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Speaker 1: No matter what job you're in, you've probably fantasized at

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Speaker 1: least once about becoming some kind of professional artist. Whether

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Speaker 1: you've got a knack for photography or you've got a

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Speaker 1: burning passion for film, you've probably wished once or twice

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Speaker 1: that you could give up your office job and live

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Speaker 1: that bohemian lifestyle instead. But surprise, the working life of

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Speaker 1: a professional creative today isn't quite as freeform, fluid and

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Speaker 1: flexible as you might think. Take Eddie Perfect for example.

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Speaker 1: He's one of Australia's most successful songwriting experts. He's an actor, singer, performer,

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Speaker 1: comedian and has written the music and lyrics for Broadway

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Speaker 1: shows such as Beetlejuice and If you need more proof

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Speaker 1: that the life of an artist is certainly not a

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Speaker 1: life free of intense scheduling, wait until Eddie explains the

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Speaker 1: Broadway practice of the twenty nine hour read. But before

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Speaker 1: we get to that, how about her reminder that the

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Speaker 1: job of a performer can be as physically demanding as

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Speaker 1: any other job. My name is doctor amanthe Immer. I'm

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Speaker 1: an organizational psychologist and the founder of behavioral science consultancy Inventium,

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Speaker 1: and this is how I work, a show about how

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Speaker 1: to help you do your best work.

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Speaker 2: Now.

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Speaker 1: Eddie had to postpone the recording of this interview by

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Speaker 1: a week because he lost his voice. And while losing

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Speaker 1: your voice is pretty annoying, what happens when you're starring

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Speaker 1: in the musical nine to five and you'll lose your voice.

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Speaker 3: Yes, we're doing nine to five, eight shows a week,

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Speaker 3: and it's not actually for me, it's not a vocally

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Speaker 3: challenging show. Necessarily. I sing two songs. I mean, I'm

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Speaker 3: a bit shouty. I play a bit of a shouty guy.

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Speaker 3: But it's certainly not as large as vocal load as

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Speaker 3: I've had on other shows. So and I've also done

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Speaker 3: it one hundred and sixty times, so it certainly didn't.

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Speaker 3: It wasn't like my voice was tired out. I just

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Speaker 3: got a weird, little like laryngitis thing where it we

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Speaker 3: just felt really weird. It couldn't nothing was coming out.

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Speaker 3: So I had to have to take some shows off,

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Speaker 3: which is a bummer. But I also feel like, you know,

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Speaker 3: we're a little bit more used to do in show

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Speaker 3: business post pandemic, this notion of you know, being able

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Speaker 3: to take time off, whereas I come from the era

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Speaker 3: where you know, it didn't matter what was going on.

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Speaker 3: You dragged yourself at the theater and you did the show.

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Speaker 3: You didn't miss shows. It was sort of a point

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Speaker 3: of pride. And now I don't know, the younger generation

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Speaker 3: are a little bit more like, oh this hurts or

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Speaker 3: I need a mental health day or whatever. And yeah,

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Speaker 3: it's really interesting to know, well, what's what's the right

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Speaker 3: amount of shows to do and not to do. It's

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Speaker 3: harding your names on the show. You want to be

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Speaker 3: in the show, you know. And of course that I took,

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Speaker 3: you know, one day off and sucking. This is the

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Speaker 3: day that everybody you know goes to see the show.

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Speaker 3: We went to see the show. You went in the show,

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Speaker 3: and you're like, oh man, there's been one hundreds since

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Speaker 3: you shows. No one's come to them but Murphy's Lawyers.

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Speaker 3: You take a day off, that's when everyone comes.

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Speaker 1: So what are your your daily rituals to stay healthy

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Speaker 1: and energetic?

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Speaker 3: Look, nothing until I have a problem, and then I

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Speaker 3: get really diligent, and then that wears off.

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Speaker 4: That's the honest answer.

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Speaker 2: So what did you do when you lost your voice?

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Speaker 3: So I kind of like muddled through, but generally the

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Speaker 3: best thing to do is just to shut up.

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Speaker 1: How do you do that when you've got two kids

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Speaker 1: and a wife and you need your voice to live?

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Speaker 4: Yeah, you do, you do.

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Speaker 3: But and I you know, some people believe in absolute

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Speaker 3: one hundred percent vocal rest. And there's a great story

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Speaker 3: about that I heard about b Yurk actually, which I

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Speaker 3: had loved.

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Speaker 4: So Burke was out here with the Big Day Out.

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Speaker 3: I think it must have been it must have been

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Speaker 3: more than ten years ago. She was out here with

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Speaker 3: the Big Day Out, and my manager at the time

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Speaker 3: was managing the Midnight Juggernauts and they were on the

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Speaker 3: same bill, and they got invited by Bi Yerke to

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Speaker 3: like an alfter party at the site, like you know,

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Speaker 3: in her sort of you know, her area, like her

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Speaker 3: little trailer. And when they got there, she had like,

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Speaker 3: you know, turntable set up and she was having a

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Speaker 3: dance party and she just had a big black piece

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Speaker 3: of gaffer tape over her mouth. So she went up

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Speaker 3: and she gave my hug and she waved high. But

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Speaker 3: everyone was like a guess that, I guess Burke's not talking,

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Speaker 3: And she just sort of danced and played records and

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Speaker 3: had a good time, And I was like, that is

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Speaker 3: the cleverest.

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Speaker 4: That is the cleverest way.

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Speaker 3: To go on vocal rest is to actually put a

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Speaker 3: giant piece of tape. Otherwise you're like miming to people

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Speaker 3: that you're not using your voice. But yeah, some people

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Speaker 3: wear like badges and stuff that I'm on vocal rest.

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Speaker 3: I just think that you know, if you're on vocal rest,

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Speaker 3: just stay away from other people. Don't get weird about it.

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Speaker 3: And you know, like being able to talk is fine

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Speaker 3: when you consider, like you know that you're.

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Speaker 4: Not doing shit.

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Speaker 3: If you're taking time off the show, that's where it really,

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Speaker 3: that's where the rubber hits the road.

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Speaker 4: It's the hard work.

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Speaker 3: So if you're not doing the show, then everything else

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Speaker 3: is easy. So it's annoying, but it just happens because

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Speaker 3: you know, that's our instrument. It's like inside our bodies.

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Speaker 3: It's not a it's not an external thing.

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Speaker 2: Are there any little tricks or secrets that performers like

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Speaker 2: you know about that could help people like me that

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Speaker 2: are not in showbiz but would like to speak.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and this is so weird that everyone's going to

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Speaker 3: be and people people that know about this will be

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Speaker 3: like absolutely one hundred percent, and the people don't will

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Speaker 3: be like, come on, that can't be real. All you

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Speaker 3: need is a straw and a glass of water, and

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Speaker 3: it's an exercise where you get I get my phone

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Speaker 3: out and I put ten minutes on the timer, and

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Speaker 3: you breathe in and you breathe out through the straw,

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Speaker 3: and you you hum and blow through the straw just

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Speaker 3: enough to make a little divot in the water. And

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Speaker 3: then your job is to try and with the consistency

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Speaker 3: of your breath, keep that divot the same lengths. You

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Speaker 3: don't want to go wavering anywhere, really consistent in a

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Speaker 3: very easy part of your voice, and it feels like

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Speaker 3: you're doing nothing. It's very weird when you do that.

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Speaker 3: And then you can kind of move the tone up

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Speaker 3: and down a little bit from there as you go.

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Speaker 3: But I've gone from having absolutely no voice to getting

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Speaker 3: my voice back by doing that exercise. And somebody more

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Speaker 3: technical than I would be able to tell you why

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Speaker 3: that is. But my version of it is.

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Speaker 4: It's like.

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Speaker 3: It's almost like it massages your vocal folds and brings

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Speaker 3: them back to life in a very gentle way, and

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Speaker 3: it focuses the sounds that you're not putting a big

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Speaker 3: load onto your voice, but you're taking all the load

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Speaker 3: off your voice, and it's just a gentle massage and

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Speaker 3: it really works. Straw technique. Look it up on YouTube

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Speaker 3: and it's brought back. You know, it often happens in

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Speaker 3: the I remember in the coming into doing the comedy festival,

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Speaker 3: coming from the world of being in music theater and

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Speaker 3: talking about vocal health and you know, vocal maintenance throughout

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Speaker 3: a show. Comedians had none of that, and they're using

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Speaker 3: their voice every single day, and then they're going out

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Speaker 3: and partying and doing all sorts of things you do

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Speaker 3: during Melburne Comedy Festival, and invariably comedians start to lose

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Speaker 3: their voice and that is a great reviver people with

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Speaker 3: their little bit of steam and then blowing through your

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Speaker 3: little straw.

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Speaker 1: I want to talk about Broadway because you have written

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Speaker 1: shows for Broadway, which is quite remarkable.

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Speaker 2: Not many people get to do that during their lives.

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Speaker 2: I want you to tell me about the twenty nine

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Speaker 2: hour read. What is that?

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Speaker 3: Twenty nine hour read is essentially what we would a

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Speaker 3: normal person would call like a workshop for a new musical.

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Speaker 3: So before you get into the rehearsal, room, and as

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Speaker 3: you're writing musical, there are lots of different steps of

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Speaker 3: development along the way, and primarily that's about taking what

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Speaker 3: you've got on the page and in the score and

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Speaker 3: hearing it said read out loud and sung out loud

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Speaker 3: by actors. And in New York they have a really

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Speaker 3: great system where there is an equity agreed contract called

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Speaker 3: a twenty nine hour read where you can call an

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Speaker 3: actor for this contract a certain amount of money.

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Speaker 4: I don't know what the award wage is, but you.

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Speaker 3: Can call an actor for twenty nine hours in one week.

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Speaker 3: That's how much time you've got with them to workshop whatever,

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Speaker 3: and you can you can work out when those hours happen.

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Speaker 3: But generally, because you know, it's designed to be able

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Speaker 3: to fit in around of already working Broadway actors schedule,

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Speaker 3: you know that normally they have Monday and Tuesdays off.

