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Speaker 1: Pretty excited to see this bloke in the studio again.

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Speaker 2: Jerry, what good morning are your morning, Katie?

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Speaker 3: How are you really good? Lovely to see you. We

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Speaker 3: miss you, our old mate. We miss not having in

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Speaker 3: here sometimes for the week that was. I love it

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Speaker 3: when you text me though.

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Speaker 2: Ah it's okay.

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Speaker 4: I can actually manage texting, but Facebook, I haven't got all.

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Speaker 4: But I should say I was listening to you on

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Speaker 4: the way in and I was a bit shocked. I

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Speaker 4: know you went to the mad Eyes of High School,

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Speaker 4: but when you said you didn't know where the Sewiz

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Speaker 4: Canal was, I thought, I think we should be writing

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Speaker 4: into the Queensland Department of Education because surely you must

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Speaker 4: go where the Sewis.

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Speaker 3: Canal is Egypt. I do know.

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Speaker 1: I've educated myself clearly. I failed geography, uh.

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Speaker 4: Job, it was my favorite subject. And the sews Canal

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Speaker 4: has been around a while.

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Speaker 3: Well that's right.

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Speaker 4: Otherwise the ships are be coming by South Africa with

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Speaker 4: sales on them still okay, yez.

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Speaker 3: Oh dearing me, isn't it luck for me?

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Speaker 1: You know, when you make a mistake or when you

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Speaker 1: don't know something, everyone in.

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Speaker 3: Darwin then give you.

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Speaker 2: That's right. Pronunciations are a good one.

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Speaker 1: The line. Yeah, I never mind, though I don't take

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Speaker 1: myself too seriously.

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Speaker 3: As you know, Jerry, I'm always happy to be corrected.

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Speaker 1: Well, yeah, I'm not going to say anything.

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Speaker 3: Hey, now you I know obviously you're retired from parliament.

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Speaker 1: But what I love about you is you certainly haven't

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Speaker 1: retired from being a wonderful territory and you've you sent

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Speaker 1: out a press release a little bit earlier in the

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Speaker 1: week on what would have been his ninetieth birthday, the

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Speaker 1: Mensi School of Health, and it's about the on the

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Speaker 1: John Hargrave. Well, basically, they're pleased to announce the launch

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Speaker 1: of a fund to raise money to enable research into

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Speaker 1: the life of Dr John Hargrave AO MBE, with the

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Speaker 1: goal of publishing a biographical anthology of this great man.

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Speaker 3: Tell us a bit more about.

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Speaker 4: This, Well, you're prey your person you were interviewing a

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Speaker 4: little while ago, Linna Taro's doctor lyn Nataje would actually

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Speaker 4: know a little bit about John Hargrave, because Lenn's been

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Speaker 4: around a long time.

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Speaker 2: Dr John Hargrave.

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Speaker 4: I suppose you were someone and for a lot of

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Speaker 4: people would be under the radar because unless they knew

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Speaker 4: about him because they'd bumped into him, or they had

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Speaker 4: a reason for knowing him. He probably not known that well,

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Speaker 4: and so of course that's the reason we're trying to

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Speaker 4: raise money to make people aware of what this great

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Speaker 4: man did. So he came to the territory probably late fifties,

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Speaker 4: and worked with Aboriginal people in central Australia, but also

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Speaker 4: worked in the northern the top end, especially with people

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Speaker 4: with leprosy. And so he basically was groundbreaking because he

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Speaker 4: got away from the idea that people with leprosy should

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Speaker 4: be shunned and should be put in places like Mud Island,

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Speaker 4: which is where the Conaco Phillips is, or then Channel Island,

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Speaker 4: which is near the power station. That's where they were kept.

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Speaker 4: They were there during the war. But he was one

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Speaker 4: when they developed the East arm Leprescesrium, which doesn't exist anymore.

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Speaker 4: It's all industrial now. Show that you can allow those

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Speaker 4: people not to be shunned and put away in a

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Speaker 4: place where not to have contact with others, but to

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Speaker 4: go back to their communities. When I went to Daily

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Speaker 4: River in nineteen seventy, I mean I knew nothing about

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Speaker 4: leprosy except what you read in the Bible, you know,

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Speaker 4: that's about the only thing unclean sort of thing. But

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Speaker 4: when I went there, there were people walking around that

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Speaker 4: obviously had leprosy because they had sandals on, or they

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Speaker 4: had curled up fingers, and that was a sign that

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Speaker 4: had been affected by this disease. And I got reasonably

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Speaker 4: close to it because my future wife and Melda, she's.

