1 00:00:00,400 --> 00:00:03,880 Speaker 1: Hey, it's Pats with another episode of Rage Against the Menopause, 2 00:00:04,160 --> 00:00:08,000 Speaker 1: this one with another one of my favorite women, bridget 3 00:00:08,080 --> 00:00:11,119 Speaker 1: To Chloe. I've worked with Bridgie and Top Rating Radio. 4 00:00:11,360 --> 00:00:15,440 Speaker 1: She's one of Australia's most successful and much love personalities. 5 00:00:15,680 --> 00:00:18,479 Speaker 1: But away from the studio, to know Bridge really is 6 00:00:18,520 --> 00:00:21,640 Speaker 1: to love her whyse beyond her years, She's always had 7 00:00:21,640 --> 00:00:24,880 Speaker 1: words of advice about all aspects of life, and I 8 00:00:24,960 --> 00:00:28,480 Speaker 1: regard her as one of the original trailblazers, a woman 9 00:00:28,520 --> 00:00:31,840 Speaker 1: who broke through the glass ceiling, dominating in what was 10 00:00:31,920 --> 00:00:35,080 Speaker 1: once a man's world. I've always admired the way she 11 00:00:35,240 --> 00:00:40,159 Speaker 1: reinvents herself. Currently a presenter on ABC Radio, also an 12 00:00:40,200 --> 00:00:43,720 Speaker 1: accredited counselor with her own practice, I think you'll also 13 00:00:43,800 --> 00:00:49,160 Speaker 1: find her a valuable addition to this series. Enjoy an invisible. 14 00:00:48,600 --> 00:00:54,160 Speaker 2: Age, Menopause. It's coming for you no matter what. 15 00:00:54,520 --> 00:00:56,520 Speaker 3: Let's build a village of support. 16 00:00:56,680 --> 00:00:58,680 Speaker 2: Why is it so damn hut in here? 17 00:00:58,960 --> 00:01:01,200 Speaker 3: Menopause is so hot right now? 18 00:01:01,320 --> 00:01:02,920 Speaker 2: I think I'm finally in menopause. 19 00:01:03,160 --> 00:01:04,479 Speaker 3: Women just want to feel heard. 20 00:01:05,400 --> 00:01:09,720 Speaker 4: Rage Against the Menopause a very special guest for Rage 21 00:01:09,720 --> 00:01:11,080 Speaker 4: Against the Menopause, and. 22 00:01:10,959 --> 00:01:13,559 Speaker 3: This is a beautiful, beautiful. 23 00:01:13,160 --> 00:01:16,000 Speaker 4: Soul who I had the honor of working with several 24 00:01:16,080 --> 00:01:20,720 Speaker 4: years ago, an absolute legend in radio and TV. 25 00:01:20,880 --> 00:01:24,360 Speaker 2: Bridget To Cloak, Welcome pets. It's so nice to see you. 26 00:01:24,520 --> 00:01:28,520 Speaker 2: And now you're an award winner. I'm in very very 27 00:01:28,680 --> 00:01:30,759 Speaker 2: esteemed company. I must say no about that. 28 00:01:31,440 --> 00:01:34,720 Speaker 4: So thrilled that you could could join us. You have 29 00:01:34,840 --> 00:01:39,080 Speaker 4: had a career change. You had thirty years in TV 30 00:01:39,400 --> 00:01:42,559 Speaker 4: and radio. I read your news when you were Bridge 31 00:01:42,560 --> 00:01:43,840 Speaker 4: and Limo won Gold FM. 32 00:01:43,959 --> 00:01:46,200 Speaker 2: Yes you did, and we had a wonderful time doing that. 33 00:01:46,280 --> 00:01:48,520 Speaker 2: Then sadly I got sacked and thought what the hell 34 00:01:48,560 --> 00:01:51,520 Speaker 2: am I going to do with myself? But good I'd 35 00:01:51,520 --> 00:01:53,360 Speaker 2: had a great un so, you know, thirty years in 36 00:01:53,440 --> 00:01:56,600 Speaker 2: radio was pretty amazing. So yeah, I went back to UNI, 37 00:01:56,760 --> 00:02:00,520 Speaker 2: which was incredibly difficult. As a fifty plus I bear 38 00:02:00,680 --> 00:02:02,560 Speaker 2: something or other, couldn't remember how to write any sale 39 00:02:02,600 --> 00:02:07,040 Speaker 2: or do anything anyway. Thankfully I had two adult kids. Yeah, 40 00:02:07,040 --> 00:02:08,920 Speaker 2: so I went back and did a post grade counseling degree. 41 00:02:08,960 --> 00:02:13,040 Speaker 2: So I'm now practicing as a counselor, which is very 42 00:02:13,160 --> 00:02:14,280 Speaker 2: very different too. 43 00:02:14,560 --> 00:02:17,360 Speaker 4: It is, but you know what, I'm not surprised that 44 00:02:17,720 --> 00:02:21,600 Speaker 4: you've gone into this field because knowing you, being fortunate 45 00:02:21,600 --> 00:02:25,520 Speaker 4: and blessed enough to know you, you have always always. 46 00:02:25,160 --> 00:02:26,079 Speaker 3: Had a heart of gold. 47 00:02:26,800 --> 00:02:27,280 Speaker 2: No, you have. 48 00:02:27,520 --> 00:02:30,520 Speaker 4: And I remember when I was diagnosed with cancer, so 49 00:02:30,880 --> 00:02:35,440 Speaker 4: nine nearly. Would you believe a decade ago Audrey was three? 50 00:02:35,800 --> 00:02:36,960 Speaker 4: You remember Audrey as. 51 00:02:36,840 --> 00:02:42,640 Speaker 3: A top I know, and you know how our whole world, Chris, 52 00:02:43,040 --> 00:02:45,760 Speaker 3: our whole world had been turned upside down and shaken. 53 00:02:46,440 --> 00:02:49,720 Speaker 3: And you came to my doorstep out in the western summers. 54 00:02:49,760 --> 00:02:51,400 Speaker 3: You're like an hour away from home. 55 00:02:51,639 --> 00:02:54,320 Speaker 4: You had all this beautiful cooking and you just sat 56 00:02:55,160 --> 00:02:57,919 Speaker 4: and talked to me for like two or three hours. 57 00:02:58,280 --> 00:02:59,840 Speaker 4: And you know, the biggest gift you can give some 58 00:03:00,040 --> 00:03:01,600 Speaker 4: one is your time. 59 00:03:01,639 --> 00:03:04,960 Speaker 2: And I'll never forget you. That's exactly what you do 60 00:03:05,080 --> 00:03:07,120 Speaker 2: as well. So it was a very easy thing to 61 00:03:07,120 --> 00:03:07,920 Speaker 2: do for someone like you. 62 00:03:08,200 --> 00:03:10,399 Speaker 3: No, I've never forgotten it. It's just meant so much. 63 00:03:10,400 --> 00:03:12,160 Speaker 2: It just made a lot, doesn't it. Things like that, 64 00:03:12,160 --> 00:03:13,200 Speaker 2: There's no doubt about it. 65 00:03:13,200 --> 00:03:16,000 Speaker 3: It does. And people, I guess too, people don't. 66 00:03:15,760 --> 00:03:18,440 Speaker 4: Always know how to respond or what is the right 67 00:03:18,440 --> 00:03:21,120 Speaker 4: thing to say, but sometimes just being present. 68 00:03:21,280 --> 00:03:24,400 Speaker 2: Yeah, I've really learned that actually in my journey because 69 00:03:24,400 --> 00:03:26,320 Speaker 2: a lot of people who come to see me say 70 00:03:27,000 --> 00:03:29,360 Speaker 2: no one talks to me about it, and it's like 71 00:03:29,440 --> 00:03:31,520 Speaker 2: and I try and explain it. It's often they it's 72 00:03:31,560 --> 00:03:34,680 Speaker 2: their own uncomfortability. You know what to do, what to say, 73 00:03:34,680 --> 00:03:37,080 Speaker 2: abound with you. I think always I say this to 74 00:03:37,120 --> 00:03:38,840 Speaker 2: my kids too. The best thing you can do is 75 00:03:38,920 --> 00:03:42,120 Speaker 2: say something, do something and go from there, but don't 76 00:03:42,160 --> 00:03:42,800 Speaker 2: just leave it. 77 00:03:43,000 --> 00:03:44,640 Speaker 3: But you didn't have to do that. And it was 78 00:03:44,720 --> 00:03:45,960 Speaker 3: just thrilled to go to wheer Aby. 79 00:03:49,120 --> 00:03:53,360 Speaker 4: It's very affluent out that way, not quite affluent as well, but. 80 00:03:53,320 --> 00:03:56,720 Speaker 3: It meant so much because you know, I've always looked up, 81 00:03:57,360 --> 00:03:58,400 Speaker 3: always looked up to you. 82 00:03:58,400 --> 00:04:03,520 Speaker 4: You're so legendary and what you've done in mediawat. 