1 00:00:08,320 --> 00:00:11,520 Speaker 1: Well hallai, I'm back. Yes. 2 00:00:12,160 --> 00:00:15,240 Speaker 2: And if you thought we don't cover every strange, peculiar 3 00:00:15,320 --> 00:00:19,760 Speaker 2: and eccentric wido, oh, you'd be oh so wrong. I've 4 00:00:19,800 --> 00:00:23,319 Speaker 2: been working so hard to uncover the little secrets and 5 00:00:23,480 --> 00:00:26,920 Speaker 2: strange things people are keeping concealed from the world, or 6 00:00:26,960 --> 00:00:31,760 Speaker 2: even concealed from me. So strap in and strap on 7 00:00:31,920 --> 00:00:34,720 Speaker 2: because things might get a little naughty. 8 00:00:35,080 --> 00:00:35,280 Speaker 3: Ah. 9 00:00:35,880 --> 00:00:39,960 Speaker 2: This is concealed with art simone, and I'm art Simone. 10 00:00:40,560 --> 00:00:47,919 Speaker 1: Duh. Let's meet our guests. Roll thata do it. 11 00:00:50,960 --> 00:00:54,240 Speaker 3: Hi. My name is Renee. I have lived in Melbourne 12 00:00:54,240 --> 00:00:56,920 Speaker 3: since nineteen ninety eight, when I immigrated here from the 13 00:00:57,000 --> 00:00:59,720 Speaker 3: US to marry my internet love. I work as a 14 00:00:59,760 --> 00:01:02,640 Speaker 3: bus US this analyst on large scale IT projects and 15 00:01:02,720 --> 00:01:06,400 Speaker 3: business improvement projects. I manage a registered charity I started 16 00:01:06,440 --> 00:01:10,480 Speaker 3: in twenty fifteen and I'm currently building a new consulting business. 17 00:01:10,880 --> 00:01:12,760 Speaker 3: I have one daughter, who came with me from the 18 00:01:12,800 --> 00:01:15,560 Speaker 3: States and whom I'm very proud of. My interests in 19 00:01:15,600 --> 00:01:19,080 Speaker 3: hobbies are wide and varied, ranging from an extensive library 20 00:01:19,240 --> 00:01:22,480 Speaker 3: to a fishing coral marine tank, to visit historical sites 21 00:01:22,480 --> 00:01:26,040 Speaker 3: and traveling. I also like home crafts, make my own curtains, 22 00:01:26,200 --> 00:01:30,080 Speaker 3: put together booknooks and new cross stitch. But I'm concealing 23 00:01:30,120 --> 00:01:35,720 Speaker 3: another part of my life that some may consider quite dangerous. 24 00:01:36,959 --> 00:01:39,000 Speaker 1: How every day? How are you good? 25 00:01:39,240 --> 00:01:40,880 Speaker 2: I loving to meet you. Thanks for coming into the 26 00:01:40,880 --> 00:01:44,399 Speaker 2: studio today. Now we've never met before. Let me describe you, 27 00:01:44,440 --> 00:01:47,160 Speaker 2: all right. We've got a beautiful nights. I'd say business 28 00:01:47,240 --> 00:01:50,000 Speaker 2: chik blazer on and ie broach Ooh. 29 00:01:50,200 --> 00:01:51,160 Speaker 1: That's very fancy that. 30 00:01:51,080 --> 00:01:52,000 Speaker 3: It's my grandmother's. 31 00:01:52,040 --> 00:01:54,640 Speaker 1: Oh. I love that. We've got some pearls, but they're 32 00:01:54,680 --> 00:01:55,920 Speaker 1: like dark. 33 00:01:55,800 --> 00:01:58,480 Speaker 3: Pels, because yeah, dark, that's my thing. 34 00:01:59,240 --> 00:02:02,000 Speaker 2: I'm trying to pick them it so right, beautiful, all right, 35 00:02:02,400 --> 00:02:06,840 Speaker 2: nice tim short hair, spectacular spectacles. Now I have to 36 00:02:06,920 --> 00:02:07,800 Speaker 2: check are they prescription? 37 00:02:08,080 --> 00:02:08,400 Speaker 3: They are? 38 00:02:08,480 --> 00:02:10,000 Speaker 1: Oh good? All right, all right, I'll just check. 39 00:02:10,080 --> 00:02:12,000 Speaker 2: Because sometimes people come in here and they try to 40 00:02:12,000 --> 00:02:14,240 Speaker 2: fool me with the disguise. I don't want that to 41 00:02:14,280 --> 00:02:14,919 Speaker 2: be you today. 42 00:02:15,120 --> 00:02:16,880 Speaker 3: No, I never disguised myself. 43 00:02:16,919 --> 00:02:20,560 Speaker 2: And you are slightly shorter because we have just had 44 00:02:20,560 --> 00:02:21,960 Speaker 2: a bit of a struggle trying to get you up 45 00:02:22,000 --> 00:02:23,160 Speaker 2: onto the studio chair today. 46 00:02:23,520 --> 00:02:24,919 Speaker 1: I don't know if that has anything to do with it. 47 00:02:25,200 --> 00:02:26,800 Speaker 2: You know, I've got to pick it up, all right, 48 00:02:27,320 --> 00:02:28,920 Speaker 2: So a bit of background. So you move to your 49 00:02:29,000 --> 00:02:32,920 Speaker 2: nineteen ninety eight for a lover an internet love I did. 50 00:02:33,120 --> 00:02:36,520 Speaker 1: Oh can you tell me about that chat room? Yes? 51 00:02:37,360 --> 00:02:39,960 Speaker 3: We talked for about eight months. He flew me over here, 52 00:02:40,160 --> 00:02:44,000 Speaker 3: spent two weeks here, got engaged, kicked off the immigration 53 00:02:44,200 --> 00:02:47,360 Speaker 3: visa before I went home, waited five months, it came through, 54 00:02:47,440 --> 00:02:50,400 Speaker 3: and four weeks later my daughter and I were in Australia. 55 00:02:50,480 --> 00:02:53,240 Speaker 1: Oh, my goodness, loved good story. 56 00:02:53,480 --> 00:02:54,760 Speaker 3: Six months later I got married. 57 00:02:54,880 --> 00:02:56,760 Speaker 1: And are you still together? We are? 58 00:02:56,760 --> 00:02:57,560 Speaker 3: Not six years? 59 00:02:57,639 --> 00:02:59,240 Speaker 1: Six and a half years, though, that's pretty good. 60 00:02:59,280 --> 00:02:59,919 Speaker 3: It was a pretty good. 61 00:03:00,040 --> 00:03:02,239 Speaker 1: And you said I'm going to stick around though. 62 00:03:02,200 --> 00:03:06,160 Speaker 3: Oh absolutely, I'm a citizen. I renounced my US citizenship 63 00:03:06,360 --> 00:03:07,519 Speaker 3: in twenty eighteen. 64 00:03:07,960 --> 00:03:08,360 Speaker 1: Wow. 65 00:03:08,440 --> 00:03:10,560 Speaker 3: Yeah, so you're stuck with me. I'm running for prime 66 00:03:10,560 --> 00:03:11,960 Speaker 3: minister years. 