1 00:00:02,440 --> 00:00:07,800 Speaker 1: Get a. I'm Laala Berry, nutritionist, author, actor, TV presenter, 2 00:00:08,080 --> 00:00:14,080 Speaker 1: and professional oversharer. This podcast is all about celebrating failure 3 00:00:14,600 --> 00:00:17,200 Speaker 1: because I believe it's a chance for us to learn, 4 00:00:17,800 --> 00:00:22,160 Speaker 1: grow and face our blind spots. Each week I'll interview 5 00:00:22,239 --> 00:00:26,160 Speaker 1: a different guest about their highs as well as their lows, 6 00:00:26,200 --> 00:00:34,960 Speaker 1: all in a bid to inspire us to fearlessly fail. Hello. 7 00:00:35,080 --> 00:00:38,000 Speaker 1: Today on the pod, we have somebody that I've been 8 00:00:38,040 --> 00:00:41,879 Speaker 1: trying to get on the pod honestly for about three years. 9 00:00:42,080 --> 00:00:46,959 Speaker 1: Matt Preston, the King of All Things Food. He has 10 00:00:47,040 --> 00:00:50,479 Speaker 1: done fourteen seasons and eleven years of Master Chef. He 11 00:00:50,600 --> 00:00:54,320 Speaker 1: now has brought out Preach was his eighth book or 12 00:00:54,400 --> 00:00:57,000 Speaker 1: ninth book, and it's his memoir. It's called Big Mouth. 13 00:00:57,440 --> 00:00:59,960 Speaker 1: I've been dreader in two and a half days. I cry, 14 00:01:00,400 --> 00:01:04,640 Speaker 1: I laughed. It's an incredible, incredible read. If you want 15 00:01:04,640 --> 00:01:07,440 Speaker 1: to hear a book review, I review it on Friday's 16 00:01:07,480 --> 00:01:09,720 Speaker 1: episode Just Gone on the Friday Diary Pod, and I 17 00:01:09,800 --> 00:01:14,040 Speaker 1: highly recommend it. It's a great crazy for Crimbo. In 18 00:01:14,080 --> 00:01:17,200 Speaker 1: this chat, Matt is just like very open, very honest, 19 00:01:17,360 --> 00:01:22,160 Speaker 1: shares the highs, the lows, you know, and everything between 20 00:01:22,319 --> 00:01:26,160 Speaker 1: a really incredible human and you can see why I've 21 00:01:26,200 --> 00:01:28,440 Speaker 1: been wanting him on the pod for so long. So 22 00:01:29,040 --> 00:01:31,600 Speaker 1: big thank you Matt for saying yes to doing this pod, 23 00:01:31,600 --> 00:01:34,520 Speaker 1: and big thank you Henry for helping make it happen 24 00:01:34,560 --> 00:01:41,120 Speaker 1: as well. Thank you Matt, You're wonderful. Matt Preston. Do 25 00:01:41,160 --> 00:01:44,360 Speaker 1: you know you've been on my dream pod guest list 26 00:01:44,720 --> 00:01:45,640 Speaker 1: for quite some time? 27 00:01:45,880 --> 00:01:47,680 Speaker 2: It must be very low base to get on the. 28 00:01:49,720 --> 00:01:52,280 Speaker 1: Poor Henry, I reckon. I've emailed her over the years. 29 00:01:52,280 --> 00:01:54,960 Speaker 1: I'm like so, but your schedule has been a tricky one, 30 00:01:54,960 --> 00:01:58,040 Speaker 1: and so when I finally was able to get you on, 31 00:01:58,440 --> 00:02:01,240 Speaker 1: I have been so excited, a joy to research. You 32 00:02:01,280 --> 00:02:03,520 Speaker 1: have made you very much. Indeed, can I start with 33 00:02:03,560 --> 00:02:03,920 Speaker 1: the book? 34 00:02:04,080 --> 00:02:05,160 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, of course. 35 00:02:05,560 --> 00:02:09,160 Speaker 1: So I've been read it from beginning to end in 36 00:02:09,280 --> 00:02:10,119 Speaker 1: two and a half. 37 00:02:09,919 --> 00:02:11,560 Speaker 2: Days, only fell asleep five times. 38 00:02:12,120 --> 00:02:14,320 Speaker 1: No, my friend, you had me in tears. 39 00:02:14,520 --> 00:02:16,400 Speaker 2: Oh good, I'm glad. 40 00:02:16,680 --> 00:02:20,640 Speaker 1: I mean that in a really in a really beautiful way. 41 00:02:20,720 --> 00:02:25,400 Speaker 1: But when I was reading the epilogue, yeah, yeah, tlogy, 42 00:02:25,560 --> 00:02:26,960 Speaker 1: I think I think that's one of the things when 43 00:02:26,960 --> 00:02:28,720 Speaker 1: you write a memoir, you want to write it yourself. 44 00:02:28,800 --> 00:02:31,160 Speaker 2: So many times you pick up a memoir and it's 45 00:02:31,160 --> 00:02:34,360 Speaker 2: been written by someone else, and it loses that that 46 00:02:34,480 --> 00:02:37,280 Speaker 2: kind of essential voice. You know, we all, we all 47 00:02:37,320 --> 00:02:40,080 Speaker 2: have a voice that people maybe that I couldn't identify 48 00:02:40,120 --> 00:02:41,639 Speaker 2: what it is, but they can feel it in the 49 00:02:41,720 --> 00:02:44,840 Speaker 2: rhythm of what's being written. And I think you also, 50 00:02:45,280 --> 00:02:47,799 Speaker 2: I think also you're probably more brutal in yourself than 51 00:02:47,840 --> 00:02:50,200 Speaker 2: a than a ghostwriter would be. A ghost writer will 52 00:02:50,440 --> 00:02:53,079 Speaker 2: will it will hit stereotypes and tropes. And I think 53 00:02:53,080 --> 00:02:54,720 Speaker 2: one of the things in the book I found writing 54 00:02:54,760 --> 00:02:58,079 Speaker 2: it is often I'd find myself tumbling down writing it, 55 00:02:58,200 --> 00:03:01,040 Speaker 2: writing a trope about it, a something that had happened 56 00:03:01,080 --> 00:03:03,360 Speaker 2: to me, and go, actually, I really feel like that, 57 00:03:03,400 --> 00:03:05,320 Speaker 2: and he answers, well, no, I didn't, and so I've 58 00:03:05,320 --> 00:03:07,280 Speaker 2: got to rewrite it. So I think that's I think 59 00:03:07,320 --> 00:03:09,000 Speaker 2: that that's been one of the fun things of doing it, 60 00:03:09,080 --> 00:03:11,560 Speaker 2: that the stuff that I thought would be emotional has 61 00:03:11,560 --> 00:03:13,920 Speaker 2: actually been a lot less emotional. But you know, the 62 00:03:13,960 --> 00:03:15,960 Speaker 2: hardest thing for me in the whole book is my mother. 63 00:03:16,040 --> 00:03:18,720 Speaker 2: My brother died w News twenty two of suddenly unexplained 64 00:03:18,720 --> 00:03:20,799 Speaker 2: death through epilepsy, and my mother wrote a letter to 65 00:03:20,840 --> 00:03:26,040 Speaker 2: the papers describing how badly handled that the whole situation 66 00:03:26,120 --> 00:03:29,160 Speaker 2: of the ambulst people coming and the police notifying here 67 00:03:29,200 --> 00:03:32,880 Speaker 2: and how it handle and writing that was hard reading 68 00:03:32,960 --> 00:03:36,960 Speaker 2: it putting in, but then doing the audiobook is a 69 00:03:37,000 --> 00:03:39,760 Speaker 2: whole other level. And I think with all these things, 70 00:03:39,760 --> 00:03:43,280 Speaker 2: saying it out loud is so it's so challenging. We're all, 71 00:03:43,360 --> 00:03:46,200 Speaker 2: you know, we're all used to having on internal dialogue 72 00:03:46,200 --> 00:03:48,800 Speaker 2: and often when we write, we lay down that internal dialogue, 73 00:03:48,800 --> 00:03:50,440 Speaker 2: we don't really hear it other than our own heads. 74 00:03:50,640 --> 00:03:53,800 Speaker 2: When you say it out loud, it becomes somewhat more real, 75 00:03:54,040 --> 00:03:57,440 Speaker 2: and it also gives you some real insight into the 76 00:03:57,440 --> 00:04:00,760 Speaker 2: stuff that you then can then interrogate what it really meant. 77 00:04:00,760 --> 00:04:03,520 Speaker 2: So I found the whole process of writing, you know, 78 00:04:03,640 --> 00:04:05,920 Speaker 2: my sixty two years of my life, which is beautifully 79 00:04:06,480 --> 00:04:11,040 Speaker 2: divided into effectively thirty cent in years in England then 80 00:04:11,080 --> 00:04:13,720 Speaker 2: thirty centen years here, it was the perfect. 81 00:04:13,320 --> 00:04:16,720 Speaker 1: Time to do it well. It was so beautiful and 82 00:04:17,360 --> 00:04:19,479 Speaker 1: I think my favorite bits were where you wrote about 83 00:04:19,760 --> 00:04:23,760 Speaker 1: your mum and your mom's perspective when you just mentioned 84 00:04:23,760 --> 00:04:27,640 Speaker 1: your brother passing away at twenty two, but you through 85 00:04:27,680 --> 00:04:29,920 Speaker 1: the lens of your mother, like when the nurses came 86 00:04:29,920 --> 00:04:31,080 Speaker 1: in with all their paper were in. 87 00:04:31,040 --> 00:04:34,719 Speaker 2: There that the line refrigerate on the back of the papers. 88 00:04:35,080 --> 00:04:37,680 Speaker 2: The first time she realized that my brother was dead 89 00:04:37,760 --> 00:04:40,520 Speaker 2: was when she saw those that blue type. That's that's 90 00:04:40,560 --> 00:04:43,479 Speaker 2: brutally hard. But I think the lovely thing about it 91 00:04:43,520 --> 00:04:46,240 Speaker 2: is that you know, from that that really tough, tough time, 92 00:04:46,680 --> 00:04:49,599 Speaker 2: positive stuff came out that you know, she banded together 93 00:04:49,640 --> 00:04:53,720 Speaker 2: with another four parents who'd lost children from the through epilepsy, 94 00:04:53,760 --> 00:04:56,440 Speaker 2: through which no one really knew about, no one identified about. 95 00:04:56,560 --> 00:04:58,520 Speaker 1: No I did not was a thing. And I'm a nutritionist, 96 00:04:58,520 --> 00:05:00,360 Speaker 1: so I understand what epilepsy. 