Speaker 1: This episode was recorded on Cameragle Land. Hi guys, and
Speaker 1: welcome back to another episode of Life on Cut. I'm Laura, I'm.
Speaker 2: Brittany, and you are pretty in pink today. Britt Oh,
Speaker 2: thank you?
Speaker 3: I am.
Speaker 1: I love it.
Speaker 4: How you pretend like we've not spoken about this?
Speaker 2: Thank you?
Speaker 3: Why I am head to toe in a pink knit?
Speaker 2: You're dressed in something that I would wear, which is
Speaker 2: why when I saw you, I was like, WHOA weird
Speaker 2: for you but cool for me.
Speaker 1: I'll have that when you get over it.
Speaker 3: It's not necessarily it's not necessarily weird for me, but
Speaker 3: I am trying to be more vibrant. So I am
Speaker 3: literally head to toe in like a very bright pink knit,
Speaker 3: long pants, high neck whatever. It's a nit stye great.
Speaker 3: Ben said to me, wow, babe. I was like, do
Speaker 3: you like my out? He goes, yeah, Wow, you look
Speaker 3: like Stiffler's mom. And I was like, what's I got
Speaker 3: it going on?
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's Stacy's mom, Stiffles's mom.
Speaker 3: God, And I was like Stiffler's mom as in from
Speaker 3: American Pie? Can I confirm? And he was like, yes,
Speaker 3: she was hot?
Speaker 1: That's fine?
Speaker 3: Was that Jennifer COOLi Yes, it was White Lotus. Yes,
Speaker 3: it was absolutely Jennifer COOLi. He's like, well, not obviously,
Speaker 3: He's like doubling down. He's like, obviously, like your face
Speaker 3: doesn't look like her. But and I was like, just
Speaker 3: stop it. I was like, I was vibing this and
Speaker 3: I wasn't going for Stiffleer's mom.
Speaker 2: But it doesn't matter if you're going for it. She
Speaker 2: would wear that. But you look good at it.
Speaker 3: Hey, speaking of white Lotus, now.
Speaker 1: Is that all we do? Now we're a White Lotus podcast?
Speaker 5: No?
Speaker 3: I want to tell you something because I am really
Speaker 3: into white Lotus like the rest of the world. But
Speaker 3: I found this so interesting. So my algorithm now on
Speaker 3: Instagram has started to feed me white Loadus stuff. I
Speaker 3: guess because we've been looking up a lot of stuff
Speaker 3: for things to discuss on the podcast. But I want
Speaker 3: to tell you what I discovered. So, do you know
Speaker 3: in White Lotus, the beautiful, quiet, young Ti girl that
Speaker 3: is falling in love with the other Thai worker that
Speaker 3: works in the heart the security guard.
Speaker 4: I think I'm about to say, yeah.
Speaker 3: So she's great, but she's not, Like do you really
Speaker 3: overly notice her? Is she a main character? All this stuff. No, Well,
Speaker 3: it turns out not only is she like one of
Speaker 3: the most famous people to ever have Grace's screens of
Speaker 3: White Loader, she's one of the most famous people in
Speaker 3: the world. She's like a K pop star, isn't she
Speaker 3: in the world? She's got one hundred and six million
Speaker 3: Instagram followers. Her name is Lala Lisa Mannible Manobile. I
Speaker 3: don't know if I've pronounced in her last name, mononymously
Speaker 3: known as just Lisa, and she is like uber uber famous.
Speaker 3: They almost couldn't cast her because the security that she
Speaker 3: needs personally to even go and film on set was astronomical,
Speaker 3: and I.
Speaker 4: Was so fascinated by that.
Speaker 2: It also just shows that we live in one paradigm
Speaker 2: of the world, you know, like our Western pop culture
Speaker 2: version of what life is like. That is just one
Speaker 2: version of what exists, and there are so many other
Speaker 2: celebrities and celebrity drama and gossip and everything else that's
Speaker 2: happening in a whole other side of the world that
Speaker 2: we're not tapped into.
Speaker 5: I even think it's like more on a micro level
Speaker 5: than that, Like when you go to awards and that
Speaker 5: kind of thing, and you can be sitting next to
Speaker 5: your best friend, and you're like, like, fame is so subjective,
Speaker 5: you know, like you can look at someone and be like, oh,
Speaker 5: my god, that's that person. And this happened for me
Speaker 5: when I went to the TikTok Awards and my friend
Speaker 5: Chantel was like, Oh, that's that creator or that's that person.
Speaker 5: I was like, I've never seen or heard of them,
Speaker 5: but I was really excited that doctor Carl was there.
Speaker 3: Kisha and I were Kish and I on the weekend
Speaker 3: were literally at dinner with at the f one and
Speaker 3: these two, like I guess there were influences, but we
Speaker 3: didn't really know. They seemed really nice, but they have
Speaker 3: like ten million followers each. At the end of the night,
Speaker 3: we were like, oh, we just I'm just not in that world.
Speaker 3: We don't know who you are. But what is even
Speaker 3: more interesting is Lisa this actress. You know what the
Speaker 3: Oscars like two weeks ago, where Margaret Qualley did that
Speaker 3: amazing dance to James Bond. Did you guys see that?
Speaker 3: Oh you're missing out? It was incredible. She'd a whole
Speaker 3: incredible performance.
Speaker 1: But Lisa this.
Speaker 3: Actress was like the main singer in that dance at
Speaker 3: the Oscars two weeks ago, and I think there's a
Speaker 3: lot of people that are connecting the dots now, like
Speaker 3: myself being like, oh my god, that's wild. But yeah,
Speaker 3: uber famous in the K pop world, So.
Speaker 1: There you go. That's what really niche thank you. I
Speaker 1: enjoyed it.
Speaker 3: It's actually not. It's like trending online at the moment.
Speaker 3: And if I am gobsmacked by that, I think a
Speaker 3: lot of other people.
Speaker 4: I'm trying to find out how I knew that.
Speaker 5: I think I heard it only last week, and I'm
Speaker 5: wondering if it's the same way that you found out.
Speaker 4: I think it might have been great to the radio
Speaker 4: producer told.
Speaker 3: Me, no, I saw it online. I'm just getting fed
Speaker 3: this stuff now.
Speaker 2: I just want to say one thing before we get
Speaker 2: into answering your questions. I would like to say thank
Speaker 2: you to every single person who validated my conversation from
Speaker 2: last week about exhaust fans and how much they triggered
Speaker 2: me and how much distress they caused me, because I mean,
Speaker 2: I'm not surprised.
Speaker 1: I knew that there was going.
Speaker 2: To be allies out there who also feel the same,
Speaker 2: who feel personally victimized by exhaust fans, but I wasn't
Speaker 2: expecting it to be quite as much. And every single
Speaker 2: day I get s reels by people who have made
Speaker 2: funny videos about how exhaust fans are triggering, and I'm
Speaker 2: here for it. So thank you, thank you, thank you,
Speaker 2: thank you, thank you for validating Laura, because Brittany didn't agree,
Speaker 2: and I just want to.
Speaker 3: Say, no, I did agree, but my I don't have
Speaker 3: an exhaust fan related I was like, do I like
Speaker 3: the sound? No, but it doesn't grind my gears enough
Speaker 3: to the fact that I would have to like leave
Speaker 3: the room.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I can't even think about it. It causes mistress.
Speaker 4: I also hate it equally as much as you. I
Speaker 4: so so feel this. But we did get one message
Speaker 4: that was saying, guys, it's not an exhaust fan. This
Speaker 4: is a range hood.
Speaker 1: Yeah, what's the difference?
Speaker 3: You know what I mean?
Speaker 1: Isn't that an exhaust fan?
Speaker 3: It is. It's just called arrange wood. They've been they're
Speaker 3: splitting straws there.
Speaker 1: I think it's splitting hairs.
Speaker 3: Can't you split a straw?
Speaker 1: Why would you? I'm pretty sure you slit straw.
Speaker 3: I'm googling let's do our vibes for the week.
Speaker 1: I have a podcast.
Speaker 2: I've started listening to, which I actually am so fascinated by.
Speaker 2: It is a little bit dark, so I do I
Speaker 2: mean it actually, I take that back. Like all my podcast,
Speaker 2: it's not a little bit dark.
Speaker 1: It's very dark. But it's called Lucky Boy. Have either
Speaker 1: of you seen it.
Speaker 3: I've listened to the whole thing.
Speaker 1: It's fascinating.
