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Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to the sit Down. I'm Vive Christie,

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Speaker 1: Managing editor of Australian Tennis Magazine, and.

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Speaker 2: I'm Matt Trolo, a writer for ozopen dot com.

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Speaker 1: And Matt, why are we sitting down this week with

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Speaker 1: Paul McNamee.

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Speaker 2: Well, we actually did earlier this year in April, but

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Speaker 2: because we had such a long time with him back then,

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Speaker 2: we were talking to him about the clay court season

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Speaker 2: and his book about clay court tennis. While we had him.

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Speaker 2: He's obviously a former tournament director of the Australian Open,

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Speaker 2: so we asked him to kind of relive some of

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Speaker 2: his favorite memories and we thought with the AO coming

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Speaker 2: very soon, this would be the perfect time to run

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Speaker 2: part two of that interview, which is much more of

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Speaker 2: an Australian Open focus.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, we've been very excited to revisit the second part

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Speaker 1: of this conversation. Let's hear what Paul has to say.

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Speaker 2: You mentioned the Australian Open, and obviously you were the

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Speaker 2: tournament director for more than a decade. I had a

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Speaker 2: question to ask you about the two thousand and five

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Speaker 2: AO because I remember that one really clearly, the centenary one,

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Speaker 2: and it was so amazing on so many levels. But

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Speaker 2: I had actually, just before this interview, chatted to a journalist,

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Speaker 2: Uzzi Pekowski about the Agassi Sampras ninety five final and

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Speaker 2: she reminded me that was your first year as tournament

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Speaker 2: wil Dead then, and she said that you really move

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Speaker 2: the tournament forward compared to nineteen ninety four, like that

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Speaker 2: was when the serving man logo was introduced in night tennis.

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Speaker 3: Atization we call italization.

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Speaker 2: And so I guess that kind of those two the

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Speaker 2: ninety five and the two thousand and five AO kind

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Speaker 2: of really successfully bookended your time. But did you do

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Speaker 2: two thousand and six as well?

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Speaker 4: I did, Yeah, we're federal bat bagdatas and justin and

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Speaker 4: then didn't finish the match, which I wasn't happy about me.

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Speaker 2: But those two I gets in particular, ninety five AO

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Speaker 2: and five AO really significant for two reasons. Yeah, the

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Speaker 2: sam Pra Saxi final and the centenary I think holds

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Speaker 2: the records. Saffon and Hewett the most watched tennis match

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Speaker 2: in Australia.

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Speaker 4: Well, it was the most watched TV program in the

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Speaker 4: history of Australian television until the Matilda's semi final that's

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Speaker 4: right now they've never had ratings since then.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, as good as that.

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Speaker 4: I mean, there'll be a debate where the nineteen Australia

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Speaker 4: in two thousand ninety was the greatest, which I mean,

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Speaker 4: Craig and I can disagree. I'll say five. There was

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Speaker 4: never a tournament logo five. The top four men made

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Speaker 4: the Semis four. Four shows were in the top ten

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Speaker 4: of the year in ratings Australia and the saffen Hewart

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Speaker 4: Final was the most watch mats, even ahead of raw

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Speaker 4: weddings until boy, that would be I don't ask me,

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Speaker 4: but until until the until the Matilda's, So the Matilda's

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Speaker 4: break all records, but until then it was so.

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Speaker 3: It was an amazing year and.

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Speaker 4: You know, we had so much to celebrate that year,

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Speaker 4: and it was just unbelievable and Rocket came back and

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Speaker 4: that had hit with late and you know, there was

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Speaker 4: just so many things going on.

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Speaker 3: But.

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Speaker 2: Recentably than the other ones.

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Speaker 3: Well no, but there reason ninety.

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Speaker 4: Five was important because the first time Agacy had played

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Speaker 4: and I kind of took advantage of that because I

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Speaker 4: know he's not.

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Speaker 3: A student of history of the game, you know, because.

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Speaker 4: He played guys I don't know the guy and playing

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Speaker 4: they go, but he played the Davis Cup final from Germany.

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Speaker 4: I did it here, okay, so Andre, because with Stubbs,

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Speaker 4: he laid Stubs, a great guy, Colin Stubbs, and he

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Speaker 4: had this thing that the players don't only want to

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Speaker 4: play once at night at the Strain open back then

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Speaker 4: and I go, well, I'm sure Andre doesn't know that.

