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Speaker 1: When I make with these communities, it actually feels like

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Speaker 1: it's their tournament. It's not our tournament, it's theirs and

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Speaker 1: they're shaping it, which is what I love.

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Speaker 2: With seventy caps and thirty five international goals to her name,

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Speaker 2: Sarah Walsh is one of the most formidable Matildas to

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Speaker 2: ever play football for Australia, sitting fifth on the old

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Speaker 2: Time Matilda's goalscorers list.

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Speaker 3: While she was as much.

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Speaker 2: As a weapon off the field as she was on it,

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Speaker 2: serving as a longtime member of the Professional Football's Association

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Speaker 2: and playing a pivotal role in helping the Tillies secure

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Speaker 2: their first collective bargaineer agreement back in twenty ten. In

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Speaker 2: that same year, she also lifted the Asian Cup with

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Speaker 2: the Matildas and now sixteen years later, is working as

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Speaker 2: Chief Operations Officer at the twenty twenty six Women's Asian

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Speaker 2: Cup as the Tillies try to lift that iconic piece

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Speaker 2: of silverware once again. Welcome back to the Female Athlete

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Speaker 2: Project and thanks for pressing play on today's episode. My

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Speaker 2: name is Sophie Norris and I'm the producer here at teavapp.

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Speaker 2: Today we sit down with Matilda number one hundred and

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Speaker 2: twenty five while Australia is in the midst of hosting

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Speaker 2: Asia's biggest women's football tournament, while she opens up on

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Speaker 2: how she overcame adversity early in her career to eventually

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Speaker 2: make her Matilda's debut at age twenty one, how she

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Speaker 2: learned to use her voice to speak up for the

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Speaker 2: women's program, and what led her to land pivotal roles

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Speaker 2: in both the Women's World Cup and the current Women's

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Speaker 2: Asian Cup on Australian soil. We hope you enjoy this

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Speaker 2: episode and don't forget to grab your tickets to the

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Speaker 2: Women's Asian Cup happening now. Twelve of Asia's best teams

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Speaker 2: are battling it out on Australian shores and it's something

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Speaker 2: you don't want to miss.

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Speaker 3: Sarah Walsh, Welcome to the Female Athlete Project.

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Speaker 1: Great to be here nine days out until the tournament.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, sorry about that.

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Speaker 1: It's okay. This is where else will it be?

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Speaker 3: I love her? I love that. How are you feeling?

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Speaker 3: Has it been a hectic lead in? It?

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Speaker 1: Has it's been? You know? I was the only employee

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Speaker 1: of the LC eighteen months ago, only on Yeah, so

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Speaker 1: we build up the subsidiary to run the tournament, reports

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Speaker 1: up into FA as a wholly owned subsidiary of Football Australia.

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Speaker 1: It's a different model to what happened for the Women's

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Speaker 1: World Cup. And so we set up a floor downstairs

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Speaker 1: at FA headquarters and yeah, we are one hundred and

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Speaker 1: fifty six I think today, and we'll have our twelve

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Speaker 1: hundred volunteers and huge. But we have such a good team.

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Speaker 1: It's so many learnings. I mean, building a team so

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Speaker 1: quickly you know you want to do all these things.

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Speaker 1: How do you scale your leadership so quickly when you

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Speaker 1: know the entity won't exist in a couple months time,

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Speaker 1: So it's you know, it's like a mini startup.

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Speaker 3: Yes, without yeah that long term, it must feel quite

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Speaker 3: a strange experience to do. Like I imagine a lot

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Speaker 3: of people who end up working in these spaces kind

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Speaker 3: of go from event to events, so they're used to

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Speaker 3: the nature of it. But it must feel so weird

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Speaker 3: to pouse so much energy and something you feel so

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Speaker 3: strongly about into something that will then be over.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, well that's the workforce. I mean, I'm relatively

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Speaker 1: new to the event industry. I've obviously played in tournaments

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Speaker 1: and that absolutely helps having played them in terms of

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Speaker 1: having gone through the back end operations, having played on

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Speaker 1: the pitch, you know all the fundamentals around what should

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Speaker 1: what you need to get right? You know, what are

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Speaker 1: the things that are absolutely critical, and what are the

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Speaker 1: things that are nice to have, particularly if you're set

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Speaker 1: setting something up so quickly. So just for comparison, in

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Speaker 1: twenty fifteen, the men's Asian cut was delivered, same size,

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Speaker 1: five stadiums, relatively same sized workforce. They had four years

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Speaker 1: to deliberate, so it would have been nice to take

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Speaker 1: a year to build out your planning processes and systems.

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Speaker 1: We did that whilst we were We used to have

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Speaker 1: this phrase while we were building the plane while we

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Speaker 1: were flying, which sounds a bit dangerous, you know.

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Speaker 3: A little bit.

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Speaker 1: We're not surgeons, We're putting on football matches. So yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: I think the team would have liked a little bit

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Speaker 1: of time. But there's some You'll know this as a player.

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Speaker 1: You know, something I've used from my playing days is

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Speaker 1: like being disciplined with your time and the amount of

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Speaker 1: focus you get closer. You're just so deliberate where you

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Speaker 1: spend your time the conversations that you have, where you

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Speaker 1: lean in, where you lean out. I actually quite like

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Speaker 1: that because this is why we trained for eighteen months,

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Speaker 1: is to actually play. And that's what I remind my

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Speaker 1: team about. It's going to be you know, the stress

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Speaker 1: levels is going to be high, and you just have

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Speaker 1: to be you know really Yeah, discipline around where you

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Speaker 1: spend your time now, because that's our most valued commodity time.

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Speaker 3: I appreciate you spending some of that time with I'm

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Speaker 3: keen to jump into your I guess your your post

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Speaker 3: playing career and looking at Asian Cup and what you

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Speaker 3: did with the World Cup. But to kick us off,

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Speaker 3: can you can you take us back and describe she's

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Speaker 3: a little kid.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I saw this question depends who you ask. I

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Speaker 1: think I was. I don't have great memories. Sorry, I

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Speaker 1: have great memories of my childhood. I just don't have

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Speaker 1: a very good memory. I think I was pretty determined,

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Speaker 1: if I could use one word, it's pretty common. I'm

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Speaker 1: sure you were pretty determined and pretty obsessed with football,

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Speaker 1: and so it's probably why I don't remember much about school.

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Speaker 1: I don't remember much about anything other than going to

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Speaker 1: training and being obsessed with kicking a ball, you know,

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Speaker 1: at any spare moment I had, So there's not a

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Speaker 1: moment in my I'm going I started playing at four

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Speaker 1: or five, so it really has been my life. I've

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Speaker 1: been obsessed with it since I was young. So yeah,

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Speaker 1: I was determined and passionate. I think my parents would

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Speaker 1: have different words for that, but it never sat still. Really, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: where did the obsession come from? No, I because no

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Speaker 1: one else played it in my family. Yeah. I went

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Speaker 1: down to a football my older brother, sorry, played and

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Speaker 1: so I'd be on the sidelines and there were you know,

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Speaker 1: teams of my age around five, and I was like, oh,

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Speaker 1: can I play? And I think there was a family friend.

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Speaker 1: There was always some male sponsor. It was like, look,

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Speaker 1: she can play. We're not sure if it's allowed. And

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Speaker 1: I was just obsessed from them. So yeah, and then

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Speaker 1: I think my brother didn't play any longer after that, so.

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Speaker 3: He took the line light.

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Speaker 1: I thought he was into it, but I was. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: I loved it, and I also did a little athletics.

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Speaker 3: So you had a number of injuries as a teenager,

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Speaker 3: a number of big injuries. What was that experience like

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Speaker 3: for you?

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Speaker 1: There is Yeah, there's no doubt that those. So I

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Speaker 1: had three new reconstructions, full knee reconstructions by eighteen.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, really young. Yeah, there's a couple of.

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Speaker 1: Players in the a leagues that have done I think McNamara. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: you've got to be pretty determined to keep going after that.

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Speaker 1: And yeah, and I had doctors saying, look, just you

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Speaker 1: should stop you Biologically you're not You're not built to

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Speaker 1: be you know, turning how you need to turn and

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Speaker 1: nies are a common injury in football. But yeah, I

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Speaker 1: would say I made the national team at about fifteen sixteen,

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Speaker 1: so I thought I was pretty good. And so then

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Speaker 1: I think it was fifteen sixteen I did my first

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Speaker 1: kneed and it happened to just be a freak accident.

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Speaker 1: It wasn't because of my body had let me down.

