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Speaker 1: It's the Happy Families Podcast. It's the podcast for the

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Speaker 1: time poor parent who just once answers. Now, I'm really

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Speaker 1: excited about a special edition of the Happy Families Podcast today.

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Speaker 1: My guest is a high profile New York Times best

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Speaker 1: selling author. You might have heard of her. She has

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Speaker 1: a very very popular podcast as well. I'm going to

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Speaker 1: do the whole intro. Doctor Lisa Demore the author of

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Speaker 1: three three New York Times best sellers, the first one

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Speaker 1: all about teenage girls called Untangled, the second one, also

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Speaker 1: about teenage girls, called under Pressure, and her third brand

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Speaker 1: new book, it's called The Emotional Lives of Teenagers. I

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Speaker 1: have my doggyed copy with underlining and highlighting all through

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Speaker 1: it right here. She hosts the Ask Lisa podcast, which

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Speaker 1: is I think the only parenting podcast that I listened

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Speaker 1: to because diminishing returns right. You can only listen to

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Speaker 1: so much parenting and there are very few people who

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Speaker 1: are going to say stuff, but it's really worth grabbing

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Speaker 1: onto it. But this is the one that I listened

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Speaker 1: to outside of my own works in collaboration with UNISEF,

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Speaker 1: and is recognized as a thought leader by the American

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Speaker 1: Psychological Association. Doctor de Morris also a regular contributor to

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Speaker 1: The New York Times and CBS News. And I'm just

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Speaker 1: delighted to have Lisa joining me on the Happy Families podcast.

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Speaker 1: Thank you so much for being here.

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Speaker 2: Thank you for having me. I'm honored to hear that

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Speaker 2: mine is the podcast you listen to.

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Speaker 1: Yeah it is, and I'm not going to make a

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Speaker 1: big deal about it, but it's just a thrill to

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Speaker 1: have you here. Lisa. A couple of personal things about you.

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Speaker 1: You're based in the United States, you have kids. Why

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Speaker 1: don't you tell people a little bit about your family

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Speaker 1: so that they know that you've you don't just have

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Speaker 1: the clinical knowledge and have written the books, You've actually

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Speaker 1: got the on the ground experience, right.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. I'm based in Chica Hates Ohio, so in the

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Speaker 2: American Midwest, and i have two daughters, one who is

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Speaker 2: nineteen who just finished her first year of college, and

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Speaker 2: one who is twelve who's going into seventh grade. So

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Speaker 2: I'm on either ends of adolescence. And I also parented

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Speaker 2: teenagers and young kid through the you know, when I

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Speaker 2: think that that was a very unique experience for all

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Speaker 2: of us.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, thank you for that. As you know, I

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Speaker 1: have six daughters. My eldest has just recently announced that

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Speaker 1: she and her husband are expecting our first grandchild.

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Speaker 2: So congratulations.

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Speaker 1: I'm a big deal. It's kind of crazy. I'm officially

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Speaker 1: old enough to be a grandpa.

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Speaker 2: I don't there you go.

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Speaker 1: Well, I was going to say, I don't know quite

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Speaker 1: how that happened, but I do. But we don't. We

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Speaker 1: don't need to talk about that today. Yeah, all right,

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Speaker 1: So today's conversation is a little bit different. So formatically,

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Speaker 1: on The Happy Family's podcast, we normally only talk for

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Speaker 1: maybe fifteen or so minutes, but having you here, it's

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Speaker 1: just too good an opportunity. And I want this conversation

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Speaker 1: to take as long as it needs to to talk

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Speaker 1: about the emotional lives of teenagers. And I want to

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Speaker 1: ask you a question that is a little bit of

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Speaker 1: a provocation right out of the gate, and that is,

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Speaker 1: do we make too much of a big deal about emotions? Now?

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Speaker 1: I say that as somebody who teaches parents how to

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Speaker 1: emotion coach, and I'm all about recognizing our children's emotional world,

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Speaker 1: the science behind the just the incredible value of it.

