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Speaker 1: Black Cast Unite our voices. Black Magic Woman Podcast acknowledges

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Speaker 1: the traditional owners of the land we have recorded this

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Speaker 1: episode on. We also acknowledge traditional owners of the land

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Speaker 1: where you, the listener or viewer, are tuning in from.

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Speaker 1: We would like to pay our respects to our elders

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Speaker 1: past and present and acknowledge that this always was Aboriginal

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Speaker 1: land and always will be Aboriginal land.

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Speaker 2: I love that about our mob too.

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Speaker 3: You know, we might live in a modern context, but

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Speaker 3: we still operate on our kinship terms of reference, and

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Speaker 3: you know, try and keep that as strong as possible

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Speaker 3: and that respect and that good way too. Welcome to

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Speaker 3: the Black Magic Woman Podcast with Mandanara Bail.

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Speaker 1: Welcome to a very exciting episode of the Black Magic

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Speaker 1: Woman Podcast. I can't wait for you to hear all

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Speaker 1: about my guest today. This episode has been freaking a

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Speaker 1: long time and I'm already getting excited. When I say freaking,

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Speaker 1: I'm excited a long time in the making. I've got

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Speaker 1: my sister from childhood long time ago, when we were

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Speaker 1: dancing up at Woodford Festival. So anyone that used to

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Speaker 1: do Woodford Festival, Malaney Festival, you would have saw not

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Speaker 1: just this beautiful woman sitting next to me, but also

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Speaker 1: would have remembered one of our song men as well.

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Speaker 1: So this episode's going to be special. I can't wait

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Speaker 1: for you to hear. This is Smala, also known as Mum.

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Speaker 1: Read the label just flew in from Darwin, from the

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Speaker 1: Darwin Art Fair also known as DAF. So we're going

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Speaker 1: to dive all into that. But before we do, my sister,

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Speaker 1: we are on the beautiful lands, unseated lands of the

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Speaker 1: cooler Nations here and now I just want to acknowledge

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Speaker 1: the mob here. I've been here for a couple of days,

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Speaker 1: you're now living here, and I just can't wait to

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Speaker 1: get people to hear your story and everything that you've

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Speaker 1: been doing and what you've actually so over to you,

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Speaker 1: my sister, the microphone is yours. Tell these fellas who

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Speaker 1: your moby is, where you grew up a little bit

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Speaker 1: about yourself.

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Speaker 2: Oh my mom. Thank you, my sister for that beautiful introduction.

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Speaker 2: My mom.

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Speaker 3: My mother's from Fraser Island and Kep Islands, only known

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Speaker 3: for a very short period of history as Fraser Island.

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Speaker 2: We call it Gary.

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Speaker 3: And my dad, like you said, was a strong, staunch

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Speaker 3: cultural man and he came from Mornington Island in the

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Speaker 3: golf carpent area. And yeah, we spent a lot of

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Speaker 3: time together as children, dancing, practicing culture, traveling a lot and.

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Speaker 1: Just running a mark as kids do.

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Speaker 2: Red Phone best times Brisbane.

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Speaker 3: You know, I remember us being at Musgrave Park, my

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Speaker 3: probably earliest memory, a bit of three years old, and

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Speaker 3: Uncle Doug Curry was walking around with a bucket full

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Speaker 3: of oranges that were frozen hand out to us kids

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Speaker 3: because it was so hot.

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Speaker 2: But we've been dancing all day. Yeah, good memories.

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Speaker 1: Well, so you're literally when I think about you, I

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Speaker 1: think about all the countries you visited. Right, this is

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Speaker 1: how I think about you when I when I explained

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Speaker 1: my sister to people are surround. This girl has been

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Speaker 1: all around the world. She's met royalty, she's stayed in Paris,

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Speaker 1: she's been invited to VIP parties, She's represented our people

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Speaker 1: and culture on the international stage and now going into fashion.

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Speaker 1: You know our tea Now, Tiger Lily, you better do

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Speaker 1: a shout out for Tiger Lily. We'll never forget you

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Speaker 1: for teaching her how to weave. That's her fondest memory

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Speaker 1: and your little connection with her.

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Speaker 3: Tiger Lily is my darling. I love her so much.

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Speaker 3: I love your baby. If you're watching this, Annie has

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Speaker 3: presents coming for you. I already gave him tomorrow. This

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Speaker 3: my darling, was inspired by your mama and she's a

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Speaker 3: rainbow woman, and she actually asked me to kind of

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Speaker 3: put this on to merch a couple of months ago,

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Speaker 3: so I had to do it. But my label Mum

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Speaker 3: Read isn't actually about the printed staff felt. I went

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Speaker 3: to a runway show about two years ago and I

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Speaker 3: saw such fire and strength in our people coming down

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Speaker 3: that runway in a way that had never been represented before.

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Speaker 3: And it literally I had an emotive response. I started crying.

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Speaker 3: I sat there and it was black photographers, it was

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Speaker 3: black models, it was black clothing, it was black brands.

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Speaker 1: And black stylists, black makeup artists, blacked everything. It was

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Speaker 1: just blacked out.

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Speaker 3: It was and it was just like, this is the

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Speaker 3: beauty of our people. And I think last year was

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Speaker 3: really difficult for me after having such a very long

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Speaker 3: history of you know, I have traveled a lot, and

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Speaker 3: I've had amazing opportunities to meet amazing people around the world,

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Speaker 3: and all of that has come as a result of

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Speaker 3: you know, I was fighting for country, And as you know,

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Speaker 3: I did native title for a long time, so I

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Speaker 3: was lead applicant on our native title claim for thirteen

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Speaker 3: years for my family line. And then we got a

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Speaker 3: successful consent determination in twenty twenty one.

