1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:02,360 Speaker 1: Hey, this is Christian O'Connell. Now you might be thinking, 2 00:00:02,480 --> 00:00:04,880 Speaker 1: what the head is this English guy doing here? Where 3 00:00:04,920 --> 00:00:07,240 Speaker 1: are Jonesy and Amanda? Well, let me take over for 4 00:00:07,280 --> 00:00:08,799 Speaker 1: a bit just to let you about a new podcast 5 00:00:08,840 --> 00:00:11,520 Speaker 1: I'm doing. It's actually not new. It's a second series 6 00:00:11,520 --> 00:00:14,600 Speaker 1: of something called Stuff of Legends. Each episode I chat 7 00:00:14,640 --> 00:00:17,160 Speaker 1: to somebody. They tell him about the three objects that 8 00:00:17,239 --> 00:00:20,400 Speaker 1: really mean something in their life. And the reason why 9 00:00:20,480 --> 00:00:23,279 Speaker 1: you will be interested is I've done one with the 10 00:00:23,280 --> 00:00:27,920 Speaker 1: great Amanda Keller. The chat with Amanda made me cry, 11 00:00:28,120 --> 00:00:31,160 Speaker 1: not just during it when Amanda was crying, but for 12 00:00:31,240 --> 00:00:35,240 Speaker 1: three days afterwards. It was so moving. It's a great 13 00:00:35,360 --> 00:00:37,559 Speaker 1: chat as it would be. I think Amanda Kella is 14 00:00:37,600 --> 00:00:41,040 Speaker 1: one of the best broadcasters in Australia anyway. It's called 15 00:00:41,040 --> 00:00:45,320 Speaker 1: Stuff of Legends wherever you get your podcasts. Many believe 16 00:00:45,360 --> 00:00:47,640 Speaker 1: that we are the sum of our parts. But could 17 00:00:47,680 --> 00:00:50,960 Speaker 1: it be that our stuff, the things, the items, the 18 00:00:51,000 --> 00:00:54,280 Speaker 1: ones that we choose to buy and keep, they actually 19 00:00:54,280 --> 00:00:58,320 Speaker 1: contain meaning and they contain these hidden stories about us. 20 00:00:58,760 --> 00:01:01,400 Speaker 1: I'm Christian O'Connell and this is the Stuff of Legends. 21 00:01:02,160 --> 00:01:04,840 Speaker 1: I ask interestant people to come on the show and 22 00:01:05,040 --> 00:01:08,479 Speaker 1: share the stories of three of the most treasured objects. 23 00:01:08,760 --> 00:01:11,280 Speaker 1: You get these stories you've never heard before, ones you 24 00:01:11,360 --> 00:01:13,960 Speaker 1: might not expect, and what you do is, although they're 25 00:01:14,000 --> 00:01:17,120 Speaker 1: sharing a story about something which is very personal to them, 26 00:01:17,520 --> 00:01:19,720 Speaker 1: I always find and I hope you do as well, 27 00:01:19,920 --> 00:01:23,399 Speaker 1: that actually it always opens up something in you. Our 28 00:01:23,440 --> 00:01:26,640 Speaker 1: guest today really is a powerhouse of Australian television and 29 00:01:26,760 --> 00:01:29,279 Speaker 1: radio and it's been on for the last thirty years. 30 00:01:29,480 --> 00:01:31,720 Speaker 1: It's a joy. Whenever I do anything with her, I 31 00:01:31,720 --> 00:01:33,960 Speaker 1: actually get nervous because she makes me feel like I'm 32 00:01:34,000 --> 00:01:36,039 Speaker 1: a white belt. I'm a beginner and she is a 33 00:01:36,040 --> 00:01:39,240 Speaker 1: black belt. She's also a LOGI winner. Let's find out 34 00:01:39,280 --> 00:01:40,360 Speaker 1: who's joining us. 35 00:01:40,800 --> 00:01:44,440 Speaker 2: My name is Amanda Keller. I do a breakfast show 36 00:01:44,480 --> 00:01:48,080 Speaker 2: on WSFM. I am one of the hosts of the 37 00:01:48,120 --> 00:01:51,440 Speaker 2: Living Room. How much detail do you need? Star sign Pisces, 38 00:01:51,800 --> 00:01:53,880 Speaker 2: lover of jewelry, lover of cups of tea. 39 00:01:54,400 --> 00:01:57,200 Speaker 1: When you say jewelry is bling, you look like a mayress. 40 00:01:57,360 --> 00:01:58,680 Speaker 1: You love to wear a lot of bleak. 41 00:01:58,720 --> 00:02:01,120 Speaker 2: I've just taken off my bracelets because they'll be two noisy. 42 00:02:01,400 --> 00:02:03,480 Speaker 2: Like mister t I make him look understated. 43 00:02:13,880 --> 00:02:16,880 Speaker 1: Amanda Kenna, I'm trying to know what is the first item. 44 00:02:16,960 --> 00:02:18,840 Speaker 1: Then you've got for stuff of legends. 45 00:02:19,280 --> 00:02:21,640 Speaker 2: I'm trying to look out what order I'll tell these in. 46 00:02:22,080 --> 00:02:27,280 Speaker 2: I'll start with Snoopy. Snoopy is a bean bag toy, 47 00:02:28,200 --> 00:02:30,480 Speaker 2: probably what half the size of a loaf of bread, 48 00:02:31,240 --> 00:02:35,400 Speaker 2: and it's Snoopy from the Peanuts comics. And this was 49 00:02:35,440 --> 00:02:38,960 Speaker 2: given to me by my grandmother, probably on my fourteenth birthday, 50 00:02:39,000 --> 00:02:41,040 Speaker 2: I think. And I was in love with Barry Manilow. 51 00:02:41,160 --> 00:02:43,880 Speaker 2: So anything that was like a beagle of how amazing. 52 00:02:44,360 --> 00:02:48,880 Speaker 2: But Snoopy became my confidant. I'd never had a pet, 53 00:02:48,960 --> 00:02:51,720 Speaker 2: desperate for a pet, so this bean bag would sit 54 00:02:51,760 --> 00:02:54,440 Speaker 2: on my shoulder when I did my homework. I'd whisper 55 00:02:54,480 --> 00:02:57,200 Speaker 2: my secrets into Snoopy's ears. And I was desperate to 56 00:02:57,639 --> 00:02:59,440 Speaker 2: And my diary is full of all this talk, my 57 00:02:59,480 --> 00:03:02,240 Speaker 2: teenage worry about who will I be and what will 58 00:03:02,280 --> 00:03:03,040 Speaker 2: happen and what. 59 00:03:03,080 --> 00:03:03,920 Speaker 3: Will my life be? 60 00:03:04,040 --> 00:03:05,840 Speaker 2: And I was growing up in the midst of suburbia 61 00:03:05,880 --> 00:03:08,040 Speaker 2: with nothing aspirational in front of me. 62 00:03:08,120 --> 00:03:09,880 Speaker 1: Did you keep your teenage diaries? 63 00:03:10,240 --> 00:03:13,240 Speaker 2: I've still got my teenage diary because you're so lucky. 64 00:03:13,400 --> 00:03:14,720 Speaker 1: What's it like reading those? 65 00:03:15,120 --> 00:03:16,400 Speaker 3: You know what's fascinating. 66 00:03:16,440 --> 00:03:19,320 Speaker 2: When I first found it under the house, probably twenty 67 00:03:19,320 --> 00:03:20,079 Speaker 2: five years ago. 68 00:03:20,040 --> 00:03:21,360 Speaker 1: That's like a scene from a movie. What do you 69 00:03:21,360 --> 00:03:23,080 Speaker 1: mean you found them under the house? What were they 70 00:03:23,120 --> 00:03:23,560 Speaker 1: doing there? 71 00:03:23,680 --> 00:03:26,240 Speaker 2: I had written it and we'd moved house, and I 72 00:03:26,800 --> 00:03:30,320 Speaker 2: was married, and I opened it up and out came 73 00:03:30,360 --> 00:03:33,639 Speaker 2: a photograph of a friend of mine who passed away 74 00:03:33,639 --> 00:03:37,560 Speaker 2: at the age of sixteen, and I just it was 75 00:03:37,600 --> 00:03:39,520 Speaker 2: a visceral kick because. 76 00:03:39,280 --> 00:03:40,120 Speaker 3: I'd forgotten that. 77 00:03:40,120 --> 00:03:43,560 Speaker 2: That's why I'd started my diary, because my friend had died, 78 00:03:44,320 --> 00:03:47,080 Speaker 2: and that's where my diary started, the first entry. 79 00:03:47,720 --> 00:03:49,680 Speaker 3: And yet in my mind, my. 80 00:03:49,800 --> 00:03:52,760 Speaker 2: Diary and when I went on to read it is 81 00:03:52,800 --> 00:03:55,160 Speaker 2: all about my love of Barry Manilow. I had my 82 00:03:55,240 --> 00:03:57,320 Speaker 2: wisdom teeth out, and my brother's friend came over, and 83 00:03:57,360 --> 00:03:59,640 Speaker 2: I was an addressing gown and with big chubby cheeks. 84 00:04:00,160 --> 00:04:03,560 Speaker 2: All of the emotion of those teenageys all sat in 85 00:04:03,600 --> 00:04:04,800 Speaker 2: the same strata. 