1 00:00:00,040 --> 00:00:02,640 Speaker 1: Now we just spoke, of course, to James O'Brien, the 2 00:00:02,680 --> 00:00:07,400 Speaker 1: acting Deputy Commissioner, about this news stream of police the public. 3 00:00:07,480 --> 00:00:11,160 Speaker 1: The police public safety officers now joining us in the studio. 4 00:00:11,240 --> 00:00:15,720 Speaker 1: He's the president of the Northern Territory Police Association, Nathan Finn. 5 00:00:15,800 --> 00:00:17,640 Speaker 1: Good morning, Finny, Good morning, Katy. 6 00:00:17,440 --> 00:00:19,640 Speaker 2: And good morning for listens. And you've already promoted that 7 00:00:19,720 --> 00:00:22,360 Speaker 2: the previous assistant commissary he's not the Deputy commission of 8 00:00:22,360 --> 00:00:26,600 Speaker 2: But that's right. I'm sure he wasn't going to correct you. 9 00:00:25,760 --> 00:00:28,920 Speaker 1: I always like to give people a bit of a promotion. 10 00:00:29,000 --> 00:00:30,400 Speaker 1: What should I make yours today? 11 00:00:32,280 --> 00:00:37,760 Speaker 2: Happy with anything? At the moment? 12 00:00:39,120 --> 00:00:41,440 Speaker 1: You love your job? You love your job, Finny. 13 00:00:41,520 --> 00:00:46,199 Speaker 2: We're busy, are very passionate about what we do. Absolutely, 14 00:00:46,720 --> 00:00:49,199 Speaker 2: my team are very proud to represent our members and 15 00:00:49,200 --> 00:00:51,400 Speaker 2: making sure that they're supporting everything. 16 00:00:51,600 --> 00:00:54,920 Speaker 1: Absolutely. I know that you are always busy. Now, tell 17 00:00:55,000 --> 00:00:58,160 Speaker 1: me was the union consulted about these plans for the 18 00:00:58,160 --> 00:00:59,720 Speaker 1: police public safety officers? 19 00:01:00,160 --> 00:01:03,480 Speaker 2: When you say consulted, when you say spoken to. There's 20 00:01:03,520 --> 00:01:06,479 Speaker 2: been a couple of conversations, Katie. That's it. There's clearly 21 00:01:06,480 --> 00:01:09,880 Speaker 2: been no concept of what's actually being put forward. We 22 00:01:09,959 --> 00:01:14,039 Speaker 2: get frustrated when we hear announcements and being announcements being made, 23 00:01:14,360 --> 00:01:16,480 Speaker 2: when we're spoken to on the phone and go, this 24 00:01:16,560 --> 00:01:18,320 Speaker 2: is what's coming, this is what's going to be announced, 25 00:01:18,360 --> 00:01:20,480 Speaker 2: so we better brief you on what's going on. So 26 00:01:20,520 --> 00:01:23,640 Speaker 2: there's been verbal discussions, Catie, we haven't seen anything in writing. 27 00:01:24,160 --> 00:01:26,600 Speaker 2: This is something that's it's not new, it's a new 28 00:01:26,640 --> 00:01:29,760 Speaker 2: concept of policing and most of our jurisdictions interstate have 29 00:01:29,880 --> 00:01:32,679 Speaker 2: these types of models that operate through the transit systems 30 00:01:32,720 --> 00:01:35,040 Speaker 2: as well. There's a lot of questions that need to 31 00:01:35,080 --> 00:01:38,160 Speaker 2: be answered and whether that can be supported or not supported, 32 00:01:38,959 --> 00:01:41,240 Speaker 2: it's going to be in the detail, Coatie, and we 33 00:01:41,240 --> 00:01:42,880 Speaker 2: don't have that detail at the moment. There's a lot 34 00:01:42,880 --> 00:01:46,160 Speaker 2: of things to work through and until we get that detail, 35 00:01:46,160 --> 00:01:48,320 Speaker 2: it's hard to obviously have those discussions. 