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Speaker 1: Well, there is no doubt that the situation in Alice

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Speaker 1: Springs has been dominating headlines right around the nation. And

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Speaker 1: as we've spoken about, yesterday, the Chief Minister and also

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Speaker 1: the Prime Minister Anthony Albinezi, well, they announced that they

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Speaker 1: are going to have these alcohol restrictions. So essentially, Mondays

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Speaker 1: and Tuesdays are going to be takeaway alcohol free days

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Speaker 1: in Alice Springs and then there's going to be reduced

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Speaker 1: alcohol reduced hours on the remaining days from three pm

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Speaker 1: until seven pm only for takeaway alcohol. The government's also

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Speaker 1: going to introduce one transaction per person each day, doing

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Speaker 1: so immediately through the Band Drinker Register. Now, one person

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Speaker 1: who we've spoken to on numerous occasions about the ending

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Speaker 1: of the Stronger Futures legislation and the impact that it

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Speaker 1: was going to have, or concerningly they thought it was

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Speaker 1: going to have, is Professor John Boffer. Here is the

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Speaker 1: spokesperson for the People's Alcohol Action Coalition and joins me

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Speaker 1: on the line right now. Good morning to you.

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Speaker 2: Doctor Boffer, and good more and caddy.

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Speaker 1: Doctor Boffer. As I said, you and I have spoken

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Speaker 1: before about the ending of the Stronger Futures legislation, you

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Speaker 1: called it six months ago even longer and said that

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Speaker 1: the ending of that legislation is going to have a

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Speaker 1: significant impact. And it really has hasn't that.

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Speaker 2: Yes, Look, it has had the impact not just the

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Speaker 2: People's Alcohol Action Coalition, but the Averaginal Health Service and

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Speaker 2: Amsan Naja, the Legal Service, other Averaginal organizations. We all

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Speaker 2: knew it was going to have a big impact, and

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Speaker 2: we all knew that this has been an incredibly the

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Speaker 2: most effective alcoholic production measure that we've seen in Central Australia.

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Speaker 2: There was a difference of opinion about that, clearly the government,

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Speaker 2: I think they were hoping that the minimum flow price

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Speaker 2: and BDR and other measures would be sufficient and that

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Speaker 2: removing this would not be as harmful as we thought

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Speaker 2: it would be. Well, I think now it's plea to everybody.

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Speaker 2: It has been very harmful. It has led to a

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Speaker 2: very large increase in our cohol consumption and harms. You know,

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Speaker 2: it's about five additional assaults per day, and we're talking

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Speaker 2: the severe end of the assault spectrum, you know, stabbings, acts, wounds,

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Speaker 2: machete winds, broken limbs, those sorts of things not and

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Speaker 2: so it has unfortunately created the harm that we thought

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Speaker 2: it would. But importantly now we do have now a

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Speaker 2: very serious commitment from both the com and the norn

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Speaker 2: Churchi government to address the situation, and the Chief Minister

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Speaker 2: has announced some very strong immediate measures to alcohol. Takeaway

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Speaker 2: day three days a week is significant, it's very significant,

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Speaker 2: the production and take away trading hours is very significant.

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Speaker 2: A commitment to consult further on the stronger future provisions.

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Speaker 2: Because what people might appreciate, it is only Ella Springs

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Speaker 2: in Central Australia that's really suffered, because the Averaginal living

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Speaker 2: areas around ten and Creking happened are still alcohol banned

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Speaker 2: their general restricted areas under the non Chenship correct because

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Speaker 2: the people in those areas have requested that and they've

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Speaker 2: got that, and they've had that for a very long time.

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Speaker 2: So the palleys in those towns are still as effective

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Speaker 2: as they were, and so we've seen actually as things

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Speaker 2: all Springs have got a lot worse, things in towner

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Speaker 2: Greek have actually improved. And that's what we should have

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Speaker 2: expected in two thousand and twenty two to see improvement

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Speaker 2: because all over the world in the COVID years twenty

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Speaker 2: twenty twenty twenty one, alcohol consumption went up, domestic violence

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Speaker 2: went up, not just in Australia but in the US

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Speaker 2: and other in Europe across the world. That was a

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Speaker 2: phenomenon we saw. And equally in twenty twenty two, as

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Speaker 2: the COVID situation improved, we started to see a decline

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Speaker 2: again in consumption and harm, but not in CenTra Australia.