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Speaker 1: Someone trotted my foot and I turned. So that was

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Speaker 1: the start of it. Had a really great rehab and

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Speaker 1: then come back and made the Aussie squad again, and

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Speaker 1: I was going to go into camp and just my

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Speaker 1: right one come from under me, which is quite common

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Speaker 1: after you do you first. So I did a really

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Speaker 1: great rehab and then I come back and I did

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Speaker 1: it again, and I was like, all right, this is

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Speaker 1: this is something wrong here. So I ended up taken

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Speaker 1: a couple of years off. But I think there's no

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Speaker 1: way I would be who I am today if I

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Speaker 1: had an easy, coasting teenage years, you know, playing for

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Speaker 1: the national team like the Caplin Fords and the sand

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Speaker 1: Curve started so early and played for so long. It was, yeah,

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Speaker 1: it was. It was really tough. So I actually gave

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Speaker 1: it away for a year or so, and then I

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Speaker 1: debuted it when I was twenty one, which is actually

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Speaker 1: really late to debut because I've given it away for

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Speaker 1: a couple of years, and I think at that point,

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Speaker 1: you just like, gratitude is the word, you know. I

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Speaker 1: never thought i'd actually wear the jersey after that, so yeah,

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Speaker 1: I remember wearing it for the first time thinking I

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Speaker 1: might only get to wear it once because my knee

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Speaker 1: might blow out. But I literally felt like that every

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Speaker 1: time I put it on for ten years. So just

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Speaker 1: gratitude is what I had. So when I retired, it

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Speaker 1: was actually easy to walk away because I had kind

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Speaker 1: of ten bonus years.

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Speaker 3: In my mind, It's pretty amazing perspective to have as

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Speaker 3: a twenty one year old, you know, Like I feel

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Speaker 3: like if I reflect on my career. It wasn't until

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Speaker 3: I was, you know, like late twenties, early thirties that

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Speaker 3: I not appreciate. I loved it the whole way through

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Speaker 3: and appreciated it. But I think you kind of look

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Speaker 3: back on when you're a youngster and there's elite, high

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Speaker 3: performance environments for you to be I don't know, to

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Speaker 3: have a solid head on your shoulders at that age

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Speaker 3: is pretty impressive. Do you think that was the reflection

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Speaker 3: of the injury process.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's pretty humbling to sit on the sidelines for

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Speaker 1: three years and watch your best mates played for Australia

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Speaker 1: and I remember, oh, yeah, I got into before the Olympics,

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Speaker 1: so I probably would I would have been in the

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Speaker 1: Olympic squad. So Heather Garriott and I grew up together.

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Speaker 1: She has like one hundred more caps than me, and

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Speaker 1: we started playing and made the Elsie squad together. So

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Speaker 1: that's how many caps I probably missed. But that just

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Speaker 1: goes to show that I was in two thousand Olympics

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Speaker 1: and I'd just done my knee, so I didn't watch

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Speaker 1: any of it, but I turned on to watch Kathy

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Speaker 1: and I told Kathy fram in this story. Actually, when

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Speaker 1: I met a join.

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Speaker 3: My buckets.

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Speaker 1: Don't you got to meet her? Are you happy?

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Speaker 3: Can you happy? Please? Can you hook a sister up?

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Speaker 1: Come on, I don't have some connection, but I cannot

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Speaker 1: find someone that does.

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Speaker 3: And I told her this story.

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Speaker 1: She also down in the dumps, and I mean, got

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Speaker 1: an Olympics in your home city. It was forty minutes

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Speaker 1: from where I live. So I was pretty dedicated to

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Speaker 1: not watch a thing. I didn't watch any of the football.

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Speaker 3: That was just so hard.

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Speaker 1: But I turned on to watch her and that little

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Speaker 1: fire on me again just to see that. So I

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Speaker 1: told her that story during the World Cup. And then

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Speaker 1: she told me a story that the materials have been

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Speaker 1: quite profound for her because she met them before the

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Speaker 1: Women's World Cup and and she said to me that

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Speaker 1: her daughter just didn't really get the fuss on why

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Speaker 1: Austraya fussed over Kathy. You know, she's seen a race

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Speaker 1: and stuff, but you just it's it's such a disconnect

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Speaker 1: if you weren't there and totally, but they went and

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Speaker 1: met the Matilda's before the World Cup, and they were

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Speaker 1: her idols, her daughter's idols, and they saw her idols

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Speaker 1: looking up to her mom. And that was the moment

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Speaker 1: the Penny dropped for her daughter that her mum was

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Speaker 1: someone that's powerful, I know. So she was thanking me

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Speaker 1: for giving her that moment. I'm like, wow, Kathy Freeman, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's pretty big, but she'd been so profound for me

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Speaker 1: in that moment to give it one more crack.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, imagine being Kathy with your daughter being like, no,

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Speaker 3: I'm telling you, like I changed in this country, I

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Speaker 3: swear to you.

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Speaker 1: And she's seen the videos and the you know, the

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Speaker 1: around the track with the flag, but she saw you know,

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Speaker 1: the Matildas at their peak wanting photos with her mom,

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Speaker 1: and I think that was changing for their family. Yeah.

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Speaker 3: So you missed out on that that would have been

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Speaker 3: really tough and didn't watch any But two thousand and

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Speaker 3: six was Asian Cup on home soil. That experience. Did

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Speaker 3: that heal some things? Yeah?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think. You know, it's like when you're a

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Speaker 1: young player, well twenty one, you should be a young player. Actually,

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Speaker 1: if the balance of the squad and workload has been

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Speaker 1: managed over the over the years, you should have some

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Speaker 1: thirty year olds, you should have some late twenties. And

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Speaker 1: so I was, you know, I can't remember how old

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Speaker 1: I was twenty one, so I was still trying to

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Speaker 1: establish myself in the squad. I don't know how many

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Speaker 1: caps I'd had, but I was scoring goals and kind

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Speaker 1: of takes you a few years to feel like, well

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Speaker 1: not a few years, but to feel like you actually

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Speaker 1: belong there. You look at you're playing with some of

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Speaker 1: your role models that you've looked up to. You know,

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Speaker 1: you've got Shell Salisbury, youet dialogic, they were defenders, but

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Speaker 1: these players that had worn the jersey forever. So that

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Speaker 1: was the first tournament on home sal Women's Asian Cup.

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Speaker 1: It was really pivotal time for Australian football. It was

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Speaker 1: the first time we'd played in Asia because we were

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Speaker 1: in Oceania, and so what that meant was we were

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Speaker 1: playing powerhouses like Japan and China. So I think we

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Speaker 1: weren't really there wasn't great expectations on us to make

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Speaker 1: the World Cup. That was a qualified for the World Cup.

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Speaker 1: We went all the way to the final to play China.

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Speaker 1: So yeah, no, and I do recall I scored a

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Speaker 1: couple of goals in that and felt like I belonged

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Speaker 1: And yeah.

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Speaker 3: And then twenty ten, you guys win and it's the

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Speaker 3: first major trophy for an Australian football team. What was

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Speaker 3: it like to be part of something like that?

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Speaker 1: It was great, fantastic. We'd had a lot of transition

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Speaker 1: through the squad, it was and again you might get

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Speaker 1: a different story from someone else was there. My memory

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Speaker 1: wasn't great, but I remember I was pretty injured. I'd

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Speaker 1: come back my NAT. So when you have three new reconstructions,

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Speaker 1: so I sets in it twenty five and I kept

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Speaker 1: having to have multiple just arthroscopes to get cartilage out

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Speaker 1: that kept flicking off. You know, it's like a gross

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Speaker 1: either a knee person or an ankle personality. Yeah, And

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Speaker 1: so I had had surge four weeks before the tournament,

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Speaker 1: and I had to because I had to get just

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Speaker 1: I just had to keep getting cartiage pulled out because

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Speaker 1: it would flick off. And four weeks to come back

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Speaker 1: is like you're pushing it. Oh yeah, So I was fit.

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Speaker 1: I think I was playing in the US and they

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Speaker 1: were just going to see maybe if I was used

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Speaker 1: at the back end of the tournament, but I ended

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Speaker 1: up playing. I think I played a full game against

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Speaker 1: China then or I come on for a career, and

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Speaker 1: then I played a full game against Japan in the

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Speaker 1: semi and yeah it was. I was meant to play

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Speaker 1: in the final, but that night my knee clicked in

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Speaker 1: the bathroom and I needed surgery.

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Speaker 3: Again.

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Speaker 1: I'd pushed it too hard, too early. Yeah, and so yeah,

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Speaker 1: Sam started in the final and scores and did the

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Speaker 1: backflip and it was really a turning point for the

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Speaker 1: next generation. I remember after that, I ended up retiring

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Speaker 1: two years after. I mean, Sam was. It just goes

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Speaker 1: to show that what is It's how many years ago

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Speaker 1: was it?

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Speaker 3: Now?

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Speaker 1: It's sixteen years ago. That's how long Sam's been playing

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Speaker 1: international team and she's still the only player in our

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Speaker 1: current team that has lifted a trophy in international trophy. Yeah. Wow,

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Speaker 1: the hunger in that team to lift something for the

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Speaker 1: Matildas is there. But yeah, it was just a really

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Speaker 1: pivotal moment for the transition of the team to Sam

301
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Speaker 1: was young, but that was my time out and then

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Speaker 1: there was this next generation of mid twenties that were

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Speaker 1: coming through you and tameke A Yallop, you had Kaya Simon's.