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Speaker 1: And I've watched it happen to my own family when

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Speaker 1: I make a big deal about my kid's emotions. It's

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Speaker 1: it's valuable. But the more I'm watching trends in parenting

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Speaker 1: at the moment, the more I'm becoming concerned that we're

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Speaker 1: elevating the importance of emotions too much in our efforts

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Speaker 1: to support our children and our teens. Has the pendulum

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Speaker 1: swung too far? Lisa?

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Speaker 2: Perhaps I will tell you what your question reminds me of.

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Speaker 2: It reminds me of a conversation I had literally almost

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Speaker 2: twenty years ago, when I was enormously pregnant with the

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Speaker 2: kid who just finished her first year of college, my

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Speaker 2: oldest daughter, and so I was about to become a

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Speaker 2: parent for the first time. And I was with a

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Speaker 2: senior clinical colleague and we were wrapping up a meeting

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Speaker 2: and it was the last time I was going to

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Speaker 2: see her before I went on maternity leave. And I

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Speaker 2: was almost out the door, and she was like, Lisa,

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Speaker 2: do you want me to tell you how psychologists mess

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Speaker 2: up their kids? And I said yes, And she said

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Speaker 2: they talk about feelings too much, about them too much

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Speaker 2: that when the kid is having an upset feeling, the

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Speaker 2: psychologists parent might be saying, oh, you're having a mad feeling,

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Speaker 2: let's explore that mad feeling. And what she said is

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Speaker 2: there comes a point where you say, you've been upset

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Speaker 2: for a while, what's going to help you feel better?

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Speaker 2: And I think that that line of hers, which is

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Speaker 2: sort of a throwaway line, really encapsulates what we want

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Speaker 2: to do is to both validate and acknowledge and take

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Speaker 2: seriously kids emotions. But if talking about feelings isn't giving relief,

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Speaker 2: if they're not getting better by just getting some expression

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Speaker 2: to quickly change gears, And this is really something you know,

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Speaker 2: I lay on the book to move towards like, well,

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Speaker 2: then how do we tame that emotion? You know, what's

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Speaker 2: going to help you feel better? Being one of the

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Speaker 2: ways that we can start to ask that question. So

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Speaker 2: I think the way my colleague just guided me, it

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Speaker 2: was such great advice and I so appreciated it. You know,

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Speaker 2: on the way out of this meeting has obviously stayed

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Speaker 2: with me for a very long time.

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Speaker 1: When you hear that what do you think is going

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Speaker 1: on for an adolescent? What do you think is going

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Speaker 1: on in their mind?

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Speaker 2: Well, I mean I think it happened right that we

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Speaker 2: say that we want our kids to talk with us

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Speaker 2: about their feelings, and then when we do, we don't

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Speaker 2: always know what to do with, you know, with that moment.

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Speaker 2: And I will tell you my go to response, both

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Speaker 2: as a parent and also the one I recommend is

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Speaker 2: just start with empathy. Just it's a very small step.

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Speaker 2: But I think probably the words I say more than

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Speaker 2: anything after about nine pm in our house is like,

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Speaker 2: oh man, that stinks, you know, when they tell me

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Speaker 2: what's wrong, and my goal is to see us like

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Speaker 2: is that going to get it right? Is that as

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Speaker 2: much as you need it? Which is that you told

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Speaker 2: me about the upset feeling And I said, I hear

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Speaker 2: that that stinks, or I'm so sorry that happened to you.

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Speaker 2: And then I take a beat because sometimes they're like, yep,

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Speaker 2: I thought so too, and then they're ready to move on,

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Speaker 2: or they may deepen it and want to talk more

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Speaker 2: about it. But I think offering empathy is a first response,

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Speaker 2: and offering it with the confidence that that may be

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Speaker 2: all that is required in the moment does a huge

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Speaker 2: amount of work of both staying present but also being

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Speaker 2: a steady presence. Right, we're not getting agitated ourselves, We're

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Speaker 2: not canceling plans, we're not picking up the phone. We're

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Speaker 2: just saying empathy maybe what you're looking for here, So

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Speaker 2: I've got plenty of that.