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Speaker 1: Big, big congratulations, huge achievement, and still hasn't finished the fight.

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Speaker 2: Still there, fight's still there.

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Speaker 3: Actually, Native title claim number two just got registered and

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Speaker 3: my family put me up on that, So.

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Speaker 2: Here we go again.

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Speaker 3: But I actually did try and step back last year

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Speaker 3: because the referendum, I feel was very heavy on a

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Speaker 3: lot of our mob and for me personally, I felt

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Speaker 3: like we were a part of a conversation that was

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Speaker 3: drowning our voices out. At the same time it was

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Speaker 3: supposed to give us one and I came to the conclusion,

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Speaker 3: how can they hear us if they can't even see us?

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Speaker 2: And while it.

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Speaker 3: Was so deadly for me to see all of these

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Speaker 3: brands and different styles of clothing represented on that runway,

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Speaker 3: I had noticed when I was sitting there that something

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Speaker 3: was missing, and.

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Speaker 2: It was our traditional resources.

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Speaker 3: Where's the skin, Where's the fur, where's the feathers, where's

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Speaker 3: the weaving, where's the quill work, where's the shells, like

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Speaker 3: little bits.

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Speaker 2: Of adornment, but not actually in the clothes.

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Speaker 3: And so I decided to challenge myself and see if

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Speaker 3: I could take the skills that I've learnt over my

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Speaker 3: lifetime sitting with my old people, learn how to weave

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Speaker 3: and tie feathers and work the sinew and chew it.

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Speaker 1: And when we're talking about sinew, we're talking about kangaroo.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, we're talking about kangaroo.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, the insides of a kangaroo that holds the muscles together.

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Speaker 1: That sinew. Yeah, so when you ever get kangaroo, mean

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Speaker 1: it's a bit chewy, that's sinewy.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 1: So Smile is talking about using the sinew from the

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Speaker 1: room to then tie pieces together. This is definitely for

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Speaker 1: non mob that have no idea that you're talking about

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Speaker 1: using animal. But it's not. We don't waste anything.

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Speaker 3: And so I have three eskis in the back of

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Speaker 3: my fall drive, once for reptiles, ones for mammals, and

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Speaker 3: the other ones for birds. So I think it's yeah,

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Speaker 3: these hands don't mind getting dirty.

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Speaker 1: I'm sorry, I know I saw you just trying to

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Speaker 1: cut that old man gowenna up. Remember we found that going.

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Speaker 2: You and Peace come in with it.

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Speaker 1: He was literally got hit. We had to put him

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Speaker 1: out of his misery.

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Speaker 2: Yep.

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Speaker 1: And I wanted that belly fat a ye.

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Speaker 2: Had to get the poison.

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Speaker 1: I didn't have a knife sharp enough.

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Speaker 2: We couldn't get through well yack. I didn't have a knife,

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Speaker 2: didn't have.

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Speaker 1: The reptiles, birds and mamois.

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Speaker 3: I love this, so I treat them all. I take

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Speaker 3: them home, assault them, I wash them. It's like from

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Speaker 3: an eucalyptus, and then I use them to create these

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Speaker 3: items of clothing.

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Speaker 2: That are one hundred percent.

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Speaker 3: Naturally made from country, or they have been made from

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Speaker 3: the fractures that exist upon it. So we live in

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Speaker 3: a fractured nation, and I feel last year those fractures

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Speaker 3: actually really became quite visible, and out of those fractures

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Speaker 3: came us. And I don't know where we're going to

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Speaker 3: go in the future, but I feel like now is

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Speaker 3: the time for us to be seen, because if we're

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Speaker 3: going to be heard, we need to be seen, because

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Speaker 3: they need to see us for all the beauty that

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Speaker 3: we have.

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Speaker 1: Your next T shirt right, your next line, your next

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Speaker 1: print needs to be if you haven't already done this,

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Speaker 1: and don't copy you fellus. This is trademarked on the show. Besides,

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Speaker 1: and if you do, copies are comment for you. We'll

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Speaker 1: see you.

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Speaker 2: I'll get my sister to do it.

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Speaker 1: How can they hear us when they can't see us.

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Speaker 1: That's going to be on a T shirt. Love it.

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Speaker 3: I actually set it to the models at the Country

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Speaker 3: to catur runway show that we just did last week

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Speaker 3: up in Dowan. So I showcased with twenty designers from

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Speaker 3: across the country fifteen piece collection and Country to Cautour

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Speaker 3: actually as an opportunity for younger models to learn about

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Speaker 3: the industry and get experience on runways. And we were

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Speaker 3: asked to address them and explain about our pieces before

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Speaker 3: they wore them, and I asked them to think about

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Speaker 3: the thousand generations of women that have birthed for them

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Speaker 3: to be here today and how they want a thousand

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Speaker 3: generations down the line of their descendants to feel as

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Speaker 3: powerful black matriarchs walking on our own land.

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Speaker 2: And to walk down the runway like that.

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Speaker 3: And it it was.

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Speaker 2: It was really emotional.

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Speaker 3: Actually, I had those young girls come up to me

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Speaker 3: afterwards and thanked me for they felt it. They felt

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Speaker 3: it in the pieces.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, they come something they probably never felt before.

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Speaker 3: Because you know, when we were dancing, when we were young,

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Speaker 3: you know, and back when we were doing it, it

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Speaker 3: wasn't like nowadays, Like I really feel like our parents

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Speaker 3: and our generation and the generation beforehand, our generation has children.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, because it was our parents that did it.