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Speaker 4: So because it's his first so I said, Andre, look,

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Speaker 4: you're gonna have to play twice at night, you know.

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Speaker 4: He said, I can to me once the first week

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Speaker 4: once or second?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, no way. Then I knew it was done. We got,

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Speaker 3: we've got, we won.

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Speaker 4: And the second weekend I played Pat Rafter on this

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Speaker 4: which was just off the scale, right, So we had this.

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Speaker 4: So it all worked out, all worked out beautifully. And

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Speaker 4: ninety five and of course poor Pete, you know, he lost.

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Speaker 4: Tim Gullitzen was confirmed out cancer and you know when

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Speaker 4: Pete was crying on the court in his match against Courier.

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Speaker 4: That was a quarter final we had and was the

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Speaker 4: first time Sampus and Agacy, who were the two best

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Speaker 4: players of that year, had played in a final of

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Speaker 4: a Grand Slam.

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Speaker 3: And it happened here in Australia.

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Speaker 4: So after that Jeff I went to Jeff and I said,

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Speaker 4: you know, we've got to make our move on the

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Speaker 4: ATP because we had double we had equal ranking points

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Speaker 4: with the other Slams. For the women's we didn't have

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Speaker 4: it for the men's. We didn't have the same ranking

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Speaker 4: points as the other three Grand Slams. People didn't realize that,

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Speaker 4: so I said, now as the moment we had Sam

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Speaker 4: Pazagacy was an off the sky tournament ninety five, So

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Speaker 4: we went and the ATP agreed to equal prior equal

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Speaker 4: ranking points to the other. So that was the first

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Speaker 4: time ninety six of the Australian Open had the same

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Speaker 4: points as the other Grand Slams. And then we eventually

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Speaker 4: got the prize money up to equal the others and

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Speaker 4: in fact exceeded.

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Speaker 3: So I don't particularly love the arms race between the Slams.

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Speaker 4: I just think they're four equal partners of this beautiful

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Speaker 4: chain called the Grand Slams. So we were never trying

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Speaker 4: to be better. I didn't think when I was in charge.

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Speaker 3: But I felt that.

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Speaker 4: To be the equal we probably needed to be a

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Speaker 4: little bit better, you know, because we was just the history.

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Speaker 3: We didn't have the history of the others in terms

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Speaker 3: of the great players.

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Speaker 4: So and it's just gone from strength and strength since

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Speaker 4: two thousand and six. I mean it, it's an incredible tournament.

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Speaker 4: The facility is the best in the world. You know,

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Speaker 4: you know, it was a great year this year with

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Speaker 4: Youanick center breaking through.

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Speaker 3: You know, it's you know, it's very deep.

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Speaker 4: You know, I love clay from a playing perspective, But

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Speaker 4: of course this train Open is the closest to me

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Speaker 4: because of twelve wonderful years I had here and for

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Speaker 4: me personally, I won the junior event, this train Open,

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Speaker 4: I won the doubles, and I've become tournament director.

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Speaker 3: So it means a lot to me.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, in a nice kind of full circle that

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Speaker 2: you went through all of the stages of it. You

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Speaker 2: might have already said it, but was there a particular

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Speaker 2: Is there one greatest highlight for you as tournament director

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Speaker 2: in those twelve years?

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Speaker 5: Ooh, look, I think well two thousand and five was

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Speaker 5: the standout year, the centenary and we did justice to

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Speaker 5: the centenary of the tournament and.

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Speaker 3: The semi finals.

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Speaker 4: Were amazing when Leyton beat Roddick and Saffan came from

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Speaker 4: match point down to beat Roger Federer, and then the

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Speaker 4: final was incredible.

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Speaker 3: You know, Layton was winning that final.

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Speaker 4: I mean he's a setup and and then control in

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Speaker 4: the second set, and Ivan the physio, Layton's physio. Yeah,

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Speaker 4: he gets caught out and caught by Layton. The first everything, no,

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Speaker 4: probably all was good. Layton's winning the match. In the

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Speaker 4: second set, it's like three to two. Layton on serve

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Speaker 4: and Safin calls vib because they can choose which trainers

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Speaker 4: that both players at the same trainer in the final,

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Speaker 4: but the player gets to choose the final because they

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Speaker 4: can choose which a TP got on tournament rep they want.

