1 00:00:00,160 --> 00:00:02,440 Speaker 1: It is just ten minutes after ten o'clock. Now, if 2 00:00:02,480 --> 00:00:04,880 Speaker 1: you listen to the show fairly regularly, you'll know that 3 00:00:04,920 --> 00:00:08,119 Speaker 1: we've spoken at length over the last few months about 4 00:00:08,160 --> 00:00:10,080 Speaker 1: some of the shortages that we've seen when it comes 5 00:00:10,080 --> 00:00:14,440 Speaker 1: to doctors and nurses here in the Northern Territory. Now, 6 00:00:14,440 --> 00:00:17,560 Speaker 1: the federal government's got a proposal which would entice doctors 7 00:00:17,560 --> 00:00:21,520 Speaker 1: and nurse practitioners to regional and remote areas of Australia. 8 00:00:22,000 --> 00:00:24,639 Speaker 1: So from January next year, the federal government's looking to 9 00:00:24,720 --> 00:00:28,639 Speaker 1: wipe the university debt of doctors or nurse practitioners under 10 00:00:28,680 --> 00:00:31,120 Speaker 1: a few conditions. Now joining me on the show to 11 00:00:31,160 --> 00:00:32,920 Speaker 1: tell us a little bit more about this is the 12 00:00:32,960 --> 00:00:36,319 Speaker 1: Regional Health Minister, David Gillespie. Good morning to you. 13 00:00:37,280 --> 00:00:39,639 Speaker 2: Good morning Katie. Please you wish you at the top end. 14 00:00:39,960 --> 00:00:44,519 Speaker 1: Well, David, this sounds like a really interesting proposal. Can 15 00:00:44,560 --> 00:00:47,000 Speaker 1: you talk us through exactly how it's going to work. 16 00:00:48,800 --> 00:00:53,440 Speaker 2: Well, it's basically a waiver of your hecks ld LINGO, 17 00:00:53,680 --> 00:00:57,200 Speaker 2: or the help debt that you accumulate when you're studying 18 00:00:57,440 --> 00:01:01,960 Speaker 2: for a medical degree or a nurse practitioner degree, and 19 00:01:02,440 --> 00:01:05,440 Speaker 2: it's conditional on you. You have to have done three 20 00:01:05,520 --> 00:01:08,319 Speaker 2: postgraduate years, so you can't be just to begin a 21 00:01:08,360 --> 00:01:12,119 Speaker 2: baby doctor. You have to be either a senior registrar 22 00:01:12,319 --> 00:01:16,759 Speaker 2: or becoming a fully fellow doctor. And if you've done 23 00:01:16,800 --> 00:01:20,720 Speaker 2: a six year degree, you can by working six years 24 00:01:21,440 --> 00:01:25,640 Speaker 2: get the whole fee waves But which is really interesting 25 00:01:26,120 --> 00:01:30,920 Speaker 2: for Northern Territorians, it's more remote, so there's a fifty 26 00:01:32,200 --> 00:01:36,199 Speaker 2: reduction on what is required. So if you're in what 27 00:01:36,680 --> 00:01:40,400 Speaker 2: areas are called remote or very remote, you know, most 28 00:01:40,440 --> 00:01:44,880 Speaker 2: of the Northern Territory is that outside Darwin. But the 29 00:01:44,920 --> 00:01:48,480 Speaker 2: modified Mono system, if it's a six or a seven 30 00:01:48,800 --> 00:01:51,720 Speaker 2: in a one to seven scale, you would only have 31 00:01:51,760 --> 00:01:54,360 Speaker 2: to do three years instead of six years. But if 32 00:01:54,360 --> 00:01:57,960 Speaker 2: you've done a four year degree, you would need to 33 00:01:57,960 --> 00:02:02,320 Speaker 2: do two years. Can't just do it a fly and 34 00:02:02,400 --> 00:02:04,640 Speaker 2: fly out job. You have to be doing twenty four 35 00:02:04,680 --> 00:02:08,680 Speaker 2: hours a week, you know, every week, making a commitment 36 00:02:08,800 --> 00:02:13,680 Speaker 2: to the regional rule and remote town or villages that 37 00:02:13,720 --> 00:02:16,160 Speaker 2: you're working in, and you will get your help debt 38 00:02:16,240 --> 00:02:20,080 Speaker 2: waived and nurse practitioners as well, not just medicaids. 