1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:03,279 Speaker 1: Now Darwin's cheapest capital city. It is the cheapest capital 2 00:00:03,279 --> 00:00:05,440 Speaker 1: city to buy a home in the country at the moment. 3 00:00:05,519 --> 00:00:08,520 Speaker 1: By the look of things, median house prices just under 4 00:00:08,560 --> 00:00:11,360 Speaker 1: five hundred thousand dollars compared to more than a million 5 00:00:11,440 --> 00:00:15,239 Speaker 1: dollars in Sydney, eight hundred thousand in Brisbane, Melbourne and 6 00:00:15,320 --> 00:00:19,400 Speaker 1: the Act. So what is causing the Northern Territory property 7 00:00:19,440 --> 00:00:23,079 Speaker 1: market to drop or remain stagnant? Joining us on the 8 00:00:23,120 --> 00:00:26,240 Speaker 1: line right now is the arii NT the Real Estate 9 00:00:26,280 --> 00:00:30,400 Speaker 1: Institute of the Northern Territories CEO aswen Da Silva. Good 10 00:00:30,400 --> 00:00:31,400 Speaker 1: morning to you as one. 11 00:00:32,440 --> 00:00:34,400 Speaker 2: Good morning to you, lovely to have. 12 00:00:34,400 --> 00:00:37,000 Speaker 1: You on the show. Now tell me how is the 13 00:00:37,040 --> 00:00:38,800 Speaker 1: market going at the moment? 14 00:00:40,400 --> 00:00:43,880 Speaker 2: Thanks for having me. Yeah, so, the market is quite 15 00:00:44,240 --> 00:00:47,680 Speaker 2: stagnant when I and I'm talking about the sales side 16 00:00:47,680 --> 00:00:51,680 Speaker 2: of things. Yeah so, I mean if you really look 17 00:00:51,720 --> 00:00:54,920 Speaker 2: at post COVID, there has not been a capital growth 18 00:00:55,400 --> 00:00:57,800 Speaker 2: in terms of the median house raisers. It has been 19 00:00:58,000 --> 00:01:04,160 Speaker 2: fairly stagnant. During cod IT we had interstate travel getting 20 00:01:04,200 --> 00:01:06,919 Speaker 2: into the investment property market side of things. 21 00:01:07,120 --> 00:01:07,360 Speaker 1: Yep. 22 00:01:07,560 --> 00:01:12,840 Speaker 2: And if you a picture yourself that against the population 23 00:01:13,959 --> 00:01:18,240 Speaker 2: population is also stagnant. It's a point seven percent increase 24 00:01:18,280 --> 00:01:21,640 Speaker 2: in twenty twenty three, whereas the national increase was two 25 00:01:21,680 --> 00:01:27,720 Speaker 2: point seven percent. So whilst the prices haven't gone up, 26 00:01:28,040 --> 00:01:32,800 Speaker 2: population also as sort of gone up. We are looking 27 00:01:32,800 --> 00:01:34,800 Speaker 2: at in comparison with other capital cities. 28 00:01:35,040 --> 00:01:37,400 Speaker 1: Yeah, which makes it difficult, right. I mean, if you're 29 00:01:37,440 --> 00:01:40,720 Speaker 1: looking to sell your home at this point in time, 30 00:01:40,800 --> 00:01:43,759 Speaker 1: I would imagine that you may be looking at selling 31 00:01:43,800 --> 00:01:49,320 Speaker 1: it not at a price that you'd be hoping for. Yeah. 32 00:01:49,400 --> 00:01:52,520 Speaker 2: In majority of the cases, sometimes you have bargains that 33 00:01:52,680 --> 00:01:55,360 Speaker 2: is on offer, so you need to wait for them. 34 00:01:55,480 --> 00:01:58,600 Speaker 2: You need to be patient, and if you set up 35 00:01:58,600 --> 00:02:00,280 Speaker 2: see a bargain, you must go for it. So I 36 00:02:00,320 --> 00:02:05,480 Speaker 2: think I think we have we need to change fundamentally, Katie, 37 00:02:05,520 --> 00:02:10,480 Speaker 2: because if you sort of continue with this fashion, we 38 00:02:10,520 --> 00:02:13,680 Speaker 2: will continue with the same issues. I mean, you know, 39 00:02:13,960 --> 00:02:17,440 Speaker 2: there has to be a proposition we need to build on. 40 00:02:18,680 --> 00:02:21,320 Speaker 2: Talking about the liver ability. I mean, we have so 41 00:02:21,400 --> 00:02:24,080 Speaker 2: many things going right. I mean, the weather is good, 42 00:02:24,160 --> 00:02:27,680 Speaker 2: it's a smaller community, we can get things done, so 43 00:02:28,000 --> 00:02:31,000 Speaker 2: all that is good, but we need to latch onto 44 00:02:31,160 --> 00:02:35,639 Speaker 2: some opportunities that are available to us. If that makes. 