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Speaker 1: It was their moment to start getting more game time

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Speaker 1: after that, and we'd won something.

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Speaker 3: So that year as well. You're part of some negotiations

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Speaker 3: to get pretty significant pay increases for the Matildas. What

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Speaker 3: was that process like if you kind of compared what

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Speaker 3: that process looks like back in twenty ten compared to

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Speaker 3: potential negotiations these days.

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Speaker 1: I've never been asked that. Actually, while I was on

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Speaker 1: the player side in twenty ten, and it was we

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Speaker 1: had Brendan Schwab was at the Players Association and he

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Speaker 1: did a great job at I think thinking forward around Okay, well,

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Speaker 1: this is what we'll ask for this cycle, and this

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Speaker 1: is what we'll ask for the next, because if you

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Speaker 1: ask for too much in the I'm pretty well equipped

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Speaker 1: on cbas now from a player and a federation side.

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Speaker 1: But yeah, it's all about where you start and where

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Speaker 1: you want to end. And you know your green amber red,

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Speaker 1: what do you what are you happy to give away?

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Speaker 1: And what do you what are you not? And at

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Speaker 1: the time, something that was really important to us was

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Speaker 1: just simple security. We were on We went on contracts,

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Speaker 1: so we actually didn't have a collective bug at agreement.

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Speaker 1: We were paid per diems and they were fine, but

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Speaker 1: you know, if you got injured, there was no kind

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Speaker 1: of even other federation through the coach would support kind

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Speaker 1: of your best players. There was no security, so people

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Speaker 1: wanted to even rent, Like you know, it's like you

331
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Speaker 1: actually need some form of documentation so that you work

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Speaker 1: fore you know, it's like oh yeah, yeah, And so

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Speaker 1: that cycle was really about getting contracted, getting conditions signed

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Speaker 1: up like laundry and Wi Fi on trips, and the

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Speaker 1: fundamentals like covering travel tool from the airport to for

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Speaker 1: your time away. We set out some really good play

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Speaker 1: development programs at the time that used to sit with

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Speaker 1: the Federation, So we had these employee recognition programs. They

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Speaker 1: were great. So the money wasn't enough to be able

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Speaker 1: to survive on. But what we did was through a

341
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Speaker 1: guy called Glenn Warry who was very influential in mentoring me.

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Speaker 1: He set up a really great program for employers. So

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Speaker 1: I worked with Rebel Sport. At the time, I wouldn't

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Speaker 1: have been able to pay my rent, like just with

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Speaker 1: what we were paid, and so they would just give

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Speaker 1: me work whenever I was home, casual work, and yeah,

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Speaker 1: it was fantastic and easy work like in retail, not

348
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Speaker 1: too strenuous. So yeah, but yet that was a good

349
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Speaker 1: step forward. But it was a new concept and we

350
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Speaker 1: didn't see too many women's teams. It wasn't like there's

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Speaker 1: a blueprint in other sports happening. We didn't have a blueprint.

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Speaker 1: Actually was Socceros had a CBA that had gone for

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Speaker 1: a while, so I knew we were obviously working with

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Speaker 1: the same players union. So I can't remember how old

355
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Speaker 1: it was, but I definitely with someone. You know, I

356
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Speaker 1: was raised, if you're going to complain about something you

357
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Speaker 1: want to if you if you're in a position to

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Speaker 1: do something about it, you should absolutely put your hand

359
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Speaker 1: up and do something about it. So I was on

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Speaker 1: the players committee, and so I attended all the meetings

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Speaker 1: and soaked all that up. And yeah, that did move

362
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Speaker 1: us forward incrementally, very slowly.

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Speaker 3: And that skill set is obviously something that's helped you significantly.

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Speaker 3: I'd imagine in your current career. How did you kind

365
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Speaker 3: of develop that voice and the ability to advocate for

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Speaker 3: yourself and your teammates in that space.

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Speaker 1: Oh, I tell you what, it's so much easier when

368
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Speaker 1: I said I played athletics or I did athletics, and

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Speaker 1: it's mostly just because I was quick. I would do

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Speaker 1: the sixty meter hurdles and I used to be up

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Speaker 1: against Jana Pittman. Actually, no way, I'll get your photos.

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Speaker 1: She's like meter taller than me. Yeah, how did I

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Speaker 1: have the hurdles? There were sixty meter hurdles, so they

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Speaker 1: were the little one.

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Speaker 3: So that's why I had to give it up.

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Speaker 1: Anyway. The point is I hated it so much. Okay,

377
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Speaker 1: like I did it because I was fast, But there's

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Speaker 1: something about team sport that I thrived in. I don't

379
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Speaker 1: think it's the pressure or not wanting all the pressure

380
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Speaker 1: to be on myself, but I thrive off being able

381
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Speaker 1: to leverage those moments with other people. And so that's

382
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Speaker 1: probably why I loved football anyway. But back to negotiating,

383
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Speaker 1: When you're negotiating for a team, like I was dogged,

384
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Speaker 1: it wasn't just for me, it was for something much

385
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Speaker 1: bigger than us. And it makes it easier, I think,

386
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Speaker 1: to ask, Yeah, because you're kind of asking for a

387
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Speaker 1: cause there's something much bigger than yourself. So that's why

388
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Speaker 1: I found it easy to ask. And I think something

389
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Speaker 1: that I've learned over the years and I still use

390
00:20:32,480 --> 00:20:35,840
Speaker 1: it today, is how disarming asking questions can be if

391
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Speaker 1: you ask the right ones, and you can find middle

392
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Speaker 1: ground with people that you don't you don't share common

393
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Speaker 1: views on because you'll find that most of the nose

394
00:20:47,440 --> 00:20:49,960
Speaker 1: that you receive, will barriers you come up up against

395
00:20:49,960 --> 00:20:54,800
Speaker 1: are really fear based. They're never rational. And we see

396
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Speaker 1: that now. Look at the Matilda's. They're one of the

397
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Speaker 1: most commercial brands, and it's because we believed in it.

398
00:20:59,520 --> 00:21:02,520
Speaker 1: There were way more people than me that were driving it.

399
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Speaker 1: And that's how I would say that the change was

400
00:21:07,840 --> 00:21:11,679
Speaker 1: affected through many many Matildas over the years. Yulyidier Williams

401
00:21:12,359 --> 00:21:14,679
Speaker 1: what they did in twenty fifteen, they took a stand

402
00:21:14,760 --> 00:21:18,000
Speaker 1: and I was in the Federation then. Actually that was

403
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Speaker 1: quite hard to watch because I was working at the

404
00:21:20,680 --> 00:21:27,560
Speaker 1: Federation and I think all these little moments and I

405
00:21:27,600 --> 00:21:30,920
Speaker 1: guess movements have contributed to where they are today. There's

406
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Speaker 1: no doubt would have happened if we hadn't have reached

407
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Speaker 1: what we did in twenty ten. I think in twenty

408
00:21:36,359 --> 00:21:39,920
Speaker 1: nineteen that was the big one. A couple of things

409
00:21:39,920 --> 00:21:43,280
Speaker 1: that need to be right for that and the Matilda's

410
00:21:43,280 --> 00:21:47,359
Speaker 1: that always wanted equal paying conditions, but it was the time.

411
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Speaker 1: If you think about it, it's a finite plot of

412
00:21:50,880 --> 00:21:55,520
Speaker 1: investment that the National Team department has, that the Federation has,

413
00:21:55,760 --> 00:22:00,320
Speaker 1: who's deciding on where that gets spent and why. But

414
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Speaker 1: I think the thing that changed. Up until twenty nineteen,

415
00:22:03,840 --> 00:22:06,119
Speaker 1: we've been negotiating in a different room to what the

416
00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:09,560
Speaker 1: soccer who's had, So they were negotiating for what they

417
00:22:09,600 --> 00:22:12,480
Speaker 1: wanted and we were negotiating for what we wanted. In

418
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Speaker 1: twenty nineteen, they come together and decided on a framework

419
00:22:16,080 --> 00:22:20,560
Speaker 1: of equality and there were three there were five, sorry,

420
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Speaker 1: five soccer us in the room, and that's why it happened.

421
00:22:23,600 --> 00:22:25,360
Speaker 1: Federation thought it was a good idea at that point,

422
00:22:25,480 --> 00:22:27,119
Speaker 1: until it was always thought it was a great idea.

423
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Speaker 1: Players Union, A guy called John de Luca. He was fantastic.

424
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Speaker 1: He come in and said, this is a good idea.

425
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Speaker 1: When you've got the four decision makers thinking it's a

426
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Speaker 1: good idea, that's how it happens. You really need the

427
00:22:41,160 --> 00:22:44,080
Speaker 1: man in the room and some of those soccer us.

428
00:22:44,080 --> 00:22:46,720
Speaker 1: Straight after the World Cup with the first people I

429
00:22:46,800 --> 00:22:49,520
Speaker 1: called to say, hey, you did this. That's four years

430
00:22:49,520 --> 00:22:53,919
Speaker 1: of equal pay twenty nineteen to twenty three. That's what

431
00:22:53,960 --> 00:22:54,320
Speaker 1: I did.

