WEBVTT - Phone addiction? 📱 The science on why you need to cut back 0:00:04.040 --> 0:00:07.400 Get everyone Sam here. I've been thinking a lot about 0:00:07.520 --> 0:00:11.240 the common themes that keep recurring on The Woodlife, about 0:00:11.240 --> 0:00:15.080 the importance of sleep, importance of exercise, importance of eating 0:00:15.120 --> 0:00:18.759 real food. And I love the fact that these absolute 0:00:18.880 --> 0:00:22.320 keys are continually reinforced in different ways by the experts 0:00:22.360 --> 0:00:26.040 that we speak to. But I also want to dive 0:00:26.200 --> 0:00:31.680 deeper into some of these to really understand them on 0:00:31.720 --> 0:00:36.159 a scientific level. And I think have more practical tips 0:00:36.200 --> 0:00:38.480 of Okay, I kind of get it now, but what 0:00:38.520 --> 0:00:42.120 can I do about it? Today's expert is going to 0:00:42.240 --> 0:00:46.680 blow your mind when it comes to the importance of 0:00:46.720 --> 0:00:49.880 a spending less time on our phones and most importantly, 0:00:50.440 --> 0:00:52.880 how we do that or how we get our kids 0:00:53.040 --> 0:00:56.240 to do that. So, if you're a parent or you 0:00:56.520 --> 0:00:59.440 know that you spend too much time, but the whole 0:00:59.520 --> 0:01:02.440 digital detox thing is this extreme thing that's not really 0:01:02.480 --> 0:01:04.760 going to work for you, you have to stick around. 0:01:04.800 --> 0:01:06.480 I'm going to hand on heart say it's probably the 0:01:06.480 --> 0:01:08.560 best chat that we've had on the wood Life. It's 0:01:08.600 --> 0:01:12.720 with the incredible doctor Christy Goodwin. That's coming up next. 0:01:12.840 --> 0:01:15.679 Then we're going to talk incidental exercise. That's all today 0:01:15.880 --> 0:01:46.200 on the Woodlife. We have had many guests that are 0:01:46.200 --> 0:01:49.040 in the wellness space on the WOODLFE over the last 0:01:49.120 --> 0:01:53.120 year and a half, and it's interesting how often their 0:01:53.440 --> 0:01:56.480 checklist of five or ten things to improve your wellness 0:01:56.480 --> 0:01:59.440 comes up, and one of those things is inevitably to 0:01:59.560 --> 0:02:02.920 reduce screen time. So I've gone and done some research 0:02:03.120 --> 0:02:06.800 and I've discovered an absolute guru in this space and 0:02:06.840 --> 0:02:09.600 I'm thrilled to welcome her to the WOODLFE today, doctor 0:02:09.680 --> 0:02:13.320 Christy Goodwin. Welcome to the WOODLFE. How big an issue 0:02:13.520 --> 0:02:18.079 is this? What do you specialize in? And then we'll 0:02:18.080 --> 0:02:20.360 get to it eventually, most importantly, what can we do 0:02:20.440 --> 0:02:20.800 about it? 0:02:21.040 --> 0:02:22.959 Well, thank you for this opportunity, and I'm going to 0:02:23.040 --> 0:02:26.640 raise my guilty hand and acknowledge. Even though I research this, 0:02:26.840 --> 0:02:29.440 even though I write and speak about this, I find 0:02:29.480 --> 0:02:32.920 it really hard, if not impossible, sometimes to tame my 0:02:33.000 --> 0:02:36.639 tech covers. This is a universal dilemma, whether you're a parent, 0:02:36.680 --> 0:02:39.360 an adult, a kid. I often call our kids screen ages. 0:02:39.840 --> 0:02:43.079 The reality is we all get sucked into the digital vortex. 0:02:43.840 --> 0:02:46.639 And isn't it funny? As a parent? You know, I've 0:02:46.680 --> 0:02:50.480 got three little ones, you know, five, four, nearly two, 0:02:50.840 --> 0:02:55.280 and you just you tell yourself you're not going to 0:02:55.360 --> 0:03:01.040 let that happen, and you feel like you're parenting well, 0:03:01.200 --> 0:03:05.080 and they're still doing heaps of adventures and outdoor activities 0:03:05.120 --> 0:03:10.040 and creative tasks that don't involve screen times. But it does. 0:03:10.320 --> 0:03:14.360 It still infiltrates your life and it sneaks up on you. 0:03:14.440 --> 0:03:18.519 And the term you used vortex, I mean, isn't it true? 0:03:18.639 --> 0:03:22.320 You jump, You go down a social media rabbit hole 0:03:22.680 --> 0:03:25.919 for what feels like two minutes and you've been there 0:03:25.960 --> 0:03:29.560 for forty five. It's scary, and it's not our fault. 