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Speaker 1: It's the Happy Families podcast. It's the podcast for.

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Speaker 2: The time poor parent who just wants answers. Now today,

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Speaker 2: I'm a Happy Families podcast answering your questions. Happy families

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Speaker 2: dot com dot au is where you go to come

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Speaker 2: the podcast link and then just press the button. Easy

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Speaker 2: to use, start talking and you can send messages through

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Speaker 2: just like this one.

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Speaker 3: Hi, Justin and Kylie, I love your podcast. I am

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Speaker 3: a longtime listener and this is actually for my friend.

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Speaker 3: My friend is a single mum and has been since pregnancy.

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Speaker 3: Her son is ten years old who has started suddenly

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Speaker 3: being aggressive and disrespectful. He is always angry with her

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Speaker 3: and doesn't listen. He does things and says things intentionary

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Speaker 3: to upset her. Because my friend is single, her wage

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Speaker 3: is going just to rent and food. Sometimes she can't

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Speaker 3: even afford the food. She has used all of her

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Speaker 3: free mental health sessions on her son, and she can't

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Speaker 3: afford the ongoing psychologist or even an assessment for his behavior.

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Speaker 3: She feels extremely stuck and is at the point of

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Speaker 3: which she's saying to me that she just wants to

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Speaker 3: call the police to take him away from her. For

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Speaker 3: the context, the child is no father in his life.

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Speaker 3: They've never met. The mother has had a handful of

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Speaker 3: relationships over the years, but nothing is stuck. He has

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Speaker 3: been raised by his mum and a family friend, and

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Speaker 3: his grandparents are not so much in the picture. He

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Speaker 3: has just changed schools this year, but he's doing well

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Speaker 3: at school, so it seems I just want to know

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Speaker 3: if you can tell me how best to support her

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Speaker 3: as a friend, and what services there are available for

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Speaker 3: those with a single income and who don't have the

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Speaker 3: ability to pay for these things. If there are any

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Speaker 3: tips you can give me to pass on to her

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Speaker 3: when this child is being erratic and violent and aggressive

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Speaker 3: when she's alone in the house with him, and how

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Speaker 3: to calm him down and to talk to him.

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Speaker 2: Thanks so much, Well, thanks so much Anonymous for sending

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Speaker 2: that message through ten years old wanting to call the

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Speaker 2: police feeling unsafe. I mean, this is a really, really

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Speaker 2: tough story, and it's totally unfair research around this boys

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Speaker 2: and single mums. There are just no easy wins here.

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Speaker 3: Now.

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Speaker 2: I know that a lot of people say we've got

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Speaker 2: to support diverse families, we've got to be encouraging about this,

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Speaker 2: and I totally agree with that, but the reality is Statistically,

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Speaker 2: this is just a really, really tough spot in Australia.

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Speaker 2: At the moment. Fifteen percent of Australian families are run

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Speaker 2: by single parents single parent households. Eighty percent of those

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Speaker 2: are single mums, So that pretty much means twelve percent

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Speaker 2: of Australian family households where there are dependents in the

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Speaker 2: home run by mum and Hilda surveys from just last year.

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Speaker 2: This Hilda is the household income and labor dynamics in Australia.

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Speaker 2: Survey November last year. Average income of a single parent

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Speaker 2: family in Australia thirty four thousand dollars. It's actually dropped

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Speaker 2: from thirty eight thousand a few years ago. Cost of living,

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Speaker 2: rent crisis, mental health challenges. I mean, how are you

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Speaker 2: supposed to pay for a psychologist under those circumstances is

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Speaker 2: just so hard. I think it's impossible. I don't know

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Speaker 2: how you're supposed to do it, certainly benefit by the

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Speaker 2: way I looked it up, nine hundred and eighty seven

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Speaker 2: dollars per fortnite for a single parent nine hundred and

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Speaker 2: eighty set. That's less than five hundred bucks a week,

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Speaker 2: and you're supposed to be show me somewhere where you

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Speaker 2: can rent for less than five hundred bucks a week

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Speaker 2: and still put food on the table, run a car,

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Speaker 2: and all that sort of thing. This is just a

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Speaker 2: really tough spot, So a handful of things that I'm

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Speaker 2: going to say. First off, when it comes to getting

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Speaker 2: psychological help, my first recommendation would be, don't worry about

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Speaker 2: getting psychological help for your sun. I'd be looking for it.