Speaker 2: So I'm only up to episode three at the moment,
Speaker 2: but it follows a man whose story he was deeply
Speaker 2: affected by child sexual assault from his teacher. So he
Speaker 2: was fourteen years old and he got into a relationship
Speaker 2: with his then twenty seven year old teacher, and it's
Speaker 2: this very fascinating discussion around who is allowed to be
Speaker 2: a victim and who is a perpetrator. The teacher in
Speaker 2: question never faced any repercussions for what she did, and
Speaker 2: there's so many discussions around whether he was the only child,
Speaker 2: whether there were more boys that she took advantage of,
Speaker 2: And it really shows how the system deeply fails boys
Speaker 2: because it is this expectation that because they're boys, that
Speaker 2: they can't possibly be victims of female perpetrators. I mean,
Speaker 2: as much as it is incredibly dark, like I'm enjoying
Speaker 2: the storytelling of it and the way that the podcast
Speaker 2: has been constructed.
Speaker 1: What was your thoughts of it?
Speaker 3: Well, the only thing I'll say is, because I've finished
Speaker 3: it and you haven't yet, is that the only thing
Speaker 3: that you said was incorrect because you haven't got there yet.
Speaker 3: Is she is held accountable. But it takes far longer
Speaker 3: and it's more of a roundabout way.
Speaker 1: Legally though was there prison time or anything, Because.
Speaker 3: I won't give it away, but there are repercussions, not
Speaker 3: to the level that there should be one hundred percent
Speaker 3: will say that. I think it was also a bit
Speaker 3: of a product of the time because this man now
Speaker 3: is in his maybe his forties, and it's nearly forty yer.
Speaker 3: It's taken him a long time to realize what happened
Speaker 3: to him was in fact assault, whereas at the time
Speaker 3: it's called lucky boy because everyone was like, Wow, you're
Speaker 3: so lucky, You're banging the teacher kind of thing. But
Speaker 3: it took him a long time. And then when he
Speaker 3: starts to realize that maybe there were other people and
Speaker 3: it really affected who he was, he decides to go
Speaker 3: and advocate for himself. But it was like, oh, let's
Speaker 3: just get rid of this teacher and sweep it under
Speaker 3: the carpet, but it's fascinating.
Speaker 2: So she went on to work at so many other schools.
Speaker 2: I think it was like seventeen schools. It establishes that
Speaker 2: she moves throughout her career, and it's insinuated at the
Speaker 2: point that I am at that she continued this molestation
Speaker 2: throughout her career, and there was so many other boys
Speaker 2: who are affected by this. I also think it's very
Speaker 2: interesting because Gareth is now a forty year old man,
Speaker 2: but he has dealt with mental health struggles throughout his
Speaker 2: entire life, and he has dealt with trying to make
Speaker 2: sense of what happened to him when he was a
Speaker 2: really little kid, and he asked the questions like would
Speaker 2: I be this person had that not happened to me?
Speaker 2: And he never has has received that sort of validation.
Speaker 2: It is definitely fascinating, very dark, but I really think
Speaker 2: it's an important listen because it rewires exactly that that
Speaker 2: question about who is a victim and who is a perpetrator,
Speaker 2: and why do we see boys and young girls who
Speaker 2: are the same age differently, and why do we see
Speaker 2: female and male perpetrators differently? So it's called lucky Boy
Speaker 2: it's being created by Tortoise Media and it is a
Speaker 2: four part podcast.
Speaker 1: It's fantastic.
Speaker 3: Yeah, can definitely recommend that. My recommendation this week is
Speaker 3: something that is I mean everyone is talking about it online.
Speaker 3: It is one of the best TV shows that has
Speaker 3: come out of Britain or anywhere in a decade.
Speaker 4: It is so good.
Speaker 3: It's called Adolescence. It's a four part series. The reason
Speaker 3: it has been so highly spoken about is not only
Speaker 3: the themes it explores, but the brilliance in the acting,
Speaker 3: the writing, the plot, the meaning and the way it
Speaker 3: was filmed. So each episode is shot in one shot,
Speaker 3: one continuous shot, and it's quite incredible to go on
Speaker 3: the journey. So when they start to the end, so
Speaker 3: an hour worth of shooting, which is probably like half
Speaker 3: a day really, it is one shot on every single character.
Speaker 3: The people that needed to work on it, so like
Speaker 3: other assistant producers, cameraman are dressed up so that when
Speaker 3: the cameras go past them it looks like they're also
Speaker 3: in the scene even though they're doing their job. And
Speaker 3: it centers around this thirteen year old British boy who
Speaker 3: murders a female classmate. It's co written and he also
Speaker 3: acts in it and produces it. By a man called
Speaker 3: Stephen Graham and his purpose of it. He was sitting
Speaker 3: at home one day and he opened up the newspaper
Speaker 3: and he saw this young British teenage boy had murdered
Speaker 3: a girl. He'd stabbed her. Turned on the TV another
Speaker 3: part of the country, a young teenage boy had stabbed
Speaker 3: and murdered a girl. This had happened multiple times, and
Speaker 3: there's a real problem in Britain at the moment with
Speaker 3: male violence, Like we know it's everywhere, but seventeen percent
Speaker 3: of male violence last year in Britain had happened between
Speaker 3: ten and seventeen year olds. And he is decided, He's like,
Speaker 3: oh my god, I am a father. I am going
Speaker 3: to highlight the impact that people like Andrew Tate, that
Speaker 3: things like social media and the external pressures and online
Speaker 3: pressures are having on our teenagers. And it shows it
Speaker 3: in every aspect. It shows it from the parents and
Speaker 3: a really stable family home. So it's trying to intentionally
Speaker 3: highlight that a lot of problems don't necessarily come from
Speaker 3: unstable family homes, like they have a really loving mother
Speaker 3: and father. It goes and highlights the school system, the
Speaker 3: issues that are happening there, and in this particular show,
Speaker 3: a lot of the issues have come and stemmed from
Speaker 3: online social media exposure. It is brilliant and there. It
Speaker 3: is one hundred percent on Rotten Tomatoes. Is not one
Speaker 3: person that has written anything bad about it. It is
Speaker 3: going to be the most award winning show of the year.
Speaker 3: I cannot recommend enough. The only thing I'll say is
Speaker 3: you get a bit motion sickness when you're watching it
Speaker 3: because the cameras continue a shot, they are running, they
Speaker 3: are flying, following people. It's truly incredible in every single aspect.
Speaker 3: I haven't felt this strongly about something in a really
Speaker 3: long time.
Speaker 1: Where's it available.
Speaker 3: It's Netflix. It's for four episodes. It would probably be
Speaker 3: number one at the moment if you had a look.
Speaker 3: So it's a pretty easy watch in terms of its
Speaker 3: bite size, quick four episodes. I watched it in one
Speaker 3: night because I just became obsessed with it.
Speaker 5: My vibe for this week is one of the most
Speaker 5: beautiful interviews I have listened to. I would say maybe ever,
Speaker 5: it's something that I know I'm going to think about
Speaker 5: in the weeks to months to maybe even years to come,
Speaker 5: and it was on Inherited Podcasts, which is by Shameless Media,
Speaker 5: and it's the interview with Michelle Andrews. So Michelle being
Speaker 5: one of the co founders of Shameless, she is also
Speaker 5: a friend of all of ours, and it was such
Speaker 5: a moving conversation. So it's Ruby who interviewed her, and
Speaker 5: I know that you've been uninherited as well. In this episode,
Speaker 5: Michelle spoke so beautifully about this friendship that she had
Speaker 5: with Zara, and to be honest at actually, there were
Speaker 5: a lot of parallels that I could draw between your
Speaker 5: friendship and my friendship with the two of you, because
Speaker 5: it's quite a unique dynamic where you.
Speaker 1: You know, you guys started a business together.
Speaker 5: Obviously Michelle and Zara did as well, and they have
Speaker 5: this really deep friendship where they are so supportive of
Speaker 5: each other, plus being business partners, and so for us
Speaker 5: it was like plus working together. And I loved the
Speaker 5: way that she spoke about her friendship with Zara and
Speaker 5: just how pure and how supportive of each other they are,
Speaker 5: and just how unique it is to find a friendship
Speaker 5: that is that true. She also spoke about her and
Speaker 5: Mitchard's that's her husband, are their fertility challenges and kind
Speaker 5: of their road to pregnancy, and that obviously was something
Speaker 5: that she spoke about a lot in their Glass podcast.