0:03:29.600 --> 0:03:32.600 You know the tech that we all use professionally and personally, 0:03:32.600 --> 0:03:34.880 but more so our leisure tech. You know, social media, 0:03:35.160 --> 0:03:39.600 group chats, multiplayer video games. The people creating these technologies 0:03:39.640 --> 0:03:43.360 have intentionally used a whole lot of persuasive design techniques 0:03:43.680 --> 0:03:45.920 to get us hooked on their platforms. You know the 0:03:45.960 --> 0:03:49.360 fact that notifications come to us often say, we have 0:03:49.480 --> 0:03:53.080 ancient palelithic brains. We have brains that are biologically designed 0:03:53.080 --> 0:03:56.280 to go and hunt, forage and get information. But when 0:03:56.320 --> 0:03:59.640 information is constantly being thrust at us, it tricks our 0:03:59.680 --> 0:04:03.520 brain into thinking, well, this is a potential stress or 0:04:03.560 --> 0:04:06.040 coming to me. I must be in a heightened alert state. 0:04:06.280 --> 0:04:08.880 This could be a potential danger. So even though we 0:04:08.920 --> 0:04:12.080 know our phone is vibrating or flashing, our brain can't 0:04:12.080 --> 0:04:15.520 differentiate between a real threat and a perceived threat, and 0:04:15.560 --> 0:04:18.640 so we click on the notification, we pick up the phone. 0:04:19.279 --> 0:04:22.599 The fact that our notification bubble by default is usually red, 0:04:22.800 --> 0:04:25.800 you know, read is a psychological trigger for danger and urgency. 0:04:25.880 --> 0:04:28.039 The fact that there's a metric saying you've got you know, 0:04:28.160 --> 0:04:32.560 fourteen unread WhatsApp messages draws us in. You know, the 0:04:32.600 --> 0:04:35.600 fact in on YouTube and Netflix and stand all the 0:04:35.640 --> 0:04:39.719 streaming services. One clip rolls into the next. The AutoPlay feature, 0:04:39.800 --> 0:04:41.560 you know, we used to have to enable that, but 0:04:41.600 --> 0:04:44.760 it's now a default setting. So there's so many clever 0:04:45.600 --> 0:04:49.640 persuasive ways that draw us in and our kids and 0:04:49.839 --> 0:04:54.480 the average Australian, it is estimated, will spend seventeen years 0:04:54.520 --> 0:04:58.839 of their life on their phones. Who thirty three percent 0:04:58.880 --> 0:05:02.880 of our waking hours are sucked into that digital vortex alone, 0:05:02.960 --> 0:05:06.400 Let alone our laptops, our tablets, our desktop computers. This 0:05:06.440 --> 0:05:10.640 will change with artificial intelligence and wearable technologies. We are 0:05:10.880 --> 0:05:13.799 really spending a huge amount of time and often say 0:05:14.360 --> 0:05:16.840 if we don't take that control, if we're not intentional, 0:05:16.960 --> 0:05:19.240 it's not an anti tech you know, I don't believe 0:05:19.240 --> 0:05:22.800 in digital detoxes. It's not about digital amputation for our kids. 0:05:22.839 --> 0:05:26.920 You know, they're outdated, antiquated approaches. But if we aren't intentional, 0:05:27.000 --> 0:05:30.920 if we do not take back control, technology will and 0:05:31.040 --> 0:05:34.279 does rob us of our two most important human resources, 0:05:34.680 --> 0:05:38.080 our time and our attention. And that's why I'm worried. 0:05:38.360 --> 0:05:42.560 Well, thirty three percent of our awake time, thirty three 0:05:42.600 --> 0:05:43.240 percent of. 0:05:43.120 --> 0:05:44.119 Our aways life. 0:05:44.560 --> 0:05:47.159 Yeah, it actually took me a minute to let that 0:05:47.279 --> 0:05:51.000 sink in. I mean, that is so beautifully articulated. I 0:05:51.040 --> 0:05:55.080 guess the first place my head went was I totally 0:05:55.120 --> 0:05:58.240 agree that we have to take back control. But even 0:05:58.279 --> 0:06:02.640 when I try and either do it myself or teach 0:06:02.720 --> 0:06:07.000 discipline to others around switching those notifications off and making 0:06:07.040 --> 0:06:09.039 it a bit more of a you know, or you 0:06:09.120 --> 0:06:11.640 turn your phone off or whatever it is, you then 0:06:11.760 --> 0:06:14.880 just turn it back on to be absolutely bombarded. I'd 0:06:14.920 --> 0:06:19.279 love your advice on how best just focusing on reducing 0:06:20.040 --> 0:06:25.719 I guess that bombardment of stimuli. Where's the first place 0:06:25.839 --> 0:06:27.080 you start with people? 