86 00:04:05,120 --> 00:04:06,880 Speaker 1: It's so intense, it's so big. 87 00:04:07,800 --> 00:04:10,520 Speaker 2: I had no concept of what was big and what wasn't. 88 00:04:10,560 --> 00:04:11,840 Speaker 2: It was all the same. 89 00:04:12,040 --> 00:04:13,760 Speaker 1: But that's the right of being a teenager. We have 90 00:04:13,920 --> 00:04:15,960 Speaker 1: no perspective, and we shouldn't have. 91 00:04:16,640 --> 00:04:19,000 Speaker 2: And I just felt sorry for myself. I felt sorry 92 00:04:19,040 --> 00:04:21,720 Speaker 2: for the girl I read about, and I felt embarrassed 93 00:04:22,279 --> 00:04:25,479 Speaker 2: about the girl I read about, those tortured teen dreams, 94 00:04:25,520 --> 00:04:27,920 Speaker 2: and how I was going to go and win an 95 00:04:27,920 --> 00:04:31,800 Speaker 2: oscar and thank Barry, and I was going to marry Barry, obviously, 96 00:04:32,040 --> 00:04:32,880 Speaker 2: And it's. 97 00:04:32,760 --> 00:04:35,599 Speaker 1: All about Barry. It sounds like some sort. 98 00:04:35,440 --> 00:04:39,680 Speaker 2: Of stalker because you know why, because Barry wrote sensitive 99 00:04:39,720 --> 00:04:43,159 Speaker 2: songs and he was relatively unattractive, and that hit every 100 00:04:43,200 --> 00:04:43,600 Speaker 2: note that. 101 00:04:43,640 --> 00:04:48,000 Speaker 1: Was to relatively unattractive. He felt more gettable, like that 102 00:04:48,000 --> 00:04:48,560 Speaker 1: could happen. 103 00:04:48,800 --> 00:04:50,120 Speaker 3: He felt more gettable. 104 00:04:51,000 --> 00:04:53,200 Speaker 2: A friend of mine was into The Monkeys, but she 105 00:04:53,400 --> 00:04:55,960 Speaker 2: liked Peter Talk because he was the ugly one. 106 00:04:56,040 --> 00:04:57,720 Speaker 1: You know, you knew your level, you knew you should 107 00:04:57,720 --> 00:05:00,919 Speaker 1: have spoken at his funeral service, best known as the 108 00:05:01,000 --> 00:05:02,440 Speaker 1: ugly one in the Monkeys. 109 00:05:06,800 --> 00:05:10,800 Speaker 2: Many eulogies. Yes, so I think that's why I loved Barry. 110 00:05:11,200 --> 00:05:14,200 Speaker 2: But that's what My diary is, filled with the tortured stuff, 111 00:05:14,240 --> 00:05:18,520 Speaker 2: and it's it's sphincter tightening to read it. It's excruciating. 112 00:05:19,160 --> 00:05:22,960 Speaker 2: But knowing the diary and the kind of person I was, 113 00:05:23,440 --> 00:05:27,520 Speaker 2: Snoopy held all the secrets. And years later, just when 114 00:05:27,560 --> 00:05:30,039 Speaker 2: my son was about eight years old, and he was 115 00:05:30,080 --> 00:05:33,320 Speaker 2: holding Snoopy. Snoopy's next to my bed still now, yep, 116 00:05:33,680 --> 00:05:37,480 Speaker 2: I use Snoopy as a touchstone for gratitude, for history, 117 00:05:38,120 --> 00:05:40,960 Speaker 2: for the modest start to my life. My brother got 118 00:05:40,960 --> 00:05:43,279 Speaker 2: a pillow one year for Christmas. You know, we didn't 119 00:05:43,279 --> 00:05:44,640 Speaker 2: have a show off. 120 00:05:45,200 --> 00:05:48,640 Speaker 1: It's trouble now. It's those things that people our age makeup. 121 00:05:49,040 --> 00:05:51,400 Speaker 1: It's tough, heart walk nine hundred miles of school. I 122 00:05:51,400 --> 00:05:54,080 Speaker 1: was beaten with sticks. He did not get a pillow. 123 00:05:54,720 --> 00:05:56,760 Speaker 2: Mum just didn't get it. And the girl next door. 124 00:05:56,839 --> 00:05:59,400 Speaker 2: Christmas Day was such a double edged sword because Carrol 125 00:05:59,440 --> 00:06:01,840 Speaker 2: next door, it's let's come and see what you got 126 00:06:01,839 --> 00:06:06,359 Speaker 2: for Christmas. And it was excruciating. And one year on 127 00:06:06,440 --> 00:06:08,520 Speaker 2: Christmas night, Dad said, come on, we'll go and we 128 00:06:08,560 --> 00:06:10,040 Speaker 2: went through the trading post and he bought me a 129 00:06:10,040 --> 00:06:12,560 Speaker 2: second hand record player because he knew that whatever it 130 00:06:12,720 --> 00:06:16,480 Speaker 2: was that day was had been a little mortifying. So 131 00:06:16,760 --> 00:06:19,600 Speaker 2: I told Jack this story that I was given Snoopy, 132 00:06:19,880 --> 00:06:22,760 Speaker 2: and Snoopy held all my secrets and Snoopy is still 133 00:06:22,760 --> 00:06:24,919 Speaker 2: the keeper of the flame. And at the end of 134 00:06:24,960 --> 00:06:26,880 Speaker 2: this story, and I was crying as I told Jack, 135 00:06:27,240 --> 00:06:29,800 Speaker 2: he listened all the way through, and he said, is 136 00:06:29,839 --> 00:06:32,320 Speaker 2: that all you'd got for your birthday? That was the 137 00:06:32,360 --> 00:06:34,400 Speaker 2: only part of the entire story that he. 138 00:06:34,360 --> 00:06:35,479 Speaker 1: Was honesty of our kids. 139 00:06:35,920 --> 00:06:36,720 Speaker 3: Yeah, that's right. 140 00:06:37,040 --> 00:06:39,400 Speaker 2: And he was mortified on my behalf that I would 141 00:06:39,400 --> 00:06:41,000 Speaker 2: get this at fourteen and think it was great. 142 00:06:41,279 --> 00:06:42,960 Speaker 1: But Mane, I love that you still got it, and 143 00:06:43,000 --> 00:06:45,480 Speaker 1: I love how it represents your journey, doesn't it. I 144 00:06:45,480 --> 00:06:48,560 Speaker 1: guess from your innocence. You know, I've been a teenager 145 00:06:48,560 --> 00:06:51,839 Speaker 1: when Snoopy was your bestie. He was a confident on everything, 146 00:06:52,160 --> 00:06:54,720 Speaker 1: and he's still in your life now and he's still 147 00:06:54,720 --> 00:06:55,440 Speaker 1: playing a role. 148 00:06:56,400 --> 00:06:59,440 Speaker 2: Yeah. And my naivety about Barry. There were many things 149 00:06:59,440 --> 00:07:04,520 Speaker 2: I didn't under stand in those days. I don't think 150 00:07:04,560 --> 00:07:05,320 Speaker 2: Barry even knew No. 151 00:07:05,560 --> 00:07:07,719 Speaker 1: I don't think he didn't have a Snoopy, Or maybe 152 00:07:07,720 --> 00:07:08,000 Speaker 1: he did. 153 00:07:08,839 --> 00:07:11,280 Speaker 2: He had a real life Snoopy. He had a real beagle. 154 00:07:13,040 --> 00:07:14,760 Speaker 3: You using a euphemism. I'm not sure. 155 00:07:16,120 --> 00:07:19,320 Speaker 1: I've met Barry. And half the interview with some yeah, 156 00:07:19,360 --> 00:07:22,600 Speaker 1: and half the interview was him getting phone calls from 157 00:07:22,680 --> 00:07:25,240 Speaker 1: his I don't know his dog handler in l A 158 00:07:25,400 --> 00:07:28,920 Speaker 1: and Barry talking to his dogs. He does love his beagles. 159 00:07:29,360 --> 00:07:32,119 Speaker 2: Wow, Because I was to ride in my diary about 160 00:07:32,160 --> 00:07:34,720 Speaker 2: my It was New Year's Eve, so imagine being in 161 00:07:34,760 --> 00:07:37,440 Speaker 2: New York with Barry. And because I was pre sexual 162 00:07:37,920 --> 00:07:40,600 Speaker 2: as was Barry, I'm assuming man. My diary was filled 163 00:07:40,640 --> 00:07:44,200 Speaker 2: with all the cliches. There'd be a big flaccati rug, 164 00:07:44,560 --> 00:07:47,120 Speaker 2: there'd be a big open fire, and that we'd be 165 00:07:47,200 --> 00:07:50,840 Speaker 2: drinking hot chocolate. It had all the teen dreams. 166 00:07:51,160 --> 00:07:52,760 Speaker 1: So was there any part of you that thought about 167 00:07:52,800 --> 00:07:54,520 Speaker 1: giving Snoopy to your son Jack? 168 00:07:55,200 --> 00:07:58,520 Speaker 2: No, you know, Jacket three sets of car Kies in 169 00:07:58,520 --> 00:08:01,400 Speaker 2: the last week. I would not risk Snoopy. 170 00:08:02,200 --> 00:08:05,320 Speaker 1: So Snoopy lives on the bed and always will not. 171 00:08:05,240 --> 00:08:08,160 Speaker 2: On the bed. I'm not a freak to the bed 172 00:08:08,760 --> 00:08:10,560 Speaker 2: next to the bed, and the diary is in a 173 00:08:10,640 --> 00:08:12,559 Speaker 2: shelf near the bed as well. 174 00:08:17,280 --> 00:08:20,760 Speaker 1: Snoopy A beautiful choice, Amanda. And what is your second 175 00:08:20,840 --> 00:08:22,040 Speaker 1: thing to share with us. 176 00:08:22,480 --> 00:08:24,720 Speaker 2: Let's go to a pair of scissors, which is a 177 00:08:24,760 --> 00:08:29,760 Speaker 2: weird item. And I only found these probably five years ago, 178 00:08:30,400 --> 00:08:33,000 Speaker 2: but my mum gave these to me when I was 179 00:08:33,120 --> 00:08:35,920 Speaker 2: in my teens. It's a pair of left handed scissors 180 00:08:36,320 --> 00:08:40,880 Speaker 2: that would have been incredibly expensive. I'm left handed and 181 00:08:42,280 --> 00:08:44,800 Speaker 2: mum gave me these, and I'm sure I would have 182 00:08:44,800 --> 00:08:48,359 Speaker 2: pulled a face of oh, you know, what a dreadful 183 00:08:48,400 --> 00:08:50,040 Speaker 2: thing to be given, especially. 