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Speaker 2: In terms of support for parenting, research shows pretty comprehensively

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Speaker 2: that when kids get psychological help, let's say on Tuesday

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Speaker 2: morning at nine thirty, and then they start to have

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Speaker 2: a meltdown on Friday afternoon at three point thirty or

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Speaker 2: five o'clock, they don't say, hmm, I should think back

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Speaker 2: to what my psychologists told me on Tuesday and implement that.

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Speaker 2: They just don't do it. They don't have the emotion regulation,

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Speaker 2: they don't have the frustration tolerance, they don't have the

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Speaker 2: delay gratification, they don't have the executive fun they don't

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Speaker 2: have the skills to be able to do that, whereas

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Speaker 2: for us as parents, we do. So what I would

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Speaker 2: be recommending when there's some funding available, when there's some

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Speaker 2: cash available, get mum help first she's going to get

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Speaker 2: more value learning effective parenting than he's going to get

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Speaker 2: being told that he needs to control his anger. That

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Speaker 2: doesn't mean that he doesn't need help. He really does,

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Speaker 2: but I don't think that psychological help is the help

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Speaker 2: that he needs. When I listen to this, what I

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Speaker 2: hear is good men need to be around this kid.

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Speaker 2: He doesn't have his dad in his life. Grandparents are

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Speaker 2: barely involved. There's no indication of other good men. So

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Speaker 2: I just love that you're a friend who wants to support.

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Speaker 2: I wish the government could do more, I really do,

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Speaker 2: but ultimately this is going to be an individual responsibility thing.

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Speaker 2: The government's too busy blowing multi billions of dollars on

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Speaker 2: desalination plants and billions of dollars on sporting stadiums, and

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Speaker 2: spending hundreds of millions of dollars in Victoria to not

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Speaker 2: host the Commonwealth Games that they said they would host.

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Speaker 2: The the government excess, I mean the billions of dollars

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Speaker 2: a year that they spend on advertising so that they

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Speaker 2: can tell everyone how good a job they're doing. We

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Speaker 2: can't rely on the government, and ndis finding that's blowing out.

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Speaker 2: It was supposed to cost sixteen bill. It's currently at

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Speaker 2: forty two billion, and it's going up, and unfortunately it's

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Speaker 2: not being used well. I know too many people that

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Speaker 2: work in NDIS systems, and these stories of excess and

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Speaker 2: the way that people are taking advantage of the system

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Speaker 2: when there are people who are so desperately in need

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Speaker 2: is just devastating. I know that many people are using

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Speaker 2: it the right way, and that's wonderful, that's what it's

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Speaker 2: there for. But there's just too much abuse of this system.

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Speaker 2: So if this is going to be an individual thing,

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Speaker 2: and that's kind of what you've said, right, I want

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Speaker 2: to be there. I want to be a supporting friend.

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Speaker 2: I just think that's wonderful. Here's how I think that

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Speaker 2: you can support Number one. There will be some services

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Speaker 2: that are available that could be helpful, but they differ

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Speaker 2: depending on which community you're in. The free services things

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Speaker 2: like Beyond Blue, Black Dog, that kind of stuff, they're

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Speaker 2: fairly general. I think we need some specific kinds of

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Speaker 2: health here, So that's the first thing i'd say. Beyond that,

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Speaker 2: here's what I think this little guy needs. He needs

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Speaker 2: families in their circle, families in their community to engage

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Speaker 2: with them as a family. So what am I talking

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Speaker 2: about here. I'm saying, maybe go on a picnic and

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Speaker 2: invite them. Get three or four or five families who

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Speaker 2: are all willing to say, Hey, one day a week,

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Speaker 2: let's have them over for a barbecue, or let's do

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Speaker 2: a games night, or let's do a picnic down at

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Speaker 2: the beach or down at the park. Let's keep this

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Speaker 2: kid socially engaged and give some support to mum as well.