0:06:27.360 --> 0:06:29.720 Yes, and you're exactly right. This is why I don't 0:06:29.720 --> 0:06:34.560 recommend doing a digital detox or anything really restrictive, because 0:06:34.800 --> 0:06:37.480 the research tells us in terms of digital detoxes, they 0:06:37.480 --> 0:06:40.960 create exactly what you just describe a binge and a 0:06:40.960 --> 0:06:43.479 perch cycle. We go offline for three days, but we 0:06:43.520 --> 0:06:46.440 come back Monday morning and we are digitally bombarded by 0:06:46.480 --> 0:06:51.479 the dms, the emails, the WhatsApp messages, and the detox 0:06:51.560 --> 0:06:55.320 doesn't actually create long term sustainable habits. A study was 0:06:55.360 --> 0:06:57.880 done where they compared two groups of people. One group 0:06:57.920 --> 0:07:01.080 who were asked to reduce their social media use by 0:07:01.200 --> 0:07:03.200 an hour a day. The other group went on a 0:07:03.240 --> 0:07:06.919 full digital detox. They fully restricted their use, and what 0:07:07.040 --> 0:07:10.640 the study conclusively found was that those people that went 0:07:10.760 --> 0:07:14.040 on the full digital detox reverted back to their screen 0:07:14.080 --> 0:07:18.000 habits before the digital detox was imposed. But the group 0:07:18.080 --> 0:07:20.760 that just reduced their social media time by an hour 0:07:20.760 --> 0:07:24.480 a day was spending four months after the study thirty 0:07:24.600 --> 0:07:27.360 minutes less on social media. So the research tells us 0:07:27.360 --> 0:07:30.280 that cutting it down or cutting it back is better 0:07:30.320 --> 0:07:33.240 than cutting it out. Because as we know as humans, 0:07:33.280 --> 0:07:38.640 anything that's fully restrictive doesn't often lead to long term change. 0:07:38.960 --> 0:07:41.240 So what I often say to people, is we've got 0:07:41.240 --> 0:07:44.160 to make our tech less sticky, less appealing, because you 0:07:44.200 --> 0:07:48.600 know it is so psychologically appealing. Is it as simple 0:07:48.640 --> 0:07:51.400 as putting your phone somewhere where you cannot see it. 0:07:52.120 --> 0:07:54.480 Research tells us that even if our phone is on 0:07:54.720 --> 0:07:57.920 silent and face down, if it's still in our line 0:07:57.920 --> 0:08:01.640 of sight, it drops out performance our cognitive performance by 0:08:01.640 --> 0:08:04.600 about ten percent. So put bluntly seeing your phone makes 0:08:04.640 --> 0:08:06.760 you about ten percent dumber. I can't be any more 0:08:06.840 --> 0:08:09.840 to recten that. It literally is a brain drain. Some 0:08:09.880 --> 0:08:13.240 of even if we're not picking it up, not opening it, 0:08:13.720 --> 0:08:16.120 some of our attention has gone there. So is it 0:08:16.160 --> 0:08:18.080 putting it in a bag, leaving it in the glove 0:08:18.120 --> 0:08:20.520 box in the car? Is it putting it in another 0:08:20.600 --> 0:08:23.280 room when you want to be fully present in those moments? 0:08:23.840 --> 0:08:25.800 Is it turning it to grayscale? And the first to 0:08:25.840 --> 0:08:28.560 say Instagram is really boring in black and white? It 0:08:28.640 --> 0:08:32.480 really is. Is it logging out of your apps on 0:08:32.520 --> 0:08:35.080 your smartphone. One of the reasons that we go down 0:08:35.080 --> 0:08:38.400 that digital vortex is because there's no friction. Now with 0:08:38.480 --> 0:08:41.600 facial recognition, you don't even have to enter your past code. 0:08:41.679 --> 0:08:44.320 You can simply hold the device up and off you 0:08:44.360 --> 0:08:48.240 go down that rabbit hole. So logging out. You know, 0:08:48.280 --> 0:08:50.800 most of us now have digital dementia. We can't remember 0:08:50.840 --> 0:08:54.560 any information because we're just being constantly peppered. When we 0:08:54.600 --> 0:08:57.800 can't remember the password, it may create