83 00:04:02,160 --> 00:04:04,119 Speaker 3: And for you to reach out like that, it meant 84 00:04:04,120 --> 00:04:04,400 Speaker 3: a lot. 85 00:04:04,440 --> 00:04:06,480 Speaker 4: And so it doesn't surprise me that you've gone into 86 00:04:06,480 --> 00:04:08,400 Speaker 4: counseling because you've always had a heart of goals. You've 87 00:04:08,400 --> 00:04:11,600 Speaker 4: all you know, the woman behind the persona of the 88 00:04:11,640 --> 00:04:15,840 Speaker 4: media personality with the high profile. There's a beautiful soul 89 00:04:16,040 --> 00:04:19,400 Speaker 4: in there and I'm so thrilled that everyone gets to 90 00:04:19,480 --> 00:04:20,719 Speaker 4: benefit from. 91 00:04:20,520 --> 00:04:22,440 Speaker 3: That, all your clients in your business. 92 00:04:22,560 --> 00:04:25,160 Speaker 2: You're a darling. Thank you. Look, I'm really enjoying it. 93 00:04:24,560 --> 00:04:29,880 Speaker 2: It's it's a very very demanding because you've got people's 94 00:04:30,240 --> 00:04:32,200 Speaker 2: lives in your hands to a certain extent. I mean, 95 00:04:32,279 --> 00:04:35,599 Speaker 2: I don't mean obviously medically or anything, but there's a 96 00:04:35,640 --> 00:04:38,400 Speaker 2: lot going on out there, particularly since COVID. I so 97 00:04:38,720 --> 00:04:40,640 Speaker 2: a lot of anxiety, a lot of depression, a lot 98 00:04:40,640 --> 00:04:44,160 Speaker 2: of couples having problems. So I am really enjoying. I'm 99 00:04:44,200 --> 00:04:47,680 Speaker 2: really enjoying doing it. It's it's great when you get 100 00:04:47,680 --> 00:04:49,880 Speaker 2: a good result and you feel like you're making a difference. 101 00:04:49,920 --> 00:04:53,000 Speaker 2: Sometimes it's really difficult, but yeah, no, look it's been 102 00:04:54,040 --> 00:04:57,120 Speaker 2: it's been interesting and great and I'm you know, I'm 103 00:04:57,120 --> 00:05:00,679 Speaker 2: proud of myself for being able to change careers because 104 00:05:00,680 --> 00:05:02,479 Speaker 2: I could have just curled up in a ball and 105 00:05:02,720 --> 00:05:05,560 Speaker 2: never got up again, which was tempting for a couple 106 00:05:05,560 --> 00:05:05,840 Speaker 2: of days. 107 00:05:05,839 --> 00:05:08,200 Speaker 3: Well, you know, radio can be brutal. Media can be 108 00:05:08,360 --> 00:05:09,800 Speaker 3: absolutely brutal. 109 00:05:09,920 --> 00:05:13,599 Speaker 4: And it's like it's that creative sphere, isn't it, where 110 00:05:13,640 --> 00:05:16,839 Speaker 4: you just pour your heart And so especially with Brecky Radio, 111 00:05:16,960 --> 00:05:20,640 Speaker 4: you bring your whole life to the show, don't you overshare? 112 00:05:20,800 --> 00:05:21,800 Speaker 2: That's really dood to do. 113 00:05:21,920 --> 00:05:24,480 Speaker 3: And so it does feel like you've been cut off 114 00:05:24,480 --> 00:05:25,040 Speaker 3: at the knees. 115 00:05:25,400 --> 00:05:27,800 Speaker 2: No, it was a terrible shock. But I look back 116 00:05:27,800 --> 00:05:30,240 Speaker 2: at it now and I think, look, there's a lot 117 00:05:30,240 --> 00:05:32,400 Speaker 2: of lot I could have done differently. But I do 118 00:05:32,480 --> 00:05:35,800 Speaker 2: think I've never better about it because I think I 119 00:05:35,839 --> 00:05:38,280 Speaker 2: am so lucky to have worked in the media when 120 00:05:38,279 --> 00:05:40,080 Speaker 2: I did for as long as I did, and I 121 00:05:40,120 --> 00:05:42,920 Speaker 2: think I just feel grateful for it. So I think 122 00:05:42,920 --> 00:05:46,800 Speaker 2: that's helped with getting over the I think the shock 123 00:05:46,839 --> 00:05:50,120 Speaker 2: and the grief. It's grief losing something that was like 124 00:05:50,160 --> 00:05:52,040 Speaker 2: losing it, right, do you think? 125 00:05:52,320 --> 00:05:54,960 Speaker 4: I always say, but I don't know how true it is. 126 00:05:55,040 --> 00:05:58,120 Speaker 4: It doesn't define no who I am, but does it? 127 00:05:58,240 --> 00:06:00,680 Speaker 2: Well? I always said that too, And I've been watching 128 00:06:00,800 --> 00:06:03,600 Speaker 2: a colleague of ours get sacked a year earlier and 129 00:06:04,040 --> 00:06:06,400 Speaker 2: thinking she was very about to define by it. Oh no, 130 00:06:06,480 --> 00:06:08,920 Speaker 2: that won't be me. But it was me. I mean, 131 00:06:08,960 --> 00:06:11,200 Speaker 2: all my kids knew me, as was that person on 132 00:06:11,200 --> 00:06:13,800 Speaker 2: the rate. I knew a mother obviously, but I'd always 133 00:06:13,800 --> 00:06:18,680 Speaker 2: been that. I didn't realize how much that was part 134 00:06:18,720 --> 00:06:22,520 Speaker 2: of me, yes, until it stopped. So, which is really 135 00:06:22,520 --> 00:06:24,680 Speaker 2: interesting now because now I work a lot with helping 136 00:06:24,720 --> 00:06:29,480 Speaker 2: people regain their identity, like often school moms. When you're 137 00:06:29,480 --> 00:06:32,200 Speaker 2: a school mum. When your child glave school, you left 138 00:06:32,960 --> 00:06:35,440 Speaker 2: with a bit of a lack of purpose. What next? 139 00:06:35,640 --> 00:06:37,880 Speaker 2: So it's redefining who you are. So I think that's 140 00:06:37,920 --> 00:06:40,560 Speaker 2: what I had to do. But like you, Pats, I said, no, 141 00:06:40,680 --> 00:06:42,479 Speaker 2: that's not me. This isn't who I am. But it 142 00:06:42,560 --> 00:06:44,400 Speaker 2: is a big part of your life. You give everything, 143 00:06:45,520 --> 00:06:47,400 Speaker 2: so of course it's going to be part of your identity. 144 00:06:47,400 --> 00:06:47,920 Speaker 2: It has to be. 145 00:06:48,200 --> 00:06:50,599 Speaker 4: It must have felt quite foreign because I know, if 146 00:06:50,640 --> 00:06:53,400 Speaker 4: we're on survey break and Audrey is still at school 147 00:06:53,960 --> 00:06:56,960 Speaker 4: and I'm there for breakfast, which she's. 148 00:06:56,800 --> 00:06:58,440 Speaker 3: Not used to me, I get in the way. 149 00:06:58,560 --> 00:07:00,960 Speaker 2: I know you're a nuisance when you see ruined the 150 00:07:01,040 --> 00:07:02,480 Speaker 2: root I do, and. 151 00:07:02,440 --> 00:07:05,840 Speaker 4: She'll say, Mum, it's okay, you just do your own thing, 152 00:07:05,880 --> 00:07:07,320 Speaker 4: and I feel very useless. 153 00:07:07,360 --> 00:07:09,440 Speaker 2: I know. It's funny, isn't it. It's so funny how 154 00:07:09,480 --> 00:07:12,200 Speaker 2: you just realize that they get on quite well without you, 155 00:07:12,560 --> 00:07:14,440 Speaker 2: but your home and wanting to be part of it all. 156 00:07:14,520 --> 00:07:16,160 Speaker 2: I know, like back to. 157 00:07:16,160 --> 00:07:18,360 Speaker 3: Work, it's not where you fit, mum. You're not in 158 00:07:18,400 --> 00:07:19,600 Speaker 3: that part of the jigsaw. 159 00:07:20,000 --> 00:07:22,760 Speaker 4: But that's also isn't that a problem to where when 160 00:07:22,800 --> 00:07:25,200 Speaker 4: you're a working mum, and especially when you're doing Brecky 161 00:07:25,280 --> 00:07:28,680 Speaker 4: radio and you're leaving house at you know, god, god 162 00:07:28,800 --> 00:07:32,840 Speaker 4: forsaken hours. You've set them up, You've got It's like 163 00:07:32,840 --> 00:07:34,200 Speaker 4: a fine routine, isn't it. 164 00:07:34,200 --> 00:07:35,040 Speaker 2: It's like a factory. 165 00:07:35,200 --> 00:07:37,360 Speaker 4: Everyone's got their role, they know where they're meant to 166 00:07:37,360 --> 00:07:40,120 Speaker 4: be at what time, and you almost do yourself out 167 00:07:40,160 --> 00:07:40,560 Speaker 4: of a job. 168 00:07:41,120 --> 00:07:42,880 Speaker 2: Well, I just have terrible guilt about not being around 169 00:07:42,920 --> 00:07:45,920 Speaker 2: in the morning. God, yes, But then I realized, especially 170 00:07:45,920 --> 00:07:48,320 Speaker 2: as the kid's got a bit older, that the afternoon 171 00:07:48,440 --> 00:07:50,200 Speaker 2: was when they needed you because you had a bad 172 00:07:50,280 --> 00:07:51,360 Speaker 2: day or whatever. 