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Speaker 3: They carved out a space where they made them see us.

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Speaker 3: They made them see us, and we took our culture

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Speaker 3: and our song and our dance, and we took it

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Speaker 3: to places where the reception wasn't always that great. You know,

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Speaker 3: we weren't actually always met with applause and O, this

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Speaker 3: is wonderful.

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Speaker 1: You know, you didn't always have an audience except.

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Speaker 2: For family, Yeah, exactly.

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Speaker 1: You know, they always show up.

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Speaker 2: But when when we.

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Speaker 3: Paint up and we put on our dance gear, for me,

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Speaker 3: that always felt like a shield, you know, like I'm protected,

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Speaker 3: like no matter what happens outside in that other world,

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Speaker 3: I'm walking in my spirit in this moment, and I

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Speaker 3: am so protected by all my old people. And I

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Speaker 3: try to put that into the pieces that I create.

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Speaker 3: And after I yearned with the girls and they did

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Speaker 3: their first they put the pieces on. It was their

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Speaker 3: first dress rehearsal, and they walked down the runway. I

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Speaker 3: had them coming up to me and crying afterwards, saying

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Speaker 3: that they just felt strong and powerful.

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Speaker 2: When they wore it and shielded.

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Speaker 3: And for me, if I can give that feeling to

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Speaker 3: these young girls, and they.

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Speaker 1: Feels and nieces our daughters.

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Speaker 3: Our future manies, mothers, you know, and culturally, you know,

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Speaker 3: like when I'm an old girl, they're young girls. They're

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Speaker 3: going to be my small mums and you know, my

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Speaker 3: little sisters and my big sisters. That switches the other

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Speaker 3: way because as we get older, we become younger and

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Speaker 3: they become older and they got to look after us.

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Speaker 1: It's such a beautiful explanation description of our culture. And

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Speaker 1: that's what saddens me about this country is that and

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Speaker 1: we don't have to worry about non apecial people or

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Speaker 1: white Australians and non Indigenous Australians, but they've missed out

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Speaker 1: on so much. They've missed out on this amazing gift

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Speaker 1: that we're still willing to share with.

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Speaker 3: Them, or constantly trying to share, constantly trying to share. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: and if people could open their eyes, they could see it.

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Speaker 3: If they could see it, they'd be able to open

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Speaker 3: their beinnungs. So that they can hear it.

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Speaker 1: And then feel it. Yeah, and it would be a

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Speaker 1: feeling that they've never felt before. A lot of non

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Speaker 1: abistional people say a lot of white fellows.

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Speaker 2: Say that.

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Speaker 1: They don't they don't have this sense of belonging or

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Speaker 1: they don't feel like they belong anywhere. And I said,

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Speaker 1: because you've never been welcomed into the country, blackfellows can

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Speaker 1: give you that sense of belonging that you can only

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Speaker 1: get from our mob, right from our people from this country.

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Speaker 1: That's still available, not to everyone, but we're still here.

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Speaker 2: We gotta come in a good way, and you want

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Speaker 2: to come in a good way. Yeah, and here.

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Speaker 1: In this place the Warren Jerry mob they took about

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Speaker 1: woman Jenka and it's not greetings. The mob I deliver

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Speaker 1: training yesterday said oh, yeah, that means hello, And I'm like, well,

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Speaker 1: actually no. So I had to warn Hunter, Commissioner Hunter

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Speaker 1: on the podcast and she said to me, it means

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Speaker 1: to come with purpose. And you know when the people

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Speaker 1: that you meet are good people and we take them

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Speaker 1: in and we show them the way and then we

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Speaker 1: make them part of our community. That's right.

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Speaker 3: And we grew up with an open door policy. That's

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Speaker 3: exactly in front or open for you know everybody.

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Speaker 1: Well opened fridge door, open window, someone come through the window.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, that wasn't unusual.

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Speaker 1: So what are you going to do with this country

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Speaker 1: to catue our darling out fair? These awards you got

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Speaker 1: nominated for? Like, what is what's happening now?

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Speaker 3: Should I rat it all off till I feel like, oh,

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Speaker 3: it's a bit it's a bit.

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Speaker 1: Of a It's not an overnight success, all right. You

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Speaker 1: might have thought, smilas you know, doing this and working

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Speaker 1: here and running meetings and off back to country. In

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Speaker 1: the meantime, you're doing thousands of hours of work, like

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Speaker 1: this is hand sewing beating. I watched you with Tiger Lily,

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Speaker 1: and you're just how you set your weaving up. You've

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Speaker 1: got these big things and it's all And I just thought, oh,

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Speaker 1: I don't have the patience for this. And we're in

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Speaker 1: Cans on holidays for my fortieth and Tigler just kept

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Speaker 1: saying to me, take me back to Arnie house. But

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Speaker 1: it was my birth time. I think we're going to

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Speaker 1: spend the day together. She didn't want to spend the

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Speaker 1: day with me. She got more patience than you, She

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Speaker 1: got way more patience than me. But she she she

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Speaker 1: was loving every minute of watching you and and learning

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Speaker 1: from you.

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Speaker 3: And that's the magic, you know, that's it's She's very

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Speaker 3: special in that sense. Like I, I sit down with

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Speaker 3: the kids as much as I can to try and

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Speaker 3: teach them and pass it on.

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Speaker 2: And you know, not.

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Speaker 3: Everybody is a weaver, some of some people don't have

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Speaker 3: the patience for it. But when you come across a

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Speaker 3: little girl that is as talented and as deeply enthralled

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Speaker 3: by it that she sat there with me for hours.