a little bit 0:08:57.840 --> 0:09:01.400 more friction, you know, taking your tech temptations off the 0:09:01.440 --> 0:09:05.400 home screen of your phone, controlling your notifications. As you said, 0:09:05.480 --> 0:09:08.560 it's really hard to resist that. So I have three 0:09:08.559 --> 0:09:12.400 golden rules with notifications. One, disable all non essential ones. 0:09:13.040 --> 0:09:16.320 Two we can now bundle or batch when our notifications 0:09:16.360 --> 0:09:18.640 come to us, so rather than dribbling in throughout the 0:09:18.720 --> 0:09:21.360 day and distracting us, we can nominate what time or 0:09:21.400 --> 0:09:24.840 times of the day we want the WhatsApp notifications, we 0:09:24.880 --> 0:09:28.839 want our team's notifications or email notifications. And the third 0:09:28.880 --> 0:09:32.000 one is create VIP lists so that when you put 0:09:32.040 --> 0:09:34.439 your phone on focus or do not Disturb mode, they're 0:09:34.440 --> 0:09:38.360 called different things on different platforms. Everybody else gets blocked 0:09:39.040 --> 0:09:42.240 apart from those people on that list. Everybody else gets blocked, 0:09:42.240 --> 0:09:43.840 but they can get through. So I think there are 0:09:43.880 --> 0:09:46.079 things that we can do, but I am the first 0:09:46.120 --> 0:09:50.240 to say it's hard, Like we are fighting a monumental 0:09:50.280 --> 0:09:52.240 battle in terms of our time and attention. 0:09:53.120 --> 0:09:55.920 You know, it's one of those things I'm sure many 0:09:56.040 --> 0:10:01.160 people are like, absolutely know the what Christie is saying 0:10:01.280 --> 0:10:05.720 is right, But God, that scares me if this is you, 0:10:06.280 --> 0:10:08.720 and my guess is it is most of you. And 0:10:08.760 --> 0:10:10.920 I'm putting my hand right up in the air, and 0:10:10.960 --> 0:10:13.560 I love your honesty two in this, Christie, I'm going 0:10:13.600 --> 0:10:17.319 to find this seriously hard. I have a massive issue here. Massive. 0:10:17.760 --> 0:10:21.600 I mean I've put in probably ten percent of the 0:10:21.640 --> 0:10:25.000 little rules or little protocols that you've spoken about already, 0:10:25.080 --> 0:10:27.400 and I've already found it's helped a little bit. But 0:10:27.440 --> 0:10:30.280 there's so much more that I can do. And I 0:10:30.400 --> 0:10:35.200 love the term we need to take back control. 0:10:35.559 --> 0:10:38.680 Let's face it, we're slaves to our screens, and it's 0:10:38.720 --> 0:10:40.560 no accident. As I said, there's a whole lot of 0:10:40.559 --> 0:10:44.000 persuasive design techniques. The other reason we often and our 0:10:44.080 --> 0:10:47.160 kids in particular our teens. You know why social media 0:10:47.240 --> 0:10:50.120 and multiplayer video games and group chats are so appealing 0:10:50.760 --> 0:10:53.120 is that our more our leisure than our sort of 0:10:53.240 --> 0:10:57.400 work and productivity technologies. But our leisure technologies tap into 0:10:57.400 --> 0:11:01.800 our three most basic psychological drivers most basic human need 0:11:02.280 --> 0:11:05.400 is connection. We are hardwired for relational connection. We want 0:11:05.400 --> 0:11:08.360 to feel like we belong. This is why social media, 0:11:08.440 --> 0:11:13.600 group chats, emails, teams, messages, slack messages, multiplayer video games 0:11:13.640 --> 0:11:17.200 are so popular. Our second need is to feel competent. 0:11:17.280 --> 0:11:19.280 And in the online world, we don't have to often 0:11:19.320 --> 0:11:21.120 exert a lot of hard work and we get to 0:11:21.120 --> 0:11:23.839 feel competent. I can triage my inbox, I can reply 0:11:23.920 --> 0:11:27.160 to the messages. For young people, it's how many Fortnite 0:11:27.160 --> 0:11:30.559 battles they've won, how many social media vanity metrics they 0:11:30.600 --> 0:11:33.320 get on their posts. And the third need that we 0:11:33.360 --> 0:11:36.240 have as humans is control. We want to feel like 0:11:36.280 --> 0:11:38.520 we have some autonomy, and the online world gives us 0:11:38.520 --> 0:11:42.360 a perceived, although i'll say false, sense that we're in control. 