 --> 0:01:09.880 that he's just like, you're like, what can't you do? 0:01:10.120 --> 0:01:12.680 He was an incredible chat so I hope you guys 0:01:12.800 --> 0:01:15.319 enjoyed listening to him as much as we enjoyed having 0:01:15.360 --> 0:01:18.560 him on the show. Welcome to the stage please everyone. 0:01:18.600 --> 0:01:20.920 I'd big loud welcome Matt o'kine. 0:01:26.959 --> 0:01:31.640 Hey, why do you immediately look so much cooler thout us? 0:01:33.760 --> 0:01:39.039 I feel very underdressed. I changed my shoelaces. That gave 0:01:39.160 --> 0:01:42.000 my shoes a whole new sprits, you know what I mean. 0:01:42.200 --> 0:01:43.360 I did say to Matt, I was like, do you 0:01:43.400 --> 0:01:45.319 reckon you could be here at five forty five today, 0:01:45.360 --> 0:01:47.119 And he was like, nah, I've got daycare drop off? 0:01:47.160 --> 0:01:49.560 Sorry, pick up pick up, daycare pickup. 0:01:49.680 --> 0:01:53.040 And then my daughter wasn't She was eating spaghetti and 0:01:53.680 --> 0:01:56.760 thank you so much, and she was not picking up 0:01:56.760 --> 0:01:59.640 the spaghetti rite with her fork, and there was so 0:01:59.760 --> 0:02:03.360 many tears, like it was just and I'm twisting the 0:02:03.400 --> 0:02:04.720 fool I'm going, is it is this? 0:02:04.840 --> 0:02:05.640 It is this? 0:02:05.800 --> 0:02:09.120 It is just like it's not it's getting it away. 0:02:10.200 --> 0:02:12.600 Oh but anyway, we're here, Matt. 0:02:12.680 --> 0:02:15.200 We start all of our podcast interviews with our new 0:02:15.240 --> 0:02:19.160 guests by asking them their most embarrassing story. We like 0:02:19.200 --> 0:02:21.440 to really start lows, then we can build you back up. 0:02:21.840 --> 0:02:25.000 What is the most embarrassing thing that's ever happened to you? 0:02:25.560 --> 0:02:30.800 Do you know? In two the year basically I sucked 0:02:30.800 --> 0:02:34.639 my own dick. We've all been there. 0:02:36.080 --> 0:02:38.000 Yeah, so I know that was one of those things 0:02:38.040 --> 0:02:40.720 I never thought that I would ever tell anyone else. 0:02:40.560 --> 0:02:44.400 But or it was like something very much intentionally. Yes, 0:02:44.480 --> 0:02:46.520 it wasn't an accident. I thought it. 0:02:46.720 --> 0:02:50.240 Wasn't like a really the plane landed badly and I 0:02:50.280 --> 0:02:50.640 was like. 0:02:50.560 --> 0:02:51.040 Boom, boom. 0:02:54.560 --> 0:02:58.119 It wasn't like I was fifteen at the time. So 0:02:59.840 --> 0:03:11.640 I'm sorry I have Yeah, so I had taken it 0:03:11.680 --> 0:03:14.320 was in Ghana, right, I was visiting Ghana with my dad. 0:03:14.919 --> 0:03:18.799 I don't know if that's necessary. Well, it's a very 0:03:19.000 --> 0:03:24.400 humored country, and it feels like I you know, I 0:03:24.480 --> 0:03:28.639 was in a bath and it was hot, and I 0:03:28.680 --> 0:03:30.400 feel like I was really in the bath for a 0:03:30.480 --> 0:03:38.320 long time and my back felt good and. 0:03:36.720 --> 0:03:40.800 And then I got an erection and then I was 0:03:40.880 --> 0:03:43.440 just like looking at it and it was looking at me. 0:03:56.440 --> 0:03:56.480 No. 0:03:56.880 --> 0:04:06.640 Look, I'm saying, like every guy in. 0:04:06.600 --> 0:04:08.880 This room has tried to suck their own dick, Okay, 0:04:10.360 --> 0:04:11.760 every single one of them. 0:04:11.880 --> 0:04:15.800 I can see a few of you, a few of you. 0:04:15.800 --> 0:04:18.599 You you've tried it, you've tried it. 0:04:20.520 --> 0:04:26.000 You fail, you fail. But but here's the