1 00:00:00,080 --> 00:00:02,560 Speaker 1: We just heard from doctor John Boffer about the alcohol 2 00:00:02,640 --> 00:00:05,600 Speaker 1: changes coming into effecting Olie Springs, if you want to 3 00:00:05,600 --> 00:00:09,040 Speaker 1: purchase a lunchtime heavy beer. Now joining us on the 4 00:00:09,080 --> 00:00:12,480 Speaker 1: line is the head of Hospitality here in the Northern Territory, 5 00:00:12,720 --> 00:00:14,440 Speaker 1: Kathy Simmons. Good boarding to you. 6 00:00:15,320 --> 00:00:16,240 Speaker 2: Good morning Katie. 7 00:00:16,440 --> 00:00:19,000 Speaker 1: Kathy. What do you make of this change that came 8 00:00:19,079 --> 00:00:21,160 Speaker 1: into effect a little earlier in the week. You've got 9 00:00:21,200 --> 00:00:23,000 Speaker 1: to sit down, You've got to have a proper meal 10 00:00:23,120 --> 00:00:24,440 Speaker 1: if you're going to have a heavy beer. 11 00:00:25,600 --> 00:00:31,600 Speaker 2: Look, we are disappointed by the decision to continue down 12 00:00:31,680 --> 00:00:36,320 Speaker 2: this path of overregulation, but not particularly surprised considering what 13 00:00:36,320 --> 00:00:40,000 Speaker 2: we've seen before from the current Liquor Commission chairperson. Look, 14 00:00:40,600 --> 00:00:43,000 Speaker 2: it's one thing to vary the conditions of one license 15 00:00:43,200 --> 00:00:46,559 Speaker 2: as a disciplined reaction, but it's really unprecedented for the 16 00:00:46,600 --> 00:00:50,280 Speaker 2: Liquor Commission to add conditions to twenty licenses at once 17 00:00:50,720 --> 00:00:54,600 Speaker 2: when remember there's no electual allegation of wrongdoing or any 18 00:00:54,920 --> 00:00:58,560 Speaker 2: license breach. This isn't a disciplinedar rey action. The Commission's 19 00:00:58,560 --> 00:01:01,440 Speaker 2: actually been really clear about that. So that makes the 20 00:01:01,520 --> 00:01:03,160 Speaker 2: question what kind of action is this? 21 00:01:04,000 --> 00:01:07,920 Speaker 1: So like, what what's the reaction been from some of 22 00:01:07,959 --> 00:01:11,200 Speaker 1: those venue owners and operators about the changes. 23 00:01:12,040 --> 00:01:14,479 Speaker 2: Well, look, everyone's you know, this is the new rule. 24 00:01:14,560 --> 00:01:16,959 Speaker 2: Everyone's trying to do the right thing. So they've started 25 00:01:16,959 --> 00:01:20,520 Speaker 2: to train their staff in what to do on what day, 26 00:01:21,000 --> 00:01:23,319 Speaker 2: and so what we've seen, you know, over the last 27 00:01:23,360 --> 00:01:26,600 Speaker 2: two days for hospital's priests days, I should say, for 28 00:01:26,640 --> 00:01:28,880 Speaker 2: hospital staff trying to serve a beer over the bar. 29 00:01:29,440 --> 00:01:31,520 Speaker 2: The rule is going to be it is difficult to 30 00:01:31,600 --> 00:01:34,200 Speaker 2: explain to customers and to tourists, and it's easy to 31 00:01:34,240 --> 00:01:36,400 Speaker 2: make a mistake. You've got to remember this is a 32 00:01:36,520 --> 00:01:40,480 Speaker 2: very casualized workforce. You know, a casual staff are working 33 00:01:40,480 --> 00:01:43,160 Speaker 2: fifteen hours a week. We now need to check the day, 34 00:01:43,600 --> 00:01:46,240 Speaker 2: the time, the rest of your order, the number of 35 00:01:46,240 --> 00:01:49,120 Speaker 2: people you're there with, and whether you're sitting down, then 36 00:01:49,400 --> 00:01:51,880 Speaker 2: work out whether you drink is legal to serve. Like, 37 00:01:52,040 --> 00:01:53,960 Speaker 2: how is this rule going to be effective at actually 38 00:01:54,000 --> 00:01:59,000 Speaker 2: doing anything except tripping up staff and managers that are 39 00:01:59,040 --> 00:02:00,800 Speaker 2: trying to do the right thing, Like in. 40 00:02:00,720 --> 00:02:03,440 Speaker 1: A practical sense, like what kind of drinks would you 41 00:02:03,480 --> 00:02:05,960 Speaker 1: be talking about here? You know, for me, like I've 42 00:02:06,120 --> 00:02:09,200 Speaker 1: worked in a pub for about a long time. 43 00:02:10,000 --> 00:02:13,040 Speaker 2: Yeah, let's say you're a visitor at Alice Spring. If 44 00:02:13,040 --> 00:02:15,160 Speaker 2: you've just parked a camper van or a trader who's 45 00:02:15,160 --> 00:02:17,960 Speaker 2: decided to have a knockoff. You finished work at two pm, 46 00:02:18,080 --> 00:02:20,320 Speaker 2: you head over to the Gillen Club. You order, you're 47 00:02:20,360 --> 00:02:22,360 Speaker 2: not very thirsty, You're just order a handle, okay, a 48 00:02:22,400 --> 00:02:27,040 Speaker 2: handle of Cooper's Green hard rated stone and wood. Service 49 00:02:27,080 --> 00:02:30,200 Speaker 2: of that beverage is now illegal today a Thursday, but 50 00:02:30,240 --> 00:02:33,280 Speaker 2: two days ago on a Tuesday, that's fine. And also 51 00:02:33,320 --> 00:02:36,120 Speaker 2: on a Saturday that's fine too. But Wednesday, Thursdays and 52 00:02:36,160 --> 00:02:40,519 Speaker 2: Fridays that's not allowed unless you order a meal. 53 00:02:40,760 --> 00:02:44,560 Speaker 1: It it makes it hard to manage. 54 00:02:44,600 --> 00:02:47,840 Speaker 2: I would think, Yeah, it's very difficult to manage, really 55 00:02:47,840 --> 00:02:50,440 Speaker 2: difficult to manage. And like I said, difficult to understand. 56 00:02:50,440 --> 00:02:53,720 Speaker 2: It's difficult for staff to understand, and it's very difficult 57 00:02:53,800 --> 00:02:56,200 Speaker 2: for visitors and locals to understand. 58 00:02:56,520 --> 00:02:58,600 Speaker 1: Yeah, and like and we know we've already got other 59 00:02:58,639 --> 00:03:01,560 Speaker 1: restrictions in place in our I mean doctor John Boffer 60 00:03:01,639 --> 00:03:03,399 Speaker 1: was saying on the show that he feels that those 61 00:03:03,440 --> 00:03:08,400 Speaker 1: restrictions are having a massively positive impact. And you know, 62 00:03:08,440 --> 00:03:11,720 Speaker 1: I always think data is really important and making sure 63 00:03:11,720 --> 00:03:14,640 Speaker 1: that they've got that data the government so that any 64 00:03:14,720 --> 00:03:17,200 Speaker 1: changes that they make. You can actually see whether it 65 00:03:17,280 --> 00:03:19,880 Speaker 1: has or hasn't changed, because sometimes I feel like there's 66 00:03:19,880 --> 00:03:22,040 Speaker 1: a lot of changes that come into play, but you're 67 00:03:22,080 --> 00:03:24,040 Speaker 1: not really sure which ones are actually working. 68 00:03:24,800 --> 00:03:27,720 Speaker 2: Yeah. Absolutely, Look I just heard doctor Boffer on your 69 00:03:27,720 --> 00:03:29,640 Speaker 2: show before, and he just said that on Mondays and 70 00:03:29,680 --> 00:03:33,000 Speaker 2: Tuesdays things have gotten a lot better. Particularly well pubs 71 00:03:33,000 --> 00:03:36,040 Speaker 2: and clubs can serve over the bar on Mondays and Tuesdays. 72 00:03:36,080 --> 00:03:39,520 Speaker 2: There's no restrictions. These restrictions do not apply on Mondays 73 00:03:39,520 --> 00:03:42,720 Speaker 2: and Tuesdays, so alcohol served on premises is not a 74 00:03:42,720 --> 00:03:46,720 Speaker 2: cause for concern. There's what we've seen and what my 75 00:03:46,800 --> 00:03:48,920 Speaker 2: members are telling me, and what you know we've seen 76 00:03:48,960 --> 00:03:51,080 Speaker 2: in the news as well, is that criner and anti 77 00:03:51,120 --> 00:03:54,320 Speaker 2: social behavior in Alice Springs has gotten much better, particularly 78 00:03:54,320 --> 00:03:57,200 Speaker 2: over the last twelve months, and that's due to more 79 00:03:57,240 --> 00:04:00,400 Speaker 2: investment in policing. It's not due to overregulation of businesses. 