0:11:42.640 --> 0:11:44.800 And so a couple of years ago, a mum told 0:11:44.800 --> 0:11:47.920 me this powerful story, and I have never forgotten. She 0:11:48.080 --> 0:11:49.959 told me that she picked her daughter up from school 0:11:49.960 --> 0:11:52.120 one day and her mum turned and said to her mum, 0:11:52.240 --> 0:11:54.320 how much do you earn per our mom? And her 0:11:54.360 --> 0:11:57.160 mom thought, wow, my daughter is finally you know, ambitious. 0:11:57.440 --> 0:11:59.600 She said, look, sweetheart, I own a salary. I'd have 0:11:59.679 --> 0:12:03.000 to do calculations let me get back to you. She 0:12:03.160 --> 0:12:05.680 tucked her daughter into bed that night, and she's tucking 0:12:05.720 --> 0:12:08.320 her in, she said, sweetheart, I've calculated my alli right, 0:12:08.440 --> 0:12:11.440 this is what it is. Why do you ask? And 0:12:11.440 --> 0:12:14.640 her young daughter turned to her mum and said, because 0:12:14.640 --> 0:12:17.600 I'd liked to buy an hour of your time without 0:12:17.640 --> 0:12:22.240 your phone. Yeah out. And even if you don't have kids, 0:12:22.360 --> 0:12:25.160 I think many of us would recognize that our time 0:12:25.240 --> 0:12:28.400 and our attention are being taken away by this. I 0:12:28.440 --> 0:12:31.080 don't want us and I know this sounds melodramatic, but 0:12:31.679 --> 0:12:34.200 the harsh reality is if we are giving up seventeen 0:12:34.280 --> 0:12:37.280 years of our life just to our phones, that's an 0:12:37.320 --> 0:12:41.199 inordinate amount of time. There's certainly some functionality there. I'm 0:12:41.240 --> 0:12:44.480 not denying that, but if we were brutally honest with ourselves, 0:12:44.520 --> 0:12:47.280 for many of us, that's a huge amount of time 0:12:47.320 --> 0:12:48.680 that we will never get back. 0:12:49.400 --> 0:12:52.240 So a couple of things, I mean that story wows 0:12:52.320 --> 0:12:56.199 is that nearly burst into tears. I've had a couple 0:12:56.240 --> 0:12:59.000 of occasions we're probably probably ten where my kids have 0:12:59.040 --> 0:13:02.319 said and I haven't heard them because I've been glued 0:13:02.360 --> 0:13:05.120 to my phone. And then Dad, put down your phone, 0:13:05.400 --> 0:13:08.160 and you know they're very little. So when that happens, well, 0:13:08.760 --> 0:13:11.840 I don't notice that you notice until you say that thing, 0:13:11.880 --> 0:13:15.760 but god, you do notice. And then those three needs 0:13:15.800 --> 0:13:21.120 connected competent control because the connected one is interesting because 0:13:21.160 --> 0:13:27.360 I have a teenage daughter, and it's that desire to 0:13:27.440 --> 0:13:31.320 feel connected through social media. But it's just not a 0:13:31.360 --> 0:13:39.719 real connection, like I just it's not replacing real connections, 0:13:39.800 --> 0:13:44.800 real friendships, real human interaction. And so it's just this 0:13:44.800 --> 0:13:51.439 this fake I mean, yeah, but it's a horrible substitute. 0:13:51.000 --> 0:13:53.480 And we have to be careful. We can't demonize it 0:13:53.520 --> 0:13:56.240 because for our young people, the online world really is 0:13:56.280 --> 0:13:59.960 their primary conduit for connection. But the harsh reality is 0:14:00.160 --> 0:14:03.360 the research tells us that any sort of text based 0:14:03.360 --> 0:14:07.840 communication does not even though we are connecting, does not 0:14:08.000 --> 0:14:12.199 create a hormone called oxytocin. So oxytocin's the social bonding 0:14:12.280 --> 0:14:15.040 sometimes referred to as the love hormone. We get it 0:14:15.080 --> 0:14:18.480 when we're in close physical proximity with others. Their brain 0:14:18.679 --> 0:14:23.240 biologically has to produce this hormone. What we also know 0:14:23.360 --> 0:14:27.520 is that text based communications make the brain produce cortisol, 0:14:27.600 --> 0:14:32.280 the stress hormone, two ways that people totally unaware of 0:14:32.760 --> 0:14:35.520 that our tech habits can make us feel stressed without 0:14:35.560 --> 0:14:38.960 even realizing it is that