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Speaker 1: It's their Happy Families podcast.

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Speaker 2: Go Away.

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Speaker 3: You have done something so extraordinary by deciding that ninety

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Speaker 3: six thousand of you wanted to come and hang out

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Speaker 3: and dance and seeing.

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Speaker 4: Hi. I'm Mikayla and I attended Taylor swift errors tour

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Speaker 4: on Saturday night, so that was Melbourne Knight too, and

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Speaker 4: it was just so much fun and being there with

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Speaker 4: so many other fans. It was just such a fun atmosphere,

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Speaker 4: seance and definitely a night I probably worked.

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Speaker 1: The guest outside. Well. It has been blanket coverage, wall

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Speaker 1: to wall coverage for the last week or so for

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Speaker 1: Taylor Swift. Nobody, nobody can get enough of Taylor. It

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Speaker 1: seems everybody's talking about the concerts. Everyone's talking about the incredible,

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Speaker 1: dynamic woman that she is thirty four years old and

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Speaker 1: seems to be queen of the world right now. Today

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Speaker 1: I'm the Happy Families Podcast a little bit more taite

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Speaker 1: for you. First up, we got to talk to our

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Speaker 1: mum of daughters. She went to the show in Melbourne

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Speaker 1: last week with her girls. We're going to find out

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Speaker 1: how that was for her. And in the second part

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Speaker 1: of the podcast, we're going to talk to an academic

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Speaker 1: from the University of Melbourne doctor Jennifer Beckett, who has

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Speaker 1: been studying the Taylor Swift effect and even hosted a

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Speaker 1: symposium on the Gold Coast last week looking at the

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Speaker 1: impact of Taylor Swift on society. First up, though, Karen

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Speaker 1: Karen is a mum of a couple of girls, a

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Speaker 1: few girls who went along to Melbourne last week and

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Speaker 1: participated in the Taylor Swift concert. How did the girls

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Speaker 1: go at the concert? Was it just meltdown mode?

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Speaker 2: It was absolutely insane. We've got tickets quite late in

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Speaker 2: the year, and so of course to go from Adelaide

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Speaker 2: to Melbourne, and the girls were excited, but I don't

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Speaker 2: think we really appreciated how incredible it was until we

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Speaker 2: arrived in Melbourne.

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Speaker 1: Were the ticket's lousy? Tickets like you got them? Like

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Speaker 1: you said, fairly late.

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Speaker 2: We were lucky enough to get tickets through an acquaintance,

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Speaker 2: so yeah we got Yeah, we had some contacts and

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Speaker 2: we've got some flaw seating which was just amazing, and

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Speaker 2: we weren't too far away from the stage, so yeah,

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Speaker 2: we had really great seats, which is lucky. But I

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Speaker 2: think that it wouldn't matter where he sat. I think

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Speaker 2: that the show is just spectacular.

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Speaker 1: So describe the atmosphere. What's happening when Sabrina Carpenter finishes,

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Speaker 1: the set, changes are made and Taylor Swift comes out.

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Speaker 1: The lights go down and Taylor Swift comes out. What

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Speaker 1: what was that lot?

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Speaker 2: That was pandemonium? Like there is so much screaming and crying.

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Speaker 2: It was just hysteria. These these girls just love her.

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Speaker 2: So the primary audience is female and it wasn't mad

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Speaker 2: at the age. So you've got in front of us

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Speaker 2: the little girls, probably eight or nine. My daughter's twenty eight,

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Speaker 2: twenty three, and twenty and it was just incredible. So

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Speaker 2: my daughter was standing next to another young girls her age.

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Speaker 2: They held hands the whole concert. They sang together, they

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Speaker 2: cried together. This is a girl she'd never ever even met.

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Speaker 2: So yeah, it was just it's like nothing I've ever

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Speaker 2: been till. It's really it was amazing.

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Speaker 1: So, Karen, prior to this concert, were you a Taylor

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Speaker 1: Swift fan? No, but I am now that quick that

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Speaker 1: converted you.

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Speaker 2: She I am so converted. It was just it's the

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Speaker 2: whole city was alive, people dressed up and you know,

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Speaker 2: I've just been saying it the empowerment and for women

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Speaker 2: to just attend event and feel so safe and nurtured.