36 00:01:48,720 --> 00:01:51,160 Speaker 1: I mean, we did just speak to James O'Brien. He 37 00:01:51,240 --> 00:01:54,400 Speaker 1: said that they're going to operate similarly to what the 38 00:01:54,880 --> 00:01:58,560 Speaker 1: Palis do. Surely it's a good thing to have more 39 00:01:58,600 --> 00:02:01,080 Speaker 1: of them and more people are the front line, you know, 40 00:02:01,280 --> 00:02:02,160 Speaker 1: able to help out. 41 00:02:02,360 --> 00:02:05,200 Speaker 2: I wouldn't describe the Pali situation as a positive for 42 00:02:05,200 --> 00:02:08,000 Speaker 2: the Northern Territory Police Force, Katie. We've seen the PALI 43 00:02:08,040 --> 00:02:10,200 Speaker 2: positions there. We're currently got seven out of the seventy 44 00:02:10,200 --> 00:02:12,720 Speaker 2: one that operate, so our constalls are being forced to 45 00:02:12,720 --> 00:02:16,040 Speaker 2: do this role. And we see this potentially going down 46 00:02:16,080 --> 00:02:19,560 Speaker 2: the same track, Katie. What happens when these ppsos aren't 47 00:02:19,560 --> 00:02:22,160 Speaker 2: on duty? Is it expected expectation of a constable to 48 00:02:22,160 --> 00:02:24,600 Speaker 2: fill that role? Is it going to be placed back 49 00:02:24,600 --> 00:02:28,280 Speaker 2: onto police to actually manage that we've seen in the paper, 50 00:02:28,280 --> 00:02:30,000 Speaker 2: we've seen in the media going through that this fifty 51 00:02:30,000 --> 00:02:32,440 Speaker 2: six positions been identified, that funding is going to come 52 00:02:32,480 --> 00:02:35,200 Speaker 2: across the police is what I'm understanding at the moment. Again, 53 00:02:35,360 --> 00:02:38,160 Speaker 2: who knows that these fifty six police fifty six officers 54 00:02:38,160 --> 00:02:40,200 Speaker 2: at the moment are going to be suitable to transition 55 00:02:40,280 --> 00:02:42,040 Speaker 2: into the Police Public Safety Office. 56 00:02:42,080 --> 00:02:44,600 Speaker 1: Well, we'd spoken to their CPSU yesterday. They'd sort of 57 00:02:44,680 --> 00:02:46,800 Speaker 1: raised a concern that some of them may not want 58 00:02:46,840 --> 00:02:49,560 Speaker 1: to either, So that is something that obviously. 59 00:02:49,200 --> 00:02:51,799 Speaker 2: Is going to have to be And again, if they 60 00:02:51,800 --> 00:02:53,519 Speaker 2: wanted to be police officers, they would apply to be 61 00:02:53,520 --> 00:02:55,360 Speaker 2: police officer and they probably be police officers now if 62 00:02:55,360 --> 00:02:57,600 Speaker 2: they were suitable and wanted to take down that stream. 63 00:02:57,880 --> 00:02:59,959 Speaker 2: So we don't know, But what happens in that same 64 00:03:00,200 --> 00:03:02,919 Speaker 2: in the case of let's go fifty six of these 65 00:03:03,000 --> 00:03:05,959 Speaker 2: people that have been identified the safety officers come across 66 00:03:06,000 --> 00:03:07,519 Speaker 2: and do the training, Who's going to do that role 67 00:03:08,280 --> 00:03:12,399 Speaker 2: while they're transitioning to this new rock. What's the expectation 68 00:03:12,520 --> 00:03:15,360 Speaker 2: is police going to maintain that visibility over the transit 69 00:03:15,360 --> 00:03:18,360 Speaker 2: safety network. Who's going to look after the public housing 70 00:03:18,400 --> 00:03:21,800 Speaker 2: safety officers at the time if they all transition. We 71 00:03:21,840 --> 00:03:24,320 Speaker 2: don't know. Again, until we see the detail about the 72 00:03:24,400 --> 00:03:26,280 