when we're on any screen, 0:14:39.640 --> 0:14:42.040 we do not sigh as much as what we should 0:14:42.080 --> 0:14:45.160 now as humans, we are biologically designed to sigh while 0:14:45.160 --> 0:14:48.720 we're awaight, roughly every five minutes. It's a natural biological 0:14:48.760 --> 0:14:52.240 mechanism that's built in to our biology that helps us 0:14:52.240 --> 0:14:55.440 regulate our stress response. We do it really subtly. It's 0:14:55.480 --> 0:14:58.120 two inhalations through our nose and an exhalation through our mouth, 0:14:58.480 --> 0:15:01.440 natural way to regulate our oxides in carbon dioxide levels. 0:15:01.760 --> 0:15:04.360 But when we are looking at a small surface area 0:15:04.400 --> 0:15:07.560 our phone, our tablet, our laptop, our computer, we do 0:15:07.640 --> 0:15:10.480 not sigh anywhere near as much. What does this mean 0:15:11.040 --> 0:15:14.000 We are often in a sympathetic nervous system state. We're 0:15:14.000 --> 0:15:17.840 in an elevated stress state just by looking at our screens. 0:15:18.440 --> 0:15:21.000 Another way you will find this one hopefully interesting too, 0:15:21.120 --> 0:15:23.480 is that when we have a very narrow gaze, so 0:15:23.520 --> 0:15:26.520 when our eyes are converging looking at our phones, our tablets, 0:15:26.520 --> 0:15:32.560 our laptops, we again trigger the stress response because biologically, 0:15:32.600 --> 0:15:35.800 as humans, we are designed to dilate our gaze. We 0:15:35.840 --> 0:15:38.760 are designed to look at things in the distance. As humans, 0:15:38.760 --> 0:15:42.160 We're not designed for us to adopt a very narrow gaze. 0:15:42.200 --> 0:15:45.680 So again, when our eyes converge, it triggers that stress response. 0:15:45.880 --> 0:15:48.760 There must be something a potential danger or stress or 0:15:49.000 --> 0:15:52.040 because I've got this very narrow gaze. So think about 0:15:52.040 --> 0:15:54.960 the hours that all of us, kids, teens, and adults 0:15:54.960 --> 0:15:58.560 are spending with that narrow gaze and not sighing. We're 0:15:58.600 --> 0:16:02.560 often really stressed. Those quartersol levels are high, and we 0:16:02.640 --> 0:16:05.960 haven't even started to consider what we're actually doing on 0:16:06.000 --> 0:16:09.400 the screen. Our tech habits are having a profound impact 0:16:09.440 --> 0:16:11.720 on us in ways that I don't think we've even 0:16:11.800 --> 0:16:14.320 started to really digest and consider. 0:16:15.160 --> 0:16:17.760 I couldn't agree with. The more it is, like, the 0:16:17.760 --> 0:16:21.280 more you know, the more petrifying it is. So I'd 0:16:21.360 --> 0:16:26.400 love some advice selfishly on what you can do with teenagers, 0:16:26.480 --> 0:16:29.520 because not just my daughter Evie, but no of course 0:16:29.640 --> 0:16:32.320 you know parents with teenagers out there who must be going, 0:16:32.360 --> 0:16:34.280 oh my god, I'm totally at a loss of what 0:16:34.400 --> 0:16:36.720 to do. I'd love some tips, Grissy, if you've got any. 0:16:37.080 --> 0:16:41.000 Yeah, So my three tips for parents are the big 0:16:41.080 --> 0:16:43.440 overarching message is that we have to be the co 0:16:43.600 --> 0:16:47.200 pilot of the digital plane, not the passenger, and the 0:16:47.240 --> 0:16:50.760 reason is that the developing brain, the adolescent brain, does 0:16:50.800 --> 0:16:54.320 not have the architecture that is required to regulate what 0:16:54.360 --> 0:16:57.280 they do online. Part of the brain called the prefrontal 0:16:57.280 --> 0:16:59.360 cortex of CAEN say, it's like the CEO or the 0:16:59.400 --> 0:17:02.440 air traffic control system of the brain. It has three 0:17:02.480 --> 0:17:06.440 big jobs. It's impulse control, it's working memory, and its 0:17:06.440 --> 0:17:08.520 mental flexibility, so all sort of the high roll to 0:17:08.560 --> 0:17:13.080 thinking skills. It does not fully develop until somewhere in 0:17:13.119 --> 0:17:16.400 the twenties, late twenties for males, early twenties for females. 