173 00:07:51,440 --> 00:07:53,440 Speaker 3: That's where you always say that to me, that was 174 00:07:53,480 --> 00:07:53,680 Speaker 3: the way. 175 00:07:54,240 --> 00:07:58,440 Speaker 2: Maybe I was just justifying consult myself. Because I did, 176 00:07:58,440 --> 00:08:00,880 Speaker 2: I felt terribly guilt. Yes, I never dropped them off. 177 00:08:01,000 --> 00:08:03,960 Speaker 4: Ever, you miss the assembly, you miss the choir, you 178 00:08:04,040 --> 00:08:08,800 Speaker 4: miss the violin assembly, the certificate giving. It's like I 179 00:08:08,880 --> 00:08:11,640 Speaker 4: always have pangs of that even now. Bridge It's like, 180 00:08:11,680 --> 00:08:14,720 Speaker 4: I look at Audrey, she's thirteen, nearly fourteen. We've only 181 00:08:14,760 --> 00:08:18,320 Speaker 4: got maybe four or five years, and you know, they'll 182 00:08:18,440 --> 00:08:20,280 Speaker 4: cryst will console me and say, yeah, but look what 183 00:08:20,320 --> 00:08:23,720 Speaker 4: you've been able to do for her by exactly working. 184 00:08:23,760 --> 00:08:25,840 Speaker 3: But it's not the same sometimes. 185 00:08:26,040 --> 00:08:29,000 Speaker 2: Look, Look, I think working is a good thing for mums. 186 00:08:29,000 --> 00:08:29,680 Speaker 3: I think it's good. 187 00:08:29,720 --> 00:08:34,120 Speaker 2: And unfortunately the work we do, I did you do 188 00:08:34,120 --> 00:08:36,400 Speaker 2: does take away that big chunk of the day. But however, 189 00:08:36,559 --> 00:08:38,679 Speaker 2: as I always say, you're there for the rest of it, 190 00:08:39,040 --> 00:08:40,080 Speaker 2: and you know, it's good that. 191 00:08:40,080 --> 00:08:43,040 Speaker 3: Men a toast and sleep, sleep and grumpy. 192 00:08:42,760 --> 00:08:45,040 Speaker 2: Even though you can't talk to them because you're exhausted. 193 00:08:47,040 --> 00:08:49,160 Speaker 2: I mean, I gave my kids barbecue shapes for dinner. 194 00:08:49,160 --> 00:08:50,679 Speaker 2: As I think I told you I was so tired 195 00:08:50,679 --> 00:08:54,320 Speaker 2: some nights. Oh so yeah, yeah, do what you do. 196 00:08:54,360 --> 00:08:55,959 Speaker 2: You do what you do, and everyone does what they do. 197 00:08:56,000 --> 00:08:59,080 Speaker 2: I think every mother has guilt, every working mother has guilt, 198 00:08:59,120 --> 00:09:01,600 Speaker 2: and even mothers are at home have guilt. Yes, from 199 00:09:01,640 --> 00:09:03,600 Speaker 2: the minute you have a baby, you have guilt. Yep. 200 00:09:04,280 --> 00:09:06,760 Speaker 4: Yeah, it's hard that you get, Oh, you're not going 201 00:09:06,800 --> 00:09:08,839 Speaker 4: back to work, aren't you. I got, oh you're not 202 00:09:08,880 --> 00:09:10,680 Speaker 4: going back to work if you know it's taken you 203 00:09:10,760 --> 00:09:12,679 Speaker 4: five years to have your baby, now you're going back 204 00:09:12,679 --> 00:09:15,400 Speaker 4: to work. But it's almost Also, why should I stop 205 00:09:15,480 --> 00:09:20,160 Speaker 4: being what I do just because I can do well, 206 00:09:20,160 --> 00:09:22,959 Speaker 4: we're told we can do everything. But then you're right, 207 00:09:23,040 --> 00:09:25,680 Speaker 4: stay at home mums get Oh you're staying at home. 208 00:09:26,200 --> 00:09:26,760 Speaker 3: You can't win. 209 00:09:26,880 --> 00:09:28,760 Speaker 2: You can't win, and I think the best way to 210 00:09:28,760 --> 00:09:31,040 Speaker 2: do is except the best thing is just to accept 211 00:09:31,080 --> 00:09:32,840 Speaker 2: you can't win and do the best at what you're doing. 212 00:09:33,480 --> 00:09:36,040 Speaker 2: And you know, just accept that is the way it is. 213 00:09:36,120 --> 00:09:36,800 Speaker 2: It's the only awake. 214 00:09:37,240 --> 00:09:40,120 Speaker 4: Yeah, you were so helpful for me as I because 215 00:09:40,120 --> 00:09:42,160 Speaker 4: I think I was back from Matt leave. I think, 216 00:09:42,320 --> 00:09:44,440 Speaker 4: wasn't I when I went back to breakfast, So it 217 00:09:44,559 --> 00:09:47,600 Speaker 4: certainly helped. You certainly helped get me through those mornings and. 218 00:09:47,559 --> 00:09:49,400 Speaker 2: Those I just think it would help to have another 219 00:09:49,440 --> 00:09:51,720 Speaker 2: mother in the team too, who understands what it's like 220 00:09:51,760 --> 00:09:54,120 Speaker 2: to leave there. Well, mine worn't babies, but I left 221 00:09:54,160 --> 00:09:56,920 Speaker 2: mine from when they were three months old. Yeah, I 222 00:09:56,920 --> 00:09:59,480 Speaker 2: went back to work. That's hard. You know that I 223 00:09:59,520 --> 00:10:03,199 Speaker 2: had ter good with that as well. Anyway, But once 224 00:10:03,240 --> 00:10:05,080 Speaker 2: again you sort of wait up and you think, but 225 00:10:05,360 --> 00:10:07,840 Speaker 2: least I can give you this, and that's. 226 00:10:07,720 --> 00:10:08,760 Speaker 3: Right, that's right. 227 00:10:09,040 --> 00:10:11,560 Speaker 4: Tell me, how is your work different? Because I guess 228 00:10:11,600 --> 00:10:15,640 Speaker 4: you're so. You're such a great orator and talker and 229 00:10:16,400 --> 00:10:20,680 Speaker 4: this it flows so beautifully and naturally. But this, I 230 00:10:20,800 --> 00:10:21,960 Speaker 4: this must be different for you. 231 00:10:22,440 --> 00:10:25,360 Speaker 2: The biggest thing I had to learn was one of 232 00:10:25,400 --> 00:10:27,640 Speaker 2: the best skills you can have in counseling is listening. 233 00:10:28,200 --> 00:10:30,679 Speaker 2: Now you and I know that if there's dead air 234 00:10:30,760 --> 00:10:34,120 Speaker 2: for one minute, we start talking. Yes, And I've been trained, 235 00:10:34,120 --> 00:10:36,439 Speaker 2: as we all have on radio, to just keep talking, 236 00:10:36,520 --> 00:10:38,760 Speaker 2: keep talking, keep talking, because if you stop, it goes 237 00:10:38,840 --> 00:10:40,439 Speaker 2: into panic mode and they put music. 238 00:10:40,320 --> 00:10:41,280 Speaker 3: Emergency tape goes. 239 00:10:42,120 --> 00:10:45,680 Speaker 2: So the biggest skill I've had to learn is sitting 240 00:10:45,800 --> 00:10:50,520 Speaker 2: and listening and while they're talking, not being scared of 241 00:10:50,800 --> 00:10:53,640 Speaker 2: dead air, like listen because then they'll keep going. So 242 00:10:53,640 --> 00:10:55,400 Speaker 2: that's been the biggest thing. And I don't talk nearly 243 00:10:55,440 --> 00:10:58,000 Speaker 2: as much as I used to imagine that, No I did. 244 00:10:58,120 --> 00:11:00,320 Speaker 2: I literally sit there and I listen. I listened because also, 245 00:11:00,360 --> 00:11:03,120 Speaker 2: you don't give advice, You just help them try and 246 00:11:03,160 --> 00:11:05,120 Speaker 2: work it out for themselves. Yes, because if you give 247 00:11:05,120 --> 00:11:07,720 Speaker 2: advice to somebody, if it's the wrong advice, that's a 248 00:11:07,720 --> 00:11:12,720 Speaker 2: big thing. So I have really say to myself every 249 00:11:12,800 --> 00:11:15,320 Speaker 2: day two years one mouth, yeah, which used. 250 00:11:15,200 --> 00:11:18,280 Speaker 3: To be right all the way around. 251 00:11:18,600 --> 00:11:23,160 Speaker 2: So I'm rewired, and that's probably bee the biggest challenge. Yeah. 252 00:11:23,280 --> 00:11:25,679 Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm so proud of you. Do you know what 253 00:11:25,720 --> 00:11:28,600 Speaker 4: you've done for women of our age? In our fifties. 