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Speaker 2: The girls in front of us, as I said, they

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Speaker 2: are only about eight or nine. When mum went off

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Speaker 2: to the bathroom, she just left. The girls say, you know,

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Speaker 2: we had already made contact and had some chatting, and

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Speaker 2: you know, it was just an unspoken you know, we checked,

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Speaker 2: we'll check look after your girls where you're gone. And

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Speaker 2: it was just a feeling of safety and love and

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Speaker 2: oh yeah, it was. It was just amazing. I just

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Speaker 2: can't It's indescribable almost because it didn't matter who you were,

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Speaker 2: whether you were young or old a q are. So

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Speaker 2: many of the dads were dressed up by their daughters.

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Speaker 2: It was just he was amazing. It was absolutely it.

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Speaker 1: Really sounds like it was the ultimate mother daughter experience.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it was, It really was. And in some instance

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Speaker 2: there was a little small families. So the man behind

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Speaker 2: us the girls and got dad to wear a king

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Speaker 2: crown and they dressed mom up as a princess and

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Speaker 2: Dad was dancing and you know, singing to the weather.

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Speaker 2: I think that, Yeah, it really truly was a beautiful,

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Speaker 2: beautiful experience. And I guess what I love the most

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Speaker 2: was having you know, raised three girls. You know, you

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Speaker 2: could just be who you want to be. There was

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Speaker 2: young women almost being like, you know, calisthenics costumes with

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Speaker 2: hard boots and you know, the feathers and the glitter,

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Speaker 2: and whether you're size two or size twenty two, it

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Speaker 2: was just an all in type of feeling. And the

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Speaker 2: friendship bracelets giving out freely and you know, all the

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Speaker 2: exchanging of the words on the friendship bracelets. Young girls

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Speaker 2: obviously sat at home and made with words like love

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Speaker 2: and inspiration and yeah, it was it was amazing.

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Speaker 1: Karen, what was your favorite song at the show.

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Speaker 2: Well, my favorite song is love Story and always has

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Speaker 2: been the Romeo and Juliet, so I think that was

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Speaker 2: the one for me. But of course the girls are all,

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Speaker 2: you know, the young ones, They all know the words

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Speaker 2: to every single song.

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Speaker 1: Was there a particular song where you thought the walls

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Speaker 1: are actually shaking here, like this is this is the

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Speaker 1: moment where it all comes crashing down, It's that big.

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Speaker 2: So I don't know the names of them, so I'm

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Speaker 2: not probably the best one to ask, but probably later

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Speaker 2: on she played some of her new music and the

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Speaker 2: girls were just yeah, they just yeah, they just all

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Speaker 2: were singing and we all we the bracelets which have

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Speaker 2: the lights on them so that the stadium changes color

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Speaker 2: as people are clapping and singing along. So it was just, yeah,

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Speaker 2: it's just amazing.

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Speaker 1: A global pop star who works hard, shows respect and

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Speaker 1: loves her fans, tours with her mum, no drugs, no

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Speaker 1: drinking though swearing, nothing overtly sexual. What's not to love

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Speaker 1: about Taylor Swift? It sounds like you're completely converted, Karen.

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Speaker 2: I am completely converted, and that's what the girls seen her.

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Speaker 2: They see acceptance, they see love, they see hard work,

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Speaker 2: is shoes an amazing role models, and unfortunately there's there's

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Speaker 2: very few.

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Speaker 1: I feel like I have a brand new I haven't

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Speaker 1: even seen the show, but I feel like I have

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Speaker 1: this incredible, brand new crush on this musical artist that

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Speaker 1: my daughters love, and I'm I feel like I'm becoming converted.

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Speaker 1: Just with the water walk.

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Speaker 2: You would be wonderful for you to be able to

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Speaker 2: take you girls, but you know, hens teeth.

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Speaker 1: Thanks for rubbing that in, Karen. I really appreciate that thing.

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Speaker 1: I really appreciate you chatting with us, Karen. Up next,

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Speaker 1: we're going to have a chat with doctor Jennifer Beckett.