184 00:08:49,679 --> 00:08:52,720 Speaker 1: Based on track record of pillows you know now? The 185 00:08:52,760 --> 00:08:57,240 Speaker 1: scissors it was, it was on form, it really was, 186 00:08:58,040 --> 00:08:59,600 Speaker 1: I'm brand for Mum brand. 187 00:08:59,679 --> 00:09:02,680 Speaker 2: I'm sure I sneered and went what an old lady 188 00:09:02,760 --> 00:09:04,960 Speaker 2: thing to be given. And yet when I found them 189 00:09:05,000 --> 00:09:07,319 Speaker 2: again recently, it brought up a whole lot of stuff 190 00:09:07,360 --> 00:09:09,839 Speaker 2: about my relationship with my mum, who was no longer here. 191 00:09:09,920 --> 00:09:13,199 Speaker 2: She died about seventeen years ago. And because I used 192 00:09:13,240 --> 00:09:16,000 Speaker 2: these all the time now, and isn't that the nature 193 00:09:16,120 --> 00:09:18,960 Speaker 2: of your relationship with a parent, And I want to 194 00:09:18,960 --> 00:09:21,120 Speaker 2: say a thousand times to Mum every day, I get 195 00:09:21,160 --> 00:09:23,440 Speaker 2: it now, I get it now, and I'm talking. I'm 196 00:09:23,440 --> 00:09:25,720 Speaker 2: always emotional. I talk about my mum because I felt 197 00:09:25,760 --> 00:09:28,760 Speaker 2: a little unseen by Mum that when I went to Uni, 198 00:09:28,880 --> 00:09:31,720 Speaker 2: she made all my clothes and I wanted to dress 199 00:09:32,360 --> 00:09:34,960 Speaker 2: like I was in the tops and twins. I wanted 200 00:09:34,960 --> 00:09:37,720 Speaker 2: to buy army disposal coats and things, and Mum knitted 201 00:09:37,720 --> 00:09:42,920 Speaker 2: me cardigans with bat wings and homemade dresses and I 202 00:09:42,960 --> 00:09:44,800 Speaker 2: didn't wear any of it. And I didn't hide the 203 00:09:44,840 --> 00:09:46,679 Speaker 2: fact from her I didn't wear any of it, so 204 00:09:47,200 --> 00:09:51,080 Speaker 2: I was so casual in my hurtfulness. And even when 205 00:09:51,559 --> 00:09:54,600 Speaker 2: talking about dropping my son at UNI. He's the second 206 00:09:54,600 --> 00:09:57,200 Speaker 2: son who's now left home, and it hit me like 207 00:09:57,240 --> 00:10:00,040 Speaker 2: a ton of bricks when my first son did, I 208 00:10:00,440 --> 00:10:03,400 Speaker 2: just thought, I just want to say, I'm so sorry. 209 00:10:03,520 --> 00:10:07,120 Speaker 2: How casual I was about all the stuff, about all 210 00:10:07,160 --> 00:10:11,320 Speaker 2: the stuff, all of it, all of it. And I 211 00:10:11,480 --> 00:10:14,319 Speaker 2: felt that my life started when I went to Union, 212 00:10:14,400 --> 00:10:18,080 Speaker 2: left home, and the thought that for my children, their 213 00:10:18,120 --> 00:10:19,160 Speaker 2: lives are starting now. 214 00:10:19,160 --> 00:10:20,400 Speaker 3: It's kind of horrifying. 215 00:10:20,480 --> 00:10:21,920 Speaker 1: It's heartbreaking, isn't it. 216 00:10:21,920 --> 00:10:26,080 Speaker 2: It's heartbreaking. I went to see an energy worker recently. 217 00:10:26,120 --> 00:10:27,640 Speaker 2: I'm not even really into that, but a friend of 218 00:10:27,679 --> 00:10:29,120 Speaker 2: mine said, won't you go and see her? And she 219 00:10:29,280 --> 00:10:32,400 Speaker 2: was amazing, and I laiter and I closed my eyes, 220 00:10:32,440 --> 00:10:34,719 Speaker 2: and she said, because I was dealing with my son 221 00:10:34,840 --> 00:10:36,960 Speaker 2: leaving the youngest son just a few weeks ago. 222 00:10:36,840 --> 00:10:39,439 Speaker 1: Really really traumatic, it really is. 223 00:10:39,679 --> 00:10:42,520 Speaker 2: And even just the nag I was before he went 224 00:10:42,679 --> 00:10:45,160 Speaker 2: to get his forms done, to get this done. Every 225 00:10:45,160 --> 00:10:46,800 Speaker 2: time I spoke to him, it's something I was saying, 226 00:10:46,840 --> 00:10:47,320 Speaker 2: have you done this? 227 00:10:47,360 --> 00:10:48,320 Speaker 3: Have you done this? Have you done this? 228 00:10:48,600 --> 00:10:50,600 Speaker 2: And I didn't want that to be how it was. 229 00:10:51,640 --> 00:10:53,800 Speaker 2: And she said to me, and I later my eyes closed, 230 00:10:53,840 --> 00:10:55,520 Speaker 2: I'll probably cry or satin. She said, put him in 231 00:10:55,559 --> 00:10:56,400 Speaker 2: a boat next to you. 232 00:10:56,520 --> 00:10:58,480 Speaker 1: Oh my god, you set me off and put. 233 00:10:58,360 --> 00:11:01,839 Speaker 2: Everything in that boat that he needs, every emotional thing 234 00:11:01,840 --> 00:11:06,160 Speaker 2: you've given him, every spiritual support, every single thing he 235 00:11:06,280 --> 00:11:11,840 Speaker 2: needs to have a wonderful, emotionally comfortable, strong life. And 236 00:11:11,840 --> 00:11:13,720 Speaker 2: then she said, let the boat go. And I started 237 00:11:13,720 --> 00:11:14,080 Speaker 2: to solve. 238 00:11:14,200 --> 00:11:15,600 Speaker 3: I said, I can't let the boat go. 239 00:11:16,559 --> 00:11:18,880 Speaker 2: And she said, all right, you can get in the boat, 240 00:11:19,840 --> 00:11:23,199 Speaker 2: but you sit behind him, and you're the passive support 241 00:11:23,240 --> 00:11:27,800 Speaker 2: in his boat, and his light shines and guides him, 242 00:11:27,920 --> 00:11:30,960 Speaker 2: and you're only there if needed. And I thought, oh, 243 00:11:31,000 --> 00:11:33,360 Speaker 2: you know what, I can deal with that, but I 244 00:11:33,400 --> 00:11:35,080 Speaker 2: can't let the boat go without me. 245 00:11:35,640 --> 00:11:38,839 Speaker 1: Oh my god, it's a beautiful image. It's just a 246 00:11:38,880 --> 00:11:43,920 Speaker 1: beautiful scene. I'm entering that. You know. My eldest daughter, 247 00:11:44,040 --> 00:11:46,200 Speaker 1: she turns eighteen in three months time. We went to 248 00:11:46,200 --> 00:11:49,880 Speaker 1: look at a university last weekend, and yeah, it's you 249 00:11:49,960 --> 00:11:52,800 Speaker 1: don't want to let go, You actually don't it kind of. 250 00:11:52,840 --> 00:11:56,520 Speaker 1: I suddenly felt very reluctant about the whole journey. I 251 00:11:56,559 --> 00:11:59,640 Speaker 1: suddenly reached this point where it was like, oh, this 252 00:11:59,720 --> 00:12:01,559 Speaker 1: is hard break, and I didn't know it would end 253 00:12:01,679 --> 00:12:04,480 Speaker 1: like this. We always know they're going to leave. We left. 254 00:12:04,840 --> 00:12:06,480 Speaker 1: I went to Uni, like you did. But when you 255 00:12:06,520 --> 00:12:09,839 Speaker 1: start feeling it and you're parent, it's nothing but heartbreaking. 256 00:12:09,880 --> 00:12:12,320 Speaker 1: You don't actually want to let them go. You don't 257 00:12:12,520 --> 00:12:14,840 Speaker 1: accept the passage of time, do you. You want to 258 00:12:15,440 --> 00:12:17,959 Speaker 1: stop the train, stop the train. 259 00:12:18,200 --> 00:12:23,400 Speaker 2: And though your rational brain says I want all these 260 00:12:23,440 --> 00:12:28,120 Speaker 2: things for you, I've hopefully reared you in a way 261 00:12:28,800 --> 00:12:33,120 Speaker 2: that all these things now are your journey. Off you go. 262 00:12:33,320 --> 00:12:35,120 Speaker 2: I've written the first chapter. The rest of the book 263 00:12:35,240 --> 00:12:37,679 Speaker 2: is yours. But when you said there you don't want 264 00:12:37,720 --> 00:12:40,080 Speaker 2: it to end, I think we have to not see 265 00:12:40,080 --> 00:12:43,680 Speaker 2: it as an ending. Yeah, it's just it's shifting and 266 00:12:43,720 --> 00:12:45,719 Speaker 2: it's morphing. But that doesn't make it any better, it 267 00:12:45,800 --> 00:12:48,880 Speaker 2: does it. And that's why things like the scissors I 268 00:12:49,040 --> 00:12:51,360 Speaker 2: just I didn't look back. I was so cavalier. And 269 00:12:51,360 --> 00:12:53,360 Speaker 2: if Mum was still here, that's what I would say 270 00:12:53,400 --> 00:12:55,920 Speaker 2: to her is I'm so sorry if I made it 271 00:12:55,920 --> 00:12:57,560 Speaker 2: look like I didn't give a rats. 272 00:12:57,320 --> 00:12:57,920 Speaker 3: Because I didn't. 273 00:12:57,920 --> 00:13:00,000 Speaker 2: It was all about me, and I'm trying to remember 274 00:13:00,120 --> 00:13:03,800 Speaker 2: that about my son's I have to take myself out 275 00:13:03,800 --> 00:13:07,000 Speaker 2: of this. My neediness can't come into this. And some 276 00:13:07,120 --> 00:13:08,480 Speaker 2: days I'm better at that than others. 