Speaker 5: But then the last part of the conversation, and the
Speaker 5: part that I feel like I could even hear up
Speaker 5: thinking about it, was her speaking about her mumd being
Speaker 5: diagnosed with incurable brain cancer. And there was a particularly
Speaker 5: you know, fascinating part to this story where she was
Speaker 5: diagnosed with the type of cancer that Belle Gibson claimed
Speaker 5: to have had, and it was kind of all at
Speaker 5: the same time that apple side of Vinegar was thrust
Speaker 5: into the spotlight, and her mom just sounds like the
Speaker 5: most incredible person. She sounds like this person who has
Speaker 5: had such a fulfilled life, and Michelle shares a lot
Speaker 5: of what her mom has taught her in this episode.
Speaker 5: And that's why I think I'm gonna kind of think
Speaker 5: about it. I feel so emotional thinking about it. Was
Speaker 5: just such a beautiful conversation, the way that Michelle speaks
Speaker 5: about her mom and the impact that her mum has had,
Speaker 5: especially at a time where you know, she's pregnant and
Speaker 5: it just seems as though these very cruel situation has
Speaker 5: happened at also one of the most beautiful times in
Speaker 5: her life and how that's going to kind of impact her.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I feel silly for getting emotional.
Speaker 4: It was, Michelle.
Speaker 1: I hope that you hear this.
Speaker 4: It was one of the most beautiful conversations I have
Speaker 4: ever listened to.
Speaker 3: I agree, and I think I'm doing a lot of
Speaker 3: self reflection even just listening to those conversations. And something
Speaker 3: that she said the other day, she said she asked
Speaker 3: her mum to put a bucket list, like, write a
Speaker 3: bucket list down. Now, I'm gonna get emotion, you know,
Speaker 3: tell me what you want to do in this life
Speaker 3: and I'll make it happen. And the whole bucket list
Speaker 3: was the most mundane.
Speaker 1: Everyday things.
Speaker 3: I just want to go to the park with the
Speaker 3: dogs and my grandkids, things that she can do every day.
Speaker 3: And then Michelle was like, Wow, you are the definition
Speaker 3: of success because your bucket list is already the life
Speaker 3: you live. Yeah, And I was like, that's what that's
Speaker 3: what people strive for. Yeah, So I agree. Beautiful conversation
Speaker 3: and if Michelle does listen to this, You've got all
Speaker 3: of our love here.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 5: Yeah. So that's inherited podcast. The episode most recent one
Speaker 5: with Michelle Andrews.
Speaker 3: Question number one. I'm venturing back into dating as a
Speaker 3: single girl in her early thirties after a very toxic
Speaker 3: relationship ending a few months ago. I also found out
Speaker 3: last year that I am unable to have my own
Speaker 3: children due to some very bad healthy sh shoes. This
Speaker 3: was devastating, as I always saw myself being a mum
Speaker 3: one day. My question is at what stage do I
Speaker 3: disclose this to potential partners A couple of dates in
Speaker 3: it just feels really heavy, and most people I meet
Speaker 3: seem to want kids, so I'm mindful of wasting their time,
Speaker 3: but I'm unsure how to approach this.
Speaker 2: This is so I mean, we talked about this just beforehand,
Speaker 2: and this is such a hard one to answer because
Speaker 2: I understand on one hand, like, firstly, I'm so sorry
Speaker 2: that you're going through this, Like it's an incredibly hard
Speaker 2: thing that you're having to process for yourself and.
Speaker 3: That you never expect when you grow up. You never
Speaker 3: think that that's going to be you.
Speaker 2: Yeah, But then also being in this state where you're like,
Speaker 2: am I stopping someone from having something that they want
Speaker 2: in their life? And then when do I need to
Speaker 2: tell them about my health? Or medical or whatever it
Speaker 2: is issues that I'm having. I don't think it's a
Speaker 2: couple of dates in I don't think that you owe
Speaker 2: it to someone straight away that you need to tell
Speaker 2: them that you're not able to have kids. And I
Speaker 2: say this because yes, you may not be able to
Speaker 2: carry children, but it doesn't mean that you don't want
Speaker 2: to have children, and it doesn't mean that you don't
Speaker 2: want to have kids. It would be a different conversation
Speaker 2: if you'd said, I found out that I'm not able
Speaker 2: to carry children and I don't want to have them
Speaker 2: at all because of that reason. Then I think it's
Speaker 2: okay to speak about it to people and find someone
Speaker 2: who's aligned in not wanting to have children. It just
Speaker 2: means your journey towards becoming a mother is going to
Speaker 2: be harder and more intentional than what other people's might
Speaker 2: have to be. So I would say it's definitely a
Speaker 2: conversation that needs to be had, but I don't think
Speaker 2: you need to have it until you're invested in that relationship,
Speaker 2: Like until you're sure that there's something worth putting your time,
Speaker 2: your energy, and your focus into and they've shown you
Speaker 2: that they're also equally as interested in you, and yes,
Speaker 2: maybe they might want children, but they also want you
Speaker 2: and to be with you and to have, you know,
Speaker 2: some sort of relationship with you. Then I think I
Speaker 2: would be approaching it, but I don't think I would
Speaker 2: be offering it up as a conversation on the third day.
Speaker 3: I feel a little bit differently, Laura. I think that
Speaker 3: you don't. I wouldn't be waiting until I'm invested and
Speaker 3: they're invested. I don't think it's a conversation that you
Speaker 3: have to voluntarily offer that information up before it's a conversation.
Speaker 3: But if it does come up, which it often does
Speaker 3: early in dating, if it does come up and there
Speaker 3: is a question that is posed to you, Hey, how
Speaker 3: do you feel about kids?
Speaker 1: Do you want kids?
Speaker 3: I think that that is when the conversation does have
Speaker 3: to come up, because also you want to weed these
Speaker 3: people out from the start, and if they've asked you,
Speaker 3: you can't lie because that's not going to end well either.
Speaker 3: So I don't think you have to be invested, but
Speaker 3: I think it's a positive thing for you to have
Speaker 3: that conversation quite early on, because they're going to show
Speaker 3: you who they are and what they want and what
Speaker 3: they're okay with from the beginning. And if someone says,
Speaker 3: well I only want my own biological kids, or I
Speaker 3: only want my person to be able to carry their
Speaker 3: child or whatever else, that's going to show you who
Speaker 3: they are and that that person is absolutely not right for.
Speaker 2: You, I totally agree with you, completely brew it. I
Speaker 2: don't think, though, that you have to go into it
Speaker 2: being like I have something I have to tell you. No,
Speaker 2: I don't voluntarily admit to you. Know, you haven't done
Speaker 2: anything wrong. You're not stopped them from anything in their life,
Speaker 2: and it's because it's something that you know is a
Speaker 2: part of your life, and that's a conversation that has
Speaker 2: to be had. I don't think it has to be
Speaker 2: met with like I'm a burden. And that might be
Speaker 2: how you feel at the moment, because it's still something
Speaker 2: that you're processing. And especially when you say, you know,
Speaker 2: so many people I meet they want to have kids,
Speaker 2: and so I feel like I have this responsibility to
Speaker 2: disclose it to them. I think the way that you've
Speaker 2: just described it, brit takes that burden, that responsibility away
Speaker 2: a little bit, like, yeah, I do really want to
Speaker 2: have kids, but you know, I've had a lot of
Speaker 2: health issues around this, and it's for me.
Speaker 1: It's not going to be a clear and easy route.
Speaker 2: So I need someone who's willing to go on that
Speaker 2: journey with me to have children, like whatever that looks
Speaker 2: like in our future. Yeah, I think that that is
Speaker 2: an okay conversation, But I definitely don't think you owe
Speaker 2: it to someone to give your medical history or to
Speaker 2: give anything about yourself until you're at a point where
Speaker 2: you're ready. However, that said, you definitely can't wait until
Speaker 2: they're like one year two years deep and invested and
Speaker 2: they've been talking about how they want kids this whole time,
Speaker 2: and then you turn around and go, oh, actually, sorry
Speaker 2: forgot to tell you. Didn't want to tell you, didn't
Speaker 2: know how to tell you. I've known this thing for
Speaker 2: forever and I just didn't share it with you because
Speaker 2: that I think would build a lot of resentment in
Speaker 2: your relationships.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I genuinely think we don't have to overthink this
Speaker 3: one in a way, And I don't want that to
Speaker 3: be insensitive, but I think it's best for you to say, hey, like,
Speaker 3: this is my situation. So if someone says hey to
Speaker 3: you on kids, you're like, yeah, actually, I really really
Speaker 3: do Unfortunately I can't actually carry my own so it
Speaker 3: might be or have my own. Sorry, you haven't actually
Speaker 3: said Carrie, You've just said have so I don't know
Speaker 3: what your situation is. Maybe that means biologically you can't
Speaker 3: have your own children and it will look different for you.