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Speaker 1: I have two comments on this. Number One, I'm amazed

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Speaker 1: that you're even talking after nine pm, because for me,

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Speaker 1: I've got nothing at all. But secondly, what I love

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Speaker 1: about that, oh man, that stinks that that line is

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Speaker 1: you're not trying to fix the problem, but you're also

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Speaker 1: not going too deep into the emotional world of your teenager.

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Speaker 1: It's just this surface level. Maybe it's no, it's an

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Speaker 1: empathic response, but the invitation is then at their feet

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Speaker 1: to decide what they're going to do.

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Speaker 2: With Do you want to go deeper? Is that enough?

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Speaker 1: Great?

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Speaker 2: And it's a very It's also how much energy I

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Speaker 2: have at.

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Speaker 1: APR Okay, I can do that. I arrest my case.

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Speaker 1: I rest my case. So, Lisa, I see too common

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Speaker 1: but well intentioned mistakes that parents make when it comes

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Speaker 1: to their their teens and their emotions. The first mistake

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Speaker 1: we've already talked about we sometimes make too big of

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Speaker 1: a deal about emotions. In fact, just on that, We've

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Speaker 1: had a TV show in the last month or so

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Speaker 1: here in Australia called Parental Guidance I'm the co host

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Speaker 1: and expert on the show, and we've had some gentle

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Speaker 1: parents who are on the show. This time, we get

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Speaker 1: a whole bunch of parenting styles, whole bunch of parents

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Speaker 1: in the room. We get all the parents to do

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Speaker 1: these challenges with their families. We watch the challenges back,

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Speaker 1: and each parenting style comments on what they're seeing, what

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Speaker 1: they like, what they don't like about the other parenting styles.

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Speaker 1: It's fascinating conversations that come out of it. And one

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Speaker 1: of the biggest criticisms of the gentle parent was you

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Speaker 1: make too big of a deal about your kid's emotional state,

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Speaker 1: Like sometimes you've just got to get onto it. And

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Speaker 1: so this conversation I think, I mean, we've already covered

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Speaker 1: that off, but I wanted to highlight just how prescient

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Speaker 1: that issue is right now. But the second one that

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Speaker 1: I see a lot of parents try to just step

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Speaker 1: into is that a lot of parents try to shield

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Speaker 1: their children from emotional pain because I don't want their

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Speaker 1: kids to be traumatized. Now, there are two questions that

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Speaker 1: come out of this observation. The first is, I would

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Speaker 1: love it if you could talk about the idea of

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Speaker 1: trauma and children and teens experiencing trauma, because my sense

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Speaker 1: is the definition of trauma has expanded over the last

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Speaker 1: decade or so. But also if we could talk a

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Speaker 1: bit about why shielding kids from emotions might be counterproductive.

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Speaker 2: Just to start with the first part about over focus

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Speaker 2: on emotion under a focus on emotion, like where does

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Speaker 2: it really belong? One of the metaphors they share in

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Speaker 2: the book I learned from a dear colleague of mine

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Speaker 2: here in town, another psychologist tour named is Terry, and

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Speaker 2: I cite her in the back of the book, and

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Speaker 2: she has this great metaphor, And I think this gets

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Speaker 2: to sort of the gentle parenting question, which is she says,

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Speaker 2: emotions there should be one member of our personal board

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Speaker 2: of directors that we all have, like an internal board

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Speaker 2: of directors. And there's many people at that table, and

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Speaker 2: it's like or many you know, figures at that table.

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Speaker 2: So it's like our obligations, our interests, our logistical concerns,

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Speaker 2: financial concerns, you know, there's all of these things that

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Speaker 2: help with the making and emotions are on the board

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Speaker 2: that they do have value in helping us know how

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Speaker 2: things are going or how we feel, you know, whether

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Speaker 2: something's working or not working. But the kicker, the way

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Speaker 2: that Terry says it is emotions chair are on the board.

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Speaker 2: They do not chair the board, and they almost never

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Speaker 2: have the deciding vote. And I think that that way

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Speaker 2: of thinking about it, that emotions are enormously valuable in

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Speaker 2: balance with other considerations, but they don't call the shots.