67 00:03:13,000 --> 00:03:15,960 Speaker 2: Okay, people, business analysts, Is that what you said? 68 00:03:16,200 --> 00:03:17,600 Speaker 1: Yes? What is that? 69 00:03:18,160 --> 00:03:20,920 Speaker 3: Nobody knows? No, no, not even us. And we we 70 00:03:21,080 --> 00:03:23,679 Speaker 3: just sort to do everything we get on these projects 71 00:03:23,680 --> 00:03:25,440 Speaker 3: and then we tell people what we think they need 72 00:03:25,480 --> 00:03:27,880 Speaker 3: to know and what you do, and we document things 73 00:03:27,919 --> 00:03:29,600 Speaker 3: and we don't actually do a lot of work. 74 00:03:29,720 --> 00:03:31,440 Speaker 1: Well, someone has to do it. I think one has 75 00:03:31,480 --> 00:03:33,560 Speaker 1: to do it. And amazed. I'll be you. You have 76 00:03:33,639 --> 00:03:35,960 Speaker 1: a lot of interests. I do you like to do 77 00:03:36,000 --> 00:03:40,760 Speaker 1: a lot of things? I get bored easy, Yes, the lot. 78 00:03:40,800 --> 00:03:42,800 Speaker 2: I've stopped writing them down because there were so many. 79 00:03:43,000 --> 00:03:44,400 Speaker 2: How do you how do you keep up with all 80 00:03:44,440 --> 00:03:45,080 Speaker 2: of those things? 81 00:03:45,480 --> 00:03:46,240 Speaker 3: I don't always. 82 00:03:48,840 --> 00:03:50,240 Speaker 1: I love that though. I love that. 83 00:03:50,320 --> 00:03:51,960 Speaker 3: I got to retire soon so I can do all 84 00:03:52,000 --> 00:03:53,000 Speaker 3: the things I'm interested in. 85 00:03:53,160 --> 00:03:57,080 Speaker 1: I love that. Okay. 86 00:03:57,080 --> 00:03:59,120 Speaker 2: So now I'm gonna ask you three questions, okay, and 87 00:03:59,120 --> 00:04:01,120 Speaker 2: from the answers to the three questions, plus with the 88 00:04:01,160 --> 00:04:03,040 Speaker 2: bit of the background info, I'm going to try and 89 00:04:03,040 --> 00:04:05,280 Speaker 2: work out what it is that you were concealing from me. 90 00:04:05,840 --> 00:04:06,880 Speaker 1: Okay, here we go. 91 00:04:07,280 --> 00:04:10,400 Speaker 2: Question number one, what would you call your autobiography? 92 00:04:11,000 --> 00:04:13,680 Speaker 3: Well, I actually have one in progress because I also write. 93 00:04:14,120 --> 00:04:18,240 Speaker 3: I couldn't put everything down. I actually have about three 94 00:04:18,240 --> 00:04:22,160 Speaker 3: books in progress, but this one's called going Bold Bold 95 00:04:22,320 --> 00:04:26,760 Speaker 3: or bald Bold. So I had my head shaped for 96 00:04:26,920 --> 00:04:30,359 Speaker 3: charity some years ago and found it to be a 97 00:04:30,560 --> 00:04:33,040 Speaker 3: very difficult thing. It actually was the scariest thing I 98 00:04:33,040 --> 00:04:36,080 Speaker 3: ever did, to be honest, which was sort of surprised me. 99 00:04:36,560 --> 00:04:39,320 Speaker 3: So it was for the Lukemia Foundation. It was a 100 00:04:39,320 --> 00:04:44,000 Speaker 3: business thing and So my book is about taking risks 101 00:04:44,240 --> 00:04:46,479 Speaker 3: and how to really live a full life. You know, 102 00:04:46,520 --> 00:04:47,880 Speaker 3: you need to get out there, you need to take 103 00:04:47,920 --> 00:04:51,160 Speaker 3: some risks. You need to throw yourself sometimes into situations 104 00:04:51,160 --> 00:04:53,520 Speaker 3: that scare you a situations you don't know the outcome 105 00:04:53,800 --> 00:04:55,960 Speaker 3: if you're really going to have an exciting and interesting 106 00:04:56,080 --> 00:04:56,720 Speaker 3: life going. 107 00:04:58,520 --> 00:04:59,880 Speaker 1: So I feel every time I take a week. 108 00:04:59,720 --> 00:05:04,800 Speaker 3: Off, I hated it. 109 00:05:05,960 --> 00:05:10,839 Speaker 2: Okay, Question number two, what's an unusual thing that you 110 00:05:10,920 --> 00:05:11,640 Speaker 2: have in your house? 111 00:05:12,640 --> 00:05:14,760 Speaker 3: Well, I have a lot of unusual things, you can bet. 112 00:05:14,839 --> 00:05:17,760 Speaker 3: But one of my favorites that people don't seem to 113 00:05:17,800 --> 00:05:22,120 Speaker 3: appreciate is a picture that I picked up from the 114 00:05:22,120 --> 00:05:26,680 Speaker 3: Men on Men exhibition at the Laired called Pancake Daddy. 115 00:05:27,360 --> 00:05:31,839 Speaker 3: And is this really big older guy, yes, who's stark naked. 116 00:05:32,000 --> 00:05:34,760 Speaker 3: He's laying on a stack of pancakes. Is that strawberries 117 00:05:34,800 --> 00:05:37,480 Speaker 3: in the background. He's pouring syrup over himself, you know, 118 00:05:37,520 --> 00:05:40,159 Speaker 3: and he's looking out like he's been discovered, and he 119 00:05:40,320 --> 00:05:42,400 Speaker 3: just he looks so happy, but he also looks so like, 120 00:05:42,440 --> 00:05:44,480 Speaker 3: oh my god, people are looking at me kind of thing. 121 00:05:44,680 --> 00:05:46,359 Speaker 3: And my partner and I just absolutely adore it. And 122 00:05:46,360 --> 00:05:48,640 Speaker 3: see my kitchen, So you can't really miss. 123 00:05:48,480 --> 00:05:50,480 Speaker 2: It, but that would make me appetised. Should we eat 124 00:05:50,480 --> 00:05:51,960 Speaker 2: in the kitchen? That would be true. 125 00:05:52,520 --> 00:05:54,320 Speaker 1: I'd walk and be like, oh I'm hungry. I don't 126 00:05:54,360 --> 00:05:55,599 Speaker 1: know why, Okay. 127 00:05:55,920 --> 00:05:59,640 Speaker 2: And the third, where is the strangest place you've fallen 128 00:05:59,680 --> 00:06:00,200 Speaker 2: a slip? 129 00:06:00,839 --> 00:06:01,480 Speaker 1: Well? I did. 130 00:06:01,480 --> 00:06:03,320 Speaker 3: It's the strangest, but it's probably the worst place I 131 00:06:03,320 --> 00:06:05,880 Speaker 3: ever fell asleep. I used to have a beautiful little 132 00:06:05,880 --> 00:06:08,760 Speaker 3: Silver MX five that I was my pride and enjoyed. 