277 00:13:09,440 --> 00:13:12,520 Speaker 1: Oh, that is just I can't stop thinking about the boat. 278 00:13:13,840 --> 00:13:16,320 Speaker 2: I'm going to make you cry about the boat. You 279 00:13:16,320 --> 00:13:18,520 Speaker 2: did matter if that boat tied up, don't let that book. 280 00:13:18,800 --> 00:13:20,960 Speaker 1: I'm going to burn that boat. She's not getting that boat. 281 00:13:21,040 --> 00:13:25,960 Speaker 1: I'm burning the escape boats. You're going nowhere. It is. 282 00:13:26,000 --> 00:13:28,480 Speaker 1: It's so hard, and no one really talks about it. 283 00:13:29,000 --> 00:13:31,480 Speaker 1: I hadn't really realized, of course she's going to leave, 284 00:13:31,600 --> 00:13:33,679 Speaker 1: you know. I left, and you're right. I remember being 285 00:13:33,720 --> 00:13:36,160 Speaker 1: at that age. I couldn't wait to leave. And it 286 00:13:36,200 --> 00:13:37,920 Speaker 1: wasn't even about my mum and dad being bad. It 287 00:13:37,960 --> 00:13:39,280 Speaker 1: was just I was desperate to get out in the 288 00:13:39,280 --> 00:13:42,080 Speaker 1: world and find out who I was, to start living 289 00:13:42,120 --> 00:13:45,960 Speaker 1: my life, you know, and live independently, and you just 290 00:13:46,000 --> 00:13:48,400 Speaker 1: want it's all about you. Your world is just literally 291 00:13:48,400 --> 00:13:50,080 Speaker 1: about an inch in front of your face. You've got 292 00:13:50,480 --> 00:13:54,080 Speaker 1: zero empathy for anybody else. You're right, you don't. There's 293 00:13:54,080 --> 00:13:56,240 Speaker 1: no rearview mirror, and there shouldn't be you're only eighteen. 294 00:13:56,600 --> 00:13:59,400 Speaker 1: But now experience the other side of it. It is 295 00:14:00,040 --> 00:14:02,439 Speaker 1: I hadn't realized what a big deal it was, and you. 296 00:14:02,520 --> 00:14:05,959 Speaker 2: Just don't when you drop your son or your daughter 297 00:14:06,559 --> 00:14:09,640 Speaker 2: at these places and you see all the shiny faces, 298 00:14:09,640 --> 00:14:12,400 Speaker 2: and I see everyone carrying their bedding in with their 299 00:14:12,440 --> 00:14:14,760 Speaker 2: parents and their bags. I think every parent's feeling what 300 00:14:14,800 --> 00:14:18,800 Speaker 2: I'm feeling today. But all of these kids, this is 301 00:14:18,880 --> 00:14:22,120 Speaker 2: his lifelong friends, this is where it's all happening, and 302 00:14:22,200 --> 00:14:25,160 Speaker 2: the big university campus and the things he's going to study. 303 00:14:25,200 --> 00:14:26,760 Speaker 3: And I felt as jealous as hell. 304 00:14:27,480 --> 00:14:30,320 Speaker 2: I felt a huge hit of nostalgia and a huge 305 00:14:30,400 --> 00:14:33,120 Speaker 2: hit of jealousy, and I wanted it all again. But 306 00:14:33,320 --> 00:14:34,960 Speaker 2: at the time it was also I don't know if 307 00:14:35,000 --> 00:14:38,119 Speaker 2: you remember, as you say, off we went on our adventure, 308 00:14:38,480 --> 00:14:40,680 Speaker 2: but it was filled with angst and broken hearts, so. 309 00:14:40,720 --> 00:14:42,520 Speaker 1: Much fair, so much anxiety. 310 00:14:42,720 --> 00:14:43,360 Speaker 2: But we don't. 311 00:14:43,200 --> 00:14:45,640 Speaker 3: Remember any of that, do we. We don't remember the fear. 312 00:14:45,920 --> 00:14:48,120 Speaker 1: No, and you weren't actually ready. I remember thinking I 313 00:14:48,160 --> 00:14:50,240 Speaker 1: was a man at eighteen. I look back now, when 314 00:14:50,320 --> 00:14:54,080 Speaker 1: you were a boy, you were years off, years away 315 00:14:54,080 --> 00:14:56,680 Speaker 1: from being an actual, you know, a man. You were 316 00:14:56,720 --> 00:14:59,200 Speaker 1: just still a boy. You're not quite ready for it, 317 00:14:59,600 --> 00:15:01,640 Speaker 1: you know. And it's just like we still have to 318 00:15:01,680 --> 00:15:04,000 Speaker 1: sort of clean up after them, you know, and do 319 00:15:04,160 --> 00:15:06,320 Speaker 1: so much of their day to day. I'm thinking, he 320 00:15:06,400 --> 00:15:10,360 Speaker 1: ain't ready to run your life independently. But you've got 321 00:15:10,360 --> 00:15:12,280 Speaker 1: to let them go, and it's so hard. But what 322 00:15:12,320 --> 00:15:16,120 Speaker 1: a lovely reminder of your relationship with your mom. I 323 00:15:16,200 --> 00:15:18,200 Speaker 1: know you said she sort of died seventeen years ago, 324 00:15:18,240 --> 00:15:20,720 Speaker 1: but she feels very, very alive in your life and 325 00:15:20,760 --> 00:15:21,280 Speaker 1: in your heart. 326 00:15:21,320 --> 00:15:23,600 Speaker 3: To me, oh, look, she absolutely is. 327 00:15:23,760 --> 00:15:27,920 Speaker 2: And I just get that relationship so much more now 328 00:15:28,560 --> 00:15:31,000 Speaker 2: and in the kids' lives. Whenever they did well at school, 329 00:15:31,040 --> 00:15:32,960 Speaker 2: I said, oh, Grandma would be so proud of you. 330 00:15:33,240 --> 00:15:38,040 Speaker 2: That she's a rich seam in our lives. But occasionally 331 00:15:38,120 --> 00:15:41,680 Speaker 2: it's something like the scissors, or it's a phrase that 332 00:15:41,760 --> 00:15:44,800 Speaker 2: Mum used. She's to say, go to university, get your 333 00:15:44,840 --> 00:15:47,200 Speaker 2: piece of paper, and the world is your oyster, because 334 00:15:47,200 --> 00:15:48,560 Speaker 2: she'd never had a chance to do any of that. 335 00:15:48,840 --> 00:15:50,920 Speaker 2: And it's all reason I didn't even like oysters. And 336 00:15:50,960 --> 00:15:53,680 Speaker 2: so that was a laughing stop in my family, that phrase. 337 00:15:54,160 --> 00:15:56,480 Speaker 2: And now I feel it so keenly for the kids. 338 00:15:56,560 --> 00:16:01,480 Speaker 2: All that stuff that I thought was Mum and not me, 339 00:16:02,040 --> 00:16:03,640 Speaker 2: it's a rich scene in me too. 340 00:16:04,160 --> 00:16:06,960 Speaker 1: Would you say that now strangely right, because I was 341 00:16:06,960 --> 00:16:08,800 Speaker 1: speaking to a friend of mine who lost his dad 342 00:16:08,840 --> 00:16:12,240 Speaker 1: about five years ago, and he was saying how he 343 00:16:12,280 --> 00:16:16,600 Speaker 1: actually has a better relationship with his dad now he's 344 00:16:16,600 --> 00:16:19,000 Speaker 1: not around, but he is, he has these He just 345 00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:21,760 Speaker 1: has so much more love and understanding for his dad. 346 00:16:21,800 --> 00:16:25,360 Speaker 1: He's actually having this second wave, the second relationship, but 347 00:16:25,440 --> 00:16:27,920 Speaker 1: a deeper relationship. Maybe not a better one, but a 348 00:16:27,920 --> 00:16:29,680 Speaker 1: deeper one with him. Is that you and your mum now, 349 00:16:30,760 --> 00:16:31,640 Speaker 1: Oh absolutely? 350 00:16:31,720 --> 00:16:34,360 Speaker 2: And as I said last few weeks, was just nagging 351 00:16:34,440 --> 00:16:35,280 Speaker 2: Jack about have you done this? 352 00:16:35,400 --> 00:16:35,840 Speaker 3: Fet on that? 353 00:16:36,240 --> 00:16:38,760 Speaker 2: And I think Mum did this and it drove me crazy, 354 00:16:39,200 --> 00:16:41,920 Speaker 2: but it's necessary because he doesn't know anything. I'm sure 355 00:16:42,000 --> 00:16:45,080 Speaker 2: Mum thought the same. Also, when my mum did pass away, 356 00:16:45,080 --> 00:16:47,080 Speaker 2: a friend of mine bought me a plant called bad 357 00:16:47,120 --> 00:16:52,520 Speaker 2: Hair Day and that has been propagated in various parts 358 00:16:52,560 --> 00:16:55,880 Speaker 2: around the garden and once a year it flowers around 359 00:16:55,920 --> 00:16:56,960 Speaker 2: the time she passed away. 360 00:16:57,040 --> 00:16:57,800 Speaker 1: Oh you kidding me? 361 00:16:58,320 --> 00:17:01,920 Speaker 3: And I thought, what at what an amazing thing? 