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Speaker 2: It's gone the opposite. So really, when you think about

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Speaker 2: where we should have been and where we are, it's

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Speaker 2: even worse. So it is really important now that we've

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Speaker 2: got this commitment. People understand that alcohol is essential to

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Speaker 2: the problem and they understand the need for an immediate

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Speaker 2: solution through Supployd Action as well as the commitment through

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Speaker 2: an alcohol management plan that addresses the underlying social determinants.

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Speaker 1: Doctor Boffer, were you in a situation were you able

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Speaker 1: to did you speak or did anybody from the People's

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Speaker 1: Alcohol Action Coalition have the opportunity to speak to the

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Speaker 1: Prime Minister yesterday? And what did you convey?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? Look, I had the opportunity to speak to the

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Speaker 2: Prime Minister and the Chief Minister and the other people

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Speaker 2: that came to other spring, the other politicians, and we

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Speaker 2: conveyed the message that I'm just talking to you about

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Speaker 2: now that it has caused harm. We showed some data

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Speaker 2: about the level of harm that has occurred and talked

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Speaker 2: about what needs to happen going forward, and you know

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Speaker 2: that we did getitments from both governments and they've announced

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Speaker 2: those publicly. So if you've heard what's happening, which is

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Speaker 2: really significant, I think you know the Chief Minister is

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Speaker 2: very committed and understands how serious alcohol is, and I

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Speaker 2: think we had a misunderstanding in terms of how significant

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Speaker 2: this one measure was. But we've now got very serious

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Speaker 2: restrictions and a commitment to look at the an opt

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Speaker 2: out system for the stronger future legislation as well as

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Speaker 2: a commitment for further investment and also looking at an

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Speaker 2: alcohol management plan that does look at the big issues

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Speaker 2: like early childhood trauma. What are we going to do

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Speaker 2: about it? Access to education we've got, you know, school

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Speaker 2: attendance in cent Australia's dropped to the lowest level ever.

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Speaker 2: You've got less than a third of children going to

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Speaker 2: school four days a week. That's an important underlying determent

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Speaker 2: that leads to you know, then you've got unemployment, poverty.

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Speaker 2: We know we've got a population that's very susceptible to

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Speaker 2: dependence on alcohol and unregulated use of alcohol. So this

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Speaker 2: is why we do need special measures, and we need

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Speaker 2: them until we get on top of those other issues.

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Speaker 1: And doctor Bob, I'm glad that you raise that because

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Speaker 1: i know that that in the past the Chief Minister

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Speaker 1: has said we cannot have race based policy and had

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Speaker 1: really pushed back on that, and you know, had said

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Speaker 1: that the Stronger Future's legislation was race based policy. But fundamentally,

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Speaker 1: you know, we have got a serious issue with alcohol.

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Speaker 1: Do you do you accept that that it's race based

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Speaker 1: policy or do you think that that's you know, that

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Speaker 1: sort of hiding under the guise of something being racist

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Speaker 1: when it's actually not.

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Speaker 2: Well, look, the policy really as it existed, it is discriminatory.

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Speaker 2: It is primarily directed at or directed that people living

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Speaker 2: on average land. So it is discriminatory, but not all

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Speaker 2: funs of discrimination and racism. And we've made the point

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Speaker 2: there is publicly discrimination or affirmative action that's well described

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Speaker 2: and it's used in many different settings. It's used by

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Speaker 2: the Federal Labor Party for women's pre selection, which is

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Speaker 2: why we're now seeing so many great women in the

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Speaker 2: federal Parliament. That's a very effective example of how positive

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Speaker 2: discriminational affirmative action works. So sometimes when you've got a

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Speaker 2: marginalize disadvantaged group, you do need to look at policies

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Speaker 2: that are positive discrimination, which is what we thought this was.