thing. I 0:04:26.080 --> 0:04:30.200 was like, look, we all know how this ends. 0:04:31.440 --> 0:04:35.640 I'm not going to reach you, but let's just see 0:04:35.640 --> 0:04:40.880 how much I don't reach you by all. And then 0:04:40.920 --> 0:04:43.000 I got closer and closer, and. 0:04:44.800 --> 0:04:56.560 Next thing, my dick was in my mouth. It wasn't 0:04:56.960 --> 0:04:58.280 I wasn't good at it, you know what I mean. 0:04:58.279 --> 0:05:03.800 I was like, it was just like you know what 0:05:03.839 --> 0:05:10.280 I mean, just the very top bend, just the tip 0:05:10.560 --> 0:05:17.039 did you edging? I think it's called no because it 0:05:17.120 --> 0:05:19.320 was happening. And then I was like, oh, I can't 0:05:19.360 --> 0:05:23.360 do this. This is disgusting. You thought of that after 0:05:23.480 --> 0:05:25.840 the fact. And then I was like, no, I can 0:05:25.960 --> 0:05:28.839 do this. And then I went back down. I couldn't reach. 0:05:29.600 --> 0:05:33.080 I couldn't reach the second time. The second time I 0:05:33.120 --> 0:05:36.320 couldn't reach, went back for seconds. Even if you. 0:05:36.800 --> 0:05:39.240 Didn't want it to happened, it retracted away from you. 0:05:39.520 --> 0:05:43.520 Yeah, it was like, I can't it's forbidden. 0:05:44.800 --> 0:05:47.799 In all seriousness, because like I thought this was a myth. 0:05:48.880 --> 0:05:50.839 Can you did you actually make contact? 0:05:50.920 --> 0:05:51.040 Jen? 0:05:51.240 --> 0:05:53.280 Yeah? But look here's the thing. People are like, oh, 0:05:53.360 --> 0:05:54.440 you must have a big. 0:05:54.400 --> 0:05:57.600 But it's not like that at all. What happened was 0:05:57.640 --> 0:06:02.680 I was fifteen and it had grown to its maximum length, 0:06:02.720 --> 0:06:05.000 but I was still had the body of a boy. 0:06:07.320 --> 0:06:09.640 Do you know what I mean, so it was like 0:06:10.320 --> 0:06:16.000 it was really just a once in a lifetime opportunity, but. 0:06:16.279 --> 0:06:18.200 Really a once in a lifetime was it once and 0:06:18.279 --> 0:06:18.839 once only? 0:06:19.240 --> 0:06:21.040 Yeah? And that's it and that was just that was it? 0:06:21.080 --> 0:06:23.159 And trust me, I tried. 0:06:25.640 --> 0:06:28.720 Well, sometimes life like offers you up these opportunities. 0:06:28.760 --> 0:06:30.320 I'm so glad you grabbed that one. 0:06:30.480 --> 0:06:30.720 Yeah. 0:06:30.760 --> 0:06:32.960 Absolutely. Moral of the story is never let go of 0:06:32.960 --> 0:06:33.400 a good thing. 0:06:33.520 --> 0:06:33.599 No. 0:06:35.600 --> 0:06:37.040 I My next question. 0:06:37.000 --> 0:06:39.200 Was how did you know you were funny enough to 0:06:39.200 --> 0:06:41.200 be a comedian? But we can skip past that because 0:06:41.200 --> 0:06:42.120 I've got it right now. 0:06:42.560 --> 0:06:43.560 No, how do you know? 0:06:43.800 --> 0:06:48.120 How how do you feel like I'm funny? I'm going 0:06:48.200 --> 0:06:50.400 to make people pay you to come and see me. 0:06:52.560 --> 0:06:53.640 Yeah, I don't know that. 0:06:53.720 --> 0:06:56.480 I mean, look, what the actual, the actual, biggest sort 0:06:56.520 --> 0:06:59.159 of question is, at what point do you start not 0:06:59.240 --> 0:07:01.000 being embarrassed about things like that. 0:07:02.920 --> 0:07:05.160 And just realizing that that's just who you. 0:07:05.120 --> 0:07:08.359 Are and what you can talk about on stage, Because 0:07:08.440 --> 0:07:11.400 I mean, for a very long time, especially as a 0:07:11.440 --> 0:07:14.400 young guy, you would just be like