Speaker 3: But I do think it's a conversation that if it
Speaker 3: is brought up, that you just say it and you
Speaker 3: don't say it with a way where it's like you're
Speaker 3: apologizing to them or anything like that, because it is
Speaker 3: just a part of who you are and your journey
Speaker 3: and your story and your body, and that is it.
Speaker 3: That's a part of your package. And I don't think
Speaker 3: that's anything to feel shameful or be embarrassed for. Or
Speaker 3: I hate the fact that you're even overthinking it now
Speaker 3: and it's probably giving you a level of anxiety, Like God,
Speaker 3: when do I tell a potential partner you're thinking about it?
Speaker 2: A lot for you to written this in Yeah, but
Speaker 2: I understand why it's so totally I do too. You
Speaker 2: know there are going to be people out there. I mean,
Speaker 2: you haven't said whether you're in a heterosexual relationship or not,
Speaker 2: but there's going to be people who and I'm saying,
Speaker 2: I'm guessing because otherwise, you know, you'd be able to
Speaker 2: figure it out. There will be men who having children
Speaker 2: is a number one priority for them. They want to
Speaker 2: be a dad, they want to have kids, and that's
Speaker 2: going to be something that you will find out pretty
Speaker 2: early on in the conversations, you know, like, and you
Speaker 2: will know that maybe that's not someone who there's going
Speaker 2: to be a great potential in pursuing a relationship with.
Speaker 2: But you will also meet other people who are like, yeah,
Speaker 2: I've thought about the idea of kids. I'm not sure,
Speaker 2: like you know, haven't met the right person for it yet.
Speaker 2: People's perspective on whether or not they want to be parents.
Speaker 2: Not everybody's idea is fixed, and a lot of people
Speaker 2: aren't one hundred percent sure, and their willingness and excitement
Speaker 2: around having kids really kind of kicks into gear when
Speaker 2: they find someone who they want to do it with,
Speaker 2: you know, Whereas like, I know a lot of people
Speaker 2: have had the conversations of like, yes, the idea of
Speaker 2: having kids is something that I would like to explore,
Speaker 2: but I want to be with you more, you know,
Speaker 2: like that's and I mean, that's something that you talking
Speaker 2: about like those relationships absolutely exist. So I don't think
Speaker 2: that you should like disclude yourself or think that like
Speaker 2: dating is going to be so much harder for you
Speaker 2: in finding someone because of this and because of what
Speaker 2: you're going through. So I mean, I'm so sorry that
Speaker 2: it is something that you have to navigate. And I
Speaker 2: don't in any way want to make out that it's
Speaker 2: not a huge deal, because it is for you, clearly,
Speaker 2: But I just don't think that you owe a responsibility
Speaker 2: to anyone that early on in dating.
Speaker 3: You just don't yeah or involuntarily like you don't need
Speaker 3: to bring it up as if like, hey, I have
Speaker 3: something I need to admit, I need to tell you something.
Speaker 3: You know, I've got a year to live, Like, it's
Speaker 3: just a part of who you are, and there's so
Speaker 3: many people who are in the exact same situation. So
Speaker 3: and I hope you're not listening to this thinking that
Speaker 3: we're diminishing it or your feelings, because we're absolutely not.
Speaker 3: I just don't want you to feel shame embarrassment about
Speaker 3: it and going to dating like you are the burden,
Speaker 3: because you're absolutely not.
Speaker 1: All right. Question number two.
Speaker 2: My boyfriend's best friend has a great partner and three
Speaker 2: kids who have become a big part of our life.
Speaker 2: We always saw them as the perfect family until two
Speaker 2: months ago when we found out that he's been cheating
Speaker 2: for over a year and got a girl pregnant. Of course,
Speaker 2: pregante Jesus. His partner was the one who told us
Speaker 2: and asked us not to say anything. She is a
Speaker 2: very proud person and was obviously a mess. I supported
Speaker 2: her and of course trying to say all the right things.
Speaker 2: But nearly three months later, she's just still with him,
Speaker 2: seemingly in denial, while he acts like nothing happened. My
Speaker 2: boyfriend and I are struggling with all the lies as
Speaker 2: he used their friendship to cover his tracks multiple times.
Speaker 2: Do I keep being friends with them and pretend this
Speaker 2: didn't cause so much hurt? I'm worried we will lose
Speaker 2: these kids because we have hardly seen them since all
Speaker 2: this has happened. I think she's saying, like, the connection
Speaker 2: with the children, yeah, and we really just don't know
Speaker 2: what to do.
Speaker 1: Advice please?
Speaker 4: What a dick?
Speaker 3: Nob This takes a different level on We often have
Speaker 3: conversations about I don't agree with my friend's morals. They're cheating,
Speaker 3: What do I do do I have to be around them?
Speaker 3: I don't like my friend's partner. This is a little
Speaker 3: bit different because not only do you not agree with
Speaker 3: what your friends are doing or what he has done,
Speaker 3: but he's also used your friendship to do it.
Speaker 1: He has used you as the excuse.
Speaker 3: Hey, I'm going to catch up with Brian today. I'm
Speaker 3: going away for the weekend with Brian, whatever it is. Meanwhile,
Speaker 3: I'm assuming Brian has no knowledge, because if your husband
Speaker 3: did know that he was the reason, or he was
Speaker 3: the excuse and he went along with it, that's adding
Speaker 3: another layer. So I'm going to assume he didn't know
Speaker 3: he was the excuse. But then you got to think
Speaker 3: if you were going to use a really close friend
Speaker 3: as an excuse, surely you would be telling them in
Speaker 3: case it came up in conversation, Hey, just so you
Speaker 3: know I was with you this weekend.
Speaker 2: No, because there's so much secrecy and shame obviously, like
Speaker 2: he's cheating, he can't then say to his friend, Hey,
Speaker 2: I'm using you as an alibi because I'm fucking this
Speaker 2: other person.
Speaker 1: But they probably would be people that do It.
Speaker 2: Was just a terrible mess of a situation where he
Speaker 2: was on all fronts in order to get away with
Speaker 2: what he was doing.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think it's difficult with the kid aspect too.
Speaker 3: It's easy to pull yourself away from a friendship if
Speaker 3: it doesn't serve you anymore. But when you have an
Speaker 3: attachment and you've said you're very close to their kids,
Speaker 3: almost sounds like you've got that like auntie, uncle god
Speaker 3: parent relationship and they've become a really integral part of
Speaker 3: your life, it is harder to extract yourself from that.
Speaker 3: But what I will say is if you despise him
Speaker 3: and are so disgusted by him that much, then you
Speaker 3: can't force that friendship. You can't fake that. You can't
Speaker 3: fake being around them. Doesn't mean you have to lose
Speaker 3: your friendship with her, but I do think it's a
Speaker 3: discussion that you need to tell her, like, Hey, I'm
Speaker 3: really I'm really struggling. I'm going to support you if
Speaker 3: you want to stay because you've made the decision. Maybe
Speaker 3: they've made the decision to work through it for the
Speaker 3: family and for the kids, but.
Speaker 4: You still have to be okay with it. You still
Speaker 4: get to choose the people that.
Speaker 3: You have in your life and that who you hang
Speaker 3: around with totally.
Speaker 2: I think that this is a really, really hard one
Speaker 2: because the reality is your friendship has changed. Regardless of
Speaker 2: whether you talk about it or you don't talk about it.
Speaker 2: Your friendship's change because he's not the person that you
Speaker 2: thought he was. He doesn't behave in a way that's
Speaker 2: congruent with the morals and the ethics and everything else
Speaker 2: that you have in your relationship. And because he's not
Speaker 2: talked about it at all, like by the sounds of things,
Speaker 2: he's just never said anything like she's spoken about it
Speaker 2: to you, but he's just pretended like nahhing has happened.