254 00:11:28,800 --> 00:11:29,400 Speaker 4: You're so right. 255 00:11:29,440 --> 00:11:30,640 Speaker 3: It's like a. 256 00:11:30,559 --> 00:11:35,079 Speaker 4: Collision sometimes of life. I think your fifties decade for 257 00:11:35,200 --> 00:11:37,959 Speaker 4: me going through perimenopause and menopause. I think it's been 258 00:11:38,040 --> 00:11:42,120 Speaker 4: an mind that I had cancer in my forties and 259 00:11:42,120 --> 00:11:46,480 Speaker 4: fertility problems. I think it's been the most challenging, to 260 00:11:46,559 --> 00:11:47,360 Speaker 4: be honest. 261 00:11:47,120 --> 00:11:49,080 Speaker 2: And I don't think anyone prepares you for it. I mean, 262 00:11:49,080 --> 00:11:51,000 Speaker 2: no one really prepares you for having a baby either, 263 00:11:51,040 --> 00:11:53,480 Speaker 2: I suppose. But this menopause thing comes in so many 264 00:11:53,559 --> 00:11:59,000 Speaker 2: different and everyone's just so different. Is terrifying, isn't it. 265 00:11:59,200 --> 00:12:01,480 Speaker 2: Some of the things it does to you, which it 266 00:12:01,559 --> 00:12:03,719 Speaker 2: was funny, not funny, actually was awful. I had a 267 00:12:03,880 --> 00:12:05,640 Speaker 2: quite a young boy, you know, he has to be 268 00:12:05,720 --> 00:12:10,640 Speaker 2: about nineteen or something. This was about a few months ago, 269 00:12:10,880 --> 00:12:15,000 Speaker 2: and I suddenly started getting the sweats and I was 270 00:12:15,120 --> 00:12:20,000 Speaker 2: literally dripping, dripping, and I'm like, it was so embarrassing 271 00:12:20,000 --> 00:12:22,160 Speaker 2: because it's this young boy. I'm not gonna tell sorry, 272 00:12:22,200 --> 00:12:25,360 Speaker 2: I've got menopause. Had it been like a someone else, 273 00:12:25,400 --> 00:12:27,600 Speaker 2: I might have. But there was nothing I could do 274 00:12:27,640 --> 00:12:30,400 Speaker 2: about it. And I've do you know, it's funny. I've 275 00:12:30,400 --> 00:12:33,760 Speaker 2: been having watched the American election campaign. All I can 276 00:12:33,800 --> 00:12:35,640 Speaker 2: do is look at Carmala Harris. I don't know where 277 00:12:35,640 --> 00:12:38,360 Speaker 2: she sits in her journey. And I go back to 278 00:12:38,440 --> 00:12:41,560 Speaker 2: Hillary Clinton, all these high profile women, How the hell 279 00:12:42,240 --> 00:12:46,920 Speaker 2: do they manage menopause if they're getting bad effects from it? 280 00:12:47,000 --> 00:12:48,600 Speaker 2: I think about that all the time. 281 00:12:48,920 --> 00:12:51,240 Speaker 4: It's not fair, is it. At times? I can remember 282 00:12:51,240 --> 00:12:53,480 Speaker 4: you sitting with a fan in the studio. You had 283 00:12:53,480 --> 00:12:55,160 Speaker 4: that fan that plugged the USB thing. 284 00:12:55,280 --> 00:12:57,560 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I still have a fan. I've got this 285 00:12:57,559 --> 00:12:59,360 Speaker 2: group of girlfriends and whenever we go to for dinner, 286 00:12:59,400 --> 00:13:03,280 Speaker 2: we bring our hands and we all sit there and honestly, 287 00:13:03,280 --> 00:13:06,720 Speaker 2: everyone else is going, what are they doing? But I don't. 288 00:13:07,120 --> 00:13:11,400 Speaker 2: I'm a funny place, actually, because I was very late, right, 289 00:13:11,480 --> 00:13:15,600 Speaker 2: funnily enough to actually stopping having all together. Yeah. So, 290 00:13:16,240 --> 00:13:20,880 Speaker 2: and I have had not constant symptoms, but the ones 291 00:13:20,880 --> 00:13:23,400 Speaker 2: like I've just described you have come from nowhere. Ye, 292 00:13:23,640 --> 00:13:25,720 Speaker 2: and they and the nights where I can't sleep, Oh 293 00:13:26,040 --> 00:13:28,880 Speaker 2: my god, it's the worst. Yeah, so bad. Yeah, But 294 00:13:28,920 --> 00:13:31,760 Speaker 2: then it's all just seems to and you know, sometimes 295 00:13:31,760 --> 00:13:33,640 Speaker 2: when you're moody, you can't work out why, whether is 296 00:13:33,679 --> 00:13:36,160 Speaker 2: it that or is it something else? It's hard to know. 297 00:13:37,559 --> 00:13:37,839 Speaker 2: You know. 298 00:13:38,120 --> 00:13:40,560 Speaker 4: That's what I find most frustrating about it is And 299 00:13:40,600 --> 00:13:42,400 Speaker 4: if you go to a specialist, they can't tell you 300 00:13:42,440 --> 00:13:44,880 Speaker 4: at what point you are in your journey either. 301 00:13:44,960 --> 00:13:47,080 Speaker 2: As I say, to look at your mother, don't they? Yeah, 302 00:13:47,280 --> 00:13:49,080 Speaker 2: but my mother had his direct to met very early, 303 00:13:49,400 --> 00:13:51,880 Speaker 2: so it's hard to look at her and say, what's 304 00:13:51,920 --> 00:13:54,200 Speaker 2: your journey because apparently that is quite relevant. 305 00:13:54,280 --> 00:13:57,680 Speaker 3: Well, my mum's eighty eighty one and still getting hot 306 00:13:57,720 --> 00:13:59,040 Speaker 3: flushes the sweats. 307 00:13:59,120 --> 00:14:02,960 Speaker 2: It's not fair some people have it. I actually had 308 00:14:03,320 --> 00:14:06,320 Speaker 2: a client once again, a woman a bit younger than me, 309 00:14:06,640 --> 00:14:10,520 Speaker 2: and it actually ruined her life. She got the worst 310 00:14:10,559 --> 00:14:14,120 Speaker 2: symptoms I've ever seen started to affect a marriage. 311 00:14:14,600 --> 00:14:16,920 Speaker 4: It's awful, it is what did you? What have you 312 00:14:16,960 --> 00:14:20,240 Speaker 4: found helps has helped for you? I did try HRT 313 00:14:20,440 --> 00:14:21,920 Speaker 4: for a while when that was going through that. 314 00:14:21,920 --> 00:14:24,280 Speaker 2: That was good. But as I say, then I feel 315 00:14:24,280 --> 00:14:26,600 Speaker 2: all fine again, and I think I've been one of 316 00:14:26,640 --> 00:14:29,720 Speaker 2: the lucky ones, to be honest, but just having a 317 00:14:30,360 --> 00:14:34,560 Speaker 2: hint of what it's like when it's bad, and for 318 00:14:34,640 --> 00:14:36,720 Speaker 2: some people they get that all the time for years on. 319 00:14:36,840 --> 00:14:40,000 Speaker 2: It's absolutely horrific and the brain fade. 320 00:14:41,080 --> 00:14:44,040 Speaker 4: Yeah, Honestly, the amount of times I've been in the 321 00:14:44,040 --> 00:14:45,800 Speaker 4: middle of saying something on air and then I'll just 322 00:14:46,080 --> 00:14:47,920 Speaker 4: and I can't think, or I can't think of a word, 323 00:14:48,360 --> 00:14:51,280 Speaker 4: and the boys just look at me, and I think, do. 324 00:14:51,400 --> 00:14:53,360 Speaker 2: You remember when we were in when we used to 325 00:14:53,440 --> 00:14:55,200 Speaker 2: work together and I had that fan going and the 326 00:14:55,200 --> 00:14:58,800 Speaker 2: boys used to tease us, tease me unmercifully. And I 327 00:14:58,800 --> 00:15:00,320 Speaker 2: think back now and I think, and I lots of 328 00:15:00,360 --> 00:15:03,720 Speaker 2: men are listening to your podcast because men need to 329 00:15:03,720 --> 00:15:07,240 Speaker 2: get on board with this totally, and young men, young men, 330 00:15:07,360 --> 00:15:09,600 Speaker 2: and be so supportive because it used to be a 331 00:15:09,680 --> 00:15:12,880 Speaker 2: joke or she's going through the church and it's actually 332 00:15:13,560 --> 00:15:16,840 Speaker 2: so offensive because it is, you know, we go through 333 00:15:16,880 --> 00:15:18,600 Speaker 2: so much. And I would love to think that men 334 00:15:18,720 --> 00:15:21,520 Speaker 2: listen to rage against the menopause and think how can 335 00:15:21,560 --> 00:15:22,920 Speaker 2: I best support my partner. 