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Speaker 3: Wednesday is a bit of a ride off because they've

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Speaker 3: got them matday in the evening show. Thursdays and Fridays.

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Speaker 3: I've got an evening show, but I don't everything think

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Speaker 3: during the day, So normally it's like Monday Tuesday, you know,

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Speaker 3: maybe half an hour on a Wednesday and then a

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Speaker 3: full day on Thursday, and then and a presentation on Friday,

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Speaker 3: and that'll take you up to twenty nine hours. And

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Speaker 3: at the same time, this person actor can still be

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Speaker 3: doing their you know, eight show a week Broadway show.

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Speaker 3: It seems like crazy and unsustainable for a performer because

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Speaker 3: you'd be like, oh, okay, you know, every single second

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Speaker 3: of your already you know busy schedules now taken up

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Speaker 3: with this twenty nine hour. I read that's in the gaps,

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Speaker 3: and I thought, well, obviously these actors don't do many

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Speaker 3: of these. They maybe they do four or five with

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Speaker 3: them a year, and that's they go okay, well this week, honey,

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Speaker 3: don't expect to see me. I'm going to be doing

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Speaker 3: the show and this workshop. So I remember asking some

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Speaker 3: of the people in the first Beetlejuice twenty nine hour

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Speaker 3: read like how many of these do you do a week?

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Speaker 3: And they were like, oh, like between twenty five and

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Speaker 3: thirty five.

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Speaker 2: Oh my god.

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Speaker 3: So they're constantly doing them constantly, So their life is

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Speaker 3: their work life balance is non existent. They are just

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Speaker 3: layer living for Broadway. And unlike in Australia, where we

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Speaker 3: receive a show that's already been through the development process

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Speaker 3: that's already kind of been tried and tested and now exists,

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Speaker 3: and it comes in a suitcase and has all of

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Speaker 3: the bits worked out stand here and you know, do this.

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Speaker 3: We don't have that system necessarily of twenty nine hour

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Speaker 3: reads where we workshop stuff constantly, and that does actually

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Speaker 3: kind of take the place of auditioning in a way,

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Speaker 3: because you get to be in a room with the

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Speaker 3: director you want to work with, and you're working on

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Speaker 3: an entirely new script with changes coming every day, and

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Speaker 3: you're trained to give spontaneous, bold, smart, funny, great brave

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Speaker 3: choices all day every day, and it very much helps

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Speaker 3: because you know, it's rather than just walking into a

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Speaker 3: room and doing your best sixteen in bars.

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Speaker 4: You get to work with a director.

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Speaker 3: They get to find out what you're like in the room,

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Speaker 3: do you work really well together, and if you're a

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Speaker 3: good match for that director and that project, then you generally,

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Speaker 3: as the case happened with Beetlejuice, those actors would stay

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Speaker 3: on the project and if they didn't like the piece

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Speaker 3: of them when interested, or they had other things going on,

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Speaker 3: they could leave or whatever. Or if we didn't think

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Speaker 3: they were right fit, then we could kind of not

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Speaker 3: rehire them and get other actors we thought were more appropriate.

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Speaker 4: But eventually you kind of a.

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Speaker 3: Mass your team, so it's not like, well we've got

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Speaker 3: the show, now let's audition. It's like you've been taking

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Speaker 3: these actors on this whole journey and in a lot

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Speaker 3: of ways they are helping to create that role, and

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Speaker 3: twenty nine hour read is a really big part of that.

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Speaker 3: It is incredibly hectic, and you end up generally having

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Speaker 3: everybody with their scores and scripts on music stands and

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Speaker 3: reading and singing and sort of in different permutations.

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Speaker 4: But it's incredibly useful, not just.

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Speaker 3: For working out how the piece goes, for you know,

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Speaker 3: producers to sit in and see what's going on, for

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Speaker 3: other creatives see what's going on. And as you go

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Speaker 3: through the process, excuse me, those periods of time get longer,

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Speaker 3: so you stop doing twenty nine hour reads and you

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Speaker 3: go into a different contract.

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Speaker 2: But yeah, so with the twenty nine hour read.

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Speaker 1: When I first heard about this concept, it reminded me

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Speaker 1: of what a lot of organizations do that use agile methodology,

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Speaker 1: where they'll do sprints, so they might do an intense

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Speaker 1: period of work on a project over a very short

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Speaker 1: space of time, and I guess that's kind of you know,

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Speaker 1: the musical theater equivalent. So say for the first Beetle

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Speaker 1: Juice twenty nine hour read, what goes into preparing for

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Speaker 1: that and making the most of that week?

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Speaker 3: Well, lots of things. I mean, on one level, you

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Speaker 3: have to cast it. You know, you have to find

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Speaker 3: the people that are going to play the roles. And

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Speaker 3: generally that's not an audition process. That's like, who do

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Speaker 3: we know that we think is right and let's get

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Speaker 3: them in and that's very targeted and you might have

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Speaker 3: a little help with like an ensemble or whatever.

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Speaker 4: So that's part of the process.

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Speaker 3: You need to You need to hire stage management who

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Speaker 3: run the whole thing and make sure that you know,

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Speaker 3: everybody's sticking to time, and that's very strict on broad

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Speaker 3: Weather is like stop Watch strict, so that nobody is

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Speaker 3: you know, going being used any for a minute, even

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Speaker 3: a minute longer than they should, and they're getting the

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Speaker 3: brakes when they should. That's really important. You have depending

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Speaker 3: on what you want to get out of the twenty

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Speaker 3: an hour read, you have the authors there, you have

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Speaker 3: a musical director whose job it is to take all

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Speaker 3: of the music and create like a piano vocal score

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Speaker 3: that you give to the cast. You need to run

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Speaker 3: those rehearsals. We had a band in our first twenty

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Speaker 3: nine hour read. We had like are three or four

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Speaker 3: piece band because with Beetlejuice, you know, that kind of

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Speaker 3: that style of being able to use contemporary music and

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Speaker 3: be and it was very much a part of it.

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Speaker 3: We didn't want it just to be on a piano. So, yes,

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Speaker 3: there's a lot of stuff, a lot of photocopying, a

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Speaker 3: lot of you know, and there's this great facility on

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Speaker 3: forty second Street opposite the Madame to Swords called New

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Speaker 3: forty two, which is like a you know, a multi story,

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Speaker 3: multi rehearsal room venue, and you sort of book these

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Speaker 3: rooms and side rooms and there's breakout room. So while

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Speaker 3: you know you've running an ensemble number, you're grabbing some

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Speaker 3: lead people and taking them into a breakout room and

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Speaker 3: doing you know, songs with them, and so it's just

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Speaker 3: it's very efficient and you're just basically trying to squeeze

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Speaker 3: as much effectiveness out of that twenty nine hours as

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Speaker 3: you can. And then when you get to the day,

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Speaker 3: it's just hectic because everyone, you know, it's like it's

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Speaker 3: only skin deep. The material I mean has been living

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Speaker 3: with it for one second and then everyone just does

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Speaker 3: their best at trying to sell that material and they

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Speaker 3: throw themselves into it and it's extraordinary. You can get

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Speaker 3: a lot done into in on hours.

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Speaker 1: With Beetlejuice once you got the geek, like, where where

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Speaker 1: do you start when writing a musical? Because if if

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Speaker 1: I'm correct, the book or the script was written when

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Speaker 1: you were brought into the project.

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Speaker 2: So what do you do? Like do you how do

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Speaker 2: you know where to put songs and what kind of

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Speaker 2: song goes where? What does that look like?

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Speaker 3: Well, it's called song spotting, right basically where you go

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Speaker 3: through a story and you go where do I think

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Speaker 3: the songs? Where do I think the songs go? And

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Speaker 3: that's sort of fun because you know it can kind

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Speaker 3: of be wherever you want really, And with Beetlejuice, you

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Speaker 3: know a lot of that song spotting had sort of

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Speaker 3: been done by Scott and Anthony who wrote the script then.

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Speaker 3: But they would be like, we think a song happens here,

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Speaker 3: that's maybe about this, and sometimes that would be perfect

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Speaker 3: and I would do that, and other times I'd have

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Speaker 3: an idea for a song and then the song would dictate,

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Speaker 3: you know, how the script was rewritten, and maybe the

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Speaker 3: scene maybe that it doesn't start with a scene and

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Speaker 3: then with the song. Maybe it starts with the song

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Speaker 3: and the scene happens in the middle of the song,

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Speaker 3: and all sorts of different permutations, but you generally, I

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Speaker 3: just generally go through the score and all the script

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Speaker 3: and go, well, here's this musical moment, what's that going

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Speaker 3: to be?

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Speaker 4: And I would work on it.

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Speaker 3: And send it back and forth between myself and the writers,

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Speaker 3: and they would give thoughts and notes on it, and

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Speaker 3: we'd eventually end up with something we wanted to try

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Speaker 3: in the room. But yeah, I mean, I it's the best,

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Speaker 3: the best time.

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Speaker 4: You're just chucking stuff in the pit.

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Speaker 3: You know, there's a pit of there's a beatle juice pit,

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Speaker 3: and you just write songs and throw them in there,

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Speaker 3: and then.

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Speaker 4: You know, you go on this is this going to work?

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Speaker 4: Is that not going to work?

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Speaker 3: And I really enjoy that sort of part of it

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Speaker 3: where it's sort of clear blue sky, it can be,

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Speaker 3: can kind of be whatever you want. And every now

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Speaker 3: and then I'd get an idea for a musical moment

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Speaker 3: that you know that wasn't in the script or there

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Speaker 3: was this I just couldn't.

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Speaker 4: Work out a place for it. But I'd be like,

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Speaker 4: what about this? And sometimes people will like it enough

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Speaker 4: to write into it. Didn't have it.

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Speaker 3: I didn't have an ability as much to be like, no,

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Speaker 3: we're not doing that. And then you know, you also

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Speaker 3: have a you know, you have a lot to say

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Speaker 3: about the script as well, because you know, I would

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Speaker 3: get lots of notes on the songs. I think, you know,

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Speaker 3: the maybe the character could go here in this song,

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Speaker 3: and maybe the bridge could say this, I maybe we

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Speaker 3: could explore another idea of bringing in a different voice

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Speaker 3: in this in this moment. And then likewise I be like, I,

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Speaker 3: you know, I wonder whether in this moment in them

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Speaker 3: in the script something different happens and we would talk

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Speaker 3: about that.