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Speaker 1: Jennifer Beckett is an academic who has been studying the

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Speaker 1: Taylor Swift effect from a scholarly perspective and how Taylor

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Speaker 1: Swift is affecting our entire world. We're going to find

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Speaker 1: out about the archaeological evidence Taylor Swift's concerts are going

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Speaker 1: to leave behind, as well as the financial impact of

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Speaker 1: Taite and her tour. Doctor Jennifer Beckett is a lecturer

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Speaker 1: in Media and Communications at the University of Melbourne. Last week,

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Speaker 1: Jennifer well did two things that were very big. First

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Speaker 1: of all, she went and saw Taylor Swift live in

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Speaker 1: concert at the mcg More on that in a second,

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Speaker 1: but Doctor Beckett also convened an academic conference on the

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Speaker 1: impact of Taylor Swift on our society. Doctor Beckett, thank

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Speaker 1: you so much for being this on the podcast. First off,

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Speaker 1: tell me about Taylor Swift on Friday Night and was

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Speaker 1: it Can you be gentle to everyone like me who

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Speaker 1: wished that they could have been there but weren't able

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Speaker 1: to be Was it everything you hope that it would be.

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Speaker 3: It was incredible, It was absolutely amazing. I've been to

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Speaker 3: a lot of gigs in my lifetime, a lot of

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Speaker 3: bucket list gigs, one of the few people to see

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Speaker 3: Evarna live in Australia. But my god, that was amazing.

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Speaker 1: Wow wow hearing you say that. So, I mean, we've

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Speaker 1: had wal to wall coverage of Taylor Swift for the

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Speaker 1: last week or thereabouts now, probably a bit more than that.

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Speaker 1: My daughters were so keen to go. They spent so

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Speaker 1: much time trying to get tickets, couldn't get them. We've

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Speaker 1: looked at all kinds of options, but I wasn't really

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Speaker 1: that disappointed. The amount of money, especially to travel down

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Speaker 1: from Queensland, and the time and the effort and the hassle.

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Speaker 1: And I'm not a huge Tailor Swift fan personally, and

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Speaker 1: I feel like I'm missing out, Like I want these

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Speaker 1: tickets as bad as anything, because everyone's saying it was

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Speaker 1: so good from an academic point of view. And I

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Speaker 1: don't want to lose our listeners by talking academic geeky

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Speaker 1: stuff too much. But what is the research telling us

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Speaker 1: about the Taylor Swift effect? Who is affected by her?

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Speaker 1: And how our other middle aged men fathers of teenage

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Speaker 1: girls also struggling with what's going on right now in

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Speaker 1: the massive fomo around it.

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Speaker 3: I think there's a really interesting question. We had a conference.

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Speaker 3: You know, we'd sixty different disciplines, so in an academic setting,

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Speaker 3: it means like basically everything that you could study at

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Speaker 3: a university was represented at this conference. So we had

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Speaker 3: papers from medicine, we had papers from like public transport

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Speaker 3: and design, and yeah, it was it was incredible. So

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Speaker 3: there's not really any area that she's not touching on

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Speaker 3: at the moment. One of the papers at the conference

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Speaker 3: was an archaeological paper, and it literally talked about how

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Speaker 3: there is going to be like an archaeological layer of

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Speaker 3: the ears.

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Speaker 1: To her, I thought you were going to tell me

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Speaker 1: that there were hieroglyphs predicting and prophecies.

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Speaker 3: That's the ultimate tailor swift easter egg.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, so how is there going to be an archaeological

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Speaker 1: layer of.

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Speaker 3: Tailor car beach left behind?

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Speaker 1: Get out of here.

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Speaker 3: It's going to be like all the friendship bracelets, all

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Speaker 3: the merch that's been left behind, it's all there will

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Speaker 3: be an Like if you go to the coliseum in

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Speaker 3: Rome when they were digging through they were finding like

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Speaker 3: the layers from the gladiator matches of like all the

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Speaker 3: peanut shells and everything, there will be an ears to

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Speaker 3: an archaeological layer. I'm just where she's been.

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Speaker 1: What what does that mean in a practical sense, like

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Speaker 1: what is Tailor Swift doing to our economy? What is

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Speaker 1: Taylor Swift doing to our public transport? For example? Can

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Speaker 1: you can you give a couple of concrete examples.