80 00:04:01,160 --> 00:04:04,120 Speaker 2: We talk about reputation of being the wild North, but 81 00:04:04,840 --> 00:04:09,760 Speaker 2: in practice, most Territorians drink responsibly and moderately, and I'm 82 00:04:09,760 --> 00:04:13,600 Speaker 2: not really seeing that. You know, service over a full 83 00:04:13,600 --> 00:04:15,960 Speaker 2: strength beer on a Tuesday is any more or less 84 00:04:15,960 --> 00:04:18,640 Speaker 2: harmful than service of a full strength beer on Thursday. 85 00:04:18,520 --> 00:04:21,080 Speaker 1: Kathi, there will be some listening this morning going well, 86 00:04:21,120 --> 00:04:24,080 Speaker 1: surely there is a role though for hospitality and its 87 00:04:24,120 --> 00:04:29,200 Speaker 1: members in you know, shaping alcohol harm reduction moving forward. 88 00:04:29,279 --> 00:04:30,919 Speaker 1: I mean, what do you say to people listening this 89 00:04:31,000 --> 00:04:35,760 Speaker 1: morning that are going, you know, or hospitality or venues, pubs. 90 00:04:35,800 --> 00:04:37,400 Speaker 1: Everybody needs to step up here. 91 00:04:38,480 --> 00:04:41,680 Speaker 2: Well, so we do know that anti social behavior and 92 00:04:41,720 --> 00:04:44,160 Speaker 2: crime has a lot of factors behind it, and misuse 93 00:04:44,200 --> 00:04:47,400 Speaker 2: of alcohol absolutely does contribute. But by the Chair of 94 00:04:47,400 --> 00:04:50,359 Speaker 2: the Liquor Commission's own statements, there are no breaches in 95 00:04:50,400 --> 00:04:54,039 Speaker 2: these venues where he slapped these additional rules. His exact quotes, 96 00:04:54,320 --> 00:04:56,799 Speaker 2: which was on radio in the part in Dallas Screens 97 00:04:57,000 --> 00:05:00,960 Speaker 2: was it's not like these people are serving drunks. Venues 98 00:05:00,960 --> 00:05:03,919 Speaker 2: that serve over the bar and Alice Springs are adhering 99 00:05:04,000 --> 00:05:07,440 Speaker 2: to their responsible service of alcohol obligations and they're serving 100 00:05:07,440 --> 00:05:11,120 Speaker 2: a legal product in a responsible way to ordinary territoriums. 101 00:05:11,520 --> 00:05:15,520 Speaker 2: So let's investigate what actually is the cause of alcohol 102 00:05:15,640 --> 00:05:19,840 Speaker 2: related harm, where what is happening here exactly? Because the 103 00:05:19,920 --> 00:05:23,120 Speaker 2: Military Commission is actually said it's not like these people 104 00:05:23,160 --> 00:05:27,760 Speaker 2: are serving drunks. There is responsible service of alcohol. 105 00:05:27,360 --> 00:05:30,640 Speaker 1: Here look from your perspective then, like why you know 106 00:05:30,720 --> 00:05:33,479 Speaker 1: what reason has been given for this change? Then? 107 00:05:34,279 --> 00:05:37,200 Speaker 2: Well, in making our submission and for my members where 108 00:05:37,200 --> 00:05:40,480 Speaker 2: they've made submissions, we've asked for the evidence that actually 109 00:05:40,520 --> 00:05:44,640 Speaker 2: connects on premises service with the problems in our Springs 110 00:05:44,640 --> 00:05:48,000 Speaker 2: CBD and particularly at ye Parenia shopping center, which is 111 00:05:48,600 --> 00:05:51,520 Speaker 2: where the complaint originally came from, and we were denied. 112 00:05:52,240 --> 00:05:55,560 Speaker 2: There's just the assertion that these things are causally connected. 