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Speaker 4: So it's very very collaborative.

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Speaker 1: So with song spotting, are you looking for certain points

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Speaker 1: in the story or the script where there's a certain

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Speaker 1: emotional point or where you have to move things forward?

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Speaker 1: Like how do you know it's the right spot for

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Speaker 1: a song?

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Speaker 3: Well, that's a really yeah, and that's the question. I mean,

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Speaker 3: there's also every song songs you know in musicals have

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Speaker 3: different functions. So generally, and there's no like hard and

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Speaker 3: fast rules, but generally, the opening song of a musical

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Speaker 3: is a world creating musical, a world building musical. You're

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Speaker 3: kind of saying to an audience, this is the world

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Speaker 3: that we're in, and this is the way we're going

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Speaker 3: to talk about this world, or the way we're going

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Speaker 3: to express ourselves in this world. And that's that might

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Speaker 3: be you know, everything sort of subliminatey from what the

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Speaker 3: orchestrations are doing. This is going to be very lush

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Speaker 3: and romantic, or it's going to be you know, dark

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Speaker 3: and mysterious and brooding, or it's going to be a comedy.

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Speaker 3: You know, you do need to let people know it's

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Speaker 3: going to be a comedy, like, guys, this is funny.

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Speaker 3: You need to have a really good joke up front

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Speaker 3: of everyone laughs, and then they're all like, okay, cool,

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Speaker 3: we're in a comedy.

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Speaker 4: You know. That's what I went and saw hair Spray

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Speaker 4: the other night. You know, what is it? Good morning Baltimore.

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Speaker 3: That's the opening number, you know, great, great world building thing,

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Speaker 3: you know, and most musicals.

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Speaker 4: Are like that.

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Speaker 3: And then there's generally the protagonist has a sort of

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Speaker 3: an eye want song towards the beginning where they are

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Speaker 3: going to go, Well, this is where I am now,

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Speaker 3: and this is where I want to be, and I

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Speaker 3: don't necessarily know how to get there or whatever is missing,

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Speaker 3: but this is what I want, and then that's sort

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Speaker 3: of the journey that the show.

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Speaker 4: Will go on.

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Speaker 3: Sometimes there are charm songs that do absolutely nothing to

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Speaker 3: extend the plot, and that's basically because an audience just

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Speaker 3: needs to fucking break, you know, they need to not

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Speaker 3: have to ingest plot. At this point, I want.

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Speaker 1: To talk about the process of writing a song and

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Speaker 1: kind of deep dive into that, and you suggested that

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Speaker 1: we unpack Creepy Old Guy from Medal Juice, which has

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Speaker 1: been stuck in my head. It's so it's so catchy,

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Speaker 1: like I love it. It's I mean, it's such a

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Speaker 1: dark topic to write a song about, yeah, but it

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Speaker 1: is such an upbeat, happy sing along kind of tune.

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Speaker 1: So I want to play you the first minute of

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Speaker 1: Creepy Old Guy before we get in and dissect it.

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Speaker 1: So here is some of Creepy Old Guy from Beetlejuice

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Speaker 1: by Eddie Perfect.

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Speaker 5: Way back when I'm just telling simple and set everywhere

402
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Speaker 5: Feltman stair out on the street, and I felt used

403
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Speaker 5: to be kind of confused. I would be to loogether

404
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Speaker 5: eyes really love creepy old guy. We all do dumb

405
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Speaker 5: jus the skin like rilled cheese, saggy oldses, saggy old

406
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Speaker 5: asa cute viol.

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Speaker 6: You saw the psars.

408
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Speaker 7: They make me blush.

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Speaker 2: I can't get enough. No one loves me. He wants

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Speaker 2: to be mine.

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Speaker 1: I'll try.

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Speaker 3: I'm having my own gray old guy.

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Speaker 6: Guy, old guy, my gray real guy. I'm so happy.

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Speaker 7: Girls may seem disgusting, but we're actually just shine step side.

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Speaker 4: I am older, but glad.

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Speaker 6: I wedd.

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Speaker 1: Can you firstly said the scene? What is creepy old

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Speaker 1: guy about? Where does it fit in the music?

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Speaker 3: So for anyone that's seen the film Beetlejuice, they know

420
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Speaker 3: there's this weird moment towards it. It's a pretty odd

421
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Speaker 3: structured film. It's brilliant film, but it's very odd and

422
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Speaker 3: it's hard to know what the rules are. You know,

423
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Speaker 3: what happens when you die, who becomes a ghost, who

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Speaker 3: has to go to the nether world? Who stays? Is

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Speaker 3: Beetlejuice a ghost or is he a demon?

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Speaker 4: You know?

427
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Speaker 3: Like, how can be? It can be reduced, be seen.

428
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Speaker 3: What does he have to do to be seen? And

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Speaker 3: then once he's seen, what does he have to do

430
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Speaker 3: to be alive? You know, we had to wrestle with

431
00:22:06,840 --> 00:22:11,000
Speaker 3: all those rules and make really strict rules for ourselves

432
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Speaker 3: about what they were, and then try not to bore

433
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Speaker 3: the audience to death but telling them what they were.

434
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Speaker 3: But in the film, very definite and very iconic moment

435
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Speaker 3: where Beetlejuice, you know, demands to marry when on a

436
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Speaker 3: Rider's character linear and she has that iconic red wedding

437
00:22:28,359 --> 00:22:31,080
Speaker 3: dress on, and that's in order for him to become alive.

438
00:22:31,320 --> 00:22:33,040
Speaker 3: We know that in order to become alive, and he's

439
00:22:33,040 --> 00:22:36,320
Speaker 3: to get married. And so we've got you know, we know,

440
00:22:36,359 --> 00:22:40,439
Speaker 3: we've got a fourteen year old character on stage, and

441
00:22:41,400 --> 00:22:45,159
Speaker 3: you know, we've very much been through and continue to

442
00:22:45,200 --> 00:22:50,960
Speaker 3: go through the Me too movement. We've got a you know,

443
00:22:51,920 --> 00:22:55,880
Speaker 3: centuries old demon who wants to marry her.

444
00:22:57,440 --> 00:22:58,080
Speaker 4: What do we do?

445
00:22:58,080 --> 00:23:01,359
Speaker 3: Do we just cut that and find something new, like

446
00:23:01,480 --> 00:23:03,639
Speaker 3: a whole new idea about how it's going to get married?

447
00:23:04,920 --> 00:23:07,359
Speaker 3: Do do we do it and find some kind of

448
00:23:07,400 --> 00:23:10,680
Speaker 3: like little way to make it okay for the audience

449
00:23:10,920 --> 00:23:15,200
Speaker 3: and my attitude with all those things is like leaning

450
00:23:15,320 --> 00:23:18,600
Speaker 3: as hard as you can. Everyone's like it is weird

451
00:23:18,800 --> 00:23:22,280
Speaker 3: and it is uncomfortable. And there is a kind of

452
00:23:22,320 --> 00:23:25,520
Speaker 3: a thing where there is a lot of money involved

453
00:23:25,560 --> 00:23:29,840
Speaker 3: in writing and putting on a show that for anyone

454
00:23:29,840 --> 00:23:33,080
Speaker 3: that wants to, you know, not risk losing all that money.

455
00:23:33,440 --> 00:23:35,520
Speaker 3: One way to do that is just by not ever

456
00:23:35,760 --> 00:23:39,439
Speaker 3: risking an audience being even remotely uncomfortable about anything at

457
00:23:39,440 --> 00:23:42,880
Speaker 3: any particular time. But we know that as artists that

458
00:23:42,880 --> 00:23:46,720
Speaker 3: that doesn't work. You know that actually, on the roller

459
00:23:46,720 --> 00:23:49,399
Speaker 3: coaster ride that you go through in a good show,

460
00:23:49,840 --> 00:23:51,600
Speaker 3: you get to feel all sorts of things.

461
00:23:51,720 --> 00:23:52,600
Speaker 4: You feel, you know.

462
00:23:52,680 --> 00:23:58,400
Speaker 3: Elated, joy, surprise, shock, sometimes you know, rage, and all

463
00:23:58,400 --> 00:24:00,800
Speaker 3: those things are okay as long as you're being kind

464
00:24:00,840 --> 00:24:02,359
Speaker 3: of led through them in a way that's sort of

465
00:24:02,400 --> 00:24:06,320
Speaker 3: cogent and smart. And when we were writing this bit,

466
00:24:06,400 --> 00:24:08,320
Speaker 3: I was like, come on, we've got to we've got

467
00:24:08,640 --> 00:24:11,119
Speaker 3: we've got to go for it. And I remember, I

468
00:24:11,119 --> 00:24:12,920
Speaker 3: don't know if you recall this, there was this thing

469
00:24:12,960 --> 00:24:17,240
Speaker 3: where it was maybe seven or eight years ago, women

470
00:24:17,280 --> 00:24:20,280
Speaker 3: were strapping GoPro cameras with themselves and walking through Manhattan

471
00:24:20,359 --> 00:24:25,040
Speaker 3: and sort of documenting how much kind of like sexual harassment.

472
00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:28,879
Speaker 3: They got on the street and I watched a whole

473
00:24:28,880 --> 00:24:31,959
Speaker 3: bunch of these and all the time I was like,

474
00:24:33,119 --> 00:24:34,680
Speaker 3: what did that guy think?

475
00:24:34,920 --> 00:24:37,840
Speaker 4: Does he think that's gonna work? It? Has it ever worked?

476
00:24:38,359 --> 00:24:39,720
Speaker 4: Has it ever worked.

477
00:24:40,920 --> 00:24:44,439
Speaker 3: That a woman is like in being told to smile

478
00:24:44,560 --> 00:24:47,320
Speaker 3: more or like you know, hey baby, where you're going?