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Speaker 2: An Aboriginal lady.

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Speaker 4: Her mum came from down near the mouth of the

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Speaker 4: Daily River and was living at the Daily Remission at

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Speaker 4: the time because she had leprosy, and because that was

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Speaker 4: one reason they were living there, because there was a

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Speaker 4: medical clinic there. So she eventually died from leprosy, but

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Speaker 4: when she was alive, we used to go and visit

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Speaker 4: her because they used to go back into the leproscerium

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Speaker 4: and get treatment and they could come back home. So

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Speaker 4: when she was staying there, we'd go down to what

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Speaker 4: is the road to East arm now, and you have

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Speaker 4: to go through a gate. They're knock on the caretakers

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Speaker 4: door and ask him to open up, and we'll go

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Speaker 4: down and visited her there. And then we got to

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Speaker 4: know a little bit about John Hargrave, so he was

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Speaker 4: the person there that was groundbreaking. He actually trained Aboriginal people,

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Speaker 4: Aboriginal men, and some of them are still alive today

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Speaker 4: on how to do microsurgery on these patients as well

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Speaker 4: as no Aboriginal people. They weren't doctors, they're still around today,

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Speaker 4: and some of the stories I've heard it just absolutely

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Speaker 4: mind boggling that there were people here with very little

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Speaker 4: education and we're able to do microsurgery on people.

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Speaker 3: Unbelievable. And so he trained them really to do that.

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Speaker 4: He did all that, and he took away the stigmatizedation

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Speaker 4: of leprosy in the community, that it wasn't something that

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Speaker 4: you should push people away and lock them away forever,

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Speaker 4: that you should be able to treat it. And of

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Speaker 4: course treatment is now improved out of sight, and I

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Speaker 4: think there may be a very very small amount of leprosies.

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Speaker 4: Other people might be able to say whether that's true

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Speaker 4: or not, but it's basically being wiped out of the

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Speaker 4: Northern territory.

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Speaker 1: And so, Jerry, what you would like to see is,

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Speaker 1: and I think it's not just but others as well,

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Speaker 1: you would like to actually see, you know, a tribute,

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Speaker 1: but obviously the publishing of a biographical anthology of this

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Speaker 1: great man how do we do this.

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Speaker 4: Well, we've asked the Forest Peter Forrest and Sheila Forest

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Speaker 4: is well known to put together a book which would

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Speaker 4: highlight the life of doctor John Hargraves, and they will

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Speaker 4: do research and interview people who knew him because he

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Speaker 4: affected lots of people, not just those involved with leprosy.

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Speaker 4: He was in Team Moor and he helped train te

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Speaker 4: mare Ease people on facial reconstruction surgery, so there were

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Speaker 4: people there with faces that were distorted in that. So

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Speaker 4: he when he retired from doing the leprosy work in

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Speaker 4: the Northern Churchy went to Team or as well, so

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Speaker 4: he taught those people. But he had an effect on

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Speaker 4: other doctors because he was such a great man. He

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Speaker 4: did fight bureaucracy at times. Other times there were people

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Speaker 4: that didn't agree with him and that, but he trained

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Speaker 4: other doctors and some of those doctors are supportive of

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Speaker 4: this as well. We've got a list there who they were.

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Speaker 4: Ted Egan, for instance, knew of me very well. He's

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Speaker 4: going to put a forward to this bibliography, so that's fantastic.

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Speaker 4: But there are a number of other people who are

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Speaker 4: supportive of him. We've got the help of the Menzi

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Speaker 4: School of Health. So they are allowing us to use

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Speaker 4: their web page to raise the money. So people wanted

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Speaker 4: to put money towards this, and I think, look, it

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Speaker 4: really is a great, a great idea that we do

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Speaker 4: tell people about this important, the important work of John.

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Speaker 4: He did die last year, by the way, and it

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Speaker 4: would have been his nineteth birthday today. They can get

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Speaker 4: onto the Menzi School of Health web page. You click

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Speaker 4: on support us and go down carefully to what it

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Speaker 4: says tribute to doctor John Hargrave and you can give

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Speaker 4: twenty five dollars or you can have multiples of twenty

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Speaker 4: five dollars. So well now we just put twenty five

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Speaker 4: if you can put four twenty five. Yeah, so we

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Speaker 4: need a reasonable amount of money to be Yeah, I

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Speaker 4: think that somewhere. My guess is it's probably somewhere between

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Speaker 4: at least thir forty thousand dollars to bring out a

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Speaker 4: good one.

