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Speaker 1: Earlier this week the Labor Party in ount Selena Rubo

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Speaker 1: would take the important role of opposition leader. Duran Young

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Speaker 1: is set to be the deputy, with the small opposition

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Speaker 1: receiving resources and funding to officially hold the government to account.

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Speaker 1: Now joining us on the line is Robin Lamley, the

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Speaker 1: Independent member Farara lun Good morning.

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Speaker 2: Robin, Good morning, Katie.

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Speaker 1: Robin. You took to social media earlier in the week

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Speaker 1: to congratulate the new opposition leader, but also cautioned that

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Speaker 1: it is a role which comes with great responsibility.

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Speaker 2: I did, Katie. I've been observing the former Labor government,

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Speaker 2: the former Labor ministers now for eight years, quite closely,

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Speaker 2: and like Selena, many of them I think were taking

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Speaker 2: the mickey out of the position. They a lot of

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Speaker 2: them had small children. They carried their children throughout their

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Speaker 2: time as ministers, gave birth to children and looked after

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Speaker 2: small children, and that's lovely in itself. I think what

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Speaker 2: I observe is that a lot of them worked part

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Speaker 2: time as ministers on huge incomes, and I really believe

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Speaker 2: that that's one of the reasons why they failed in government,

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Speaker 2: because they weren't one hundred percent dedicated to their position.

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Speaker 2: They tried to do what is not just a full

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Speaker 2: time job as a twenty four to seven job part time,

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Speaker 2: and you could see that they had their children with

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Speaker 2: them at different events. Lauren Moss was another obvious person

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Speaker 2: who did that a lot. I remember she traveled down

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Speaker 2: to Alice Springs a few years ago and took her

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Speaker 2: little child around two different meetings and agency visits. And

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Speaker 2: it just doesn't work, Katie. And you know, I'm probably

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Speaker 2: sounding like a fifty nine year old bit sort of

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Speaker 2: out a date, but I do have a very strong

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Speaker 2: work ethic and I always judge people by the people

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Speaker 2: that we employ in our shop, in our friends. And

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Speaker 2: they can't take their kids to work, well, and I can't.

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Speaker 1: I think that's a good point to make.

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Speaker 2: It's inconvenient. They have to find childcare arrangements for their

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Speaker 2: children and they have to work full time like most Australians.

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Speaker 2: So I think Labor have done the wrong thing there

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Speaker 2: and amongst all sorts of other things that they're Yeah, well,

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Speaker 2: I think wonder how Selena is going to manage.

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Speaker 1: I think that's I think that's a good point to make, Robin,

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Speaker 1: because look I'm listening and I'm thinking, oh, shit, I've

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Speaker 1: had to, you know, like I've had to drag my

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Speaker 1: kids around two different things over the years, as I

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Speaker 1: know that, you know, and and you know, they've had

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Speaker 1: to come into work at different times. I can recall

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Speaker 1: days when, you know, when my eldest was quite young,

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Speaker 1: you know, doing an interview with the Chief Minister and

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Speaker 1: seeing a swinging around on the chair and the studio

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Speaker 1: behind and thinking, oh my goodness, I can't believe I've

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Speaker 1: had to bring it to work, you know. And it's

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Speaker 1: always a last resort for me. They're older now, but

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Speaker 1: it's always the last resort for me, as I know

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Speaker 1: it is for a lot of parents. So you know,

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Speaker 1: I know there'll be some people listening this morning who

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Speaker 1: are thinking, oh, come on, Robin, you know that's what

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Speaker 1: some of us have to do in terms of juggling.

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Speaker 1: But we are talking about.