97 00:04:59,839 --> 00:05:01,880 Speaker 2: Is and that's look and I think that that was 98 00:05:02,080 --> 00:05:05,520 Speaker 2: that was a common issue back then. I think the 99 00:05:05,560 --> 00:05:07,480 Speaker 2: great thing is that they went out and they made 100 00:05:07,520 --> 00:05:10,400 Speaker 2: it their work to one see that people losing children 101 00:05:10,360 --> 00:05:13,800 Speaker 2: with epilepsy understood what had happened too. That then suddet 102 00:05:14,040 --> 00:05:16,839 Speaker 2: was identified as something because it's one of those things 103 00:05:17,040 --> 00:05:20,040 Speaker 2: if you do have epilepsy, you know, by by followed 104 00:05:20,040 --> 00:05:22,800 Speaker 2: by taking medication at the right time, by by not 105 00:05:22,839 --> 00:05:25,159 Speaker 2: getting overly tired. There's a whole range of things you 106 00:05:25,160 --> 00:05:28,640 Speaker 2: can do that dramatically reduce your chances of dying. But 107 00:05:28,720 --> 00:05:30,440 Speaker 2: you know, in this country, we lose one hundred and 108 00:05:30,480 --> 00:05:34,160 Speaker 2: seventy young people from Sudet, which I think you know compares. 109 00:05:34,400 --> 00:05:36,160 Speaker 2: We spend a lot of time talking my cock death, 110 00:05:36,160 --> 00:05:38,560 Speaker 2: which is terrible, but it's in that same can and 111 00:05:38,680 --> 00:05:42,359 Speaker 2: there's no doubt that for me, tragedy resides in a 112 00:05:42,440 --> 00:05:45,360 Speaker 2: generation dying before their parents or their grandparents. That's what 113 00:05:45,440 --> 00:05:47,600 Speaker 2: the real parents. You know. We grow into that idea 114 00:05:47,680 --> 00:05:50,120 Speaker 2: that we lose our we lose our grandparents, and then 115 00:05:50,240 --> 00:05:52,559 Speaker 2: you know, twenty five years thirty that we use our parents, 116 00:05:52,560 --> 00:05:54,280 Speaker 2: and that's sort of the normal rhythm. The moment it 117 00:05:54,279 --> 00:05:56,880 Speaker 2: gets out of that rhythm, it becomes a really painful 118 00:05:56,920 --> 00:05:57,320 Speaker 2: place to be. 119 00:05:57,480 --> 00:06:01,359 Speaker 1: Yeah, I must say, like, and you mentioned this at 120 00:06:01,400 --> 00:06:03,599 Speaker 1: the start, how you like it's felt like your voice 121 00:06:03,680 --> 00:06:06,360 Speaker 1: the whole way through. And I messaged one of my 122 00:06:06,400 --> 00:06:08,760 Speaker 1: best friends last night and I said, oh my god, 123 00:06:08,800 --> 00:06:11,080 Speaker 1: I've just finished Matt Present's book. I said, I'm balling. 124 00:06:11,120 --> 00:06:13,679 Speaker 1: My boyfriend walked in and I was just there, tears 125 00:06:13,760 --> 00:06:16,320 Speaker 1: rolling down my face and he was like, oh boss, 126 00:06:16,320 --> 00:06:20,560 Speaker 1: because I cry quite Yeah, I'm very much absolutely. And 127 00:06:20,640 --> 00:06:22,800 Speaker 1: I messaged my friend. I was like, I've just I said, 128 00:06:22,839 --> 00:06:26,599 Speaker 1: he writes about grief so beautifully. 129 00:06:26,440 --> 00:06:28,240 Speaker 2: I think I think the thing about grief is it 130 00:06:28,240 --> 00:06:29,920 Speaker 2: it's all it's it has to be part of all 131 00:06:29,960 --> 00:06:33,520 Speaker 2: our lives and how you approach it and how you 132 00:06:33,760 --> 00:06:36,960 Speaker 2: approach failing. And obviously the title of this podcast feel 133 00:06:36,960 --> 00:06:40,320 Speaker 2: Listen You're Failing, is it's so important, so much of 134 00:06:40,320 --> 00:06:44,280 Speaker 2: the stuff, so much of the familial pain that all 135 00:06:44,360 --> 00:06:46,160 Speaker 2: families do. And I think that's been the strangest thing 136 00:06:46,160 --> 00:06:50,080 Speaker 2: about writing you know, my my mom's a single mom 137 00:06:50,839 --> 00:06:53,240 Speaker 2: when what we went through with that with my brother, 138 00:06:53,320 --> 00:06:56,480 Speaker 2: all these things you confront you realize that these are 139 00:06:56,560 --> 00:06:59,760 Speaker 2: universal stories that they happen, happen everywhere, and we don't 140 00:06:59,760 --> 00:07:02,600 Speaker 2: talk about them, and they become secrets. You know, they 141 00:07:02,640 --> 00:07:04,840 Speaker 2: become monsters under the bed. We're scared that someone's going 142 00:07:04,880 --> 00:07:07,400 Speaker 2: to find out about it, and it's shame and humiliation, 143 00:07:07,520 --> 00:07:12,240 Speaker 2: all these really really very not very useful emotions. And 144 00:07:12,600 --> 00:07:15,080 Speaker 2: that by by talking about it, I found so many 145 00:07:15,080 --> 00:07:17,720 Speaker 2: people come up and say, oh, this happened to my aunt, 146 00:07:17,880 --> 00:07:21,520 Speaker 2: or my sister did that, or or my best friend 147 00:07:21,520 --> 00:07:23,960 Speaker 2: when I was when I was at school, they passed 148 00:07:23,960 --> 00:07:26,720 Speaker 2: from sidep as well, and you start you start this 149 00:07:26,920 --> 00:07:30,920 Speaker 2: kind of sense of being able to have those conversations 150 00:07:31,200 --> 00:07:34,640 Speaker 2: without the negativity of failing. It's still going to be painful. 151 00:07:34,680 --> 00:07:36,760 Speaker 2: But I think the fact you can talk about it 152 00:07:36,800 --> 00:07:39,840 Speaker 2: makes it makes it sets it into a perspective of 153 00:07:39,880 --> 00:07:42,680 Speaker 2: where you are. And I think my overall feeling after 154 00:07:42,720 --> 00:07:45,400 Speaker 2: writing the book was really want of gratitude because of 155 00:07:45,440 --> 00:07:48,840 Speaker 2: the fact that you know most of the time, most 156 00:07:48,840 --> 00:07:50,400 Speaker 2: of the time, where you are when you end up 157 00:07:50,400 --> 00:07:53,520 Speaker 2: in invariably better You know, there's a small segment of society, 158 00:07:53,560 --> 00:07:55,040 Speaker 2: but that's not the case for so many. If it is, 159 00:07:55,080 --> 00:07:58,400 Speaker 2: and we we tend to we can obsess about those 160 00:07:58,480 --> 00:08:02,080 Speaker 2: those failures in the pastal minagey actually being grateful for 161 00:08:02,320 --> 00:08:05,280 Speaker 2: the amazing successes and the great stuff we've got health 162 00:08:05,400 --> 00:08:08,920 Speaker 2: or family or all those work doing stuff we love. 163 00:08:09,360 --> 00:08:11,360 Speaker 2: They're they're the things we need to take a bit 164 00:08:11,400 --> 00:08:14,080 Speaker 2: more time about rather than worrying about the Christmas turkey. 165 00:08:14,480 --> 00:08:17,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, totally. Can I ask what your sisters thought of 166 00:08:17,400 --> 00:08:17,800 Speaker 1: the book? 167 00:08:18,560 --> 00:08:21,240 Speaker 2: Yeah, they look they were heavily involved in writing about it. 168 00:08:21,280 --> 00:08:23,880 Speaker 2: I relied on them for because I was away for 169 00:08:24,040 --> 00:08:25,760 Speaker 2: so much of you know, I was away at boarding 170 00:08:25,760 --> 00:08:28,440 Speaker 2: school and then then moved here. So I relied on 171 00:08:28,480 --> 00:08:32,160 Speaker 2: them for for for other for other inputs. I think 172 00:08:32,200 --> 00:08:34,920 Speaker 2: they think they were they I haven't had that, I 173 00:08:34,920 --> 00:08:38,800 Speaker 2: haven't had that phone call going I'm very unhappy. So 174 00:08:38,800 --> 00:08:41,280 Speaker 2: so yeah, so so we're we're still talk regularly. So 175 00:08:41,640 --> 00:08:44,000 Speaker 2: I think it's I mean, it is interesting because obviously 176 00:08:44,360 --> 00:08:46,000 Speaker 2: one of the things you write a memoir is you're 177 00:08:46,000 --> 00:08:47,959 Speaker 2: writing your own story, but also you've got it very 178 00:08:48,000 --> 00:08:50,920 Speaker 2: careful about impinging on other people's stories, and that's one 179 00:08:50,960 --> 00:08:53,920 Speaker 2: of the things, like I was quite careful with the book. 180 00:08:54,040 --> 00:08:57,560 Speaker 2: So so you know, my my sister's stories are theirs 181 00:08:57,600 --> 00:09:00,439 Speaker 2: to tell. So where where they intersect with my then 182 00:09:00,440 --> 00:09:01,840 Speaker 2: they feature where they don't. 183 00:09:02,320 --> 00:09:04,320 Speaker 1: It was really it was just really nice the way 184 00:09:04,360 --> 00:09:07,160 Speaker 1: that you it feels like you've honored everybody in your 185 00:09:07,520 --> 00:09:09,080 Speaker 1: life quite beautifully. 186 00:09:09,840 --> 00:09:12,680 Speaker 2: That's already that's alreally interesting insight. Yeah, I think that's 187 00:09:12,720 --> 00:09:14,839 Speaker 2: I think that that's one of the things to do 188 00:09:14,960 --> 00:09:17,160 Speaker 2: is to actually and that's a great thing about writing it. 189 00:09:17,160 --> 00:09:19,560 Speaker 2: When you've been through your life and you have a 190 00:09:19,640 --> 00:09:22,880 Speaker 2: sense of perspective, you're able to go, gee will that 191 00:09:22,960 --> 00:09:25,319 Speaker 2: was that was a problem, but actually overall it was 192 00:09:25,360 --> 00:09:27,840 Speaker 2: fundamentally positive. And I think most of the experiences all 193 00:09:27,880 --> 00:09:31,000 Speaker 2: through my life have always had positive outcomes, even the 194 00:09:31,040 --> 00:09:31,520 Speaker 2: bad ones. 195 00:09:31,600 --> 00:09:34,640 Speaker 1: Yeah, because you grow and learns almost it with yourself 196 00:09:34,720 --> 00:09:38,480 Speaker 1: some awareness. Can I ask about someone that you've coined 197 00:09:38,480 --> 00:09:42,840 Speaker 1: as your third sister, Yes, beautiful Henry. Is it true 198 00:09:42,880 --> 00:09:46,440 Speaker 1: that she was chatting to you about casting format? 