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Speaker 1: Oh no, yeah, didn't you sleep over? Tigerly won't sleep

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Speaker 1: at anyone's house. She's in my bed, still in my

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Speaker 1: bed at eight, and she didn't come home.

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Speaker 2: We swap kids, you took you took my sisters? No

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Speaker 2: are we? Baby? Oh?

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Speaker 3: Speaking of nowI though, So I have just I've got

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Speaker 3: to do a shout out to my little sister because

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Speaker 3: the last ten days I have spent up on Ladakir

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Speaker 3: country and that's her country. And so she's a Mills.

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Speaker 3: She's a Mills, that's right, so and a Junie Mills.

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Speaker 3: And so yesterday I went and seeing RB and I

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Speaker 3: dropped off all of my new line because this is

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Speaker 3: the thing as well.

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Speaker 1: Just gotta like seriously, I I that's what I'm gonna wear.

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Speaker 1: I put my laptop in this bag today and I

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Speaker 1: did have the whale shirt like this whale when you

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Speaker 1: see your new line.

305
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Speaker 3: So my new line was actually meant to come from

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Speaker 3: a manufacturer, but it was the late delivery, so I

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Speaker 3: didn't arrive in time, so that my entire collection was

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Speaker 3: everything handmade, grassroots cultural couture, totally bespoke, handbearded, woven, and

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Speaker 3: a lot.

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Speaker 2: Of labor, a lot of love, a lot of labor.

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Speaker 3: Probably about over the last three months, so I spent

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Speaker 3: probably about two hundred and fifty hours of just weaving

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Speaker 3: and beating. I tried to keep account on each piece

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Speaker 3: that I did, so every piece that I do comes

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Speaker 3: with story. And I only launched my label in October

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Speaker 3: last year, so it's been ten months and.

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Speaker 2: It's been a domino effect.

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Speaker 3: So within three days of meat launching the label, I

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Speaker 3: was invited to Melbourne Fashion Week to showcase on the

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Speaker 3: Gambi Mara runway. They rang me and they were like,

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Speaker 3: do you have eight pieces you could show on the

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Speaker 3: runway next week? And I was like mm hmm, yep,

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Speaker 3: How you do it, fake it, do you make it? Yeah?

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Speaker 3: I didn't, but I did buy that next week, and

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Speaker 3: so I showcased there and amazingly, I had Thelma Plum's

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Speaker 3: stylists reach out to me, and I then created a

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Speaker 3: piece for her to where when she performed at Coldplay's

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Speaker 3: sold out concert in Wa, I saw the pigs. She

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Speaker 3: just looked absolutely amazing. Shout out to Thalia as well,

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Speaker 3: you're just divine.

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Speaker 1: We love you, Thelma, but.

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Speaker 2: We don't talk about it.

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Speaker 3: And then so not long after that, I was invited

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Speaker 3: to Global Indigenous Runway with Melbourne Fashion Festival, New York

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Speaker 3: Fashion Week. The country took a tour Runway and a

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Speaker 3: few others that I can't talk about just yet. And

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Speaker 3: I think, like watch your space people as a one

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Speaker 3: woman show, you know, like it's me. I make everything.

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Speaker 3: I built my website myself, I do everything myself. And

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Speaker 3: I was yearning with my mum about it, and I

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Speaker 3: was just kind of like, you know, I just feel

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Speaker 3: like some days maybe I'm not worthy to be in

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Speaker 3: the space. And my mom turned around and just said

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Speaker 3: to me, Mala, you might feel like you're behind, but

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Speaker 3: when it comes to you doing this, you've been doing

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Speaker 3: this for thirty years. You know, you've been ever since

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Speaker 3: you were a little girl. You've been pulling apart string

348
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Speaker 3: and pulling things apart and putting them together and making clothes.

349
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Speaker 3: And you might feel like you're behind, but you actually

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Speaker 3: laps ahead.

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Speaker 2: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: So you just you've got to have faith in yourself

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Speaker 3: and just let yourself create. Because I've never really had

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Speaker 3: the time to.

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Speaker 2: Really sit down.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm always going, and of course, and so just

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Speaker 3: in this last year, seeing what's come out of that,

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Speaker 3: it is pretty amazing.

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Speaker 1: And I see you found love.

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Speaker 3: Stop.

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Speaker 2: Oh yes, I did. I found myself a lovely.

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Speaker 1: Southern really is. I don't need a man. You were

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Speaker 1: very carefree, case didn't want in a rome in the

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Speaker 1: country doing you and the next minute loved up, shacked up.

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Speaker 3: I met him at my runway show. I haven't told

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Speaker 3: you how I met him. Here everybody gonna find out

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Speaker 3: how I mad him. I met him at my runway show.

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Speaker 3: I just finished dress the models and had to put

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Speaker 3: my dress on because they walked the designers out. So

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Speaker 3: I went into the model room, I put on my dress,

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Speaker 3: come out and I'm standing there and I can feel

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Speaker 3: someone staring at me. You know, well around nothing, I

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Speaker 3: still feel it. I look around and then I see

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Speaker 3: this beautiful man standing there in a tuxedo. Mind you,

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00:20:23,751 --> 00:20:27,951
Speaker 3: beautiful black man in a tuxedo old in the ladder way.

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Speaker 2: You know, did you do? It's just like I looked

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Speaker 2: at him and he was is this real?

378
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Speaker 1: This cannot be real?

379
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Speaker 2: And you know what this means to me, right? I know?