336 00:15:23,120 --> 00:15:24,800 Speaker 3: I think the tide is turning, you know, Bridge. 337 00:15:24,840 --> 00:15:29,000 Speaker 4: I've had so much beautiful feedback from series one last year, 338 00:15:29,480 --> 00:15:32,840 Speaker 4: and surprisingly it took me off guard. A lot of 339 00:15:32,880 --> 00:15:36,680 Speaker 4: men in their thirties who say thank you for educating me, 340 00:15:36,680 --> 00:15:39,280 Speaker 4: because I had no idea what it was. And they'll say, 341 00:15:39,320 --> 00:15:41,200 Speaker 4: you know, I know my mum was going through something, 342 00:15:41,200 --> 00:15:43,800 Speaker 4: but I didn't fully understand it. So thank you for 343 00:15:43,960 --> 00:15:46,800 Speaker 4: educating me, and thank you for equipping me for when 344 00:15:46,880 --> 00:15:49,200 Speaker 4: my partner in ten or twenty. 345 00:15:49,000 --> 00:15:50,120 Speaker 3: Years goes through. 346 00:15:50,240 --> 00:15:52,960 Speaker 4: That's what I've aimed to do in this and to 347 00:15:53,000 --> 00:15:54,960 Speaker 4: get the donversation, and you have done a great job 348 00:15:54,960 --> 00:15:55,160 Speaker 4: of that. 349 00:15:55,200 --> 00:15:58,000 Speaker 2: And I really love that fact that these younger men 350 00:15:58,240 --> 00:16:00,440 Speaker 2: are very different to them grew up with. 351 00:16:00,480 --> 00:16:01,640 Speaker 3: It can't be. 352 00:16:01,880 --> 00:16:07,520 Speaker 2: It's amazing. They're much more in tune with being sympathetic, empathetic, 353 00:16:08,120 --> 00:16:10,440 Speaker 2: understanding and not just going on my wife's gating to 354 00:16:10,600 --> 00:16:12,680 Speaker 2: you know, all that rubbish we used to get. I 355 00:16:12,680 --> 00:16:16,240 Speaker 2: think I've seen a massive change in. I think young 356 00:16:16,280 --> 00:16:19,239 Speaker 2: men these days are amazing and it's a credit. 357 00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:21,720 Speaker 4: To their mothers and their fathers for bringing up this 358 00:16:22,160 --> 00:16:25,360 Speaker 4: new generation of men. You've got Charlie's what now, twenty 359 00:16:25,360 --> 00:16:26,960 Speaker 4: twenty five. 360 00:16:27,040 --> 00:16:30,160 Speaker 2: I know he's a grown up, and my daughter's twenty three, Alex, 361 00:16:30,200 --> 00:16:35,520 Speaker 2: so I know they're I know they're big, mature people now. Believable, 362 00:16:35,560 --> 00:16:37,560 Speaker 2: But I do I've really seen a change in. I 363 00:16:37,560 --> 00:16:39,360 Speaker 2: think I was listening to one of your podcasts with 364 00:16:39,360 --> 00:16:43,320 Speaker 2: one of an expert she was saying this, the metopause 365 00:16:43,440 --> 00:16:45,680 Speaker 2: now is a bit like what mental health was a 366 00:16:45,720 --> 00:16:48,320 Speaker 2: few years ago where Noah is not talking and no 367 00:16:48,360 --> 00:16:52,160 Speaker 2: one was talking about it. Now it is becoming something. 368 00:16:52,360 --> 00:16:55,800 Speaker 2: Thank goodness for you and other people who are tackling it. Yeah, 369 00:16:55,840 --> 00:16:57,880 Speaker 2: because it's still a little bit of one of those 370 00:16:57,920 --> 00:16:58,680 Speaker 2: forbiddens up. 371 00:16:58,640 --> 00:17:00,560 Speaker 3: Their stigma, which is ridicul It's. 372 00:17:00,480 --> 00:17:02,760 Speaker 2: Ridiculous because half the population go through no. 373 00:17:02,920 --> 00:17:05,080 Speaker 3: I know, and one third of is it one third 374 00:17:05,119 --> 00:17:05,480 Speaker 3: of women? 375 00:17:05,560 --> 00:17:08,320 Speaker 4: At any time, I was doing a bit of research 376 00:17:08,440 --> 00:17:11,159 Speaker 4: and you were on a wonderful podcast, The Power of Women. 377 00:17:11,480 --> 00:17:13,360 Speaker 2: Oh yeah, that was very digillic. 378 00:17:13,440 --> 00:17:16,720 Speaker 4: Yeah, of course, and you said something that I think 379 00:17:16,760 --> 00:17:18,000 Speaker 4: a lot of women can relate to. 380 00:17:18,040 --> 00:17:19,760 Speaker 3: I'm going to play the audio because. 381 00:17:19,560 --> 00:17:22,880 Speaker 2: We were talking to all our girlfriends. We're all fifty plus, say, 382 00:17:23,200 --> 00:17:25,800 Speaker 2: every single one of them has had to go through 383 00:17:25,840 --> 00:17:28,679 Speaker 2: some sort of change transition, whether it be like me 384 00:17:28,840 --> 00:17:31,880 Speaker 2: losing a job, my friend losing her husband, empty nest, 385 00:17:32,000 --> 00:17:35,760 Speaker 2: the kids have moved out, menopause, feeling invisible. And I 386 00:17:35,800 --> 00:17:39,040 Speaker 2: think that age group of women go through such a 387 00:17:39,080 --> 00:17:42,720 Speaker 2: lot and the attention is not on them. Nobody seems 388 00:17:42,760 --> 00:17:45,240 Speaker 2: to realize what an invisible age this is. 389 00:17:45,600 --> 00:17:47,720 Speaker 3: I love that an invisible age And do. 390 00:17:47,640 --> 00:17:52,240 Speaker 2: You know it's so interesting. I've and it is exactly 391 00:17:52,320 --> 00:17:55,000 Speaker 2: what I said. They're watching friends, every one of my friends. 392 00:17:55,040 --> 00:17:57,320 Speaker 2: Something's going on. Whether it might even be elderly parents 393 00:17:57,359 --> 00:17:58,120 Speaker 2: getting sick. 394 00:17:58,040 --> 00:17:58,679 Speaker 3: That's a big thing. 395 00:17:58,840 --> 00:18:02,399 Speaker 2: Yeah, and there is. I really feel like this group 396 00:18:02,440 --> 00:18:05,800 Speaker 2: of women I put, let's say fifty plus need a 397 00:18:05,840 --> 00:18:08,399 Speaker 2: lot more support than what they're getting. I get a 398 00:18:08,440 --> 00:18:10,640 Speaker 2: lot of women that age coming into my rooms as well, 399 00:18:10,680 --> 00:18:13,560 Speaker 2: and often it is literally I don't know who I am, 400 00:18:13,600 --> 00:18:15,159 Speaker 2: I don't know what to do with myself, or I've 401 00:18:15,160 --> 00:18:17,560 Speaker 2: forgotten how to talk to my husband and all of 402 00:18:17,560 --> 00:18:20,760 Speaker 2: these things and no one you know, when you're young. Occasionally, 403 00:18:20,880 --> 00:18:22,560 Speaker 2: not that we want men whistling at us, but we 404 00:18:22,680 --> 00:18:25,400 Speaker 2: used to get noticed. That we're a group of women 405 00:18:25,400 --> 00:18:28,120 Speaker 2: who no longer get noticed. And it's not a matter 406 00:18:28,119 --> 00:18:30,399 Speaker 2: of vanity or anything else. It's just like, oh, what 407 00:18:30,440 --> 00:18:33,280 Speaker 2: would she do? Just there? You're not what would that 408 00:18:33,400 --> 00:18:36,840 Speaker 2: person who's had all this life experience. No, And it 409 00:18:36,960 --> 00:18:39,280 Speaker 2: is a very difficult age, and I would love to 410 00:18:39,320 --> 00:18:42,879 Speaker 2: see a lot more done. In fact, before I did 411 00:18:42,920 --> 00:18:46,760 Speaker 2: the counselor, I wanted to start a network group for women, 412 00:18:47,280 --> 00:18:51,400 Speaker 2: which then the counseling can have just never got around 413 00:18:51,400 --> 00:18:55,040 Speaker 2: to it. My partner Andy Webster, who's she's a counselor 414 00:18:55,119 --> 00:18:56,760 Speaker 2: as well. We've for a long time wanted to put 415 00:18:56,800 --> 00:19:00,400 Speaker 2: together this workshop where we bring women together who going 416 00:19:00,440 --> 00:19:05,320 Speaker 2: through whatever it is and give them support one strategies, 417 00:19:05,520 --> 00:19:09,680 Speaker 2: lover it skills how to find themselves again and get 418 00:19:09,680 --> 00:19:13,200 Speaker 2: through that. And look it is a projected on the list. 419 00:19:13,320 --> 00:19:15,479 Speaker 3: Yeah, I think that would be brilliant. 