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Speaker 1: Three sixty with Katie Wolf. Join the conversation with Katie Wolf.

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Speaker 2: You are our eyes and ears in the Territory Mixed

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Speaker 2: one oh four.

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Speaker 3: Point nine joining me live in the studio right now

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Speaker 3: from AFAD the Amateur Fishermen's Association here in the Northern

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Speaker 3: Territory Chief Executive David jir Ravolo, Good morning to.

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Speaker 1: You morning, Katie.

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Speaker 3: Great great to see you now. Were reading the paper

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Speaker 3: today that recreational fishing stakeholders have been told that a

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Speaker 3: decision by traditional owners to allow access to parts of

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Speaker 3: the East Alligator River will be made in coming days.

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Speaker 3: The Northern Territory News is reporting that the Northern Lane

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Speaker 3: Councilors set to announce well hopefully that access will remain

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Speaker 3: for those recreational FIS shows for the Arnham Land side

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Speaker 3: of the East Alligator until at least December twenty twenty two. David,

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Speaker 3: is that your understanding at this point or is it

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Speaker 3: still sort of up in the air.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that look, that is consistent with my understanding, and

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Speaker 2: we certainly hope that that's confirmed publicly soon. I did

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Speaker 2: quickly check in with the NLC to make sure that

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Speaker 2: was accurate, and that is the information that we have, so,

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Speaker 2: I guess for fishes, the important take home there is

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Speaker 2: when the registration process was brought in that side, the

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Speaker 2: Arnham Land side of the East Alligator River and the

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Speaker 2: Cooper Creek were red areas that people couldn't access with

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Speaker 2: the registration and we're hoping that will be updated maps

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Speaker 2: provided soon which update that and hopefully it turns yellow

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Speaker 2: very soon.

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Speaker 3: It's been a difficult time, I guess, or a very

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Speaker 3: interesting time, you'd have to say, for our recreational fishes

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Speaker 3: in the territory with the Blue Mud Bay decision a

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Speaker 3: few weeks ago, and then you know, waiting on this

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Speaker 3: decision as well. How are our recreational fishes feeling at

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Speaker 3: the moment.

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Speaker 1: I think it's been a tough time for everyone.

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Speaker 2: It's certainly been a tough time for us at our

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Speaker 2: fand and I know it's been a difficult path for

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Speaker 2: the NLC as well and the stuff that I've been

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Speaker 2: engaging with there. But for recreational fishes, we're really upset

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Speaker 2: with losing access to some of the places that they

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Speaker 2: love and places which traditional owners have shared access with

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Speaker 2: recreational fishes for so many years twelve years or more

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Speaker 2: since the Bloomer Bay decision. So look, I think there's

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Speaker 2: been an acknowledgment of that. Of course, I need to

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Speaker 2: preface that it is the right of traditional owners to

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Speaker 2: decide what happens on their waters. In many ways, there's

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Speaker 2: a lot of frustration that it's taken so long to

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Speaker 2: resolve it, of course from recreational fishes, but from traditional

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Speaker 2: owners have really been expecting change since that decision in

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Speaker 2: two thousand and eight, and so you know, it's been

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Speaker 2: an evolving process. I think initially people get really upset

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Speaker 2: when they find out they can't access the place that

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Speaker 2: they love. And now really attention is turning to, well,

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Speaker 2: how can we fix this and how can we make

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Speaker 2: it better?

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Speaker 1: And you know, I'm.

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Speaker 2: Certainly convinced that we've got to work better and more

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Speaker 2: closely with the NLC and with traditional owners because we've

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Speaker 2: got so many shared values where each party here, if

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Speaker 2: you want to use that term, or if I'm going

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Speaker 2: to use that term, is very much committed to stewardship

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Speaker 2: of aquatic resources and looking after our fish.

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Speaker 3: Now, how is that registration process going so far? You know,

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Speaker 3: like people responding to it quite well, or how has

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Speaker 3: it been playing out over the last couple of weeks,

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Speaker 3: so I.