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Speaker 2: Yes, yeah, but I have to ask you facetiously, are

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Speaker 2: you on two hundred and seventy five thousand dollars a

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Speaker 2: year definitely not afford if you are to organize childcare

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Speaker 2: and sort it out. Yeah. I'm definitely not a little

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Speaker 2: bit different here, Katie. You know I get that occasionally,

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Speaker 2: and I did it myself. Y, you take kids to

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Speaker 2: work and you have to make do, and particularly with

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Speaker 2: childcare being so difficult to find. But I just saw

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Speaker 2: this as a real feature or characteristic of the former

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Speaker 2: labor government. Nicole Manison was another one I know work

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Speaker 2: part time and for that, as a former police minister,

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Speaker 2: we all suffered. We watch crime escalates to crisis levels

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Speaker 2: in Alice Springs because the police minister was at home

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Speaker 2: looking after the kids a lot of the time. And

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Speaker 2: I can hear people crying across nor the terrorory me

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Speaker 2: saying this that I've held onto this for a long time. Katie, Yeah,

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Speaker 2: I absolutely stand by what I'm saying. It is wrong

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Speaker 2: that ministers who have paid a huge amount of money

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Speaker 2: with a massive responsibility work part time.

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Speaker 1: Rob And I know that they would argue that they

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Speaker 1: don't that they would probably argue that you know that

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Speaker 1: they do work after hours, and you know there's a

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Speaker 1: lot that they have to give up on the weekends

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Speaker 1: in order to do their roles. So it's fair enough

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Speaker 1: to take the kids in to work at different times.

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Speaker 2: Well, good, bring it on. I'd like that debate, and

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Speaker 2: I'd like some sincerity around it, because I think we've

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Speaker 2: all suffered because a lot of these ministers haven't been

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Speaker 2: upfront and honest about it. And there lies the next

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Speaker 2: problem is what happened with Labor as a result of

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Speaker 2: how they behaved, and that is not telling the truth

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Speaker 2: to territories. I mean, you can hide for so long

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Speaker 2: and you can spend all the nonsense you want. You

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Speaker 2: could call red black or yellow purple, and it's the opposite.

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Speaker 2: But people know when they're not being told the truth.

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Speaker 2: They know when they're being spun a load of nonsense.

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Speaker 2: And I think we saw that for many years by

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Speaker 2: the former Labor government.

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Speaker 1: Robert, I want to ask you. I mean with the

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Speaker 1: opposition leader, they get paid. You've set around two hundred

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Speaker 1: and seventy five thousand dollars a year they does the

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Speaker 1: opposition also get a raft of resources there's an MLA

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Speaker 1: like yourself or the other independents don't get absolutely.

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Speaker 2: So the opposition get their own well appointed suite on

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Speaker 2: Level four of Parliament House, which is under the well

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Speaker 2: known Level five where governments sit, and they from what

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Speaker 2: I recall, they get about one million dollars to spend

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Speaker 2: on staff and operating their office. So the opposition leader

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Speaker 2: gets around two hundred and seventy five thousand dollars a year,

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Speaker 2: and the deputy gets an extra allowance on top of

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Speaker 2: the basic salary of all members of Parliament is around

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Speaker 2: one hundred and sixty five I think, or maybe one

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Speaker 2: hundred and seventy thousand dollars. We all get that. That's

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Speaker 2: what I get, and for the extra duties that a

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Speaker 2: lot of a lot of people get, there is extra money.

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Speaker 2: For example, if you're the deputy Opposition leader, I think

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Speaker 2: you might get another thirty or forty thousand on top

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Speaker 2: of that. I haven't got the list in front of me.

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Speaker 2: If you're the whip, you get extra money. If you're

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Speaker 2: a chair of a committee, you get extra money. So

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Speaker 2: there's not many members that just sit on the basic salary,

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Speaker 2: but as an independent member get I just get the

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Speaker 2: basic salary and if I sit on a committee, I

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Speaker 2: might be eligible for an extra sixteen thousand dollars and

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Speaker 2: that's what I got over the last four years as

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Speaker 2: a member of the Public Accounts Committee, because that has

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Speaker 2: special responsibilities. But look the money, the money flows fairly

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Speaker 2: freely in politics, and we've got nothing to complain about

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Speaker 2: the territory and should be watching how these people execute

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Speaker 2: their roles and I think they should be more accountable.