113 00:05:56,240 --> 00:05:58,600 Speaker 2: The most basic legal right is to see the evidence 114 00:05:58,640 --> 00:06:00,599 Speaker 2: against you, and that still has not been produced. We 115 00:06:00,640 --> 00:06:04,480 Speaker 2: want to see the data. Again. This isn't disciplinary like, 116 00:06:04,680 --> 00:06:08,479 Speaker 2: this isn't a disciplinary act. This is activism. It's something 117 00:06:08,520 --> 00:06:11,400 Speaker 2: that an activist commission has decided to do of its 118 00:06:11,400 --> 00:06:14,600 Speaker 2: own initiative, and in its arrogance, has decided that normal 119 00:06:14,680 --> 00:06:17,560 Speaker 2: legal principles don't apply. This is the final days of 120 00:06:17,600 --> 00:06:20,680 Speaker 2: the term of the current chair. He's been an activist before, 121 00:06:20,920 --> 00:06:22,800 Speaker 2: he'll be an activist again. You can have him wanting 122 00:06:22,800 --> 00:06:25,160 Speaker 2: your show in two weeks time after his term finishes. 123 00:06:25,200 --> 00:06:28,760 Speaker 2: But our judicial books, well sound annoyed. 124 00:06:29,000 --> 00:06:30,719 Speaker 1: You sound like you're annoyed. 125 00:06:30,839 --> 00:06:35,080 Speaker 3: Yeah, I am annoyed. You know, like if there were 126 00:06:35,200 --> 00:06:39,359 Speaker 3: the evidence connecting the harm. Like my members and the 127 00:06:39,400 --> 00:06:42,560 Speaker 3: staff that work in these venues, they're they're locals, they're 128 00:06:42,560 --> 00:06:46,000 Speaker 3: taxpayers too. They don't want crime and any social behavior 129 00:06:46,000 --> 00:06:48,839 Speaker 3: in their cities and their towns. They want to be safe. 130 00:06:49,240 --> 00:06:52,720 Speaker 3: But enough is enough, Like let's look at the things 131 00:06:52,720 --> 00:06:53,640 Speaker 3: that actually work. 132 00:06:54,520 --> 00:06:57,120 Speaker 1: And so you feel like this is just a bridge too. 133 00:06:57,000 --> 00:07:00,960 Speaker 2: Far, very much a bridge too far. We're looking at 134 00:07:00,960 --> 00:07:02,720 Speaker 2: our legal options. We're still considering those. 135 00:07:02,800 --> 00:07:05,159 Speaker 1: Yeah, right, well, Kathy, it sounds like there could be 136 00:07:05,160 --> 00:07:07,839 Speaker 1: a bit more to play out here. Hey, I always 137 00:07:07,880 --> 00:07:10,040 Speaker 1: appreciate your time. Thank you very much for having a 138 00:07:10,120 --> 00:07:11,520 Speaker 1: chat with me. And I got to tell you, you know, 139 00:07:11,600 --> 00:07:13,320 Speaker 1: yesterday we were almost having a bit of a laugh 140 00:07:13,360 --> 00:07:14,720 Speaker 1: about it, thinking, oh, you know, you got to have 141 00:07:14,720 --> 00:07:16,880 Speaker 1: your knife and fork to have a pizza now, But 142 00:07:16,920 --> 00:07:19,240 Speaker 1: it definitely sounds like it's a bit more serious than that, 143 00:07:19,480 --> 00:07:21,600 Speaker 1: particularly for those venues in Alice. 144 00:07:22,440 --> 00:07:25,720 Speaker 2: It's an absolute joke. And you know, it's just a 145 00:07:25,800 --> 00:07:28,480 Speaker 2: joke and another knife and fork, like you're gonna eat 146 00:07:28,480 --> 00:07:29,960 Speaker 2: a burger with a knife and fork, or is a 147 00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:32,760 Speaker 2: burger okay to eat with your hands? It just it 148 00:07:32,800 --> 00:07:33,480 Speaker 2: makes no sense. 149 00:07:33,520 --> 00:07:34,960 Speaker 1: Well, look, I don't know if I could eat a 150 00:07:34,960 --> 00:07:40,880 Speaker 1: burger with a knife and fork. Kathy, thank you. Was 151 00:07:40,920 --> 00:07:43,200 Speaker 1: always really appreciate your time this morning. 152 00:07:43,800 --> 00:07:45,360 Speaker 2: Thanks Poebie, thank you.