I would. I mean, 0:07:14.440 --> 0:07:16.360 I swore to myself that I would never ever tell 0:07:16.480 --> 0:07:20.600 that particular story because that's so shameful and embarrassing and blah. 0:07:20.680 --> 0:07:21.160 Blah blah. 0:07:21.240 --> 0:07:24.640 But the more you get to that point as a 0:07:24.680 --> 0:07:27.840 performer or content creator or whatever, and you guys do 0:07:27.880 --> 0:07:30.200 it all the time. It's like the more you open up, 0:07:30.240 --> 0:07:32.320 the realer you are, the more you realize that people, 0:07:33.800 --> 0:07:35.360 you're not the only kid with a bathtub. 0:07:35.400 --> 0:07:35.960 You know what I mean. 0:07:37.680 --> 0:07:39.320 You know what I'm i saying is that he also 0:07:39.480 --> 0:07:41.000 ran out of content and had to mind. 0:07:41.520 --> 0:07:46.119 Yeah yeah, yeah, exactly literally, So yeah. 0:07:46.160 --> 0:07:49.400 So I mean that's that's where things started becoming more 0:07:49.400 --> 0:07:51.920 interesting for me as a performer and as a as 0:07:51.960 --> 0:07:54.040 a as a comedian and stuff like that, sort of 0:07:54.280 --> 0:07:58.800 hitting that truth level and honesty that I think people 0:07:59.040 --> 0:08:01.720 certainly now just want to or everybody appreciate it. 0:08:01.800 --> 0:08:06.239 This well, it's not often we do have the pleasure 0:08:06.400 --> 0:08:09.360 of being in the presence of an award winning comedian. 0:08:09.480 --> 0:08:13.680 So we're really gonna utilize that tonight by talking about 0:08:14.280 --> 0:08:19.080 micro racial aggression. So I mean, go forget, We've got 0:08:20.360 --> 0:08:22.200 We've got a comedian, and we're gonna we're gonna go we. 0:08:22.240 --> 0:08:24.200 Get to waste our time, is what we're saying. We're 0:08:24.240 --> 0:08:26.840 taking you from talking about all of your funny times 0:08:26.840 --> 0:08:28.320 in life to talking about some very. 0:08:28.200 --> 0:08:30.040 Seriously, sure, go for it. Let's go for it. 0:08:30.200 --> 0:08:33.080 But well, let's start with what is racial microaggression? 0:08:33.880 --> 0:08:36.160 Oh look, it's just little things. I mean, you know, 0:08:36.440 --> 0:08:38.360 I had to pull up someone recently because they were 0:08:38.360 --> 0:08:41.200 talking about how my hair looks like pubes, right, and like, 0:08:41.960 --> 0:08:43.439 while it kind of does. 0:08:43.400 --> 0:08:46.319 You're like, you don't get to say that, you know. 0:08:47.360 --> 0:08:49.720 And so and people don't do it out of like 0:08:50.280 --> 0:08:53.559 most people don't do it out of spie or hate 0:08:53.640 --> 0:08:54.360 or anything like that. 0:08:54.440 --> 0:09:00.040 They just don't know. And so the whole race conversation. 0:09:01.160 --> 0:09:04.760 There really is a battle against you know, or there's 0:09:04.880 --> 0:09:14.480 naivity and ignorance versus wilful ignorance and purposeful hate, you know, 0:09:14.559 --> 0:09:16.920 and that and that's kind of where where where the 0:09:16.960 --> 0:09:19.960 sort of line is drawn down. Sometimes there's people that 0:09:19.960 --> 0:09:21.800 get caught in the crossfire, but most of the time 0:09:21.880 --> 0:09:27.079 and the majority of people aren't willfully out to be. 0:09:28.640 --> 0:09:30.120 To be ignorant. 