Speaker 2: There's no accountability, you're not seeing any remorse. So therefore
Speaker 2: it makes you question his intentions even more. I would say,
Speaker 2: in this instance, if you were ever going to even
Speaker 2: remotely salvage this friendship, a conversation probably has to happen
Speaker 2: between your husband and his friend. Like I think you've
Speaker 2: obviously had many conversations with the wife, I think a
Speaker 2: conversation needs to happen between those two. But I also
Speaker 2: do think that if his wife wants to pretend like
Speaker 2: this didn't happen, and she wants to stay in that relationship,
Speaker 2: and they're just brushing everything under the carpet. There is
Speaker 2: absolutely nothing that the two of you can do about that,
Speaker 2: like that's their prerogative to do. So, however, it is
Speaker 2: understandable that it's changed your perspective on their relationship and
Speaker 2: also on the friendship, because you know you can no
Speaker 2: longer just happily go out on your couple dates and
Speaker 2: both be talking about, you know, like how great you are,
Speaker 2: aware you're at all like the things that's happening in
Speaker 2: your life, because all you're thinking is you're a fucking liar.
Speaker 2: You've been having an affair free year, and you've got
Speaker 2: another woman pregnant, Like I don't know you, I don't
Speaker 2: know who the person is. And this is the thing
Speaker 2: about cheating, It's like it doesn't just affect the person
Speaker 2: who's in the relationship. Of course, it affects that person
Speaker 2: the most, but it affects everything. It affects all your
Speaker 2: friendship groups, and there's so much repair work that needs
Speaker 2: to be done, not just with your partner, that with
Speaker 2: all the people who you're lying affects, and like the
Speaker 2: friendships that it deteriorates as well.
Speaker 3: I would also try, if you haven't yet, to really
Speaker 3: talk to your friend and understand why she's staying and
Speaker 3: what level they've gotten to, and try and understand his actions.
Speaker 3: What has he done to repair the situation after is
Speaker 3: he put in a lot of effort, Because sometimes we
Speaker 3: can feel a bit of an ick for our friends
Speaker 3: or a level of discuss for our friends when they
Speaker 3: are staying in a situation that we can't understand why.
Speaker 3: And maybe that is what is happening to a level
Speaker 3: here because you're like, Wow, three months later, she's in denial,
Speaker 3: She's just there. I can't believe it. Yeah, yeah, I
Speaker 3: think you need to understand why and what she's going through.
Speaker 3: It's not always black and white, and leaving a situation
Speaker 3: sometimes is really hard. They have kids and they've been
Speaker 3: married and they're together. So I would try and understand
Speaker 3: see where she's at, still continue to support her before
Speaker 3: you make any drastic decisions. Yes, this is about you
Speaker 3: as well, but indirectly it's more directly about what your
Speaker 3: friend is going through at the moment.
Speaker 2: I mean, and also you know she might be a
Speaker 2: very private person, but there's no way that she's just
Speaker 2: brushed this under the rug in terms of her own relationship,
Speaker 2: like she is suffering yeah, three months on finding out
Speaker 2: the husband's had an affair for a year and got
Speaker 2: another woman pregnant, Like, she is suffering, and she is
Speaker 2: suffering quietly, And it may be because she no longer
Speaker 2: wants to share with you how she's feeling, because she's
Speaker 2: made the decision that she wants to stay. But that
Speaker 2: doesn't mean that she's in a place of like denial
Speaker 2: or pretending like it didn't happen. It just means that
Speaker 2: she's humiliated, Like this is a truly humiliating thing to
Speaker 2: go through finding this out. I'm so interested, Like, is
Speaker 2: the person who we got pregnant having the baby?
Speaker 3: Like, yeah, is he going to be in there life?
Speaker 2: How do you just brush this under the carpet and
Speaker 2: pretend like it didn't happen, Like I mean for an aftermath, like,
Speaker 2: please tell us if he's going through with it. I
Speaker 2: also think as well, the only thing I want to
Speaker 2: add to this is three months later, it's still very fresh,
Speaker 2: Like we don't know how this is going to pan
Speaker 2: out in the long term. I would say, do what
Speaker 2: you can to still be a part of the kid's life,
Speaker 2: but I think for your own preservation and if you
Speaker 2: really do just have, like you said, Britt, the ick
Speaker 2: or like a disgust for your friendship without having a
Speaker 2: conversation to try and repair it, and without there being
Speaker 2: some sort of level of accountability or understanding or even
Speaker 2: like some showing of remorse from him, It's almost impossible
Speaker 2: for you, guys to sit down with him and think
Speaker 2: like that he's the person that you once did because
Speaker 2: you're opinions of him have forever changed.
Speaker 3: And also, like we always say, put your own oxygen
Speaker 3: mark gone first and you're most important, And I mean
Speaker 3: I believe that in a lot of aspects. But in
Speaker 3: this situation, of course, you're going to do what is
Speaker 3: right for you if it's troubling you the friendship and
Speaker 3: you don't want to be in anymore. But at the
Speaker 3: end of the day, the core part of a friendship
Speaker 3: is that you are there for a person when they
Speaker 3: go through their ups and downs. So I would hate
Speaker 3: for your immediate response to be, hey, I'm not going
Speaker 3: to be a part of this anymore. I feel like
Speaker 3: your immediate response needs to be there for your friend,
Speaker 3: try to understand her and support her, and then make
Speaker 3: your decisions on what you want to do with that friendship.
Speaker 3: As a whole.
Speaker 1: It's hard though, isn't it.
Speaker 2: It's hard though when you're like, I want to be
Speaker 2: there for her, but he's not outwardly taking accountability. And
Speaker 2: the thing is is with cheating, right, when someone doesn't
Speaker 2: take accountability in more ways than just with their partner,
Speaker 2: like other people knowing, then there isn't social accountability, right.
Speaker 2: It's like he gets to go on and save face
Speaker 2: and everyone still think he's just this perfect guy, and
Speaker 2: there hasn't been any sort of like showing up in
Speaker 2: terms of like show going up truthfully in your.
Speaker 1: Relationships, brit I have a question for you.
Speaker 2: Have you ever been in a situation where you're friends
Speaker 2: with someone and someone's cheated or you found out something
Speaker 2: about someone that changed your opinion of them and change
Speaker 2: the trajectory of the friendship.
Speaker 3: I have had friends in the past that have cheated
Speaker 3: on their partners, so they were my friend that did
Speaker 3: the wrong thing, and I maintained those friendships with them.
Speaker 3: I didn't agree with it, but I really tried to
Speaker 3: understand the why and what are they going to do
Speaker 3: about it afterwards? And where is that going to go?
Speaker 3: You know, because that's the important thing for me. I
Speaker 3: just would hate in this situation for you to end
Speaker 3: your friendship because of something that your friend's husband did.
Speaker 3: That's where it comes down to me. I think there's
Speaker 3: maybe there needs to be some lines drawn in the
Speaker 3: sand before you make these really big life altering decisions
Speaker 3: if they are a really good friend, because part of
Speaker 3: friendships is you're not always going to agree with what
Speaker 3: your friend does, but you do need to be there
Speaker 3: for them in the rough parts. Otherwise, what is the
Speaker 3: point of a friendship. Your friendship's not only there for
Speaker 3: the highs and the fakeness and the really top surface
Speaker 3: level stuff.
Speaker 1: Lots of people go.
Speaker 3: Through really traumatic things and that's when you do need friends.
Speaker 3: So maybe you need to dig a little bit deep
Speaker 3: with her before you make these decisions. That's my only Yeah,
Speaker 3: my only worries you were going to pull away from
Speaker 3: something that he did, which isn't necessarily fair on her.
Speaker 2: Yeah, But I think about this, and like when I
Speaker 2: think about my past relationships, we you know, when I
Speaker 2: was with my ex who cheated, we had couples that
Speaker 2: we were friends, like my friends. They were our couple friends,
Speaker 2: you know, when it kind of because I would obviously
Speaker 2: go to my friend and I would tell her what
Speaker 2: had happened. And then a couple of months later, like
Speaker 2: I was in repair mode because I'd gone back to
Speaker 2: him and everything else, and we didn't have kids, Like
Speaker 2: we didn't have those things that make it even harder
Speaker 2: to leave. They got to a point where my friends
Speaker 2: didn't respect him, and like my friend's partners didn't respect him,
Speaker 2: so like we went from being able to hang out
Speaker 2: as like a couple friends to my friends and their
Speaker 2: partners being like, I want fucking nothing to do with him.
Speaker 1: He's a flog, and like that really affected my friendship.
Speaker 2: Then it forced me into a situation where I had
Speaker 2: to choose my relationship over my friendships. And like, now,
Speaker 2: you know, obviously, years later, I've done the repair work
Speaker 2: and I'm still friends with everyone, and I can look
Speaker 2: back and go, that was a terrible situation. But I
Speaker 2: just so feel for this woman who's trying to keep
Speaker 2: her family together totally. She's trying to keep a family together,
Speaker 2: and she has a partner who seemingly is not taking responsibility,
Speaker 2: and I just don't know how this is going to
Speaker 2: pan out for everyone.