39 00:02:20,600 --> 00:02:23,240 Speaker 1: And so when you talk about you know about the 40 00:02:23,240 --> 00:02:26,480 Speaker 1: different areas of the Northern Territory, I'm assuming that you know, 41 00:02:26,600 --> 00:02:29,240 Speaker 1: somewhere like gun Bologna would be you know, I would 42 00:02:29,280 --> 00:02:32,920 Speaker 1: be regarded as as remote. When you talk about a 43 00:02:32,960 --> 00:02:36,280 Speaker 1: place like Darwin. Would that be considered regional still or 44 00:02:36,320 --> 00:02:37,519 Speaker 1: would it be excluded? 45 00:02:37,639 --> 00:02:41,040 Speaker 2: No, look, I'd have to look at it. It would. 46 00:02:41,120 --> 00:02:45,520 Speaker 2: It's quite a big population, so it would be a 47 00:02:45,600 --> 00:02:48,639 Speaker 2: two probably, And it kicks in when you go from 48 00:02:48,800 --> 00:02:52,320 Speaker 2: three to seven. So towns less than fifty thousand people 49 00:02:53,600 --> 00:02:57,519 Speaker 2: would be a three. A small country town, say twenty 50 00:02:57,600 --> 00:03:01,200 Speaker 2: thousand people would be a four. Yep, five would be 51 00:03:01,360 --> 00:03:06,440 Speaker 2: like more than five thousand, and then six is remote 52 00:03:06,480 --> 00:03:11,720 Speaker 2: and seven is very remote. So I think Catherine is 53 00:03:11,800 --> 00:03:16,600 Speaker 2: a six. So that gives you some indication. Darwin would 54 00:03:16,600 --> 00:03:19,800 Speaker 2: be a two I expect or it's not big enough 55 00:03:21,480 --> 00:03:25,639 Speaker 2: to be a one. That's big cities like towns Fall 56 00:03:26,080 --> 00:03:28,040 Speaker 2: or cans or Sydney or Melbourne. 57 00:03:28,440 --> 00:03:31,040 Speaker 1: Well, I suppose it's you know, it's a It seems 58 00:03:31,080 --> 00:03:33,360 Speaker 1: like a really good idea in theory. I think a 59 00:03:33,400 --> 00:03:35,360 Speaker 1: lot of you know, a lot of young UNI students 60 00:03:35,640 --> 00:03:37,960 Speaker 1: or people starting out would think I'll do my time 61 00:03:38,400 --> 00:03:41,040 Speaker 1: remote or in a regional location and then be able 62 00:03:41,040 --> 00:03:44,400 Speaker 1: to wipe my hex steat. I suppose are we trying 63 00:03:44,400 --> 00:03:47,840 Speaker 1: to look at enticing people from those major capital cities 64 00:03:48,000 --> 00:03:52,200 Speaker 1: like Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane, two places like the Northern Territory. 65 00:03:54,040 --> 00:03:58,600 Speaker 2: We do we always do. We have already in the 66 00:03:58,640 --> 00:04:03,040 Speaker 2: Medicare rebate system. If you are more remote, you get 67 00:04:03,200 --> 00:04:08,960 Speaker 2: more practice incentives depending on what services you're doing, and 68 00:04:09,000 --> 00:04:11,440 Speaker 2: we are trying to add to that as well in 69 00:04:11,520 --> 00:04:14,200 Speaker 2: a separate piece of work, because we realize if you're 70 00:04:14,240 --> 00:04:17,200 Speaker 2: a GP working in a remote area or in a 71 00:04:17,240 --> 00:04:19,279 