0:09:30.320 --> 0:09:33.560 But if we're actually talking about in terms of the 0:09:33.559 --> 0:09:36.760 way that society is changing or change when it comes to, 0:09:37.480 --> 0:09:39.160 you know, the way people look at race, it's a 0:09:39.200 --> 0:09:41.280 couple of things that are point that happened to me 0:09:41.360 --> 0:09:44.400 recently having a daughter she's three years old, right, and 0:09:44.480 --> 0:09:46.800 she's got curly hair, and I'm really getting scared of 0:09:46.840 --> 0:09:49.520 the day that she comes home and wants to straighten it, 0:09:49.640 --> 0:09:52.360 you know, because she's just so like I saw my 0:09:52.400 --> 0:09:55.520 sister straighten her hair for her whole life and being 0:09:55.600 --> 0:09:58.200 called you know, a pupe had made fun of pew 0:09:58.400 --> 0:10:00.719 like hair, and we can put velkan on the roof 0:10:00.760 --> 0:10:01.719 and you again stick to the roof and all that 0:10:01.760 --> 0:10:03.360 sort of stuff. It still sticks to you for a 0:10:03.400 --> 0:10:09.240 long time. So seeing my daughter, you know, hopefully embracing 0:10:09.280 --> 0:10:10.400 the curly hair is a big one. 0:10:10.800 --> 0:10:11.000 Now. 0:10:11.160 --> 0:10:15.080 When my partner and I just recently were showing my 0:10:15.240 --> 0:10:16.520 daughter the. 0:10:16.120 --> 0:10:18.880 Bananas ad from the nineties. Do you remember that one 0:10:18.920 --> 0:10:20.360 ban Na Na Na Na Nana. 0:10:20.960 --> 0:10:23.400 Yeah, so I mean classic ad, right, And my partner 0:10:23.520 --> 0:10:25.440 was like, oh, let's go and watch this Banana's ad. 0:10:25.360 --> 0:10:26.640 You know, and she was singing the song and my 0:10:26.720 --> 0:10:28.319 daughter was like, what is that? What's that song? And 0:10:28.400 --> 0:10:29.600 my partner's like, we'll watch the ad. 0:10:29.920 --> 0:10:32.520 So we sat down and watched the ad and after 0:10:32.640 --> 0:10:34.880 the ad, this was the classic nineties ad. 0:10:35.080 --> 0:10:37.439 After the ad, I looked up and my partner was 0:10:38.200 --> 0:10:40.840 literally crying, right, and I was like, oh, my gosh, 0:10:40.880 --> 0:10:45.079 what's what's what happened with the banana? I don't know, 0:10:45.200 --> 0:10:46.000 like what happened? 0:10:48.520 --> 0:10:50.319 I know, I know, I know, like, well yeah, but 0:10:50.720 --> 0:10:56.480 she was like, I just realized that there's only white 0:10:56.559 --> 0:10:59.000 kids in that ad, right, which is fine. It's the 0:10:59.120 --> 0:11:01.880 nineties and that's what. But then she was like, now 0:11:01.960 --> 0:11:06.000 that I you know, our daughter is part African and 0:11:06.679 --> 0:11:09.120 and now I'm with you, I'm only realizing that that 0:11:09.320 --> 0:11:10.960 you would have grown up watching that ad and seen 0:11:10.960 --> 0:11:13.760 a completely different ad. So she only realized that now, 0:11:14.400 --> 0:11:16.480 And that's absolutely fine. Everyone takes the time to learn 0:11:16.520 --> 0:11:20.440 that sort of stuff. But this afternoon, literally Asavo, when 0:11:20.480 --> 0:11:23.280 I was doing that daycare pickup, my daughter walked past 0:11:23.400 --> 0:11:26.880 this sign that said that that was just had a 0:11:27.679 --> 0:11:29.480 it was just like a community sort of sign. You know, 0:11:29.520 --> 0:11:31.360 they've got them in daycare, put you away things, blah 0:11:31.400 --> 0:11:34.160 blah blah. But it had a like a young brown 0:11:34.240 --> 0:11:37.240 girl in this sign. And my daughter, Sophia, out of nowhere, 0:11:37.520 --> 0:11:41.000 completely unprompted, walked up and said, Dad, look that girl 0:11:41.040 --> 0:11:43.720 looks like me, right, And I said, yeah, she does. 0:11:43.840 --> 0:11:47.000 She's got curly hair and she's got yeah and brown 0:11:47.080 --> 0:11:49.560 