Speaker 3: All Right, let's talk Hall Passes. My partner of seven
Speaker 3: years has asked what I would think of having a
Speaker 3: whole pass for one night with a complete random We're
Speaker 3: twenty five, and he says he would like to experience
Speaker 3: other sexual partners. Since we've been together since we were eighteen.
Speaker 3: I am not opposed to the idea, and I have
Speaker 3: thought about it before. He has said it would be
Speaker 3: with a stranger and only once, and we would never
Speaker 3: tell each other the when, where, who, why, what once
Speaker 3: we had done it. I am leaning towards a yes,
Speaker 3: but have an underlying fear that our relationship wouldn't be
Speaker 3: the same afterwards. He is one hundred percent of my penguin,
Speaker 3: and I believe we will last a lifetime for sure.
Speaker 3: I guess my question for you is is this a
Speaker 3: reasonable request? And what boundaries would you put in place
Speaker 3: around it.
Speaker 2: This is fascinating and I think look could be great,
Speaker 2: could be playing with fire. My only question is, and
Speaker 2: the only thing that feels like it wouldn't align with
Speaker 2: me if I was going to open up my relationship,
Speaker 2: because obviously everyone does this shit differently, and I think
Speaker 2: your best bet would be actually to speak to people
Speaker 2: and to do some research on people who have successfully
Speaker 2: opened and closed their relationship. None of us, the three
Speaker 2: of us have had experiences where we have successfully navigated
Speaker 2: open relationships and then close that relationship again. We can
Speaker 2: have our opinions, but like, don't go have skin in
Speaker 2: the game.
Speaker 1: Put it that way.
Speaker 2: My only thing though that worries me is you say
Speaker 2: we will never speak about when, where, or once we
Speaker 2: have done it. That means that to you and mentally
Speaker 2: and emotionally, that relationship is then open because you have
Speaker 2: no caveat as to when it has happened and when
Speaker 2: it is now closed again. And I think that that's
Speaker 2: very dangerous for a monogamous relationship if that's what you
Speaker 2: want as your end goal, because who's to say that
Speaker 2: it has happened, Who's to say that it's still happening?
Speaker 2: And also, if it has happened, who's to say it's
Speaker 2: not going to happen again? If he never has to
Speaker 2: have a conversation around the parameters of which the rules are.
Speaker 3: I totally understand the way he's feeling. I want to
Speaker 3: start by saying that it's pretty normal to have these
Speaker 3: feelings of is the grass greener? What are other experiences
Speaker 3: like when you've never been with anyone else, when you're
Speaker 3: eighteen and you get together. You're an adolescent, you've just
Speaker 3: finished high school, and all of a sudden, you're in
Speaker 3: your mid twenties. You think you're going to be with
Speaker 3: this person forever. Like I think you can truly love
Speaker 3: someone but be very curious as to what else is
Speaker 3: out there in the world. So I would say those
Speaker 3: feelings are normal, but not a lot of people go
Speaker 3: down the track of then acting on them and opening him.
Speaker 3: The first thing that jumps out at me is when
Speaker 3: you said, what boundaries would you put in place if
Speaker 3: you did it. I don't like the fact that he
Speaker 3: has come to you and set the boundaries straight away.
Speaker 3: He has said it will be with a stranger only once,
Speaker 3: and we'll never tell each other about it.
Speaker 4: That's not how this works.
Speaker 3: Open relationships need to be completely consensual, and they need
Speaker 3: to be so many boundaries and rules that are set
Speaker 3: by both parties. If you decide to open this, you
Speaker 3: get equal say into what you're comfortable with and how
Speaker 3: it works. Personally, if I were to go down this
Speaker 3: track one day, I would never let it happen without
Speaker 3: me knowing about it. I think I would want to know,
Speaker 3: not necessarily all the details, but I would want to
Speaker 3: know that it had happened, And there needs to be
Speaker 3: a level of if you decide you want to know more,
Speaker 3: that he tells you about it, because that is what
Speaker 3: will be destructive. If you start to ask questions and
Speaker 3: he says, hey, we set the rule. We're not talking
Speaker 3: about it. I'm not telling you if I did it.
Speaker 3: That will drive you insane, will be the demise of
Speaker 3: the relationship. Yeah.
Speaker 2: My other thing in this though, like, and I worry
Speaker 2: because I'm like, I don't want you to do something
Speaker 2: because you feel as though you have to, and I
Speaker 2: know you've said you've said okay, like you know, I'm
Speaker 2: okay with exploring the idea and what not. My thought
Speaker 2: is is that there are other ways that you can
Speaker 2: explore other sexual partners without it having to be this like,
Speaker 2: he gets to set the rules. We're going to open
Speaker 2: the relationship, and I'm never going to know when it happens.
Speaker 1: It seeds to fuck when everyone's but not tell me
Speaker 1: at some point.
Speaker 2: It's gonna happen. The thing is is, you know you
Speaker 2: could potentially seek out having a threesome that would be
Speaker 2: a consensual, additional way of having another sexual relationship without
Speaker 2: it being you know, not being part of it. He
Speaker 2: could if he really wanted to go to a sex worker,
Speaker 2: which is then a transactional sexual experience. The only thing
Speaker 2: I think that you need to keep in mind is
Speaker 2: that it isn't easy. It isn't easy to find someone
Speaker 2: to have sex with, Like you have to put groundwork in.
Speaker 2: You either have to go on the dating sites or
Speaker 2: you've got to go out at night. You've got to
Speaker 2: put in the flirting. Like if you're going to have
Speaker 2: a one night casual sex experience with someone, there is
Speaker 2: effort that has to be put in in order to
Speaker 2: manufacture that relationship. And so I really want you to
Speaker 2: be aware of what that effort looks like, because that
Speaker 2: could be the part that feels the most damaging or
Speaker 2: the most hurtful, because it might require flirting with one
Speaker 2: girl that didn't work out, got to flirt with another girl,
Speaker 2: Okay that didn't eventuate. I'm texting this chick over here
Speaker 2: to try and like, you know, I've got to go
Speaker 2: on a couple of dates in order to then, you know,
Speaker 2: I think be really really clear about what constitutes this
Speaker 2: one night whole pass pass out, because you can't just
Speaker 2: meet someone in a corridor and go, hey, you want
Speaker 2: to fuck a right?
Speaker 1: Cool?
Speaker 2: Like, this is it, and then we can't tell anyone
Speaker 2: about it. It requires energy and it requires effort, and
Speaker 2: how are you going to feel about that energy and
Speaker 2: that effort and everything else that goes into opening up
Speaker 2: this relationship. See, I just think so many conversations have
Speaker 2: to happen, and I think seek out as much information
Speaker 2: as you possibly can around how to open a relationship
Speaker 2: successfully and also how to close it again, because that's
Speaker 2: what I think looks like is important to you, is
Speaker 2: some sort of long term monogamy.
Speaker 3: Well, you've also said that you're worried that your relationship
Speaker 3: is going to change if you do it. Absolutely it's
Speaker 3: going to change. That's one hundred percent guarantee. It is
Speaker 3: not the same as it was. Feelings will be different,
Speaker 3: thoughts will be different, the way you interact is different.
Speaker 3: And I say that because I have some pretty good
Speaker 3: friends that are in an open relationship, both of them consensually,
Speaker 3: and even though they were both wanting the same things
Speaker 3: and they went into it that way, it absolutely changed
Speaker 3: to the point that they're like, oh, this isn't how
Speaker 3: I thought it was going to be. And I want
Speaker 3: to close it again, and it has to be fluid
Speaker 3: enough to be able to close it whenever you want.
Speaker 3: If something changes, even if you do close it again,
Speaker 3: you do have to go in knowing that something has changed,
Speaker 3: something has happened in the relationship. Even if you both
Speaker 3: said yes, it will change the way you think and
Speaker 3: feel and interact with each other, not necessarily.
Speaker 4: For the worse.
Speaker 3: It could be amazing. You both could love it, and
Speaker 3: it could be exactly what your relationship needs. But it
Speaker 3: very well could do the opposite. So you need to
Speaker 3: be one hundred percent on board. Not doing it for
Speaker 3: anyone else. Go into it with open eyes, knowing that
Speaker 3: things will change, and yeah, maybe seek some outside resources.