199 00:09:47,040 --> 00:09:48,880 Speaker 2: She was? She was the daughter in law of my 200 00:09:49,160 --> 00:09:52,720 Speaker 2: mum's best friends. They both they both both talk KINDI together. 201 00:09:52,760 --> 00:09:55,880 Speaker 2: And when Henry, who was casting expert at that time 202 00:09:55,920 --> 00:10:00,000 Speaker 2: here in Australia, when she was asking for advice chatting out, 203 00:10:00,120 --> 00:10:03,160 Speaker 2: got a cast a food show and and mother in 204 00:10:03,240 --> 00:10:05,040 Speaker 2: law said you should talk to that Matt Preston. So 205 00:10:05,120 --> 00:10:07,960 Speaker 2: I talked to her with advice on on you know, 206 00:10:07,960 --> 00:10:10,000 Speaker 2: I've been running the melbourn Field Wife first, on the 207 00:10:10,000 --> 00:10:12,560 Speaker 2: creative side of that side, I knew and I knew 208 00:10:12,679 --> 00:10:14,400 Speaker 2: kind of who were good performers. So he's had a 209 00:10:14,400 --> 00:10:17,840 Speaker 2: long conversation about that. And then halfway through she she 210 00:10:17,920 --> 00:10:20,360 Speaker 2: asked to see a picture. And because it was they 211 00:10:20,360 --> 00:10:22,120 Speaker 2: were only looking for the originally were only looking for 212 00:10:22,400 --> 00:10:24,240 Speaker 2: two chefs to be judges and a female and a 213 00:10:24,240 --> 00:10:27,360 Speaker 2: female heighs was the theory. And and on the strength 214 00:10:27,360 --> 00:10:29,760 Speaker 2: of the picture, not on my CV, went my CV. 215 00:10:29,840 --> 00:10:33,240 Speaker 2: All they wanted was this disapproving, slightly shabby sheet, look 216 00:10:33,280 --> 00:10:35,280 Speaker 2: at me with a with a bit of material amanet 217 00:10:35,280 --> 00:10:37,959 Speaker 2: and well, that's that's interesting. Look. And the line was 218 00:10:38,000 --> 00:10:40,400 Speaker 2: if I can string a sentence together, they'd write another 219 00:10:40,480 --> 00:10:42,719 Speaker 2: another judge role for me. So that's what happened. I 220 00:10:42,800 --> 00:10:45,360 Speaker 2: ended up with another judge role. And then George and 221 00:10:45,400 --> 00:10:47,559 Speaker 2: Gary ended up being the two chefs, which is how 222 00:10:47,600 --> 00:10:48,120 Speaker 2: cool is that? 223 00:10:48,200 --> 00:10:52,200 Speaker 1: And then cool eleven seasons like you were part of 224 00:10:52,240 --> 00:10:52,559 Speaker 1: one of. 225 00:10:52,520 --> 00:10:53,320 Speaker 2: Those eleven years. 226 00:10:53,400 --> 00:10:56,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, fourteen seasons, fourteen. 227 00:10:56,000 --> 00:11:00,000 Speaker 2: With all the with Junior and all and stuff like that. Yeah, 228 00:11:00,040 --> 00:11:01,880 Speaker 2: it was amazing. I an amazing experience. I mean, I 229 00:11:01,880 --> 00:11:04,400 Speaker 2: mean and only now, only now when you sit back down, 230 00:11:04,559 --> 00:11:06,319 Speaker 2: and I think that's the great thing, when you when 231 00:11:06,360 --> 00:11:08,520 Speaker 2: you when you're not when you note down all the 232 00:11:08,559 --> 00:11:10,760 Speaker 2: things you've done in your life, and that those eleven 233 00:11:10,840 --> 00:11:12,559 Speaker 2: years were so central. They took up a lot of time. 234 00:11:12,600 --> 00:11:15,440 Speaker 2: But we went some amazing places and we got to 235 00:11:15,480 --> 00:11:19,439 Speaker 2: interview some unbelievable place people and shooting, you know, locations 236 00:11:19,480 --> 00:11:21,800 Speaker 2: like like the General Assembly of the un which is 237 00:11:21,840 --> 00:11:24,640 Speaker 2: just insane. You're sitting there, you know, you've grown up 238 00:11:24,640 --> 00:11:26,760 Speaker 2: with seeing all this black and white footage of a 239 00:11:26,880 --> 00:11:29,640 Speaker 2: world leader's thumping tables and suddenly you're standing in the 240 00:11:29,679 --> 00:11:32,319 Speaker 2: podium at the un and I don't I think at 241 00:11:32,320 --> 00:11:34,960 Speaker 2: that point no other TV showed film there. I mean 242 00:11:35,000 --> 00:11:37,760 Speaker 2: one movie shot there. So this is a truly unique experience. 243 00:11:37,800 --> 00:11:40,160 Speaker 2: So we were very lucky with that. That kind of 244 00:11:40,160 --> 00:11:43,240 Speaker 2: global success A mars Chef allowed us to play in 245 00:11:43,280 --> 00:11:45,560 Speaker 2: lots of areas, and because it was such a warm 246 00:11:45,600 --> 00:11:48,920 Speaker 2: and positive show, we got access to amazing talent from 247 00:11:48,920 --> 00:11:51,040 Speaker 2: around the world who wouldn't normally do what would be 248 00:11:51,040 --> 00:11:53,600 Speaker 2: class of the reality show. So whether it's like Jamie Oliver, 249 00:11:53,679 --> 00:11:56,520 Speaker 2: who's still involved in in Master Chef, which is fantastic 250 00:11:56,559 --> 00:12:01,000 Speaker 2: to see we get we got in Heston Massive Jella, 251 00:12:04,040 --> 00:12:08,400 Speaker 2: just just the most amazing cavalcade of culinary brilliant that 252 00:12:09,040 --> 00:12:11,000 Speaker 2: you get to pinch yourself when you're with and you 253 00:12:11,000 --> 00:12:13,040 Speaker 2: get to learn from. It's like it's like it's like 254 00:12:13,160 --> 00:12:15,679 Speaker 2: ringside seats for a great tennis match. It's amazing. 255 00:12:15,960 --> 00:12:17,760 Speaker 1: Well, I feel like I got to be a tiny 256 00:12:17,760 --> 00:12:19,320 Speaker 1: fly on the wall for a little bit of it 257 00:12:19,440 --> 00:12:22,400 Speaker 1: because I would do the food and wine shows and 258 00:12:22,440 --> 00:12:25,200 Speaker 1: the like the heroes of the food and Wine show 259 00:12:25,320 --> 00:12:29,440 Speaker 1: would be these incredible, like you guys and these incredible 260 00:12:29,440 --> 00:12:33,080 Speaker 1: and I'd be like ontour doing the side macro like 261 00:12:33,200 --> 00:12:35,800 Speaker 1: health stage with Toby Paddick and we'd have like the 262 00:12:35,840 --> 00:12:38,920 Speaker 1: little yeah we have like the little health gang. But 263 00:12:39,000 --> 00:12:42,400 Speaker 1: then you know it would be the rock stuff like 264 00:12:42,440 --> 00:12:45,920 Speaker 1: it was like rock star status on the main stage. 265 00:12:45,960 --> 00:12:48,000 Speaker 1: I know, it felt like I felt like I was 266 00:12:48,040 --> 00:12:51,400 Speaker 1: like wow, whether it was like you know, Gary or 267 00:12:51,960 --> 00:12:53,640 Speaker 1: it was pretty huge. 268 00:12:53,360 --> 00:12:57,079 Speaker 2: To the food was crazy, crazy big for that Pero 269 00:12:57,440 --> 00:13:01,720 Speaker 2: was mars Chef rolling for three seasons. Then for season 270 00:13:01,800 --> 00:13:04,880 Speaker 2: four MKR to go over and that was massive for 271 00:13:05,080 --> 00:13:07,520 Speaker 2: our four or five seasons. So so certainly you know, 272 00:13:07,800 --> 00:13:10,520 Speaker 2: the Manu's and all those guys, it was an amazing 273 00:13:10,559 --> 00:13:12,880 Speaker 2: time to talk about food and it had an amazing impact, 274 00:13:13,240 --> 00:13:15,280 Speaker 2: I think on the way Australian's eight, which is brilliant 275 00:13:15,280 --> 00:13:18,439 Speaker 2: because people suddenly thought food is being important. They valued, 276 00:13:18,600 --> 00:13:22,560 Speaker 2: Hopefully those people who take the line's share of the 277 00:13:22,640 --> 00:13:24,959 Speaker 2: work of putting dinner on the table, which is a 278 00:13:25,840 --> 00:13:30,640 Speaker 2: relentless chore. Hopefully it's I mean, I always worry that 279 00:13:30,720 --> 00:13:32,760 Speaker 2: the potentially what we did would actually make it harder 280 00:13:32,760 --> 00:13:34,520 Speaker 2: for them, because they could the old days, they could 281 00:13:34,559 --> 00:13:36,959 Speaker 2: just get away with putting salad and sausage roll and 282 00:13:37,000 --> 00:13:39,199 Speaker 2: a plate, and suddenly the kids are going, oh like 283 00:13:39,240 --> 00:13:42,640 Speaker 2: a risotto, mum yea dad, can you ever carry? Do 284 00:13:42,679 --> 00:13:42,960 Speaker 2: you know what? 285 00:13:43,000 --> 00:13:44,320 Speaker 1: I love that you wrote in the book And it 286 00:13:44,400 --> 00:13:47,520 Speaker 1: was like, hopefully we inspire people not to buy parmesan 287 00:13:47,640 --> 00:13:49,480 Speaker 1: pre ready to err because it smells like vomit. And 288 00:13:49,480 --> 00:13:50,640 Speaker 1: I was like, oh my god, he's. 289 00:13:50,600 --> 00:13:52,640 Speaker 2: Right, and no one does. When was the last time 290 00:13:52,679 --> 00:13:57,480 Speaker 2: you saw shaky parmesan in you? That that that changer, 291 00:13:57,679 --> 00:13:59,640 Speaker 2: that was always you know, in terms of in terms 292 00:13:59,679 --> 00:14:02,280 Speaker 2: of my on my tombstand that all to day we 293 00:14:02,320 --> 00:14:06,040 Speaker 2: stopped we stopped vomity juny cardboard parmesan. And I think 294 00:14:06,040 --> 00:14:08,160 Speaker 2: that I think that that's great and that's you know, 295 00:14:08,200 --> 00:14:10,560 Speaker 2: that's the whole thing about. All you're trying to do 296 00:14:10,640 --> 00:14:14,439 Speaker 2: is give people advice on when when it's worth spending 297 00:14:14,480 --> 00:14:16,360 Speaker 2: a little bit more and when it's when it's worth 298 00:14:16,360 --> 00:14:19,000 Speaker 2: spending less on you know what you're doing that you know, 299 00:14:19,080 --> 00:14:20,920 Speaker 2: good parmesan is going to make a huge different to you, 300 00:14:21,080 --> 00:14:24,480 Speaker 2: to your to your pastor if you're using a microplane, 301 00:14:24,480 --> 00:14:26,640 Speaker 2: so it's lovely and fine you use less. So that's 302 00:14:26,640 --> 00:14:29,480 Speaker 2: a big class and then save your money on some 303 00:14:29,520 --> 00:14:31,160 Speaker 2: of the other stuff you might be spending by a 304 00:14:31,160 --> 00:14:34,120 Speaker 2: little bit less meat and benefit from the parmesan. 