skin like me. And I felt so. 0:11:51.480 --> 0:11:56.400 Like thankful that it has changed, because I think when 0:11:56.440 --> 0:11:59.880 we talk about race and everything, it's like it gets 0:12:00.120 --> 0:12:06.760 blurred to this line where us as adults understand it, 0:12:06.880 --> 0:12:09.800 but kids don't. And the best example I always sort 0:12:09.840 --> 0:12:12.400 of use in this scenario is when I was ten 0:12:12.520 --> 0:12:17.360 and I was watching the you know, Pauline Hansen was 0:12:17.400 --> 0:12:20.800 making her biggest rise up through the ranks, and she 0:12:20.960 --> 0:12:22.320 was all over the news, and she was talking about 0:12:22.320 --> 0:12:23.440 immigrants and blah blah blah. 0:12:23.800 --> 0:12:25.920 And I remember, you know, looking at. 0:12:27.559 --> 0:12:31.120 At the news and thinking about and hearing her talk 0:12:31.120 --> 0:12:33.719 about how bad immigrants are and blah blah blah. And 0:12:33.800 --> 0:12:35.679 then I remember going into my mum's room and asking 0:12:35.760 --> 0:12:39.680 her his dad an immigrant, and my mum said yes, 0:12:40.559 --> 0:12:45.360 And I remember feeling really embarrassed about that and ashamed 0:12:45.440 --> 0:12:46.840 and like scared. 0:12:46.880 --> 0:12:49.599 I thought, oh, no, I can't let anyone know. I 0:12:49.640 --> 0:12:52.280 can't let anyone know that my dad's an immigrant, you know. 0:12:52.640 --> 0:12:59.640 And that's so like, it's quite evil what. 0:13:01.240 --> 0:13:02.959 Can be done and the way that kids can be 0:13:02.960 --> 0:13:06.360 manipulated through the media, And so as adults, it's easy 0:13:06.440 --> 0:13:08.719 to say, oh, well, shouldn't everyone have their say and 0:13:08.800 --> 0:13:10.720 have their opinion and blah blah blah. But we're forgetting 0:13:10.720 --> 0:13:13.240 who actually gets access to that and who gets to 0:13:13.720 --> 0:13:16.200 and who suddenly feels like they're not one of us 0:13:16.320 --> 0:13:20.480 and not allowed to be here, and whose parents are less. 0:13:20.840 --> 0:13:22.040 Valued in society. 0:13:22.720 --> 0:13:26.000 And so that's why, you know, just my daughter seeing 0:13:26.040 --> 0:13:27.520 someone that look like her on a sign to me 0:13:27.640 --> 0:13:31.000 today felt like we're going in the right direction. 0:13:31.600 --> 0:13:32.520 How does that for you? 0:13:32.840 --> 0:13:35.679 How does that impact you growing up? Like seeing that 0:13:35.800 --> 0:13:38.800 ad on TV or seeing seeing Pauline on TV and 0:13:38.880 --> 0:13:42.720 seeing that conversation and then having speaking to your dad 0:13:43.000 --> 0:13:46.719 and connecting the dots, like, how does that impact you 0:13:46.840 --> 0:13:48.520 long term where you are now in your life? 0:13:50.720 --> 0:13:52.439 Well, the reason why I do stand up comedy is 0:13:52.559 --> 0:13:53.800 because I. 0:13:56.080 --> 0:13:57.600 Didn't think that I was going to get any acting 0:13:57.760 --> 0:14:00.680 jobs because there was no brown people on austrain and TV, 0:14:00.880 --> 0:14:04.520 and so I felt like if I connected with audiences 0:14:04.640 --> 0:14:07.560 by being myself as much as possible, that they'd see 0:14:07.800 --> 0:14:10.800 and hear someone that they could relate to without needing 0:14:10.880 --> 0:14:14.079 to go through any higher up powers, et cetera. So 0:14:14.160 --> 0:14:16.040 that's actually part of the reason why I guess I'm 0:14:16.040 --> 0:14:18.960 even sitting on this stage is because understanding that there 0:14:19.000 --> 0:14:21.440 were gatekeepers at the time, and that they're still to 0:14:21.520 --> 0:14:23.560 an extent is but doing my best to sort of 0:14:23.600 --> 0:14:28.400 get around that. As far as what it does to 0:14:28.440 --> 0:14:32.320 you when you're growing up, this has gone so far 0:14:32.480 --> 0:14:34.560 away from sucking my own dick. I'm going to tell you, 0:14:35.600 --> 0:14:39.520 oh my Lodi, you got to do a bit of both, right, 0:14:39.560 --> 0:14:40.960 you got to have a bit of light and shade. 