133 00:06:09,240 --> 00:06:13,200 Speaker 3: And it's a sports car. It's a convertible. Yeah, it's 134 00:06:13,200 --> 00:06:16,160 Speaker 3: a little convertible that you really should go up there. Great, 135 00:06:16,400 --> 00:06:20,279 Speaker 3: it's a musta musta car. And uh yeah, So I 136 00:06:20,320 --> 00:06:22,480 Speaker 3: used to drive it a lot, like all the time, 137 00:06:22,640 --> 00:06:24,599 Speaker 3: and I used to go to parties a fair amount 138 00:06:24,600 --> 00:06:27,320 Speaker 3: when I was a few years younger. And I guess 139 00:06:27,360 --> 00:06:29,600 Speaker 3: I was getting older because it was one o three 140 00:06:29,600 --> 00:06:32,640 Speaker 3: am coming back from a health fire party and I 141 00:06:32,760 --> 00:06:35,720 Speaker 3: kind of ran into a tree and totaled it as 142 00:06:35,720 --> 00:06:37,840 Speaker 3: I fell asleep away from. 143 00:06:40,080 --> 00:06:43,000 Speaker 1: It. Was a bit of a party girl. Oh what 144 00:06:43,040 --> 00:06:43,880 Speaker 1: can I say? 145 00:06:44,080 --> 00:06:47,760 Speaker 2: Okay, all right, God, I mean, I've got lots of 146 00:06:47,760 --> 00:06:50,120 Speaker 2: things in my head after all of this, but enough 147 00:06:50,320 --> 00:06:53,360 Speaker 2: they come together in a beautiful clear pitcher that can 148 00:06:53,400 --> 00:06:54,279 Speaker 2: hang in your kitchen. 149 00:06:54,600 --> 00:06:57,520 Speaker 1: All right? So nat and audio going bald? Didn't like that? 150 00:06:58,200 --> 00:07:03,279 Speaker 2: Raise money leukemia pancake, Oh, sexy man on pancake, Oh yummy, 151 00:07:03,680 --> 00:07:07,040 Speaker 2: falling asleep. I had a nap in a master beautiful car, 152 00:07:07,120 --> 00:07:09,720 Speaker 2: but on the way back from a hell fire party. 153 00:07:10,160 --> 00:07:13,120 Speaker 2: All right, So there's lots of fun things going out, okay, 154 00:07:13,520 --> 00:07:19,040 Speaker 2: and crosstitch, Oh what is that pained for you? I 155 00:07:19,080 --> 00:07:25,880 Speaker 2: don't know's it's okay? And I are you a dominatrix close? 156 00:07:29,960 --> 00:07:34,000 Speaker 3: I'm a polyamorous, pan sexual, sadistic leather master who also 157 00:07:34,040 --> 00:07:35,760 Speaker 3: lived for a number of years as a full time 158 00:07:35,840 --> 00:07:38,880 Speaker 3: slave in a master slave relationship. I earned my cover 159 00:07:38,960 --> 00:07:44,240 Speaker 3: in twenty nineteen after twenty one years of actively practicing bbsm. 160 00:07:44,080 --> 00:07:48,080 Speaker 1: Oh Man, well done. We have a lot to go in. 161 00:07:48,760 --> 00:07:50,320 Speaker 1: I'm excited about that. 162 00:07:51,480 --> 00:07:53,120 Speaker 2: I'm going to give myself a pattern the back for 163 00:07:53,160 --> 00:07:54,560 Speaker 2: that one, because I don't think I would have got 164 00:07:54,600 --> 00:07:55,800 Speaker 2: that so specific. 165 00:07:59,040 --> 00:08:01,480 Speaker 4: Ah, I'm going to take this one as a win. 166 00:08:01,680 --> 00:08:05,200 Speaker 4: I got a right, yes, oh, Renee. We have so 167 00:08:05,320 --> 00:08:08,080 Speaker 4: much to find out to do a leather master. Ah, 168 00:08:08,360 --> 00:08:09,280 Speaker 4: hydrids leather weather. 169 00:08:09,280 --> 00:08:09,920 Speaker 1: I'll go get. 170 00:08:09,800 --> 00:08:21,840 Speaker 2: Mine all right, So we are here with Renee, who 171 00:08:22,640 --> 00:08:25,000 Speaker 2: I got it pretty close, may not be a dominatrix, 172 00:08:25,040 --> 00:08:29,200 Speaker 2: but is a leather master amongst a whole amount of other. 173 00:08:29,040 --> 00:08:29,800 Speaker 1: Things as well. 174 00:08:30,240 --> 00:08:33,559 Speaker 2: Oh my goodness, let's let's go back to the basics. 175 00:08:33,760 --> 00:08:36,280 Speaker 2: To be a leather master, you have to be part 176 00:08:36,480 --> 00:08:41,160 Speaker 2: of the BDSM community. Can you tell me what BDSM is? 177 00:08:41,840 --> 00:08:44,360 Speaker 3: So. BDSM is an acronym that came out in the 178 00:08:44,480 --> 00:08:49,480 Speaker 3: nineteen nineties to basically expand what was originally S and M, 179 00:08:49,520 --> 00:08:52,320 Speaker 3: which is cetamasochism. But it's a bit more than that, 180 00:08:52,400 --> 00:08:57,400 Speaker 3: so that sounds for bondage discipline cetamasochism, and the DS 181 00:08:57,440 --> 00:09:01,199 Speaker 3: can also stand for dominance and submission, which is power exchange, 182 00:09:01,520 --> 00:09:05,959 Speaker 3: so more the emotional side of things. And it's everything 183 00:09:05,960 --> 00:09:08,120 Speaker 3: from a lifestyle for some people to just a set 184 00:09:08,120 --> 00:09:11,160 Speaker 3: of activities. Some people's just a bedroom thing. Some people 185 00:09:11,200 --> 00:09:13,840 Speaker 3: it extends beyond that. Some people it's sexual, some people 186 00:09:13,880 --> 00:09:17,360 Speaker 3: it's not. So it's actually really deep and complicated and 187 00:09:17,440 --> 00:09:20,120 Speaker 3: has a long history, like eighty to ninety years of 188 00:09:20,200 --> 00:09:22,520 Speaker 3: history actually, which most people don't know. 189 00:09:23,040 --> 00:09:26,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, I guess it's not like simply black and white 190 00:09:26,440 --> 00:09:29,680 Speaker 2: or one set of rules that apply to every single situation. 