Speaker 2: number of people who are suitable, who want to come 73 00:03:26,320 --> 00:03:29,000 Speaker 2: over and discussions to go on with that, we don't 74 00:03:29,040 --> 00:03:31,280 Speaker 2: know if they're going to be our members, Katie, so 75 00:03:31,320 --> 00:03:33,919 Speaker 2: I heard this morning on the radio the police officers 76 00:03:33,919 --> 00:03:36,800 Speaker 2: they're going to be carrying full accruitchments. Again, we don't 77 00:03:36,840 --> 00:03:39,000 Speaker 2: know that. We haven't seen that, we haven't seen what 78 00:03:39,040 --> 00:03:40,960 Speaker 2: the concept is in relation to it. We know our 79 00:03:40,960 --> 00:03:43,400 Speaker 2: palis have firearms at the moment. Again, they've got very 80 00:03:43,400 --> 00:03:45,520 Speaker 2: limited powers where they can carry them firearms and it 81 00:03:45,560 --> 00:03:47,560 Speaker 2: has to be in accordance with their duties. We don't 82 00:03:47,600 --> 00:03:49,600 Speaker 2: know what these duties are for the PPM, So. 83 00:03:49,640 --> 00:03:51,320 Speaker 1: All of this needs to be worked through at this 84 00:03:51,360 --> 00:03:53,440 Speaker 1: point in time. I mean, James did go through some 85 00:03:53,520 --> 00:03:56,600 Speaker 1: of that with us, but it sounds as though it's 86 00:03:56,640 --> 00:03:59,360 Speaker 1: quite a bit of negotiation or discussion that needs to happen. 87 00:03:59,240 --> 00:04:02,880 Speaker 2: At this huge legislative changes to take place, Cady. So again, 88 00:04:02,920 --> 00:04:05,240 Speaker 2: it's frustrating that the government comes out announces this when 89 00:04:05,520 --> 00:04:06,840 Speaker 2: not a lot of the stuff is going to be 90 00:04:06,880 --> 00:04:10,240 Speaker 2: worked out, and there's expectations about when it starts adding 91 00:04:10,240 --> 00:04:13,600 Speaker 2: extra week's works to police to obviously facilitate this, to 92 00:04:13,720 --> 00:04:16,000 Speaker 2: organize this, to go through the legacy changes that need 93 00:04:16,040 --> 00:04:19,159 Speaker 2: to be made, the training at our college that's already 94 00:04:19,279 --> 00:04:23,600 Speaker 2: at capacity. We've seen a huge number of recruits coming through, 95 00:04:23,640 --> 00:04:25,680 Speaker 2: We've got a huge number of training facilities going through, 96 00:04:25,680 --> 00:04:27,560 Speaker 2: but we've got no extra room to so I'm not 97 00:04:27,640 --> 00:04:29,800 Speaker 2: quite sure how this is going to maintain that. 98 00:04:29,960 --> 00:04:32,839 Speaker 1: So, Finny, is that the message that you are receiving 99 00:04:32,880 --> 00:04:34,640 Speaker 1: from your members at the moment. 100 00:04:35,240 --> 00:04:38,919 Speaker 2: They're unsure, Cadie, And again they're quite frustrated that we 101 00:04:38,920 --> 00:04:41,159 Speaker 2: haven't got to a pay deal for the police officers 102 00:04:41,200 --> 00:04:44,360 Speaker 2: and we're announcing a new stream of police officers they're 103 00:04:44,360 --> 00:04:46,479 Speaker 2: going to be placed out in the public. So they're 104 00:04:46,520 --> 00:04:48,760 Speaker 2: quite frustrated about it, and they don't have the detail either. 105 00:04:48,920 --> 00:04:50,680 Speaker 2: And I don't have the detail either. So when they 106 00:04:50,720 --> 00:04:53,080 Speaker 2: ring me and go what's going on this, what's their proposal? 107 00:04:53,279 --> 00:04:56,960 Speaker 2: I can't go, Well, I've been briefed, fully, I've had discussions, Catie. 