0:14:41.080 --> 0:14:43.320 I think this is really important though, so that one 0:14:43.480 --> 0:14:46.040 Moment of the Year at the Podcast Awards last year 0:14:46.320 --> 0:14:50.080 for speaking about this, and that's when we listened to 0:14:50.280 --> 0:14:53.440 that section that audio that was put forward for the 0:14:53.480 --> 0:14:55.880 Podcast Awards. That was why we were like, this is 0:14:55.920 --> 0:14:57.480 the conversation we want to have on stage. 0:14:57.560 --> 0:14:59.920 Yeah, and look, it's a really important one. It's very difficult. 0:15:00.040 --> 0:15:01.960 People get very defensive when they talk about it, feel 0:15:02.000 --> 0:15:04.440 uncomfortable and it's like you just don't that's not that 0:15:04.560 --> 0:15:06.600 doesn't help anyone. You know, You've just got to kind 0:15:06.640 --> 0:15:08.880 of try and be as open as possible about it. 0:15:10.760 --> 0:15:12.560 So what what I was gonna say is, you know, 0:15:12.640 --> 0:15:14.440 you feel like, I mean, growing up, you feel that 0:15:14.480 --> 0:15:14.720 you do. 0:15:14.800 --> 0:15:19.920 Feel a little bit like embarrassed about being brown. 0:15:19.960 --> 0:15:21.680 You're making all the sort of jokes to try and 0:15:21.840 --> 0:15:25.320 you know, cover up, you know who you are and 0:15:25.440 --> 0:15:27.360 what you are, you kind of reject there's a lot 0:15:27.400 --> 0:15:30.040 of cultural rejection and all that sort of stuff. 0:15:32.000 --> 0:15:35.120 And you feel like, I look back on some of 0:15:35.160 --> 0:15:37.680 the stuff that I used to say and do. 0:15:37.800 --> 0:15:40.000 To my dad because I was kind of a little 0:15:40.040 --> 0:15:42.640 bit embarrassed by, you know, him being African and stuff 0:15:42.640 --> 0:15:45.440 like that, and it's like it's shameful, you know, because 0:15:45.480 --> 0:15:47.680 this is a guy who like worked his ass off 0:15:47.760 --> 0:15:52.080 to you know, get his university degree out of Ghana, 0:15:52.160 --> 0:15:54.360 to move to Australia, start in your life, set up 0:15:54.360 --> 0:15:58.040 a family, you know, and everything, and and then you're 0:15:58.080 --> 0:15:59.640 making fun of him for the way he says ms 0:15:59.720 --> 0:16:01.600 squee to instead of mosquito, you know. 0:16:01.600 --> 0:16:02.000 What I mean. 0:16:02.760 --> 0:16:05.560 And I mean he still does it, and I still 0:16:05.640 --> 0:16:07.880 make fun of him, but you know, I'm allowed to now, 0:16:07.960 --> 0:16:08.560 I'm allowed to. 0:16:08.840 --> 0:16:12.440 But yeah, but like things like that, you know, so 0:16:12.560 --> 0:16:14.200 you look back on it, you're like, what was I thinking? 