479
00:24:47,600 --> 00:24:51,040
Speaker 3: And stopped and gone, well, this person seems cool, maybe

480
00:24:51,080 --> 00:24:53,879
Speaker 3: we could start a relationship. I was like, it's so

481
00:24:54,440 --> 00:24:57,520
Speaker 3: odd that men do it, but it doesn't get them

482
00:24:57,560 --> 00:24:59,359
Speaker 3: what they what they want.

483
00:25:00,440 --> 00:25:02,879
Speaker 4: In fact, it's just the bummer all around.

484
00:25:03,440 --> 00:25:05,879
Speaker 3: So I was like, but what if what if? What

485
00:25:05,960 --> 00:25:08,159
Speaker 3: if a creepy old guy got what he got what

486
00:25:08,240 --> 00:25:10,640
Speaker 3: he wanted? Like what if all of that stuff kind

487
00:25:10,640 --> 00:25:15,240
Speaker 3: of worked? And so we knew that we had to

488
00:25:15,280 --> 00:25:19,639
Speaker 3: deal with this notion of beadle Juice wanting to get married.

489
00:25:19,640 --> 00:25:22,760
Speaker 3: But what if it's not his plan? What if it's

490
00:25:22,760 --> 00:25:25,560
Speaker 3: her plan? And in our musical, Lydia's got this plan

491
00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:29,560
Speaker 3: to get rid of beetlejuice. In order to get rid

492
00:25:29,600 --> 00:25:31,720
Speaker 3: of Beetlejuice, she needs to make him alive. In order

493
00:25:31,760 --> 00:25:35,280
Speaker 3: to make him alive, she needs to marry him. And

494
00:25:35,280 --> 00:25:36,960
Speaker 3: in order for him to agree to marry her, she

495
00:25:37,000 --> 00:25:40,640
Speaker 3: needs to like convince him that she's really into it,

496
00:25:40,880 --> 00:25:44,400
Speaker 3: and so she sings, you know, like creepy old guy

497
00:25:44,560 --> 00:25:48,240
Speaker 3: like or Inland, that all of this horrible stuff's been

498
00:25:48,320 --> 00:25:51,240
Speaker 3: happening to me, and now we finally get to kind

499
00:25:51,280 --> 00:25:56,480
Speaker 3: of really lock that shit down and everybody gets the

500
00:25:56,560 --> 00:25:59,880
Speaker 3: con get there in on the corn and so then

501
00:26:00,040 --> 00:26:02,800
Speaker 3: playing along with it is super awkward. The father joining

502
00:26:02,840 --> 00:26:04,880
Speaker 3: in and sort of pimping out his daughter and the friends.

503
00:26:05,480 --> 00:26:07,879
Speaker 3: You know, it's all to serve a higher purpose, but

504
00:26:08,000 --> 00:26:10,439
Speaker 3: while you're in it, it really like messes with an

505
00:26:10,480 --> 00:26:15,200
Speaker 3: audience's mind. And the producers were really scared by the song,

506
00:26:17,640 --> 00:26:21,000
Speaker 3: especially because the original opening lyric was way back when

507
00:26:21,359 --> 00:26:25,240
Speaker 3: I was just ten, simple and sweet everywhere. Fellows would

508
00:26:25,240 --> 00:26:28,080
Speaker 3: stare out in the street and the producer was like, whoa,

509
00:26:28,200 --> 00:26:35,479
Speaker 3: whoa ten, and I was like, yeah, ten, that's like

510
00:26:35,720 --> 00:26:38,439
Speaker 3: it's I don't know. I mean, I'm spoken to a lot.

511
00:26:38,520 --> 00:26:40,600
Speaker 3: I spoke to a lot of women about this. It

512
00:26:40,680 --> 00:26:45,320
Speaker 3: starts really really early, really early, so part of me

513
00:26:45,440 --> 00:26:47,719
Speaker 3: is like, well, this is the truth, this is what happens.

514
00:26:47,800 --> 00:26:49,879
Speaker 3: So you know this is going to be a satirical

515
00:26:49,920 --> 00:26:54,359
Speaker 3: song about a sexual harass at getting everything he wanted

516
00:26:55,160 --> 00:26:58,639
Speaker 3: and really believing that this is like that all of

517
00:26:58,640 --> 00:27:01,600
Speaker 3: the work he's done, the amazing roundwork is done, suddenly

518
00:27:01,680 --> 00:27:04,000
Speaker 3: is paying off and you can't believe it. This is great,

519
00:27:05,080 --> 00:27:09,840
Speaker 3: only to be murdered. And so it's it's certainly got

520
00:27:09,840 --> 00:27:11,440
Speaker 3: a very clear purpose, and we had to be very

521
00:27:11,440 --> 00:27:13,840
Speaker 3: clear about how we set it up and to make

522
00:27:13,880 --> 00:27:16,000
Speaker 3: sure that it was a con and that everybody knew

523
00:27:16,000 --> 00:27:18,360
Speaker 3: that they were tricking beat of Juice and he's sort

524
00:27:18,400 --> 00:27:21,800
Speaker 3: of not really in on it, but then as it's going,

525
00:27:21,840 --> 00:27:26,560
Speaker 3: it's messed up. And I really loved watching Broadway audiences

526
00:27:26,560 --> 00:27:29,840
Speaker 3: because I you know, I know from seeing a lot

527
00:27:29,840 --> 00:27:32,399
Speaker 3: of Broadway shows, there isn't there isn't a lot of

528
00:27:32,440 --> 00:27:36,320
Speaker 3: that stuff on Broadway, and that's very much my style

529
00:27:36,359 --> 00:27:39,000
Speaker 3: of comedy. And I think it's quite Australian that the

530
00:27:40,880 --> 00:27:44,120
Speaker 3: I'm going to lead you through the valley of absolute discomfort,

531
00:27:44,400 --> 00:27:47,440
Speaker 3: this really messed up thing, which also, by the way,

532
00:27:47,520 --> 00:27:51,600
Speaker 3: happens to be the truth, but we're going to flip

533
00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:53,520
Speaker 3: the power structure of it. But we're going to take

534
00:27:53,520 --> 00:27:56,000
Speaker 3: you all the way through this very dark idea.

535
00:27:57,359 --> 00:27:59,320
Speaker 4: And you just see.

536
00:27:59,160 --> 00:28:02,119
Speaker 3: Audiences sort of free falling with it, just like you know,

537
00:28:02,440 --> 00:28:06,480
Speaker 3: horror and whispering to each other and confuse and what's

538
00:28:06,520 --> 00:28:10,680
Speaker 3: going on. Some people don't quite understand satire, so they

539
00:28:10,720 --> 00:28:12,280
Speaker 3: were like, is this for real?

540
00:28:12,440 --> 00:28:12,679
Speaker 4: You know?

541
00:28:13,160 --> 00:28:15,400
Speaker 3: You know those people that are always like getting outraged

542
00:28:15,400 --> 00:28:18,680
Speaker 3: about onion headlines, like how dare they? And you're like, dude,

543
00:28:18,720 --> 00:28:19,440
Speaker 3: it's satire.

544
00:28:19,560 --> 00:28:19,760
Speaker 1: You know.

545
00:28:20,040 --> 00:28:24,719
Speaker 3: There's a lot of that going on. But thankfully everybody

546
00:28:24,800 --> 00:28:27,200
Speaker 3: is sort of stuck with it and we got the

547
00:28:28,119 --> 00:28:31,240
Speaker 3: real win, which is where you take audiences to the

548
00:28:31,280 --> 00:28:37,640
Speaker 3: most awkward, uncomfortable, truthful place and then you deliver them

549
00:28:37,640 --> 00:28:41,040
Speaker 3: to the other side safely, which is absolutely delicious because

550
00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:42,719
Speaker 3: it is like that's the rollercoaster.

551
00:28:43,520 --> 00:28:46,760
Speaker 1: So it sounds like you're starting very big picture with

552
00:28:46,880 --> 00:28:50,280
Speaker 1: the song, like what is the role, what is the

553
00:28:50,320 --> 00:28:52,479
Speaker 1: tone that we need to hit, what's the journey that

554
00:28:52,520 --> 00:28:56,200
Speaker 1: we're taking the audience on during this about four minute

555
00:28:56,520 --> 00:28:59,080
Speaker 1: kind of piece of time. What do you do when

556
00:28:59,080 --> 00:29:02,080
Speaker 1: you sit down and actually start getting into the nitty gritty,

557
00:29:02,160 --> 00:29:04,760
Speaker 1: like do you start at the start or do you

558
00:29:04,880 --> 00:29:08,520
Speaker 1: kind of map out what's the verse chorus structure?

559
00:29:09,000 --> 00:29:09,720
Speaker 4: Well, I'm very.

560
00:29:09,680 --> 00:29:16,280
Speaker 3: Much obsessed with with groove and rhythm, and I feel

561
00:29:16,320 --> 00:29:19,840
Speaker 3: like whenever I go to write a song that's for

562
00:29:19,880 --> 00:29:22,960
Speaker 3: a scene, I feel like the scene has a certain temperature,

563
00:29:23,680 --> 00:29:27,040
Speaker 3: and you know, like I don't know why this analogy

564
00:29:27,040 --> 00:29:28,520
Speaker 3: popped into my head, but you know when you would

565
00:29:28,560 --> 00:29:30,240
Speaker 3: like buy goldfish and you had to keep them in

566
00:29:30,240 --> 00:29:32,480
Speaker 3: the bag and put them in the thing, and you

567
00:29:32,520 --> 00:29:35,640
Speaker 3: can't just chuck them in there because they'll die. You know,

568
00:29:35,720 --> 00:29:37,840
Speaker 3: you do need to kind of take care of your songs.

569
00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:40,160
Speaker 3: You can't like have this really dark, brooding scene and

570
00:29:40,280 --> 00:29:41,520
Speaker 3: have a really super happy song.

571
00:29:41,640 --> 00:29:41,800
Speaker 4: You know.