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Speaker 2: I mean a lot of jurisdictions it's a requirement that

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Speaker 2: ministers show their diary, have a public diary where you

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Speaker 2: can see where the ministers go and what they do.

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Speaker 2: That to be fair enough, Well, it's very it would

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Speaker 2: be very confronting for the like well I've seen in

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Speaker 2: the past. You have to account for every hour of

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Speaker 2: their day. It would be quite incredible.

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Speaker 1: Looks Robin. There are a couple of people messaging through saying, Robin,

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Speaker 1: this is a new low for you, you know, calling

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Speaker 1: into question a mum juggling her kids. There's others backing

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Speaker 1: you up saying you know that you're right. People have

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Speaker 1: not been working full time in their jobs. So it

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Speaker 1: is like there's definitely you know, that discussion starting to

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Speaker 1: happen around I guess the way you know, the way

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Speaker 1: in which they man Yeah, it's.

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Speaker 2: Just being accountable. And when you are earning a huge

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Speaker 2: amount of money, and I dare say that people calling

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Speaker 2: in aren't earning anywhere close to what the Northern Territory

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Speaker 2: ministers the It really is important that you sort out

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Speaker 2: your childcare arrangement and you do work all time. I

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Speaker 2: remember when Gunner took about five weeks off on paternity

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Speaker 2: leave when he was Chief Minister. I mean any other

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Speaker 2: normal person you'd say yes, But the Chief Minister of

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Speaker 2: the Northern Territory, who's not on two hundred and seventy

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Speaker 2: five thousand, he was on about three hundred thousand dollars

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Speaker 2: taking weeks and weeks of paternity leave. I know this

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Speaker 2: isn't going to go down well with certain sectors, but

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Speaker 2: I feel I can say what I like because this

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Speaker 2: is the truth and this is what goes on and

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Speaker 2: people need to know that. And if it's okay with Territorians,

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Speaker 2: then I'll apologize and move on to the next issue.

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Speaker 2: But I think at the beginning of the parliamentary term

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Speaker 2: like this, it's a question to stay put it out there.

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Speaker 2: You know that this is what has been going on.

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Speaker 2: Part time ministers are underperforming, under delivering and not telling

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Speaker 2: the truth to territorians.

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Speaker 1: Robin, I want to ask it is looking I mean,

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Speaker 1: just when we sort of thought like things were looking

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Speaker 1: like they've been decided when it comes to the election

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Speaker 1: rethrow of preferences in the seat of Nightcliff has the

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Speaker 1: former Chief Minister Natasha Files looking as though she's going

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Speaker 1: to lose to the Greens. So while final vote counts

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Speaker 1: are yet to be confirmed by the Northern Territory Electoral Commission,

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Speaker 1: the updated count has Files on just forty two votes

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Speaker 1: behind the Greens Cat Macnamara in the two candidate preferred counts,

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Speaker 1: so two hundred votes to twenty two hundred and forty two,

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Speaker 1: despite the fact, of course that Natasha Files does lead

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Speaker 1: quite considerably on those primary votes. I mean, what do

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Speaker 1: you make of this situation.

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Speaker 2: I think it's quite unbelievable. I did not see this

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Speaker 2: coming at all, Katie, and I'm shocked, like all of us.

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Speaker 2: It's just a peculiarity of the preferential voting system that

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Speaker 2: we have that someone who can win on first preferences

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Speaker 2: quite comfortably can end up losing to someone who was

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Speaker 2: third on preferences. So look, I can only imagine how

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Speaker 2: upset Natasha Files is feeling, you know, But she joined

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Speaker 2: her colleagues in what has been an absolute white out

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Speaker 2: for labor. I heard the new opposition leader Selena Ubo

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Speaker 2: talking on ABC Ala Springs radio yesterday with little apology

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Speaker 2: about or little reflection on what they've done wrong. I mean,

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Speaker 2: when you're completely wiped out, when the most popular politician