191 00:09:29,400 --> 00:09:33,200 Speaker 3: Right, No, No, absolutely not. The thing about BDSM is 192 00:09:33,200 --> 00:09:35,400 Speaker 3: that while we can have some general principles that we 193 00:09:35,480 --> 00:09:38,439 Speaker 3: say we apply and we say we apply broadly, it's 194 00:09:38,440 --> 00:09:41,520 Speaker 3: an individual thing. So anyone can actually do anything they want. 195 00:09:41,600 --> 00:09:43,320 Speaker 3: You know, if you spank your partner in the bedroom, 196 00:09:43,320 --> 00:09:45,920 Speaker 3: you're basically doing BDSM, whether anyone knows it or not. 197 00:09:46,280 --> 00:09:47,840 Speaker 3: Or you might be out at clubs, you might be 198 00:09:47,880 --> 00:09:50,920 Speaker 3: out at munches, which are social gatherings, you might be 199 00:09:51,080 --> 00:09:53,720 Speaker 3: running a business off of it. It's so wide and 200 00:09:53,760 --> 00:09:57,200 Speaker 3: so varied and so personal that you can't really, you know, 201 00:09:57,360 --> 00:09:59,040 Speaker 3: put it in a box and say it's just one 202 00:09:59,120 --> 00:10:00,000 Speaker 3: or two different things. 203 00:10:00,800 --> 00:10:02,880 Speaker 1: Now, how did you get involved into this world? 204 00:10:03,840 --> 00:10:04,160 Speaker 3: Well? 205 00:10:04,200 --> 00:10:05,000 Speaker 1: How did it happen? 206 00:10:05,600 --> 00:10:09,640 Speaker 3: By accident? Kind of? I had an internet relationship fall 207 00:10:09,679 --> 00:10:12,840 Speaker 3: apart in nineteen ninety six December in nineteen ninety six, 208 00:10:12,880 --> 00:10:15,160 Speaker 3: I was really upset and a friend of mine on 209 00:10:15,200 --> 00:10:17,680 Speaker 3: the internet. She said, come to these chat rooms with me. 210 00:10:17,800 --> 00:10:19,839 Speaker 3: You know, they'll divert you. So I went. One of 211 00:10:19,840 --> 00:10:22,480 Speaker 3: it was called Torture Chamber and the other one was 212 00:10:22,520 --> 00:10:23,800 Speaker 3: called Submission. 213 00:10:23,440 --> 00:10:25,439 Speaker 1: And you said, oh okay, yeah. 214 00:10:25,480 --> 00:10:27,560 Speaker 3: I went in and she said, oh, oh, we have 215 00:10:27,640 --> 00:10:30,079 Speaker 3: to give you another name, oh, you know, and a 216 00:10:30,120 --> 00:10:32,280 Speaker 3: little bird and I was a little bird for years. 217 00:10:32,720 --> 00:10:35,280 Speaker 3: And I went in there and I said, Hugh, you 218 00:10:35,320 --> 00:10:38,200 Speaker 3: guys are really weird and I'm not like you, which 219 00:10:38,240 --> 00:10:41,319 Speaker 3: is really ironic now because my whole life has been 220 00:10:41,320 --> 00:10:44,280 Speaker 3: around that since. But yeah, it took a little while. 221 00:10:44,559 --> 00:10:46,520 Speaker 3: But they were lovely, lovely people, and they didn't care 222 00:10:46,559 --> 00:10:48,360 Speaker 3: what I thought of them, and they just said, yeah, 223 00:10:48,360 --> 00:10:50,199 Speaker 3: that's okay. You know you want to hang around, go ahead, 224 00:10:50,320 --> 00:10:51,200 Speaker 3: you don't want to hang around. 225 00:10:51,480 --> 00:10:54,800 Speaker 1: Leave So then you started in this chat room world, 226 00:10:54,960 --> 00:10:57,719 Speaker 1: and then how did you kind of branch off to 227 00:10:57,840 --> 00:11:01,000 Speaker 1: then what you do now, you know, or like in person? 228 00:11:01,400 --> 00:11:04,280 Speaker 3: Yeah, it was. And they like to say this because 229 00:11:04,280 --> 00:11:06,440 Speaker 3: a lot of people say, oh, if you're not doing 230 00:11:06,480 --> 00:11:08,480 Speaker 3: things in real life, you know, you're not really doing them, 231 00:11:08,559 --> 00:11:11,280 Speaker 3: especially now there's a lot of things about doing things 232 00:11:11,360 --> 00:11:13,920 Speaker 3: on the internet. But I made a lot of friendships, 233 00:11:14,000 --> 00:11:16,640 Speaker 3: a lot of relationships on the Internet that translated to 234 00:11:16,720 --> 00:11:19,560 Speaker 3: real life at some point. And so I spent about 235 00:11:19,600 --> 00:11:26,040 Speaker 3: five months playing around internet, six phone, six different relationships, 236 00:11:26,840 --> 00:11:30,000 Speaker 3: got some training from a guy in Seattle, and although 237 00:11:30,000 --> 00:11:32,400 Speaker 3: we didn't meet until later, and all kinds of things, 238 00:11:32,440 --> 00:11:35,080 Speaker 3: and after five months, I said, you know, I need 239 00:11:35,080 --> 00:11:38,320 Speaker 3: to see what this is really like. So I was 240 00:11:38,400 --> 00:11:42,600 Speaker 3: involved at that time with a cross dressing dominant in 241 00:11:42,640 --> 00:11:45,199 Speaker 3: New York and I lived in Montana, which is wait 242 00:11:45,280 --> 00:11:47,360 Speaker 3: far away, and he sent me a ticket and I 243 00:11:47,360 --> 00:11:49,920 Speaker 3: went spent a week with him, and after about three 244 00:11:50,000 --> 00:11:52,280 Speaker 3: days he said, nothing has to happen, and that was fine. 245 00:11:52,320 --> 00:11:54,840 Speaker 3: But after about three days something just sparked and we 246 00:11:54,920 --> 00:11:58,120 Speaker 3: got into it and it blew my mind and I 247 00:11:58,320 --> 00:12:00,240 Speaker 3: just never looked back. From there. I said, this is 248 00:12:00,280 --> 00:12:02,559 Speaker 3: my place, this is my people, this is what I needed, 249 00:12:02,559 --> 00:12:04,920 Speaker 3: This what I've been missing in my life. And I 250 00:12:05,000 --> 00:12:07,320 Speaker 3: came home and it was like, no, I have to 251 00:12:07,360 --> 00:12:11,880 Speaker 3: pursue this. So a year later I moved to Australia, 252 00:12:11,960 --> 00:12:15,160 Speaker 3: but I'd already met online the people here in the 253 00:12:15,160 --> 00:12:17,720 Speaker 3: community because they had their own chat rooms here called 254 00:12:17,720 --> 00:12:21,640 Speaker 3: Ospedism doesn't exist anymore. And so when I got here, 255 00:12:21,800 --> 00:12:25,280 Speaker 3: I was vetted by four women for two hours sake 256 00:12:25,480 --> 00:12:27,679 Speaker 3: sat together with me, talked with me, figured out who 257 00:12:27,720 --> 00:12:31,000 Speaker 3: I was, my ideas, my attitudes, what I knew, and 258 00:12:31,040 --> 00:12:33,720 Speaker 3: then they said, okay, you're all right, come to the 259 00:12:33,720 --> 00:12:34,520 Speaker 3: club on this night. 