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Speaker 2: You know, very rarely do they call the shots. I

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Speaker 2: think is a helpful way to approach it. Then there

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Speaker 2: is the issue of trauma, and I would say, justin

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Speaker 2: like to put it quite directly, I do think parents

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Speaker 2: worry that very very intense emotions will harm their child.

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Speaker 2: And I can tell you, as the mother of adolescence,

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Speaker 2: I see where parents get that concern. When a teenager

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Speaker 2: is having a very very power emotion, it is harrowing

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Speaker 2: to watch, It is harrowing to be, you know, present for.

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Speaker 2: And I really have a deep empathy for parents sense

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Speaker 2: that like, this may be damaging my child for them

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Speaker 2: to be as upset as they are, Like, I really

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Speaker 2: get that. Now. The very good news is that is

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Speaker 2: rarely the case that humans we are built to withstand

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Speaker 2: a great deal of emotion. Teenagers, by their nature, have

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Speaker 2: very intense emotions and typically developing teenagers will have a

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Speaker 2: deeply intense upset emotion followed not too long after by

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Speaker 2: a perfectly happy emotion. Right, there's sort of a rapid sequence.

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Speaker 2: So then it gets to the question of can emotions

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Speaker 2: harm our kids? And the answer to that is yes,

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Speaker 2: if they are traumatic, which then gets to your question

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Speaker 2: of what makes something traumatic? And certainly you're right. In

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Speaker 2: the US, the general discourse around trauma has really broadened

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Speaker 2: the use of the term. You know, the way we

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Speaker 2: think about it clinically, technically a psychologist has never changed,

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Speaker 2: but the culture uses the term in a very, very

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Speaker 2: broad way. So if we go to the definition that

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Speaker 2: we rely on as clinicians, a trauma is an experience

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Speaker 2: that out matches a person's ability to cope with the experience.

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Speaker 2: And the metaphor I use in my book is it's

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Speaker 2: the difference between like a surge of water that tests

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Speaker 2: a dam and a surge of water that breaks a dam. Right,

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Speaker 2: if coping is the dam and you know water are

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Speaker 2: the emotions. We do not want people overwhelmed. Now here's

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Speaker 2: the really like precise and important and maybe nitpicky a

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Speaker 2: critical issue and you know this, but just to explain

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Speaker 2: to your listeners. We don't actually refer to events as traumatic.

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Speaker 2: We refer to impact as traumatic because the same event

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Speaker 2: could traumatize one person but on another. And we know

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Speaker 2: this right from years of studying soldiers. You know that

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Speaker 2: they were all in the same battalion, they all went

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Speaker 2: through the same horrors. Some come back and they're totally

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Speaker 2: traumatized and others are just deeply upset, right, And so

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Speaker 2: it's really an interaction between the event, to whom the

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Speaker 2: event occurs, the various factors involved with the person who

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Speaker 2: experiences the bad event. Now that said important asterisk. There's

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Speaker 2: some things that people go through that are just so

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Speaker 2: bad we call them traumas because they're almost certainly going

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Speaker 2: to traumatize anybody, right, I mean, so you know, like

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Speaker 2: horrors of war and you know, obviously terrible assaults like

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Speaker 2: things like that. But the question of trauma usually comes

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Speaker 2: down to is the person able to cope with what happened?

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Speaker 2: And if the answer is no, then they stand to

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Speaker 2: be traumatized. And if a person is traumatized, it leaves

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Speaker 2: a mark. It is definitely bad for kids, it's bad

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Speaker 2: for anybody to be traumatized. But when you get into

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Speaker 2: the subtleties of it. It's not always so cut and dried.

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Speaker 2: What's the trauma or what's not going to be a

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Speaker 2: trauma for any given person.

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Speaker 1: I love the dam bursting and my resources to cope

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Speaker 1: with the demands of the moment. That's such a beautiful

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Speaker 1: illustration of that. It's terribly reductionist of me to say it.