305 00:14:34,320 --> 00:14:36,600 Speaker 1: So you're right though, it was a whole movement that 306 00:14:36,840 --> 00:14:38,880 Speaker 1: like swept across. 307 00:14:38,840 --> 00:14:41,000 Speaker 2: And then look, I mean it's important to acknowledge that, 308 00:14:41,080 --> 00:14:44,160 Speaker 2: you know. It starts with Jamie Jamie Oliver having a 309 00:14:44,160 --> 00:14:47,160 Speaker 2: primetime TV show which had a big impact. It starts 310 00:14:47,160 --> 00:14:50,440 Speaker 2: with people like Stephanie Alexander started a Kitchen Garden Foundation 311 00:14:50,480 --> 00:14:53,520 Speaker 2: which I think was ninety ninety three she started talking 312 00:14:53,560 --> 00:14:57,120 Speaker 2: about it. It starts with all those amazing and they're 313 00:14:57,160 --> 00:15:01,960 Speaker 2: fundamentally women, but influential women like Valley Little Jill do Play, 314 00:15:02,080 --> 00:15:06,800 Speaker 2: Michelle Southern, Dona Hay. You know, suddenly saying food doesn't 315 00:15:06,840 --> 00:15:08,760 Speaker 2: need to be the realm of chefs. It's the realm 316 00:15:08,760 --> 00:15:10,520 Speaker 2: of people who cook for their family and who want 317 00:15:10,560 --> 00:15:14,040 Speaker 2: to know how to cook in fifteen minutes or less, 318 00:15:14,080 --> 00:15:16,920 Speaker 2: something tasty that the kids will actually eat, not push 319 00:15:16,960 --> 00:15:17,560 Speaker 2: around the plate. 320 00:15:17,840 --> 00:15:20,720 Speaker 1: Yeah, big time, big time. I love there's this bit 321 00:15:20,760 --> 00:15:23,960 Speaker 1: where you talked about you had these three goals, and 322 00:15:24,440 --> 00:15:26,960 Speaker 1: one was to go to the logis yes tick Yes, 323 00:15:27,400 --> 00:15:28,960 Speaker 1: appear on Live Yes? 324 00:15:29,200 --> 00:15:29,920 Speaker 2: Is that tick? 325 00:15:30,120 --> 00:15:34,080 Speaker 1: And wasn't like k Rod and Boor out there the 326 00:15:34,120 --> 00:15:34,640 Speaker 1: same night. 327 00:15:34,760 --> 00:15:37,480 Speaker 2: It was, Yeah, it was, it was it was the 328 00:15:37,520 --> 00:15:41,880 Speaker 2: other it was the it was the rather more challenging 329 00:15:43,080 --> 00:15:49,240 Speaker 2: German Austrian fashion commentator. Oh god, so it was Sasha 330 00:15:49,280 --> 00:15:51,600 Speaker 2: Baron Kern in that character which was amazing where which 331 00:15:51,680 --> 00:15:56,840 Speaker 2: ended up? So it was not Alergy it was Bruno. No, yeah, yeah, 332 00:15:56,840 --> 00:16:00,320 Speaker 2: it was Bruno and Bruno obviously brought in a two 333 00:16:00,520 --> 00:16:05,360 Speaker 2: knitted naked suits, one for fully anatomically correct no no 334 00:16:05,560 --> 00:16:09,560 Speaker 2: ken bulge there, and that that segment ended with them 335 00:16:09,560 --> 00:16:13,600 Speaker 2: both standing there in knitted nude suits on stage, which 336 00:16:13,640 --> 00:16:15,360 Speaker 2: is which is truly bizarre. You know. That's and then 337 00:16:15,440 --> 00:16:18,160 Speaker 2: this whole experience of being in a TV studio. I 338 00:16:18,200 --> 00:16:20,920 Speaker 2: think my entourage was one person there was you know, 339 00:16:21,200 --> 00:16:24,640 Speaker 2: Kevin Rabb was PM, so he had security. Coming to 340 00:16:25,880 --> 00:16:29,120 Speaker 2: Bruno's on trage is even bigger. So we're like we 341 00:16:29,120 --> 00:16:31,280 Speaker 2: look out there's like wow, there's like there's like forty 342 00:16:31,280 --> 00:16:35,520 Speaker 2: people see that. That that's really famous. And I think 343 00:16:35,560 --> 00:16:37,560 Speaker 2: that that's one of the things that that you know, 344 00:16:37,760 --> 00:16:41,360 Speaker 2: we we've always been really lucky with with mastership. I 345 00:16:41,400 --> 00:16:44,400 Speaker 2: think Marscheff made is familiar rather than famous. So so 346 00:16:44,440 --> 00:16:47,560 Speaker 2: it's much more. It's a very comfortable situation where people 347 00:16:47,560 --> 00:16:49,160 Speaker 2: just say, like you in the street in morning, Matt, 348 00:16:49,240 --> 00:16:51,760 Speaker 2: It's it's a it's a really lovely it's a lovely 349 00:16:51,800 --> 00:16:54,600 Speaker 2: relationship we've had because again it's never been it was 350 00:16:54,640 --> 00:16:57,840 Speaker 2: never provocative. People in veriably wanted to share a picture 351 00:16:57,840 --> 00:17:01,560 Speaker 2: of pavelover they've made and and that that kind of 352 00:17:01,560 --> 00:17:04,440 Speaker 2: familiarity is a much more comfortable place for me than 353 00:17:04,840 --> 00:17:07,680 Speaker 2: than you know, the whole concept of fame, which is 354 00:17:07,760 --> 00:17:09,399 Speaker 2: kind of scary. We get a bit of that in 355 00:17:09,400 --> 00:17:12,680 Speaker 2: India when the show was peaking there. That was kind 356 00:17:12,680 --> 00:17:15,680 Speaker 2: of screaming in the streets and pushing crowds and crushing 357 00:17:15,720 --> 00:17:18,320 Speaker 2: and you know, kids being thrust at you and. 358 00:17:18,480 --> 00:17:21,600 Speaker 1: Yeah like your biggest fand three months old exactly. 359 00:17:21,840 --> 00:17:24,040 Speaker 2: You know the one. Yeah so so that so that 360 00:17:24,160 --> 00:17:26,720 Speaker 2: and I think that's uh, that's when when you see 361 00:17:26,760 --> 00:17:29,359 Speaker 2: that side of it, that that doesn't resonate. It's lovely 362 00:17:29,400 --> 00:17:31,600 Speaker 2: to be known in other in other places when you 363 00:17:31,640 --> 00:17:34,480 Speaker 2: make a show effect in a shed near the racecourse 364 00:17:34,520 --> 00:17:37,560 Speaker 2: outside Melbourne. But but but it's much more natural when 365 00:17:37,560 --> 00:17:40,040 Speaker 2: you bump into people at a train station in Italy, 366 00:17:40,320 --> 00:17:42,000 Speaker 2: or you know, and they come up and they that 367 00:17:42,160 --> 00:17:45,200 Speaker 2: they generally have a high How are you like the show? Yes, 368 00:17:45,320 --> 00:17:48,359 Speaker 2: I you know you you came and filmed at this place. 369 00:17:48,520 --> 00:17:51,440 Speaker 2: My sister was there, and that that sort of interaction 370 00:17:51,520 --> 00:17:54,240 Speaker 2: is a real coup because invariably ends with them either 371 00:17:54,359 --> 00:17:56,800 Speaker 2: giving you a recipe or telling you somewhere good they've eaten. 372 00:17:56,960 --> 00:18:01,240 Speaker 2: So win. When there's there's my upsett. The cost is 373 00:18:01,240 --> 00:18:05,080 Speaker 2: a photograph. The result is information local. 374 00:18:04,800 --> 00:18:08,400 Speaker 1: Tip I have to The third one was guest on neighbors. 375 00:18:08,400 --> 00:18:11,480 Speaker 1: Now I deep dive and found your namebors, your dad? 376 00:18:11,520 --> 00:18:13,879 Speaker 1: Was that so much fun? So much judging the baker, 377 00:18:14,040 --> 00:18:14,640 Speaker 1: so much fun? 378 00:18:14,680 --> 00:18:17,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, it was great, just because you know, having having 379 00:18:17,080 --> 00:18:18,760 Speaker 2: come to Australia to write about neighbors on the home 380 00:18:18,800 --> 00:18:21,199 Speaker 2: in a way right, to suddenly find myself on and 381 00:18:21,240 --> 00:18:22,800 Speaker 2: I knew this to set well, because I've been out 382 00:18:22,800 --> 00:18:25,320 Speaker 2: there to interview a lot of the stars over the years, 383 00:18:25,600 --> 00:18:27,760 Speaker 2: but this was from ninety three to ninety eight. But 384 00:18:27,800 --> 00:18:30,240 Speaker 2: then you know, I'm thirtieth of Earth three to be 385 00:18:30,320 --> 00:18:33,840 Speaker 2: there and do a scene with the legend that is 386 00:18:33,880 --> 00:18:34,520 Speaker 2: doctor Carl. 387 00:18:34,359 --> 00:18:37,680 Speaker 1: Kennedy, right, was what a legend in real life and a. 388 00:18:37,640 --> 00:18:40,800 Speaker 2: Legend in real life and a beautiful human and to 389 00:18:40,840 --> 00:18:43,400 Speaker 2: do the same thing was was great fun. And playing myself, 390 00:18:43,440 --> 00:18:45,280 Speaker 2: you know, I mean I always jo I'm no actor, 391 00:18:45,640 --> 00:18:48,040 Speaker 2: but but but it was. It was just great fun 392 00:18:48,119 --> 00:18:50,320 Speaker 2: to play with him and he was it was a 393 00:18:50,359 --> 00:18:51,440 Speaker 2: really special man. 394 00:18:51,480 --> 00:18:54,200 Speaker 1: And my mom was yourself. 395 00:18:54,320 --> 00:18:56,520 Speaker 2: My mum was very excited by that. That my mum 396 00:18:56,520 --> 00:18:58,800 Speaker 2: being the woman that when I was nominated for Best 397 00:18:58,840 --> 00:19:01,360 Speaker 2: New Chalent Logan, she she voted for a famous home 398 00:19:01,400 --> 00:19:04,160 Speaker 2: famous home and away actor who eventually won ended up willing. 