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Speaker 3: In Melbourne alone, she's brought in over one billion dollars

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Speaker 3: into the state. That's people traveling to the state, accommodation,

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Speaker 3: trans ubers, all of that all over. That is fully

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Speaker 3: one third of what Victoria usually brings in in major

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Speaker 3: events in a year. So it's around three point three

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Speaker 3: billion usually she's accounted for one third and it's only

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Speaker 3: middle of February.

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Speaker 1: So does that mean that if we have another interest

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Speaker 1: rate high gets Taylor's forh No.

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Speaker 3: But she has had massive effects on the economy all

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Speaker 3: over the world. I mean we've had state leaders begging

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Speaker 3: for her to go to their countries to boost the economy.

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Speaker 3: So I think in the US she put something like

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Speaker 3: five point six billion dollars in wow, just in general,

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Speaker 3: and that's really in like money in travel, in accommodation,

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Speaker 3: but also for a lot of like smaller traders in towns,

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Speaker 3: so etsys selling out of beads or friendship bracelets that

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Speaker 3: were being made. We're talking about restaurants being booked out,

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Speaker 3: hotels being booked out, and you know, if she was

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Speaker 3: to wear like a piece of fashion from an Australian

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Speaker 3: small Australian designer, that would sell out. So the effect

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Speaker 3: of Taylor Swift is amazing. And like if you think

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Speaker 3: about the incredible effect that her fans had on the

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Speaker 3: NFL in the US record viewership, particularly a young among

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Speaker 3: young women, so much so that the NFL is like

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Speaker 3: completely leant into the Taylor Swift effect, particularly the Kansas

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Speaker 3: City Chiefs, like most of their players were introduced when

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Speaker 3: they went when they were going into the Super Bowl

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Speaker 3: using Taylor Swift albums. So I think it's just one

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Speaker 3: of the Yeah, So it's one of these things where

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Speaker 3: she's just touching on so many pies. She's like right

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Speaker 3: at the height of the cultural zeitguise at the moment.

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Speaker 3: I mean you could ask another question, which is like,

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Speaker 3: are we going to get sick of Taylor Swift?

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Speaker 1: I don't think so, not at the moment. I mean,

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Speaker 1: she's just in this sweet spot, isn't she. Are there

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Speaker 1: any controversies that academics are arguing about when it comes

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Speaker 1: to Taylor Swift.

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Speaker 3: Well some other things that we argue or we argue about,

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Speaker 3: but that we raise our issues around, you know, how

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Speaker 3: she builds that empire. She's a billionaire now and she

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Speaker 3: know she does that off the backs of the amount

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Speaker 3: of money that fans will spend. You know, she's an

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Speaker 3: incredibly talented artist, but you know, you have to kind

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Speaker 3: of think about what's being spent here and how she

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Speaker 3: builds that relationship with fans to make it so that

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Speaker 3: they feel like if they don't get that variant of

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Speaker 3: an album, they've missed out. The other things that people

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Speaker 3: are talking about were like, well what about climate emissions

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Speaker 3: and she's flying everywhere in her private jet and also

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Speaker 3: just thinking about things like, well, you know, sometimes her

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Speaker 3: fans behave very badly online because they're defending Taylor to

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Speaker 3: her detractors, whether or not she's asked them to. But

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Speaker 3: does she she's built such strong relationship with them over

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Speaker 3: time and done it on purpose, does she have a

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Speaker 3: responsibility to call them out and tell them this is

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Speaker 3: not how fans behave.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, Taylor Swift for president of not just the United States,

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Speaker 1: maybe the world the way she's going is Taala Swift

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Speaker 1: the biggest pop star that the planet's ever seen. I

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Speaker 1: know that you're not a music historian, but when I

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Speaker 1: compare what she's doing now to the Beatles and Elvis

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Speaker 1: and the Rolling Stones and Madonna and Michael Jackson, they've

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Speaker 1: held all those kinds of king of pop, Prince of pop,

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Speaker 1: Queen of pop kind of titles. Where does she compare.