380
00:20:38,671 --> 00:20:42,111
Speaker 2: You know how that? Yeah, that's calls out to me

381
00:20:42,151 --> 00:20:42,911
Speaker 2: from my childhood.

382
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Speaker 3: And anyway, I see this man and he's staring at

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Speaker 3: me like dead intent. And when a man is looking

384
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Speaker 3: at you and he's sleazy, he'll look at you and

385
00:20:50,831 --> 00:20:52,631
Speaker 3: he'll kind of do that kind of thing, you know,

386
00:20:52,751 --> 00:20:55,351
Speaker 3: raise his eyebrows or whatever, or think when he's got

387
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Speaker 3: that whole I'm deadly, or I'll look down and look away,

388
00:20:59,791 --> 00:21:04,031
Speaker 3: you know, because they got caught looking at you for

389
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Speaker 3: young ones.

390
00:21:04,951 --> 00:21:06,751
Speaker 2: Yeah, take note, fellows, we know what you do.

391
00:21:08,271 --> 00:21:11,391
Speaker 1: We can read you from a mile away.

392
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Speaker 2: Well, what struck me with him?

393
00:21:13,551 --> 00:21:15,791
Speaker 3: He just swept me off my feet, I guess from

394
00:21:15,831 --> 00:21:17,711
Speaker 3: the get go is he did neither.

395
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Speaker 2: He did neither.

396
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Speaker 3: He looked me dead in my eyes, and he walked

397
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Speaker 3: straight over to me and he goes my name's Paul Kelly.

398
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Speaker 1: Literally Paul Kelly.

399
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Speaker 3: Paul Kelly, Yes, not the white Paul Kelly, the black

400
00:21:31,471 --> 00:21:33,311
Speaker 3: Paul Kelly. Yeah, but they got the same birthday.

401
00:21:35,111 --> 00:21:38,511
Speaker 1: Big shout out to Paul Kelly. Yeah to both years on.

402
00:21:38,591 --> 00:21:40,511
Speaker 2: My Runway show because I put his name down on

403
00:21:40,551 --> 00:21:40,831
Speaker 2: the door.

404
00:21:40,831 --> 00:21:42,431
Speaker 3: I hadn't ringing me up and they were like, are

405
00:21:42,471 --> 00:21:44,511
Speaker 3: you bringing Paul Kelly And you're going.

406
00:21:44,471 --> 00:21:47,311
Speaker 1: To keep saying it's the black Paul Kelly. I love this.

407
00:21:47,471 --> 00:21:50,231
Speaker 3: Literally, Like when we went because I dressed Emily Watermor

408
00:21:50,231 --> 00:21:55,751
Speaker 3: for the Nethasnia's National Indigenous Music Awards, we had the

409
00:21:55,871 --> 00:21:57,711
Speaker 3: Fashion Awards and the Music Awards NEMA at.

410
00:21:57,631 --> 00:21:59,231
Speaker 2: The same time, two days apart.

411
00:21:59,351 --> 00:22:01,591
Speaker 1: How good is that? Though, come to Darwin and we

412
00:22:01,631 --> 00:22:04,191
Speaker 1: had them all done at the same time. Literally, that's

413
00:22:04,231 --> 00:22:05,071
Speaker 1: next year I'm coming.

414
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Speaker 3: You've got to come to Darwin from like the about

415
00:22:07,591 --> 00:22:10,911
Speaker 3: the twentieth of July until about the twelfth of August, because.

416
00:22:10,831 --> 00:22:14,351
Speaker 1: When put that date in your diary, all right, twentieth

417
00:22:14,351 --> 00:22:16,111
Speaker 1: of July to twelfth of boo, because that's when we

418
00:22:16,111 --> 00:22:16,391
Speaker 1: need to.

419
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Speaker 2: Be in Darwin's when you need to be in Darwin.

420
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Speaker 1: We will get so many people on this podcast here.

421
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Speaker 3: Look Emily, she went and put down because I was

422
00:22:25,031 --> 00:22:28,591
Speaker 3: a stylist and addressed her for the event. But Paul

423
00:22:28,671 --> 00:22:31,431
Speaker 3: was coming with us, and she put him down her

424
00:22:31,511 --> 00:22:34,151
Speaker 3: security and we were having a little giggle on the

425
00:22:34,151 --> 00:22:35,951
Speaker 3: way to the event because it was just like they're

426
00:22:35,951 --> 00:22:39,551
Speaker 3: going to be like, why is Paul Kelly Vian Emily security?

427
00:22:42,831 --> 00:22:45,151
Speaker 2: Oh but yeah, he's He's just a.

428
00:22:45,111 --> 00:22:48,071
Speaker 1: Love black humor, right, just black fellows will get things

429
00:22:48,111 --> 00:22:51,471
Speaker 1: like that. I love it, So, Emily, what a matter

430
00:22:51,631 --> 00:22:54,191
Speaker 1: is coming on this podcast. We're going to do virtues.

431
00:22:54,311 --> 00:22:56,911
Speaker 1: Can't get to the same place. She's here Friday, I

432
00:22:57,031 --> 00:22:59,871
Speaker 1: leave Wednesday. We're both in Melbourne and we're missing each other.

433
00:23:00,591 --> 00:23:03,591
Speaker 1: So sister girl, we've been trying to get this yard happening.

434
00:23:03,751 --> 00:23:05,791
Speaker 2: My daughter asks going to happen? She call me mom.

435
00:23:05,871 --> 00:23:06,671
Speaker 1: I love this one.