399 00:19:04,400 --> 00:19:06,800 Speaker 2: How can you vote for him? He's very good looking, 400 00:19:06,840 --> 00:19:09,560 Speaker 2: he's very good, but I'm your son. Nobody's still very 401 00:19:09,600 --> 00:19:12,080 Speaker 2: very good. It was value with him. It's like, g Mum, 402 00:19:12,080 --> 00:19:12,760 Speaker 2: that's not very loyal. 403 00:19:13,000 --> 00:19:15,040 Speaker 1: So you being on neighbors would have been like the 404 00:19:15,040 --> 00:19:16,240 Speaker 1: holy grail for your mom. 405 00:19:16,720 --> 00:19:18,880 Speaker 2: It was you know, it's always it's always important. It's 406 00:19:18,880 --> 00:19:21,159 Speaker 2: always hard to impress some others and my mum was 407 00:19:21,160 --> 00:19:23,800 Speaker 2: one of those ones, and for that moment it was 408 00:19:24,119 --> 00:19:25,000 Speaker 2: she was impressed. 409 00:19:25,359 --> 00:19:28,040 Speaker 1: I love it. I love it, and I love the 410 00:19:28,040 --> 00:19:31,600 Speaker 1: way that you wrote about her being obsessed with this 411 00:19:31,680 --> 00:19:33,159 Speaker 1: shows it's strictly come dancing. 412 00:19:33,600 --> 00:19:38,800 Speaker 2: Yeah. So the UK version, the UK Strictly Strictly as 413 00:19:38,840 --> 00:19:41,280 Speaker 2: the UK version of Dancing with the Stars. And so 414 00:19:41,320 --> 00:19:43,159 Speaker 2: the last thing that you know, she slipped away with 415 00:19:43,280 --> 00:19:47,080 Speaker 2: kind of dementia and Parkinson's and myeloma. But the last 416 00:19:47,119 --> 00:19:49,520 Speaker 2: thing she kind of the last great grasp and reality 417 00:19:49,560 --> 00:19:52,040 Speaker 2: in the verted commas was watching the finale of season 418 00:19:52,040 --> 00:19:55,639 Speaker 2: twentieth Strictly in the UK. And then after she died 419 00:19:56,200 --> 00:19:58,560 Speaker 2: two months later, I get the phone call saying do 420 00:19:58,560 --> 00:19:59,879 Speaker 2: you want to you want to have croo crack at 421 00:20:00,200 --> 00:20:02,880 Speaker 2: with the stars? It was like, this feels like it's ordained. 422 00:20:05,160 --> 00:20:07,720 Speaker 2: That's right. My mum is pulling the strings from up above. 423 00:20:08,040 --> 00:20:10,520 Speaker 2: And you know, you know, normally you think, oh that's 424 00:20:10,560 --> 00:20:12,320 Speaker 2: your lovely of your mother, you know, making sure you've 425 00:20:12,320 --> 00:20:15,159 Speaker 2: got some work. But I undad knew my mother was 426 00:20:15,200 --> 00:20:17,720 Speaker 2: only doing it so she'd have something to laugh laugh 427 00:20:17,840 --> 00:20:19,960 Speaker 2: up from up there or down there wherever she was. 428 00:20:20,160 --> 00:20:22,639 Speaker 1: I can't believe that you've had the courage to do 429 00:20:22,760 --> 00:20:25,159 Speaker 1: both dancing and the Stars and marks singer. 430 00:20:25,440 --> 00:20:26,800 Speaker 2: I think that's I think that that's one of the 431 00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:28,399 Speaker 2: great things when you get older, you know again and 432 00:20:28,480 --> 00:20:31,560 Speaker 2: we go back to this concept of failure and humiliation, 433 00:20:31,920 --> 00:20:34,480 Speaker 2: which is I think underpinned so many So much of 434 00:20:34,560 --> 00:20:38,119 Speaker 2: what we're talking about about generally is and when you 435 00:20:38,160 --> 00:20:41,880 Speaker 2: actually analyze what you shine a light on it, it's like, what, 436 00:20:41,880 --> 00:20:44,000 Speaker 2: what's the worst that can happen? You're not very good 437 00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:45,560 Speaker 2: at dancing, you're not really good at seeing, but you're 438 00:20:45,600 --> 00:20:47,160 Speaker 2: not really good at dancing. You're not really good at seeing. 439 00:20:47,200 --> 00:20:50,080 Speaker 2: So it's only reality. So people can't say anything that 440 00:20:50,840 --> 00:20:54,920 Speaker 2: really hurts you in that situation. And I really enjoyed it. 441 00:20:55,000 --> 00:20:58,119 Speaker 2: I was dancing with my dance pass of Jess Raffa. 442 00:20:58,119 --> 00:20:59,480 Speaker 2: I've been training with her twice a week. 443 00:21:00,080 --> 00:21:01,400 Speaker 1: All the TikTok I was, I. 444 00:21:01,320 --> 00:21:02,760 Speaker 2: Was with it. I was with her this morning and 445 00:21:02,960 --> 00:21:06,440 Speaker 2: the studio doing some jarring together because because I loved 446 00:21:06,480 --> 00:21:08,200 Speaker 2: it and it's and it's a beautiful way of keeping 447 00:21:08,280 --> 00:21:10,760 Speaker 2: fit and so so like I think, I think you've 448 00:21:10,800 --> 00:21:12,760 Speaker 2: got to you've got to do stuff as you get older, 449 00:21:12,840 --> 00:21:14,560 Speaker 2: do stuff that takes you outside of your comfort zone 450 00:21:14,600 --> 00:21:17,600 Speaker 2: and acknowledge this idea that you don't need to be 451 00:21:17,640 --> 00:21:19,760 Speaker 2: great at something to love it. And I think this 452 00:21:19,920 --> 00:21:22,240 Speaker 2: is a it's a weird thing because like, oh, I 453 00:21:22,280 --> 00:21:23,800 Speaker 2: wouldn't be very good at that, but that doesn't matter. 454 00:21:23,800 --> 00:21:26,080 Speaker 2: What if you enjoy it? Oh, well that's okay. Well 455 00:21:26,080 --> 00:21:28,879 Speaker 2: then in which case there's the positive. And you know, 456 00:21:29,440 --> 00:21:31,879 Speaker 2: you look at people. Some people don't get it and 457 00:21:31,880 --> 00:21:33,840 Speaker 2: you say, well, do you play golf? Yes, you're any good? No? 458 00:21:33,920 --> 00:21:35,479 Speaker 2: Will you ever play in the Australia? No? But no, 459 00:21:36,400 --> 00:21:38,600 Speaker 2: But do you I love it? So you're really bad 460 00:21:38,600 --> 00:21:40,639 Speaker 2: at it, but you love it, And that's okay, you do. 461 00:21:40,960 --> 00:21:42,560 Speaker 2: You don't need to be great at something to have 462 00:21:42,600 --> 00:21:43,399 Speaker 2: great joy at it. 463 00:21:43,600 --> 00:21:45,919 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's such a good I never I'm a bit 464 00:21:45,960 --> 00:21:48,520 Speaker 1: of the perfectionist type. Oh no, I must, that's right. 465 00:21:48,600 --> 00:21:50,280 Speaker 2: I mean I think that's I think that's so. And 466 00:21:50,320 --> 00:21:52,280 Speaker 2: I think that you know, obviously you're going to work 467 00:21:52,320 --> 00:21:54,520 Speaker 2: hard at it, and you're going to pay attention and 468 00:21:54,520 --> 00:21:56,360 Speaker 2: you're going to give it a good shot. But but 469 00:21:56,480 --> 00:22:00,000 Speaker 2: you know, it's you're not You're not. You're probably never 470 00:22:00,119 --> 00:22:03,480 Speaker 2: going to scale the everest that actually doing something really 471 00:22:03,480 --> 00:22:05,600 Speaker 2: well is to a level where you know, I'm swinging 472 00:22:05,680 --> 00:22:08,359 Speaker 2: the Masters or something like that. But just to be 473 00:22:08,359 --> 00:22:10,720 Speaker 2: able to do things a bit better, and that small hill, 474 00:22:10,800 --> 00:22:13,800 Speaker 2: it's exciting. Yeah, you know when when when you when 475 00:22:13,800 --> 00:22:15,360 Speaker 2: you climb up a small hill and you're not really 476 00:22:15,359 --> 00:22:16,959 Speaker 2: good at stuff. It's like wow, the wow, look how 477 00:22:16,960 --> 00:22:17,480 Speaker 2: far I've come? 478 00:22:17,560 --> 00:22:20,720 Speaker 1: And that's I loved your final song, the Monkey's song 479 00:22:21,320 --> 00:22:23,960 Speaker 1: dream Believer, What a great song that was My childhood 480 00:22:24,480 --> 00:22:26,560 Speaker 1: mum used to have that one on reef, that album 481 00:22:26,600 --> 00:22:26,960 Speaker 1: on reef. 482 00:22:27,160 --> 00:22:29,280 Speaker 2: Davy Davy Jones used to drink in the local pub, 483 00:22:29,640 --> 00:22:31,280 Speaker 2: the local pub that used to go to when I 484 00:22:31,320 --> 00:22:34,000 Speaker 2: was growing up, Davy Jones on one side of the bar, 485 00:22:34,119 --> 00:22:36,360 Speaker 2: top Ahead and drummer from the Clash on the other. No, 486 00:22:36,600 --> 00:22:38,520 Speaker 2: it was like it was like your two signs of 487 00:22:38,560 --> 00:22:41,320 Speaker 2: youth in the same place and the most want the 488 00:22:41,359 --> 00:22:44,840 Speaker 2: monkeys in the class does work together. 489 00:22:45,200 --> 00:22:48,000 Speaker 1: Oh, there are so many questions I've got for you. 490 00:22:48,119 --> 00:22:51,359 Speaker 1: I love that you included in the book these report cards. 491 00:22:51,480 --> 00:22:54,560 Speaker 1: As I wrote one of them down, he can be 492 00:22:54,640 --> 00:22:56,880 Speaker 1: good when he wants to be, but when he doesn't 493 00:22:56,960 --> 00:23:00,240 Speaker 1: he can be awful. I do hope that he will 494 00:23:00,240 --> 00:23:03,520 Speaker 1: make up his mind to do justice to himself. That 495 00:23:03,680 --> 00:23:04,399 Speaker 1: was kind of brutal. 