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Speaker 2: It's going to make such a difference for her. If

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Speaker 2: you're part of a broader community. Maybe there's even the

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Speaker 2: capacity to drop a meal around spontaneously, or an uber voucher,

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Speaker 2: an uber eats voucher, just to lighten the load. Because

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Speaker 2: that financial load it's overwhelming. It's so hard to concentrate

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Speaker 2: on anything else. The second thing that I'd say, outside

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Speaker 2: of engaging with the family is keep this kid busy,

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Speaker 2: getting him in in sports, getting him involved in extracurricular activities.

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Speaker 2: Obviously there's a financial challenge here, but to the extent

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Speaker 2: that there are scholarships available, to the extent that there's

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Speaker 2: charity available, maybe somebody in the community is willing to say, hey,

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Speaker 2: I'm happy to fork out the two hundred and fifty

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Speaker 2: or four hundred bucks per term, so this kid can

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Speaker 2: stay off the streets and be wearing himself out, developing

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Speaker 2: competence and skills and making friends. This sort of thing

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Speaker 2: is going to make such a big difference for mum.

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Speaker 2: She gets a little bit of a lightning of the load,

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Speaker 2: but also for this kid as he gets to engage

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Speaker 2: in these activities and lastly recruit good man. He needs

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Speaker 2: to learn what it is to be a good man,

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Speaker 2: to learn how to help the people around him feel

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Speaker 2: stronger and safer. That's the essence of healthy masculinity. And

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Speaker 2: at the moment, I just don't think he's seeing it enough.

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Speaker 2: I wish I could off more. It's, like I said,

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Speaker 2: almost an impossible, unfair situation. And unfortunately we keep on

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Speaker 2: seeing that there is a to parent privilege. We can

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Speaker 2: talk about the importance of diversity in families and it is,

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Speaker 2: but ultimately the stats don't support this as being an

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Speaker 2: optimal way to raise a family. If that's where you are,

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Speaker 2: or my compassion, my heart goes out to you. But

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Speaker 2: this is a really tough job. All right, Let's take

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Speaker 2: a look at question number two.

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Speaker 1: Hi, doctor Justin and Kylie, I'm calling you regarding my son,

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Speaker 1: who's six year old, calling you from London, and we

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Speaker 1: are originally from Melbourne, but we have moved to London

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Speaker 1: about one and a half years ago. It's certainly a

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Speaker 1: big change for my little one. By this time, he's

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Speaker 1: completely adjusted to the new way of life. However, we've

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Speaker 1: been traveling extensively and I've noticed ever since my son

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Speaker 1: has turned six, he has shown signs of aggression or

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Speaker 1: you know, anger. More and more he realizes what anger is,

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Speaker 1: but he doesn't know what to do about it or

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Speaker 1: how to control it. And because we've been traveling a lot,

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Speaker 1: we've landed in very embarrassing situations. Sometimes, you know, when

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Speaker 1: we're at a dinner or maybe at a cruise or

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Speaker 1: at the airport and everyone's just looking at us, and

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Speaker 1: I have this shouting, yelling child who doesn't really know

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Speaker 1: how to control his anger or communicate what he wants

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Speaker 1: us to do to help him in that situation. I've

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Speaker 1: realizes that there are a couple of things that trigger it.

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Speaker 1: Of course, when he's tired or angry, hungry and thirsty.

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Speaker 1: I don't know how to stop him from believing that

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Speaker 1: he can get his way all the time, or he

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Speaker 1: can buy things all the time, but I really don't

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Speaker 1: know how to handle this situation, so I hope you

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Speaker 1: can help me. I love your show and thank you

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Speaker 1: for all the support that you provide for parents like us.

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Speaker 2: Well, good for you for packing up and having the

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Speaker 2: adventure of a lifetime heading off to London sounds amazing.