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Speaker 1: But the word that I'll usually use when I'm describing

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Speaker 1: trauma is trauma is a result of processing. If we've

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Speaker 1: got the capacity to process and respond in healthy, in

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Speaker 1: adaptive ways, then even the most quote unquote traumatic things

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Speaker 1: can be minimally impactful. And there's your word again, the

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Speaker 1: quality of the impact, which which for me comes back

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Speaker 1: to a processing issue. We still haven't dealt with the

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Speaker 1: underplaying of emotions. But I just want to stay with

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Speaker 1: this trauma concept for a minute. When our children experience

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Speaker 1: something that we perceive could be traumatic because of their

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Speaker 1: huge emotional response, because of the quality they're processing right now,

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Speaker 1: the impact that it seems to have seems overwhelming. Outside

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Speaker 1: of empathy, which we've obviously covered off quite comprehensively already,

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Speaker 1: what other tools to parents have to support their children.

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Speaker 1: Some of the kids can respond adaptively and process effectively.

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Speaker 2: What that brings us to is like the giant, gorgeous

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Speaker 2: body of work on emotion regulation. I love that we're

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Speaker 2: talking about kids having really big, powerful feelings and those

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Speaker 2: are unavoidable. Those are often valuable for growth and development,

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Speaker 2: but they do need to be regulated. And as you know,

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Speaker 2: nearly half of my book, the chapters four and five

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Speaker 2: there's only five chapters, is devoted to very specific strategies

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Speaker 2: to help kids regulate, and it's in two buckets. Chapter

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Speaker 2: four is, sometimes kids regulate emotions through expressing them, talking

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Speaker 2: about them, getting them out, physically, weeping, listening to music

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Speaker 2: that catalyzes the experience. And sometimes kids regulate emotions by

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Speaker 2: taming them, by finding ways to quiet them, so seeking comforts,

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Speaker 2: temporary distractions, problem solving, gaining a new perspective, taking advice.

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Speaker 2: You know, like there's that sort of in that group

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Speaker 2: of regulatory strategies. And so the job of an adult

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Speaker 2: is two things. One is watch what your kid does.

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Speaker 2: I think so often we're like in there trying to

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Speaker 2: intervene and the kid is like, I'm going to go

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Speaker 2: cuddle with the dog and watch my show. Right, the

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Speaker 2: kid is already well underway with perfectly gorgeous coping. If

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Speaker 2: and only if your kid cannot figure out a way

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Speaker 2: to express feelings that brings relief and or a way

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Speaker 2: to tame feelings that brings relief, then you get in

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Speaker 2: on it. Maybe get them talking if you think they

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Speaker 2: need to do that. Maybe offer them comforts if you

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Speaker 2: think that would actually help take the emotion down a

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Speaker 2: few notches. But to see ourselves in that auxiliary role

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Speaker 2: of supporting what truly kids do quite naturally. And I

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Speaker 2: think often, and I think this was very much an

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Speaker 2: effect of writing this book, I think often we don't

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Speaker 2: appreciate enough how good kids are regulating their own emotions,

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Speaker 2: because sometimes they use strategies that strike becaus as quirky

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Speaker 2: or just don't appreciate them, like you know, gone outside

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Speaker 2: to you know, run around and play sports and blow

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Speaker 2: off steam. Like that's an emotion regulatory strategy for a

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Speaker 2: lot of kids. It's a good one, but we don't

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Speaker 2: always see it for what it is.

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Speaker 1: Let's say we go back to that first example that

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Speaker 1: you use. You've got a child who's had a big emotion,

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Speaker 1: maybe they have experienced something that's quite traumatic, and now

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Speaker 1: they're sitting in front of the television, eating ice cream

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Speaker 1: out of the blanket and pedting the dog like you

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Speaker 1: suggested for me. I would see my child doing that,

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Speaker 1: and I would be concerned. Hang on, this is not adaptive.

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Speaker 1: Is you're not actually dealing with it. You're distracting yourself.

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Speaker 1: You're not there at all. Now I know the value

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Speaker 1: of distraction in my mind. Logically, I get that sometimes

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Speaker 1: you just need a day or two or a week

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Speaker 1: or two to adapt to the new reality. Your friends

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Speaker 1: have been bullying you, you've lost your friendship group, you've

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Speaker 1: dumped your boyfriend or your girlriend, or they dumped you.