260 00:12:34,960 --> 00:12:36,160 Speaker 1: Wow. Really yeah? 261 00:12:36,200 --> 00:12:38,080 Speaker 3: And I wait. My husband and I at the time, 262 00:12:38,120 --> 00:12:41,440 Speaker 3: we walked down an alley to a roller door. 263 00:12:42,360 --> 00:12:43,040 Speaker 1: Roller door went. 264 00:12:43,040 --> 00:12:45,520 Speaker 5: Up, big guys standing under a ball, you know, like 265 00:12:45,760 --> 00:12:50,959 Speaker 5: who are you? And then and then Belinda came out 266 00:12:51,000 --> 00:12:52,880 Speaker 5: and chained and nothing else and said, oh, they're with 267 00:12:52,960 --> 00:12:55,200 Speaker 5: me and that was our birthday party, and well be 268 00:12:55,240 --> 00:12:57,760 Speaker 5: bopped in and from then on, you know, we were accepted 269 00:12:57,800 --> 00:13:01,040 Speaker 5: into the community and invited to various things. 270 00:13:01,440 --> 00:13:04,840 Speaker 2: So would you say the community is quite protective of 271 00:13:05,240 --> 00:13:07,480 Speaker 2: each other and themselves in terms of who they let 272 00:13:07,520 --> 00:13:10,040 Speaker 2: in to make sure they're the right fit or the 273 00:13:10,120 --> 00:13:12,480 Speaker 2: right vibe or what's that like? 274 00:13:13,040 --> 00:13:15,960 Speaker 3: Well, this is the problem. There was a place called 275 00:13:15,960 --> 00:13:18,280 Speaker 3: fet Life that came in almost ten years ago, I 276 00:13:18,280 --> 00:13:21,400 Speaker 3: guess now, And when we went on there, we thought 277 00:13:21,440 --> 00:13:23,520 Speaker 3: it was great because they had cleared out all the 278 00:13:23,559 --> 00:13:26,480 Speaker 3: chat rooms. The owners had come and stripped out all 279 00:13:26,480 --> 00:13:28,680 Speaker 3: the sex channels and the BDSM channels and we couldn't 280 00:13:28,679 --> 00:13:31,360 Speaker 3: meet there anymore, so we didn't have an online place 281 00:13:31,400 --> 00:13:33,480 Speaker 3: to go to. So we thought this was great, and 282 00:13:33,600 --> 00:13:36,439 Speaker 3: it was for a while, but because it was an 283 00:13:36,480 --> 00:13:40,320 Speaker 3: open forum and they wanted more people on and because 284 00:13:40,320 --> 00:13:43,920 Speaker 3: people started advertising events openly, we got flooded. We got 285 00:13:43,920 --> 00:13:46,600 Speaker 3: flooded and flooded and flooded, and we're still flooded. We 286 00:13:46,600 --> 00:13:49,600 Speaker 3: have thousands of people entering every year. Yeah, and that's 287 00:13:49,720 --> 00:13:51,200 Speaker 3: driven a lot of people underground. 288 00:13:51,280 --> 00:13:51,439 Speaker 5: Now. 289 00:13:51,679 --> 00:13:53,600 Speaker 3: When I came in, Yeah, you had to be on 290 00:13:53,640 --> 00:13:56,400 Speaker 3: the list, you had to be known, you had to 291 00:13:56,640 --> 00:13:59,840 Speaker 3: have certain underlying principles that you accepted and agreed to 292 00:14:00,000 --> 00:14:02,720 Speaker 3: and worked with. We were very protective of each other, 293 00:14:02,960 --> 00:14:05,160 Speaker 3: even if we didn't like each other, because we needed 294 00:14:05,200 --> 00:14:08,200 Speaker 3: each other. Right. It was an underground and we acted 295 00:14:08,240 --> 00:14:11,120 Speaker 3: like an underground. You didn't know people's real name. That 296 00:14:11,520 --> 00:14:13,880 Speaker 3: was funny sometimes, what's that me being a drag queen? 297 00:14:13,960 --> 00:14:16,439 Speaker 3: I don't know half my friend's real names. I know 298 00:14:16,520 --> 00:14:18,280 Speaker 3: we went we were trying to get some credit. Once 299 00:14:18,400 --> 00:14:19,960 Speaker 3: my husband and I are like, oh, we should call 300 00:14:20,080 --> 00:14:21,800 Speaker 3: you know, we should call less and it's like, well, 301 00:14:21,800 --> 00:14:27,640 Speaker 3: what's their last name? We don't know? I didn't know, Well, yeah, hello, 302 00:14:30,320 --> 00:14:33,040 Speaker 3: you know, because it was very secretive, you know, it's 303 00:14:33,240 --> 00:14:35,960 Speaker 3: very about protecting people, not outing people, because it was 304 00:14:36,040 --> 00:14:37,240 Speaker 3: dangerous in the early days. 305 00:14:37,240 --> 00:14:39,640 Speaker 2: You're going to say, is that I'm sure there was 306 00:14:39,680 --> 00:14:42,680 Speaker 2: and they probably still is a bunch of stigma around 307 00:14:42,760 --> 00:14:44,520 Speaker 2: your community essentially. 308 00:14:44,840 --> 00:14:49,200 Speaker 3: Well, it's interesting, honestly because what I found being an 309 00:14:49,240 --> 00:14:52,240 Speaker 3: advocate and talking to what we call vanilla people, they 310 00:14:52,240 --> 00:14:54,920 Speaker 3: didn't like that much. Talking to them, I actually find 311 00:14:55,080 --> 00:14:57,640 Speaker 3: a lot more acceptance. Now that's not the way it 312 00:14:57,720 --> 00:14:59,720 Speaker 3: used to be, but a lot more acceptance now. On 313 00:14:59,760 --> 00:15:02,440 Speaker 3: some times, it's people within our community that are actually 314 00:15:02,520 --> 00:15:06,680 Speaker 3: less accepting than people outside. Where ten years ago, fifteen 315 00:15:06,760 --> 00:15:10,240 Speaker 3: years ago, Yeah, you couldn't really talk about it openly. 316 00:15:10,600 --> 00:15:12,760 Speaker 3: You could lose your job, you could lose your partner, 317 00:15:12,800 --> 00:15:15,160 Speaker 3: you could lose your family. There's still people who you'll 318 00:15:15,200 --> 00:15:19,280 Speaker 3: lose your family. There is still absolutely by some prejudice 319 00:15:19,320 --> 00:15:21,560 Speaker 3: out there. But there's a lot more acceptance than our 320 00:15:21,600 --> 00:15:24,560 Speaker 3: people sometimes understand. I mean, they're just too frightened to 321 00:15:24,560 --> 00:15:25,800 Speaker 3: find out earlier. 