436
00:23:06,831 --> 00:23:11,431
Speaker 3: I love itally my big daughter and a small mummy culturally,

437
00:23:11,511 --> 00:23:13,591
Speaker 3: you know, and I love that about our mob too.

438
00:23:13,671 --> 00:23:17,351
Speaker 3: You know how we might live in a modern context,

439
00:23:17,391 --> 00:23:20,671
Speaker 3: but we still operate on our kinship terms of reference

440
00:23:20,831 --> 00:23:25,111
Speaker 3: and you know, dry and keep that as strong as

441
00:23:25,111 --> 00:23:28,151
Speaker 3: possible and that respect and that good way too.

442
00:23:29,071 --> 00:23:34,151
Speaker 1: Oh my god, Marla, just from I can't stop thinking

443
00:23:34,151 --> 00:23:36,311
Speaker 1: of how far you've come. And you probably still think

444
00:23:36,391 --> 00:23:38,911
Speaker 1: every day when you when you're that yan with your

445
00:23:38,991 --> 00:23:43,351
Speaker 1: mom and you kind of you know, the pressure of

446
00:23:43,391 --> 00:23:47,831
Speaker 1: being in business, the pressure just trying to keep your

447
00:23:47,831 --> 00:23:53,311
Speaker 1: head above the water in this pretty tumultuous world. This

448
00:23:53,311 --> 00:23:55,871
Speaker 1: this this world that we're living in right now. There's

449
00:23:55,911 --> 00:24:00,351
Speaker 1: so much uncertainty, so there's even more pressure of being

450
00:24:00,391 --> 00:24:04,231
Speaker 1: a being self employed, Like I can't imagine doing everything

451
00:24:04,351 --> 00:24:08,511
Speaker 1: right now in this kind of the world we're living

452
00:24:08,511 --> 00:24:10,751
Speaker 1: in now is very different to ten years ago. It's

453
00:24:10,791 --> 00:24:15,111
Speaker 1: very different from a year ago. And I just hope that,

454
00:24:16,591 --> 00:24:19,631
Speaker 1: you know, with our old people guiding us. And my

455
00:24:19,711 --> 00:24:24,351
Speaker 1: husband Piece always says us, I've doubted myself at least

456
00:24:25,791 --> 00:24:28,671
Speaker 1: maybe once or twice a week. I'll work on something

457
00:24:29,311 --> 00:24:32,151
Speaker 1: and say I can't do it. Why have I committed?

458
00:24:32,831 --> 00:24:35,631
Speaker 1: And Peace always say to me, they're old people. They're

459
00:24:35,671 --> 00:24:38,391
Speaker 1: not going to let you fail. Don't give up, keep going,

460
00:24:38,471 --> 00:24:42,431
Speaker 1: keep pushing yourself. This is how far you've come, you know.

461
00:24:42,511 --> 00:24:45,831
Speaker 1: And I've got to keep trusting in my old people.

462
00:24:45,951 --> 00:24:49,071
Speaker 1: And annie La always said that too, she said, she's

463
00:24:49,111 --> 00:24:51,671
Speaker 1: our old people are deadly. Look look how far we've come.

464
00:24:52,191 --> 00:24:55,871
Speaker 1: We thank them all the time for our achievements, our success,

465
00:24:56,351 --> 00:24:59,351
Speaker 1: the fact that we've got this energy still, we've still

466
00:24:59,351 --> 00:25:00,551
Speaker 1: got that fire in our belly.

467
00:25:01,231 --> 00:25:01,871
Speaker 2: And that's them.

468
00:25:03,151 --> 00:25:06,231
Speaker 3: They showed us, they taught us, they paved that way

469
00:25:06,271 --> 00:25:11,271
Speaker 3: for us, and without them, we wouldn't be here. And

470
00:25:10,991 --> 00:25:11,871
Speaker 3: and that.

471
00:25:11,951 --> 00:25:12,431
Speaker 2: Is a given.

472
00:25:12,511 --> 00:25:15,751
Speaker 3: But I also have to acknowledge on this podcast right now,

473
00:25:16,951 --> 00:25:19,431
Speaker 3: you and your sisters and everything that use have done

474
00:25:19,471 --> 00:25:22,111
Speaker 3: for me in my life, I would not be who

475
00:25:22,111 --> 00:25:22,831
Speaker 3: I am.

476
00:25:23,191 --> 00:25:24,311
Speaker 2: I would not be where I.

477
00:25:24,271 --> 00:25:27,231
Speaker 3: Am if it wasn't for all of you or every

478
00:25:27,231 --> 00:25:29,191
Speaker 3: single one of you have all picked me up.

479
00:25:29,231 --> 00:25:31,511
Speaker 1: That's all nine of us, and all.

480
00:25:31,431 --> 00:25:33,951
Speaker 2: Nine of you in different ways.

481
00:25:34,031 --> 00:25:35,951
Speaker 1: We've all got this different relationship with you.

482
00:25:36,031 --> 00:25:40,071
Speaker 3: Yeah, and you know, like we were bonded as children.

483
00:25:40,151 --> 00:25:43,271
Speaker 2: We went you know, we danced together, we cried together,

484
00:25:43,311 --> 00:25:45,511
Speaker 2: we played together, we fought together.

485
00:25:46,951 --> 00:25:49,711
Speaker 1: Not over man over man, no way.