496 00:23:04,840 --> 00:23:06,760 Speaker 2: I mean old fashioned report cars, you know the old 497 00:23:06,840 --> 00:23:08,720 Speaker 2: nowadays where you just you know, you click one of 498 00:23:08,760 --> 00:23:14,000 Speaker 2: five comments and stelf generates at Chatchy Pier Chatchy. It 499 00:23:14,280 --> 00:23:17,840 Speaker 2: just it wasn't like that. They they unleashed and I 500 00:23:17,840 --> 00:23:19,280 Speaker 2: thought I was quite good at school. I have this 501 00:23:19,359 --> 00:23:22,240 Speaker 2: memory been quite good at school. And I was quickly 502 00:23:22,320 --> 00:23:26,040 Speaker 2: disabused of that notion by the my mother had reports 503 00:23:26,119 --> 00:23:28,520 Speaker 2: going back to when I was five and going onwards, 504 00:23:28,520 --> 00:23:33,120 Speaker 2: and strangely, you know, talks too much, is distracting all 505 00:23:33,160 --> 00:23:37,320 Speaker 2: these things. Yeah that's right, all those stuff, all that 506 00:23:37,359 --> 00:23:39,240 Speaker 2: stuff comes out and you go, okay, well, you know 507 00:23:39,320 --> 00:23:42,320 Speaker 2: the who I was then is still very much who 508 00:23:42,320 --> 00:23:42,800 Speaker 2: I am now. 509 00:23:43,320 --> 00:23:45,280 Speaker 1: I've got to say when I told my mate yesterday, 510 00:23:45,320 --> 00:23:46,840 Speaker 1: I was like, You've got to read this book. I said, 511 00:23:46,880 --> 00:23:50,480 Speaker 1: it's incredible. I've been crying, I've laughed. And she said, 512 00:23:50,520 --> 00:23:53,239 Speaker 1: but isn't it isn't it food based? And I was like, 513 00:23:53,640 --> 00:23:56,520 Speaker 1: there is this incredible section about what the cake says 514 00:23:56,560 --> 00:23:59,159 Speaker 1: about you. Can I tell you which cake I am? 515 00:23:59,600 --> 00:24:04,000 Speaker 1: Cake will be surprised. Yeah, lumberjack, I love me a 516 00:24:04,040 --> 00:24:05,359 Speaker 1: lumberjack or a hummingbird? 517 00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:10,720 Speaker 2: Oh my, and and what and it's all invariably and 518 00:24:10,840 --> 00:24:13,639 Speaker 2: very reach that trading bloke it comes into. Is that 519 00:24:13,720 --> 00:24:15,960 Speaker 2: not the thing that that's interesting? I would have I 520 00:24:16,000 --> 00:24:17,720 Speaker 2: would have had you. I would have had you more 521 00:24:17,800 --> 00:24:18,560 Speaker 2: down in that. 522 00:24:18,359 --> 00:24:20,400 Speaker 1: That character I thought, you want to guess me is, Look, 523 00:24:20,480 --> 00:24:22,440 Speaker 1: I'm never going to say no to a good character. 524 00:24:22,280 --> 00:24:25,480 Speaker 2: Because Karen Caken Lumber their kind of brother and sister. Yeah, 525 00:24:26,119 --> 00:24:28,600 Speaker 2: there's there's there's food in there, but and but bad food, 526 00:24:28,640 --> 00:24:31,720 Speaker 2: good food because obviously that's a hungry child, greedy child. 527 00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:33,879 Speaker 2: It has to be in there. But I've written, you know, 528 00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:35,720 Speaker 2: the last book was a history of effectually the history 529 00:24:35,720 --> 00:24:38,640 Speaker 2: of food, so I've kind of done that deep dive, 530 00:24:38,800 --> 00:24:41,560 Speaker 2: serious dive into food as a recipe book. So it 531 00:24:41,640 --> 00:24:44,240 Speaker 2: was nice to to not have recipes and to just 532 00:24:44,560 --> 00:24:47,520 Speaker 2: and to just also flag those kind of moments of 533 00:24:47,640 --> 00:24:50,520 Speaker 2: you know, there's there's so many terrible and this is 534 00:24:50,560 --> 00:24:54,200 Speaker 2: this trope thing. You know, read any interview with a 535 00:24:54,320 --> 00:24:56,000 Speaker 2: with a chef or listen to any interview in the 536 00:24:56,040 --> 00:24:58,760 Speaker 2: chef they learned from the grandmother, and you go, but 537 00:24:58,760 --> 00:25:01,080 Speaker 2: what is that you learned PHAs dust from your grandmother? 538 00:25:01,119 --> 00:25:01,760 Speaker 1: I don't think so. 539 00:25:03,240 --> 00:25:05,520 Speaker 2: Or my first memory was, you know, the first memories 540 00:25:05,560 --> 00:25:08,800 Speaker 2: of a is of a tomatoes fresh from the greenhouse, 541 00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:11,560 Speaker 2: warm on one side, where the sun's hit it during 542 00:25:11,560 --> 00:25:14,520 Speaker 2: the afternoon, and it's like very romantic when you go, well, 543 00:25:14,560 --> 00:25:16,760 Speaker 2: actually is it really and you go. In my case, no, 544 00:25:16,840 --> 00:25:18,720 Speaker 2: it was a terrible nooga bar that I was obsessed 545 00:25:18,760 --> 00:25:22,399 Speaker 2: with and saved my pocket money for and then found extremely, 546 00:25:22,600 --> 00:25:25,880 Speaker 2: extremely disappointing. It's just a noga bar because it had 547 00:25:25,880 --> 00:25:28,399 Speaker 2: a cartoon character. From the outside. You connected it is 548 00:25:28,440 --> 00:25:30,480 Speaker 2: connected to a soccer World Cup, and I was like, wow, 549 00:25:30,520 --> 00:25:32,360 Speaker 2: I need to have that. I have that, that kind 550 00:25:32,359 --> 00:25:34,120 Speaker 2: of desire to own possession. 551 00:25:34,119 --> 00:25:35,960 Speaker 1: You know what? This book made me want to have 552 00:25:36,040 --> 00:25:38,000 Speaker 1: treat or pie because I lived in London for a 553 00:25:38,000 --> 00:25:41,960 Speaker 1: little bit and past all the baker like the pie. 554 00:25:42,480 --> 00:25:45,600 Speaker 2: I'm excited because treacle pie, bread crumbs, bread crumbs, treek 555 00:25:45,680 --> 00:25:48,040 Speaker 2: or butter in a pie crust. Super cheap, you know, 556 00:25:48,160 --> 00:25:50,240 Speaker 2: real real kind of you know, a real kind of 557 00:25:50,480 --> 00:25:52,880 Speaker 2: Depression era of food. But I've just come back from 558 00:25:52,920 --> 00:25:54,760 Speaker 2: India and one of the one of the distric we 559 00:25:54,800 --> 00:25:56,440 Speaker 2: did was a carrot dish Indian and we used to 560 00:25:56,760 --> 00:25:59,600 Speaker 2: we used like candied carrot threads, like like an Indian 561 00:25:59,640 --> 00:26:02,480 Speaker 2: carrot with lots of cardival and one of the people 562 00:26:02,480 --> 00:26:04,880 Speaker 2: who is working with us out there went, oh, when 563 00:26:04,920 --> 00:26:07,840 Speaker 2: I was cooking at this Indian restaurant in London, we 564 00:26:07,960 --> 00:26:12,560 Speaker 2: used to make a treacle tar with golden golden syrup, 565 00:26:13,040 --> 00:26:15,879 Speaker 2: red crumbs and and this carrot harvest. So it was 566 00:26:15,920 --> 00:26:19,760 Speaker 2: like a carrot candied carrot treacle tar. It's like, how 567 00:26:19,840 --> 00:26:20,080 Speaker 2: do you. 568 00:26:20,400 --> 00:26:22,359 Speaker 1: Sign me up? Can I say I saw you this 569 00:26:22,400 --> 00:26:24,680 Speaker 1: morning post fruit mince pie with bacon? 570 00:26:24,760 --> 00:26:25,119 Speaker 2: Why not? 571 00:26:25,760 --> 00:26:29,240 Speaker 1: I'm here for it now. I'm a fruit since fine nerd, 572 00:26:29,280 --> 00:26:30,960 Speaker 1: but I was here for it. 573 00:26:31,119 --> 00:26:34,280 Speaker 2: Mince in the fifteen sixteenth century was made with meat, 574 00:26:34,320 --> 00:26:36,320 Speaker 2: you know, regimented meat, meat and fruit. That was the 575 00:26:36,320 --> 00:26:38,160 Speaker 2: whole idea. That's what it's called mince meat. In fact, 576 00:26:38,720 --> 00:26:40,679 Speaker 2: there were lots of you know, the original blamonges. You know, 577 00:26:40,680 --> 00:26:43,080 Speaker 2: there's kind of desserts or made with pounded chicken breast 578 00:26:43,160 --> 00:26:45,159 Speaker 2: to give it body. And you can still find that 579 00:26:45,200 --> 00:26:48,840 Speaker 2: in certain caries in Istanbul. And that's again another medieval recipe. 580 00:26:48,960 --> 00:26:51,720 Speaker 2: But yeah, I'm a big fan. Look that that combination 581 00:26:52,119 --> 00:26:54,320 Speaker 2: when you're thinking about flavors and you're thinking about what 582 00:26:54,359 --> 00:26:58,040 Speaker 2: we like with flavors, that combination of sweet and spicy, 583 00:26:58,400 --> 00:27:01,280 Speaker 2: whether it's a mince pie or whether it's a cot 584 00:27:01,359 --> 00:27:05,440 Speaker 2: cross bun. Yeah, baking goes really well. Sign me bacon 585 00:27:05,480 --> 00:27:07,720 Speaker 2: goes read little bit of marmalade. As well in that 586 00:27:07,800 --> 00:27:12,760 Speaker 2: hot cross bun with your baker. I'm probably particular, but again, 587 00:27:12,800 --> 00:27:14,760 Speaker 2: but it doesn't you know that whole thing about that 588 00:27:14,800 --> 00:27:18,000 Speaker 2: whole thing about sweet and salt. Yeah, sweet salt fat 589 00:27:18,080 --> 00:27:21,080 Speaker 2: is a divine combination. That that's what all those things have. 590 00:27:21,760 --> 00:27:24,000 Speaker 1: I have to say. Another thing that I loved reading 591 00:27:24,000 --> 00:27:27,159 Speaker 1: about in the book was I because my memories of you. 592 00:27:27,280 --> 00:27:29,160 Speaker 1: I was also with Pam Mack for quite a while, 593 00:27:29,160 --> 00:27:31,200 Speaker 1: and so I'd be in having meetings for like book 594 00:27:31,240 --> 00:27:34,159 Speaker 1: covers and whatnot in beautiful Mary's office, and there'd be 595 00:27:34,200 --> 00:27:36,840 Speaker 1: your mug on like three or four different versions of 596 00:27:36,880 --> 00:27:40,200 Speaker 1: your possible covers, and I remember, I'd always think when 597 00:27:40,720 --> 00:27:42,200 Speaker 1: Christmas time, I'm like, I don't want to bring a 598 00:27:42,240 --> 00:27:45,119 Speaker 1: book out at Christmas. I'm against Matt Preston and Jamie Oliver. 