108 00:04:57,240 --> 00:04:59,920 Speaker 2: We haven't even started the consultation, the management of consultation, 109 00:05:00,160 --> 00:05:02,880 Speaker 2: and they're required to do that under the obviously current 110 00:05:02,920 --> 00:05:05,440 Speaker 2: consent agreement. We need to go through that process, Katie, 111 00:05:05,480 --> 00:05:06,000 Speaker 2: and see what it. 112 00:05:05,920 --> 00:05:09,440 Speaker 1: Looks to play devil's advocate here. I mean, it's surely 113 00:05:09,480 --> 00:05:12,599 Speaker 1: it's a good thing to have some if we're able 114 00:05:12,640 --> 00:05:15,440 Speaker 1: to have some other officers who are able to deal 115 00:05:15,520 --> 00:05:18,159 Speaker 1: with some of that anti social behavior, you know, that 116 00:05:18,279 --> 00:05:20,960 Speaker 1: public drinking, that kind of thing that we see around 117 00:05:20,960 --> 00:05:23,320 Speaker 1: the place all the time. That, to be really blunt 118 00:05:23,360 --> 00:05:26,200 Speaker 1: about it, our Northern Territory police are too bloody busy 119 00:05:26,560 --> 00:05:28,119 Speaker 1: to be dealing Katie. 120 00:05:27,640 --> 00:05:30,320 Speaker 2: And that's the real big issue at the moment. Again, 121 00:05:30,360 --> 00:05:32,159 Speaker 2: I'm not saying I support I'm not saying I don't 122 00:05:32,160 --> 00:05:34,520 Speaker 2: support it. I see the benefits of it as well, 123 00:05:34,560 --> 00:05:35,919 Speaker 2: and I see the negatives of it as well. To 124 00:05:35,960 --> 00:05:38,320 Speaker 2: our current workforce. We don't know what the impacts are 125 00:05:38,320 --> 00:05:41,039 Speaker 2: going to be long term on our current police officers. 126 00:05:41,279 --> 00:05:43,560 Speaker 2: These are people that I don't take care of currently, 127 00:05:43,760 --> 00:05:46,400 Speaker 2: so that the tsos and the faizos, I don't take 128 00:05:46,400 --> 00:05:48,960 Speaker 2: care of them. So industry wise, I haven't got an 129 00:05:48,960 --> 00:05:51,120 Speaker 2: agreement to say that this is a stream that I 130 00:05:51,279 --> 00:05:53,640 Speaker 2: look after, we look after industrially. There's going to have 131 00:05:53,680 --> 00:05:56,560 Speaker 2: to be a new consent agreement negotiated in respect to 132 00:05:56,600 --> 00:05:59,560 Speaker 2: them separately. Outside of this one. Again, there's a lot 133 00:05:59,600 --> 00:06:02,560 Speaker 2: of things, lots to get through. There's a huge load 134 00:06:02,560 --> 00:06:05,120 Speaker 2: of works. So when the government has an announcement about this, 135 00:06:06,279 --> 00:06:08,680 Speaker 2: everyone else is playing trying to play catch up now. 136 00:06:09,080 --> 00:06:11,200 Speaker 2: And the police have reassured me that they're going to 137 00:06:11,240 --> 00:06:13,760 Speaker 2: get a written submission to the Northern Territory Police station 138 00:06:13,839 --> 00:06:16,360 Speaker 2: Ation by the eleventh of July. I look forward to 139 00:06:16,400 --> 00:06:18,160 Speaker 2: reading that, look forward to starting those consoments. 140 00:06:18,240 --> 00:06:20,240 Speaker 1: So at this point in time, it seems like, you 141 00:06:20,279 --> 00:06:22,839 Speaker 1: know that's the biggest issue, is that you actually need 142 00:06:22,920 --> 00:06:23,839 Speaker 1: some further detail. 143 00:06:24,080 --> 00:06:24,960 Speaker 2: Yeah, definitely. 