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Speaker 2: And you have to balance the rights, the fundamental rights

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Speaker 2: of women to be free from violence, children to be

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Speaker 2: free from hunger, children to be parented and cared for appropriately,

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Speaker 2: that those things that are undermined if there's too much alcohol,

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Speaker 2: too much intoxication happening in a community. So it's not

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Speaker 2: a simple equation, and so it was very simplicity. So

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Speaker 2: it was racist, and I think that I think there's

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Speaker 2: an awareness that we've got to move beyond that and

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Speaker 2: find practical solutions that work, whatever those solutions may be.

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Speaker 1: Doctor Boffer, you mentioned before that level of harm and

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Speaker 1: the I think you said five presents a day and

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Speaker 1: we're talking axe wounds and that kind of thing. Was

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Speaker 1: that correct? Can you just talk me through those numbers

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Speaker 1: again and how that was collated.

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Speaker 2: We're talking about since theation, stronger futures on average, and

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Speaker 2: additional five assaults a day domestic assaults and alcohol related assaults,

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Speaker 2: so five the day more you know, you're thirty five

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Speaker 2: forty extra a week and see what and they're the

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Speaker 2: severe those assaults are leading to us. A lot of

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Speaker 2: them are leading to hospitalizations and emergency department presentations, and

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Speaker 2: that ties up police resources because, as the police keep

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Speaker 2: telling us clearly, you've got to deal with interpersonal violence

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Speaker 2: ahead of property crime. So police are tied up because

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Speaker 2: of those additional assaults and the interpersonal violence and domestic lance,

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Speaker 2: and then they have less capacity to deal with property

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Speaker 2: crime and other things that are going on, and it

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Speaker 2: becomestin and you've got your child protection workers completely overwhelmed

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Speaker 2: again because of increased problems with car and protecting the

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Speaker 2: children because of the amount of olcohol in the community.

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Speaker 2: So that you know, as the police have been saying,

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Speaker 2: you can't just police your way out of this. You've

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Speaker 2: got we've got a very high ratio of police to

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Speaker 2: population now it's at least one to one hundred, so

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Speaker 2: that you know, in Australian terms, that's incredibly high, perhaps

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Speaker 2: the highest in the country. So we've got to do

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Speaker 2: other things. We needed a second breaker. The police wanted

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Speaker 2: what we've got now. The police are very very clear

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Speaker 2: that this will make a difference and enable them to

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Speaker 2: get on and do that, to be able to have

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Speaker 2: time for other aspects of police and respond quicker. That's important,

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Speaker 2: but it's not by itself, it's not enough.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 2: This again highlights the fact that until we seriously address

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Speaker 2: early childhood trauma, early childhood programs, education access to schools,

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Speaker 2: like teacher turnout, of getting the right teachers in the schools,

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Speaker 2: getting bilingual education in the schools, getting schools to be

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Speaker 2: a place where there's good to engagement where young people

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Speaker 2: will attend and stay. They're getting employment and lifting people

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Speaker 2: out of poverty and addressing overcrowding. Now there are some

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Speaker 2: serious commitments from the new Labor government to addressing housing

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Speaker 2: and employment, but we need we need a lot more

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Speaker 2: focus on education. That requires a two way discussion. It's

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Speaker 2: not just government, it's government and community working together. So

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Speaker 2: there is a commitment to a partnership between both levels

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Speaker 2: of government and the community to work on the issues,

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Speaker 2: and that commitment needs.

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Speaker 1: To stay, Doctor Bofferd. Before I let you go, just

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Speaker 1: very quickly, I do want to ask you. We know

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Speaker 1: the regional Controller Darrell Anderson, due to report back on

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Speaker 1: the first of February, what are you hoping what is

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Speaker 1: you know, what is the People's Alcohol Action Coalition hoping

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Speaker 1: comes from that first of February when she reports back.

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Speaker 2: Look, we're hoping that she reports back that after the consultations,

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Speaker 2: people do want to move to an opt out system

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Speaker 2: with the former strong refugures. I'll call it the restrictions.

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Speaker 2: That's what we'd be hoping for from that consultation and

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Speaker 2: we'll see what comes out of it.

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Speaker 1: Well, doctor John Boffer, we always appreciate your time. Thank

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Speaker 1: you very much for having a chat with us this morning.

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Speaker 2: Thank you, Katy, thank you