322 00:15:25,840 --> 00:15:28,640 Speaker 1: I use the term a mounch. Can you tell me 323 00:15:28,680 --> 00:15:29,360 Speaker 1: what a monch is? 324 00:15:29,800 --> 00:15:35,880 Speaker 3: Well, a monch is a non vanilla luncheon. Really, a 325 00:15:36,000 --> 00:15:40,680 Speaker 3: monch was actually created specifically in the old days to 326 00:15:40,880 --> 00:15:45,040 Speaker 3: encourage newcomers to come and meet us. So the rules 327 00:15:45,040 --> 00:15:48,240 Speaker 3: where you couldn't wear outrageous clothing or fetish style stuff, 328 00:15:48,240 --> 00:15:51,280 Speaker 3: you had to look very vanilla. You couldn't bring toys 329 00:15:51,320 --> 00:15:53,320 Speaker 3: and things. It was to encourage people to feel safe 330 00:15:53,320 --> 00:15:55,640 Speaker 3: with us, find out we're just people, you know, and 331 00:15:55,680 --> 00:15:56,920 Speaker 3: then go from there. 332 00:15:57,040 --> 00:15:59,120 Speaker 1: It's good for people to meet the community and the 333 00:15:59,120 --> 00:15:59,920 Speaker 1: people around them. 334 00:16:00,320 --> 00:16:02,440 Speaker 3: To get people out meeting real people. And I'm saying 335 00:16:02,440 --> 00:16:04,200 Speaker 3: we're not as scary as they say, at least not 336 00:16:04,320 --> 00:16:06,200 Speaker 3: outside ourselves. 337 00:16:08,600 --> 00:16:10,080 Speaker 1: When consensual for everybody. 338 00:16:10,320 --> 00:16:15,479 Speaker 3: When we're scary, up my dungeon scary. 339 00:16:15,640 --> 00:16:18,560 Speaker 2: So what is like, what does the scope of BDSM, 340 00:16:18,600 --> 00:16:19,720 Speaker 2: What does that look like for you? 341 00:16:19,920 --> 00:16:26,080 Speaker 3: Like, Oh, that's been a journey because I was very submissive. 342 00:16:26,480 --> 00:16:26,800 Speaker 1: I was. 343 00:16:27,600 --> 00:16:30,360 Speaker 3: I found out that my sexuality was tied to BDSM 344 00:16:30,800 --> 00:16:33,200 Speaker 3: because for me, vanilla sex is just a no go, 345 00:16:33,840 --> 00:16:36,440 Speaker 3: no interest cirrial. I was nine years old, but after 346 00:16:36,480 --> 00:16:38,880 Speaker 3: my daughter was born, didn't miss it right. That was 347 00:16:38,920 --> 00:16:43,080 Speaker 3: before I found BDSM. So my sexuality is definitely around it. 348 00:16:43,120 --> 00:16:46,440 Speaker 3: But I also had submissive tendencies, so I did that 349 00:16:46,560 --> 00:16:50,360 Speaker 3: for a while. I served dominance. I was under contract 350 00:16:50,440 --> 00:16:52,000 Speaker 3: for a few months to one dominance. 351 00:16:52,080 --> 00:16:53,560 Speaker 1: What does that mean under contract? 352 00:16:53,680 --> 00:16:56,360 Speaker 3: Well, we wrote up a contract, so we signed this 353 00:16:56,440 --> 00:16:59,200 Speaker 3: contract and then I served team. I served a few 354 00:16:59,200 --> 00:17:02,360 Speaker 3: others and then when I separated from my husband, I 355 00:17:02,440 --> 00:17:06,440 Speaker 3: decided to go for. I only wanted relationships within BDSM 356 00:17:06,520 --> 00:17:08,560 Speaker 3: because while he wanted to try it, it turned out not 357 00:17:08,600 --> 00:17:09,280 Speaker 3: to be his thing. 358 00:17:09,640 --> 00:17:12,359 Speaker 1: Right, Okay, So I started. 359 00:17:12,040 --> 00:17:14,640 Speaker 3: Dating a man. We call it dating. I don't really 360 00:17:14,640 --> 00:17:17,359 Speaker 3: call it dating. We started to engage. We engage for 361 00:17:17,359 --> 00:17:19,879 Speaker 3: eight months. I said I was going to move out 362 00:17:19,920 --> 00:17:21,480 Speaker 3: of my house. He said, you'll move in with me. 363 00:17:21,800 --> 00:17:24,280 Speaker 3: I've signed the contract. Show Wednesday, I'll show you the place. 364 00:17:24,800 --> 00:17:28,480 Speaker 3: And so he became my master. He was my master 365 00:17:28,640 --> 00:17:29,560 Speaker 3: for seven years. 366 00:17:29,760 --> 00:17:32,800 Speaker 1: And in some of these scenarios, Amasa can have a 367 00:17:32,840 --> 00:17:34,679 Speaker 1: bunch of people, right, Well. 368 00:17:34,520 --> 00:17:38,040 Speaker 3: If you're Polly, yes, right, So you can have monogamy 369 00:17:38,200 --> 00:17:40,760 Speaker 3: or you can have polyamory. And I've always been polyamorous. 370 00:17:40,840 --> 00:17:43,160 Speaker 3: I mean even when I was long before I met BDSM, 371 00:17:43,240 --> 00:17:45,680 Speaker 3: I was always had multiple dates and things like that. 372 00:17:45,800 --> 00:17:48,200 Speaker 3: So he really polyamory as a whole. 373 00:17:49,560 --> 00:17:50,600 Speaker 1: She could open up, right. 374 00:17:51,160 --> 00:17:54,679 Speaker 3: So we had agreements that, yes, there would be other people, 375 00:17:55,080 --> 00:17:56,879 Speaker 3: but the main thing was it was a true what 376 00:17:56,920 --> 00:17:59,359 Speaker 3: we call a total power exchange, which means that he 377 00:17:59,440 --> 00:18:02,920 Speaker 3: had all right and full control and he made all decisions. 378 00:18:03,640 --> 00:18:04,200 Speaker 1: Wow. 379 00:18:04,400 --> 00:18:06,960 Speaker 3: Yeah, so I you know I went into that deliberately. 380 00:18:07,000 --> 00:18:09,200 Speaker 3: I wore a slave collar. I had a custom made 381 00:18:09,200 --> 00:18:11,800 Speaker 3: pendant when I had my hair done. The biggest thing 382 00:18:11,960 --> 00:18:14,320 Speaker 3: was that my collar in lock. Okay, I didn't realize. 383 00:18:14,320 --> 00:18:16,040 Speaker 3: I wasn't thinking about it until they shaved it off. 384 00:18:16,040 --> 00:18:18,800 Speaker 3: And then there were all of my colleagues were work there. 385 00:18:18,680 --> 00:18:23,320 Speaker 1: And so all the way Rise twenty four seven. 