362 00:17:02,080 --> 00:17:05,280 Speaker 2: And ironically I can remember everyone's birthdays and the versaries 363 00:17:05,280 --> 00:17:07,480 Speaker 2: bah blah none. I was talking to my brother about 364 00:17:07,480 --> 00:17:09,680 Speaker 2: this recently. Neither of us can remember the date of 365 00:17:09,760 --> 00:17:12,720 Speaker 2: mum's death, and yet those flowers remind me. 366 00:17:12,760 --> 00:17:15,640 Speaker 3: Oh, it's October. That is beautiful, amazing. 367 00:17:15,840 --> 00:17:18,040 Speaker 1: I took about the presence, the reminding you of a 368 00:17:18,160 --> 00:17:20,720 Speaker 1: soul stall being around in your life. How lovely to 369 00:17:20,760 --> 00:17:21,160 Speaker 1: have that. 370 00:17:21,920 --> 00:17:24,960 Speaker 2: And isn't it I think you've spoken about this before too, 371 00:17:25,040 --> 00:17:29,040 Speaker 2: that when you think about family heirlooms, it's not the silverware, 372 00:17:29,440 --> 00:17:30,320 Speaker 2: it's the spature life. 373 00:17:30,320 --> 00:17:31,400 Speaker 1: It's not Antiqu's road show. 374 00:17:31,640 --> 00:17:32,960 Speaker 3: It's not Antique's road show. 375 00:17:33,000 --> 00:17:35,359 Speaker 2: It's the scissors, or it's the stuff that gets used 376 00:17:35,480 --> 00:17:37,720 Speaker 2: in your household every day that you can picture your 377 00:17:37,760 --> 00:17:40,879 Speaker 2: mum's hand pouring from the water, joke, whatever it is. 378 00:17:41,119 --> 00:17:43,480 Speaker 2: That's the heritage. And it's the cookbooks Dad gave me 379 00:17:43,960 --> 00:17:46,919 Speaker 2: mum's old cookbooks and there's a handwriting and everything in 380 00:17:46,920 --> 00:17:47,440 Speaker 2: the cookbook. 381 00:17:47,480 --> 00:17:47,760 Speaker 3: I love. 382 00:17:47,800 --> 00:17:53,840 Speaker 2: This is Geraldine's scones, Auntie Margherite's minestrone. Everything has a name, 383 00:17:54,200 --> 00:17:56,080 Speaker 2: and many of them from the back of packets, so 384 00:17:56,200 --> 00:18:00,240 Speaker 2: as wik bics that get turned into chicken kiev or 385 00:18:00,280 --> 00:18:04,040 Speaker 2: something like that. Everything was thickened with cornflower. It was 386 00:18:04,119 --> 00:18:07,440 Speaker 2: so much of its time. But these are the families, 387 00:18:07,520 --> 00:18:09,359 Speaker 2: and I don't want to play down war medals, but 388 00:18:09,440 --> 00:18:12,679 Speaker 2: we honor our male ancestors in a different way and 389 00:18:12,720 --> 00:18:14,400 Speaker 2: this stuff should be honored as well. 390 00:18:14,400 --> 00:18:17,520 Speaker 1: I think, yeah, you're right. Actually it is really important, 391 00:18:17,600 --> 00:18:22,000 Speaker 1: isn't it. It's how history and family story is kept alive. 392 00:18:22,480 --> 00:18:24,120 Speaker 2: It's the folklore and it's often the women. 393 00:18:24,160 --> 00:18:24,600 Speaker 1: It's true. 394 00:18:24,640 --> 00:18:27,840 Speaker 2: And without Mum used to know to the half hour 395 00:18:27,960 --> 00:18:30,119 Speaker 2: what all my cousins all around Australia were doing, what 396 00:18:30,280 --> 00:18:33,160 Speaker 2: mum's brother and the sisters were doing, I've lost I've 397 00:18:33,200 --> 00:18:36,440 Speaker 2: lost that link because Mum was the gatekeeper of all 398 00:18:36,480 --> 00:18:37,120 Speaker 2: the information. 399 00:18:37,280 --> 00:18:40,760 Speaker 1: There should be a museum, an international museum and national 400 00:18:40,840 --> 00:18:46,119 Speaker 1: museums of mums where there's like archives and databases for 401 00:18:46,240 --> 00:18:49,119 Speaker 1: all our family histories. Because you're right. Even even my 402 00:18:49,200 --> 00:18:51,480 Speaker 1: wife does it more than I do, you know, and 403 00:18:51,560 --> 00:18:54,280 Speaker 1: her mum did it as well. You're right. They are 404 00:18:54,320 --> 00:18:56,679 Speaker 1: like the central sort of prison for everything, aren't you. 405 00:18:57,520 --> 00:19:01,840 Speaker 2: Yeah? Yes, And and maybe you're right, like a giant 406 00:19:01,920 --> 00:19:05,400 Speaker 2: Arthur Murray dance chart been fam we need to say, okay, 407 00:19:06,160 --> 00:19:08,560 Speaker 2: who's who's the cousins, that's who's married who, That's where 408 00:19:08,560 --> 00:19:12,199 Speaker 2: they are they live at Bownup or have all of 409 00:19:12,240 --> 00:19:15,359 Speaker 2: that and maybe you know all the letters, the notes, 410 00:19:15,400 --> 00:19:18,840 Speaker 2: the handwritten recipes, all that stuff needs to be archived 411 00:19:19,359 --> 00:19:22,800 Speaker 2: and given this wonderful reverence that maybe we haven't in 412 00:19:22,840 --> 00:19:23,320 Speaker 2: the past. 413 00:19:23,720 --> 00:19:25,760 Speaker 1: Yeah, I'm going back to see my mum in a 414 00:19:25,760 --> 00:19:27,440 Speaker 1: couple of months time. I haven't seen it for three 415 00:19:27,480 --> 00:19:30,600 Speaker 1: years because obviously COVID lockdown all that. And the first 416 00:19:30,600 --> 00:19:32,040 Speaker 1: thing I'm going to do is smell the top of 417 00:19:32,040 --> 00:19:34,880 Speaker 1: her head. She has a very distinct conditioner She's been 418 00:19:35,000 --> 00:19:37,880 Speaker 1: using since I was a kid. She's never changed it, 419 00:19:38,200 --> 00:19:39,800 Speaker 1: and I always do it. The last thing when I 420 00:19:39,800 --> 00:19:41,880 Speaker 1: saw her, I just let her head forward and went 421 00:19:42,560 --> 00:19:44,920 Speaker 1: see let one, you know. And as soon as we 422 00:19:44,960 --> 00:19:47,560 Speaker 1: have a very very emotional reunion, the first thing I 423 00:19:47,640 --> 00:19:50,440 Speaker 1: do with oh my god, you're back. I'm back there. 424 00:19:50,680 --> 00:19:53,360 Speaker 1: It's that sense I need to bottle it. I need 425 00:19:53,400 --> 00:19:56,160 Speaker 1: to somehow I needed to permanently be around in my life, 426 00:19:56,200 --> 00:19:58,320 Speaker 1: you know, like your scissors and that the smell of 427 00:19:58,400 --> 00:19:59,960 Speaker 1: mum's conditioner. 428 00:20:00,600 --> 00:20:03,480 Speaker 2: Yeah, and that's the stuff that's far more important than 429 00:20:03,640 --> 00:20:06,440 Speaker 2: a silverware jug that's been passed down from your great grandparent. 430 00:20:06,480 --> 00:20:18,080 Speaker 1: One hundred percent so far, Amanda, Then you've chosen snoopy 431 00:20:18,280 --> 00:20:21,120 Speaker 1: a pair of left handed scissors as two of your 432 00:20:21,119 --> 00:20:24,640 Speaker 1: most treasured items, what is your last one. 433 00:20:24,920 --> 00:20:30,919 Speaker 2: It's a stone that I have had mounted in a frame. 434 00:20:32,000 --> 00:20:35,439 Speaker 2: And I found this stone when I was in my 435 00:20:35,520 --> 00:20:38,760 Speaker 2: mid twenties in Mudgie in New South Wales. I have 436 00:20:38,800 --> 00:20:41,240 Speaker 2: a weekend away with friends and I think I was heartbroken. 437 00:20:41,280 --> 00:20:43,200 Speaker 2: I think my boyfriend and I had broken up. We'd 438 00:20:43,200 --> 00:20:44,920 Speaker 2: broken up a number of times, but this one was 439 00:20:44,960 --> 00:20:50,040 Speaker 2: the big breakup. And I was heartbroken and went for 440 00:20:50,080 --> 00:20:53,240 Speaker 2: a walk and on the shore of the river I 441 00:20:53,320 --> 00:20:58,240 Speaker 2: found this rock and it looked to me like a 442 00:20:58,440 --> 00:21:03,600 Speaker 2: face puzzling into a hip. And there was just something 443 00:21:03,640 --> 00:21:07,520 Speaker 2: about the shape of it that made me think, that's 444 00:21:07,560 --> 00:21:11,920 Speaker 2: what I want in a relationship. I want that intimacy, 445 00:21:12,640 --> 00:21:19,320 Speaker 2: that closeness, that just something just felt immersive about what 446 00:21:19,480 --> 00:21:23,679 Speaker 2: that stone said to me about a relationship. And not 447 00:21:23,760 --> 00:21:26,040 Speaker 2: long after that, I met Harley, who I've now been 448 00:21:26,040 --> 00:21:30,119 Speaker 2: married to for thirty two years. This stone, for me, 449 00:21:31,200 --> 00:21:34,720 Speaker 2: was the portent of the weight of a potential of 450 00:21:34,760 --> 00:21:39,159 Speaker 2: a relationship. And your relationships, as we all know, ups 451 00:21:39,200 --> 00:21:41,640 Speaker 2: and downs and you're in love and then there's months 452 00:21:41,680 --> 00:21:44,119 Speaker 2: where you don't care too much. And a friend of 453 00:21:44,119 --> 00:21:46,280 Speaker 2: mine once said, and I think this famous psychology is 454 00:21:46,320 --> 00:21:48,919 Speaker 2: that the opposite of love isn't hate, it's indifference. 