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Speaker 1: And any words, yet Weather Twiggy and his and his

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Speaker 1: wife Sheila are going to get behind this as well.

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Speaker 2: I haven't heard anything.

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Speaker 4: I know that doctor Hargroves didn't work so much in

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Speaker 4: Western Australia.

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Speaker 2: There are other doctors working out there.

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Speaker 4: He was mainly working in the northern Terrify as the

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Speaker 4: top end in Central Australia, and then of course he

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Speaker 4: did move off. As I said to Timor, but he

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Speaker 4: was just a wonderful man because I think people haven't

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Speaker 4: who weren't involved in those sorts of things how much

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Speaker 4: about it. Because he was a humble man as well.

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Speaker 4: He didn't get up and make big statements about what

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Speaker 4: he did. It's just that the people who were affected

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Speaker 4: by him, and so my wife still remembers him coming

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Speaker 4: down to Daily River and checking the family regally to

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Speaker 4: find out if they had leprosy because Mum had it.

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Speaker 1: So I would bet that there's a lot of Territorians

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Speaker 1: that are probably in a similar boat. And you know,

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Speaker 1: I just think it's so incredibly important when you've got

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Speaker 1: you know, people like doctor Hargraves who've done incredible work

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Speaker 1: for terror tos's. You know, you're talking about life changing

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Speaker 1: stuff here. I would love to read more about him.

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Speaker 1: I would love to know more about him, and I

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Speaker 1: think that there'd be a lot of others feeling the same.

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Speaker 1: Where can we go to if we want to maybe

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Speaker 1: make a donation?

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Speaker 4: So, as I said, you go to the MENSI School

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Speaker 4: of Health website. You just click on where it says

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Speaker 4: support us, and then you go down. You follow it

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Speaker 4: down and you'll get to a place there says tribute

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Speaker 4: to doctor John Hargrave and then you can click on

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Speaker 4: that and put your donations in. So that'd be good

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Speaker 4: if we'd love people to donate him. It's a small

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Speaker 4: amount because I think this is this is the life

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Speaker 4: of a doctor that really was a true territorium and

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Speaker 4: a legend, a humble legend, the legend we shout about,

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Speaker 4: but someone who did so much good for people in

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Speaker 4: the Northern Territory and many Aboriginal people will remember him,

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Speaker 4: especially in the communities and people in teamor so.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, a wonderful person.

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Speaker 3: Oh good stuff for Jerry would.

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Speaker 2: Before I finished, Yes, I did you get vaccinated?

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Speaker 3: How did it go?

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Speaker 1: Oh?

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Speaker 2: I hard even knew they did it?

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Speaker 3: Really? Yeah?

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Speaker 2: Yeah. My wife went too.

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Speaker 4: She kept asked me what it was for, because that's

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Speaker 4: part of the part of the problem with dementia, unfortunately.

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Speaker 4: But she was happy to go. And there was lots

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Speaker 4: of rural people. I went to the Hope to do one,

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Speaker 4: lots of people. It was like going back and having

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Speaker 4: a bit of a armed as all the people I

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Speaker 4: hadn't seen for a long time, so it was very nice.

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Speaker 4: And look, I'm one of those who very much supports vaccination.

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Speaker 4: I'm one who had polio, and I know that if

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Speaker 4: the vaccination had been around when I was very young,

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Speaker 4: I would not not have had polio. So I've got

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Speaker 4: an arm that doesn't quite work as well as it should,

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Speaker 4: and I just say to people, look, don't listen to

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Speaker 4: the anti vacks. It is important that we control this disease.

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Speaker 4: And I'm an example of where when it's not controlled,

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Speaker 4: what has happened only mild. But I know that many

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Speaker 4: of my people in my age, and I was in

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Speaker 4: hospital with quite a few of them who had polio,

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Speaker 4: it was a terrible disease, and vaccination changed that. In fact,

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Speaker 4: polio I think is nearly wiped out out due to

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Speaker 4: the help of Rotrie and Bill Gates. I think maybe

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Speaker 4: in one African country left, and if it can get

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Speaker 4: wiped out altogether, so many children will have a much

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Speaker 4: better future.

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Speaker 2: So much important.

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Speaker 1: It's a very powerful message, Jerry, that one. I think

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Speaker 1: you hit the nail on the head there, and what

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Speaker 1: a good example to give.

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Speaker 3: I really appreciate you coming in this morning. I've missed you.

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Speaker 3: We're gonna have to get you in a bit more often. OK,

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Speaker 3: that's Jerry Wood there