45 00:02:35,400 --> 00:02:37,680 Speaker 1: Sense, Yeah, it does. I mean some of those and 46 00:02:37,720 --> 00:02:39,600 Speaker 1: we've spoken about it in the past. You know, we 47 00:02:39,639 --> 00:02:42,680 Speaker 1: know that when the impacts boom happened, it meant that, 48 00:02:42,840 --> 00:02:45,360 Speaker 1: you know, some of those property prices went right up. 49 00:02:45,440 --> 00:02:47,680 Speaker 1: But what it also sort of saw is that we 50 00:02:47,880 --> 00:02:50,480 Speaker 1: just have one project. We didn't sort of divers the 51 00:02:50,760 --> 00:02:53,840 Speaker 1: you know, diversify the economy, I suppose. But if we 52 00:02:53,840 --> 00:02:55,840 Speaker 1: can get a few things up and going, it does 53 00:02:55,919 --> 00:02:59,240 Speaker 1: make a difference, doesn't absolutely. 54 00:02:59,360 --> 00:03:02,240 Speaker 2: I mean, you're spot on impact a sort of a 55 00:03:02,280 --> 00:03:05,600 Speaker 2: one off type of thing. In twenty thirteen fourteen, then 56 00:03:05,639 --> 00:03:09,000 Speaker 2: there was a massive correction that took place, whereas in 57 00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:14,520 Speaker 2: other areas the prices went up. Our key focus area 58 00:03:14,639 --> 00:03:18,160 Speaker 2: is actually two folds. One needs we need to continue 59 00:03:18,200 --> 00:03:23,520 Speaker 2: to build on make available affordable housing. For that, we 60 00:03:23,600 --> 00:03:28,080 Speaker 2: need institutional investors to come in, plus of course the 61 00:03:28,080 --> 00:03:32,960 Speaker 2: private investors, so that we need to have the necessary 62 00:03:33,960 --> 00:03:37,520 Speaker 2: environment for them to come. Nobody is going to come 63 00:03:37,600 --> 00:03:41,080 Speaker 2: and put in money if there's no capital growth, So 64 00:03:41,240 --> 00:03:44,320 Speaker 2: we need to set up on one side, we need 65 00:03:44,360 --> 00:03:49,640 Speaker 2: to have this affordable housing. The thing going the other side, 66 00:03:49,760 --> 00:03:54,000 Speaker 2: it has to be a demand based grower, so that 67 00:03:54,600 --> 00:03:57,000 Speaker 2: that needs to happen as well. So and those two 68 00:03:57,040 --> 00:03:58,160 Speaker 2: needs to go hand in hand. 69 00:03:59,080 --> 00:04:03,200 Speaker 1: As one tell us, you know, we hear anecdotally at 70 00:04:03,200 --> 00:04:05,480 Speaker 1: the moment, and I did know in a report by 71 00:04:05,520 --> 00:04:08,720 Speaker 1: the ABC's rox Sam Fitzgerald earlier in the week as well, 72 00:04:09,240 --> 00:04:12,280 Speaker 1: she'd spoken to a Territorian who had sold her home 73 00:04:12,360 --> 00:04:15,400 Speaker 1: at one hundred thousand dollars loss. By the look of things, 74 00:04:16,279 --> 00:04:20,440 Speaker 1: we are hearing anecdotally that you know that some Territorians 75 00:04:20,440 --> 00:04:22,320 Speaker 1: are in a situation at the moment where if they 76 00:04:22,360 --> 00:04:25,520 Speaker 1: are wanting to sell their homes, they're really they are 77 00:04:25,560 --> 00:04:29,000 Speaker 1: looking at selling at a loss depending on when they 78 00:04:29,080 --> 00:04:32,479 Speaker 1: purchased it. Is that something that you are hearing or 79 00:04:32,520 --> 