455 00:21:49,600 --> 00:21:51,320 Speaker 1: Oh my god, what a great word. 456 00:21:51,680 --> 00:21:54,359 Speaker 2: Yeah, isn't it incredible? It is and it's so true. 457 00:21:54,440 --> 00:21:57,280 Speaker 2: And you can go through fits of that in a 458 00:21:57,400 --> 00:21:59,880 Speaker 2: marriage and it's always a relief then to come out 459 00:21:59,880 --> 00:22:03,199 Speaker 2: the other side of that again. But I have this 460 00:22:03,320 --> 00:22:07,320 Speaker 2: on my shelf at home just because I'm very proud 461 00:22:07,400 --> 00:22:10,840 Speaker 2: of the longevity of our relationship and the stuff we've weathered, 462 00:22:10,920 --> 00:22:14,199 Speaker 2: years of IVF, all of the stuff that comes with that, 463 00:22:14,920 --> 00:22:18,280 Speaker 2: ups and downs, with careers, two fabulous sons who are 464 00:22:18,320 --> 00:22:20,480 Speaker 2: now leaving us, and once again trying to work out. 465 00:22:20,520 --> 00:22:24,800 Speaker 2: Now it's only been two weeks. Who are we? What 466 00:22:24,880 --> 00:22:28,479 Speaker 2: do we do? I've overcooked for two weeks. We've had 467 00:22:28,560 --> 00:22:31,600 Speaker 2: leftovers again and again the friend and the laundry shoots 468 00:22:31,600 --> 00:22:33,760 Speaker 2: empty and there's not stuff on the floor. The stuff 469 00:22:33,800 --> 00:22:36,359 Speaker 2: that I have railed against suddenly go oh, I want that. 470 00:22:36,920 --> 00:22:40,480 Speaker 2: So we now have to reassess who we are, and 471 00:22:40,520 --> 00:22:43,760 Speaker 2: so it's very timely that I'm looking again at this 472 00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:45,920 Speaker 2: stone to remind me of the essence of us. 473 00:22:46,400 --> 00:22:49,680 Speaker 1: You're forming new ground, aren't you a new identity? Now? 474 00:22:49,720 --> 00:22:53,560 Speaker 1: Because the other ones it's not needed anymore. It doesn't exist. 475 00:22:53,600 --> 00:22:55,800 Speaker 1: It's sort of gone with them, and it's. 476 00:22:55,640 --> 00:22:58,160 Speaker 2: So weird, Like we'll sit down. I say, let's sit 477 00:22:58,200 --> 00:22:59,800 Speaker 2: at the table to have dinner so we don't end 478 00:22:59,880 --> 00:23:02,320 Speaker 2: up sitting in front of the television every night. But 479 00:23:02,359 --> 00:23:04,480 Speaker 2: then as we're eating, I say, hurry up, because we're 480 00:23:04,480 --> 00:23:06,359 Speaker 2: on to sit in front of the television. This is 481 00:23:06,359 --> 00:23:08,760 Speaker 2: so weird, it's too weird just with the two of us. 482 00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:11,240 Speaker 1: And I bet the table suddenly feels just that bit 483 00:23:11,280 --> 00:23:13,280 Speaker 1: too big, like this is made for a family. 484 00:23:13,600 --> 00:23:15,399 Speaker 2: It's just us now, and the end of the tables 485 00:23:15,400 --> 00:23:16,680 Speaker 2: just filled with junk because we don't have to clear 486 00:23:16,720 --> 00:23:18,360 Speaker 2: it anymore because only two of us sitting there. 487 00:23:20,640 --> 00:23:23,760 Speaker 1: I love that you still got the stone because in a 488 00:23:23,800 --> 00:23:25,640 Speaker 1: relationship we use that a lot. Don't mean the rock. 489 00:23:26,240 --> 00:23:29,080 Speaker 1: She's my rock, He's my rock. That stone and that 490 00:23:29,560 --> 00:23:31,840 Speaker 1: sense of wanting to find someone out there for me 491 00:23:31,920 --> 00:23:34,800 Speaker 1: that only fits me. And that's what a great relationship is. 492 00:23:34,840 --> 00:23:37,840 Speaker 1: You slot in, don't you. And I've been married almost 493 00:23:37,840 --> 00:23:41,320 Speaker 1: twenty four years, and so I feel like I think 494 00:23:41,359 --> 00:23:44,320 Speaker 1: I've had probably several marriages within that one with my wife, 495 00:23:44,320 --> 00:23:47,199 Speaker 1: because you do you have these different seasons don't you. 496 00:23:47,200 --> 00:23:49,399 Speaker 1: You go through some really tough times and love us 497 00:23:49,440 --> 00:23:52,720 Speaker 1: to show up in very unusual places and experiences you 498 00:23:52,840 --> 00:23:55,359 Speaker 1: never thought you'd have when you started out, you know, 499 00:23:55,400 --> 00:23:57,119 Speaker 1: getting married and what your life would be and the 500 00:23:57,119 --> 00:23:59,720 Speaker 1: plans you had and kids and the houses and holidays 501 00:23:59,720 --> 00:24:02,320 Speaker 1: and all this other stuff that goes with life comes 502 00:24:02,359 --> 00:24:05,600 Speaker 1: along and changes, doesn't it, and evolve. So and you're 503 00:24:05,680 --> 00:24:09,600 Speaker 1: going through another big evolution, you know, together and separately 504 00:24:09,640 --> 00:24:12,320 Speaker 1: as well. But going back to the stone and still 505 00:24:12,320 --> 00:24:14,840 Speaker 1: seeing what's the most important thing is like, it's just 506 00:24:14,960 --> 00:24:17,240 Speaker 1: us two in the world. Actually, that's all we need 507 00:24:17,320 --> 00:24:18,240 Speaker 1: and then we can go from that. 508 00:24:18,600 --> 00:24:21,280 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's interesting that you know, this has been very 509 00:24:21,359 --> 00:24:23,280 Speaker 2: timely to talk about the stone because it sits in 510 00:24:23,320 --> 00:24:25,600 Speaker 2: the lounge room there, but along with a whole lot 511 00:24:25,640 --> 00:24:28,399 Speaker 2: of other stuff. But to look at it again now, 512 00:24:28,600 --> 00:24:32,399 Speaker 2: how timely this week to be reminded of the essence 513 00:24:32,440 --> 00:24:34,920 Speaker 2: of who we are. And they you know, they say 514 00:24:34,960 --> 00:24:38,200 Speaker 2: loves are doing word where you go through different permutations 515 00:24:38,240 --> 00:24:42,440 Speaker 2: in a relationship. Making a cup of tea is love, 516 00:24:42,880 --> 00:24:44,600 Speaker 2: Cooking a meal is love. 517 00:24:45,160 --> 00:24:47,639 Speaker 1: Amanda, That's so true. That can be like a really 518 00:24:47,760 --> 00:24:50,560 Speaker 1: intimate experience. I'm sure that if people at the start 519 00:24:50,600 --> 00:24:52,479 Speaker 1: of relationship in their twenties ago. No, it's not. It's 520 00:24:52,480 --> 00:24:55,520 Speaker 1: all on the bendrum as you let a relationship unfold. 521 00:24:55,760 --> 00:24:58,639 Speaker 1: You're in us actually sometimes just to simply put the 522 00:24:58,680 --> 00:25:01,119 Speaker 1: kettle on when you haven't been asked to, and just 523 00:25:01,200 --> 00:25:02,960 Speaker 1: taking a cup of tea to someone who know is 524 00:25:03,000 --> 00:25:06,359 Speaker 1: having a tough time well out, even words being said. 525 00:25:07,080 --> 00:25:10,480 Speaker 1: Everything everything is in that moment, isn't it. That's what 526 00:25:10,520 --> 00:25:11,159 Speaker 1: intimacy is. 527 00:25:11,240 --> 00:25:13,720 Speaker 2: It is, and that's the I know you moment. I 528 00:25:13,720 --> 00:25:16,600 Speaker 2: feel you. That's where you're seen. Yes, you're really seen. 529 00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:19,239 Speaker 1: Yeah, and I think that's what we all want. I 530 00:25:19,280 --> 00:25:21,240 Speaker 1: love the stone and I love you. Still got it, 531 00:25:21,280 --> 00:25:24,760 Speaker 1: and I bet it still means something now again, doesn't it. 532 00:25:24,760 --> 00:25:27,080 Speaker 1: It's got like a again. It's like like you described, 533 00:25:27,080 --> 00:25:28,879 Speaker 1: it's got this power to it. I can feel like 534 00:25:28,920 --> 00:25:33,840 Speaker 1: it's going. It's calling you back to just YouTube. 