420 00:19:15,600 --> 00:19:17,919 Speaker 2: Yeah, I do so you felt that. I mean, you're 421 00:19:17,960 --> 00:19:19,720 Speaker 2: a lot younger than maybe it with your friends. 422 00:19:19,600 --> 00:19:23,000 Speaker 3: Not that much younger. Yeah, I have and girlfriends as well. 423 00:19:23,000 --> 00:19:23,119 Speaker 3: You know. 424 00:19:23,160 --> 00:19:24,560 Speaker 4: I'll tell you a funny story. I was in a 425 00:19:24,600 --> 00:19:28,280 Speaker 4: major retailer the other day in the shoe department, go figure, 426 00:19:28,359 --> 00:19:33,359 Speaker 4: yes and yes, Imelda standing there, and I was right 427 00:19:34,119 --> 00:19:38,600 Speaker 4: in the staffer's face, like I was right there, right there. 428 00:19:38,960 --> 00:19:41,400 Speaker 4: There were two younger girls either side of me who 429 00:19:41,440 --> 00:19:44,920 Speaker 4: came after, and she went to them, but she didn't 430 00:19:44,960 --> 00:19:48,600 Speaker 4: even It was like truly didn't exist. It really was 431 00:19:48,920 --> 00:19:52,600 Speaker 4: like I was invisible. And one of them fortunately said 432 00:19:52,640 --> 00:19:55,320 Speaker 4: I'm sorry this lady was here first, and I thought, 433 00:19:56,000 --> 00:20:01,200 Speaker 4: I'm not that hard to like, I'm here, I am here, Like. 434 00:20:01,320 --> 00:20:02,840 Speaker 2: It is an invisible age. 435 00:20:03,760 --> 00:20:04,679 Speaker 3: Really, invisible. 436 00:20:04,760 --> 00:20:07,080 Speaker 2: Yeah, it really is. It's almost like you just discarded, 437 00:20:07,119 --> 00:20:11,240 Speaker 2: like you know, we are an aging society, but it's 438 00:20:11,280 --> 00:20:14,800 Speaker 2: a shame. In other countries, aging is considered the older 439 00:20:14,880 --> 00:20:17,160 Speaker 2: you get, the more valuable you get, and I feel 440 00:20:17,160 --> 00:20:19,680 Speaker 2: like in this country that is not the case at all. Yeah, 441 00:20:20,119 --> 00:20:23,600 Speaker 2: but you know, I think, I think I'm turning sixty 442 00:20:23,720 --> 00:20:26,719 Speaker 2: this year and I'm really excited about I've got no 443 00:20:26,800 --> 00:20:29,720 Speaker 2: problem with getting older. I love the idea of being 444 00:20:29,760 --> 00:20:32,960 Speaker 2: sixtycause I love the world life, all of that experience. 445 00:20:33,000 --> 00:20:37,320 Speaker 2: But you can't buy no, But I am feeling all 446 00:20:37,359 --> 00:20:39,359 Speaker 2: those things that you're just talking about, the invisibility and 447 00:20:39,359 --> 00:20:42,040 Speaker 2: everything else, and it is something that we have to 448 00:20:42,119 --> 00:20:46,760 Speaker 2: work on together as a group of women and give 449 00:20:46,840 --> 00:20:49,000 Speaker 2: us the skills to get through that in the strategies, 450 00:20:49,040 --> 00:20:51,800 Speaker 2: because it is. It's a terrible, terrible feeling. And I 451 00:20:51,800 --> 00:20:54,600 Speaker 2: don't think men get that, No they don't. They don't know. 452 00:20:54,880 --> 00:20:57,920 Speaker 3: Well, they're seen as a silver fox and a stallion. 453 00:20:58,160 --> 00:21:01,159 Speaker 2: Look at those. Yeah, all those lives really suiting. We 454 00:21:01,240 --> 00:21:05,120 Speaker 2: get a line and we suddenly you know, it really is. Look, 455 00:21:05,160 --> 00:21:09,000 Speaker 2: it's getting better slowly. But I was never aware of 456 00:21:09,480 --> 00:21:12,680 Speaker 2: all the things that women of this age go through. 457 00:21:12,720 --> 00:21:15,679 Speaker 2: I think you I don't know whether you've heard that 458 00:21:15,760 --> 00:21:18,120 Speaker 2: A lot of the homeless population and women. 459 00:21:17,920 --> 00:21:21,399 Speaker 4: Over sixty, which is just marriage breakups and yet or 460 00:21:21,440 --> 00:21:24,960 Speaker 4: no super or not all of that being, you know, 461 00:21:25,160 --> 00:21:26,640 Speaker 4: not being out of work because I will bring. 462 00:21:26,480 --> 00:21:27,000 Speaker 2: Up the children. 463 00:21:27,040 --> 00:21:29,439 Speaker 3: It is disgusting because they give all of themselves. 464 00:21:29,640 --> 00:21:31,920 Speaker 4: And that that's another point I want to make, and 465 00:21:32,160 --> 00:21:36,040 Speaker 4: that you have made previously, is that don't in effect, 466 00:21:36,040 --> 00:21:38,960 Speaker 4: don't rest on your laurels, like okay, I've had a 467 00:21:39,000 --> 00:21:42,760 Speaker 4: thirty six year career in radio, but don't take for 468 00:21:42,880 --> 00:21:47,240 Speaker 4: granted whatever industry you're in that well it just sounds 469 00:21:47,320 --> 00:21:48,800 Speaker 4: dye that it won't be discarded. 470 00:21:48,880 --> 00:21:49,760 Speaker 3: Have a backup. 471 00:21:49,840 --> 00:21:51,359 Speaker 2: Well, okay, I talked a lot about that in that 472 00:21:51,400 --> 00:21:53,679 Speaker 2: podcast that would diguill It. I never had a backup, 473 00:21:53,880 --> 00:21:57,479 Speaker 2: and I look back now and think, you idiot, But 474 00:21:57,640 --> 00:21:59,959 Speaker 2: I actually just just kept going and going and going, 475 00:22:00,160 --> 00:22:03,320 Speaker 2: and I never ever crossed my mind that was stupid. 476 00:22:03,440 --> 00:22:06,080 Speaker 2: So the worst thing about which you're right, That's what 477 00:22:06,119 --> 00:22:08,960 Speaker 2: I learned, is always have a plan, be and don't 478 00:22:08,960 --> 00:22:14,240 Speaker 2: think you're too old to not knowskill reskill. And I 479 00:22:14,280 --> 00:22:17,040 Speaker 2: think when I went to Union, I was the oldest 480 00:22:17,040 --> 00:22:20,119 Speaker 2: by a mile, but all the young kids were just 481 00:22:20,280 --> 00:22:22,440 Speaker 2: lovely to me. They couldn't have been nicer. They were 482 00:22:22,440 --> 00:22:24,919 Speaker 2: better at their essays, but they all said in the 483 00:22:24,960 --> 00:22:27,320 Speaker 2: practical stuff, we can't get to where you are because 484 00:22:27,320 --> 00:22:30,120 Speaker 2: you're older. You've just got an experience which we can't see. 485 00:22:30,280 --> 00:22:32,320 Speaker 4: So I mean, you're so good at talking to people 486 00:22:33,119 --> 00:22:33,960 Speaker 4: life experience. 487 00:22:34,080 --> 00:22:36,840 Speaker 2: Well, we've got so much to offer, and we can't 488 00:22:36,880 --> 00:22:41,040 Speaker 2: let menopause or anything else, or invisibility or anything else 489 00:22:41,119 --> 00:22:44,480 Speaker 2: put us off and not feeling empowered that. You know, 490 00:22:45,040 --> 00:22:51,640 Speaker 2: I'm excited about the next twenty years, assuming I really 491 00:22:51,720 --> 00:22:53,639 Speaker 2: am excited about it, but I am passionate about I 492 00:22:53,640 --> 00:22:56,320 Speaker 2: would really love to help, really would love to get 493 00:22:56,320 --> 00:22:58,400 Speaker 2: this workshop together, which you need to do it. It's 494 00:22:58,440 --> 00:23:00,119 Speaker 2: on my list, Pats. 495 00:23:01,760 --> 00:23:04,440 Speaker 4: No, But I mean good things worth doing take time. 496 00:23:04,480 --> 00:23:07,760 Speaker 4: It's like this podcast to you know this seriously, Bridge 497 00:23:07,800 --> 00:23:09,639 Speaker 4: was like three four years in the making. 498 00:23:09,720 --> 00:23:12,640 Speaker 2: And what made you so passionate because you were going through. 499 00:23:12,600 --> 00:23:14,120 Speaker 3: Because I was frustrated. 