572
00:29:41,880 --> 00:29:44,000
Speaker 3: It's almost like there's a pace and a rhythm to

573
00:29:44,080 --> 00:29:47,880
Speaker 3: a scene. And I sort of, as I think helps

574
00:29:47,920 --> 00:29:49,880
Speaker 3: being an actor too, I go, you know, what's the

575
00:29:50,560 --> 00:29:52,480
Speaker 3: what's the music that would come out of this scene

576
00:29:52,520 --> 00:29:58,480
Speaker 3: to support it? And I knew that with Creepy Old Guy,

577
00:29:58,640 --> 00:30:01,400
Speaker 3: for example, you know it came. It comes at the

578
00:30:01,480 --> 00:30:02,080
Speaker 3: end of the show.

579
00:30:02,280 --> 00:30:02,880
Speaker 4: It's the.

580
00:30:04,640 --> 00:30:06,760
Speaker 3: I think it's like the last big production number before

581
00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:10,760
Speaker 3: the final final kind of ending the shakes, and so

582
00:30:10,800 --> 00:30:12,680
Speaker 3: it needs to be kind of fun and energetic, but

583
00:30:12,680 --> 00:30:15,719
Speaker 3: also because it's dark, it needs to bounce because you know,

584
00:30:15,800 --> 00:30:18,640
Speaker 3: you have this beautiful thing with music where you can

585
00:30:18,680 --> 00:30:22,040
Speaker 3: get away with saying the most incredibly dark shit if

586
00:30:22,080 --> 00:30:25,480
Speaker 3: you kind of can to leaver the whole thing with,

587
00:30:26,200 --> 00:30:30,120
Speaker 3: you know, the the lightness of music. There's a you know,

588
00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:32,040
Speaker 3: there's a great sort of I love those sort of

589
00:30:32,320 --> 00:30:35,840
Speaker 3: women's do what you know, the those kind of like

590
00:30:35,880 --> 00:30:38,680
Speaker 3: you know, the Temptations and the kind of beautiful kind

591
00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:42,120
Speaker 3: of the girl groups and the kind of motown sound,

592
00:30:42,640 --> 00:30:44,520
Speaker 3: And I knew I wanted that sort of like you know,

593
00:30:45,640 --> 00:30:48,280
Speaker 3: swing to it. Also, there's a great Phil Collins song,

594
00:30:48,320 --> 00:30:52,640
Speaker 3: you Can't Harry Love. I don't think it's his song.

595
00:30:52,640 --> 00:30:53,920
Speaker 3: It's probably someone else's song.

596
00:30:53,800 --> 00:30:53,880
Speaker 5: But.

597
00:30:55,800 --> 00:30:58,720
Speaker 3: It's got that you know, I need love love, you know,

598
00:30:59,080 --> 00:31:01,280
Speaker 3: And I wanted that kind of feel. I thought that

599
00:31:01,360 --> 00:31:04,560
Speaker 3: was like a really great fun feel. So start there

600
00:31:04,640 --> 00:31:07,400
Speaker 3: with the kind of rhythm and then build it up

601
00:31:07,400 --> 00:31:07,760
Speaker 3: from there.

602
00:31:07,800 --> 00:31:08,320
Speaker 4: And I knew it.

603
00:31:08,360 --> 00:31:10,400
Speaker 3: Was it was a structure that would support lots of

604
00:31:10,480 --> 00:31:12,800
Speaker 3: other voices. You know, everyone can join in and sort

605
00:31:12,800 --> 00:31:18,280
Speaker 3: of sing we have dancing skeletons, and then you know,

606
00:31:20,320 --> 00:31:22,080
Speaker 3: kind of a breakdown that's like a kind of the

607
00:31:22,200 --> 00:31:25,320
Speaker 3: church service, you know, organs and stuff. So I mean

608
00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:28,040
Speaker 3: I kind of just kind of get really lost inside

609
00:31:28,080 --> 00:31:31,520
Speaker 3: the imaginary world of it. And now I'm at a

610
00:31:31,520 --> 00:31:34,680
Speaker 3: point with my writing where, you know, with a laptop

611
00:31:34,720 --> 00:31:37,480
Speaker 3: and a keyboard and a whole bunch of sounds, I

612
00:31:37,480 --> 00:31:40,200
Speaker 3: can kind of recreate a Broadway band and I can

613
00:31:40,280 --> 00:31:43,000
Speaker 3: just sort of like make it sound like an approximation

614
00:31:43,080 --> 00:31:45,560
Speaker 3: of what I think it will sound like on stage.

615
00:31:45,560 --> 00:31:48,760
Speaker 3: And that's and that's sort of been an amazing part

616
00:31:48,760 --> 00:31:50,840
Speaker 3: of the process because when you go to put vocals down,

617
00:31:50,920 --> 00:31:54,520
Speaker 3: sometimes I would be, you know, being Beetlejuice in my studio,

618
00:31:55,240 --> 00:31:57,120
Speaker 3: still trying to work out what Beatle just would sound like.

619
00:31:57,120 --> 00:31:59,360
Speaker 3: And then it's having these ideas of ad libs and

620
00:31:59,400 --> 00:32:01,560
Speaker 3: you know, how much does he sing, how much does

621
00:32:01,560 --> 00:32:03,920
Speaker 3: he shout? How much is he know, like, what's the

622
00:32:04,000 --> 00:32:09,760
Speaker 3: Tom Waits to, you know, Frank Sinatra ratio of it all. So, yeah,

623
00:32:10,840 --> 00:32:12,400
Speaker 3: it's a good way to work because you can kind

624
00:32:12,400 --> 00:32:16,440
Speaker 3: of hand over a demo that then has the entirety

625
00:32:16,480 --> 00:32:18,880
Speaker 3: of what you have in your head sort of played

626
00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:20,800
Speaker 3: out rather than I like, and you need that for

627
00:32:21,000 --> 00:32:23,080
Speaker 3: Creepy Old Guy because it needs to be a full

628
00:32:23,200 --> 00:32:27,160
Speaker 3: vision or it's just these little pieces of just weird

629
00:32:27,440 --> 00:32:30,120
Speaker 3: horrible Dad's talking about.

630
00:32:31,680 --> 00:32:32,720
Speaker 4: Have you guys seen Lalita.

631
00:32:32,760 --> 00:32:34,680
Speaker 3: This is just like that but fine, you know that

632
00:32:34,800 --> 00:32:37,880
Speaker 3: stuff that was like we just had no idea how

633
00:32:37,920 --> 00:32:38,560
Speaker 3: it would work.

634
00:32:39,520 --> 00:32:41,560
Speaker 2: That's such a great line. I mean, there's so many

635
00:32:41,600 --> 00:32:43,040
Speaker 2: great lines in that song.

636
00:32:43,400 --> 00:32:47,840
Speaker 1: And like, how do you know when you're done lyrically,

637
00:32:47,920 --> 00:32:50,520
Speaker 1: Like particularly with a song that needs to be funny

638
00:32:50,640 --> 00:32:55,400
Speaker 1: to make it work and just sort of to counterbalance

639
00:32:55,640 --> 00:32:56,440
Speaker 1: the horror of it.

640
00:32:56,400 --> 00:33:00,480
Speaker 2: All, Like how do you know how many Joe like

641
00:33:00,560 --> 00:33:01,520
Speaker 2: and what's funny?

642
00:33:01,560 --> 00:33:03,840
Speaker 4: And it's sort of like how many jokes?

643
00:33:03,840 --> 00:33:05,680
Speaker 3: It's sort of also like they've got to come at

644
00:33:05,680 --> 00:33:09,040
Speaker 3: a regular interval, so you can't just kind of have

645
00:33:09,240 --> 00:33:12,160
Speaker 3: like the worst thing, and they should build, they should grow.

646
00:33:12,720 --> 00:33:14,479
Speaker 3: So if you've got like a first verse, it's got

647
00:33:14,520 --> 00:33:16,240
Speaker 3: to kill a joke in it, for example, and you

648
00:33:16,280 --> 00:33:18,960
Speaker 3: get to the second verse and the joke's not so strong,

649
00:33:19,480 --> 00:33:21,640
Speaker 3: well you just need to swap those jo you just

650
00:33:21,640 --> 00:33:23,920
Speaker 3: swap those verses or something at least that part of

651
00:33:23,920 --> 00:33:24,360
Speaker 3: the verses.

652
00:33:24,360 --> 00:33:25,040
Speaker 4: Everything needs to.

653
00:33:24,960 --> 00:33:27,400
Speaker 3: Grow and get funny. You can't start funny and get

654
00:33:27,480 --> 00:33:33,960
Speaker 3: less funny. But you know, I mean, I love writing

655
00:33:34,040 --> 00:33:38,160
Speaker 3: jokes into songs. I love comedy and songs is so

656
00:33:38,160 --> 00:33:41,880
Speaker 3: fun and I drive myself absolutely insane trying to reverse

657
00:33:41,920 --> 00:33:42,760
Speaker 3: engineer stuff.

658
00:33:42,760 --> 00:33:43,600
Speaker 4: But there's a line.

659
00:33:44,200 --> 00:33:47,960
Speaker 3: There's a line in Creepy Old Guy, which is one

660
00:33:48,000 --> 00:33:51,400
Speaker 3: of my favorites, because I just felt like we needed

661
00:33:51,440 --> 00:33:57,120
Speaker 3: one moment to just let the audience know that this

662
00:33:57,320 --> 00:33:59,520
Speaker 3: is a joke, this is you know what I mean

663
00:33:59,560 --> 00:34:02,800
Speaker 3: that And it's the line where all the music cuts

664
00:34:02,840 --> 00:34:05,160
Speaker 3: out and the entire cast just face the audience and

665
00:34:05,160 --> 00:34:07,680
Speaker 3: they say, I can't believe some cultures think this kind

666
00:34:07,720 --> 00:34:10,960
Speaker 3: of thing's all right, and then boom they're back into it.

667
00:34:10,960 --> 00:34:13,120
Speaker 3: They literally just break the fourth wall and just go,

668
00:34:13,520 --> 00:34:16,880
Speaker 3: can you believe people marry fourteen year old kids?

669
00:34:17,120 --> 00:34:19,960
Speaker 4: Which is also true? You know it's the truth.