432
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Speaker 3: Wow. Yeah, that's powerful now, that unity piece. How was

433
00:22:59,840 --> 00:23:02,320
Speaker 3: it experience for you going from being a player who

434
00:23:02,359 --> 00:23:04,920
Speaker 3: was advocating for the players to move to the federation side.

435
00:23:05,000 --> 00:23:06,760
Speaker 3: Was that a tricky thing to do or did you

436
00:23:06,800 --> 00:23:09,760
Speaker 3: feel like you were, I don't know, equipped with more

437
00:23:09,760 --> 00:23:11,840
Speaker 3: knowledge when you moved to that federation side. In a

438
00:23:11,840 --> 00:23:15,520
Speaker 3: different sense, I.

439
00:23:15,440 --> 00:23:17,879
Speaker 1: Think my colleagues would have called me pretty annoying. Again,

440
00:23:18,040 --> 00:23:21,520
Speaker 1: like you know, changing the system from within or trying

441
00:23:21,520 --> 00:23:24,399
Speaker 1: to not change it, trying to influence it. There are

442
00:23:24,400 --> 00:23:29,000
Speaker 1: a lot of really great people. I'd tell you what.

443
00:23:29,080 --> 00:23:30,960
Speaker 1: When I first got in there, I started to realize

444
00:23:31,119 --> 00:23:34,840
Speaker 1: very quickly. Why you know, we won the women's Asian

445
00:23:34,880 --> 00:23:39,160
Speaker 1: Cup in twenty ten and turned up to our families

446
00:23:39,160 --> 00:23:44,720
Speaker 1: and a couple cameras. There's just no investment or strategy,

447
00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:48,840
Speaker 1: any deliberate strategy. It's exactly what you get ad hoc outcomes.

448
00:23:48,960 --> 00:23:53,439
Speaker 1: So when I moved into the business, it's fair to

449
00:23:53,480 --> 00:23:56,640
Speaker 1: say that that was a business that run the soccaos

450
00:23:57,040 --> 00:23:59,199
Speaker 1: and the A League men's and a bit of A

451
00:23:59,280 --> 00:24:03,679
Speaker 1: League women's and a bit of Matilda's. And so the

452
00:24:03,720 --> 00:24:09,080
Speaker 1: shift in twenty nineteen was, you know, the foundations around

453
00:24:09,160 --> 00:24:12,080
Speaker 1: contractually were there, so no matter what leadership of the

454
00:24:12,160 --> 00:24:15,560
Speaker 1: day turned up, you kind of have to pay the players.

455
00:24:15,560 --> 00:24:18,679
Speaker 1: This now, I think that's the value of having a

456
00:24:18,800 --> 00:24:21,680
Speaker 1: union in the ecosystem is no matter what leadership turns

457
00:24:21,760 --> 00:24:24,240
Speaker 1: up or the governance changes, the players are protected. I

458
00:24:24,240 --> 00:24:27,280
Speaker 1: think that's important. But one of my favorite things about

459
00:24:27,280 --> 00:24:30,160
Speaker 1: after twenty nineteen is that the business stopped talking about

460
00:24:30,160 --> 00:24:33,320
Speaker 1: it equal pay like it's actually it was nice to

461
00:24:33,320 --> 00:24:36,440
Speaker 1: stop talking about it. We started talking about like the

462
00:24:36,520 --> 00:24:38,639
Speaker 1: national teams as a unit and thinking about, okay, well,

463
00:24:38,640 --> 00:24:41,120
Speaker 1: what do the women need because we've been treating them

464
00:24:41,160 --> 00:24:43,960
Speaker 1: like little men for so long? Yeah, oh, actually more

465
00:24:44,000 --> 00:24:49,000
Speaker 1: research on injuries that are reoccurring, load management, sports science,

466
00:24:50,680 --> 00:24:52,960
Speaker 1: and so we had this really great kind of framework

467
00:24:53,000 --> 00:24:56,639
Speaker 1: for the two you know, national teams. You started talking about, Okay, well,

468
00:24:56,680 --> 00:24:59,639
Speaker 1: how's the brand going to be different? Not how they paid?

469
00:24:59,720 --> 00:25:03,480
Speaker 1: And you know, so they were both, you know, the

470
00:25:03,480 --> 00:25:05,920
Speaker 1: Sokkar Roos and Matillas were now set up for success.

471
00:25:06,240 --> 00:25:08,800
Speaker 1: I think, I genuinely think I wouldn't be sitting here.

472
00:25:09,119 --> 00:25:12,040
Speaker 1: We probably wouldn't have had the Asian Cup if you know,

473
00:25:12,119 --> 00:25:15,960
Speaker 1: they hadn't had four years of high quality investment into

474
00:25:16,000 --> 00:25:21,000
Speaker 1: their conditions, their camps, the travel business, everything that matters

475
00:25:21,080 --> 00:25:23,359
Speaker 1: to them performing, because they wouldn't have run so deep

476
00:25:23,800 --> 00:25:24,680
Speaker 1: into the tournament.

477
00:25:26,080 --> 00:25:29,160
Speaker 3: I know, you've talked probably to death about that twenty

478
00:25:29,200 --> 00:25:31,680
Speaker 3: twenty three feet for Women's World Cup and how it

479
00:25:31,720 --> 00:25:33,919
Speaker 3: never gets I love that. So I don't want to

480
00:25:34,000 --> 00:25:36,040
Speaker 3: dwell on up for too long, but I'd love to

481
00:25:36,040 --> 00:25:39,880
Speaker 3: touch on probably in addition to obviously that twenty nineteen negotiation.

482
00:25:40,080 --> 00:25:42,680
Speaker 3: But I guess like a lot of people probably saw

483
00:25:42,720 --> 00:25:45,399
Speaker 3: the World Cup and like some people were already in

484
00:25:45,400 --> 00:25:47,000
Speaker 3: love with the Tillies, some people fell in love with

485
00:25:47,040 --> 00:25:49,640
Speaker 3: the Tillies along the way. But can you just kind

486
00:25:49,640 --> 00:25:52,920
Speaker 3: of touch on how much strategy there was behind the

487
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:55,440
Speaker 3: lead up to an event like that, and I guess

488
00:25:55,880 --> 00:25:58,159
Speaker 3: challenging the idea that these things just happened and that

489
00:25:58,200 --> 00:26:01,000
Speaker 3: they performed well just because.

490
00:26:00,920 --> 00:26:03,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, well I think we've already kind of touched on

491
00:26:03,560 --> 00:26:08,240
Speaker 1: why they performed well. But yeah, there was so much

492
00:26:08,320 --> 00:26:13,840
Speaker 1: work that went into the brand and what leavers do

493
00:26:13,880 --> 00:26:17,000
Speaker 1: you have around a sporting team like eyeballs, so how

494
00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:19,400
Speaker 1: many people can access some other one free to wear.

495
00:26:20,960 --> 00:26:24,160
Speaker 1: We were absolutely deliberate about every decision that was made

496
00:26:24,160 --> 00:26:27,719
Speaker 1: around the Matilda's and to the point that you know,

497
00:26:27,760 --> 00:26:31,560
Speaker 1: I talked about you're seeing a federation. You run national teams,

498
00:26:31,600 --> 00:26:34,840
Speaker 1: you run women's and you run men's and we don't

499
00:26:34,880 --> 00:26:39,119
Speaker 1: have finite resources, right and so the executive need to

500
00:26:39,160 --> 00:26:42,119
Speaker 1: be able to contact switch between the two and you

501
00:26:42,160 --> 00:26:44,080
Speaker 1: set out a strategy and you make sure that you

502
00:26:44,160 --> 00:26:47,359
Speaker 1: invest in it to be able to leverage it. It

503
00:26:47,440 --> 00:26:49,720
Speaker 1: was back in twenty one, so like the commercial partners,

504
00:26:50,359 --> 00:26:53,800
Speaker 1: Matildas didn't have commercial partners lined up everywhere because we

505
00:26:53,840 --> 00:26:58,040
Speaker 1: didn't have we have the metrics that would be able

506
00:26:58,080 --> 00:27:01,479
Speaker 1: to land us a big fish. We went to Combat

507
00:27:02,119 --> 00:27:03,919
Speaker 1: We had to way more than Combank. We went to

508
00:27:04,200 --> 00:27:07,159
Speaker 1: I Reckon, we got ninety nine percent nos and we

509
00:27:07,280 --> 00:27:09,760
Speaker 1: got this big yes. So we sat down with Kombak

510
00:27:09,800 --> 00:27:12,160
Speaker 1: in twenty one. We weren't filling out stadiums at all.

511
00:27:12,880 --> 00:27:15,439
Speaker 1: We were starting to think more strategically about where they played.