Speaker 2: country town where you work at the hospital as well 72 00:04:19,320 --> 00:04:23,200 Speaker 2: and look after accident emergency and deliver babies or have 73 00:04:23,320 --> 00:04:26,960 Speaker 2: to resuscitate people from say a car accident, that's different 74 00:04:27,000 --> 00:04:29,960 Speaker 2: from sitting in suburbia or in a big city where 75 00:04:29,960 --> 00:04:33,320 Speaker 2: there's teaching hospitals on every second corner and lots of 76 00:04:33,320 --> 00:04:36,320 Speaker 2: specialists where you don't have to worry about that you 77 00:04:36,120 --> 00:04:41,560 Speaker 2: know you're on call. It's a different work requirement and 78 00:04:41,600 --> 00:04:46,440 Speaker 2: we want to reward people for that extra skill and responsibility, 79 00:04:46,960 --> 00:04:51,320 Speaker 2: and we are encouraging general practitioners with those skills to 80 00:04:51,440 --> 00:04:54,640 Speaker 2: stay in these country towns because the workforce for the 81 00:04:54,640 --> 00:05:01,440 Speaker 2: hospital is the general practitioner, a nurse practitioner level workforces 82 00:05:01,480 --> 00:05:04,479 Speaker 2: a city they can run without any GPS, so they've 83 00:05:04,480 --> 00:05:07,480 Speaker 2: just got their own workforce. But in country it's different. 84 00:05:07,640 --> 00:05:10,280 Speaker 1: Well, and then I guess it's even different again when 85 00:05:10,320 --> 00:05:12,960 Speaker 1: you go really quite remote into some of our remote 86 00:05:13,000 --> 00:05:16,599 Speaker 1: indigenous communities. But you know, particularly here in the likes 87 00:05:16,600 --> 00:05:20,160 Speaker 1: of the Northern Territory, is there any worry you know 88 00:05:20,200 --> 00:05:23,520 Speaker 1: that you might have doctors and nurse practitioners think, oh, 89 00:05:23,560 --> 00:05:26,159 Speaker 1: I'd really like to do a stint in a remote 90 00:05:26,160 --> 00:05:29,040 Speaker 1: place in the Northern Territory. But then you know they 91 00:05:29,080 --> 00:05:32,120 Speaker 1: get there, they realize just how remote they are, and 92 00:05:32,920 --> 00:05:34,760 Speaker 1: you know it can't sort of last the distance. 93 00:05:36,600 --> 00:05:39,359 Speaker 2: Look, that may well happen, but as I said, you 94 00:05:39,400 --> 00:05:41,960 Speaker 2: can't just do a fly in for a month or two. 95 00:05:42,960 --> 00:05:45,400 Speaker 2: To qualify for it, you have to make a commitment 96 00:05:45,440 --> 00:05:48,559 Speaker 2: at least twenty four hours a week for the year 97 00:05:48,800 --> 00:05:52,200 Speaker 2: and a minimum of two years. And you can remit 98 00:05:52,640 --> 00:05:59,200 Speaker 2: half or all of your hex step for your nursing 99 00:05:59,279 --> 00:06:02,600 Speaker 2: masters or for your medical degree. And they're not all 100 00:06:02,600 --> 00:06:05,960 Speaker 2: the same length. Some med degrees are a post grad 101 00:06:06,000 --> 00:06:08,719 Speaker 2: degree and they take four years, some are five and 102 00:06:08,760 --> 00:06:12,000 Speaker 2: some are six. And depending on where you are, if 103 00:06:12,040 --> 00:06:15,920 Speaker 2: you're in the interregional areas, but in the country. It's 104 00:06:16,040 --> 00:06:19,120 Speaker 2: one for one. You have to do six years to 105 00:06:19,120 --> 00:06:26,120 Speaker 2: get a full six year rebate