00:04:35,719 Speaker 1: seeing at the moment, Yes, I mean. 80 00:04:35,640 --> 00:04:38,240 Speaker 2: And that's a very unfortunate situation. I mean, if you're 81 00:04:38,279 --> 00:04:41,559 Speaker 2: selling a property under dues and you're looking at moving 82 00:04:41,560 --> 00:04:45,080 Speaker 2: away from from the territory, that's not going to help 83 00:04:45,160 --> 00:04:48,960 Speaker 2: us in so many areas. And also from a government 84 00:04:48,960 --> 00:04:53,040 Speaker 2: point of view, we are getting less stamp stampiece, am 85 00:04:53,080 --> 00:04:55,760 Speaker 2: I right? Yeah, I getting that the tampiece at the 86 00:04:55,800 --> 00:04:57,960 Speaker 2: normal market prices you are to sell it, you're selling 87 00:04:57,960 --> 00:05:01,400 Speaker 2: it lower than that underdua. So so that those are 88 00:05:01,440 --> 00:05:05,080 Speaker 2: the reasons why the population is actually not growing. I 89 00:05:05,080 --> 00:05:07,479 Speaker 2: mean we have great I mean, we're students come in 90 00:05:07,600 --> 00:05:12,240 Speaker 2: the There is quite a lot of migration. I did 91 00:05:12,240 --> 00:05:18,480 Speaker 2: see that ABC newsighter myself. But there are population leakages, 92 00:05:18,480 --> 00:05:20,040 Speaker 2: particularly within the younger folk. 93 00:05:20,440 --> 00:05:20,680 Speaker 1: Yep. 94 00:05:21,480 --> 00:05:25,160 Speaker 2: See, So we had to first stop those leakages. Second, 95 00:05:25,760 --> 00:05:28,240 Speaker 2: we need to encourage more people to come in and 96 00:05:28,360 --> 00:05:32,479 Speaker 2: invest here. And that's why you're talking about investors coming 97 00:05:32,520 --> 00:05:36,600 Speaker 2: in and for them, there has to be a tretton 98 00:05:36,640 --> 00:05:38,920 Speaker 2: on investment logic has to be there. 99 00:05:39,160 --> 00:05:42,000 Speaker 1: Yeah. Now as one, what I mean, are we suffering 100 00:05:42,080 --> 00:05:45,839 Speaker 1: reputationally at the moment as well? Do you believe as 101 00:05:45,839 --> 00:05:48,360 Speaker 1: a result of the issues that we're experiencing with crime? 102 00:05:49,920 --> 00:05:54,360 Speaker 2: Yeah, I mean, I mean this tagline of anty becoming 103 00:05:54,480 --> 00:06:00,760 Speaker 2: or diving becoming a being a transient population transient we 104 00:06:00,800 --> 00:06:03,320 Speaker 2: see for plays and type of thing needs to be 105 00:06:03,400 --> 00:06:07,520 Speaker 2: addressed and needs to be addressed fairly quickly. You can't 106 00:06:07,640 --> 00:06:11,800 Speaker 2: carry on with this transition. We need to convert that 107 00:06:12,320 --> 00:06:16,080 Speaker 2: into some kind of a long term investment type of 108 00:06:16,080 --> 00:06:18,560 Speaker 2: thing where people come in, settle down with his young 109 00:06:18,600 --> 00:06:24,520 Speaker 2: with his niks matter, and they make a go here. Crime. Yes, 110 00:06:24,800 --> 00:06:28,599 Speaker 2: I mean crime has been brought somewhat under control. Thankfully, 111 00:06:29,080 --> 00:06:31,320 Speaker 2: but you can all play it up and that is 112 00:06:31,360 --> 00:06:36,240 Speaker 2: another stigma we need to address because that's a hard one. 113 00:06:36,360 --> 00:06:39,200 Speaker 2: I mean, your media has a role to play. Everyone 114 00:06:39,200 --> 00:06:40,799 Speaker 2: has a role to play. We have a role to play. 115 00:06:41,520 --> 00:06:44,880 Speaker 2: So I mean, if if you really took a look 116 00:06:44,920 --> 00:06:49,080 Speaker 2: at the talk to a sort of a potential either 117 00:06:49,120 --> 00:06:52,600 Speaker 2: a family or even an investor looking at okay, let 118 00:06:52,680 --> 00:06:57,800 Speaker 2: me go and buy into ten fifteen homes below market 119 00:06:57,880 --> 00:07:02,440 Speaker 2: like that lady was talking about. We need to sort 120 00:07:02,440 --> 00:07:06,800 Speaker 2: of get them to think, okay, this is a place 121 00:07:06,839 --> 00:07:07,400 Speaker 2: to invest. 