512
00:27:15,480 --> 00:27:17,280
Speaker 1: We were just playing in Sydney prior to that, so

513
00:27:17,280 --> 00:27:20,520
Speaker 1: we move them around Australia. But we sat down with

514
00:27:20,600 --> 00:27:23,119
Speaker 1: Combank and set a vision for where we wanted to be.

515
00:27:23,280 --> 00:27:27,320
Speaker 1: And obviously it was a time we had that you

516
00:27:27,359 --> 00:27:29,959
Speaker 1: have the luxury of having a Women's World Cup. There

517
00:27:30,000 --> 00:27:33,560
Speaker 1: were one point three two billion dollars injected into the economy.

518
00:27:33,600 --> 00:27:36,400
Speaker 1: Everyone wants to be involved, but we set a framework

519
00:27:36,480 --> 00:27:38,600
Speaker 1: that if you're going to be on board. You need

520
00:27:38,640 --> 00:27:40,840
Speaker 1: to be on board. The contract needs to extend beyond

521
00:27:40,840 --> 00:27:43,760
Speaker 1: the tournament, so you're a long term partner or you're

522
00:27:43,800 --> 00:27:47,040
Speaker 1: not our partner. And instead of sitting down and going, well,

523
00:27:47,080 --> 00:27:49,440
Speaker 1: you know they're getting ten thousand of this match, blah

524
00:27:49,480 --> 00:27:52,359
Speaker 1: blah blah, we set a path to in twenty twenty

525
00:27:52,400 --> 00:27:54,240
Speaker 1: four to twenty five, we're going to be filling out

526
00:27:54,240 --> 00:27:58,960
Speaker 1: stadiums with your support. And they loved that because why

527
00:27:59,000 --> 00:28:02,320
Speaker 1: would I use past per performance as a metric to

528
00:28:02,640 --> 00:28:06,120
Speaker 1: secure investment when it had none? So let us show

529
00:28:06,160 --> 00:28:08,520
Speaker 1: you what your investment will do. And they loved it

530
00:28:08,720 --> 00:28:11,360
Speaker 1: and we got them, and once you get someone like Combank,

531
00:28:11,680 --> 00:28:13,680
Speaker 1: we had a lot more yeses. We did a broadcast

532
00:28:13,720 --> 00:28:19,400
Speaker 1: deal with Paramount and made really good decisions around making

533
00:28:19,440 --> 00:28:21,200
Speaker 1: sure it was on free to wear. We need more

534
00:28:21,240 --> 00:28:24,560
Speaker 1: people to see them. We did a Disney doco and

535
00:28:24,600 --> 00:28:29,280
Speaker 1: that was really to show the personal side of the team,

536
00:28:27,760 --> 00:28:32,520
Speaker 1: and there were so many decisions who they played like

537
00:28:32,640 --> 00:28:35,080
Speaker 1: right down to who they played, where they played, when

538
00:28:35,119 --> 00:28:39,760
Speaker 1: they played. I think we did a lot of work

539
00:28:39,760 --> 00:28:42,560
Speaker 1: on the pitch. I think you'll like this, But for

540
00:28:42,600 --> 00:28:46,240
Speaker 1: a long time we'd brought out low ranked teams. I

541
00:28:46,240 --> 00:28:49,920
Speaker 1: mean that disrespectfully. Respectfully, we'd beat them five now and

542
00:28:49,960 --> 00:28:53,880
Speaker 1: six now. So I think Australia thought Matilda the Matilda's

543
00:28:53,920 --> 00:28:56,400
Speaker 1: were like the top team in the world. There's two

544
00:28:56,480 --> 00:29:00,200
Speaker 1: hundred and eleven teams that play football around the world,

545
00:29:00,800 --> 00:29:02,760
Speaker 1: and so it was really important for us to test

546
00:29:02,760 --> 00:29:07,040
Speaker 1: ourselves against the best before the World Cup came, right,

547
00:29:07,040 --> 00:29:09,000
Speaker 1: you know, we'll just play these teams. So we had

548
00:29:09,040 --> 00:29:12,360
Speaker 1: to balance that and they played England. We tried to

549
00:29:12,360 --> 00:29:15,000
Speaker 1: play every single top ten and we got beat and

550
00:29:16,200 --> 00:29:18,800
Speaker 1: you know, it was a deliberate strategy around making sure

551
00:29:18,800 --> 00:29:20,959
Speaker 1: that we played the top teams, but also started to

552
00:29:21,000 --> 00:29:23,800
Speaker 1: create depths. We did some research to show that our

553
00:29:23,840 --> 00:29:27,880
Speaker 1: top eleven players were playing nine of our minutes. That's

554
00:29:27,920 --> 00:29:30,000
Speaker 1: not how you win World Cups tournaments. You need to

555
00:29:30,080 --> 00:29:33,000
Speaker 1: rotate squads. Spain won that tournament and they were able

556
00:29:33,040 --> 00:29:37,080
Speaker 1: to rest their entire squad for the third group March. Yeah. Wow.

557
00:29:37,160 --> 00:29:39,040
Speaker 1: We didn't get to do that because they lost to

558
00:29:39,840 --> 00:29:42,520
Speaker 1: Nigeria and so then they had to backs against the

559
00:29:42,560 --> 00:29:46,160
Speaker 1: wall against Kanna and so the on pitch strategy was

560
00:29:46,280 --> 00:29:49,560
Speaker 1: so sophisticated in a way that it kind of rubbed

561
00:29:49,640 --> 00:29:53,080
Speaker 1: up against our commercial one, and so we were playing

562
00:29:53,120 --> 00:29:56,760
Speaker 1: all these hard matches. I see blooding in new players,

563
00:29:58,280 --> 00:30:02,000
Speaker 1: getting you know, smashed against Spain seven nil, whilst we're

564
00:30:02,000 --> 00:30:05,520
Speaker 1: trying to get more people to watch it, and we're

565
00:30:05,520 --> 00:30:07,440
Speaker 1: filming it for Disney and so if you go back

566
00:30:07,480 --> 00:30:11,080
Speaker 1: and watch that Disney. So there were times that we

567
00:30:11,080 --> 00:30:14,120
Speaker 1: were like, is this strategy right, and were still convicted.

568
00:30:14,160 --> 00:30:17,760
Speaker 1: And then towards the back end, the on pitch strategy

569
00:30:17,880 --> 00:30:21,680
Speaker 1: started to work where we had more playing as, playing

570
00:30:21,680 --> 00:30:25,840
Speaker 1: more minutes, giving rest to the Sam Curz and the

571
00:30:25,840 --> 00:30:28,120
Speaker 1: Atlanta Kennedys who were traveling all around the world. We

572
00:30:28,160 --> 00:30:31,640
Speaker 1: need them fresh. And then their performances started to come

573
00:30:31,720 --> 00:30:34,840
Speaker 1: up right in time for the World Cup and we

574
00:30:34,840 --> 00:30:36,920
Speaker 1: were still filming and so if you go watch it

575
00:30:36,960 --> 00:30:40,080
Speaker 1: was bad, bad, bad. They're out in the Asian Cup.

576
00:30:40,800 --> 00:30:43,320
Speaker 1: It lose to career and so some of the footage

577
00:30:43,400 --> 00:30:45,880
Speaker 1: is pretty you know, it's pretty bad to watch, and

578
00:30:45,920 --> 00:30:49,040
Speaker 1: then it comes up. So the commercial strategy kind of

579
00:30:49,040 --> 00:30:54,040
Speaker 1: met the on pitch and I never forget Tom. Sorry Tom,

580
00:30:54,320 --> 00:30:57,840
Speaker 1: Tony Gustafson. At the end of it was the end

581
00:30:57,880 --> 00:31:00,080
Speaker 1: of twenty twenty two and the team hadn't actually we

582
00:31:00,120 --> 00:31:02,200
Speaker 1: had a win in a while, and we're all like, okay,

583
00:31:02,240 --> 00:31:04,080
Speaker 1: actually the team needs a win. Now, we should probably

584
00:31:04,080 --> 00:31:06,480
Speaker 1: play a low ranked team. He's like, I want to

585
00:31:06,480 --> 00:31:09,160
Speaker 1: play Sweden. We're like, oh my god, there are fourth

586
00:31:09,200 --> 00:31:11,680
Speaker 1: in the world Tony, and he's like, no, we're ready.