500 00:23:14,200 --> 00:23:17,320 Speaker 4: So when I was going through it, I just thought, 501 00:23:17,560 --> 00:23:19,520 Speaker 4: why aren't we talking about this? 502 00:23:19,800 --> 00:23:22,040 Speaker 3: Like why is it such a dirty word? 503 00:23:22,160 --> 00:23:25,720 Speaker 4: Like there was so much emphasis on conception and pregnancy 504 00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:29,399 Speaker 4: and birth, but why not again, It's that whole discarded 505 00:23:29,440 --> 00:23:33,439 Speaker 4: generation where I thought, well, hang on, no, and you 506 00:23:33,560 --> 00:23:36,439 Speaker 4: work decades and decades and decades to perfect your craft 507 00:23:36,480 --> 00:23:37,320 Speaker 4: and then this hits. 508 00:23:37,400 --> 00:23:39,159 Speaker 3: And you know, for me it was hang on. 509 00:23:39,280 --> 00:23:42,399 Speaker 4: So I had infertility for five years and lots of 510 00:23:42,400 --> 00:23:44,840 Speaker 4: pregnancy loss. Then I got cancer and then I hit 511 00:23:45,040 --> 00:23:45,920 Speaker 4: It's like, now. 512 00:23:45,760 --> 00:23:47,000 Speaker 3: You want me to go through. 513 00:23:46,760 --> 00:23:49,080 Speaker 2: This, Yes, I know, and we'll be a mum. And 514 00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:52,359 Speaker 2: it has there has to be a situation of empathy. 515 00:23:52,400 --> 00:23:54,960 Speaker 2: It's like, it really annoys me that women don't get 516 00:23:55,000 --> 00:24:00,040 Speaker 2: sanitary products. We're talking about half she's still. 517 00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:02,119 Speaker 3: On probably I can't remember. 518 00:24:02,359 --> 00:24:04,600 Speaker 2: All I know is that you know, when half the 519 00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:09,000 Speaker 2: population is going through something, surely and the empathy from 520 00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:12,040 Speaker 2: men is one of the most important things. And I 521 00:24:12,040 --> 00:24:14,560 Speaker 2: do think hopefully that is thanks to you and other people, 522 00:24:14,720 --> 00:24:17,479 Speaker 2: is coming to light. But you know the other thing 523 00:24:17,480 --> 00:24:20,119 Speaker 2: where women have babies, and that's not easy. I mean, 524 00:24:20,160 --> 00:24:22,080 Speaker 2: I'm glad we do. I'm glad we get to do 525 00:24:22,119 --> 00:24:24,880 Speaker 2: that to be that person, but that is tough when 526 00:24:24,920 --> 00:24:27,120 Speaker 2: you think what you go through with that, and then 527 00:24:27,400 --> 00:24:29,000 Speaker 2: you come out the other end and off you go 528 00:24:29,040 --> 00:24:30,439 Speaker 2: again into this other abyss of. 529 00:24:30,520 --> 00:24:32,200 Speaker 3: Yeah, go and be professional again now. 530 00:24:32,200 --> 00:24:35,320 Speaker 4: Plus you just feel like you're carrying so many bags 531 00:24:35,359 --> 00:24:36,120 Speaker 4: and everything. 532 00:24:36,200 --> 00:24:37,960 Speaker 2: I know, and I think I just think it's really 533 00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:39,480 Speaker 2: important to have it out in the open, and it 534 00:24:39,520 --> 00:24:41,000 Speaker 2: would be good, and it would have been nice if 535 00:24:41,040 --> 00:24:42,720 Speaker 2: I could have when I was in the room sweating 536 00:24:42,720 --> 00:24:47,800 Speaker 2: with that young boy embarrassed, well, I think I just 537 00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:52,199 Speaker 2: think it caught me by surprise and I was horrified, 538 00:24:52,280 --> 00:24:55,560 Speaker 2: and I just if it had been you sitting opposite me, 539 00:24:55,600 --> 00:24:58,159 Speaker 2: that would have been easy. But I think in retrospect, 540 00:24:58,200 --> 00:25:01,040 Speaker 2: I should have just said, also, you don't reveal too 541 00:25:01,119 --> 00:25:03,560 Speaker 2: much about which, of course it might be a bit 542 00:25:03,600 --> 00:25:06,280 Speaker 2: personal too, but I would definitely. I mean, the girls 543 00:25:06,280 --> 00:25:08,080 Speaker 2: and I talk about it all the time. We spend 544 00:25:08,160 --> 00:25:10,440 Speaker 2: our life talking about it with our fans, and that's 545 00:25:10,480 --> 00:25:12,680 Speaker 2: great and everything else. And look, some of my friends 546 00:25:12,720 --> 00:25:15,720 Speaker 2: have had it absolutely terribly, like they have really their 547 00:25:15,720 --> 00:25:19,520 Speaker 2: whole lives have been affected by it. I changed their life, 548 00:25:19,640 --> 00:25:24,000 Speaker 2: Britchie about to stop worker one has one's been on 549 00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:29,600 Speaker 2: hrt off, hrt, tried this, tried that, just ongoing and 550 00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:31,919 Speaker 2: very down in the dumps and you know, not a 551 00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:35,879 Speaker 2: depressive personality at all. So that's been really really tricky. 552 00:25:36,240 --> 00:25:38,760 Speaker 4: How many of your clients that you see through counseling 553 00:25:39,480 --> 00:25:45,200 Speaker 4: do you think perhaps their mental state can be metopause 554 00:25:45,200 --> 00:25:46,320 Speaker 4: part of it. 555 00:25:45,920 --> 00:25:48,400 Speaker 2: A few, like a lot of women who come in 556 00:25:48,680 --> 00:25:51,560 Speaker 2: who are in that range. I often say, I'm not 557 00:25:51,600 --> 00:25:56,320 Speaker 2: sure I'm feeling this way if it's that or But 558 00:25:56,440 --> 00:25:59,280 Speaker 2: usually it always plays a part, and some, as I've said, 559 00:25:59,400 --> 00:26:04,360 Speaker 2: really drastically bad I was. I don't know. I don't 560 00:26:04,359 --> 00:26:06,080 Speaker 2: know the answers to it because I haven't gone into 561 00:26:06,080 --> 00:26:08,000 Speaker 2: it far enough because I haven't needed to. But I 562 00:26:08,040 --> 00:26:11,080 Speaker 2: do think always heading down the Eastern track's a good 563 00:26:11,080 --> 00:26:14,639 Speaker 2: idea to just seeing if there's some some sort of 564 00:26:15,119 --> 00:26:17,639 Speaker 2: Chinese medicine that can help you. Yeah, I don't know. 565 00:26:18,560 --> 00:26:20,560 Speaker 3: If it means standing on your head up against a wall. 566 00:26:20,920 --> 00:26:22,840 Speaker 2: If it helps, Yeah, It's like I do try to 567 00:26:22,840 --> 00:26:24,400 Speaker 2: get pregnant to do the bicycle legs. 568 00:26:24,560 --> 00:26:26,240 Speaker 4: Yes, you would have done it, pillow up under the 569 00:26:26,240 --> 00:26:31,359 Speaker 4: bum you every single day. Well, I was taking Chinese herbs, 570 00:26:31,359 --> 00:26:33,080 Speaker 4: so we were flying up to Sydney once a month. 571 00:26:33,119 --> 00:26:36,159 Speaker 4: We had this German Chinese doctor, doctor Snell. 572 00:26:36,240 --> 00:26:36,879 Speaker 3: He was brilliant. 573 00:26:36,920 --> 00:26:39,680 Speaker 4: He had this tiny little practice in Chatswood and we 574 00:26:39,800 --> 00:26:42,280 Speaker 4: go up once a month and he do dry needling. 575 00:26:42,800 --> 00:26:44,800 Speaker 4: And I think it was at Moxie. Have you ever 576 00:26:44,800 --> 00:26:45,280 Speaker 4: seen mine? 577 00:26:45,280 --> 00:26:47,720 Speaker 2: I had moxy. I had Moxy, the burning box I 578 00:26:47,760 --> 00:26:49,320 Speaker 2: called it. Yeah, I had that when I was trying 579 00:26:49,320 --> 00:26:49,919 Speaker 2: to get pregnant. 580 00:26:50,240 --> 00:26:51,159 Speaker 3: Yes, it's brilliant. 