122 00:07:07,920 --> 00:07:12,520 Speaker 1: Yeah, which is hard, and it's a hard one at 123 00:07:12,520 --> 00:07:14,560 Speaker 1: the moment, you know, when we're when all of us 124 00:07:14,560 --> 00:07:17,120 Speaker 1: are being impacted by those issues of crime, it's a 125 00:07:17,120 --> 00:07:19,080 Speaker 1: hard one to sort of say to your family or 126 00:07:19,080 --> 00:07:21,400 Speaker 1: your friends interstate, oh yeah, I think you should. You know, 127 00:07:21,440 --> 00:07:23,560 Speaker 1: you should buy a place in Darwin. We'd all love to. 128 00:07:23,720 --> 00:07:25,880 Speaker 1: And you know it's ten years ago or eight years ago. 129 00:07:25,920 --> 00:07:28,720 Speaker 1: We may have, but it's it's a difficult one and 130 00:07:28,720 --> 00:07:32,360 Speaker 1: I would imagine that somewhere like Alice Springs is finding 131 00:07:32,400 --> 00:07:34,040 Speaker 1: that even tougher right now. 132 00:07:35,200 --> 00:07:38,280 Speaker 2: Absolutely no, I mean, if you look at our vacancy rates, 133 00:07:38,440 --> 00:07:43,239 Speaker 2: Darwin is not too bad. It's tracking within the national 134 00:07:43,280 --> 00:07:48,560 Speaker 2: averages were under uh touched under four percent. But Alice Springs, 135 00:07:48,640 --> 00:07:53,440 Speaker 2: if there is a sorry trying a social related issue 136 00:07:54,480 --> 00:07:56,840 Speaker 2: the way con cigarette just can shoot up because there 137 00:07:56,840 --> 00:07:59,880 Speaker 2: are least breaks that take place. I mean, people just 138 00:08:01,040 --> 00:08:02,520 Speaker 2: say no and we're not going to live in Alice 139 00:08:02,560 --> 00:08:04,520 Speaker 2: Springs and we are moving away, and it's hard for 140 00:08:05,360 --> 00:08:10,840 Speaker 2: landlords to give that property on rent immediately upon previous 141 00:08:10,840 --> 00:08:14,600 Speaker 2: tenet leaving. So yeah, so the data issues further compounded 142 00:08:14,640 --> 00:08:16,760 Speaker 2: by the fact that we are in a very high 143 00:08:16,760 --> 00:08:17,760 Speaker 2: interest rate scenario. 144 00:08:18,040 --> 00:08:18,280 Speaker 1: Yeah. 145 00:08:18,600 --> 00:08:21,000 Speaker 2: I mean, if you're looking at borrowing at six six 146 00:08:21,040 --> 00:08:23,640 Speaker 2: and a half percent, you would like to see your 147 00:08:24,880 --> 00:08:28,760 Speaker 2: property go up in value more than that, right, So 148 00:08:28,800 --> 00:08:30,840 Speaker 2: otherwise you might as well put that money into a 149 00:08:30,880 --> 00:08:33,000 Speaker 2: bank and make whatever. 150 00:08:34,920 --> 00:08:39,080 Speaker 1: So can I ask does the real estate Institute in 151 00:08:39,120 --> 00:08:42,760 Speaker 1: the Northern Territory life do you keep Obviously, you know, 152 00:08:42,920 --> 00:08:47,160 Speaker 1: you keep records of how many homes are selling throughout 153 00:08:47,200 --> 00:08:50,000 Speaker 1: a year. Is there any information that's sort of kept 154 00:08:50,040 --> 00:08:53,199 Speaker 1: in terms of you know, why people are selling or 155 00:08:53,240 --> 00:08:54,920 Speaker 1: if they're moving into states. 156 00:08:56,920 --> 00:09:00,000 Speaker 2: The data is available, you know, the number of transactions 157 00:09:00,040 --> 00:09:03,120 Speaker 2: for a quarter, for a year, for the previous three years, 158 00:09:03,160 --> 00:09:06,480 Speaker 2: so all that information is available at a fairly detailed level. 