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Speaker 1: Some big emotional upheopal has happened, and you kind of

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Speaker 1: do need to just hide under the blankets and hibernate.

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Speaker 1: And yet on about day two or day three, you

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Speaker 1: know that, even though you know that this is necessary

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Speaker 1: and mourning and grief are part of the emotional repertoire

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Speaker 1: and experience of kids, you know that you're going to

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Speaker 1: be banging on that door and saying you need to

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Speaker 1: get up, You need to get on with things like

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Speaker 1: this process of leaving it to them, but feeling a

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Speaker 1: need to interfere. It's a reality of parenting right, and

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Speaker 1: we just want the best for our kids. Our intentions

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Speaker 1: are good. Where do we draw that line.

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Speaker 2: Let's say it wasn't traumatic, but it was very upsetting,

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Speaker 2: because obviously if a kid's been traumatized, we're going to

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Speaker 2: go down a different path in terms of intervention, but

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Speaker 2: just very upsetting. The goal of good coping is that

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Speaker 2: it brings relief and does no harm. That's the definition

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Speaker 2: of what constitutes good coping. And so it's well within

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Speaker 2: the realm of possibility that a kid could use distraction

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Speaker 2: for coping and get relief, but start to use so

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Speaker 2: much distraction, you know, day after day binge watching TV

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Speaker 2: or day after day playing on video games to try

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Speaker 2: to suppress emotions, that it starts to cause harm, meaning

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Speaker 2: they're not doing the other things they're supposed to be doing,

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Speaker 2: or they're not getting enough sleep, or they're now becoming

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Speaker 2: you know, and they're not physically active, or it's damaging

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Speaker 2: their good relationships. And so I think that that if

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Speaker 2: we work with then that idea of like, if it's

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Speaker 2: bringing relief and doing no harm, it's fine. And I

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Speaker 2: tell this story in this book about my older daughter

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Speaker 2: with her permission at the height of her stress about

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Speaker 2: the college process taking she had a can of Seltzer

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Speaker 2: and she was closed and she was shaking it, and

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Speaker 2: I was like, what are you doing. She's like, I'm

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Speaker 2: so stressed about the college process. I'm gonna go spray

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Speaker 2: this all over the backyard. Okay, super weird brings relief

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Speaker 2: does no harm? Fine, Like fine, Like we can sacrifice

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Speaker 2: one can of seltzer to the college process. So what

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Speaker 2: I've come to really think about and again, like it's

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Speaker 2: so useful, and I know you have this experience too,

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Speaker 2: like when you write a book, like you really have

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Speaker 2: to sort out a new way of thinking about things,

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Speaker 2: especially around distraction. The issue with distraction is not in

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Speaker 2: and of itself distraction. Distraction can actually be very valuable.

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Speaker 2: It's dosing, right that you can't distract so much that

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Speaker 2: you create a new set of problems. And so my

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Speaker 2: own conversation is clinically with teenagers are much much better

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Speaker 2: now that I'm like, yeah, distract yourself, fine, like video games. Fine,

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Speaker 2: it's not the distraction, it's the dosing. That conversation goes

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Speaker 2: well because they're like, yes, I'm not doing my homework

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Speaker 2: because of the distraction. I'm like all right, you need

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Speaker 2: to fix the dosing, like you can still play video games,

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Speaker 2: but not so much.

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Speaker 1: I love the simplicity of that. It's just so it's

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Speaker 1: so reassuring to hear. Now, let's step back into that

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Speaker 1: last part of that question that we kind of moved

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Speaker 1: away from shooting emotions, shooting our kids from their big emotions.

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Speaker 1: Can we talk about why that's counterproductive and are there

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Speaker 1: any times when it actually would be useful?

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Speaker 2: So the useful time is if you think there's a

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Speaker 2: chance they could become traumatized, right, I think that that's

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Speaker 2: the line, Like, we don't let kids become traumatized if

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Speaker 2: we can help it. And so if you know, you know,

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Speaker 2: that is just going to overwhelm a kid. And it's interesting,

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Speaker 2: like even you can picture, like you know, kids looking

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Speaker 2: at horror movies, right, that could be traumatizing for some kids,

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Speaker 2: or kids watching pornography can be traumatizing for them like

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Speaker 2: that they'd start unable to cope and then they really

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Speaker 2: are suffering as a result. So we shield kids from

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Speaker 2: those kinds of things. There is, however, and this is

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Speaker 2: I think the hardest thing to come to terms with

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Speaker 2: as a parent. There's such value in our kids experiencing distress.