599 00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:48,560 Speaker 1: I always, I'd always, and I'm like, everyone's. 600 00:27:48,160 --> 00:27:52,200 Speaker 2: Going to those covers were not mic May because I'm 601 00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:55,640 Speaker 2: a I hate I hate that. Again. There's here's another 602 00:27:55,680 --> 00:27:58,880 Speaker 2: trope that on the cover, it's a it's a picture 603 00:27:59,000 --> 00:28:01,880 Speaker 2: of the all the going You've surprised me, and I've 604 00:28:01,920 --> 00:28:04,159 Speaker 2: bade you've surprised me, and I've made this and you're 605 00:28:04,200 --> 00:28:06,719 Speaker 2: holding a plate and it's like hello, it's say, well, 606 00:28:06,800 --> 00:28:10,280 Speaker 2: that's ridiculous. So on the cover of my third book, 607 00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:12,240 Speaker 2: I wanted to have a picture of a Pavelo, really 608 00:28:12,240 --> 00:28:15,280 Speaker 2: big pavlo and my eyes, my eyes just popping over 609 00:28:15,359 --> 00:28:17,879 Speaker 2: the top of it. Yeah, that's right. And and and 610 00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:20,280 Speaker 2: we were debating the title. They went, you can't have 611 00:28:20,400 --> 00:28:22,440 Speaker 2: that cover because that's the sort of cover you have 612 00:28:22,560 --> 00:28:25,000 Speaker 2: on a memoir. You've got to be holding a plate 613 00:28:25,080 --> 00:28:28,119 Speaker 2: looking surprised at someone support in the kitchen. That that 614 00:28:28,359 --> 00:28:31,040 Speaker 2: that's what everyone has. And so the reason why the 615 00:28:31,040 --> 00:28:33,560 Speaker 2: book is called cookbook was to make it very clear 616 00:28:33,640 --> 00:28:36,200 Speaker 2: to people that it was a cookbook and not a memoir. 617 00:28:36,320 --> 00:28:38,200 Speaker 2: And then that's how I got away with having the 618 00:28:38,360 --> 00:28:43,280 Speaker 2: I mean, I love it. How good is genius? 619 00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:47,960 Speaker 1: Can I say the cover of Big Mouth beautiful? 620 00:28:48,120 --> 00:28:51,000 Speaker 2: Julian Kingma is the most amazing photographer and you're big 621 00:28:51,080 --> 00:28:53,920 Speaker 2: bluey lighting. Always find a photographer can light you, and 622 00:28:54,360 --> 00:28:57,760 Speaker 2: that that's it. That's I love this light. Lighting. Lighting 623 00:28:57,880 --> 00:28:59,440 Speaker 2: is the art. And Julian is one of the best 624 00:28:59,480 --> 00:29:02,560 Speaker 2: photographer as ports photographers in Australia. He's marvelous. I've worked 625 00:29:02,560 --> 00:29:04,040 Speaker 2: with a couple of times before when I walked in 626 00:29:04,160 --> 00:29:06,080 Speaker 2: he was taking the picture. I was I would have 627 00:29:06,120 --> 00:29:07,280 Speaker 2: an absolute it's. 628 00:29:07,120 --> 00:29:09,880 Speaker 1: A hurler of a cup like and it feels the 629 00:29:09,960 --> 00:29:12,800 Speaker 1: book is quite vulnerable, and it feels that cover feels like. 630 00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:15,959 Speaker 2: This is you look. I think, I think, I think 631 00:29:16,080 --> 00:29:18,440 Speaker 2: when when I mean, so much of what we do 632 00:29:18,680 --> 00:29:22,600 Speaker 2: when we get known for something is conforming to an 633 00:29:22,640 --> 00:29:24,800 Speaker 2: image that people want to expect to see from a 634 00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:28,200 Speaker 2: cookbook or expect to see from somewhere's on Telly. And 635 00:29:28,440 --> 00:29:30,520 Speaker 2: I love the fact that he you know, when like 636 00:29:30,600 --> 00:29:32,280 Speaker 2: when someone paints you. For the Archibold, we paended a 637 00:29:32,320 --> 00:29:34,600 Speaker 2: couple of times the Archibold, and I found that really confronting, 638 00:29:34,680 --> 00:29:39,760 Speaker 2: because the good artist shows something in you that maybe 639 00:29:39,800 --> 00:29:42,120 Speaker 2: you don't want shine. And there's there's some there's some, 640 00:29:42,520 --> 00:29:45,920 Speaker 2: there's some, there's some facets to you. It's not just 641 00:29:46,000 --> 00:29:48,160 Speaker 2: a straight two dimensional image. There's other stuff going on 642 00:29:48,280 --> 00:29:51,040 Speaker 2: behind the eyes. And I thought that that's what Julian 643 00:29:51,080 --> 00:29:53,840 Speaker 2: captured brilliantly, was this idea that you know, it's it's 644 00:29:54,080 --> 00:29:56,920 Speaker 2: it's a you know, it's not the no one's been 645 00:29:57,000 --> 00:29:59,520 Speaker 2: there with a with a wand taking away the wrinkles 646 00:29:59,600 --> 00:30:04,320 Speaker 2: and the you know and the the the degradation of 647 00:30:04,360 --> 00:30:07,400 Speaker 2: the face from sixty years of bad behavior. It's you know, 648 00:30:07,920 --> 00:30:09,920 Speaker 2: it's it's a it's a real it's a real image. 649 00:30:09,920 --> 00:30:10,520 Speaker 2: And I love that. 650 00:30:11,160 --> 00:30:12,760 Speaker 1: It's my favorite cover of yours and. 651 00:30:12,840 --> 00:30:14,600 Speaker 2: I too, I love it. I think it's really good. 652 00:30:14,600 --> 00:30:17,280 Speaker 2: That's so and I'm not holding a plate of food 653 00:30:17,360 --> 00:30:20,160 Speaker 2: and I'm not looking surprised. Two big classes. 654 00:30:20,200 --> 00:30:22,960 Speaker 1: And in my case, the other person I had to 655 00:30:23,080 --> 00:30:25,000 Speaker 1: mention that I loved reading about in your book and 656 00:30:25,040 --> 00:30:27,440 Speaker 1: I hadn't put two and two together is beautiful Gappa 657 00:30:27,640 --> 00:30:30,840 Speaker 1: Emma Warren. She worked on a lot of my books. 658 00:30:30,880 --> 00:30:31,480 Speaker 2: She's amazing. 659 00:30:31,560 --> 00:30:33,960 Speaker 1: And when you wrote so beautifully about her, not only 660 00:30:34,000 --> 00:30:36,520 Speaker 1: throughout the book but also in Your Food Family, but 661 00:30:36,680 --> 00:30:39,680 Speaker 1: at the end that your acknowledgment pages are absolutely beautiful. 662 00:30:40,160 --> 00:30:42,400 Speaker 1: And I wrote to Gwappa straight away and I was like, woppa, 663 00:30:42,480 --> 00:30:43,200 Speaker 1: you're in the book. 664 00:30:43,440 --> 00:30:46,120 Speaker 2: But that's what's so exciting when you work with people. 665 00:30:46,160 --> 00:30:48,800 Speaker 2: And you know Warre Mendez who was the Food Food 666 00:30:48,840 --> 00:30:51,840 Speaker 2: Directorate Delicious, who's now in his own TV show about 667 00:30:52,040 --> 00:30:55,120 Speaker 2: cooking in South Africa. He's got this amazing career. I've 668 00:30:55,160 --> 00:30:58,280 Speaker 2: just been in India with him cooking's it's great to 669 00:30:58,280 --> 00:31:00,360 Speaker 2: see all these people their career going off up at 670 00:31:00,360 --> 00:31:02,560 Speaker 2: the Great Man with Emma Warren. Em and Warren worked 671 00:31:02,600 --> 00:31:05,400 Speaker 2: a lot with Karen Martini. Yeah, and ran one of 672 00:31:05,440 --> 00:31:09,080 Speaker 2: her kitchens in in Spain. But she's been in some 673 00:31:09,160 --> 00:31:12,000 Speaker 2: beautiful cos he books, one of which I was reading 674 00:31:12,080 --> 00:31:15,120 Speaker 2: the I was reading Drew Barrymore's book and there was 675 00:31:15,280 --> 00:31:19,600 Speaker 2: Emma's book open in Drew Barrymore Moore's kitchen. I sent 676 00:31:19,680 --> 00:31:22,480 Speaker 2: this the US, going, look at this. You're in Drew 677 00:31:22,520 --> 00:31:25,080 Speaker 2: Barrymore's kitchen. She loves cooking for your book. How amazing 678 00:31:25,200 --> 00:31:25,360 Speaker 2: is this? 679 00:31:25,520 --> 00:31:27,800 Speaker 1: So she's going to go on Drew Barrymore Show now 680 00:31:28,000 --> 00:31:29,200 Speaker 1: inception moment. 681 00:31:29,360 --> 00:31:31,760 Speaker 2: She exactly exactly needs to go there. But I mean 682 00:31:31,800 --> 00:31:33,960 Speaker 2: that that's and that's that whole thing that you only 683 00:31:34,560 --> 00:31:37,560 Speaker 2: you realize that you writing something like this, that you know, 684 00:31:37,960 --> 00:31:40,360 Speaker 2: my first cot books written by with two months from 685 00:31:40,360 --> 00:31:43,480 Speaker 2: the school, one Marney Roe, who had worked with Karen, 686 00:31:43,520 --> 00:31:45,840 Speaker 2: and another mum who's the most amazing that we call 687 00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:48,120 Speaker 2: her the cake Whisperer. She is the best baker I've 688 00:31:48,160 --> 00:31:50,720 Speaker 2: ever met. She's a she's an absolute master for me. 689 00:31:50,840 --> 00:31:53,800 Speaker 2: She's up there with with Napaul's and called Kate quince Row, 690 00:31:53,880 --> 00:31:57,560 Speaker 2: she's you know, her cheesecare recipe is still the best 691 00:31:57,600 --> 00:32:00,280 Speaker 2: cheesecare resipe I've ever seen. So working with these people 692 00:32:00,320 --> 00:32:04,000 Speaker 2: to develop recipes and to make food that's a little 693 00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:06,520 Speaker 2: bit different or easier or better. Because if you're going 694 00:32:06,560 --> 00:32:08,160 Speaker 2: to do a cookbook, you can't just knock out the 695 00:32:08,240 --> 00:32:11,239 Speaker 2: same beer canned chicken and Homas recipe that everyone does 696 00:32:11,280 --> 00:32:13,280 Speaker 2: because it's kind of predictable. You've got to give people 697 00:32:13,400 --> 00:32:18,000 Speaker 2: different things. But working with them, working with Warren, with Emma, 698 00:32:18,120 --> 00:32:20,320 Speaker 2: and they worked on the last cook together, they ran 699 00:32:20,360 --> 00:32:22,600 Speaker 2: the kitchen and Emma just came up for two weeks 700 00:32:22,720 --> 00:32:25,480 Speaker 2: just to hang in Sydney and shoot with the with 701 00:32:25,560 --> 00:32:28,880 Speaker 2: William and Hannah Mepham, which was you know and Warren. 