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Speaker 3: I don't think that you can compare her to any

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Speaker 3: of them. I think probably the closest she would get

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Speaker 3: is Beyonce. Right, But I think the difference between Taylor

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Speaker 3: Swift and all of those other stars, and I think

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Speaker 3: even Beyonce considering when she started in the sort of

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Speaker 3: pop scene back with Destiny's Child, right, we didn't have

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Speaker 3: social media, and Taylor Swift kind of starts as social

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Speaker 3: media is kicking off like she started. She's there in

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Speaker 3: my Space talking to fans right from the very beginning,

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Speaker 3: and she's rolled through all the social media platforms. She

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Speaker 3: joined TikTok last year and that was a huge moment.

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Speaker 3: They call it the tailor spike on TikTok, where Taylor

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Speaker 3: Swift joined TikTok and it just got shoots through the

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Speaker 3: roof with all of her fans. So I think because

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Speaker 3: of social media, she's become bigger than any of them.

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Speaker 3: And I would I sometimes would think like what would

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Speaker 3: have happened to the Beatles if social media had been

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Speaker 3: around at the time. It's not that fan clubs didn't exist,

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Speaker 3: it's that you had to do that with a pen

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Speaker 3: and paper, and now you can do it online.

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Speaker 1: One last question, is there a dark side to the

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Speaker 1: fandom and the adoration and the elevation of this pop

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Speaker 1: icon for our children and maybe even for our broader society.

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Speaker 3: Well, I mean, I think if you're going to idolize anybody,

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Speaker 3: she's not a bad person to idolize. She's generally a

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Speaker 3: very good person. She has you know, she genuinely seems

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Speaker 3: to care about the world and her fans as well.

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Speaker 3: But I guess the direk side is with anything if

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Speaker 3: you engage uncritically. So if you just skort of, like

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Speaker 3: blindly love Taylor Swift and you don't question anything that

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Speaker 3: she does and you just consume, consumed, consume, that's a problem.

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Speaker 3: So it really is. I think if you're a parent

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Speaker 3: of a child, or if you are a swifty you

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Speaker 3: need to kind of sometimes take a step back and

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Speaker 3: think maybe, oh maybe maybe that wasn't the greatest thing

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Speaker 3: that she did, without getting like overly obsessive about it.

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Speaker 3: And I think the other thing to be wary of

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Speaker 3: is just, you know, don't go overboard when you're like

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Speaker 3: defending your pop star. Like we don't want people to

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Speaker 3: be running into that realm of like trolling other people

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Speaker 3: because they're not the kind of fan that you are,

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Speaker 3: or trolling her exes because you think that they've done

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Speaker 3: her wrong, and say be death threats to people like

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Speaker 3: that is a dark side of that fandom. It's the

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Speaker 3: dark side of a lot of fandoms these days. But

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Speaker 3: I think just be that's the area that you know,

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Speaker 3: I'm probably most concerned about.

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Speaker 1: She is the number one news topic, the number one

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Speaker 1: topic across Australia and probably even around the world at

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Speaker 1: the moment, a couple more shows in Sydney before the weekend.

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Speaker 1: And she is I mean, she is only human, but

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Speaker 1: she's a pretty great role model, as you said, for

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Speaker 1: young girls. Positive force for good doesn't carry on like

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Speaker 1: so many of the other superstars that we've seen over

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Speaker 1: the years and over the decades. I think she's a

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Speaker 1: pretty great role model right now, and I'm stoked that

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Speaker 1: my girls love her. Doctor Jennifer Beckett, such a delight

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Speaker 1: to talk with you. Thanks for sharing the academic side

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Speaker 1: of what's going on with the Taylor Swift effect around

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Speaker 1: the country.

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Speaker 3: Thanks for having me.

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Speaker 1: Doctor Jennifer Beckett is a lecturer in Media and Communications

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Speaker 1: at the University of Melbourne and convened the very first

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Speaker 1: Australian Taylor Swift Academic Conference over the last couple of weeks.

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Speaker 1: Really hope that if you're struggling like me, I mean,

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Speaker 1: like my daughters for having missed out on Taylor Swift,

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Speaker 1: that the things that we're bringing you are helpful and

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Speaker 1: inspiring and exciting and just giving you a sense of

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Speaker 1: how big this thing really. The Happy Family's podcast is

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Speaker 1: produced by Justin Roland from Bridge Media. Craig Bruce is

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Speaker 1: our executive producer. More information is available about making your

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Speaker 1: family happier at the Taylor Swift's TikTok side apparently or

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Speaker 1: at Happy families dot com dot au.