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Speaker 4: Ivan goes out there and I go. He comes back,

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Speaker 4: and I said, what's what's up with Marret? He goes,

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Speaker 4: he said, he's He said, he's playing so badly. He's

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Speaker 4: sad and he's lonely, and he just wanted somebody to

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Speaker 4: talk to.

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Speaker 3: He just wanted to talk about it a bad news feeling.

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Speaker 4: So I said, I just listened to him and he said, look,

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Speaker 4: I'm really lonely.

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Speaker 3: This is awful, you know.

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Speaker 4: Turned the match turned the match, broke broke Layton in

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Speaker 4: the match, turned the match, turned the match.

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Speaker 2: I didn't even take a pad at all or something.

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Speaker 3: No, he just wanted someone to talk to. I remember

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Speaker 3: thing about that year we had we had a life.

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Speaker 4: Side for America Express at the Sydney Opera House and

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Speaker 4: on Australia Day we had Layton was playing a young

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Speaker 4: Spanish guy who I knew was good because I had

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Speaker 4: seen him play in Monte Carlo right when he was sixteen.

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Speaker 3: And this guy is amazing, right, so I.

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Speaker 4: Got that match is a big match, right, Hewitt and

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Speaker 4: Nadal young, no one's heard of him here.

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Speaker 3: That's on center court on Broad Lay Berna.

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Speaker 4: And then then we've got al Alicia Mullen's playing Venus Williams.

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Speaker 3: Oh yeah that match. Yeah, these are two on Australia

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Speaker 3: Day Sidney. Your pro House is the Life site.

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Speaker 4: You know how many people went to that life So

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Speaker 4: that day seventy five thousand people went to the Opera

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Speaker 4: House in Sydney to watch the Australia Open in Melbourne.

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Speaker 4: There was more people that the tournament in Sydney was

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Speaker 4: getting right for one day to watch Austrain up and

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Speaker 4: that thing went.

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Speaker 3: Look, you know they've.

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Speaker 4: Bad live sites, but this was seventy five thousand people Okay,

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Speaker 4: if you had a mixed card you sat front, right,

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Speaker 4: that was the only perk you had, right, But unbelievable

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Speaker 4: and of course Alisha they both they both won. Alisha

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Speaker 4: then got ripped off by bad line call against Davenport

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Speaker 4: in the quarters, which was a tragedy.

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Speaker 3: So we had the line calling ready for the next year,

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Speaker 3: you know. Yeah, now, how the poor there's a profession.

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Speaker 4: It's almost extinct now up point, which is sad, but

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Speaker 4: the reality is, you know, technology has moved on.

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Speaker 3: But yeah, look that year has to be the highlight.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, there was some amazing matches over the years years

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Speaker 4: of course, but I still get a massive thrill going

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Speaker 4: to the torn And I was so sad?

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Speaker 3: Was it on your program?

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Speaker 4: The Packcash said that he feels sad every time he

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Speaker 4: goes in into Melbourne Parker. He might have had his mind,

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Speaker 4: but it was the touch.

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Speaker 3: It feels left out sometimes. Okay, that's the AI whatever

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Speaker 3: I was. I was interviewed for that as well.

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Speaker 4: I remember so Cash he just said how sad he

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Speaker 4: feels everything because he lost those two finals. But I mean,

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Speaker 4: but I feel sad that he feels so sad about it,

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Speaker 4: because you know, to be honest, today's the day, right, Yeah, absolutely, yeah,

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Speaker 4: So you know I don't feel that way.

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Speaker 3: I mean, and I lost.

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Speaker 4: I had match porn in the semis and lost in

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Speaker 4: the singles, which is tough for some of them. Me

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Speaker 4: I get one chance, didn't you know, didn't happen and

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Speaker 4: then I remember it? But yeah, yeah, I think you know.

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Speaker 3: It is what it is. You know, this life stuff happens,

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Speaker 3: right exactly.

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Speaker 2: And you've talked a lot about coaching as well, and

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Speaker 2: you obviously have a great coaching partnership with Shoe. I say,

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Speaker 2: she's having a great comeback to the sport now, which

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Speaker 2: is what is she holding three of the four major

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Speaker 2: titles or something plus.

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Speaker 4: Mixed, she's four in the last four. She's back to

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Speaker 4: number one in the world.

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Speaker 2: Which is absolutely incredible, amazing. Yeah, So what's it been

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Speaker 2: like working with her? She's a very unorthodox player, obviously,

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Speaker 2: very and a great character in the game, and you're

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Speaker 2: about to go to Madrid with her next.