144 00:06:25,040 --> 00:06:28,120 Speaker 1: Yeah. Hey, Finny, where are things at with the payoffer, 145 00:06:28,160 --> 00:06:29,400 Speaker 1: with the pay negotiations? 146 00:06:29,520 --> 00:06:31,840 Speaker 2: Yeah, Katie, thank you for asking. It's one of our 147 00:06:31,920 --> 00:06:33,760 Speaker 2: biggest things going on at the moment, The biggest thing 148 00:06:33,760 --> 00:06:35,680 Speaker 2: for our police officers that that's the number one question 149 00:06:35,680 --> 00:06:37,880 Speaker 2: we're being asked at the moment. We had a further 150 00:06:37,920 --> 00:06:43,120 Speaker 2: meeting with our consult Consultation Committee Consent Agreement Committee on 151 00:06:43,320 --> 00:06:46,000 Speaker 2: Wednesday afternoon. We received a revised offer. Again, we're working 152 00:06:46,040 --> 00:06:48,480 Speaker 2: through that revised offer. Now there's a few things in 153 00:06:48,760 --> 00:06:52,680 Speaker 2: the documentation that we weren't quite happy with in respect 154 00:06:52,680 --> 00:06:55,120 Speaker 2: to that. We're writing officially back to the Commissioner for 155 00:06:55,200 --> 00:06:58,520 Speaker 2: Public Employment in respect to that revised offer, and at 156 00:06:58,520 --> 00:07:01,680 Speaker 2: that point in time, the membershi peopill be revised about 157 00:07:01,720 --> 00:07:03,080 Speaker 2: where we're going to go and what we're going to 158 00:07:03,120 --> 00:07:03,800 Speaker 2: do from here on them. 159 00:07:03,839 --> 00:07:04,520 Speaker 1: Was it a bit better? 160 00:07:05,120 --> 00:07:08,599 Speaker 2: It's it's improving, and our relationship obviously. Then as we 161 00:07:08,680 --> 00:07:12,000 Speaker 2: go through it's it's getting improved to the point where 162 00:07:12,840 --> 00:07:14,440 Speaker 2: I don't believe that the members are going to accept that. 163 00:07:14,520 --> 00:07:16,640 Speaker 2: But again we're going to work through that process. 164 00:07:16,840 --> 00:07:18,239 Speaker 1: And so maybe go to a vice. 165 00:07:18,360 --> 00:07:20,080 Speaker 2: And maybe go to a vote, Katie, and that's that's 166 00:07:20,120 --> 00:07:22,120 Speaker 2: I think it's important to go to a vote and 167 00:07:23,000 --> 00:07:26,160 Speaker 2: it'll be clear either way from our membership, not just 168 00:07:26,200 --> 00:07:28,760 Speaker 2: from the Northern Territory Police Association whether they support it 169 00:07:28,880 --> 00:07:29,080 Speaker 2: or not. 170 00:07:29,240 --> 00:07:31,239 Speaker 1: Okay, So how soon do you reckon that could have happened. 171 00:07:31,800 --> 00:07:34,520 Speaker 2: We're still waiting for some clauses and that to be drafted. 172 00:07:34,600 --> 00:07:36,480 Speaker 2: We spoke to him again on Wednesday afternoon, so that 173 00:07:37,040 --> 00:07:39,800 Speaker 2: I'm advised this morning that they're working through those requests 174 00:07:39,840 --> 00:07:42,080 Speaker 2: that we made and in respect to some of the 175 00:07:42,080 --> 00:07:45,280 Speaker 2: information they put in the documentation. Once we receive that, 176 00:07:45,360 --> 00:07:47,520 Speaker 2: will be in a position to obviously further advise our 177 00:07:47,560 --> 00:07:50,560 Speaker 2: membership and obviously potentially go to a vote if that's 178 00:07:50,560 --> 00:07:53,640 Speaker 2: what the NTPA bought executive board nominate to. 179 00:07:53,760 --> 00:07:55,920 Speaker 1: Yeah, right, Okay, We'll keep a close eye on things. 