0:16:14.360 --> 0:16:16.840 But that's you know, you're you're you're such under the 0:16:16.960 --> 0:16:20.200 influence of the powers outside of you that you kind 0:16:20.280 --> 0:16:24.320 of don't realize the Yeah, the effect that you're having 0:16:24.400 --> 0:16:26.760 on not just yourself but others are the others people 0:16:26.800 --> 0:16:27.480 are important to you. 0:16:28.120 --> 0:16:31.880 Do you find that you still experience it, these these 0:16:32.000 --> 0:16:35.160 microaggressions in your day to day life with people that 0:16:35.240 --> 0:16:38.680 are in your life. So maybe they're friends, because maybe 0:16:38.720 --> 0:16:41.760 it's a level of ignorance or not being educated enough 0:16:41.800 --> 0:16:43.800 on the topic, because I sometimes. 0:16:43.480 --> 0:16:46.720 Been casual, I think educated on it. But they're like, oh, like, 0:16:47.000 --> 0:16:48.880 we're mates, so you don't mind, do you. 0:16:49.080 --> 0:16:51.880 Yeah, Look, I mean racism is one of those things 0:16:51.920 --> 0:16:55.560 that hides very well behind discrepancy, and so you know, 0:16:57.000 --> 0:17:03.600 in a way you can never really racists in the 0:17:03.680 --> 0:17:07.680 same way that abuses are very good at hiding what 0:17:07.840 --> 0:17:11.399 they do, and they're very good at making it impossible 0:17:11.520 --> 0:17:12.879 to prove it, right. 0:17:13.520 --> 0:17:15.560 So that's why when. 0:17:17.080 --> 0:17:21.040 You know, you have to be really lucky to catch 0:17:21.640 --> 0:17:26.399 with video a police officers choking a dude to death, 0:17:27.119 --> 0:17:32.680 and even when the video exists, they're still room for oh, well, 0:17:32.840 --> 0:17:37.200 actually I'm not that person. And so it's the same 0:17:37.280 --> 0:17:43.240 with abuse. These people work so they're masters of covering 0:17:43.320 --> 0:17:47.440 their tracks and their trails, so they very rarely get caught. 0:17:47.640 --> 0:17:56.600 You know, I remember applying for a job on at a. 0:17:56.640 --> 0:17:59.760 Video store, and I remember putting my photo on the 0:17:59.840 --> 0:18:04.040 video store on the CV because I wanted to make 0:18:04.080 --> 0:18:06.080 sure that when people saw my last name, I kind 0:18:06.119 --> 0:18:08.399 of my middle name a Jetta, they looked at my 0:18:08.560 --> 0:18:14.720 photo and they saw that I wasn't that black. Right now, 0:18:15.640 --> 0:18:18.240 it's I am embarrassed that I did that, but I 0:18:18.359 --> 0:18:21.520 also did that because studies had. 0:18:21.440 --> 0:18:25.320 Proven and still prove, that you're less likely to get 0:18:25.320 --> 0:18:29.560 a job interview in that instance. So these sort of things, 0:18:29.640 --> 0:18:33.400 unless you really get busted, they just happen all the time. 0:18:33.680 --> 0:18:35.680 And it's the same way so often where you go, 0:18:36.680 --> 0:18:39.120 I got a feeling about this person, or I don't 0:18:39.160 --> 0:18:41.320 I really don't trust this person, or I wouldn't trust 0:18:41.359 --> 0:18:43.000 this person making a decision on my behalf because I 0:18:43.040 --> 0:18:46.480 actually don't think that they're an ally. It's the same 0:18:46.520 --> 0:18:48.200 way people of color do that, same way the women 0:18:48.240 --> 0:18:49.640 do that. The same way that you have to sort 0:18:49.680 --> 0:18:55.120 of you kind of you know, you just know when 0:18:55.160 --> 0:18:57.480 it's happening to you, but of course very difficult to 0:18:57.560 --> 0:19:00.159 prove it more often than not, so you just have 0:19:00.240 --> 0:19:02.280 to sort of suck it up and get on with 0:19:02.359 --> 0:19:02.639 your day. 0:19:02.840 --> 0:19:04.359 I mean, but that's I mean, that's the thing. You 0:19:04.400 --> 0:19:06.320 shouldn't have to suck it You should suck it up, 0:19:06.359 --> 0:19:07.119 because we do. 0:19:08.200 --> 0:19:10.600 But you should have to suck it up and get 0:19:10.640 --> 0:19:11.760 on with your day. And I guess that should. 