587
00:31:12,200 --> 00:31:13,840
Speaker 1: I don't know if you remember it. We beat We

588
00:31:13,920 --> 00:31:16,720
Speaker 1: beat him at Amy Park. He was four one and

589
00:31:16,800 --> 00:31:18,520
Speaker 1: I remember seeing him in the lift and I was like,

590
00:31:18,600 --> 00:31:21,400
Speaker 1: oh my gosh, thank god we won, and we're all

591
00:31:21,440 --> 00:31:24,640
Speaker 1: almost in tears because we couldn't go into twenty twenty

592
00:31:24,680 --> 00:31:28,440
Speaker 1: three with another loss. And now the players were believing,

593
00:31:28,520 --> 00:31:31,160
Speaker 1: we were believing. It's this. What I learned from that

594
00:31:31,320 --> 00:31:33,360
Speaker 1: is you've got a team beyond the team, beyond the team,

595
00:31:33,440 --> 00:31:36,240
Speaker 1: and everyone has a role. You've got to know your role,

596
00:31:37,000 --> 00:31:39,480
Speaker 1: do your role properly and stay in your lane. And

597
00:31:39,680 --> 00:31:41,960
Speaker 1: it was that moment we knew that that hard two

598
00:31:42,040 --> 00:31:44,680
Speaker 1: years we'd all done together was right. And then he said,

599
00:31:45,200 --> 00:31:47,320
Speaker 1: straight after the game, he said, let's go play England

600
00:31:47,360 --> 00:31:49,320
Speaker 1: in England. I was like, oh my gosh, England were

601
00:31:49,400 --> 00:31:51,360
Speaker 1: number one in the world. I was like, this guy

602
00:31:52,480 --> 00:31:55,160
Speaker 1: and they wanted to play in Wemberley which is in

603
00:31:55,160 --> 00:31:57,680
Speaker 1: front of fifty thousand, like no, no, no, we'll play

604
00:31:57,720 --> 00:32:00,320
Speaker 1: in a smaller stadium so you don't have so much support.

605
00:32:01,360 --> 00:32:03,480
Speaker 1: And then they went and beat them, and then they

606
00:32:03,480 --> 00:32:06,360
Speaker 1: played France. They said, let's go play France and France

607
00:32:06,360 --> 00:32:09,200
Speaker 1: were in the top six. Just a friendly match down

608
00:32:09,240 --> 00:32:12,760
Speaker 1: at Marvel. We filled it and then they beat them

609
00:32:13,320 --> 00:32:16,240
Speaker 1: and that ended up being really important. And so I think,

610
00:32:16,360 --> 00:32:18,920
Speaker 1: you know, your high performance team working with your commercial team,

611
00:32:20,240 --> 00:32:22,640
Speaker 1: you know, and having people that understand both was really

612
00:32:22,680 --> 00:32:27,520
Speaker 1: important because we were making some risky moves that don't

613
00:32:27,520 --> 00:32:32,080
Speaker 1: always come off. But you know that. I do think

614
00:32:32,120 --> 00:32:34,920
Speaker 1: it matters that they played France before beat them at

615
00:32:34,960 --> 00:32:38,080
Speaker 1: Marvel in front of fifty thousand. You know, you flip

616
00:32:38,080 --> 00:32:41,000
Speaker 1: of a coin for a penalty shootout. But that made

617
00:32:41,080 --> 00:32:44,960
Speaker 1: that quarterfinals so much more meaningful. To know that all

618
00:32:45,000 --> 00:32:48,240
Speaker 1: of our on pitch strategy and everything we've done off

619
00:32:48,240 --> 00:32:51,120
Speaker 1: the pitch to make sure more of Australia knew who

620
00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:55,400
Speaker 1: they were. It meant that when the tournament started, people

621
00:32:55,440 --> 00:32:56,800
Speaker 1: weren't starting from a low base.

622
00:32:57,920 --> 00:33:01,320
Speaker 3: I love that, Gosh, I love that. It's so good.

623
00:33:01,520 --> 00:33:03,160
Speaker 3: It's so funny, like you talking about that and when

624
00:33:03,160 --> 00:33:05,720
Speaker 3: you mentioned Tony like, I just remember so much commentary

625
00:33:05,760 --> 00:33:08,239
Speaker 3: around the time. The poor guy, he just carried it all,

626
00:33:08,280 --> 00:33:11,440
Speaker 3: didn't he. Everyone was just questioning his decisions, what he

627
00:33:11,520 --> 00:33:13,760
Speaker 3: was doing with the team, the opposition, everything.

628
00:33:13,840 --> 00:33:16,920
Speaker 1: Well, it goes back to when we recruited Tony. I

629
00:33:17,000 --> 00:33:20,640
Speaker 1: was in the I was in the interviews. It's in

630
00:33:20,640 --> 00:33:23,000
Speaker 1: the depths of COVID, So this was I think it

631
00:33:23,040 --> 00:33:25,840
Speaker 1: was in twenty twenty and it was seven in the

632
00:33:25,880 --> 00:33:27,920
Speaker 1: morning and it was just I don't know, it must

633
00:33:27,920 --> 00:33:29,719
Speaker 1: have been winter. I don't know why I remember it

634
00:33:29,720 --> 00:33:31,560
Speaker 1: so much because it was cold. It was early, and

635
00:33:31,560 --> 00:33:35,360
Speaker 1: we're getting into the office and we're in the middle

636
00:33:35,360 --> 00:33:38,440
Speaker 1: of COVID trying to select our national team coach. And

637
00:33:38,480 --> 00:33:40,560
Speaker 1: there's some beauty in bringing a new coach in when

638
00:33:40,600 --> 00:33:45,240
Speaker 1: you're trying to start. We had equal pay done. We

639
00:33:45,480 --> 00:33:47,760
Speaker 1: just won the rights to the Women's World Cup. Like

640
00:33:48,360 --> 00:33:51,200
Speaker 1: if you ever get a blank canvas to build it,

641
00:33:51,680 --> 00:33:56,040
Speaker 1: we had one. And so the coach, which we stopped

642
00:33:56,120 --> 00:33:58,120
Speaker 1: using the term coach, we were looking for a leader.

643
00:33:59,280 --> 00:34:01,600
Speaker 1: Coaching is half the role for the national team. Right

644
00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:05,760
Speaker 1: you look at look at Joe Montemiro. He hasn't seen

645
00:34:05,800 --> 00:34:08,320
Speaker 1: his team. He hasn't been with his team since November.

646
00:34:08,600 --> 00:34:10,960
Speaker 1: He's seen him on the zoom and he will get

647
00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:13,799
Speaker 1: them four days out before the first match, and so

648
00:34:13,840 --> 00:34:17,360
Speaker 1: he's had to do all of his coaching online. Yeah,

649
00:34:17,719 --> 00:34:20,080
Speaker 1: and you're just got to trust that the information that

650
00:34:20,080 --> 00:34:22,880
Speaker 1: you give him and the tactics that you want to

651
00:34:22,920 --> 00:34:25,880
Speaker 1: employ have kind of been embedded since he hasn't had

652
00:34:25,920 --> 00:34:30,000
Speaker 1: that many matches. But for a national team, right, like,

653
00:34:30,040 --> 00:34:32,320
Speaker 1: it's not about development, it's about bringing a team together

654
00:34:32,760 --> 00:34:34,840
Speaker 1: and actually getting the best out of individuals in a

655
00:34:34,840 --> 00:34:37,440
Speaker 1: collective sense. So we're looking for a leader. So we

656
00:34:37,480 --> 00:34:41,640
Speaker 1: stopped using the term coach because coaches are everywhere. And

657
00:34:42,000 --> 00:34:43,879
Speaker 1: it's like you just said, he had a role to play.

658
00:34:43,920 --> 00:34:45,160
Speaker 1: He was going to be a face of the team.

659
00:34:45,320 --> 00:34:49,759
Speaker 1: He needed to know his answers around gender equality and

660
00:34:50,480 --> 00:34:53,480
Speaker 1: understanding he's understanding the role that Matilda is more broadly

661
00:34:53,520 --> 00:34:56,040
Speaker 1: in Australia for women in sport and for young girls

662
00:34:56,080 --> 00:35:00,399
Speaker 1: playing football. He was able to answer those questions really well.

663
00:35:00,440 --> 00:35:03,480
Speaker 1: It was authentic and it meant that, Okay, whilst we

664
00:35:03,480 --> 00:35:06,919
Speaker 1: were trying to innovate around the team, like he needed

665
00:35:06,960 --> 00:35:09,920
Speaker 1: to be comfortable with having a camera in the changellers

666
00:35:10,360 --> 00:35:12,120
Speaker 1: you know, you know what coaches are like with that,

667
00:35:12,280 --> 00:35:14,960
Speaker 1: and a lot of coaches said no. He was like,

668
00:35:15,040 --> 00:35:17,120
Speaker 1: I understand it as long as I can manage and

669
00:35:17,160 --> 00:35:21,000
Speaker 1: control and have some say in the final. You know,

670
00:35:21,280 --> 00:35:23,800
Speaker 1: you want to protect your players, and we did as well.

671
00:35:25,760 --> 00:35:28,279
Speaker 1: But he was a right person and so that's why

672
00:35:28,360 --> 00:35:31,520
Speaker 1: when you see it come together during you know, we'd

673
00:35:31,520 --> 00:35:34,600
Speaker 1: already tested what he might be under what he might

674
00:35:34,600 --> 00:35:36,840
Speaker 1: be like under pressure. A lot of coaches like to

675
00:35:36,920 --> 00:35:39,240
Speaker 1: then close the performance bub when you don't get access,

676
00:35:39,320 --> 00:35:42,880
Speaker 1: so we always had to balance that and that was

677
00:35:42,920 --> 00:35:44,320
Speaker 1: sought through in his recruitment.

