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Speaker 1: We all want to simplify our lives, and especially our

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Speaker 1: work lives, and that's hardly surprising. The modern age is

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Speaker 1: defined by distraction and excess. But Leo Bibotta, the founder

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Speaker 1: of massively popular blog zen Habits, worries that our culture's

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Speaker 1: desire for simplicity might inadvertently be sending us down the

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Speaker 1: wrong path. Simplicity, Leo says, isn't about deprivation. When you

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Speaker 1: imagine the simple life, you picture a monk or a

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Speaker 1: writer living in a cabin in the woods. But this

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Speaker 1: isn't the whole picture. Instead, Leo thinks about simplicity as

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Speaker 1: a process of expanding and contracting, just like breathing. And

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Speaker 1: in this episode, Leo gives examples of his process for

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Speaker 1: seeking simplicity and explains why deprivation isn't the goal. My

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Speaker 1: name is doctor Amanthea Immer. I'm an organizational psychologist and

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Speaker 1: the founder of behavioral science consultancy Inventium, and this is

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Speaker 1: how I work, a show about how to help you

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Speaker 1: do your best work. On today's My Favorite Tip episode,

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Speaker 1: we go back to an interview from the past and

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Speaker 1: I pick out my favorite tip from the interview. In

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Speaker 1: today's show, I speak with Lee Oberborta about what's the

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Speaker 1: first thing we can do if we're trying to simplify

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Speaker 1: our lives. Hmm.

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Speaker 2: For me, simplicity again, this is such an amazing area

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Speaker 2: to dive into. He could go really deep with it,

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Speaker 2: but for me, it's always it's like a process of

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Speaker 2: breathing where you expand and then contract. So simplicity usually

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Speaker 2: happens after you've expanded a little bit. So if you were,

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Speaker 2: for example, if you wanted to get into a genre

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Speaker 2: of reading a certain kind of books, you know, like

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Speaker 2: you say, I want to read all the mystery novels

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Speaker 2: there are, right, So you might start reading and expanding

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Speaker 2: your library, and you'd have you just like start ording

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Speaker 2: a bunch of things online and then they call come

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Speaker 2: in and after a while you don't need to be

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Speaker 2: as expensive, and so you can start to simplify from

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Speaker 2: there because you've decided like, Okay, I've already explored the expansiveness,

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Speaker 2: and now I can cut back a little bit. So

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Speaker 2: it's it's that cultivating or the it's the idea of

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Speaker 2: winnowing down from the expansiveness. So you know, in that example,

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Speaker 2: I might just pick the five novels that I couldn't

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Speaker 2: live without, and those are the ones that I want

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Speaker 2: to keep in my library, and the rest of them

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Speaker 2: I go and sell. So I think the mistake a

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Speaker 2: lot of people make is to think that this means

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Speaker 2: like you're depriving yourself or somehow you have to get

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Speaker 2: rid of things that you love. But this means, as

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Speaker 2: you like explore and expand, and then eventually, like when

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Speaker 2: you realize this too much, I didn't need to buy

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Speaker 2: this many things, you start to narrow it down to

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Speaker 2: the things that actually add value to your life, that

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Speaker 2: you actually love, and then get rid of all of

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Speaker 2: the excess, and that really lightens the load. It really

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Speaker 2: means that you are down to the things that you

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Speaker 2: actually care about. But I still, you know, recommend the

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Speaker 2: expansive mode. When I get into something, I'll usually order

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Speaker 2: way too much, spend too much money, and then and

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Speaker 2: just really empower that, like it's totally okay to go

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Speaker 2: too big, And then eventually I start to narrow it

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Speaker 2: down and I realize what's actually essential. You can't know

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Speaker 2: what's essential until you've done the expensive exploration. Being curious,

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Speaker 2: you know, that kind of stuff. But most people do

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Speaker 2: the expansiveness for a lot of their lives and they

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Speaker 2: don't then narrow it down, so you have to start

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Speaker 2: to learn what actually matters. And that's really the process

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Speaker 2: after expansion is like taking a look at all the

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Speaker 2: stuff you've done, and can you notice what's essential, what

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Speaker 2: mattered most to you, what do you care the most about,

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Speaker 2: what is necessary and unnecessary? And as you start to

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Speaker 2: narrow things down, not just like physical things, but you know,

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Speaker 2: all the commitments in your life, you know, all of

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Speaker 2: the things that you do during the day, all the

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Speaker 2: apps on your phone, all of your distractions versus the

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Speaker 2: things that you actually need to pay attention to. This

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Speaker 2: is really asking that question what matters to you? And

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Speaker 2: most people don't like to be confronted by that question

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Speaker 2: because they don't know the answer, and so they're like,

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Speaker 2: I don't know what matters. I'm just going to keep

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Speaker 2: all of it because what if it matters? And I

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Speaker 2: got you know, the fear is that I'm going to

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Speaker 2: get rid of something that matters. But asking that question

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Speaker 2: really allows you to really check into what your values are,

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Speaker 2: what you want the most in the world, and what

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Speaker 2: you care about. And I think it's such a beautiful exploration.

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Speaker 1: If you enjoy this extract, I might chat with Lee.

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Speaker 1: You might enjoy listening to the full interview, which you

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Speaker 1: can find a link to in the show notes. If

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Speaker 1: you're looking for more tips to improve the way that

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Speaker 1: you work, I write a short fortnightly newsletter that contains

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Speaker 1: three cool things that I've discovered that helped me work better,

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Speaker 1: ranging from software and gadgets that I'm loving through the

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Speaker 1: interesting research findings. You can sign up for that at

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Speaker 1: Howiwork dot com That's how I Work dot co. Thank

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Speaker 1: you for sharing part of your day with me by

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Speaker 1: listening to How I Work. If you're keen for more

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Speaker 1: tips on how to work better, connect with me via

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Speaker 1: LinkedIn or Instagram. I'm very easy to find. Just search

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Speaker 1: for Amantha Imba. How I Work was recorded on the

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Speaker 1: traditional land of the Warrangery people, part of the Cool

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Speaker 1: and Nation. I am so grateful for being able to

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Speaker 1: work and live on this beautiful land, and I want

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Speaker 1: to pay my respects to elders, past, present and emerging.

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Speaker 1: How I Work is produced by Inventium with production support

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Speaker 1: from Dead Set Studios. And thank you to Martin Nimba

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Speaker 1: who did the audio mix and makes everything sound better

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Speaker 1: than it would have otherwise