702 00:32:28,960 --> 00:32:30,440 Speaker 2: It was a great thing. And traveling with the two 703 00:32:30,480 --> 00:32:31,160 Speaker 2: of them, with the two. 704 00:32:31,120 --> 00:32:32,320 Speaker 1: Warrens having a gang. 705 00:32:32,560 --> 00:32:34,080 Speaker 2: You've got to have a gang. You got to have 706 00:32:34,080 --> 00:32:36,320 Speaker 2: a gang, especially when you're doing stuff that's tough, like 707 00:32:36,440 --> 00:32:40,840 Speaker 2: you know, doing doing degastation dinners in Kuala Lumpa. You 708 00:32:40,960 --> 00:32:43,320 Speaker 2: need you need two people who get it. And again, 709 00:32:43,440 --> 00:32:47,560 Speaker 2: Emma is such a she's such a proper soldier. She's amazing. 710 00:32:47,600 --> 00:32:48,880 Speaker 2: What she can achieve by herself. 711 00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:51,320 Speaker 1: I remember I was doing a paleo hot cross bun 712 00:32:51,440 --> 00:32:53,040 Speaker 1: recipe in one of my books, and she was like, 713 00:32:53,880 --> 00:32:55,560 Speaker 1: pull me aside and we've got you know what it's like. 714 00:32:55,600 --> 00:32:58,440 Speaker 1: There's a few ships and everyone's shooting and then there's assistance, 715 00:32:58,480 --> 00:33:00,479 Speaker 1: and she goes, I didn't think there's going to work. 716 00:33:03,440 --> 00:33:04,640 Speaker 1: I have to fix them. 717 00:33:04,920 --> 00:33:06,760 Speaker 2: And look, and that's the whole thing. I think that's 718 00:33:06,800 --> 00:33:09,160 Speaker 2: the whole thing. You want, you know, you need, you 719 00:33:09,320 --> 00:33:11,720 Speaker 2: need people you trust. So when they say, look, I 720 00:33:11,720 --> 00:33:13,320 Speaker 2: don't know why you're doing this, because if we don't 721 00:33:13,400 --> 00:33:16,280 Speaker 2: do this, you know it's actually can take a step 722 00:33:16,320 --> 00:33:19,680 Speaker 2: out and it'll be just as good or or alternatively. 723 00:33:19,800 --> 00:33:22,160 Speaker 2: And this was the message with the PA that we 724 00:33:22,240 --> 00:33:24,320 Speaker 2: did in the in World of Flavor, the last book, 725 00:33:24,480 --> 00:33:26,280 Speaker 2: which she was you've got to have a severe we've 726 00:33:26,280 --> 00:33:28,280 Speaker 2: got to make a proper source bace. I have a 727 00:33:28,320 --> 00:33:31,880 Speaker 2: property minds that it's it's important, it needs to be integrity, 728 00:33:32,800 --> 00:33:36,440 Speaker 2: so that so that that stuff and and whether it's integrity, 729 00:33:36,520 --> 00:33:39,080 Speaker 2: whether it's whether it's just it'll taste better, and it's 730 00:33:39,080 --> 00:33:41,080 Speaker 2: the whole idea. You give people the option of saying 731 00:33:41,280 --> 00:33:42,880 Speaker 2: this is going to take you an extra half an hour, 732 00:33:42,960 --> 00:33:44,920 Speaker 2: but it will you'll get a better playout. And so 733 00:33:45,000 --> 00:33:46,959 Speaker 2: it then depends on you know it's worth it if 734 00:33:46,960 --> 00:33:49,200 Speaker 2: you're doing it for it's worth it. If you're doing 735 00:33:49,240 --> 00:33:51,239 Speaker 2: it for friends coming over, it's a big show off. 736 00:33:51,320 --> 00:33:53,600 Speaker 2: You think, if it's just the kids and the family, 737 00:33:53,720 --> 00:33:57,680 Speaker 2: then then actually do the simple one and and they'll 738 00:33:57,800 --> 00:34:00,560 Speaker 2: be delighted. And that and that's the thing you timing, 739 00:34:00,880 --> 00:34:02,720 Speaker 2: Timing when you put the effort in and when when 740 00:34:02,800 --> 00:34:05,720 Speaker 2: is it really necessary? Often you know that chefs are 741 00:34:05,760 --> 00:34:08,200 Speaker 2: all about, you know, making it the best possible, no 742 00:34:08,239 --> 00:34:09,680 Speaker 2: matter how hard it is. And I think when you're 743 00:34:09,680 --> 00:34:12,080 Speaker 2: a recipe writer, it's how can I give you something 744 00:34:12,200 --> 00:34:16,640 Speaker 2: delicious that takes less hassle, less stress less time. 745 00:34:17,600 --> 00:34:19,359 Speaker 1: Matt Preston, I could talk to you all day long. 746 00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:21,680 Speaker 1: I'm going to have one more quick question because I 747 00:34:21,760 --> 00:34:24,520 Speaker 1: know we've got to get you on your way. Your 748 00:34:24,640 --> 00:34:29,040 Speaker 1: career has got many elements still, whether it's the TV presenting, 749 00:34:29,160 --> 00:34:35,319 Speaker 1: radio hosting, incredible books, beautiful reality things that you've done, 750 00:34:35,600 --> 00:34:39,360 Speaker 1: and you know, I'm so excited to see what comes 751 00:34:39,480 --> 00:34:42,120 Speaker 1: for you next year. A beautiful makeup artist that I 752 00:34:42,200 --> 00:34:46,160 Speaker 1: work with Foe posted you and Nigel this morning saying 753 00:34:46,400 --> 00:34:48,000 Speaker 1: can't wait to work with you next year. So there's 754 00:34:48,040 --> 00:34:51,799 Speaker 1: so many exciting things obviously always happening. Fantastic, isn't she beautiful? 755 00:34:52,440 --> 00:34:54,560 Speaker 2: Foe is the makeup artist for those people don't know. 756 00:34:54,680 --> 00:35:00,640 Speaker 2: Foe has these onyx Japanese like they're they're like washer 757 00:35:00,880 --> 00:35:03,040 Speaker 2: that they are gashes, and she washes you before you 758 00:35:03,120 --> 00:35:05,080 Speaker 2: go on, and you feel like a million dollars And 759 00:35:05,160 --> 00:35:08,000 Speaker 2: I'm going, I feel like I'm just stepping into the 760 00:35:08,040 --> 00:35:10,960 Speaker 2: Nigello world for a tiny moment. I just gotquashed. How 761 00:35:11,080 --> 00:35:11,600 Speaker 2: cool is this? 762 00:35:11,760 --> 00:35:14,239 Speaker 1: Ye folks? Cool? She's really cool to have on your tape. 763 00:35:14,280 --> 00:35:15,600 Speaker 2: Yeah, look, I think that I think you've got to 764 00:35:15,640 --> 00:35:17,719 Speaker 2: and I think that's it. If you get into a 765 00:35:17,760 --> 00:35:22,200 Speaker 2: situation where where you've got opportunities to do crazy different stuff, 766 00:35:22,280 --> 00:35:25,080 Speaker 2: you do the crazy different stuff. Do do that, and 767 00:35:25,239 --> 00:35:27,840 Speaker 2: just try and avoid the stuff that's a bit safe 768 00:35:27,880 --> 00:35:30,000 Speaker 2: and boring and doesn't really you know, it doesn't help 769 00:35:30,040 --> 00:35:34,000 Speaker 2: you grow and risk failing because really there is no 770 00:35:34,600 --> 00:35:37,640 Speaker 2: failure is failure is what other people put on you. Really, 771 00:35:38,200 --> 00:35:41,120 Speaker 2: there's some self there's some self analysis that goes on there. 772 00:35:41,160 --> 00:35:43,839 Speaker 2: But but but fundamentally, it's not. It's never as bad 773 00:35:43,880 --> 00:35:45,759 Speaker 2: as you think. I liken it to the monster under 774 00:35:45,760 --> 00:35:47,720 Speaker 2: the bed you're really scared of and when you shine 775 00:35:47,719 --> 00:35:49,439 Speaker 2: a torch and you go, actually, there's nothing. 776 00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:50,439 Speaker 1: It's not too bad. 777 00:35:50,719 --> 00:35:53,680 Speaker 2: Not too bad. That's the thing. What's the worst thing 778 00:35:53,760 --> 00:35:55,840 Speaker 2: that can happen? To take a punt and try stuff. 779 00:35:56,040 --> 00:35:58,600 Speaker 2: Having said that, I will draw the line at eating 780 00:35:59,200 --> 00:36:00,480 Speaker 2: you know, alligator testicle. 781 00:36:00,600 --> 00:36:02,879 Speaker 1: Okay, no, that's fair. That's that's a fair line to draw. 782 00:36:04,440 --> 00:36:06,839 Speaker 1: Thank you so much. You are absolutely wonderful. I love 783 00:36:06,920 --> 00:36:09,160 Speaker 1: love your book to the listener. Please go ahead and 784 00:36:09,200 --> 00:36:11,560 Speaker 1: get it's available now to make a great Chrissy present 785 00:36:11,840 --> 00:36:13,840 Speaker 1: and Matt Preston, you're wonderful. 786 00:36:14,640 --> 00:36:17,080 Speaker 2: You're wonderful to Thank you very much. Indeed, lovely talking 787 00:36:17,160 --> 00:36:17,239 Speaker 2: to you. 788 00:36:20,200 --> 00:36:25,800 Speaker 1: That's a wrap on another episode of Fearlessly Failing. As always, 789 00:36:26,000 --> 00:36:29,320 Speaker 1: thank you to our guests, and let's continue the conversation 790 00:36:29,520 --> 00:36:35,279 Speaker 1: on Instagram. I'm at Yamo Lollerberry. This potty my word 791 00:36:35,320 --> 00:36:40,040 Speaker 1: for podcast is available on all streaming platforms. I'd love 792 00:36:40,120 --> 00:36:43,120 Speaker 1: it if you could subscribe, rate and comment and of 793 00:36:43,239 --> 00:36:44,759 Speaker 1: course spread the love.