486
00:25:51,151 --> 00:25:54,591
Speaker 3: But you know, like our mum has raised us right, definitely,

487
00:25:54,911 --> 00:25:59,351
Speaker 3: And you know, but I I feel the matriarchy, the

488
00:25:59,431 --> 00:26:04,711
Speaker 3: sister the tittle, that's what mum read is about. It's

489
00:26:04,751 --> 00:26:08,591
Speaker 3: about celebrating us as women, the way we look after

490
00:26:08,671 --> 00:26:11,311
Speaker 3: each other, the way we hold each other, the way

491
00:26:11,351 --> 00:26:16,751
Speaker 3: we hold out each other's babies. It's a reclamation of

492
00:26:16,791 --> 00:26:21,311
Speaker 3: our sovereignty, not just as black people on our land,

493
00:26:21,791 --> 00:26:26,311
Speaker 3: but as women. It's a reclamation of our sovereignty over

494
00:26:26,351 --> 00:26:30,911
Speaker 3: our self, over our bodies, over our autonomy, our self determination,

495
00:26:31,311 --> 00:26:34,031
Speaker 3: because as women we are the backbones of our communities.

496
00:26:34,431 --> 00:26:38,711
Speaker 3: That's been proven testament to me, just in my journey,

497
00:26:38,831 --> 00:26:41,271
Speaker 3: just in my life, just through watching my sister girls

498
00:26:41,671 --> 00:26:42,231
Speaker 3: watching you.

499
00:26:42,431 --> 00:26:44,431
Speaker 2: Says you are one of my biggest inspirations.

500
00:26:44,791 --> 00:26:49,031
Speaker 3: I watched you go from strength to strength and overcome

501
00:26:49,071 --> 00:26:54,271
Speaker 3: absolutely everything that has been thrown away, and I can

502
00:26:54,351 --> 00:26:57,791
Speaker 3: only hope but I can navigate myself through this newly

503
00:26:57,831 --> 00:27:01,551
Speaker 3: found self employed business world.

504
00:27:01,311 --> 00:27:04,591
Speaker 1: Well you got, this is so got. You love you,

505
00:27:05,151 --> 00:27:07,351
Speaker 1: and we've got to just keep on support and any

506
00:27:08,071 --> 00:27:11,111
Speaker 1: any of the younger generation, even older generation that are

507
00:27:11,151 --> 00:27:14,631
Speaker 1: just gonna give this a go. It's the most scariest

508
00:27:14,671 --> 00:27:17,831
Speaker 1: thing to just not have that security, not have that

509
00:27:17,911 --> 00:27:21,711
Speaker 1: pay check coming every week, No super no leave, no

510
00:27:21,751 --> 00:27:24,951
Speaker 1: sick there's nothing there. Right until you get to a

511
00:27:24,951 --> 00:27:28,031
Speaker 1: point where you can now start paying yourself. Then you

512
00:27:28,151 --> 00:27:30,271
Speaker 1: kind of got to go, all right, I've made it,

513
00:27:30,351 --> 00:27:33,191
Speaker 1: but that's just paying yourself. Then you need that support

514
00:27:33,231 --> 00:27:33,711
Speaker 1: as you grow.

515
00:27:34,271 --> 00:27:36,631
Speaker 3: And then there's the industry that you're into, So like

516
00:27:36,791 --> 00:27:40,311
Speaker 3: stepping out of native title, being in that fighting for

517
00:27:40,391 --> 00:27:47,711
Speaker 3: country cultural preservation, you know, environmental protection, the resource industry, government,

518
00:27:47,911 --> 00:27:50,231
Speaker 3: bloody transport, main roads, all the rest of it, and

519
00:27:50,231 --> 00:27:55,231
Speaker 3: then stepping into the fashion industry. It seems quite frivolous

520
00:27:55,791 --> 00:28:01,071
Speaker 3: and almost like a luxury, especially with what we're facing.

521
00:28:01,151 --> 00:28:03,911
Speaker 3: But I felt last year that's so many of our

522
00:28:03,951 --> 00:28:08,591
Speaker 3: mob's voices was silence within the referendum debate that this

523
00:28:08,791 --> 00:28:12,751
Speaker 3: is actually, yes, it's an expense. It's a rich man's

524
00:28:12,791 --> 00:28:15,471
Speaker 3: game getting into fashion. It doesn't pay well being a

525
00:28:15,511 --> 00:28:18,711
Speaker 3: designer until you get picked up by a big you know,

526
00:28:18,871 --> 00:28:21,671
Speaker 3: until you get a collaboration or something. And for me,

527
00:28:22,551 --> 00:28:24,871
Speaker 3: it's about the ethics of the brand as well, Like

528
00:28:24,911 --> 00:28:26,671
Speaker 3: I'm not going to collaborate with someone if they've got

529
00:28:26,751 --> 00:28:29,711
Speaker 3: children in a sweatshop making their clothes, like that's just

530
00:28:29,871 --> 00:28:33,991
Speaker 3: doesn't fit with my worldview and where I want the

531
00:28:33,991 --> 00:28:38,111
Speaker 3: world to go either. So it's about standing strong in

532
00:28:38,151 --> 00:28:43,751
Speaker 3: your principles and knowing that you're getting a message out

533
00:28:43,751 --> 00:28:45,791
Speaker 3: there on that platform, and if you can get that

534
00:28:45,831 --> 00:28:49,631
Speaker 3: message out, get that representation, then maybe we'll be able

535
00:28:49,671 --> 00:28:55,231
Speaker 3: to and pause myself here, if we can convince one

536
00:28:55,831 --> 00:28:59,711
Speaker 3: non indigenous person, get them to see what it's like

537
00:28:59,751 --> 00:29:01,751
Speaker 3: for us, well then they can go and convince ten

538
00:29:01,791 --> 00:29:04,631
Speaker 3: more people a lot easier, and we can.