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Speaker 3: Week next week? Yeah, yeah, next week. So what's that

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Speaker 3: been like? Oh, look, it's been a roller coaster.

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Speaker 4: I mean, she's been I mean I saw her play

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Speaker 4: first time at Hopman Cup when I was running that

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Speaker 4: and I just saw the talent there and the way

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Speaker 4: she played angles and chess in a way on god,

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Speaker 4: she never really ever had a serve. To be honest,

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Speaker 4: it's still still the case. SERVI has been probably the

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Speaker 4: worst on the tour. So to get to another one

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Speaker 4: in the world with no service pretty good.

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Speaker 3: Pretty good.

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Speaker 4: And this time last year, no ranking whatsoever, no ranking whatsoever.

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Speaker 3: Zero. Okay, she'd been out for nearly two years.

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Speaker 4: Started in Madrid last year, the first match for nearly

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Speaker 4: two years. I wasn't there. She lost first round. I

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Speaker 4: went around, lost first round Rome. They went to Rolling

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Speaker 4: Grass and I started teaming up with her there and

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Speaker 4: didn't have a partner, no ranking, but got into a

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Speaker 4: protected ranking but not seated. Ended up one minute to

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Speaker 4: go on the signing with a Chinese player who'd never

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Speaker 4: done anything in doubles. But I said, can she serve,

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Speaker 4: as you know, she's a big girl. Could she serve

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Speaker 4: because she hit the ballhard? Yeah, Well, the sign up

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Speaker 4: with it unseated, they win, They win the French So

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Speaker 4: that was that was a pretty good start. So so Storm,

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Speaker 4: you know, is out for maybe a year with a

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Speaker 4: prote comeback with a protected ranking. Storm Storm standers, but

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Speaker 4: Storm Hunter excuse me, but Sue Way a year ago

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Speaker 4: had no ranking either and got back to number one

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Speaker 4: inside twelve months, which has never happened for it and

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Speaker 4: will never happen again.

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Speaker 3: But there is hope that it can be done.

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Speaker 4: And then she Barbara came out after the baby retirement,

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Speaker 4: played women and the end up winning. They lost, couldn't

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Speaker 4: win a match, and they went Wimen and then she

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Speaker 4: didn't know to play with the US Open, and I

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Speaker 4: wasn't there, got the Semis. Then Assie opened, Elise Mertens

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Speaker 4: split up with Storm and then.

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Speaker 2: This is the thing, two different partners each time like

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Speaker 2: that you have to coach it differently.

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Speaker 4: But the end of the day, in doubles, it's about

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Speaker 4: the team, not about the players. So the difficult thing

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Speaker 4: I think in the wimen'side in the doubles is that

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Speaker 4: you're dealing with also the coach of their partner. And

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Speaker 4: where I've been lucky is most of the time, nearly

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Speaker 4: all the time, the coach of Suway's partners had many partners.

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Speaker 3: She won these three slams with three different.

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Speaker 4: Players, by the way, which is unusual that the coach

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Speaker 4: of her partners have allowed me to take the lead role.

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Speaker 4: I asked, one of us has to take the lead,

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Speaker 4: because we are going there as a team to the God.

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Speaker 4: We're not going with You've got your coach. You've got

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Speaker 4: your coach, and we figure things out as we go. No,

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Speaker 4: we we do the setup before for the match.

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Speaker 3: You know, I scout the opponents heavily. We do the setup,

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Speaker 3: we work on it.

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Speaker 4: I mean for me, you know, I wrote sixty percent,

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Speaker 4: but really I think seventy percent of the success happens

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Speaker 4: before you ever walk on the court. I mean, that's

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Speaker 4: just the last bit playing the match. If you set

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Speaker 4: up properly and you play half decent, you win that match.

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Speaker 3: But you've got to set up. You've got to set up.

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Speaker 4: Well, and you've you've got to take away the strength

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Speaker 4: of their opponent. You've got to eliminate their weapon from

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Speaker 4: the match. So I look at their ponents, say what's

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Speaker 4: the what's their bigger threat? Ah, she's crossing a lot. Okay,

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Speaker 4: how do we take that out of the match. How

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Speaker 4: do we remove that from the match? So that players

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Speaker 4: it's going to be so angry they're not doing what

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Speaker 4: they love doing the best. So I'm very big on

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Speaker 4: maximizing our setup, but trying to destroy the weapon of

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Speaker 4: the opponent. And for example, you know a good example,

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Speaker 4: let's say Gus rips the.