0:17:16.760 --> 0:17:20.840 So it is a parenting impossibility to expect your son 0:17:20.960 --> 0:17:24.680 or daughter to spend three hours on TikTok, voluntarily turn 0:17:24.680 --> 0:17:25.920 it off and say I'm going to go on tidy 0:17:26.000 --> 0:17:27.800 my bedroom for you, mum or dad. It's just it's 0:17:27.840 --> 0:17:30.480 never going to happen. They don't have that impulse control, 0:17:30.760 --> 0:17:33.320 they don't have working memory, so even though you've repeatedly 0:17:33.359 --> 0:17:35.480 told them not to look things up, they will still 0:17:35.560 --> 0:17:38.080 keep looking things up. So we have to be that 0:17:38.200 --> 0:17:40.720 co pilot, not the passenger. And to be the copilot, 0:17:40.760 --> 0:17:42.520 I can say we've got to get three bees right. 0:17:43.000 --> 0:17:46.080 The first be is that we have to co establish 0:17:46.320 --> 0:17:49.960 boundaries with them, not on them, you know, come up 0:17:50.000 --> 0:17:52.359 with some agreed boundaries. And again this is not about 0:17:52.359 --> 0:17:56.359 imposing an agreement, It's about co constructing with your team. 0:17:56.400 --> 0:17:59.720 What are some of our parameters, our guardrails, So having 0:17:59.720 --> 0:18:02.760 more broader conversations beyond how much what are they doing? 0:18:02.840 --> 0:18:05.280 When are they using it? You know, is it before 0:18:05.320 --> 0:18:08.160 school or before they go to sleep? Where are they 0:18:08.240 --> 0:18:10.719 using it? You know, establish your no go tech zones. 0:18:11.119 --> 0:18:14.120 Your teenager is much less likely to be sending nudes 0:18:14.240 --> 0:18:16.800 if it's in the lounge room or on the kitchen counter, 0:18:17.160 --> 0:18:19.120 much more likely to be doing it in their bedroom 0:18:19.240 --> 0:18:22.399 or their bathroom with whom you know. Would you invite 0:18:22.400 --> 0:18:24.920 a complete stranger to come in and lay down next 0:18:24.920 --> 0:18:27.719 to your teenager in their bedroom at night. Absolutely not. 0:18:28.160 --> 0:18:30.960 But we're often inevitably doing that when they've got devices 0:18:31.000 --> 0:18:34.560 in their rooms. So the first bees around boundaries, the 0:18:34.600 --> 0:18:38.040 second bee is around their basic needs. I believe the 0:18:38.080 --> 0:18:40.840 reason that we have a serious mental health crisis in 0:18:40.920 --> 0:18:44.680 young people is because of technology, but not the way 0:18:44.720 --> 0:18:46.560 we all think. We're all quick to wag the point 0:18:46.640 --> 0:18:49.439 the finger and say it's smartphones, and it's social media, 0:18:49.600 --> 0:18:53.600 it's what they are displacing. Their most basic physical and 0:18:53.600 --> 0:18:57.280 psychological needs are being displaced and superseded by screens. And 0:18:57.320 --> 0:18:59.760 the three big ones. They're three most basic needs that 0:18:59.800 --> 0:19:04.880 will optimize their mental health, sleep, physical movement, and connection. 0:19:05.200 --> 0:19:08.200 And they are all being significantly shaped and I would 0:19:08.240 --> 0:19:11.800 say sometimes sabotaged by screens. We have to fiercely protect 0:19:11.840 --> 0:19:15.000 those basic needs. And the third b the harsh reality 0:19:15.080 --> 0:19:20.600 is this is one adults really struggle with, boredom, being 0:19:20.680 --> 0:19:24.760 idle with our thoughts knowing you know, years ago we 0:19:25.160 --> 0:19:26.960 used to order a coffee and you talk to the 0:19:27.000 --> 0:19:30.440 barista or the people waiting outside. Today we pull out 0:19:30.440 --> 0:19:32.600 our phones. We pull up at a red traffic light, 0:19:32.640 --> 0:19:36.160 You look around. What are most people often doing pulling 0:19:36.240 --> 0:19:39.040 out those phones? And so the pockets of white space 0:19:39.560 --> 0:19:42.320 that we used to have. I don't know about you, Sam, 0:19:42.359 --> 0:19:44.760 but I've never ever had a great idea in my 0:19:44.840 --> 0:19:48.560 inbox or an inn Excel spreadsheet. My ideas come when 0:19:48.560 --> 0:19:50.720 I'm in the shower, going for a run, going for 0:19:50.760 --> 0:19:54.000 a swim, in an airplane without Wi Fi. We used 0:19:54.040 --> 0:19:57.000 to daydream, but