581 00:26:51,200 --> 00:26:53,080 Speaker 4: And you know what so I had about because I've 582 00:26:53,080 --> 00:26:56,119 Speaker 4: got indo and polycystic. So he cleared. I mean you've 583 00:26:56,160 --> 00:26:57,639 Speaker 4: always got that, you can't get rid of it. But 584 00:26:57,760 --> 00:26:59,800 Speaker 4: cleared all the gun out of my system. And then 585 00:26:59,840 --> 00:27:02,160 Speaker 4: you pregnant and got pregnant with ordering and we've done 586 00:27:02,200 --> 00:27:03,959 Speaker 4: IVF before that that didn't work. 587 00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:05,680 Speaker 3: It's look, it's whatever. 588 00:27:05,400 --> 00:27:09,040 Speaker 2: Works, whatever works for you, and I don't care how crazy. Yeah, 589 00:27:09,119 --> 00:27:13,040 Speaker 2: it's like I remember when Jim Stein's had cancer and 590 00:27:13,400 --> 00:27:15,399 Speaker 2: he's doing everything he could and he ended up drinking? 591 00:27:15,520 --> 00:27:17,720 Speaker 2: Is you? And I think at once that's and I'm like, 592 00:27:17,840 --> 00:27:20,360 Speaker 2: I was thinking, go for it, like whatever you can 593 00:27:20,400 --> 00:27:22,680 Speaker 2: do to help yourself. But I think the best thing 594 00:27:22,760 --> 00:27:27,240 Speaker 2: is talking about it, getting your partners talking about it. 595 00:27:27,280 --> 00:27:29,560 Speaker 2: Without that And I really think back to those days 596 00:27:29,560 --> 00:27:33,440 Speaker 2: with that fan and the mockery like it was constant, 597 00:27:33,520 --> 00:27:36,320 Speaker 2: wasn't it, And look good hearted in every way, But 598 00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:39,920 Speaker 2: I think back on now. I think I shouldn't have 599 00:27:39,960 --> 00:27:41,760 Speaker 2: had to probably had to know that. 600 00:27:42,200 --> 00:27:45,359 Speaker 4: No, No, I think yeah, there's lessons to be learned. 601 00:27:45,400 --> 00:27:48,800 Speaker 2: I think, yeah, yeah, and you're teaching them. Patsy. I'm 602 00:27:48,880 --> 00:27:49,480 Speaker 2: very proud of you. 603 00:27:49,840 --> 00:27:50,720 Speaker 3: I'm proud of you. 604 00:27:51,080 --> 00:27:54,280 Speaker 2: Well, I'm prouder proud. 605 00:27:54,520 --> 00:27:58,920 Speaker 4: Like So if women are grappling and they're in Melbourne 606 00:27:58,920 --> 00:28:00,119 Speaker 4: because you're where is your. 607 00:28:01,000 --> 00:28:03,800 Speaker 2: Oh that's very nice. If you it's Bridget Duco Counseling. 608 00:28:04,280 --> 00:28:06,800 Speaker 2: I've got rooms in South Yarra, so if you can 609 00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:08,680 Speaker 2: just yeah, google Bridget do Co Counseling. 610 00:28:08,920 --> 00:28:11,520 Speaker 3: I've got rooms in South Yarra. No I haven't. 611 00:28:12,640 --> 00:28:15,120 Speaker 2: You've got rooms in Richmond, and you've got a website. 612 00:28:15,160 --> 00:28:19,720 Speaker 2: I've got a website. So it's b D yeh one 613 00:28:19,720 --> 00:28:24,000 Speaker 2: of those things. What's underscore hyphen hyphen bd bd? 614 00:28:24,400 --> 00:28:27,800 Speaker 4: Oh god, this is the rain fog. Just just blame 615 00:28:27,840 --> 00:28:29,800 Speaker 4: the brain fog. We can put a link, we can 616 00:28:29,800 --> 00:28:31,000 Speaker 4: put a link. 617 00:28:31,119 --> 00:28:36,200 Speaker 2: We can absolutely, I see that's menopause. Anyway, it's b 618 00:28:36,440 --> 00:28:44,680 Speaker 2: D Counseling dot com dot means because it's so embarrassing. 619 00:28:45,000 --> 00:28:46,880 Speaker 2: Thanks for the plug, which I've just mucked up. 620 00:28:46,920 --> 00:28:47,440 Speaker 3: No you haven't. 621 00:28:47,480 --> 00:28:50,320 Speaker 4: We'll put a link up because seriously, if people are grappling, 622 00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:53,240 Speaker 4: it helps to talk to someone that's not necessarily your 623 00:28:53,280 --> 00:28:54,959 Speaker 4: partner or a girlfriend. 624 00:28:55,120 --> 00:28:56,960 Speaker 3: You just need to find the right mix, don't you. 625 00:28:57,240 --> 00:28:59,840 Speaker 2: And I just think, and there are strategies, which you know. 626 00:29:00,200 --> 00:29:03,960 Speaker 2: I love helping people try and not feel the pain 627 00:29:04,040 --> 00:29:06,240 Speaker 2: their feeling. But I put some things into place. There 628 00:29:06,240 --> 00:29:07,440 Speaker 2: are a lot of things you can do. And I 629 00:29:07,480 --> 00:29:09,480 Speaker 2: think often with women our age, you've spent so much 630 00:29:09,480 --> 00:29:12,120 Speaker 2: time throwing everything in to the kids, You've actually forgotten 631 00:29:12,160 --> 00:29:13,000 Speaker 2: how to soothe yourself. 632 00:29:13,000 --> 00:29:15,040 Speaker 3: It's shop syndrome. I call it. 633 00:29:15,160 --> 00:29:15,400 Speaker 2: Yep. 634 00:29:15,720 --> 00:29:18,440 Speaker 4: You just you always put yourself last. And it's not 635 00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:21,640 Speaker 4: a conscious decision you make. I just think, as a mum, 636 00:29:21,680 --> 00:29:22,120 Speaker 4: you do that. 637 00:29:22,240 --> 00:29:24,880 Speaker 2: You do that, and then suddenly it's like, oh, I've 638 00:29:24,880 --> 00:29:26,920 Speaker 2: forgotten how to look after myself. I don't know how 639 00:29:27,000 --> 00:29:29,640 Speaker 2: to start. So yeah, I mean that's where And I 640 00:29:29,720 --> 00:29:32,960 Speaker 2: am passionate aboutetting these workshops, which I will must one 641 00:29:32,960 --> 00:29:33,680 Speaker 2: of these days. 642 00:29:33,760 --> 00:29:35,640 Speaker 3: I'd love to see you do that. Yeah, you should 643 00:29:35,680 --> 00:29:37,120 Speaker 3: do this podcast series. 644 00:29:37,080 --> 00:29:38,560 Speaker 2: Now I'm on yours. I don't want to do mine. 645 00:29:38,600 --> 00:29:42,640 Speaker 3: I'm quite happy a big guests, Bridgie, thank you so much. 646 00:29:42,840 --> 00:29:43,640 Speaker 2: You just adorable. 647 00:29:43,760 --> 00:29:44,680 Speaker 3: I love you a bit well, I. 648 00:29:44,640 --> 00:29:46,200 Speaker 2: Love you too, and I'm good on you. I think 649 00:29:46,200 --> 00:29:49,480 Speaker 2: this is a really amazing podcast. I've listened to every episode, 650 00:29:49,520 --> 00:29:51,920 Speaker 2: and I also think good on you because I know 651 00:29:51,920 --> 00:29:54,040 Speaker 2: you've put the whole thing together yourself and it's amazing. 652 00:29:54,280 --> 00:29:58,160 Speaker 1: So good on, congratulations, Thank you. Bridge to Chloe. You know, 653 00:29:58,240 --> 00:30:01,600 Speaker 1: some people just come into our lives reason. She's certainly 654 00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:05,479 Speaker 1: one of those blessings in my life. Join me in 655 00:30:05,600 --> 00:30:08,600 Speaker 1: episode five, as I hit the halfway mark of series 656 00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:11,840 Speaker 1: two of Rage Against the Menopause, I talk about a 657 00:30:11,880 --> 00:30:13,360 Speaker 1: breakthrough in treatment. 658 00:30:13,760 --> 00:30:14,120 Speaker 2: Ossie. 659 00:30:14,120 --> 00:30:19,000 Speaker 1: Women suffering from debilitating symptoms finally have access to the 660 00:30:19,040 --> 00:30:22,760 Speaker 1: first new kind of hormone therapy to be subsidized by 661 00:30:22,800 --> 00:30:26,600 Speaker 1: the federal government in more than two decades. We explore 662 00:30:26,600 --> 00:30:31,120 Speaker 1: those options with Professor doctor Sonya Davison, endochronology lead at 663 00:30:31,160 --> 00:30:34,680 Speaker 1: the Gene Hales Clinic. I'm Petrina Jones, and thanks for 664 00:30:34,760 --> 00:30:37,560 Speaker 1: listening Rage Against the Menopause.