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Speaker 2: Think people who have gone on to actually get one

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Speaker 2: of the registrations would find that it's been a relatively

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Speaker 2: easy process to do. We've certainly been engaging with the

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Speaker 2: NLC around some of the terms and conditions and working

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Speaker 2: through on that. As I mentioned a couple of weeks

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Speaker 2: ago when we talked one of the real challenges around

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Speaker 2: it was that the registration didn't relate to or didn't

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Speaker 2: cover a lot of the areas that people would actually

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Speaker 2: like to go fishing. And so with the consultations that

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Speaker 2: have been occurring, if we've heard those consultations have happened

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Speaker 2: in the East, I understand that other consultations are underway

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Speaker 2: right now and that the See of the NLC has

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Speaker 2: been involved in those consultations as self, which really shows

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Speaker 2: how important these issues are. Hopefully we start to see

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Speaker 2: some updated maps and that means that the registration covers

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Speaker 2: those places that people do care about. But that really

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Speaker 2: does it's up to the traditional owners to make those

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Speaker 2: decisions and it will take some time. So it is

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Speaker 2: hard for people to be patient while the runoff is

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Speaker 2: looking so good, but it will take time.

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Speaker 3: David, there had been discussion you know, when you and

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Speaker 3: I spoke on that day, after the news sort of

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Speaker 3: started to come out, of course about this registration process,

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Speaker 3: people had started questioning whether the government had sort of

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Speaker 3: done enough in this space. How are people feeling at

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Speaker 3: this point from your perspective.

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Speaker 2: Look, I have to say I think there's a real

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Speaker 2: opportunity for more leadership from the government in this space.

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Speaker 2: I understand that it's a very complex and difficult issue.

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Speaker 2: I'm not really sure that fishes really feel that they

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Speaker 2: have been heard by the government.

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Speaker 1: Certainly, my.

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Speaker 2: Understanding would be they've probably been heard more by the

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Speaker 2: NLC than they have by the government, and so we've

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Speaker 2: continued to engage with the government.

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Speaker 1: Look, it's clear that it's a complex issue. It's clear

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Speaker 1: that there are people.

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Speaker 2: Within the government, ministers who are really do get it,

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Speaker 2: do understand, but they obviously people don't want to put

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Speaker 2: a foot wrong, don't want to tread wrongly. But sometimes

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Speaker 2: that can look like you're saying nothing and that upsets people,

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Speaker 2: and I think that would be a fair criticism.

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Speaker 1: It's certainly a criticism that I've leveled.

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Speaker 2: We have continued to engage, We've been writing to the

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Speaker 2: Chief Minister, we've been writing to all of the other

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Speaker 2: relevant ministers and really just making sure that as we

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Speaker 2: move forward and try to solve these issues, and as

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Speaker 2: the NLC is doing its consultations on a case by

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Speaker 2: case basis with the tos for areas that we need

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Speaker 2: to make sure the government resources are on the table

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Speaker 2: so that we can get the best enduring deals possible.

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Speaker 2: I'm confident that the government does understand that, but they

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Speaker 2: really do need to put their best foot forward and

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Speaker 2: make sure that they can tailor the deals to traditional

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Speaker 2: owners who want to share their country in a way

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Speaker 2: that traditional owners are looking to do those agreements.

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Speaker 3: Do you reckon that they should be doing that with

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Speaker 3: more of a sense of urgency at this point.

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Speaker 2: I think, look, it's an acutely urgent issue, especially when

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Speaker 2: we have a situation where a lot of waters that

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Speaker 2: were had been shared by traditional owners for over twelve

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Speaker 2: years all of a sudden became off limits. I think

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Speaker 2: there's always room to do better in this space, and

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Speaker 2: we certainly expect the government to come to the table

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Speaker 2: with more, better and more flexible resources, and I hope

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Speaker 2: that that will mean that the NLC and our fan

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Speaker 2: can do our jobs better because we know there are

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Speaker 2: things that recreational fishes can bring to the table. We've

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Speaker 2: long been custodians of the resource and a lot of

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Speaker 2: catch and release occurs for fish, So you know, we

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Speaker 2: can look at things like better protecting fish resources. We

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Speaker 2: can look at things like collecting better data. We've been

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Speaker 2: running a citizen science program for twenty years. We could

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Speaker 2: share that data better with traditional owners when it comes

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Speaker 2: to resources for rangers, when it comes to long term

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Speaker 2: agreements that underpin access and benefits in.

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Speaker 1: Exchange for that.

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Speaker 2: There's a role for the territory government that really can't

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Speaker 2: be replaced by anybody else, and so we really hope

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Speaker 2: they're putting their best foot forward as well.