535 00:25:33,400 --> 00:25:35,240 Speaker 2: And I do need to be called back to it, 536 00:25:35,280 --> 00:25:38,400 Speaker 2: to be reminded as we're in this flux state of 537 00:25:39,119 --> 00:25:42,639 Speaker 2: kids have gone, what is it now? To be reminded 538 00:25:42,680 --> 00:25:45,520 Speaker 2: of that. And we were together for ten years before 539 00:25:45,520 --> 00:25:49,720 Speaker 2: we had children. For IVF you have together a long time, Yeah, 540 00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:53,959 Speaker 2: we've had a thousand incarnations of us, and so it 541 00:25:54,000 --> 00:25:56,040 Speaker 2: wasn't like we got married and had children and didn't 542 00:25:56,080 --> 00:25:59,640 Speaker 2: have a have together time. But it's been so long. 543 00:25:59,680 --> 00:26:03,800 Speaker 2: Now is seventy one. I'm sixty, he's seventy one. So 544 00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:08,399 Speaker 2: these new years, really we have to embrace them because 545 00:26:08,440 --> 00:26:13,359 Speaker 2: these will be These are the salad years before salad? 546 00:26:13,400 --> 00:26:17,400 Speaker 3: Is that the house years before before? 547 00:26:17,560 --> 00:26:20,119 Speaker 2: I don't the decline is not the right word. But 548 00:26:20,280 --> 00:26:23,000 Speaker 2: this is the bit we have to pay attention to. 549 00:26:23,560 --> 00:26:24,959 Speaker 1: It's so right, I feel that. 550 00:26:25,080 --> 00:26:28,400 Speaker 2: And we can't drift here because this is the bit 551 00:26:28,480 --> 00:26:29,879 Speaker 2: we need to pay attention to. 552 00:26:30,359 --> 00:26:32,200 Speaker 1: Yeah, you do need to come back to each other 553 00:26:32,320 --> 00:26:34,600 Speaker 1: in a really important way. It's like I read this 554 00:26:34,720 --> 00:26:36,720 Speaker 1: line the other day and I literally wrote it down 555 00:26:37,240 --> 00:26:40,760 Speaker 1: what would be like to grow younger towards the end? 556 00:26:40,960 --> 00:26:42,920 Speaker 1: And I thought, oh, I'm going to spend the rest 557 00:26:42,920 --> 00:26:44,320 Speaker 1: of my life thinking about that. 558 00:26:44,720 --> 00:26:46,159 Speaker 3: Do you want to do? You want to? 559 00:26:46,160 --> 00:26:47,760 Speaker 1: Though? I think it's you know what I want to 560 00:26:47,760 --> 00:26:49,480 Speaker 1: hang on too. I don't want to become cynical. I 561 00:26:49,480 --> 00:26:50,920 Speaker 1: don't want to look back and think all the good 562 00:26:50,960 --> 00:26:53,760 Speaker 1: stuff's happened. I still want to have I still want 563 00:26:53,760 --> 00:26:58,400 Speaker 1: that innocence that curiosity, that being awed by life every day. 564 00:26:58,440 --> 00:27:00,880 Speaker 1: You know, I'm fifty next year, so you know you're 565 00:27:01,080 --> 00:27:03,479 Speaker 1: you're into the overtime. You're into the second half of 566 00:27:03,480 --> 00:27:05,240 Speaker 1: your life. You know you're lucky to have got this 567 00:27:05,359 --> 00:27:08,160 Speaker 1: far and found someone I love, and I raised daughters 568 00:27:08,200 --> 00:27:10,520 Speaker 1: and had the life I've got. But yeah, I think 569 00:27:10,520 --> 00:27:12,480 Speaker 1: I still want to hang on. I don't want to calcify. 570 00:27:12,520 --> 00:27:14,560 Speaker 1: You know, some some people as get older, we've met, 571 00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:16,800 Speaker 1: we know people like this where they've kind of hardened 572 00:27:16,800 --> 00:27:19,679 Speaker 1: a bit. They're like weather to life. I don't want to. 573 00:27:19,720 --> 00:27:21,280 Speaker 1: I don't want that. I still want to hang on 574 00:27:21,320 --> 00:27:23,720 Speaker 1: to sort of an innocence to it all every day. 575 00:27:23,920 --> 00:27:24,920 Speaker 3: Well, they say, don't that. 576 00:27:25,320 --> 00:27:28,160 Speaker 2: Aging is when you when you feel your best user 577 00:27:28,200 --> 00:27:30,560 Speaker 2: behind you. And I've never felt that, And it sounds 578 00:27:30,560 --> 00:27:32,679 Speaker 2: like you don't either. And I've got a number of 579 00:27:32,680 --> 00:27:36,320 Speaker 2: friends my age, our mother's at this age, your cycle 580 00:27:36,440 --> 00:27:39,800 Speaker 2: was wrapping up, and yet I've got friends once just 581 00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:42,640 Speaker 2: gone into local politics, one has was working full time 582 00:27:42,640 --> 00:27:43,240 Speaker 2: as an artist. 583 00:27:43,280 --> 00:27:44,680 Speaker 3: It's what's my third act? 584 00:27:45,000 --> 00:27:49,000 Speaker 2: Yeah, young and working and building your life, raising a family, 585 00:27:49,200 --> 00:27:50,040 Speaker 2: what's the third bit? 586 00:27:50,440 --> 00:27:53,480 Speaker 1: You've got all these things to share and say, I'm 587 00:27:53,520 --> 00:27:55,400 Speaker 1: really interested to find out what is your third act. 588 00:27:55,440 --> 00:27:57,439 Speaker 1: I was in a coffee shop the other day and 589 00:27:57,480 --> 00:27:59,760 Speaker 1: I got chatted to this woman and she was she 590 00:27:59,800 --> 00:28:02,280 Speaker 1: told when she was seventy two, and I said, and 591 00:28:02,320 --> 00:28:03,680 Speaker 1: what are you up to today? She goes, oh, I'm 592 00:28:03,720 --> 00:28:06,160 Speaker 1: just on my way to therapy and I said, oh, wow, 593 00:28:06,160 --> 00:28:08,000 Speaker 1: have you been obviously doing that year? She went, no, 594 00:28:08,119 --> 00:28:11,119 Speaker 1: this is only my second dumb session. And we had 595 00:28:11,160 --> 00:28:13,720 Speaker 1: a laugh because I was like, I said, good on you. 596 00:28:14,000 --> 00:28:17,440 Speaker 1: I said, you're seventy two. You just don't mind. You're 597 00:28:17,480 --> 00:28:20,159 Speaker 1: just starting therapy. And she was like, oh, yes, I 598 00:28:20,200 --> 00:28:22,479 Speaker 1: just want to make sure that you know I'm clearing 599 00:28:22,520 --> 00:28:24,159 Speaker 1: up the stuff I should have done years ago so 600 00:28:24,200 --> 00:28:27,439 Speaker 1: I can enjoy the next few years. However I'm blessed with. 601 00:28:27,520 --> 00:28:30,600 Speaker 1: And I was like, that made my whole week. That 602 00:28:30,680 --> 00:28:32,720 Speaker 1: chatted that stranger of the fact that this seventy two 603 00:28:32,760 --> 00:28:35,560 Speaker 1: old was just about to start therapy, saying that, do 604 00:28:35,560 --> 00:28:37,480 Speaker 1: you know what, I've been carrying this around too much. 605 00:28:37,520 --> 00:28:39,480 Speaker 1: Now I don't want this anymore. I want to be 606 00:28:39,600 --> 00:28:42,320 Speaker 1: lighter for the next couple of years. Wow. Yeah. 607 00:28:42,400 --> 00:28:43,880 Speaker 3: I was talking about this with some girlfriends. 608 00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:46,920 Speaker 2: Yesterday. I had my sixtieth birthday last weekend, and think 609 00:28:46,960 --> 00:28:49,120 Speaker 2: what the image of what sixty is in your head, 610 00:28:49,400 --> 00:28:52,400 Speaker 2: which I thought was Whistler's mother in a rocking chair. 611 00:28:52,880 --> 00:28:53,840 Speaker 3: I pictured, that's. 612 00:28:53,720 --> 00:28:55,640 Speaker 1: What sixty was when you were younger. 613 00:28:55,640 --> 00:28:58,600 Speaker 2: We did, we did, And that's am I riding saying, 614 00:28:58,600 --> 00:28:59,800 Speaker 2: that's what sixty year olds looked like. 615 00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:02,440 Speaker 3: It might be? Might all the maybes. 616 00:29:02,280 --> 00:29:04,760 Speaker 1: You and I saw in the eighties when someone was 617 00:29:04,840 --> 00:29:07,480 Speaker 1: like sixty, they were like literally half dead, weren't they. 618 00:29:07,520 --> 00:29:11,040 Speaker 1: They were portrayed that way. And you know we were 619 00:29:11,120 --> 00:29:14,400 Speaker 1: aging and death phobic in our world, aren't we we are? 620 00:29:14,880 --> 00:29:18,040 Speaker 1: It's sort of just seen something ridiculed or thrown away 621 00:29:18,080 --> 00:29:20,200 Speaker 1: in the shadows and not thought about, like you were defunct, 622 00:29:20,200 --> 00:29:22,840 Speaker 1: you passed your cell by day, even if you're still alive. 