159 00:09:07,920 --> 00:09:11,839 Speaker 2: Uh so Darwin Alis, Catherine Tenant Creek. So all that 160 00:09:11,880 --> 00:09:16,560 Speaker 2: information is available. The reasons why these sales are taking 161 00:09:16,559 --> 00:09:22,480 Speaker 2: place is needs to be a survey that needs to 162 00:09:22,480 --> 00:09:25,920 Speaker 2: be uh that we need to conduct and and those 163 00:09:26,040 --> 00:09:31,400 Speaker 2: reasons from family to family, individual to individual will change. 164 00:09:31,720 --> 00:09:34,480 Speaker 2: I mean, some may like the lady you're talking about, 165 00:09:34,520 --> 00:09:38,560 Speaker 2: which ABC was highlighting, obviously she wanted to get out 166 00:09:38,559 --> 00:09:41,960 Speaker 2: of whatever the suburbs. They want to move out. That's 167 00:09:42,000 --> 00:09:47,559 Speaker 2: the reason she is selling, selling the property in a hurry. 168 00:09:48,000 --> 00:09:52,440 Speaker 2: So some may sell to sort of move out because 169 00:09:52,480 --> 00:09:58,120 Speaker 2: the children's education, health reason, so variety of reasons. But 170 00:09:58,120 --> 00:10:01,600 Speaker 2: but we need to we need to understand the fundamentals. 171 00:10:01,679 --> 00:10:05,520 Speaker 2: There has to be keep telling this very often and 172 00:10:05,600 --> 00:10:09,600 Speaker 2: I can't record this. We we need to have this 173 00:10:10,360 --> 00:10:14,200 Speaker 2: look at this liverability thing in the long term whilst 174 00:10:14,200 --> 00:10:19,800 Speaker 2: looking at providing confidence to investors sports from a return 175 00:10:20,360 --> 00:10:25,400 Speaker 2: on the investment point of view, and also allowing them 176 00:10:25,440 --> 00:10:28,720 Speaker 2: to make some easy additions and the building throughout the past, 177 00:10:28,920 --> 00:10:33,760 Speaker 2: we have signs we have complex uh building a through 178 00:10:33,800 --> 00:10:37,760 Speaker 2: our processors that are multi layered processors that one needs 179 00:10:37,800 --> 00:10:42,040 Speaker 2: to sort of follow we need to look at policy 180 00:10:42,160 --> 00:10:44,800 Speaker 2: reforms in the in the in the form of how 181 00:10:44,880 --> 00:10:50,360 Speaker 2: do we help these developers financial assistance, tax breaks. 182 00:10:50,160 --> 00:10:52,720 Speaker 1: All that. So it's to really get things moving again. 183 00:10:53,360 --> 00:10:56,880 Speaker 2: It's a very complex thing and these needs to be 184 00:10:57,320 --> 00:10:59,280 Speaker 2: These are all big hits. I mean it's easier said 185 00:10:59,320 --> 00:11:01,800 Speaker 2: than done. I mean we can talk, you can talk 186 00:11:02,240 --> 00:11:07,080 Speaker 2: on this for hours there. Yeah, it's that's for any garments. Yes, 187 00:11:07,320 --> 00:11:09,920 Speaker 2: if tax breaks, it's going to hit our revenue. 188 00:11:10,200 --> 00:11:13,839 Speaker 1: Yeah, that's exactly right. That's when I'm really sorry. We 189 00:11:13,920 --> 00:11:15,360 Speaker 1: are going to have to wrap it up because we've 190 00:11:15,360 --> 00:11:19,080 Speaker 1: got to catch up with the Lord, the Mayor of Palmerston. 191 00:11:19,400 --> 00:11:21,640 Speaker 1: I really appreciate you having a chat with me this morning, 192 00:11:21,679 --> 00:11:23,240 Speaker 1: and I know that a lot of our listeners will 193 00:11:23,520 --> 00:11:26,280 Speaker 1: as well. So thank you so very much for joining 194 00:11:26,360 --> 00:11:28,199 Speaker 1: us today and and we'll have to catch up with 195 00:11:28,240 --> 00:11:28,920 Speaker 1: you again soon. 196 00:11:30,280 --> 00:11:33,160 Speaker 2: Thank you, thank you, Thanks so much. Thank you.