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Speaker 2: And I think the reason it's so hard as a

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Speaker 2: parent is that we are programmed to not want to

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Speaker 2: see our kids in pain, right, I mean, when your

404
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Speaker 2: kid is in pain, like it's just everything in you

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Speaker 2: as a parent wants to make it stop. And even

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Speaker 2: like anytime my daughters have had like colds, right or flus,

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Speaker 2: I have thought, like I would give anything that I

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Speaker 2: could have the symptoms and not watch them have the symptoms.

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Speaker 2: Like I would so much rather be sick than witness

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Speaker 2: them being sick, you know. And and so I think

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Speaker 2: when our kid's in pain, like every like sell in

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Speaker 2: our parenting body is like what can I do? What

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Speaker 2: can I do to stop this? Okay, but here's why

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Speaker 2: we don't want to. Number One, it's the waste of

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Speaker 2: your energy. Your kid's going to be in pain, so

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Speaker 2: like save your energy for helping them through it, Like

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Speaker 2: you're you can't get around this. Number Two, it helps

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Speaker 2: them grow. You know that when kids are in pain

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Speaker 2: either because you know, maybe they had a bad breakup

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Speaker 2: and so they have to like really figure out how

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Speaker 2: to get past that. Who they can draw on for support,

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Speaker 2: like making sense of that relationship for themselves figuring that out.

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Speaker 2: Like it's miserable to watch, but it's a huge growth

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Speaker 2: experience to come through something like that, or they learn

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Speaker 2: not to do something that they shouldn't have done that

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Speaker 2: caused so much pain, right, I mean, just you know,

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Speaker 2: I think about a fifteen year old boy I had

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Speaker 2: in my practice who cheated and got caught and it

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Speaker 2: was bad and he was in big trouble and he

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Speaker 2: got stuck with me and it was not good. And

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Speaker 2: I remember him saying, like, you know, this is really

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Speaker 2: making me think about the kind of person I want

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Speaker 2: to be, you know, and you don't get there through

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Speaker 2: easy experiences. So it's hard to watch our kids in pain,

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Speaker 2: and yet there's real value. And it also, this is

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Speaker 2: the other thing. It's where empathy comes from. I mean

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Speaker 2: that experience of like being willing to face and accept

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Speaker 2: one's own distress. I think it is actually the basis

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Speaker 2: of being able to tolerate and accept other people's distress.

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Speaker 1: I've been talking with doctor Lisa Demore. She is the

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Speaker 1: author of the Emotional Lives of Teenagers, a brand new

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Speaker 1: best selling book on the New York Times List all

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Speaker 1: about the emotional lives about teenagers. Because I had so

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Speaker 1: much fun talking with Lisa, and the conversation went so long.

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Speaker 1: We're going to bring you part two of this discussion

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Speaker 1: next Wednesday. Can't wait to share it with you as

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Speaker 1: we talk about a whole lot of other things like

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Speaker 1: why are boys doing such harmful things, especially not just

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Speaker 1: to themselves but also to the girls around them, And

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Speaker 1: what does shame do as an emotion to our teens.

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Speaker 1: That's all coming up next week as we continue our

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Speaker 1: conversation with doctor Lisa Demore, the author of the Emotional

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Speaker 1: Lives of Teenagers. The Happy Families podcast is produced by

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Speaker 1: Justin Ruland from Bridge Media. Craig Bruce is our executive

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Speaker 1: producer and if you like more about making your family happier,

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Speaker 1: please please visit us at Happy Families dot com dot

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Speaker 1: au and become a member today. When you become a member,

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00:23:29,920 --> 00:23:31,600
Speaker 1: you support the work that we're doing and help us

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Speaker 1: to reach more families to make a bigger difference in

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Speaker 1: their lives.