Speaker 3: We've done podcasts with people in really open flowed relationships.
Speaker 3: We've done it with people that are in quadruple relationships,
Speaker 3: three people in relationship. We've done so many different types
Speaker 3: of podcasts that.
Speaker 2: You know, the one thing that is like the constant
Speaker 2: every single person that we have ever spoken to who
Speaker 2: has navigated as successful opening up or closing of a relationship,
Speaker 2: This same thing that every single person says is that
Speaker 2: it requires the most deepest level of communication and trust,
Speaker 2: like it requires so much more trust and honesty than
Speaker 2: what a normal heterosexual monogamous relationship requires, because that's like
Speaker 2: a set and forget, Hey, we're going to be monogamous. Cool,
Speaker 2: we're a monogamous and these are the rules of monogamy.
Speaker 2: Whereas opening the relationship up means if you want to
Speaker 2: know information, you have to sit down and have those
Speaker 2: uncomfortable conversations and understand the wise and understand what it
Speaker 2: is that they're doing and who is it that they're meeting.
Speaker 2: And I think that very few people can navigate open
Speaker 2: relationships without knowing any of the parameters around it and
Speaker 2: just have this like I don't want to know about it.
Speaker 2: I'm going to completely ignore anything that you do, and
Speaker 2: we're just gonna pretend like it hasn't happened. Yeah, that
Speaker 2: to me, it seems like an unusual way to approach
Speaker 2: an open relationship.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think the zero information rule is very unusual.
Speaker 3: You'd be the minority. But there's so many levels. Some
Speaker 3: people just want to know that it happened, then that's it.
Speaker 3: They don't want any details. Other people want to know
Speaker 3: more details. Some people want to know one hundred percent
Speaker 3: of what happens.
Speaker 2: I would want to know everything. I would want to
Speaker 2: know everything. I'd want an Instagram handle, I'd want.
Speaker 1: The whole thing.
Speaker 4: I would want to know nothing.
Speaker 2: But you want to know nothing because you don't want
Speaker 2: to open your relationship, you know what I mean, Like
Speaker 2: you want monogamy. Like I think that for people who
Speaker 2: are like I don't want to know a single thing,
Speaker 2: it's because they can't handle knowing, so therefore they can't
Speaker 2: handle the open relationship.
Speaker 3: Which means they're probably doing it for their partner.
Speaker 5: Yeah, there is someone in my life that I don't
Speaker 5: want to give too many details because I don't want
Speaker 5: them to be identifiable. But they have been in a
Speaker 5: relationship for a very long time.
Speaker 1: With their partner.
Speaker 5: They have both it's such a weird I don't want
Speaker 5: to say strayed from the fidelity of their relationship, but
Speaker 5: they have both had other sexual experiences outside of the relationship.
Speaker 5: They are both aware of the fact that that has happened.
Speaker 5: They want no information further.
Speaker 3: But was that cheating or an open relationship because they're
Speaker 3: very different.
Speaker 5: Look I think by you know, standards, it would have
Speaker 5: been deemed as cheating the first time, and then it
Speaker 5: was much later that they found out about, you know,
Speaker 5: the indiscretions, I guess you could call them. And so
Speaker 5: I think it's more of an understanding now of the
Speaker 5: fact that if they've been together since they were so young,
Speaker 5: they're going to be together forever because their lives are
Speaker 5: set up together and they do love each other so much.
Speaker 4: Maybe they just have to accept the fact that there
Speaker 4: are going to.
Speaker 5: Be times where one of them at some point in time,
Speaker 5: or both of them at some point in time, does
Speaker 5: like stray from this idea of a closed relationship, and
Speaker 5: they've just both been okay with that, and they've both
Speaker 5: said I don't want to know about it. I know
Speaker 5: that this might be quite a unique situation, but it
Speaker 5: is a situation, you know. So I know that most
Speaker 5: of the people we've always spoken to on the podcast
Speaker 5: are the people who are willing to talk about the
Speaker 5: fact that they're in an open relationship.
Speaker 2: The thing that I think, though, is different about that
Speaker 2: is that just seems like someone who's okay returning a
Speaker 2: blind eye to cheating, yes, rather than having both hall
Speaker 2: pass because they yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1: But I feel like that's a slightly different situation.
Speaker 5: Well, I think it's more about having a monogamish relationship,
Speaker 5: you know, like the understanding that most of the time
Speaker 5: we're in monogamous and then every now and then, if
Speaker 5: we expect to be realistic about the course of thirty
Speaker 5: forty fifty years being together and not having many sexual
Speaker 5: experiences beforehand, maybe there's going to be a time where,
Speaker 5: like each of them does go and experience someone else.
Speaker 3: Yeah, And I think the reason I think that is
Speaker 3: slightly different is and again, like, of course, all relationships
Speaker 3: aren't cut from the same cloth, and if it genuinely
Speaker 3: suits you to not know a thing, then that's fine.
Speaker 3: But I think that's different because they both just did
Speaker 3: the dirty and found out about it, and then they're like, cool,
Speaker 3: you know what, if you're gonna cheat on me in
Speaker 3: the future, just don't tell me. This is a bit
Speaker 3: of a different conversation because they're both trying to say,
Speaker 3: we want to do it once a year. It's a thing,
Speaker 3: but I don't want to tell you about it. I
Speaker 3: just think they're different conversations in a way because your
Speaker 3: friendship sounds like it's a bit accepting of infidelity. Because
Speaker 3: they got forced into that situation, they both realize that
Speaker 3: they're both doing it. And don't want to lose each other.
Speaker 3: Don't want to lose each other, which is so fine.
Speaker 5: I'm saying that because they are obviously so loyal to
Speaker 5: each other, they just have a different definition of what
Speaker 5: they want their sexual relationship to be.
Speaker 3: Exactly, And it's so fine. Like if two people are
Speaker 3: consensual in something and that's what they want, that's okay.
Speaker 3: But I think for this woman that's written in, just
Speaker 3: don't get forced into doing something because you're worried that
Speaker 3: you're going to lose him if you're not comfortable with it.
Speaker 2: It's also good that he came and had a conversation
Speaker 2: with you about it, rather than cheating on you, like
Speaker 2: he could have just done that, which would have been
Speaker 2: a pretty flog move. But it's nice that there's been
Speaker 2: a conversation, and it's great that you've been receptive to
Speaker 2: the conversation because a lot of people could take that
Speaker 2: as the beginning of the end, or could take it
Speaker 2: as being super offensive, will be like ego hurt by it.
Speaker 2: It sounds like you guys have a very healthy way
Speaker 2: of communicating, and that seems like the first and best
Speaker 2: step to potentially navigating this successfully.
Speaker 1: Please tell us how that all works out. We would
Speaker 1: love to know.
Speaker 3: Yeah, aftermath this shit.
Speaker 1: Yeah, don't tell him, but tell us. That's the difference.
Speaker 5: Also, what you were saying, we were about the whole,
Speaker 5: like the admin of actually having a hook cup.
Speaker 4: He will likely not like the fact that it's a
Speaker 4: lot easier for you to go out and find someone.
Speaker 1: I have a hall past one hundred.
Speaker 3: Oh no, I disagree. It's so easy for anyone to
Speaker 3: go and have sex if you want sex these days
Speaker 3: is made to be the easy. That's why infidelities through
Speaker 3: the roof. You can find someone to go and have
Speaker 3: sex with whilst you're in bed with your partner. It
Speaker 3: is not hard to find someone to have sex with.
Speaker 1: It depends on what you are looking for.
Speaker 2: Like, I have a really good girlfriend who is like
Speaker 2: fucking in her sexual peak right now, will happily say
Speaker 2: that she'll have sex with anyone, and that's great, Like
Speaker 2: good for her.
Speaker 4: She's just who that is.
Speaker 2: She's out there for experiences and she is living her
Speaker 2: literal best life. Yeah, and she could have someone to
Speaker 2: have se with Monday, Tuesday, Wednesdays, Sat or someday. Like
Speaker 2: it's not for her, no problem. She's also very attractive
Speaker 2: but she is like, I am not wanting our relationship.
Speaker 2: I do not want connection. I want physical gratification and
Speaker 2: that's what I'm here for. And she's literally living her
Speaker 2: best fucking life doing it. And so I think if
Speaker 2: you're approaching it with that and you're not having to
Speaker 2: do all of the after care of the dating side
Speaker 2: of things, then that transaction is easy to come across
Speaker 2: if you know where to look for it.
Speaker 1: He's the kate.