670
00:34:21,360 --> 00:34:24,000
Speaker 3: And it just gave the audience a like, oh, okay,

671
00:34:24,160 --> 00:34:27,200
Speaker 3: they know, they know, they know what they're doing. They're

672
00:34:27,200 --> 00:34:30,320
Speaker 3: not just like they don't really believe in child brides,

673
00:34:30,640 --> 00:34:32,520
Speaker 3: and we just needed to hear them say that, you

674
00:34:32,560 --> 00:34:36,200
Speaker 3: know what I mean, So you're always I mean It's

675
00:34:36,280 --> 00:34:39,799
Speaker 3: like the good thing about a Broadway development process is

676
00:34:39,840 --> 00:34:42,319
Speaker 3: you get lots of opportunities to try stuff and see

677
00:34:42,320 --> 00:34:45,759
Speaker 3: how it's working. And if you're working with a really

678
00:34:45,760 --> 00:34:48,760
Speaker 3: good director, and you know, I got along with Alex Timbers'

679
00:34:48,800 --> 00:34:51,000
Speaker 3: director so well, and he got to the point where

680
00:34:51,040 --> 00:34:53,279
Speaker 3: he knew my writing so well that he would he

681
00:34:53,320 --> 00:34:55,200
Speaker 3: would kind of go, well, that's like an A plus

682
00:34:55,320 --> 00:34:57,000
Speaker 3: joke and that this one here is like a bit

683
00:34:57,000 --> 00:35:00,080
Speaker 3: of a B joke B minus. So I think need

684
00:35:00,120 --> 00:35:02,760
Speaker 3: to get rid of that and just write A plus jokes.

685
00:35:03,560 --> 00:35:07,920
Speaker 3: And I you know, like I love that kind of direction.

686
00:35:08,080 --> 00:35:11,040
Speaker 3: Some people hate it even as an actor when like

687
00:35:11,080 --> 00:35:14,040
Speaker 3: if a director goes to me, can you just do

688
00:35:14,160 --> 00:35:14,720
Speaker 3: that better?

689
00:35:15,719 --> 00:35:18,040
Speaker 4: I love it? I love it? Or can you know?

690
00:35:18,600 --> 00:35:21,800
Speaker 3: Or like there is this weird thing where where you

691
00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:25,239
Speaker 3: somehow not supposed to say this to actors, but like,

692
00:35:25,880 --> 00:35:28,400
Speaker 3: I totally believe in a comedy you can say to

693
00:35:28,440 --> 00:35:33,160
Speaker 3: an actor, can you make that funnier? Because there are

694
00:35:33,200 --> 00:35:35,640
Speaker 3: you know, a good comedian actor will have a million

695
00:35:35,719 --> 00:35:38,000
Speaker 3: choices about how to say something, and we can find

696
00:35:38,040 --> 00:35:40,520
Speaker 3: a reason for saying something that's like that fits with

697
00:35:40,640 --> 00:35:43,680
Speaker 3: naturalism and it's believable. And you know, I would say

698
00:35:43,719 --> 00:35:46,239
Speaker 3: this in this way because you know, that's how one

699
00:35:46,440 --> 00:35:49,359
Speaker 3: way in which naturally a human being might say that,

700
00:35:49,400 --> 00:35:52,120
Speaker 3: and that's totally valid. But there's probably a better idea

701
00:35:52,239 --> 00:35:55,520
Speaker 3: or a funnier idea that's still truthful. Can you go searching,

702
00:35:55,760 --> 00:35:59,320
Speaker 3: Can you like let go of that little life raft

703
00:35:59,320 --> 00:36:01,680
Speaker 3: and go swimming out and try and find another one.

704
00:36:01,760 --> 00:36:03,040
Speaker 4: I mean that's important.

705
00:36:03,120 --> 00:36:05,360
Speaker 3: I think that's important with comedies, and it's important with

706
00:36:05,440 --> 00:36:07,480
Speaker 3: songs too, Like that joke is not as good as

707
00:36:07,480 --> 00:36:09,680
Speaker 3: that one. Cut that one. And when I work with

708
00:36:09,760 --> 00:36:14,040
Speaker 3: young writers, it's really fun because when you first write,

709
00:36:14,560 --> 00:36:18,200
Speaker 3: it's hard, and everything that comes out is so important

710
00:36:18,239 --> 00:36:21,800
Speaker 3: to you because you've hardly got anything written that everything

711
00:36:21,840 --> 00:36:23,680
Speaker 3: you've got is like such a large part of the

712
00:36:23,800 --> 00:36:27,239
Speaker 3: pie chart of what you've ever written, you don't want

713
00:36:27,239 --> 00:36:28,560
Speaker 3: to cut it or change it.

714
00:36:32,600 --> 00:36:35,160
Speaker 1: We will be back with Eddie soon talking about how

715
00:36:35,200 --> 00:36:39,560
Speaker 1: he approaches thinking creatively when he's working to a deadline.

716
00:36:40,120 --> 00:36:42,640
Speaker 1: If you're looking for more tips to improve the way

717
00:36:42,680 --> 00:36:46,200
Speaker 1: that you work, I write a short fortnightly newsletter that

718
00:36:46,239 --> 00:36:49,080
Speaker 1: contains three cool things that I've discovered that helped me

719
00:36:49,160 --> 00:36:53,280
Speaker 1: work better, ranging from software and gadgets that I'm loving

720
00:36:53,320 --> 00:36:56,400
Speaker 1: through to interesting research findings. You can sign up for

721
00:36:56,440 --> 00:37:01,040
Speaker 1: that at Howiwork dot Code. That's how I Work dots.

722
00:37:01,880 --> 00:37:06,560
Speaker 1: Now you've been writing for gosh, like two decades or

723
00:37:06,600 --> 00:37:08,120
Speaker 1: something like that, longer.

724
00:37:08,640 --> 00:37:11,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, since two, since ninety nine.

725
00:37:11,880 --> 00:37:13,840
Speaker 2: H wow, Now I.

726
00:37:15,560 --> 00:37:19,240
Speaker 1: Know my producer spoke to you prior and and he said,

727
00:37:19,680 --> 00:37:23,160
Speaker 1: ask Eddy about the soft lead pencil reference from the

728
00:37:23,239 --> 00:37:24,600
Speaker 1: late Stevens on Time.

729
00:37:24,719 --> 00:37:25,640
Speaker 2: Can you tell me about that?

730
00:37:27,000 --> 00:37:32,640
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's so Stevensontime on one of his many tips

731
00:37:32,640 --> 00:37:35,600
Speaker 3: about how to how to write lyrics, one of them

732
00:37:35,719 --> 00:37:38,600
Speaker 3: was always used like a soft lead pencil because they

733
00:37:38,640 --> 00:37:40,640
Speaker 3: wear out quicker and it means you have to sharpen

734
00:37:40,680 --> 00:37:41,040
Speaker 3: them more.

735
00:37:42,200 --> 00:37:44,439
Speaker 4: And I love that bit of writing advice.

736
00:37:44,120 --> 00:37:50,200
Speaker 3: Because what that's basically saying is build procrastination into the process. Also, interestingly,

737
00:37:51,160 --> 00:37:55,279
Speaker 3: Sometime didn't sit at the piano and write lyrics. Once

738
00:37:55,320 --> 00:37:57,919
Speaker 3: he knew what his musical structure was, he would sit

739
00:37:58,000 --> 00:37:59,880
Speaker 3: on I think he had like a kind of a

740
00:38:00,120 --> 00:38:01,600
Speaker 3: uch that it was a line on it with a

741
00:38:01,680 --> 00:38:04,840
Speaker 3: board that he put his piece of paper, and he

742
00:38:04,880 --> 00:38:08,400
Speaker 3: wrote lyrics that way, with a bit pencil and taking

743
00:38:08,440 --> 00:38:11,080
Speaker 3: lots of pauses to sharpen it, which is because the

744
00:38:11,160 --> 00:38:15,080
Speaker 3: kind of the breaks that are actually vitally important with writing.

745
00:38:15,120 --> 00:38:18,359
Speaker 3: You know, you can go on the most focused human

746
00:38:18,360 --> 00:38:20,200
Speaker 3: being in the world and I'm not going to I'm

747
00:38:20,200 --> 00:38:22,719
Speaker 3: not going to my attention is a steel trap that

748
00:38:22,719 --> 00:38:23,799
Speaker 3: I'm never going to turn off.

749
00:38:23,840 --> 00:38:25,879
Speaker 4: I'm just going to lock in on this thing.

750
00:38:25,920 --> 00:38:30,480
Speaker 3: And that's great, but you you know, you can't just

751
00:38:30,560 --> 00:38:33,839
Speaker 3: be shooting at the bullseye all the time. Sometimes you've

752
00:38:33,840 --> 00:38:35,840
Speaker 3: got to walk away from the target. And then and

753
00:38:35,880 --> 00:38:39,200
Speaker 3: then these ideas just sort of slip in walking, you know,

754
00:38:39,280 --> 00:38:42,640
Speaker 3: without listening to music, jogging without listening to music, you know,

755
00:38:42,840 --> 00:38:46,919
Speaker 3: just not tackling the problem, just the letting it sort

756
00:38:46,960 --> 00:38:49,279
Speaker 3: of like just letting the yeast rise a bit in

757
00:38:49,320 --> 00:38:55,160
Speaker 3: your brain. That's really important. And I do like separating

758
00:38:55,200 --> 00:38:56,840
Speaker 3: out of all this because you know, I write music

759
00:38:56,840 --> 00:38:59,680
Speaker 3: and lyrics, and often those jobs are done by two

760
00:39:00,120 --> 00:39:04,359
Speaker 3: entirely different people collaborating together. So I, you know, I

761
00:39:04,520 --> 00:39:07,200
Speaker 3: have to find ways to collaborate with myself. And sometimes

762
00:39:07,200 --> 00:39:11,479
Speaker 3: that means I just get my skateboard and my lyric

763
00:39:11,520 --> 00:39:13,799
Speaker 3: book and I go to a park bench and I

764
00:39:13,880 --> 00:39:16,480
Speaker 3: just write. I write lyrics, and I don't have any

765
00:39:16,520 --> 00:39:19,040
Speaker 3: piano in front of me, and so the music I

766
00:39:19,080 --> 00:39:22,120
Speaker 3: hear is a lot better because I'm I'm musically, I'm

767
00:39:22,120 --> 00:39:23,920
Speaker 3: a lot better in my brain than I am in

768
00:39:23,920 --> 00:39:25,879
Speaker 3: my actual real world.