623 00:29:22,920 --> 00:29:26,680 Speaker 1: Whereas now you realize, actually sixties, you see people doing 624 00:29:26,680 --> 00:29:29,280 Speaker 1: triathlons now, and there's seventies and stuff like that. You 625 00:29:29,320 --> 00:29:32,280 Speaker 1: can still have a really great connection to your own vitalit. 626 00:29:32,360 --> 00:29:33,680 Speaker 1: Andy in joy in Life. 627 00:29:33,880 --> 00:29:36,320 Speaker 2: There was interesting recently a number of women were discussing 628 00:29:36,360 --> 00:29:40,440 Speaker 2: this that the Golden Girls are the same age. They're 629 00:29:40,480 --> 00:29:42,680 Speaker 2: in their mid fifties, same age as the girls in 630 00:29:42,720 --> 00:29:44,160 Speaker 2: the reboot of Sex in the City. 631 00:29:44,280 --> 00:29:45,840 Speaker 1: They were not in their mid fifties. 632 00:29:45,960 --> 00:29:46,640 Speaker 2: Yeah they were. 633 00:29:46,720 --> 00:29:47,560 Speaker 1: They were like ninety. 634 00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:50,640 Speaker 2: And they weren't in a retirement village. They were in 635 00:29:50,800 --> 00:29:56,240 Speaker 2: just a condo. We assumed gray hair equals retirement village. 636 00:29:56,560 --> 00:29:58,320 Speaker 3: It's just cranky, old mold. 637 00:29:58,600 --> 00:30:01,200 Speaker 2: Yes, and they're the same an on screen as a 638 00:30:01,240 --> 00:30:03,240 Speaker 2: woman in the reboot of Sex and the City. 639 00:30:03,480 --> 00:30:06,840 Speaker 1: No, that is what that's depressed. 640 00:30:08,160 --> 00:30:13,800 Speaker 2: That's how we perceived fifty sixty then as opposed to 641 00:30:13,840 --> 00:30:14,680 Speaker 2: how we do now. 642 00:30:15,200 --> 00:30:18,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, so what do you want for the rest of 643 00:30:18,160 --> 00:30:20,240 Speaker 1: your life? What do you want more of? Because we 644 00:30:20,320 --> 00:30:22,240 Speaker 1: know what we're losing. What do you want more of? 645 00:30:23,080 --> 00:30:25,560 Speaker 2: It's hard to know, isn't it. I've got some people 646 00:30:25,600 --> 00:30:27,120 Speaker 2: to say, why are you still working so hard? 647 00:30:28,200 --> 00:30:28,800 Speaker 1: I love it. 648 00:30:28,880 --> 00:30:29,720 Speaker 3: I just love it. 649 00:30:30,400 --> 00:30:32,960 Speaker 2: I wouldn't be working this hard if I didn't love it, 650 00:30:33,200 --> 00:30:35,560 Speaker 2: saying to Mick Jaggaway still singing you know eighty seven 651 00:30:35,600 --> 00:30:37,720 Speaker 2: and whatever it is, you don't need to, But I 652 00:30:37,720 --> 00:30:40,000 Speaker 2: don't do it because I need to. I get energy 653 00:30:40,000 --> 00:30:44,480 Speaker 2: from it. So I don't know. I don't necessarily want 654 00:30:44,480 --> 00:30:46,400 Speaker 2: to slow down. It'd be nice to have a sabbatical 655 00:30:46,400 --> 00:30:48,640 Speaker 2: where you're going to take three months off and come 656 00:30:48,680 --> 00:30:51,760 Speaker 2: back again. But I want to keep going. I don't 657 00:30:51,800 --> 00:30:54,000 Speaker 2: know what I want more of. I'm getting a lot 658 00:30:54,040 --> 00:30:57,680 Speaker 2: better at taking time out. I think for a holiday 659 00:30:57,680 --> 00:31:00,960 Speaker 2: house recently, and I'm being quite strict with my boundaries 660 00:31:00,960 --> 00:31:03,440 Speaker 2: because I used to just say yes, I can do that. 661 00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:05,760 Speaker 2: Now I'm saying I won't be here and I had 662 00:31:05,800 --> 00:31:09,120 Speaker 2: to buy a house to do it. So I'm learning 663 00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:12,160 Speaker 2: the lessons of I've arn't the right to say no 664 00:31:12,480 --> 00:31:16,560 Speaker 2: to things, and I'm choosing that. But I don't fantasize 665 00:31:16,600 --> 00:31:19,320 Speaker 2: about having a quieter life. So I really don't know. 666 00:31:19,360 --> 00:31:20,960 Speaker 2: And in a way I like the fact it's still 667 00:31:21,040 --> 00:31:24,160 Speaker 2: up for grabs. Who knows, who knows what's around the corner. 668 00:31:24,840 --> 00:31:28,000 Speaker 1: Amanda Keller, You're a treat, You're a treasure. You really 669 00:31:28,040 --> 00:31:29,840 Speaker 1: heart and I generally want to thank you for my 670 00:31:29,920 --> 00:31:32,720 Speaker 1: heart to yours. Thank you for being so open hearted 671 00:31:32,880 --> 00:31:36,000 Speaker 1: in this chat as well. You shared a lot. It 672 00:31:36,120 --> 00:31:37,800 Speaker 1: meant a lot to me. You opened up my heart 673 00:31:37,840 --> 00:31:40,400 Speaker 1: with this chat as well, So thank you so much. 674 00:31:40,560 --> 00:31:41,479 Speaker 1: I love chatting to you. 675 00:31:41,720 --> 00:31:44,200 Speaker 2: I've loved it. I've loved it. And also I want 676 00:31:44,200 --> 00:31:47,040 Speaker 2: to thank you because I'd forgotten about the stone until 677 00:31:47,080 --> 00:31:50,320 Speaker 2: I'd gone to look for an item, and this could 678 00:31:50,320 --> 00:31:53,480 Speaker 2: not be more timeily in my life to remind myself 679 00:31:53,520 --> 00:31:54,240 Speaker 2: of that stone. 680 00:31:54,680 --> 00:31:59,720 Speaker 3: So thank you, oh man. 681 00:32:01,160 --> 00:32:05,360 Speaker 1: This chat with Amanda will stay with me for a 682 00:32:05,520 --> 00:32:08,960 Speaker 1: very very long time. Yeah, it really touched something which 683 00:32:09,000 --> 00:32:11,000 Speaker 1: is really in live with me with my eldest daughter 684 00:32:11,600 --> 00:32:15,000 Speaker 1: literally flying the nest, my first daughter to leave home. 685 00:32:15,480 --> 00:32:18,800 Speaker 1: As I speak to you, I didn't know that we 686 00:32:18,800 --> 00:32:21,000 Speaker 1: were going to get into that. It was like part therapy, 687 00:32:21,480 --> 00:32:23,520 Speaker 1: part the breaking open of my heart. I hope you 688 00:32:23,600 --> 00:32:26,080 Speaker 1: enjoyed it as well. She's actually my daughter will really 689 00:32:26,200 --> 00:32:28,840 Speaker 1: moving to a different city and about to start university. 690 00:32:29,120 --> 00:32:32,720 Speaker 1: So Amanda's chat, someone who's a little bit further down 691 00:32:32,760 --> 00:32:35,080 Speaker 1: the line than me, has reminded me it's actually not 692 00:32:35,160 --> 00:32:38,120 Speaker 1: about what I'm losing, which I think I've been focusing 693 00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:39,800 Speaker 1: on that lot. It's actually about what I'm going to 694 00:32:39,800 --> 00:32:42,440 Speaker 1: be adding to my life. I hope you got something 695 00:32:42,480 --> 00:32:45,680 Speaker 1: special from Amanda's chat. She's amazing, isn't she. We're always 696 00:32:45,720 --> 00:32:49,800 Speaker 1: evolving and as a turn fifty this year, aging is 697 00:32:49,840 --> 00:32:52,680 Speaker 1: a gift and it is better than the alternative. What 698 00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:54,760 Speaker 1: are you going to do with your next chapter? Thank 699 00:32:54,800 --> 00:32:58,560 Speaker 1: you very much from the wisdom of Amanda Keller. You 700 00:32:58,600 --> 00:33:01,440 Speaker 1: can follow Stuff of Legends on the iHeartRadio app to 701 00:33:01,480 --> 00:33:04,160 Speaker 1: find out new episodes and listen to the ones we've 702 00:33:04,200 --> 00:33:07,560 Speaker 1: already done. Some brilliant conversations, all kinds of brilliant people, 703 00:33:07,640 --> 00:33:12,120 Speaker 1: Russell Brown, Ricky Gervais, Matthew McConaughey, great one with Celeste 704 00:33:12,120 --> 00:33:15,120 Speaker 1: Barber that I loved. I'm Christian O'Connell and hopefully chat 705 00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:16,680 Speaker 1: to you next time on the Stuff of Legends.