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Speaker 3: Forehand cross caught on the juice side.

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Speaker 4: That's point, is not a best shot, let's be honest. Okay,

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Speaker 4: but she does rip across court very well on the

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Speaker 4: juice side. I think she's better on the outside and doubles,

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Speaker 4: but she's playing the juice side. So okay, we take

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Speaker 4: that away, make her go down the line by part

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Speaker 4: by playing I formation against that.

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Speaker 3: So she's got to go down the line or she's

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Speaker 3: going to take or take the head off. She's going

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Speaker 3: to take that, but you can't take off Suway said,

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Speaker 3: she's too good there.

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Speaker 4: So we put Suwey against the weapon because her volleying,

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Speaker 4: you know, her finishing volleys are the best in the world.

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Speaker 4: So we find a way to set up that suits us.

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Speaker 4: And sometimes she's she's the queen of the net and

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Speaker 4: sometimes she's the queen at the baseline. I like to

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Speaker 4: have a queen at both the cents a good depending

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Speaker 4: on who the partner is. But you've got to play

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Speaker 4: your role. I mean, this is Hollywood, this is you

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Speaker 4: play a role. I mean, look, I'm going to say

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Speaker 4: it like the Fire of the French last year. So

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Speaker 4: I was playing with Jina. They're playing i mean the

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Speaker 4: big Allen Allen and Perez and Martina's and the Semis.

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Speaker 4: Martina's in the Semis. In the final, they're playing Taylor

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Speaker 4: Town's End and Laila Fernandez are pretty good. Right, we're

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Speaker 4: getting smashed. But Gena Suez partner's not doing a job,

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Speaker 4: which was to rip the balls. You're going to just

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Speaker 4: rip and let's Sue Way clean it up, right, just

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Speaker 4: tided it all up, and I'm going to Siso Jing.

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Speaker 4: You know Gena's coach. Gena's not in the ball, Paul, Paul.

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Speaker 4: She's not feeling well. You know, she's she's feeling really

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Speaker 4: sick today and you know it's not happening.

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Speaker 3: After the match, we'll get a doctor. Okay, but this

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Speaker 3: is the final of the Slim.

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Speaker 1: I don't care.

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Speaker 4: I'm sorry she's sick, but we're going to match the winn.

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Speaker 4: You we're down to set in the break. This is

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Speaker 4: not going well. This is a final rolling gras. We

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Speaker 4: don't care a lot about.

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Speaker 3: Okay.

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Speaker 4: Now it's with with Gina, you know, so I just

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Speaker 4: come on, come on, So they come down because now

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Speaker 4: you can coach it now, which is almost cheating.

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Speaker 3: Okay, it's changed the game.

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Speaker 4: I mean you can say whatever you want, when you want,

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Speaker 4: when you're down your room mysteriously.

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Speaker 3: So it's okay. So Jenna Gena, I know you're not

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Speaker 3: feeling well.

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Speaker 4: I feel really bad for you know. Look, but you know,

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Speaker 4: straight off the match we'll get a doctor. You know,

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Speaker 4: but you know what, you're.

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Speaker 3: Not doing your job. You're not hitting the ball. I

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Speaker 3: don't care how sick you are, but you please, please,

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Speaker 3: can you hit the ball.

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Speaker 4: And you know, she started hitting the ball and gets

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Speaker 4: a tiebreak, got back, they got a break, gets a tiebreak.

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Speaker 3: Three on the tie base. She smashes this for wht

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Speaker 3: and so hard past Townsend. It was like so big.

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Speaker 4: I was ready to leave the stadium because I know

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Speaker 4: the match is over.

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Speaker 3: They've won this match. Now Gina has started ripping the ball.

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Speaker 4: It's over six to one and the third wow, six

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Speaker 4: one and the third.

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Speaker 3: But she started doing a job. And look, you know,

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Speaker 3: she was.

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Speaker 4: Sick and she didn't come to the to celebrate after

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Speaker 4: dinner and she was sick.

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Speaker 3: But I want to win the match.

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Speaker 5: She did.

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Speaker 3: She feel a lot better now. You've got to get

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Speaker 3: on on with things. I like that. Today's the day.

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Speaker 1: Today is the day.

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Speaker 3: Today's the day. Yeah, life lessons.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, well, Paul, it's been great chatting with you today.