0:19:11.920 --> 0:19:13.639 That's why we want to have these conversations and just 0:19:13.760 --> 0:19:13.960 on that. 0:19:14.359 --> 0:19:15.960 I when we did our due. 0:19:15.800 --> 0:19:19.560 Diligence, I was reading an article from somebody with an 0:19:19.600 --> 0:19:24.159 ethnic name that went for a job, like put their 0:19:24.200 --> 0:19:26.479 CV down twice. They went for the job twice. They 0:19:26.560 --> 0:19:28.479 didn't have photos, it was just their name, but they 0:19:28.640 --> 0:19:30.840 changed their name with the same CV, so they had 0:19:30.880 --> 0:19:33.560 their ethnic name and then they had you know, John 0:19:33.640 --> 0:19:36.439 Smith and John Smith got the interview. 0:19:37.080 --> 0:19:37.280 Yeah. 0:19:37.600 --> 0:19:39.199 And the fact that that is happening now, I mean 0:19:39.240 --> 0:19:40.720 it's very upsetting, which is why we want to have 0:19:40.800 --> 0:19:43.160 these conversations. But part of the moment of the year 0:19:43.200 --> 0:19:46.600 that you did win was talking about racism and Black 0:19:46.640 --> 0:19:49.600 Lives Matter the movement. Do you think there has been 0:19:49.720 --> 0:19:52.760 have you noticed in your life since the Black Lives 0:19:52.840 --> 0:19:55.560 Matter movement? Have you noticed a big difference in society 0:19:55.800 --> 0:19:58.080 in things that are happening to you in the day 0:19:58.119 --> 0:19:58.400 to day. 0:19:59.359 --> 0:20:01.840 Yeah, I mean, look, I think it's I think it's great. 0:20:01.920 --> 0:20:05.760 I think it is something that has Definitely there's there's 0:20:05.880 --> 0:20:08.600 levels of overcompensation at times that I feel, which I 0:20:08.760 --> 0:20:12.600 which I think is fine because it's kind of long overdue. 0:20:14.000 --> 0:20:19.320 There's also, you know, instances of people where you know, 0:20:20.680 --> 0:20:28.000 you know, there's people who will I'm trying to figure 0:20:28.000 --> 0:20:33.399 out how to say this about pointing at particular fruits 0:20:33.520 --> 0:20:38.879 or names, but essentially there will be people or companies 0:20:39.400 --> 0:20:40.960 who are very much on board. 0:20:41.880 --> 0:20:44.600 You know, yeah we did this, and you look back 0:20:45.520 --> 0:20:46.160 just like two. 0:20:46.160 --> 0:20:48.840 Years ago and you're like, well, you didn't represent any 0:20:48.880 --> 0:20:51.800 people of color, and you had like how many people 0:20:51.880 --> 0:20:52.439 on your books? 0:20:52.800 --> 0:20:54.080 One hundred people on your books. 0:20:54.080 --> 0:20:56.720 You didn't care about people of color, but now you 0:20:56.880 --> 0:21:00.640 suddenly care because you need to. That's sort of people 0:21:00.720 --> 0:21:02.760 that I don't. That's that they're the people who I 0:21:02.840 --> 0:21:07.360 get really kind of frustrated with. But I mean, it's 0:21:07.440 --> 0:21:10.640 it's it's definitely. It's definitely changing, and I'm and I'm stoked, 0:21:10.680 --> 0:21:12.480 and it's always it's changed a lot since. 0:21:12.440 --> 0:21:14.520 The banana's ad in the nineties, and it's going to 0:21:14.600 --> 0:21:15.119 keep changing. 0:21:15.160 --> 0:21:16.960 And I have faith that the majority of people are 0:21:17.000 --> 0:21:18.960 doing the right thing and that you know, it's it's 0:21:19.760 --> 0:21:20.920 you know, we're all trying our best. 0:21:20.960 --> 0:21:22.200 I think most of us are trying our best. 0:21:22.480 --> 0:21:24.480