769
00:39:26,480 --> 00:39:28,839
Speaker 4: My fingers when you go to play.

770
00:39:29,000 --> 00:39:30,880
Speaker 3: When I go to play a piano, I'd imagine that

771
00:39:30,920 --> 00:39:33,000
Speaker 3: most people when they go to play an instrument, you

772
00:39:33,120 --> 00:39:37,440
Speaker 3: end up first. The first things that happen are your habits.

773
00:39:37,640 --> 00:39:40,120
Speaker 3: You know, where do your hands go when you first

774
00:39:40,160 --> 00:39:41,719
Speaker 3: play the piano? Where do your hands go your first

775
00:39:41,719 --> 00:39:44,799
Speaker 3: play guitar? Is it a certain chord or a song

776
00:39:44,880 --> 00:39:46,920
Speaker 3: that you know, or a progression that you know that

777
00:39:46,960 --> 00:39:49,399
Speaker 3: you like? And then you know, So you're sitting right

778
00:39:49,480 --> 00:39:54,040
Speaker 3: in your habit. And so it takes a long time

779
00:39:54,080 --> 00:39:57,320
Speaker 3: to play through that and to find some original musical

780
00:39:57,400 --> 00:40:00,120
Speaker 3: language that fits. But there is no way of getting

781
00:40:00,120 --> 00:40:03,000
Speaker 3: around it. You have to go through that process. But

782
00:40:03,040 --> 00:40:05,280
Speaker 3: if I'm just writing lyrics and I just hear stuff,

783
00:40:05,320 --> 00:40:08,359
Speaker 3: I can write lyrics to what I hear in my head,

784
00:40:08,360 --> 00:40:11,440
Speaker 3: and then I can sing into my voice memo. And

785
00:40:11,520 --> 00:40:14,120
Speaker 3: you know, the music is complex and it's not there

786
00:40:14,200 --> 00:40:16,799
Speaker 3: is no habit to kind of get through. And then

787
00:40:16,840 --> 00:40:19,279
Speaker 3: when I get back to the piano, I try and

788
00:40:19,360 --> 00:40:23,120
Speaker 3: honor that musical inspiration and go straight for that.

789
00:40:24,000 --> 00:40:26,040
Speaker 2: Do you approach it differently when you've got a hard

790
00:40:26,080 --> 00:40:26,879
Speaker 2: deadline to meet?

791
00:40:28,120 --> 00:40:29,800
Speaker 4: No? No, I mean.

792
00:40:31,080 --> 00:40:35,960
Speaker 3: I make decisions quicker. So I think that I'm always

793
00:40:36,320 --> 00:40:38,640
Speaker 3: putting percentages on things that I just make up, but

794
00:40:38,719 --> 00:40:41,440
Speaker 3: I'm going to like say, like ninety percent of art

795
00:40:41,520 --> 00:40:42,560
Speaker 3: is like making a decision.

796
00:40:43,600 --> 00:40:45,040
Speaker 4: You know, you just make aion, and.

797
00:40:44,960 --> 00:40:48,120
Speaker 3: When you're working really fast, you get good at making

798
00:40:48,120 --> 00:40:51,200
Speaker 3: decisions really quickly. But as soon as you make a decision,

799
00:40:51,239 --> 00:40:54,360
Speaker 3: you're actually blocking off a million pathways of what this

800
00:40:54,480 --> 00:40:59,160
Speaker 3: song could be, and you're living with crushing disappointment about

801
00:40:59,280 --> 00:41:02,480
Speaker 3: the the brilliant opus that you thought it would have been.

802
00:41:02,520 --> 00:41:05,240
Speaker 3: And now you know, all of those avenues are closing

803
00:41:05,239 --> 00:41:07,279
Speaker 3: down as you make more and more decisions, and it

804
00:41:07,320 --> 00:41:10,839
Speaker 3: just becomes what it is, which is great but disappointing

805
00:41:11,200 --> 00:41:12,759
Speaker 3: compared to what you had in your head. I think

806
00:41:12,800 --> 00:41:14,680
Speaker 3: Woody Allen spoke about that. I know I'm probably not

807
00:41:14,680 --> 00:41:17,480
Speaker 3: allowed to talk about Woody Allen, but anyway, you know,

808
00:41:17,480 --> 00:41:19,479
Speaker 3: he's like the process of writing a scriptures you write,

809
00:41:19,560 --> 00:41:21,000
Speaker 3: you sit in your bedroom and you come up with

810
00:41:21,000 --> 00:41:23,480
Speaker 3: this idea for this script and it's perfect and it's brilliant,

811
00:41:23,480 --> 00:41:25,400
Speaker 3: And the act of making a film is just making

812
00:41:25,440 --> 00:41:28,479
Speaker 3: you heaps of mistakes until you end up with something

813
00:41:28,560 --> 00:41:30,880
Speaker 3: far less than what you conceived in the beginning. And

814
00:41:31,239 --> 00:41:36,200
Speaker 3: a good filmmaker just tries to minimize those mistakes, and I,

815
00:41:36,280 --> 00:41:38,040
Speaker 3: you know, I do think that is the case. When

816
00:41:38,040 --> 00:41:39,680
Speaker 3: you're writing a lot, you get good at just making

817
00:41:39,680 --> 00:41:41,000
Speaker 3: you say, Okay, it's going to go Here're going to

818
00:41:41,080 --> 00:41:42,040
Speaker 3: go here, and you don't.

819
00:41:42,160 --> 00:41:43,360
Speaker 4: Worry about it too much.

820
00:41:43,600 --> 00:41:45,760
Speaker 3: Whereas you know, I'm on a bit of loosid deadline

821
00:41:45,800 --> 00:41:47,520
Speaker 3: now and I don't have as much time to write,

822
00:41:47,560 --> 00:41:50,880
Speaker 3: and there's nothing so often like go I've got a

823
00:41:50,880 --> 00:41:56,799
Speaker 3: song at the moment, which is a character ends up

824
00:41:56,800 --> 00:41:59,600
Speaker 3: on this garbage island, you know, the garbage Isle.

825
00:41:59,640 --> 00:42:01,200
Speaker 4: Let's fly in the Pacific, that giant.

826
00:42:01,800 --> 00:42:06,719
Speaker 3: Yeah, he ends up on that island, and there's like

827
00:42:06,719 --> 00:42:10,160
Speaker 3: a kind of a there's like a guy that is

828
00:42:10,239 --> 00:42:10,440
Speaker 3: like that.

829
00:42:10,480 --> 00:42:13,359
Speaker 4: I don't know, like them. He just pops up.

830
00:42:13,280 --> 00:42:15,719
Speaker 3: Out of the rubbish and he's he's like it's like

831
00:42:15,760 --> 00:42:18,160
Speaker 3: the love boat, you know, Welcome to Garbage Island. And

832
00:42:18,200 --> 00:42:20,080
Speaker 3: it's like got a theme song, you know what I mean,

833
00:42:21,440 --> 00:42:24,319
Speaker 3: And everyone you know is just sort of singing and

834
00:42:24,320 --> 00:42:26,680
Speaker 3: it's like you're reuniting with all the plastic you've ever

835
00:42:26,719 --> 00:42:28,839
Speaker 3: owned and it's all waiting here for you, and it's

836
00:42:28,920 --> 00:42:31,120
Speaker 3: like where you're home, you know what I mean, you're

837
00:42:31,160 --> 00:42:34,800
Speaker 3: home amongst all of your this, you made this welcome

838
00:42:34,840 --> 00:42:37,960
Speaker 3: and you will never leave. That kind of vime, which

839
00:42:38,000 --> 00:42:40,839
Speaker 3: is super fun and I love I think the love

840
00:42:40,880 --> 00:42:44,160
Speaker 3: boat theme is probably one of the greatest songs ever written.

841
00:42:44,200 --> 00:42:46,360
Speaker 3: It's just the way it's sort of you know what

842
00:42:46,360 --> 00:42:51,719
Speaker 3: I mean, even just like the love it's you know,

843
00:42:52,040 --> 00:42:54,280
Speaker 3: that kind of sumba beat underneath. It's so much fun.

844
00:42:54,800 --> 00:42:57,040
Speaker 3: So I'm like, okay, garbage, arn's got to be like that.

845
00:42:57,280 --> 00:43:01,080
Speaker 3: It's got to be very tropical and you know. And

846
00:43:01,120 --> 00:43:04,359
Speaker 3: so I've been obsessing about this song and I kind

847
00:43:04,360 --> 00:43:07,480
Speaker 3: of find it hard to finish it because it can

848
00:43:07,520 --> 00:43:09,560
Speaker 3: be so many things and I don't know which way

849
00:43:09,600 --> 00:43:12,240
Speaker 3: it wants to be and I'm not in My focus

850
00:43:12,280 --> 00:43:15,680
Speaker 3: is terrible, so I'm like procrastinating in an unhelpful way,

851
00:43:15,719 --> 00:43:18,640
Speaker 3: and I just can't get it done.

852
00:43:19,239 --> 00:43:24,160
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I can totally understand that, like where's its home?

853
00:43:24,960 --> 00:43:27,120
Speaker 2: Out of interest? Is it part of a show or

854
00:43:27,200 --> 00:43:27,440
Speaker 2: is it?

855
00:43:27,640 --> 00:43:34,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm writing a Christmas musical. Actually it doesn't sound

856
00:43:34,160 --> 00:43:38,600
Speaker 3: like Christmas musical, but it's pretty weird. And yeah, it's

857
00:43:38,680 --> 00:43:43,840
Speaker 3: kind of got a it's it's it's about life, it's

858
00:43:43,920 --> 00:43:46,319
Speaker 3: essentially like an adaptation of a Christmas Carol. So it's

859
00:43:46,360 --> 00:43:52,520
Speaker 3: about like life and connection and you know, compassion and

860
00:43:52,800 --> 00:43:55,000
Speaker 3: you know, using Christmas.