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Speaker 2: We do have a little bit of a challenge though,

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Speaker 2: because our kids they just rely on stability and predictability

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Speaker 2: so they can feel good about them world, and they

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Speaker 2: don't tend to respond too well to a whole lot

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Speaker 2: of upheaval. Having said that, if the travel is happening

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Speaker 2: with you, and you're there, and you're stable and you're predictable,

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Speaker 2: then he'll probably be okay. So a couple of things

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Speaker 2: about what to do when kids are having these big

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Speaker 2: emotional meltdowns when they're being really challenging. First off, emotion

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Speaker 2: regulation is something that develops over time. I know plenty

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Speaker 2: of adults that are still lousy, lousy at emotion regulation.

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Speaker 2: So it starts to develop somewhere around about the age

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Speaker 2: of let's say three. That's when kids start to realize,

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Speaker 2: hang on, I can use my emotions in effective ways

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Speaker 2: to do what needs to be done. Emotion regulation is

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Speaker 2: about expressing those emotions or keeping it together because I've

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Speaker 2: got something that I'm looking to achieve. So the first

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Speaker 2: thing to highlight here is emotion regulation develops on a continuum,

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Speaker 2: starts around about two or three, and by the time

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Speaker 2: kids are about nine, that's when they're getting good at

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Speaker 2: expressing or holding their emotion together, depending on what their

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Speaker 2: goals are. They know what's expected socially. They usually do

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Speaker 2: a lot better at it. Boys they develop a little

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Speaker 2: slower than girls, and so it may be a little

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Speaker 2: bit more than nine, but usually that's about the age.

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Speaker 2: Given that you're dealing with a six year old, what

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Speaker 2: you're describing is actually it's pretty normal. Kids are least

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Speaker 2: likely to be regulated when they're hungry, angry, lonely, tired,

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Speaker 2: or stress. Just remember the German police officer says, help

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Speaker 2: mean stop. It's really hard to stop your emotions when

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Speaker 2: you are hungry, angry, lonely, tired, or stress like you

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Speaker 2: will power your self control, your ability to delay, gratification,

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Speaker 2: your frustration, tolerance, your executive function, they all take a

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Speaker 2: really big dip when those factors are they're hungry, angry, lonely,

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Speaker 2: tired and stressed. So what do you do? That's really

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Speaker 2: what the question is, what am I supposed to do

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Speaker 2: when these big emotions are happening. The first thing I

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Speaker 2: want to emphasize is compassion is important. Okay, we don't

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Speaker 2: want to be blowing up, we don't want to be

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Speaker 2: getting angry at the kids. But the second thing I

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Speaker 2: want to emphasize is that kids need to understand that

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Speaker 2: there are some things that are okay and some things

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Speaker 2: are not okay when it comes to their behavior, and

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Speaker 2: about the age of six, in fact, maybe a bit

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Speaker 2: before that, they can start to get that message loud

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Speaker 2: and clear. So there's a movement it's been around for

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Speaker 2: a long time now that kids should never hear no

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Speaker 2: in child care centers, for example, those who work in

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Speaker 2: early childcare are not supposed to say the word no

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Speaker 2: to kids. I think that's garbage. Honestly, I just think

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Speaker 2: that's rubbish. Kids have got to hear no. For the

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Speaker 2: rest of your life, you're going to hear no. It's

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Speaker 2: not that no is a problem, it's the way that

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Speaker 2: it's said. So give you a little guy a no

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Speaker 2: and say I love you, kiddo, But the answer is

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Speaker 2: no or wouldn't it be great if you could? When

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Speaker 2: you say to a child, don't you just wish? Wouldn't

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Speaker 2: it be great if you could, what you're really saying

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Speaker 2: is no, You're just saying, with a whole lot of

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Speaker 2: empathy and a whole lot of kindness, don't you just

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Speaker 2: wish we could buy that thing? Wouldn't it be great

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Speaker 2: if we could go over there and do what you

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Speaker 2: want to do?

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Speaker 3: Oh?