678
00:35:45,200 --> 00:35:47,359
Speaker 3: You touched on Joe getting access to the players four

679
00:35:47,400 --> 00:35:50,960
Speaker 3: days out we can we shift to Asian Cup and

680
00:35:51,000 --> 00:35:55,080
Speaker 3: the excitement around it. How how do you implement a

681
00:35:55,080 --> 00:35:59,759
Speaker 3: strategy for a tournament knowing how beautifully diverse Australia is

682
00:36:00,200 --> 00:36:03,000
Speaker 3: to reach fans that are going to be supporting countries

683
00:36:03,040 --> 00:36:05,800
Speaker 3: from all across Asia for games here on Australian soil.

684
00:36:06,480 --> 00:36:10,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's honestly, I'll probably after this i'll reflect, but

685
00:36:10,840 --> 00:36:15,080
Speaker 1: it's the journey here has just been eye opening for myself.

686
00:36:15,840 --> 00:36:20,239
Speaker 1: I sat down with the Indian Consul general probably a

687
00:36:20,239 --> 00:36:22,880
Speaker 1: couple days ago now, I think, and I'm on a

688
00:36:22,960 --> 00:36:25,880
Speaker 1: zoom call with all the community members tonight. It is

689
00:36:25,960 --> 00:36:29,840
Speaker 1: being really nice to get to know these communities. And

690
00:36:30,480 --> 00:36:34,320
Speaker 1: although not a lot, although you know summer cricket fans,

691
00:36:34,520 --> 00:36:39,520
Speaker 1: Bangladesh have massive communities here. There's one point one Chinese Australians,

692
00:36:39,520 --> 00:36:43,799
Speaker 1: one point one Indian Australians, and there are very rare

693
00:36:43,840 --> 00:36:46,480
Speaker 1: moments for these communities to come together to fly their

694
00:36:46,520 --> 00:36:51,960
Speaker 1: flags in a stadium with twenty seven thousand other countrymen,

695
00:36:52,760 --> 00:36:55,600
Speaker 1: and we get to create that. I get quite proud

696
00:36:55,600 --> 00:37:01,080
Speaker 1: about bringing mass communities together at scale. Yes, to watch

697
00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:04,200
Speaker 1: you know, twenty two women on follow a ball on

698
00:37:04,239 --> 00:37:07,000
Speaker 1: a pitch, But I care very much about the music

699
00:37:07,040 --> 00:37:09,520
Speaker 1: that we play, you know, all of the activity in

700
00:37:09,560 --> 00:37:11,719
Speaker 1: the precinct outside to make sure that when they turn

701
00:37:11,800 --> 00:37:14,319
Speaker 1: up to a match it feels like home. And so

702
00:37:14,400 --> 00:37:18,560
Speaker 1: we've really leveraged the experts around that multicultural New South Wales.

703
00:37:19,200 --> 00:37:24,759
Speaker 1: We've got all these community ambassadors, we've translated all of

704
00:37:24,800 --> 00:37:29,080
Speaker 1: our creative and material in language and it's starting to

705
00:37:29,080 --> 00:37:31,440
Speaker 1: become very real now because the teams are turning up.

706
00:37:31,440 --> 00:37:33,680
Speaker 1: So India turned up in Perth the other day and

707
00:37:35,320 --> 00:37:38,359
Speaker 1: you know Uzbekistan's turned up and I'll be in Perth

708
00:37:38,440 --> 00:37:42,279
Speaker 1: next week meeting with Japan, and it's just, yeah, it's

709
00:37:42,280 --> 00:37:44,080
Speaker 1: so much bigger, And I do think it's going to

710
00:37:44,080 --> 00:37:49,839
Speaker 1: be different to the Women's World Cup, because yeah, I

711
00:37:49,880 --> 00:37:54,080
Speaker 1: can't recall a time probably since twenty fifteen that will

712
00:37:54,080 --> 00:37:57,040
Speaker 1: bring all these communities together at the size and scale

713
00:37:57,040 --> 00:38:01,279
Speaker 1: of what we will be broadcast into one hundred and

714
00:38:01,320 --> 00:38:03,480
Speaker 1: forty markets. This is women's huge too.

715
00:38:03,640 --> 00:38:04,280
Speaker 3: This is huge.

716
00:38:05,600 --> 00:38:07,560
Speaker 1: So not only is there going to be good football,

717
00:38:08,560 --> 00:38:12,399
Speaker 1: I'm just it's it's been eye opening to to get

718
00:38:12,480 --> 00:38:16,840
Speaker 1: to know our Asian ancestry and it's it's been here forever,

719
00:38:17,800 --> 00:38:21,760
Speaker 1: and when I meet with these communities, it actually feels

720
00:38:21,760 --> 00:38:24,280
Speaker 1: like it's their tournament. It's not our tournament. It's theirs,

721
00:38:24,320 --> 00:38:26,799
Speaker 1: and they're and they're shaping it, which is what I love.

722
00:38:27,200 --> 00:38:29,399
Speaker 3: Yeah, and can you give us a little glimpse into

723
00:38:29,400 --> 00:38:31,480
Speaker 3: what the Tillies are going to look like heading into

724
00:38:31,480 --> 00:38:32,080
Speaker 3: this tournament?

725
00:38:32,680 --> 00:38:36,719
Speaker 1: Yeah, in terms of on the pitch, I'm not going

726
00:38:36,760 --> 00:38:43,200
Speaker 1: to comment on them, No way, I'm organizing, you're doing

727
00:38:43,200 --> 00:38:46,160
Speaker 1: the whole tournament. I've spent a fair time with with

728
00:38:46,360 --> 00:38:49,000
Speaker 1: Joe at a few events I was at an event

729
00:38:49,560 --> 00:38:52,759
Speaker 1: on Monday with him at Business Sydney and the word

730
00:38:52,800 --> 00:38:55,480
Speaker 1: that keeps getting used with him is I think he

731
00:38:55,640 --> 00:38:57,440
Speaker 1: just made a joke about it at the press conference.

732
00:38:58,640 --> 00:39:03,000
Speaker 1: What they call him high pressure Joel or something. Anyway,

733
00:39:04,320 --> 00:39:06,600
Speaker 1: if you've met the guy that he soaks pressure like

734
00:39:06,640 --> 00:39:09,719
Speaker 1: anything in terms it. But you've got a team there

735
00:39:09,760 --> 00:39:15,160
Speaker 1: that I actually like the word pressure because it's it

736
00:39:15,239 --> 00:39:19,319
Speaker 1: assumes that it's something difficult for them. It's what they

737
00:39:19,360 --> 00:39:23,920
Speaker 1: trained for, It's what Joe he's a professional. Does he

738
00:39:23,960 --> 00:39:27,319
Speaker 1: feel the weight of Australia on his shoulders? Probably at times, Yeah,

739
00:39:27,360 --> 00:39:30,400
Speaker 1: probably when when he sees how much security we have

740
00:39:30,480 --> 00:39:32,239
Speaker 1: to have at the hotel for the team to make

741
00:39:32,280 --> 00:39:35,760
Speaker 1: sure that they can have some privacy and they're kept safe. Yeah,

742
00:39:36,040 --> 00:39:38,399
Speaker 1: the scale of this thing, you know, particularly if they're

743
00:39:38,480 --> 00:39:41,839
Speaker 1: run deep, I think they're going to be moments where

744
00:39:41,840 --> 00:39:44,080
Speaker 1: we have eighty percent of Australia. So yeah, the size

745
00:39:44,080 --> 00:39:48,120
Speaker 1: and scale of things. I'm sure he'll have his moments.

746
00:39:48,760 --> 00:39:51,000
Speaker 1: But the players are kind of in their bubble right

747
00:39:51,719 --> 00:39:54,439
Speaker 1: and quite protected and they can dip in and out

748
00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:55,960
Speaker 1: whether they want to be on their phone or not.

749
00:39:56,080 --> 00:39:59,440
Speaker 1: But they'll see turning up to training in their buses.

750
00:40:00,320 --> 00:40:02,240
Speaker 1: You know, thousands of people trying to get a glimpse

751
00:40:02,239 --> 00:40:05,839
Speaker 1: of them kicking a ball. That would be fun. But yeah,

752
00:40:05,840 --> 00:40:08,920
Speaker 1: I think if everyone keeps saying, how's the pressure, Joe,

753
00:40:09,680 --> 00:40:11,840
Speaker 1: I've heard a master all week. You know, how are

754
00:40:11,840 --> 00:40:12,720
Speaker 1: you feeling the pressure?

755
00:40:13,000 --> 00:40:15,080
Speaker 3: I had two questions I ask everyone on the show

756
00:40:15,120 --> 00:40:17,640
Speaker 3: to wrap us up. First. One is what is your

757
00:40:17,760 --> 00:40:19,280
Speaker 3: favorite failure.