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Speaker 1: We've we've covered many topics, but you know, we started

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Speaker 1: talking about clay, so I thought we'd circle back and

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Speaker 1: you know, do you still get out and play on

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Speaker 1: a clay court?

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Speaker 3: And I just did today? Yeah, I played a k

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Speaker 3: with a good, good senior played brus Fergus. Yeah, we

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Speaker 3: only plant clay. Come on clay court there.

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Speaker 4: Well it's onto car, but it's probably the best onto.

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Speaker 3: Car in Melbourne, but it's not clay.

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Speaker 4: Okay, get the old bad bath whatever, but it's very good,

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Speaker 4: but it's not clay.

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Speaker 3: But yeah, I still play on and I love it.

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Speaker 4: And I went to the World Masters last year in my

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Speaker 4: age group and picked up a bronze.

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Speaker 3: I got the bronze medal.

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Speaker 4: Today someone dropped it off and yeah I've got a

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Speaker 4: bronze medal for the doubles in New Yorker last year.

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Speaker 4: Because I'm based in Europe, so you can go do

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Speaker 4: that sort of.

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Speaker 3: Thing, you know.

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Speaker 4: So I'm lucky with my life I'm very lucky with

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Speaker 4: everything that I've been involved with in tennis. It's been

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Speaker 4: ups and downs with politics, but you know what, I'm

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Speaker 4: so lucky to have had this journey right through and

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Speaker 4: still feel part of the game and love coming in here.

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Speaker 4: And you know, I feel like I've helped the engagement

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Speaker 4: with Asia Pacific, which is kind of my role in Australia,

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Speaker 4: which is very important, and I feel like that's been

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Speaker 4: I've really enjoyed doing it, and every aspect of the

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Speaker 4: sport I've loved and you know, I you know, my

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Speaker 4: parents introduced me to it. I just lost my mother

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Speaker 4: last week, which wonderful lady, but at one hundred and

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Speaker 4: two years of age, had had a great inning, so

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Speaker 4: you know, we celebrated a wonderful life. But they introduced

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Speaker 4: me to sport, and tennis has always been the one

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Speaker 4: that I've loved the most. You know, a lot of

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Speaker 4: the tennis guys got a golf and other people, you know,

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Speaker 4: which is great, But I keep coming back to tennis

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Speaker 4: because it's it's my deep lovers for this game and

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Speaker 4: I get such a thrill seeing seeing players do well

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Speaker 4: and seeing players develop develop their games, and you can only.

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Speaker 3: Be the best you can be.

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Speaker 4: So I love I love that journey in the role

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Speaker 4: that Clay plays and that journey. I love the clay

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Speaker 4: court season. I wish it was longer. It is longer

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Speaker 4: this year because the Olympics are on clay and I'm

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Speaker 4: going to go with Sueway to the Olympics for the

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Speaker 4: first time as a coach, which is good.

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Speaker 3: That's awesome.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, so I've got a lot to look forward to

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Speaker 4: this year, you know, and we'll see.

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Speaker 3: But thank you for having me on.

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Speaker 4: And and look everything that happens in this building at

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Speaker 4: Tennis Straight at HQ, I mean it's it's incredible the

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Speaker 4: growth of the organization. What's doing for gender equity. I

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Speaker 4: mean you see it, the new Can Medal Awards. How

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Speaker 4: all the good work that Tennis a Straight is doing

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Speaker 4: the people don't see. So I see that and I

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Speaker 4: love being a small part of that and hope that

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Speaker 4: that continues.

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Speaker 2: Well, that was quite good timing to hear macnahmine refer

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Speaker 2: to the new Can Metal which is tonight in Melbourn's Crown.

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Speaker 2: But yes, it is also just a reminder of how

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Speaker 2: soon the Australian Open is coming. Like we're just over

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Speaker 2: a month away.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, just a matter of weeks before we'll see it

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Speaker 1: all happen again here in Melbourne and always something special.

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Speaker 2: Unfolds, Yeah, it definitely does.

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Speaker 1: We'll be back next week with another episode of the

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Speaker 1: sit Down, and in the meantime you can listen to

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Speaker 1: John Bree and the team on the Aoshow Weekly.

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Speaker 2: And as we always remind you, details for how to

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Speaker 2: contact us are in the show notes below, and please subscribe,

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Speaker 2: rate and review. We'll see you next week, Vieve, look

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Speaker 2: forward to it. Matt