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Speaker 2: in the Northern Territory, Natasha Files, loses her seat, surely

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Speaker 2: you say we got it wrong, as we should have

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Speaker 2: done things better, and you take a good long look

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Speaker 2: at yourself. But that wasn't forthcoming in the interview I

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Speaker 2: heard yesterday, not with Morning.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, not with us either. When we'd spoken to her yesterday,

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Speaker 1: it sort of didn't seem that way, and they were

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Speaker 1: still talking about, you know, the fact that they weren't

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Speaker 1: going to be an opposition that talks the territory down

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Speaker 1: and this kind of thing. And I just kind of

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Speaker 1: thought to myself, I'm not sure whether they get it.

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Speaker 1: I don't know whether they get I don't know how

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Speaker 1: they cannot after the message that was certainly sent by

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Speaker 1: territories very loudly and clearly. But I know there's been

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Speaker 1: this bit of discussion as well about what Summer saying

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Speaker 1: is a push to the Greens. I mean, when you

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Speaker 1: look at the primary votes in Nightcliffe, just as an example,

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Speaker 1: you've got Natasha Files one four hundred and fifty eight

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Speaker 1: primary votes, Helen's secretary on one thousand and fifty five.

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Speaker 1: The Greens candidate who looks like she's going to be

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Speaker 1: coming in catmag Nama Are on nine hundred and seventy two,

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Speaker 1: Malilma May the Independent on eight hundred and fifty six,

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Speaker 1: and another independent on one hundred and one. I mean,

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Speaker 1: do you think that there has been a push to

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Speaker 1: the Greens.

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Speaker 2: Oh, definitely. I mean down here in Alice Springs, it's

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Speaker 2: been quite incredible that the Greens told twice is as

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Speaker 2: well as a labor. Labor has become a relevant in

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Speaker 2: Central Australia. In Alice Springs, I should say. I mean, obviously,

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Speaker 2: Chance you take one his seat of Glodgier comfortably. But

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Speaker 2: I think what we're seeing is people turning their backs

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Speaker 2: on labor because they lied about environmental issues. Essentially, they

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Speaker 2: lied about water allocation and fracking and all sorts of

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Speaker 2: other things that do matter for a lot of Territorians

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Speaker 2: and they've turned their back on them. I mean it

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Speaker 2: goes back to a very simple premise here, and that

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Speaker 2: is you must tell the truth. You must be honest.

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Speaker 2: You cannot lie and lie and lie to people and

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Speaker 2: expect them then to vote for you in the polls.

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Speaker 2: I think this is a lesson that we can all

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Speaker 2: learn in politics you can spin a little, you can

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Speaker 2: try and reframe things that when you blatantly look people

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Speaker 2: in the face, which I saw labor ministers do for

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Speaker 2: many years, it just won't be tolerated. Kate Warden was

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Speaker 2: the greatest disappointment around her spin on the environment and

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Speaker 2: water allocation. I mean, it's just not acceptable. And they

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Speaker 2: will have plenty of time to reflect on how dishonest

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Speaker 2: they were to Territorians, particularly over the last three to

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Speaker 2: four years, and even beyond them in the whole fracking business.

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Speaker 2: You know, even now, they can't sort of lay straight

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Speaker 2: in bed at night and say that they support fracking.

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Speaker 2: And that's probably one reason why Natasha File may not

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Speaker 2: get up. She gave so many mixed messages around all

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Speaker 2: those environmental issues that she obviously personally feels very passionate about,

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Speaker 2: but couldn't own and couldn't be honest about because her

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Speaker 2: party held the opposite view. So they became just quite

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Speaker 2: a rabble and incoherent and deeply dishonest.

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Speaker 1: Well, Robin Lambley not holding back at all this morning,

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Speaker 1: which I always appreciate. Thank you, Thank you for your time.

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Speaker 1: We'll talk to you soon. I've got a few weeks off,

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Speaker 1: so we'll talk to you when I get back.

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Speaker 2: Thank you, thanks,