758
00:40:19,800 --> 00:40:22,799
Speaker 1: Or favorite failure. I should have prepped before that coming on,

759
00:40:26,239 --> 00:40:29,719
Speaker 1: missed a couple open goals playing. Yeah, I'm not sure

760
00:40:29,719 --> 00:40:32,399
Speaker 1: if I can talk about the failures of this job

761
00:40:32,520 --> 00:40:36,000
Speaker 1: just yet. I don't know if it's a failure, but

762
00:40:36,200 --> 00:40:38,520
Speaker 1: I do wish I had have enjoyed the Women's World

763
00:40:38,520 --> 00:40:41,799
Speaker 1: Cup and actually stopped to really smell the roses and

764
00:40:43,080 --> 00:40:45,960
Speaker 1: like be present. You know, it was just maybe because

765
00:40:45,960 --> 00:40:51,040
Speaker 1: it just it just it was so all consuming and shocking.

766
00:40:51,640 --> 00:40:54,480
Speaker 1: It shocked everyone. You know, we planned for it, and

767
00:40:54,480 --> 00:40:58,799
Speaker 1: we talked about building moments, Kathy Freeman moments, but yeah,

768
00:40:58,960 --> 00:41:02,440
Speaker 1: like it really consumed. So I'm absolutely committed to that,

769
00:41:02,800 --> 00:41:05,120
Speaker 1: you know, to not doing that again and making sure

770
00:41:05,120 --> 00:41:09,480
Speaker 1: there's moments where I bring my family to a five

771
00:41:09,600 --> 00:41:12,359
Speaker 1: hundred drone show down at Cockle Bay on Sunday night

772
00:41:12,920 --> 00:41:14,840
Speaker 1: for the Women's Asian Cup. I actually want to be

773
00:41:14,840 --> 00:41:19,840
Speaker 1: president and make sure, yeah that I take time to

774
00:41:20,040 --> 00:41:22,560
Speaker 1: soak it in and remember it. I don't know if

775
00:41:22,600 --> 00:41:24,839
Speaker 1: that's a failure, but yeah, I do wish I had

776
00:41:24,920 --> 00:41:25,560
Speaker 1: done that better.

777
00:41:25,680 --> 00:41:27,960
Speaker 3: Driven Women's World Cup, I know, I really like that.

778
00:41:28,520 --> 00:41:30,760
Speaker 3: Who has had the biggest impact on you as a person.

779
00:41:31,960 --> 00:41:32,799
Speaker 1: I've got to pick one.

780
00:41:33,480 --> 00:41:36,080
Speaker 3: I know I need to change the question because everyone

781
00:41:36,120 --> 00:41:37,239
Speaker 3: says it's really hard.

782
00:41:37,400 --> 00:41:39,960
Speaker 1: I have one point in my career. Yeah, do you

783
00:41:40,040 --> 00:41:42,280
Speaker 1: know if I had to pick one, it's probably because

784
00:41:42,520 --> 00:41:44,440
Speaker 1: there were formative years and I spent a lot of

785
00:41:44,480 --> 00:41:47,759
Speaker 1: time with him. But Tom Somani, Okay, Yeah, and I

786
00:41:47,760 --> 00:41:49,840
Speaker 1: think a lot of former Matilda's say that I was

787
00:41:49,880 --> 00:41:52,160
Speaker 1: with him for ten years. I was with him when

788
00:41:52,360 --> 00:41:56,799
Speaker 1: I was injured. I consider him a close friend. He's

789
00:41:56,840 --> 00:42:00,239
Speaker 1: actually got a book coming out right on Matilda's soon.

790
00:42:00,480 --> 00:42:02,040
Speaker 1: I don't know if I was meant to say that,

791
00:42:02,080 --> 00:42:02,600
Speaker 1: but here we.

792
00:42:02,560 --> 00:42:06,399
Speaker 3: Can come out heard it here.

793
00:42:07,480 --> 00:42:13,520
Speaker 1: He's just it's is this. Absolutely he has shaped my

794
00:42:13,719 --> 00:42:18,120
Speaker 1: leadership style, my approach to you know, how I support

795
00:42:18,120 --> 00:42:21,799
Speaker 1: and manage people, how I develop people, how I think

796
00:42:21,840 --> 00:42:24,640
Speaker 1: about the world. I think they You know, I spent

797
00:42:24,640 --> 00:42:27,080
Speaker 1: my whole twenties with him, traveling the world to North

798
00:42:27,160 --> 00:42:30,080
Speaker 1: Korea with him and we and you know, I was

799
00:42:30,120 --> 00:42:32,480
Speaker 1: a pretty serious cat playing, so I didn't hang out

800
00:42:32,520 --> 00:42:36,960
Speaker 1: with the coach, but I obviously saw the type of

801
00:42:37,040 --> 00:42:39,840
Speaker 1: environment that he created and that and I really flourished

802
00:42:39,880 --> 00:42:41,839
Speaker 1: in that. And so I've had him come in and

803
00:42:41,880 --> 00:42:44,759
Speaker 1: speak to our team a few times, my executive team,

804
00:42:44,840 --> 00:42:49,279
Speaker 1: and his calmness is pretty amazing, his ability to take

805
00:42:49,280 --> 00:42:54,279
Speaker 1: pressure off people. And but you know, like he was

806
00:42:54,320 --> 00:43:01,439
Speaker 1: creating inclusive cultures well before you know that, champion. Yeah, yeah,

807
00:43:01,480 --> 00:43:05,000
Speaker 1: we always had gender balance on our on our staff,

808
00:43:05,040 --> 00:43:07,560
Speaker 1: and I kind of grew up with that being the

809
00:43:07,640 --> 00:43:10,319
Speaker 1: norm until you get out of that bubble. Do you see,

810
00:43:10,480 --> 00:43:12,600
Speaker 1: you know, a table full of men, and he just

811
00:43:12,680 --> 00:43:16,279
Speaker 1: knew how to create environments. And yeah, he's absolutely had

812
00:43:16,400 --> 00:43:19,400
Speaker 1: a profound impact on who I am.

813
00:43:19,480 --> 00:43:22,320
Speaker 3: So yeah, I would say him, that's amazing. Well, so

814
00:43:22,400 --> 00:43:24,279
Speaker 3: thank you so much for your time in such a

815
00:43:24,320 --> 00:43:26,840
Speaker 3: stressful period. I feel like I could have I hosted

816
00:43:26,840 --> 00:43:29,200
Speaker 3: a panel with you at the end of last year

817
00:43:29,360 --> 00:43:31,000
Speaker 3: at a Minerva event. I felt like I could have

818
00:43:31,000 --> 00:43:32,759
Speaker 3: spoken to you for two hours similar thing here. There

819
00:43:32,760 --> 00:43:35,000
Speaker 3: were so many things we didn't even cover around your

820
00:43:35,080 --> 00:43:38,400
Speaker 3: leadership transition, all the things. But I'm genuinely so thankful

821
00:43:38,400 --> 00:43:39,600
Speaker 3: for your time and good luck.

822
00:43:39,719 --> 00:43:41,960
Speaker 1: Thanks for your work too. I love your work. Thank

823
00:43:42,000 --> 00:43:44,000
Speaker 1: you amazing. How many sports did you play?

824
00:43:44,719 --> 00:43:45,000
Speaker 3: Yeah?

825
00:43:45,040 --> 00:43:47,080
Speaker 1: And the hardest one I reckon is that sevens one?

826
00:43:47,480 --> 00:43:48,759
Speaker 3: Oh god, it's so hard?

827
00:43:48,800 --> 00:43:50,799
Speaker 1: Are you just like the I say to anyone that

828
00:43:50,840 --> 00:43:53,920
Speaker 1: will listen, you ask anyone that knows me. You're fast,

829
00:43:53,920 --> 00:43:57,880
Speaker 1: you're fit, and you're you're big. It's just like the

830
00:43:58,040 --> 00:43:59,240
Speaker 1: ultimate athlete.

831
00:43:59,360 --> 00:44:03,759
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm wise? Would I agree? Thanks? Wander back in

832
00:44:03,800 --> 00:44:05,879
Speaker 3: my day, it feels like, well, not for going now?

833
00:44:07,200 --> 00:44:09,880
Speaker 3: Thank you old She appreciate it. Thanks so much for listening.

834
00:44:10,160 --> 00:44:12,200
Speaker 3: If you got something out of this episode, I would

835
00:44:12,239 --> 00:44:14,360
Speaker 3: absolutely love it. If you could send it on to

836
00:44:14,440 --> 00:44:18,400
Speaker 3: one person who you think might enjoy it. Otherwise, subscribe,

837
00:44:18,560 --> 00:44:20,520
Speaker 3: give us a review, and make sure you follow us

838
00:44:20,560 --> 00:44:23,360
Speaker 3: on Instagram at the Female Athlete Project to stay up

839
00:44:23,400 --> 00:44:26,560
Speaker 3: to date with podcast episodes, merch drops, and of course,

840
00:44:27,040 --> 00:44:29,719
Speaker 3: news and stories about epic female athletes