relief. If you did 106 00:06:26,120 --> 00:06:28,880 Speaker 2: a four year degree, it to be four years. So 107 00:06:30,880 --> 00:06:34,279 Speaker 2: that's the principle. And from the doctors and the reception 108 00:06:34,440 --> 00:06:36,440 Speaker 2: that I've got, a lot of people think it will 109 00:06:36,480 --> 00:06:38,720 Speaker 2: shift the dial. We don't have to wait for them 110 00:06:38,720 --> 00:06:43,600 Speaker 2: to go through med school. They're registered early career doctors 111 00:06:43,640 --> 00:06:46,400 Speaker 2: that were after and we want them to stay and 112 00:06:46,520 --> 00:06:50,279 Speaker 2: play and raise their family and work as a highly 113 00:06:50,320 --> 00:06:56,120 Speaker 2: skilled professional. You're well supported by country towns and communities 114 00:06:56,200 --> 00:06:59,360 Speaker 2: love when they get a new doctor, and we are 115 00:06:59,400 --> 00:07:02,920 Speaker 2: trying to gives them an incentive so that the sliding 116 00:07:02,920 --> 00:07:06,640 Speaker 2: door moment when they think I've done my registrar job, 117 00:07:06,760 --> 00:07:09,400 Speaker 2: I'll go back to the city now, but will cause 118 00:07:09,440 --> 00:07:12,760 Speaker 2: them to say stop, oh okay, well I've got a partner, 119 00:07:13,320 --> 00:07:16,320 Speaker 2: young family coming along. Maybe I'll stay here. I get 120 00:07:16,360 --> 00:07:19,400 Speaker 2: rid of my hexstep and it will shift the dial. 121 00:07:19,400 --> 00:07:22,160 Speaker 2: It won't move everyone nice, it will move us living 122 00:07:22,160 --> 00:07:24,280 Speaker 2: an amount of people to make a big difference. 123 00:07:24,520 --> 00:07:26,800 Speaker 1: Yeah, do you have any you know, do you have 124 00:07:26,880 --> 00:07:29,160 Speaker 1: sort of any ambition when it comes to the number 125 00:07:29,160 --> 00:07:31,280 Speaker 1: of doctors that you are hoping or the number of 126 00:07:31,360 --> 00:07:34,440 Speaker 1: nurse practitioners that you are hoping hoping are going to 127 00:07:34,480 --> 00:07:37,480 Speaker 1: move to those regional and remote areas. There must be 128 00:07:37,640 --> 00:07:39,680 Speaker 1: quite a few positions I'm assuming that need to be 129 00:07:39,680 --> 00:07:41,960 Speaker 1: filled right around Australia. 130 00:07:42,080 --> 00:07:45,920 Speaker 2: Oh yes, yeah, depending on which state you're in. There 131 00:07:45,960 --> 00:07:50,480 Speaker 2: is a deficit in the Northern Territory. Some people go 132 00:07:50,560 --> 00:07:53,480 Speaker 2: there for a short stint or fly and fly out jobs, 133 00:07:53,760 --> 00:07:55,960 Speaker 2: but they won't be the beneficiaries of this. It'll be 134 00:07:56,000 --> 00:08:02,440 Speaker 2: the younger, early past registration young doctors who I think 135 00:08:02,480 --> 00:08:05,920 Speaker 2: will see the benefit. It's not only is it a 136 00:08:05,960 --> 00:08:08,720 Speaker 2: good financial deal, it's a good career deal because you'll 137 00:08:08,720 --> 00:08:13,520 Speaker 2: get amazing experience working in country hospitals and country general practice. 