180 00:07:55,920 --> 00:07:57,760 Speaker 1: Do keep us up to date, Finny, and let us 181 00:07:57,760 --> 00:08:01,600 Speaker 1: know how those things progress on the PBSOS before I 182 00:08:01,720 --> 00:08:04,400 Speaker 1: let you go. Should they be authorized to carry firearms? 183 00:08:05,560 --> 00:08:08,000 Speaker 2: Me and dollar question, Catie. Again, I don't have all 184 00:08:08,080 --> 00:08:10,800 Speaker 2: the information. I can't really make a comment on that, 185 00:08:11,600 --> 00:08:14,040 Speaker 2: depending on how they are trained, the specific of the 186 00:08:14,080 --> 00:08:16,760 Speaker 2: training that they are proposed to receive, I haven't received 187 00:08:16,800 --> 00:08:19,880 Speaker 2: that information. Until I receive that information, it's pretty hard 188 00:08:19,920 --> 00:08:21,680 Speaker 2: to comment on speculation. 189 00:08:21,840 --> 00:08:23,320 Speaker 1: Have they given you a bit of detail about when 190 00:08:23,360 --> 00:08:25,440 Speaker 1: you might be fully briefed on this? Yeah? 191 00:08:25,480 --> 00:08:27,480 Speaker 2: As I said before, Katie, I'm hoping to get a 192 00:08:27,560 --> 00:08:30,000 Speaker 2: written response back from the police Force by the eleventh 193 00:08:30,040 --> 00:08:30,360 Speaker 2: of July. 194 00:08:30,480 --> 00:08:30,960 Speaker 1: Eleventh. 195 00:08:31,480 --> 00:08:34,120 Speaker 2: My understanding is there's been a ministery or brief submitted 196 00:08:34,160 --> 00:08:36,200 Speaker 2: to government at the request of the Government by the 197 00:08:36,240 --> 00:08:39,400 Speaker 2: Northern Territory Police Force. A cabinet submission hasn't been done, 198 00:08:39,840 --> 00:08:41,679 Speaker 2: so we don't know what it actually looks like, where 199 00:08:41,679 --> 00:08:43,680 Speaker 2: the funding's coming from, whether the funding is going to 200 00:08:43,679 --> 00:08:45,960 Speaker 2: be transferred to Northern Churchy Police Force to manage. There's 201 00:08:46,000 --> 00:08:47,920 Speaker 2: a lot of things to work through. So I advised 202 00:08:47,920 --> 00:08:52,000 Speaker 2: that the cabinet submission is due to Government next week 203 00:08:52,040 --> 00:08:54,240 Speaker 2: by the Northern Territory Police Force and at which point 204 00:08:54,280 --> 00:08:58,280 Speaker 2: in time I'm assuming that that information we provide it 205 00:08:58,360 --> 00:09:01,000 Speaker 2: to us to commence the contentation in respect to the 206 00:09:01,000 --> 00:09:02,200 Speaker 2: PPSA program. 207 00:09:02,240 --> 00:09:07,040 Speaker 1: Well. Anti Police Association President Nathan Finn always appreciate your time. 208 00:09:07,160 --> 00:09:09,079 Speaker 1: Thank you very much for chatting with me this morning. 209 00:09:09,200 --> 00:09:12,679 Speaker 2: It's always your pleasure, Katie. And making sure that our 210 00:09:12,760 --> 00:09:14,520 Speaker 2: men and women in blue out there are looking after 211 00:09:14,559 --> 00:09:18,439 Speaker 2: themselves and making sure that yeah, we're making sure we've 212 00:09:18,440 --> 00:09:20,760 Speaker 2: got their back every day every time they go out there, 213 00:09:20,800 --> 00:09:23,199 Speaker 2: and making sure that they're protected both now into the future, 214 00:09:23,280 --> 00:09:24,880 Speaker 2: and that's their role to look after them. 215 00:09:25,000 --> 00:09:27,360 Speaker 1: Good stuff, Finny, thank you, thanks so much for your time. 216 00:09:27,440 --> 00:09:27,840 Speaker 2: Thank you