386 00:18:23,440 --> 00:18:24,960 Speaker 3: Twenty four to seven, it never came off. 387 00:18:25,000 --> 00:18:28,480 Speaker 2: Wow, you've cut your hair. People can see your padlock. 388 00:18:29,040 --> 00:18:31,160 Speaker 2: How does that go down? What's the situation there? 389 00:18:31,400 --> 00:18:34,320 Speaker 3: So there's forty consultants, you know, crammed into this little office, 390 00:18:34,359 --> 00:18:37,440 Speaker 3: too barbarous going, and I'm drinking wine, you know, get 391 00:18:37,480 --> 00:18:39,600 Speaker 3: my bravery up and my beautys and go for it, 392 00:18:39,640 --> 00:18:41,520 Speaker 3: go for it. And I sit in the chair and 393 00:18:41,680 --> 00:18:44,480 Speaker 3: he starts shaving them, thinking, oh my god, here's all 394 00:18:44,520 --> 00:18:47,520 Speaker 3: of my colleagues and I had long red hair, yes, 395 00:18:47,640 --> 00:18:51,000 Speaker 3: and it's coming off, and whether they've noticed or not, 396 00:18:51,119 --> 00:18:53,560 Speaker 3: they're definitely going to see this now. So I was 397 00:18:53,640 --> 00:18:57,000 Speaker 3: kind of expecting there to be some commentary. There wasn't 398 00:18:57,040 --> 00:18:59,600 Speaker 3: any commentary, but I heard a couple of years later 399 00:18:59,680 --> 00:19:02,000 Speaker 3: from one of the people that I used to work 400 00:19:02,040 --> 00:19:04,800 Speaker 3: with that one of the development guys wanted me fired. 401 00:19:05,119 --> 00:19:07,760 Speaker 3: But actually none of my colleagues ever spoke about it, 402 00:19:07,920 --> 00:19:09,199 Speaker 3: which I'm very appreciative. 403 00:19:09,400 --> 00:19:12,000 Speaker 2: It's like, oh, that's an interesting locker you've got there, 404 00:19:12,000 --> 00:19:14,560 Speaker 2: it's around the wrong way. That's oh wow, maybe you 405 00:19:14,640 --> 00:19:18,040 Speaker 2: lost Tiffany, is it? 406 00:19:18,080 --> 00:19:18,280 Speaker 3: Ah? 407 00:19:19,640 --> 00:19:20,160 Speaker 1: I love that. 408 00:19:21,240 --> 00:19:24,760 Speaker 2: So that lock was from your first relationship as a submissive. 409 00:19:25,480 --> 00:19:27,040 Speaker 2: So what was it like when you left that? 410 00:19:27,640 --> 00:19:27,880 Speaker 1: Yeah? 411 00:19:27,920 --> 00:19:30,359 Speaker 3: So that was hard leaving that because a lot of 412 00:19:30,400 --> 00:19:33,440 Speaker 3: my life was around him and it took me five 413 00:19:33,440 --> 00:19:36,040 Speaker 3: months to leave my house besides like going to work 414 00:19:36,119 --> 00:19:41,960 Speaker 3: or groceries to break the mental bonds that I deliberately created. 415 00:19:42,000 --> 00:19:43,679 Speaker 3: And I knew what I was doing. I knew that 416 00:19:43,720 --> 00:19:44,240 Speaker 3: could happen. 417 00:19:44,440 --> 00:19:48,040 Speaker 2: So when they're in charge of everything, is that everything 418 00:19:48,119 --> 00:19:50,960 Speaker 2: or is it just within the bedroom or scenario is 419 00:19:51,040 --> 00:19:51,320 Speaker 2: like that? 420 00:19:51,640 --> 00:19:55,359 Speaker 3: No, it was everything, And that can make some people 421 00:19:55,359 --> 00:19:59,359 Speaker 3: don't understand that when you put yourself in that mental emotion, 422 00:19:59,520 --> 00:20:02,000 Speaker 3: you choose. That is a lifestyle. It's not like you 423 00:20:02,040 --> 00:20:05,960 Speaker 3: pick and choose. So even if something is really really difficult, 424 00:20:06,400 --> 00:20:09,400 Speaker 3: it is how do I serve? How do I maintain 425 00:20:09,520 --> 00:20:12,679 Speaker 3: this right? Because the old rules were that when you 426 00:20:12,720 --> 00:20:16,600 Speaker 3: stopped wying to do it, that ended the relationship. So 427 00:20:16,680 --> 00:20:18,760 Speaker 3: it's very serious stuff for some of us. A very 428 00:20:18,760 --> 00:20:21,879 Speaker 3: small proportion of the scene is went down that road, 429 00:20:22,040 --> 00:20:24,879 Speaker 3: and very few people go down that road now. But 430 00:20:25,480 --> 00:20:27,639 Speaker 3: I found a lot of value in it, and it 431 00:20:27,920 --> 00:20:29,720 Speaker 3: actually helped me in a lot of ways. I also 432 00:20:29,760 --> 00:20:32,520 Speaker 3: found things that you know, we think are so important, 433 00:20:32,560 --> 00:20:34,960 Speaker 3: I found really weren't all that important at the end 434 00:20:35,000 --> 00:20:37,000 Speaker 3: of the day, because I lived without them. After I 435 00:20:37,080 --> 00:20:41,119 Speaker 3: left him, I started training other submissives into the lifestyle 436 00:20:41,760 --> 00:20:45,040 Speaker 3: that sort of developed a dominant side. My first trainee 437 00:20:45,040 --> 00:20:47,399 Speaker 3: actually was trying to get into a relationship with me. 438 00:20:47,680 --> 00:20:49,919 Speaker 3: So three years after I trained her, I took her on. 439 00:20:50,600 --> 00:20:54,000 Speaker 3: She moved in with me. That was my first female 440 00:20:54,040 --> 00:20:57,880 Speaker 3: relationship in my fifties, and I was her master for 441 00:20:57,960 --> 00:20:58,520 Speaker 3: three years. 442 00:20:58,600 --> 00:21:01,320 Speaker 1: What was that like from you know, that's full, that's 443 00:21:01,359 --> 00:21:05,800 Speaker 1: full full? It was really hard, Yeah, to start with. 444 00:21:05,840 --> 00:21:08,200 Speaker 3: I was actually angry to begin with, you know, because 445 00:21:08,240 --> 00:21:10,040 Speaker 3: like I was going to be a submissive slave forever 446 00:21:10,600 --> 00:21:14,280 Speaker 3: and I really really kind of angry at the change 447 00:21:14,320 --> 00:21:16,200 Speaker 3: for a while. But she really helped me. I mean, 448 00:21:16,280 --> 00:21:20,439 Speaker 3: she really loved my dominance and really encouraged me to 449 00:21:20,440 --> 00:21:22,680 Speaker 3: be the best I could be. And so I grew 450 00:21:22,720 --> 00:21:25,240 Speaker 3: into that a lot because of her, and I really 451 00:21:25,280 --> 00:21:27,600 Speaker 3: give her credit for that, but she decided to go 452 00:21:27,640 --> 00:21:30,840 Speaker 3: on another path down the road, and I don't switch back. 453 00:21:30,880 --> 00:21:33,600 Speaker 3: I don't have an interest in that, so I still play. 454 00:21:33,640 --> 00:21:35,879 Speaker 3: I have a polycule, so I have a primary and 455 00:21:35,920 --> 00:21:36,800 Speaker 3: two other partners. 