Speaker 3: You gotta know where to look for it though online
Speaker 3: at the pub Nah, it's easy.
Speaker 2: No, it's certain apps. There's certain apps, and it's not
Speaker 2: your Tinder, your Hinge and your dating apps. It's there's
Speaker 2: specific apps that are for sex. I think the main
Speaker 2: one is Fieled.
Speaker 5: I mean like people might want to go and download it, Like, yeah,
Speaker 5: from what I've heard, and I think I know the
Speaker 5: friend that you're talking about.
Speaker 1: She's the best.
Speaker 3: Fields more also not just for sex, Fields, also for
Speaker 3: very particular sex. It's for all your kinks, like where
Speaker 3: you go when you have a very particular kink.
Speaker 4: There are lots of different ones, but that's the main
Speaker 4: one I've ever heard of.
Speaker 1: So, yeah, you're if you're interested.
Speaker 3: You guys are giving Hinder mumble hinge too much grace.
Speaker 1: They're all hook up.
Speaker 2: As they are hookup apps, but I think realistically there's
Speaker 2: more to weigh through because you've got to figure out
Speaker 2: what someone's after. Whereas Field and that is the one
Speaker 2: I was trying to think of. It is one hundred percent.
Speaker 2: If you're on that, you're on it because you want
Speaker 2: to have sex. You're not on it because you want
Speaker 2: to like have a friendship and go out for coffee
Speaker 2: on a Saturday walk.
Speaker 3: I have a friend on Field and I was talking
Speaker 3: to her recently. She was just hooking up with someone
Speaker 3: different every two days. She just goes on there, she
Speaker 3: goes for a walk, and she goes for the coffee
Speaker 3: with them to suss them first, because she definitely wants
Speaker 3: to still make sure that she's interested, so she does
Speaker 3: the coffee in the walk. But like the frequency of hookups,
Speaker 3: I'm like, get it girl, Like it.
Speaker 2: Was they were living by I know, I love this
Speaker 2: because I it's so far from my life being like,
Speaker 2: you know, in an eight year monogamous relationship.
Speaker 1: But I was like, okay, so what with this app?
Speaker 2: I was like, if you've arranged to have sex with
Speaker 2: someone and they've shown up to your house and like
Speaker 2: they're not what you expected, or because obviously sometimes you
Speaker 2: can you're dating, well, no, when you're dating someone rocks
Speaker 2: up and they lie they're you know, they said they're
Speaker 2: six foot, they're five to two. Like what happens if
Speaker 2: someone shows up and they're just like not the version?
Speaker 2: And she was like, oh, I still have sex with them.
Speaker 2: She's like, I don't care because I'm just here to
Speaker 2: I have sex with them. She's like, it doesn't matter
Speaker 2: to me as much that they're not exactly the person
Speaker 2: that they said they were on the profile.
Speaker 1: She's like, because it's a it's a transaction of an experience.
Speaker 2: She's like if they're an absolute fucking creep or like
Speaker 2: they've made me feel uncomfortable, She's like, that's a different thing.
Speaker 1: She's like. But apart from that, she's like whatever, Like
Speaker 1: I'm here for a good time in a long time.
Speaker 3: It's so interesting, and she's like, have sex, get out
Speaker 3: of my house. It sort of gives grinder vibes, like grinders, yes,
Speaker 3: so like it is what it is, you know that
Speaker 3: you're going there for it, you leave, well, I mean
Speaker 3: I'm not on grinder. Shockingly, but all my friends that
Speaker 3: are on grinder say the same thing.
Speaker 4: It is like the.
Speaker 3: Easiest, quickest, quickest, quickiest, It is the easiest, quickest, most
Speaker 3: intentional site.
Speaker 2: I take it back, maybe because I did I did
Speaker 2: put in so, like, you know, saying that the required
Speaker 2: time that it takes to actually like procure that type
Speaker 2: of relationship, yeah, could be the thing that would be
Speaker 2: the most upsetting part. That's why it's important to talk
Speaker 2: about this. It's important to talk about the ways in
Speaker 2: which you're going to navigate this because like, as we've established,
Speaker 2: he probably doesn't need to be on you know, bumble
Speaker 2: for example, Like it doesn't need to be on that.
Speaker 2: That's not an efficient way to find someone to just
Speaker 2: have sex with once and then never ever ever again.
Speaker 2: If that's the actual rules of this engagement. Yeah, And
Speaker 2: my rules would be things like not.
Speaker 1: That I'm gonna do this.
Speaker 3: Everyone Ben would nervo, neither would I mean, but my
Speaker 3: rules would be like no phone number swapping and no
Speaker 3: emotional connection. So like, if you did it, it's that
Speaker 3: person once and you don't get to talk to them
Speaker 3: and figure it out for a week, two weeks. You
Speaker 3: don't get to swap messages like you are one and done, buddy.
Speaker 3: I don't want you to be able to contact them.
Speaker 3: I want you to go onto an app like that
Speaker 3: if you were going to do it unmatch afterward. None
Speaker 3: of this emotional connection, none of this follow up, none
Speaker 3: of this checking in. It's like, yeah, you're in and
Speaker 3: you're out.
Speaker 1: Literally. Yeah.
Speaker 2: But so there's so much trust that's required. There's so
Speaker 2: much trust that's required. You can put those rules in place,
Speaker 2: but you have to trust that someone's following through with
Speaker 2: the things that they say, the things that you've mutually agreed.
Speaker 5: I think you've just made me realize that the you know,
Speaker 5: the boyfriend in the situation, the partner in this situation,
Speaker 5: who has brought her this idea of the hall pass.
Speaker 5: I think a really good question for you to ask
Speaker 5: is do you want to have sex with someone else
Speaker 5: or do you want to have like a romantic flirt interest,
Speaker 5: feel that desire from someone else, Because they're actually two
Speaker 5: different things totally and well.
Speaker 3: Hall pass historically is like who would you have sex
Speaker 3: with once if you could?
Speaker 1: Yeah, But I think defining that is important.
Speaker 5: Yeah, because if it's actually that you just want to
Speaker 5: feel desired by someone else, and like flirting with them
Speaker 5: and stuff. That to me would imply that there's a
Speaker 5: bit more of an emotional connection potential, whereas if it
Speaker 5: was just the physical act that you've only ever been
Speaker 5: with each other and you want to go and sleep
Speaker 5: with someone else, you would likely I mean, I think
Speaker 5: the best case scenario would be a sex worker for that,
Speaker 5: because it's like it is a literal transaction, like Laura said,
Speaker 5: So that might be another good question to ask is
Speaker 5: what are you wanting to get out of the situation,
Speaker 5: What are you wanting to feel from that situation?
Speaker 3: So I reason it's just experience. Eighteens been with anyone else?
Speaker 3: Five No, when they got together, he was eighteen, he's
Speaker 3: never been with anyone else, and he doesn't plan on it.
Speaker 3: If they want to get married, there's always going to
Speaker 3: be a very natural human curiosity whether it doesn't mean
Speaker 3: that you love each other any less. And I know
Speaker 3: because I felt the same thing. I was with my
Speaker 3: partner from sixteen for eight years fifteen, even like we
Speaker 3: were like high school sweethearts, and I remember those same
Speaker 3: I don't know, do you call him intrusive thoughts. Those
Speaker 3: same intrusive thoughts started to come in at the end
Speaker 3: of my relationship where I thought I loved this person
Speaker 3: so much and I could see myself them being a
Speaker 3: life partner.
Speaker 1: But I was like, I can't die.
Speaker 3: I never been with anyone else. What's it like to
Speaker 3: be with someone else? What's it like to have someone
Speaker 3: else touch me? What sex like with someone else? What's
Speaker 3: intimacy like with someone else? It didn't mean I loved
Speaker 3: him any differently, But you're just human and all of
Speaker 3: a sudden, you've only had this one experience with someone
Speaker 3: in one connection, and I think could be remiss to
Speaker 3: say it's not a normal feeling. Some people it's absolutely
Speaker 3: fine and they bury the feeling. Some people it manifests
Speaker 3: and to the point where it probably has with your partners,
Speaker 3: probably been thinking about this for quite a while, which
Speaker 3: is why he has brought it up. So it's fascinating
Speaker 3: and it's interesting. Doesn't mean it's the end of the relationship.
Speaker 3: Could make it better, but yeah, please aftermath the shit
Speaker 3: out of that.
Speaker 4: Well, guys, that is it from us.
Speaker 2: If you have a question for asking cut, slide on
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