we never have pockets of time to 0:19:57.040 --> 0:20:00.280 be bored anymore, and neither do our kids. So I 0:20:00.280 --> 0:20:03.480 say to parents, they are the three bees boundaries, basic needs, 0:20:03.480 --> 0:20:06.000 and boredom. And if we can nail that, our kids 0:20:06.080 --> 0:20:08.320 can use technology and we won't have to have all 0:20:08.320 --> 0:20:11.960 this moral panic and angst that their tech times are 0:20:12.000 --> 0:20:16.080 eroding their mental health and compromising them. But I think 0:20:16.240 --> 0:20:19.159 we're struggling as adults because we're not being good digital 0:20:19.240 --> 0:20:23.439 role models ourselves. We are tethered to technology, and so 0:20:23.560 --> 0:20:26.000 if we're not being good digital role models, the brain 0:20:26.080 --> 0:20:29.000 has mirror neurons, meaning that we are biologically designed as 0:20:29.080 --> 0:20:32.359 humans to imitate and copy. Like, how can we expect 0:20:32.440 --> 0:20:35.080 our kids to have really good habits if we are 0:20:35.200 --> 0:20:38.919 grappling with this. You know, we've got fully developed brain architecture. 0:20:39.400 --> 0:20:42.919 They don't. So it's again, I don't want to sound 0:20:43.720 --> 0:20:47.280 sad and somber, but this is hard. But we have to. 0:20:47.400 --> 0:20:49.000 I really think we have to put in place some 0:20:49.080 --> 0:20:51.240 strategies to be that co pilot. 0:20:52.119 --> 0:20:55.240 That is that is some of the most brilliant advice 0:20:55.280 --> 0:20:56.919 I've ever had on this show. And I mean that 0:20:57.359 --> 0:21:00.960 so sincerely. Oh thank you, Christy. I could talk to 0:21:01.000 --> 0:21:04.320 you all day because this is something that I'm fascinated by. 0:21:05.080 --> 0:21:07.080 I just want to ask you one more thing. If 0:21:07.080 --> 0:21:14.359 you could give our listeners one digital based challenge to 0:21:14.520 --> 0:21:17.480 focus on over the next week or a month, or 0:21:17.800 --> 0:21:21.080 you can decide the timeline. What would it be. 0:21:21.960 --> 0:21:25.400 So one often talk about microhabits, so not overhauling everything, 0:21:25.520 --> 0:21:28.240 not doing anything radical like a digital detos. What's one 0:21:28.240 --> 0:21:30.639 little lever that you could pull that would yield the 0:21:30.640 --> 0:21:33.359 biggest return for you? And what I find for most 0:21:33.359 --> 0:21:37.520 people is if we can start to avoid bookending our 0:21:37.640 --> 0:21:41.440 days with our devices. Ninety percent of adults. Research tells 0:21:41.520 --> 0:21:43.639 us pick up our phones before we touch our partners 0:21:43.640 --> 0:21:45.720 first thing in the morning. So we're all guilty of 0:21:45.760 --> 0:21:48.600 doing this. If we pick up our phones first thing, 0:21:49.000 --> 0:21:52.800 we trigger the stress response our limbit brain, the Migdaler 0:21:52.800 --> 0:21:54.960 in particular, sort of the emotional hub of our brain 0:21:55.040 --> 0:21:56.880 fires up. You know, we only need to see one 0:21:56.960 --> 0:22:00.840 unkind comment on our social media, an upsetting email, a 0:22:00.840 --> 0:22:03.639 sad news story, and we're already in this elevated stress 0:22:03.720 --> 0:22:06.440 response and our feet haven't even touched the floor. So 0:22:06.480 --> 0:22:10.560 the first fifteen minutes, if we can keep screen free 0:22:10.840 --> 0:22:14.959 now the one at night, ideally we would be having 0:22:15.040 --> 0:22:18.080 a screen free period about sixty minutes before we want 0:22:18.119 --> 0:22:20.399 to go to sleep, even thirty minutes will make a 0:22:20.480 --> 0:22:24.080 huge difference. The blue light not only de lazy onset 0:22:24.119 --> 0:22:26.639 of sleep, but we also now know it disrupts the 0:22:26.720 --> 0:22:29.120 quality of our sleep. If we're on a blue lit 0:22:29.160 --> 0:22:31.439 device in that sixty minutes before we go to sleep, 0:22:31.840 --> 0:22:36.040 it will shorten our deepen rem sleep stages. That's critical 0:22:36.080 --> 0:22:39.280 for memory consolidation, that's critical for us feeling like we've 0:22:39.320 --> 0:22:42.240