456 00:21:37,200 --> 00:21:38,800 Speaker 2: So we kind of touched on this bit, like what 457 00:21:38,960 --> 00:21:42,359 Speaker 2: is the role of consent in the BDSM world? 458 00:21:43,000 --> 00:21:46,560 Speaker 3: Consent? See, I learned consent twenty five years ago, right, 459 00:21:47,080 --> 00:21:50,920 Speaker 3: which is wonderful you hear about it now. But that 460 00:21:51,000 --> 00:21:53,239 Speaker 3: kind of came because we became more open and we 461 00:21:53,280 --> 00:21:55,720 Speaker 3: started to talk about the things we did within. But 462 00:21:56,000 --> 00:21:58,400 Speaker 3: consent was what I was taught in the very beginning. 463 00:21:58,920 --> 00:22:01,840 Speaker 3: Nothing without consent. And the other thing I learned, which 464 00:22:02,280 --> 00:22:04,440 Speaker 3: is one of the things that really have focused me 465 00:22:04,480 --> 00:22:07,840 Speaker 3: on the lifestyle, is I had partners that cared about me, 466 00:22:08,119 --> 00:22:11,119 Speaker 3: that put the focus on what was happening to me. 467 00:22:11,720 --> 00:22:13,760 Speaker 3: So whether it was sexual or not, you know, it 468 00:22:13,800 --> 00:22:16,520 Speaker 3: wasn't like, oh, they got sex and they wandered off, 469 00:22:16,560 --> 00:22:19,119 Speaker 3: you know, it was no. Their job was to make 470 00:22:19,160 --> 00:22:23,520 Speaker 3: sure I had an amazing experience. But nothing ever happened 471 00:22:23,520 --> 00:22:27,119 Speaker 3: without discussion or talk. So I don't care what you 472 00:22:27,160 --> 00:22:29,320 Speaker 3: were doing if it wasn't on the cards or if 473 00:22:29,359 --> 00:22:33,320 Speaker 3: you said stop no, we had safe words. If that 474 00:22:33,359 --> 00:22:37,560 Speaker 3: came out, everything stopped. So being treated that way was 475 00:22:37,720 --> 00:22:40,960 Speaker 3: just eye opening and I could never go back, you know, 476 00:22:41,080 --> 00:22:42,840 Speaker 3: to vanilla life, because I know a lot of that 477 00:22:42,880 --> 00:22:45,280 Speaker 3: still happens in vanilla life. And I'm like, no, you 478 00:22:45,320 --> 00:22:47,800 Speaker 3: don't treat me that way. So we learned to really 479 00:22:47,840 --> 00:22:50,760 Speaker 3: stand up for ourselves and to say no, you're not 480 00:22:50,880 --> 00:22:53,200 Speaker 3: doing that. Yeah, right, no matter what the situation. 481 00:22:53,359 --> 00:22:55,680 Speaker 2: I feel like there's a lot more communication in the 482 00:22:55,800 --> 00:22:56,679 Speaker 2: BDSM world. 483 00:22:57,040 --> 00:22:59,000 Speaker 3: There's so much community, Like. 484 00:22:58,880 --> 00:22:59,959 Speaker 1: Why would they shut up? 485 00:23:03,359 --> 00:23:03,439 Speaker 5: Now? 486 00:23:03,840 --> 00:23:05,840 Speaker 1: Tell me about your dungeon. I didn't even know. I 487 00:23:05,880 --> 00:23:07,600 Speaker 1: couldn't think of a better way to say it. To 488 00:23:07,720 --> 00:23:08,719 Speaker 1: help me about your dungeon. 489 00:23:09,480 --> 00:23:12,760 Speaker 3: The best part of my dungeon is this hidden Oh 490 00:23:12,800 --> 00:23:14,240 Speaker 3: I have a secret room in my house. 491 00:23:14,320 --> 00:23:16,400 Speaker 1: I love it. 492 00:23:16,640 --> 00:23:19,639 Speaker 3: Yes, doesn't everyone want a secret? 493 00:23:19,720 --> 00:23:20,880 Speaker 1: Everyone wants? Oh my god. 494 00:23:20,880 --> 00:23:23,720 Speaker 2: I went on this like TikTok like like whole the 495 00:23:23,720 --> 00:23:25,280 Speaker 2: other day where it was all these hidden rooms that 496 00:23:25,280 --> 00:23:26,680 Speaker 2: people put in their houses, and I was like. 497 00:23:27,440 --> 00:23:29,480 Speaker 3: One of my play partners made me a bookcase because 498 00:23:29,520 --> 00:23:31,679 Speaker 3: in front of the door frame and it happens to 499 00:23:31,720 --> 00:23:33,639 Speaker 3: be on a wall that looks like it's very natural 500 00:23:33,680 --> 00:23:36,520 Speaker 3: there because the walls angled. Yeah, and so nobody else 501 00:23:36,640 --> 00:23:38,520 Speaker 3: is there. And it's a big room too. It's a 502 00:23:38,600 --> 00:23:42,040 Speaker 3: second living area, so large, and it's full of lots 503 00:23:42,080 --> 00:23:42,960 Speaker 3: and lots of things. 504 00:23:43,240 --> 00:23:46,040 Speaker 1: Cabinet of curiosity. 505 00:23:46,880 --> 00:23:51,879 Speaker 2: Oh hello, I'll go chest out the furniture, go for 506 00:23:51,960 --> 00:23:52,440 Speaker 2: a swing. 507 00:23:52,640 --> 00:23:55,840 Speaker 1: Maybe we'll get one of that. I love it, I 508 00:23:55,880 --> 00:23:56,400 Speaker 1: love it. 509 00:24:05,119 --> 00:24:07,920 Speaker 2: Renee walked in here looking like a sweet little old lady, 510 00:24:08,280 --> 00:24:12,560 Speaker 2: and she was sweet, but she's also into some dirty things. 511 00:24:13,119 --> 00:24:14,160 Speaker 1: Go your good thing. 512 00:24:15,080 --> 00:24:19,040 Speaker 2: You've been listening to an iHeart Australia production concealed with utsimone. 513 00:24:19,320 --> 00:24:22,000 Speaker 2: Listen to more of what you love on iHeart and 514 00:24:22,160 --> 00:24:23,280 Speaker 2: to see what two. 515 00:24:23,200 --> 00:24:26,080 Speaker 1: Very unvanilla masses of their craft look like. Check us 516 00:24:26,080 --> 00:24:36,840 Speaker 1: out on the socials.