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Speaker 2: That would just be amazing, wouldn't it. Guess what, No,

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Speaker 2: you're just saying it really nicely. So I call that

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Speaker 2: giving them in fantasy what they can't have in reality.

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Speaker 2: I don't think that it's healthy for kids to grow

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Speaker 2: up and not hear no, because I'll tell you what,

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Speaker 2: once they're six or eight, or ten or twelve and

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Speaker 2: they here no for the first time, they'll fall apart.

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Speaker 2: They've got to develop the ability to take no. In fact,

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Speaker 2: I think that the greater your ability to take no

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Speaker 2: and then keep on going and to persist becomes one

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Speaker 2: of the most important lifelong skills. So I wouldn't be

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Speaker 2: worrying about saying no. What I would be doing is

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Speaker 2: trying to work out how to say no in a

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Speaker 2: way that minimizes the reaction. But here's the thing. When

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Speaker 2: someone gets sold no, or when someone can't do something,

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Speaker 2: no matter how you say it, there's going to be disappointment,

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Speaker 2: there's going to be frustration. There's going to be potentially

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Speaker 2: an outburst, especially with a six year old boy. So

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Speaker 2: when that happens, let him be upset about it. Again,

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Speaker 2: it's not our job to protect our children from all

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Speaker 2: of those negative emotions. If it's not appropriate for him

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Speaker 2: to be doing something, then he can't do it, and

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Speaker 2: that's okay. You don't have to live into that emotion

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Speaker 2: with him. You don't have to magnify the emotion with him.

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Speaker 2: You don't have to talk about his feelings as simple

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Speaker 2: don't you just wish wouldn't it be great? Sorry, kiddo,

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Speaker 2: not going to happen today, That's all, and then let

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Speaker 2: it be. If you can be kind and gentle afterwards,

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Speaker 2: if you can be relatively nonplussed and unaffected by his

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Speaker 2: temper tantrum, he's going to get over it really fast.

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Speaker 2: The last thing I'll say is this, if he is

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Speaker 2: really upset, if this is really going on, just look

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Speaker 2: at him and say, hey, buddy, I know how upset

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Speaker 2: you are it really feels horrible when you don't get

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Speaker 2: to do what you want to do, and then offer

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Speaker 2: him a hug or offer him some space. Do you

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Speaker 2: want to hug, do you want to talk about it?

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Speaker 2: Or just want to do you just want to be

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Speaker 2: left alone? He'll let you know once he works through

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Speaker 2: a process that emotion, he'll be okay again. That's the process,

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Speaker 2: the whole pandering to our kids, becoming our children's therapists

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Speaker 2: making their emotions king. That's not helpful and that's not healthy.

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Speaker 2: It's not growing resilient kids. That big emotion that your

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Speaker 2: child's feeling. It's like a train going into a tunnel.

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Speaker 2: Some tunnels are long and dark and deep, but the

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Speaker 2: train always comes out at the other end of the tunnel.

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Speaker 2: Same goes here his emotion or subside. And if you

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Speaker 2: can be soft and kind and gentle as you say no,

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Speaker 2: and soft and kind and gentle when the train comes

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Speaker 2: out the other side, he'll be all right. Let me

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Speaker 2: restate the answer is no. Don't you wish you could?

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Speaker 2: Wouldn't it be great? Oh buddy, you're really upset. I

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Speaker 2: get it. Do you want to hug? Do you want

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Speaker 2: to talk? Or do you just want some space they're

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Speaker 2: Once things are calm, you can ask him if he

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Speaker 2: wants to talk about it or if you just want

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Speaker 2: to get on with life, and that should be all

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Speaker 2: you need to do. Thanks so much for your questions.

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Speaker 2: Happy families dot com dot you. Click on podcasts and

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Speaker 2: then push the button start talking and we'll get your voice.

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Speaker 2: Memo love answering your questions, Happy families dot com dot you.

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Speaker 2: The Happy Families podcast is produced by Justin Rowland for

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Speaker 2: Bridge Media. Craig Bruce is our executive producer. For more

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Speaker 2: and fo about making your family happier, check us out

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