138 00:08:13,600 --> 00:08:16,840 Speaker 2: It's much more diverse and fascinating than it is when 139 00:08:16,840 --> 00:08:20,880 Speaker 2: you're back in central civilization in a metro practice. People 140 00:08:20,880 --> 00:08:24,960 Speaker 2: still get sick in the cities, not discounting the work 141 00:08:25,000 --> 00:08:27,640 Speaker 2: that gps do in the cities, But if you're practicing 142 00:08:27,680 --> 00:08:30,280 Speaker 2: in a country town, you've got so much more responsibility 143 00:08:30,280 --> 00:08:33,199 Speaker 2: and you've got to have another level of skills because 144 00:08:33,360 --> 00:08:36,000 Speaker 2: they all start off the same at med school and 145 00:08:36,040 --> 00:08:39,319 Speaker 2: as a junior doctor. But then if you stop doing 146 00:08:39,440 --> 00:08:44,439 Speaker 2: accent emergency and doing resuscitation or anesthetics your d skill. 147 00:08:44,760 --> 00:08:47,280 Speaker 2: Whereas if you're working in a country town or a 148 00:08:47,320 --> 00:08:49,800 Speaker 2: remote place in the Northern Church, you've got to be 149 00:08:49,840 --> 00:08:53,440 Speaker 2: able to call on those skills. Maybe not every morning 150 00:08:53,440 --> 00:08:58,360 Speaker 2: and afternoon, but it happens. Road crashes happen, heart attacks, sepsis, 151 00:08:58,400 --> 00:09:01,880 Speaker 2: all those things. They can all happen, but you're when 152 00:09:01,880 --> 00:09:03,000 Speaker 2: you're in a country town. 153 00:09:03,400 --> 00:09:05,560 Speaker 1: I'll be really interested to see, you know, if for 154 00:09:05,600 --> 00:09:08,400 Speaker 1: the Northern Territory it makes much of a difference come 155 00:09:08,679 --> 00:09:11,240 Speaker 1: next year and whether we do see some of those 156 00:09:11,280 --> 00:09:14,640 Speaker 1: young doctors or those those newly minted doctors and nurse 157 00:09:14,679 --> 00:09:18,440 Speaker 1: practitioners heading to the territory places like Catherine Alice Springs, 158 00:09:18,440 --> 00:09:21,640 Speaker 1: I'm assuming, and then our remote areas, whether you know, 159 00:09:21,679 --> 00:09:23,760 Speaker 1: whether it does mean that people sort of head out 160 00:09:23,920 --> 00:09:27,520 Speaker 1: to the regions and really sink their teeth into an 161 00:09:27,520 --> 00:09:28,360 Speaker 1: interesting job. 162 00:09:29,520 --> 00:09:32,439 Speaker 2: Yeah. Look, it will take a year or two to 163 00:09:32,480 --> 00:09:34,400 Speaker 2: get the full benefit because a lot of people have 164 00:09:34,559 --> 00:09:38,280 Speaker 2: planned what they're doing next year already. But we're making 165 00:09:38,320 --> 00:09:41,680 Speaker 2: it available and I'm hoping it won't just entice people, 166 00:09:41,800 --> 00:09:44,440 Speaker 2: it will keep people. Now because we do have a 167 00:09:44,480 --> 00:09:48,240 Speaker 2: cohort that's there already and they might have been thinking, whyko, 168 00:09:48,679 --> 00:09:52,719 Speaker 2: I'm going to go somewhere else, to Brisbane or you know, 169 00:09:52,920 --> 00:09:57,960 Speaker 2: to Woomba or somewhere bigger center. But this will this 170 00:09:58,040 --> 00:10:00,880 Speaker 2: will entice them to stay well. 171 00:10:01,000 --> 00:10:04,760 Speaker 1: David Gillespie, the Minister for Regional Health, I really appreciate 172 00:10:04,800 --> 00:10:06,599 Speaker 1: your time this morning. Thanks very much for having a 173 00:10:06,679 --> 00:10:07,080 Speaker 1: chat with me. 174 00:10:08,120 --> 00:10:09,120 Speaker 2: My pleasure, Katie. 175 00:10:09,240 --> 00:10:10,640 Speaker 1: Thank you. We'll talk again soon.