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Speaker 3: Now, last time you and I spoke, you know, when

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Speaker 3: this again, when this announcement was initially made about Blue

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Speaker 3: Mud Bay, we had spoken about places like Dundee essentially

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Speaker 3: potentially being quite badly impacted. What are you hearing, you know,

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Speaker 3: from people out that way at the moment when it

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Speaker 3: comes to this decision and the way that it's sort

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Speaker 3: of rolled.

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Speaker 2: Out, Now, yeah, I think it has certainly the decision

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Speaker 2: So we're referring to the Finnis River and so at

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Speaker 2: the moment The only area of the Finnis River that's

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Speaker 2: accessible for recreational fishing is the first five kilometers from

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Speaker 2: the mouth up and it used to be that you

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Speaker 2: could access another eight kilometers and now people can't access

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Speaker 2: that after traditional owners close that section of the river.

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Speaker 2: It's definitely impacted on tourism in Dundee in terms of

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Speaker 2: people who would want to travel up there maybe not

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Speaker 2: planning their trip there. And we've seen that Shady Camp

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Speaker 2: has been really really busy, a lot of people going

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Speaker 2: to a lot of people going to fish the Mayor

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Speaker 2: River system. The Daily River system was flooded as well,

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Speaker 2: So we've seen a tremendous amount of pressure put on

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Speaker 2: one system, and we know that when more places are accessible,

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Speaker 2: we're more likely to see that effort spread. So it

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Speaker 2: would be great to see that effort be able to

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Speaker 2: be spread. We will do everything that we can to

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Speaker 2: engage with the NLC and with the government to hopefully

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Speaker 2: revisit the finness in due course, but ultimately that's a

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Speaker 2: decision of the traditional owners.

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Speaker 1: It has to be respected.

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Speaker 2: My understanding is that they've raised a number of concerns

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Speaker 2: and we certainly hope that they are addressed by the

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Speaker 2: government and the NLC as promptly as can be, and

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Speaker 2: anything that we need to do, we're ready, willing and

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Speaker 2: able to assist.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I was going to say, by the sounds of things,

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Speaker 3: Effort certainly seems to be trying their best to engage

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Speaker 3: with all of those stakeholders, particularly with the likes of

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Speaker 3: the NLC, and have those really positive discussions to try

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Speaker 3: and make sure that you can get the most well,

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Speaker 3: you know, get what's best for everybody.

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Speaker 2: I guess, yeah, look, I think that's right and look

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Speaker 2: to be perfectly frank, there's been a lot of talk

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Speaker 2: for a long time about permit free fishing, registration free fishing.

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Speaker 2: People just want to be able to go where they

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Speaker 2: can go, and there's been a bit of catch up

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Speaker 2: that's had to be happening in the community in terms

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Speaker 2: of coming really understanding and acknowledging that for the last

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Speaker 2: twelve years there's been a law and the Highest Court

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Speaker 2: of Australia that traditional owners own their waters and get

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Speaker 2: to choose the conditions of access. What's really crystallized from

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Speaker 2: most fishes that have been talking to us has been

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Speaker 2: that they want to access the places that they love

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Speaker 2: and they are prepared to engage in conversation negotiation about that,

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Speaker 2: and ultimately I think that puts us in better stead

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Speaker 2: with talking with traditional owners and the NLC of how

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Speaker 2: we might be able to find a brighter future because

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Speaker 2: it's been a bit of a it's been a tough spot,

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Speaker 2: that's for sure.

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Speaker 3: I've just got a question here from gazerin Palmeston. It

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Speaker 3: says are the permits per boat or per per.

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Speaker 2: So the registration is required by each adult, So children

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Speaker 2: fishing with an adult don't require one, but everybody who

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Speaker 2: is an adult on the boat needs needs to go

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Speaker 2: on and register. The registration itself is not an arduous process.

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Speaker 2: There are terms and conditions that people should read and

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Speaker 2: make sure that they're aware of and we would engage,

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Speaker 2: encourage people to engage with them and if they have

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Speaker 2: any queries to direct those to the NLC.

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Speaker 1: But certainly every adult needs one.

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Speaker 3: Well, David Chirovolo CEO, Well, chief executive, Chief Executive, Good

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Speaker 3: on you mate, Always good to catch up with you.

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Speaker 3: I appreciate your time.

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Speaker 1: Thanks Kate, thank you