539
00:29:04,791 --> 00:29:08,751
Speaker 1: That's exactly it. So we need to kind of to

540
00:29:08,831 --> 00:29:14,551
Speaker 1: some degree, we're investing in our allies that one person

541
00:29:14,631 --> 00:29:18,631
Speaker 1: is usually the one who's already connected supporting us being

542
00:29:18,671 --> 00:29:23,071
Speaker 1: around that can go and tell ten friends to their family.

543
00:29:23,231 --> 00:29:24,951
Speaker 3: Because at the end of the day, and I know

544
00:29:25,071 --> 00:29:27,791
Speaker 3: this is gonna oh, this is what I've just found,

545
00:29:27,831 --> 00:29:30,351
Speaker 3: you know, like we can.

546
00:29:30,911 --> 00:29:32,511
Speaker 2: It takes so much energy.

547
00:29:32,231 --> 00:29:34,231
Speaker 3: For us to bring an ally over to our side

548
00:29:34,231 --> 00:29:37,711
Speaker 3: of the fence, because it's emotionally taxing for us.

549
00:29:37,311 --> 00:29:40,551
Speaker 2: It's it's literally the world we live in, and.

550
00:29:40,471 --> 00:29:42,231
Speaker 3: We're just trying to pull back the curtain so that

551
00:29:42,311 --> 00:29:44,511
Speaker 3: they can see it and get a glimpse of it.

552
00:29:47,351 --> 00:29:50,511
Speaker 3: For them to go and introdroduce people and explain to

553
00:29:50,591 --> 00:29:52,511
Speaker 3: them what we go through and.

554
00:29:52,791 --> 00:29:53,991
Speaker 2: To pull back that curtain.

555
00:29:54,311 --> 00:29:57,591
Speaker 3: It's not as an it's not an emotionally taxing ordeal

556
00:29:57,631 --> 00:29:59,911
Speaker 3: for that and it doesn't hurt their heart and their spirit.

557
00:30:00,391 --> 00:30:02,271
Speaker 3: So if we can do the work with one person.

558
00:30:02,311 --> 00:30:05,071
Speaker 3: It has a domino effect, it ripples out.

559
00:30:05,351 --> 00:30:08,871
Speaker 1: Yeah, we're saving some of that energy for ourselves and

560
00:30:09,431 --> 00:30:10,231
Speaker 1: for what we need to.

561
00:30:10,151 --> 00:30:12,631
Speaker 2: Do, which is what we honestly. Otherwise we just burn

562
00:30:12,711 --> 00:30:13,391
Speaker 2: ourselves out.

563
00:30:13,631 --> 00:30:17,191
Speaker 1: That's so true. Alrighty, I can't wait to get you

564
00:30:17,271 --> 00:30:19,391
Speaker 1: back for part I told you we're going to be

565
00:30:19,471 --> 00:30:22,751
Speaker 1: yearning again. Let's call this part one, Clint, and then

566
00:30:22,791 --> 00:30:27,631
Speaker 1: come back. When we're back in, we'll go dive into

567
00:30:28,791 --> 00:30:32,791
Speaker 1: the achievements, the Vogue magazine, there's all. There's more. I'm

568
00:30:32,831 --> 00:30:35,631
Speaker 1: going to get to a bloody client. I'm going to

569
00:30:35,751 --> 00:30:39,791
Speaker 1: try and hustle in Melbourne peak ale traffic and not

570
00:30:39,831 --> 00:30:42,591
Speaker 1: be late for this client. But my sister, it was

571
00:30:42,631 --> 00:30:47,911
Speaker 1: an absolute pleasure, privilege, honor to have you on this

572
00:30:48,111 --> 00:30:51,431
Speaker 1: couch for my audience. And now know who mum read

573
00:30:51,471 --> 00:30:55,951
Speaker 1: the label is and you better get behind my sister, support,

574
00:30:55,991 --> 00:30:58,991
Speaker 1: reach out, connect, follow. You might see some of this

575
00:30:59,191 --> 00:31:02,831
Speaker 1: merch on mum Red's website, and make sure that you

576
00:31:02,951 --> 00:31:06,751
Speaker 1: take her and me when you start rapping this stuff.

577
00:31:07,151 --> 00:31:10,591
Speaker 1: So I love you, my sister, Keep going, keep doing it,

578
00:31:11,191 --> 00:31:13,751
Speaker 1: don't give up you mob. I always say this. I

579
00:31:13,831 --> 00:31:17,031
Speaker 1: hope you've enjoyed and I know you enjoyed this Deadly Yana.

580
00:31:17,071 --> 00:31:20,151
Speaker 1: Until next time by for an hour. If you'd like

581
00:31:20,271 --> 00:31:23,551
Speaker 1: any more info on today's guest, please visit our show

582
00:31:23,591 --> 00:31:28,271
Speaker 1: notes in the episode description. A big shout out to

583
00:31:28,351 --> 00:31:31,671
Speaker 1: all you Deadly Mob and allies who continue to listen, watch,

584
00:31:31,711 --> 00:31:35,751
Speaker 1: and support our podcast. Your feedback means the world. You

585
00:31:35,791 --> 00:31:38,951
Speaker 1: can rate and review the podcast on Apple and Spotify,

586
00:31:39,191 --> 00:31:42,031
Speaker 1: or even head to our socials and YouTube channel and

587
00:31:42,111 --> 00:31:44,191
Speaker 1: drop us a line. We'd love to hear from you.

588
00:31:44,911 --> 00:31:48,391
Speaker 1: The Black Magic Woman podcast is produced by Clint Curtis