861
00:43:54,600 --> 00:43:56,440
Speaker 4: As as what I do is as.

862
00:43:56,360 --> 00:44:00,080
Speaker 3: A magical opportunity to change, you know, can any of

863
00:44:00,120 --> 00:44:02,880
Speaker 3: it's change. But it also has an environmental sort of

864
00:44:03,560 --> 00:44:08,520
Speaker 3: like substory. And so that's not a big thing because

865
00:44:08,760 --> 00:44:11,120
Speaker 3: no one wants to sit in a bloody you know,

866
00:44:11,960 --> 00:44:15,120
Speaker 3: environmental musical that stands on a soap box and get

867
00:44:15,360 --> 00:44:18,640
Speaker 3: ye resc. But it's in there, you know what I mean.

868
00:44:20,600 --> 00:44:22,319
Speaker 3: So yeah, yeah, that's part of a big thing.

869
00:44:22,760 --> 00:44:23,040
Speaker 2: Nice.

870
00:44:23,640 --> 00:44:27,000
Speaker 1: I look forward to seeing the Garbage song performed live

871
00:44:27,040 --> 00:44:27,880
Speaker 1: at some stage.

872
00:44:27,960 --> 00:44:29,960
Speaker 3: Oh my god, see I see that in my head

873
00:44:29,960 --> 00:44:32,280
Speaker 3: and there's like, you know, I mean, this is the idea.

874
00:44:32,320 --> 00:44:36,120
Speaker 3: The look of mirror ball on garbage. It's quite a

875
00:44:36,160 --> 00:44:39,000
Speaker 3: New York look actually. I think about like, you know

876
00:44:39,040 --> 00:44:41,120
Speaker 3: how plastic bags when they get really old, they get

877
00:44:41,120 --> 00:44:44,680
Speaker 3: a like shredded and gross and dirty, and they's kind

878
00:44:44,680 --> 00:44:48,160
Speaker 3: of wave like rags like little flags on in New York.

879
00:44:48,160 --> 00:44:49,920
Speaker 3: They get stuck in the trees and it's just like

880
00:44:49,960 --> 00:44:53,640
Speaker 3: a tree has no leaves, it just has these waving, raggedy,

881
00:44:54,480 --> 00:44:57,120
Speaker 3: dirty plastic rags.

882
00:44:56,719 --> 00:45:00,600
Speaker 4: Hanging off it. Oh my god, it's so pressing.

883
00:45:01,520 --> 00:45:03,640
Speaker 1: Now on that depressing note, Eddie, for people that want

884
00:45:03,680 --> 00:45:06,520
Speaker 1: to connect with you in some way, or say nine

885
00:45:06,560 --> 00:45:08,719
Speaker 1: to five, what is the best way for people to

886
00:45:08,760 --> 00:45:09,799
Speaker 1: do any of those things?

887
00:45:09,960 --> 00:45:12,799
Speaker 3: Well, nine to five it's a really great show. It's

888
00:45:12,800 --> 00:45:16,040
Speaker 3: actually it's actually yeah, it's actually a really terrific show.

889
00:45:16,440 --> 00:45:18,279
Speaker 3: I didn't know much about it before I signed on

890
00:45:18,320 --> 00:45:20,600
Speaker 3: to do it. And I know that, you know, because

891
00:45:20,600 --> 00:45:23,480
Speaker 3: of the combination of you know, Dolly Parton and you know,

892
00:45:23,520 --> 00:45:26,560
Speaker 3: being a movie adaptation and there being a lot of

893
00:45:26,600 --> 00:45:30,000
Speaker 3: like really you know, hip musicals on at the moment,

894
00:45:30,280 --> 00:45:33,520
Speaker 3: you know, issues based Jacob Little Pill and you've got

895
00:45:33,640 --> 00:45:38,560
Speaker 3: you know, Hamilton revisioning history and ethnicity, and then you've

896
00:45:38,560 --> 00:45:41,320
Speaker 3: got six. You know, it's all that kind of girl

897
00:45:41,400 --> 00:45:44,839
Speaker 3: power and feminist revision of history, and like, you know,

898
00:45:45,280 --> 00:45:47,480
Speaker 3: I know that nine to five. The musical sort of

899
00:45:47,560 --> 00:45:50,200
Speaker 3: is this sort of eighties musical musical set in the

900
00:45:50,280 --> 00:45:54,320
Speaker 3: nineteen eighties office politics around gender. It sort of seems

901
00:45:54,360 --> 00:45:56,920
Speaker 3: like it's not exactly cutting edge, but it is one

902
00:45:56,960 --> 00:46:00,600
Speaker 3: of the wittiest books by pat Resnik, and the songs

903
00:46:00,600 --> 00:46:03,400
Speaker 3: are amazing and the cast is phenomenal. We've got Marina

904
00:46:03,440 --> 00:46:07,719
Speaker 3: Pryor plays the main protagonist, Violet Newstead, and she is

905
00:46:07,840 --> 00:46:11,840
Speaker 3: so funny and so good. And we have Casey Donovan's

906
00:46:11,840 --> 00:46:15,239
Speaker 3: in the show playing Judy Burnley, who's a woman who

907
00:46:15,320 --> 00:46:18,440
Speaker 3: has been dumped by her husband and has never worked

908
00:46:18,840 --> 00:46:22,440
Speaker 3: before and sort of lies and get a job in

909
00:46:22,440 --> 00:46:25,600
Speaker 3: this office and is very meek and mild, and she

910
00:46:25,800 --> 00:46:31,040
Speaker 3: is extraordinary. And Erin Claire plays the Dolly Parton role

911
00:46:31,040 --> 00:46:34,440
Speaker 3: and she's absolutely brilliant. And we've got legendary Callin O'Connor

912
00:46:34,520 --> 00:46:37,360
Speaker 3: is in the show. So it's an extraordinary cast and

913
00:46:37,400 --> 00:46:40,720
Speaker 3: it's a really funny show. So I highly recommend people

914
00:46:40,760 --> 00:46:44,680
Speaker 3: coming to see it. We're here till the seventeenth September

915
00:46:44,719 --> 00:46:47,360
Speaker 3: and then we go to Adelaide for four weeks and

916
00:46:47,360 --> 00:46:49,480
Speaker 3: then we're done amazing.

917
00:46:49,719 --> 00:46:52,879
Speaker 1: And to connect with you personally on the socials, what's

918
00:46:52,920 --> 00:46:54,000
Speaker 1: the best way for people to do that?

919
00:46:54,040 --> 00:46:55,680
Speaker 4: I mean, you can try. I'm pretty bad.

920
00:46:56,320 --> 00:46:58,400
Speaker 3: You can come follow me on my Instagram if you

921
00:46:58,400 --> 00:47:00,800
Speaker 3: want to see lots of pictures of dogs and cats

922
00:47:00,840 --> 00:47:05,600
Speaker 3: and lambs. We've got two lambs. It's basically animals. If

923
00:47:05,600 --> 00:47:12,000
Speaker 3: you're into animals and that's Edmund Perfect at Edmund d

924
00:47:12,200 --> 00:47:13,960
Speaker 3: m U n D. I did have one. I did

925
00:47:14,080 --> 00:47:17,480
Speaker 3: have an Instagram account, Eddie Perfect. And then I'm going

926
00:47:17,520 --> 00:47:19,440
Speaker 3: to fight with my wife and I just deleted it.

927
00:47:19,560 --> 00:47:20,040
Speaker 4: The whole thing.

928
00:47:20,120 --> 00:47:23,560
Speaker 3: She's getting annoyed that I posted something size fine, and

929
00:47:23,600 --> 00:47:25,200
Speaker 3: then I was like, okay, I bet it go and

930
00:47:25,719 --> 00:47:27,080
Speaker 3: the name was gone, so I have to go to

931
00:47:27,120 --> 00:47:27,800
Speaker 3: my real name.

932
00:47:27,640 --> 00:47:30,960
Speaker 2: Which is Edmund Well Edmund Eddie.

933
00:47:31,040 --> 00:47:34,320
Speaker 1: It's been great talking to you at unpacking your process.

934
00:47:34,360 --> 00:47:35,239
Speaker 2: Thank you so much for you.

935
00:47:36,000 --> 00:47:38,960
Speaker 4: I hope it's been somewhat useful.

936
00:47:39,760 --> 00:47:43,040
Speaker 2: It's been very useful. Thank you. One of my favorite

937
00:47:43,080 --> 00:47:47,160
Speaker 2: parts of this interview was the soft lead pencil advice

938
00:47:47,520 --> 00:47:51,200
Speaker 2: about building procrastination into a creative process.

939
00:47:51,600 --> 00:47:55,439
Speaker 1: I think that we often a quick to label procrastination

940
00:47:55,560 --> 00:47:58,680
Speaker 1: as this evil thing that is the villain of productivity,

941
00:47:58,960 --> 00:48:02,680
Speaker 1: but actually, when you're working, and especially doing creative work,

942
00:48:02,960 --> 00:48:06,160
Speaker 1: procrastination is a really great opportunity to take a break

943
00:48:06,480 --> 00:48:09,719
Speaker 1: and let things wander around in your mind, and more

944
00:48:09,840 --> 00:48:12,359
Speaker 1: from than not, when you return to the task at hand,

945
00:48:12,640 --> 00:48:15,880
Speaker 1: you'll have some new thoughts and momentum to move you forward.

946
00:48:16,840 --> 00:48:20,040
Speaker 1: How I work is produced by Inventium with production support

947
00:48:20,080 --> 00:48:23,279
Speaker 1: from Dead Set Studios. The producer for this episode was

948
00:48:23,320 --> 00:48:26,239
Speaker 1: Liam Riordan, and thank you to mat Nimba who does

949
00:48:26,280 --> 00:48:29,479
Speaker 1: the audio mix for every episode and makes everything sound

950
00:48:29,520 --> 00:48:31,480
Speaker 1: so much better than it would have otherwise.

951
00:48:32,040 --> 00:48:32,839
Speaker 2: See you next time.